If you add a shared sub model between XI and XIV

[Pixela]

Please make new servers for the freeloading peasants to play on.

[Alhanelem]

Please make new servers for the freeloading peasants to play on.
Hello trollbait, how are you today?

[Pixela]

There is a probable fictional leak doing the rounds:


FF Anniversary Presentation Leak

Received orders for the FIGS translation of the Final Fantasy Anniversary Presentation happening on February 7th. Press is getting early access to announcements on February 2nd.

Total runtime: 1h 24m

Opening:
Final Fantasy History Presentation

Final Fantasy Online:
Final Fantasy XI/Final Fantasy XIV Subscription Unity Project (This Fall)
Final Fantasy XI Beginnings Rework Project (This Fall)
Naoki Yoshida: Final Fantasy XIV A Realm Reborn Anniversary

[Alhanelem]

okay, whatever, I'll believe it when i see it, but seriously

If they're paying to pay, they aren't freeloading. They deserve to be able to play just as much as anyone else. You pay Netflix one price to access their content, so I don't get why you're so opposed to SE offering a similar deal for their online games. SE still gets money, they wouldn't offer it if they had a problem with how much money they're getting. And it applies in both directions, its not like this only benefits FFXIV players (or vice versa).

Modern MMO players are going to figure out pretty quickly if they like FFXI's slower gameplay or not. I don't think you have to worry much about "freeloading" noobs ruining the game for anyone else.

Further, a program like that might keep some people off private servers, I'm seeing them get advertised more aggressively recently, and you can be sure that SE would rather people be paying them something than TRULY freeloading.

Most people who already sub to both aren't playing them *simultaneously*. You're dividing your time between them in some fashion, so it's really, really not unreasonable to offer an option that costs more than one sub but less than both.

(Full disclosure, I have a legacy FFXIV account, so I have a permanent discount already- I highly doubt they'd let legacy accounts stack discounts)



f the Final Fantasy Anniversary Presentation happening on February 7th.This doesn't make sense, as the FF brand's anniversary is in December. I rate this claim "Highly Dubious."

[BST]

Obviously fake.

[Pixela]

I don't believe it either but just in case.

The point however is that if I'm specifically paying for a service, and then get a worse service for people who aren't specifically paying for that service I'm not going to be happy. To use an example, if I'm paying for netflix and they do a deal where amazon customers get netflix for free when they have prime and then the netflix servers start being laggy...not so good.

Likewise, since XI is not a fully instancef game I'm not going to be happy if I can't do anything I log on to do cause it's full of people who are getting it for free due to paying for something else.

[Alhanelem]

The point however is that if I'm specifically paying for a service, and then get a worse service for people who aren't specifically paying for that service I'm not going to be happy.Why would an influx of new and/or returning legitimate players create a worse service for you?

[Alhanelem]

Likewise, since XI is not a fully instancef game I'm not going to be happy if I can't do anything I log on to do cause it's full of people who are getting it for free due to paying for something else. 1) they're not getting in for free, they're getting in for a discount to offset the fact that it's hard to simultaneously play two MMOs. if SE charges (example) $20 a month to play both, that's a modest savings for the buyer, it isn't "for free," plus they can still pay the extra dollars for more characters and storage.
2) Unless you're on Asura, this isn't a problem and the impact of such a promotion, as I've said many times in the past, would be nice but it would not be enough to create such problems where they don't already exist.

An incentive to play both games can only do good for both games. There is no downside here. I'm not so sure I'd be paying for both if I didn't already have the XIV legacy account discount. If they did do something like this, that just means other people can enjoy what I'm already enjoying.

We've been through this multiple times and it's pretty apparent you were trying to bait me, well you've succeeded, so congratulations I guess?

[BobbinT]

I'm personally excited. :D

https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxi/comments/10bmw62/ffxi_beginnings_rework_project_rumour/


https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/792442281893822474/1064398770021875762/IMG_5030.jpg

[Allestra]

Im happy too, I also have active legacy subscription in ffxiv and have never stopped my subscription in ffxi since the second year of NA release.
About time tbh if it comes to light! ^^

[Alhanelem]

I'm personally excited. :D

https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxi/comments/10bmw62/ffxi_beginnings_rework_project_rumour/


https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/792442281893822474/1064398770021875762/IMG_5030.jpg
I remind you the whole post is suspect because of that bit about an "anniversary presentation" in February, because Final Fantasy's anniversary is in December.

