20th Vanaversary Reddit AMA

[Sp1cyryan]

While r/FFXI will be hosting the official Dev Team AMA Monday May 23rd at 18:30 PDT / 21:30 EDT. r/FinalFantasy11 will simultaneously be holding an unofficial, unsanctioned, and satirical AMA.

There has been a noticeable level of dejection in the community in the wake of the build up to and premier of 20th Anniversary. Players have also been expressing a lack of faith in the future and thus the AMA. This stark level of negativity floating around is unpalatable to say the least. Thus, it was thought that a parody of the event itself would be an opportunity to not only have fun, but to creatively work through frustrations in the community.

Thus, I would like to invite anyone interested to also join the parody Reddit AMA on r/FinalFantasy11. It will be held at the same time to keep it simple. There are also more rules and guidelines in the stickied post there than the official one to keep it sharper or from getting out of control.

[Alhanelem]

This is frankly, kind of disgusting.

Maybe wait till after before you pass judgement?

[Sp1cyryan]

This is frankly, kind of disgusting.

Maybe wait till after before you pass judgement?

Disgusting is a strong response, and I disagree.

Who is passing judgement? Have you been following the reactions on both Reddit, AH.com, or in general?

[Alhanelem]

Disgusting is a strong response, and I disagree.

Who is passing judgement? Have you been following the reactions on both Reddit, AH.com, or in general?
Yeah, I have, and what i've been reading is a bunch of people expecting miracles just because a certain date has come up. You all set yourselves up for this, SE didn't do it for you. All SE ever said (back when this was set into motion) was that they've got a new story for us (which they've been delivering and apparently will last quite a bit longer) and that they have some unspecified stuff planned for the date.

That doesn't mean I'm thrilled about it, because I'm not, but I don't agree the reactions I'm seeing are justified.

Ask the hard questions in the AMA, see if you get any answers, and then maybe I'd support this if they aren't good.

[Sp1cyryan]

Ask the hard questions in the AMA, see if you get any answers, and then maybe I'd support this if they aren't good.

The date is set.

[Alhanelem]

The date is set.
I mean, you do you, but its still ridiculous.
I won't be participating, nor should anyone with any scruples.
The worst thing that can come from participating in the real one is nothing, and the best thing is something. I'll take that over something that's guaranteed to be meaningless feed for trolls at best, and at worst, may cause confusion with the real AMA.

[Catmato]

what i've been reading is a bunch of people expecting miracles
What you're reading is people expecting something. They gave nothing.

I mean, you do you, but its still ridiculous.
I won't be participating, nor should anyone with any scruples.
The worst thing that can come from participating in the real one is nothing, and the best thing is something. I'll take that over something that's guaranteed to be meaningless feed for trolls at best, and at worst, may cause confusion with the real AMA.

You act like you can't have two whole browser tabs open at once. One will (I assume) be heavily moderated while one will be people hanging out having fun. No reason to stick to only one.

[Sfchakan]

One will (I assume) be heavily moderated
The r/finalfantasy11 AMA.


one will be people hanging out having fun
The r/finalfantasy11 AMA.


No reason to stick to only one.
The r/finalfantasy11 AMA.


The problem with the r/ffxi AMA is that the dullards will ask dumb questions and we'll get maybe one good answer out of the dev team before their time is up. Have you seen r/ffxi and it's typical posts and comments? I feel like its safe to say over half of them haven't played the game in years and definitely aren't consistently paying customers.

If you want some really good, new information from the dev team, then check out the two articles discussed here (https://reddit.com/r/finalfantasy11/comments/usu6lo/very_interesting_4_gamer_interview_with_matsui/) and you'll learn plenty. More than you will from the r/ffxi AMA.

[Sp1cyryan]

The r/finalfantasy11 AMA.


The r/finalfantasy11 AMA.


The r/finalfantasy11 AMA.


The problem with the r/ffxi AMA is that the dullards will ask dumb questions and we'll get maybe one good answer out of the dev team before their time is up. Have you seen r/ffxi and it's typical posts and comments? I feel like it's safe to say over half of them haven't played the game in years and definitely aren't consistently paying customers.