[BobbinT]

Im happy too, I also have active legacy subscription in ffxiv and have never stopped my subscription in ffxi since the second year of NA release.
About time tbh if it comes to light! ^^


well... not sure if legacy has anything to do with it, since I'm also one of them, but if this is true, this rly incentive me actually resub than waiting for another return campaign.


That said... while I do love having my stay longer @ Vana'diel, it's still terribly unfortunate that i haven't found ways to multi-task both games other than having both run same time on me PC, I'm dying to learn how if it's actually possible... XD

[Divinas]

Please make new servers for the freeloading peasants to play on.

Do you honestly think everyone will take the extra payment to move from 14 to 11? You're almost funny. /s

[BobbinT]

Do you honestly think everyone will take the extra payment to move from 14 to 11? You're almost funny. /s
move? What do you mean? Can't ppl have both worlds instead, especially for a Final Fantasy Fans?

[Pixela]

I'm worried a move like this if successful will make the game near unplayable to the people actually paying for it. Everything is limited, whether it's queues to enter content or just competition for stuff like NM claims.

I already have to swap server sometimes to do Emp weapon farming, this would make it pointless cause all servers would be overcamped.

[Zenion]

I'm worried a move like this if successful will make the game near unplayable to the people actually paying for it. Everything is limited, whether it's queues to enter content or just competition for stuff like NM claims.

I already have to swap server sometimes to do Emp weapon farming, this would make it pointless cause all servers would be overcamped.

So, you're worried that offering Final Fantasy XIV players a chance to play Final Fantasy XI would lead to such a massive influx of new players that all servers would become as congested as Asura?

Why Pixela, I never knew you to be such an optimist.

If there were some kind of shared subscription model implemented, we'd probably see a surge in demand for early game content for about a month, quickly dwindling to barely more traffic than before the merger. Maybe some old FFXI players who made the jump to FFXIV would come back to see what's changed, and some might even stay. For the most part though, I wouldn't count on there being some gigantic untapped market for people who play FFXIV because they love the Final Fantasy franchise, but secretly wish they could be playing Everquest instead of World of Warcraft and somehow don't already know that FFXI exists.

[Sp1cyryan]

I'm personally excited. :D

https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxi/comments/10bmw62/ffxi_beginnings_rework_project_rumour/


https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/792442281893822474/1064398770021875762/IMG_5030.jpg

Imagine being excited about a 4chan post.

[Alhanelem]

Do you honestly think everyone will take the extra payment to move from 14 to 11? You're almost funny. /s
It's not to make people move, it's to get money from people who want to try both but don't want to because they don't want to pay two MMO subs. And I have met quite a few such people in my FFXIV travels.

[Alhanelem]

I'm worried a move like this if successful will make the game near unplayable to the people actually paying for it.
Your worries are unjustified. No one is or should expect some massive influx of players from such a program. This is about a moderate number of curious souls who have heard about FFXI but are already subscribed to an MMO and don't really want to pay for two.



Everything is limited, whether it's queues to enter content or just competition for stuff like NM claims.

I already have to swap server sometimes to do Emp weapon farming, this would make it pointless cause all servers would be overcamped.1)the most famous NMs were changed to force pops which solved that problem years ago. I don't know how many other NMs people care much about other than making some gil, which you can do with almost any NM.
2)With the exception of Asura and maybe Bahamut most servers are well below the capacity they can handle and would welcome an influx of players.
3) Why the heck are you regularly server hopping for emp weapons? Why not just stay on the lesser populated server and give that server population +1? You can still do anything you set your mind to on any other server.



There is absolutely no way this would happen but if so many curious XIV players did come to FFXI, all they'd have to do is add new worlds. It's not like there's a hard limit to how many players they can accomodate. Again, there's no way this would happen, but even if it did, the solution is simple.

Everyone wants more players. Why would that be a bad thing? If they need more capacity, they can add more capacity.

[BobbinT]

Imagine being excited about a 4chan post.
y not? one allowed to dreams, no? ;)
It's kinda my wish ever since FF14's 2.x in fact. :D

[Sp1cyryan]

y not? one allowed to dreams, no? ;)
It's kinda my wish ever since FF14's 2.x in fact. :D

Because it is 4chan...

No one should put stock in circular reasoning masquerading as dreams.

[Tokimemofan]

Amazing that people are taking 4chan seriously. 4chan is the sewer of the internet

[Alhanelem]

Amazing that people are taking 4chan seriously. 4chan is the sewer of the internet
Just like Asura is the sewer of FFXI


//Had to go there :D

[Tokimemofan]

Just like Asura is the sewer of FFXI


//Had to go there :D

I don’t think anyone will deny that

[Sp1cyryan]

Just like Asura is the sewer of FFXI


//Had to go there :D

This place as well as the rest of retail is not much better.

[Pixela]

I'm gonna be super disappointed if they go with a shared sub due to the message it sends.

At best given them a couple of free mog wardrobes or something.

[Alhanelem]

I'm gonna be super disappointed if they go with a shared sub due to the message it sends.

At best given them a couple of free mog wardrobes or something.
For anyone other than you, it sends a great message, that SE is willing to give people a break for dividing time between two massively time consuming MMORPGs. It really is that simple, you have X time to spend, the subscription fee assumes you'll spend a certain amount of time playing. Playing more than one MMO doesn't mean you are adding extra hours in a day to play them, so it doesn't make sense to charge someone playing both the full price of both.

I don't know why this concept is so lost on you.

Having said that -
I've seen multiple gaming news outlets reporting on this supposed anniversary presentation in February, despite the fact that FF's anniversary is in December. It's not just 4chan anymore, but it still doesn't make sense.

[Pixela]

A) $12 + B) $12

>

A+B) $12

[Alhanelem]

A) $12 + B) $12

>

A+B) $12

I don't think anyone, myself included, ever proposed "buy one get one free." Just "A discount." If someone is willing to pay A + 50% of B but 100% of B, they still gain more money than if they didn't pay for B at all.

More money than the cost of one or the other is better than not getting any more money if the person would not have paid otherwise.

They have done it in the past and there is no reason they can't do it again. The only limitation there should be is that (as is normally the case with discounts) it won't stack with any other discount i.e. the XIV Legacy Account discount.

It's probably for the best that you don't likely run a department store, because you don't seem to understand how coupons and discounts bring in customers they might not have otherwise obtained.

Blizzard's battle.net holiday/event sales even apply to WoW and its ingame item/service purchases. They wouldn't run sales if they weren't beneficial.

This objection of yours is based on a flawed and false notion that if SE gets a few dollars less from a few customers that the game will die/disappear, and that is simply a ridiculous conclusion to come to based on no evidence. Please find me an example of some other game offering a promotional discount which led to its downfall. You won't find such an example to support your hypothesis because it doesn't exist. There is no precedent for what you're arguing.

[Pixela]

The only way a company would throw away profits by offering a two fer 1 deal is if they don't plan to update it much more, which is probably going to happen when someone as important as Matsui leaves.

As such if this shared sub idea does happen, we need to get a reduction in the base subscription too.

I and others should not pay $12 for this game when you're giving it away to others for free.

[Alhanelem]

The only way a company would throw away profits by offering a two fer 1 deal is if they don't plan to update it much more1) another assertion made with no evidence or basis. Companies offer buy one get ones on popular products and services all the time. They don't just do it when they're going to abandon something.
2) I never suggested a 2 for 1 deal as I said in JUST MY LAST POST. Are you not reading on purpose?

Even if I did propose such a thing, it would be based on the widespread avialability of evidence of companies offering such promotions whom are all still around touday, such as every fast food place ever, every major bix box retailer and probably tons of small ones.

"I and others should not pay $12 for this game when you're giving it away to others for free."

No one is giving anything away for free nor was the idea ever even proposed, but even if they did, there's no obligation to you, they can offer whatever prices they want to anyone at any time and it's their right. If someone else getting a discount on something makes you so salty, well you're just going to have to grow up because it happens every day on just about everything you'll ever buy in your life.

You are being INTENTIONALLY oblivious and obtuse. The point of this kind of and any kind of promotion is to grow their customer base or get more out of their existing customer base, as is the case here. They would be going after more money, not less. This is the last time I'm going to explain this concept to you.

Should McDonald's stop offering buy one big mac get one for a dollar coupons on their app just because you can't stand the fact that someone else paid less money than you?

As I said before, I recieve a permanent discount on my FFXIV subscription as a holder of a legacy account. No one seems to be getting mad at me for paying less than they do. And SE seems to be totally fine with it since they haven't taken it away.

[Pixela]

1) another assertion made with no evidence or basis.

Calm down Ted, it's a post on a game forum not a political discussion on CNN.

We don't know what is going to happen, if it turns out to be some other kind of deal then we can discuss that when it happens.

The point being made is if it is what I said.

However, with things going the way they are if all these things turn out to be true then a reduction in the sub should follow (less developers, others getting it much cheaper, less content etc)

[Alhanelem]

Calm down Ted, it's a post on a game forum not a political discussion on CNN.Calm down? I'm quite calm. You're the one that seems to be panicking and treating every relevant bit of news as some sign of doomsday for FFXI.