If you want some really good, new information from the dev team, then check out the two articles discussed here (https://reddit.com/r/finalfantasy11/comments/usu6lo/very_interesting_4_gamer_interview_with_matsui/) and you'll learn plenty. More than you will from the r/ffxi AMA.

Thanks for the vote of confidence. I am somewhat proud of what we are building with r/FinalFantasy11.
There will be a need for both subreddits (unlike the Wikis) as people who play the game or did any level of research before asking a question will need a curated environment. Meanwhile, posters who ask why the mouse in XI can't work like it does in XIV, how to get past the Three Mage Gate, will there be a PS5 port, or if this game is worth joining will also need a separate place.

[Alhanelem]

What you're reading is people expecting something. They gave nothing. That's entirely false, as they spoke of new content incoming and gave specific timelines for it. Sorry it didn't live up to your unrealistic expectations of new expansions or ports.



Thanks for the vote of confidence. I mean, yeah, every reddit has trolls / silly people, but that includes "yours" or whose-ever it is. And if you're at the real one and ask real questions, well, that increases the odds real questions will be answered.


And you can be pretty sure the AMA will be moderated, regardless of how the rest of the sub is handled. It's not like we haven't had these before.




(unlike the Wikis)What's this supposed to mean? Both the major wikis have their place. Especially when it comes to older stuff in the game, FFXIclopedia is more accurate and less biased (and better organized IMO). But BG has its place as well for the forumulas/statistical data/nerdy stuff. Both sites are still missing various information, but that's because it's all by the users. There is very often information I can find on one that I can't find in the other, in both directions.

This thread is more a shameless plug for your subreddit than it is anything of value, your bias is obvious.

[Sp1cyryan]

What's this supposed to mean? Both the major wikis have their place. Especially when it comes to older stuff in the game, FFXIclopedia is more accurate and less biased (and better organized IMO). But BG has its place as well for the forumulas/statistical data/nerdy stuff. Both sites are still missing various information, but that's because it's all by the users. There is very often information I can find on one that I can't find in the other, in both directions.
It means exactly what I said. There is not a need for two wikis.

Outside of both sites lacking information. Which is obviously the nature of a wiki. The rest of your characterizations are incorrect and mistaken.


This thread is more a shameless plug for your subreddit than it is anything of value, your bias is obvious.

If that were the case then I would have plugged it earlier. This is purely to plug a community event.

[Catmato]

That's entirely false, as they spoke of new content incoming and gave specific timelines for it.

Where exactly did they do this? Do you mean this letter (http://www.playonline.com/pcd/topics/ff11us/detail/19466/detail.html)? The letter where he talks about nothing (https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/58223-June-2021-FINAL-FANTASY-XI-Digest?p=636491&viewfull=1#post636491)new except prime weapons, which the letter admits had already been teased?

It's odd that they've been hyping an anniversary celebration for two years and then just write us a letter with very little information. If that's your idea of a celebration, please don't invite me to your next birthday party.


Sorry it didn't live up to your unrealistic expectations of new expansions or ports
I never said or expected anything of the sort.

[Sp1cyryan]

If that's your idea of a celebration, please don't invite me to your next birthday party.

Sugar free gluten free kosher halal vegan vanilla ice cream cake saved in the freezer since 2019 with bio degradable sprinkles on top served on recycled wood pulp plates. Right after the cruelty free pin the tail on the anniversary. No confetti though, it is bad for the birds.

[Catmato]

saved in the freezer since 2019

I need to know, was it a freezer with auto-defrost? I need to know how freezer-burnt it is.

[scaevola]

Sugar free gluten free kosher halal vegan vanilla ice cream cake saved in the freezer since 2019 with bio degradable sprinkles on top served on recycled wood pulp plates. Right after the cruelty free pin the tail on the anniversary. No confetti though, it is bad for the birds.

His birthday present is the incredible feeling of self-satisfaction you'll grant him when he can look you in the eye and say, "well, nobody told you you wouldn't be getting sugar free gluten free kosher halal vegan vanilla ice cream cake saved in the freezer since 2019 with bio degradable sprinkles on top served on recycled wood pulp plates."

[Sp1cyryan]

I need to know, was it a freezer with auto-defrost? I need to know how freezer-burnt it is.