We don't know what is going to happen, if it turns out to be some other kind of deal then we can discuss that when it happens.You say this now but you've been making assumptions about what it will be, if it is even a thing at all which we still do not know, this entire time.

[Kalimairo]

Obviously fake.

sounds real tbh
same dude that posted remasters a year ago

[Alhanelem]

sounds real tbh
same dude that posted remasters a year ago
It did occur to me that this year is FFXIV's 10th anniversary, however that is in August, so this still doesn't make sense. I don't know of anything FF related that has an anniversary in February that would make them do some kind of presentation involving the MMOs.

[Rinuko]

I see Pixela makes a thread, I know it was gonna be entertaining.

[Sp1cyryan]

I see Pixela makes a thread, I know it was gonna be entertaining.

That is one way to put it.

[BST]

Well, February the 7th came and went.

<Tumbleweed>

[Pixela]

and that's a good thing!

[Alhanelem]

and that's a good thing!
They could have announced FFXI-2!

Look man, if you like wasting money, that's your perogative. But all your comments here basically amount to "stop liking what I don't like."

[Pixela]

I don't want ffxi-2, I want them to take this game seriously and part of taking the game seriously is charging full price for a game that gets updated.

As such, the rumor being fake is good.

[Alhanelem]

I don't want ffxi-2, I want them to take this game seriously and part of taking the game seriously is charging full price for a game that gets updated.

As such, the rumor being fake is good.
I mean, I never put stock in rumors in the first place, but someone who doesn't understand how promotional discounts can boost sales makes me glad you aren't the proprietor of a retail establishment. Someone could open up a store across from yours and put up a sign that says "10% off the shop across the street," and you being the principled person you are refuses to offer any discounts because serious people pay full price, goes out of business because they don't understand how promotional offers work, while the other place pulls in all your customers because they have the same products for 10% off. Now their business has grown and they're more successful than ever, all because they were willing to eat into their profits a bit in order to get money from people who previously weren't giving them any money.

The only other logical conclusion would be that you're a contrarian, whose sole purpose is only to oppose people you don't like. And sometimes I get the feeling that you specifically post to oppose anything I think is a good idea. I'll stop short of actually accusing you of that though, because I've also been accused of that in the past. Maybe it is a truly held opinion of yours, but given this is far from the only topic you oppose me on without much in the way of an argument against my opinion, it certainly is a possibility.

[Pixela]

who doesn't understand how promotional discounts can boost sales makes me glad you aren't the proprietor of a retail establishment.

You're using business tactics used in retail and trying to apply them to a video game with a sub, which doesn't really work.

A shop can want increased sales in order to get lower per unit prices from the supplier, for instance a supermarket gets much cheaper prices due to how many items they sell compared to a small shop.
A shop can want to put a competing shop out of business.
A shop can sell cheap products to sell other things when you're inside.

These don't apply to XI, they don't even want to grow the playerbase either. If they did they would release the game on ps4, release expansions or advertise it more instead of never mention it any way out of fear of it being confused with ff14.

They have even stated their entire goal is to make the players the game already has happy and not appeal to others.

[Sp1cyryan]

You two are perfect together.

[Alhanelem]

You're using business tactics used in retail and trying to apply them to a video game with a sub, which doesn't really work.There's nothing about a game subscription that doesn't allow sales to work.
Let's say you have 1000 people currently playing FFXIV and paying $12.99 a month for it, and none of them currently play FFXI.
SE offers this promotion: "Subscribe to both FFXI and FFXIV and pay only $20.99 a month, that's a $5 savings!"
Let's say 100 people take them up on this offer and begin playing FFXI.
Yes, SE is getting 5 fewer dollars from them for the added FFXI sub.
But these players were not playing FFXI before, so that's still $7.99 that they are getting from these people that weren't getting before they offered this promotion, so for 100 people, that's $799.00 a month that they were not getting from these customers before, because they wouldn't have signed up if they didn't offer the promotion. $799 is greater than 0 so they are still gaining money from existing customers.

Even if you can come up with some fuzzy math to say why you think I'm wrong, SE already offers discounts in other areas from time to time, on server transfer fees and purchasing the game itself, which can be seen as the first month of the game. They wouldn't offer these discounts unless they thought they would get money from people who wouldn't have given it to them otherwise.

The whole point of a promotion is to get money from people that you weren't getting before, and that's what would be happening here if they offered a combo discount.

And even if every last remaining honest player quit the game today, they'd STILL be making money from the botters and thus FFXI wouldn't get shut down.

[Alhanelem]

You two are perfect together.


A perfect storm, that is....