Manual defrost Mitsubishi chest freezer.

Beverages are water from a garden hose via an aquifer underneath an industrial zone. Served in Bugs Bunny themed Dixie Cups with paper straws and Shamwow napkins.

[Tarmarkvar]

Did SE ever actually hype up anything big happening for the 20th Anniversary? Or did people just ramp up their expectations because 20 is a nice round number and we are naturally inclined to believe big things on round numbered years? Did they do anything big 10 years ago?

[Sp1cyryan]

Did SE ever actually hype up anything big happening for the 20th Anniversary? Or did people just ramp up their expectations because 20 is a nice round number and we are naturally inclined to believe big things on round numbered years? Did they do anything big 10 years ago?

It depends how you define hype. People read in pretty deeply on them announcing late 2019 that updates be smaller whole they worked on TVR and got ready for the anniversary.

[Dragoy]

Did SE ever actually hype up anything big happening for the 20th Anniversary? Or did people just ramp up their expectations because 20 is a nice round number and we are naturally inclined to believe big things on round numbered years? Did they do anything big 10 years ago?

I think some of it might have been translation making it seem more like there would be a big surprise, but when actually looking at the (English) statements I could find some time ago, I mostly see it like they were more talking about things they have been putting out during all this time.

One such comment here from 2020 [1]:


Yoji Fujito: I’m sure there are some of you who are looking for something on the scale of an expansion, but there are a variety of factors at play preventing us from doing so. Like Matsui-san says, we’re hoping that maybe we can do a fan event, or look at doing more in-game events that are a bit different from what we’ve provided up until now.

1. https://gamerescape.com/2020/04/10/11-questions-for-the-final-fantasy-xi-dev-team/

[Catmato]

Did SE ever actually hype up anything big happening for the 20th Anniversary? Or did people just ramp up their expectations because 20 is a nice round number and we are naturally inclined to believe big things on round numbered years? Did they do anything big 10 years ago?


At the end of the show we mentioned that starting next fiscal year, we're going to focus our development and operations on a long-term goal of the twentieth anniversary. As such, there may be some time where the version updates may feel a bit lighter, but we're hoping to be able to deliver something that can surprise everyone later on. (https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/55210-Freshly-Picked-Vana-diel-44-Digest?p=614384&viewfull=1#post614384)

What's the surprise? Is there an announcement still to come? Lighter version updates seems to imply that there's going to be a larger version update in the context of the anniversary. This is the big one and where it started.


Finally, I’d like to remind you all that we are only a scant six months away from FINAL FANTASY XI’s 20th Vana’versary. We’ve got more fun stuff planned in the lead up to the celebration, and I hope you’ll be with us in Vana’diel every step of the way. (https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/58758-Announcing-the-November-Version-Update?p=639761&viewfull=1#post639761)

When/what is the nature of the celebration?



That being said, there are still a few months before we can really celebrate, so we’ll keep our nose to the grindstone and not get to fan ahead of ourselves. (https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/59046-Announcing-the-January-Version-Update?p=641430&viewfull=1#post641430)

Nose to the grindstone on what? Business as usual?



We’re rapidly approaching XI’s 20th Vana’versary!
While I am happy to celebrate this momentous occasion with you all, at the same time the development team wishes we had just a little bit more time! (https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/59251-Announcing-the-March-Version-Update?p=642623&viewfull=1#post642623)

More time for what? Are they still preparing something?


Only one month to go until the 20th Vana’versary! We’re ramping up in the home stretch to bring you an exciting celebration of 20 years in Vana’diel. The entire team is looking forward to sharing in the festivities right along with you. (https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/59324-Announcing-the-April-Version-Update?p=643074&viewfull=1#post643074)

Where's the celebration? Where are the festivities?

A letter (http://www.playonline.com/pcd/topics/ff11us/detail/19466/detail.html) and some interviews (https://we-are-vanadiel.finalfantasyxi.com/)are just fluff to most players. Three years of talking about the anniversary made people hopeful that the anniversary would bring some sort of actual change or addition to the game, not just some external stuff.

I personally knew better than to expect a new expansion, a new job, or anything majorly significant, but I still expected something. Maybe if SE and the development team would communicate with the english-speaking playerbase, they could have toned down player expectations (https://twinfinite.net/2019/03/3-things-final-fantasy-xis-big-20th-anniversary-surprise-could-be/) when we were clearly making a much bigger deal about it than they were, at least in regards to the game itself.

[Alhanelem]

When/what is the nature of the celebration?
I guess you're not aware of the WE ARE VANADIEL site which was specifically created to lead up to this.



What's the surprise?I'm about 99% certain the "something later on" they were talking about was The Voracious Resurgence.




Where's the celebration? Where are the festivities?I mean, what do you want? Balloons raining down from the sky? Ball drop in May in Times Square? At least part of the event is literally every content campaign being active as well as new ones the afformentioned site remembering the history of the game along with interviews, reflections, and other stuff.



they could have toned down player expectations (https://twinfinite.net/2019/03/3-things-final-fantasy-xis-big-20th-anniversary-surprise-could-be/) when we were clearly making a much bigger deal about it than they were, at least in regards to the game itself. It's nobody's fault but the players that their expectations were inflated. The thing is, people didn't really talk about it all that much either here or on twitter, basically the places they look, so I don't think SE had any reason to believe we were expecting things they weren't prepared to deliver.

I guess I'm the only one who honestly expected that it wasn't going to be MAJOR NEW CONTENT or the announcement of a remaster or an expansion or something along those lines. SE never said or did anything to imply to me that something of this magnitude was happening. But maybe I'm just living under a rock and didn't see all the player-driven hoopla over something that was expected to happen?

Regardless, someone is sure to ask them a question in the AMA about how they feel SE built up overly high expectations as to what the anniversary was going to bring and ask what SE's response to that criticism is. It would be hard to avoid answeringif as many people feel this way as you suggest.



not just some external stuff.I mean, maybe you're forgetting that they did in fact announce a new content for empyrean reofrging, the new super weapon line, and they also stated that we're only "halfway" through The Voracious Resurgence, which I actually expecting was going to conclude on the annviersary. It's not like we're getting nothing at all.

You claim your expectations were realistic but imply you still feel let down, even though they discussed and gave dates for new content, in particular a means of reforging empyrean has been awaited for like several years now. It was actually a slightly big deal to me to finally get a date for when I can bring my personal favorite job gear to the forefront again (well, for the jobs I play at least lol).

I don't feel like we got nothing, I feel like we got exactly what I expected- some new content announcements and some past reflection in interviews, and the slew of content campaigns that was likely going to come with the typical anniversary event anyway.



Outside of both sites lacking information. Which is obviously the nature of a wiki. The rest of your characterizations are incorrect and mistaken.No, they are not incorrect or mistaken. Sorry. Carry on bowing before the BG gods if you like, but I can find innaccuracies on BG that are correct on FFXIclopedia and vice versa. And quite frankly, particualrly on quests missions and the like, the details are presented in a better and more friendly way.

Not to mention certain other things like the BG article on Ballista that basically tells people not to do it. A wiki shouldn't be judging the merits of the game features, it should be presenting the information about them without bias. I still periodically hold ballista events- it's a fun release and break from the grind, that's what it's supposed to be and is entirely enjoyable if you don't pretend it's supposed to be something more than that.
While I'm tempted to create an account to fix this, somehow I have a feeling someone would have a problem with it.

[Sp1cyryan]

No, they are not incorrect or mistaken. Sorry. Carry on bowing before the BG gods if you like, but I can find innaccuracies on BG that are correct on FFXIclopedia and vice versa. And quite frankly, particualrly on quests missions and the like, the details are presented in a better and more friendly way.

Not to mention certain other things like the BG article on Ballista that basically tells people not to do it. A wiki shouldn't be judging the merits of the game features, it should be presenting the information about them without bias. I still periodically hold ballista events- it's a fun release and break from the grind, that's what it's supposed to be and is entirely enjoyable if you don't pretend it's supposed to be something more than that.
While I'm tempted to create an account to fix this, somehow I have a feeling someone would have a problem with it.

I wrote that because it is dead content and stating that to someone curious about it while they look for the actual information there is more useful, and no one else was going to edit it. You could only use Clopedia for it because it is so old and unchanged that someone 15 years ago wrote all you needed to know about it because no one edits it there either. As for bias, calling it me bowing to the "BG Gods" is no different a level of bias, if not worse.

Furthermore calling this "telling people not to do it" or similar absolute nonsense is ridiculous:
More over, Ballista and it's successor Brenner, while considered fun are generally just an event in which players enter to test certain spells or abilities for game mechanic research. Ballista and Brenner are long-forgotten and as a result unpopular content. Both events are thus very imbalanced since their release countless years ago.
That is just how it is.


I still periodically hold ballista events
Naturally.

As for finding inaccuracies, there is no room for anyone to talk when they neither fix nor report them. Everyone claims these things, but since they rarely if ever cite the alleged inaccuracies then there is no proof it was even a real inaccuracy. Let alone one of consequence because people like to point at a position that on the border of two coordinates or something similar and yell "INNACURACIES!" I could really drive the whole wiki argument into the ground, but that would require writing a novel that fall upon blind eyes, and is not a good investment.


That all being said, so how about that AMA? Less than 4 days now!

[Catmato]

I'm about 99% certain the "something later on" they were talking about was The Voracious Resurgence.
They started the 20th anniversary in 2020 (https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/57117-August-6-2020-%28JST%29-Version-Update?p=629638&viewfull=1#post629638)?


I mean, what do you want?
Something. Anything. Maybe an announcement of new content, new gear, some kind of news beyond "here's when you can expect these things you already knew about".

At least part of the event is literally every content campaign being active
Nothing new.


It's nobody's fault but the players that their expectations were inflated. The thing is, people didn't really talk about it all that much either here or on twitter, basically the places they look, so I don't think SE had any reason to believe we were expecting things they weren't prepared to deliver.
Then (https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/59158-Is-there-secrecy-over-the-20th-anniversary) you (https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/59040-Where-are-we-in-FFXI?p=641515&viewfull=1#post641515) clearly (https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/58636-Classic-Servers?p=640146&viewfull=1#post640146) weren't (https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/58773-Should-assist-be-retooled-as-a-general-help-channel-for-all?p=640097&viewfull=1#post640097) paying (https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/4771-Craft-Skill-Limitations?p=639079&viewfull=1#post639079) attention (https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/57957-Don-t-forget-the-casual-players?p=635732&viewfull=1#post635732).


I guess I'm the only one who honestly expected that it wasn't going to be MAJOR NEW CONTENT or the announcement of a remaster or an expansion or something along those lines.
...
It would be hard to avoid answeringif as many people feel this way as you suggest.
Do you, or do you not believe that many other people feel the same way I do?



I mean, maybe you're forgetting that they did in fact announce a new content for empyrean reofrging,
Almost a year ago. (https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/58223-June-2021-FINAL-FANTASY-XI-Digest?p=636491&viewfull=1#post636491)


the new super weapon line,
Teased in the last TVR update.

and they also stated that we're only "halfway" through The Voracious Resurgence,
Not much of an announcement.

It's not like we're getting nothing at all.
I disagree.



I don't feel like we got nothing, I feel like we got exactly what I expected- some new content announcements and some past reflection in interviews, and the slew of content campaigns that was likely going to come with the typical anniversary event anyway.
I'm glad you're happy. Many people aren't.

[Sp1cyryan]

So we are all in agreement on the importance of this secondary AMA then, right?

[Pixela]

It will be just as useful as the "official" one so why not.

All we will get is "it's too difficult to do that!", yeah it's difficult for me to pay my sub lately too.

[Tarmarkvar]

It will be just as useful as the "official" one so why not.

All we will get is "it's too difficult to do that!", yeah it's difficult for me to pay my sub lately too.

I mean, that's kind of a hollow threat. Businesses don't do well by catering to their most fickle and demanding customers. You are REALLY not as important as you think you are.

[Tarmarkvar]

So we are all in agreement on the importance of this secondary AMA then, right?

It definitely has cathartic value for the vocal minority of people who are displeased with the game but for some reason keep playing.

[Tarmarkvar]

I personally knew better than to expect a new expansion, a new job, or anything majorly significant, but I still expected something. Maybe if SE and the development team would communicate with the english-speaking playerbase, they could have toned down player expectations (https://twinfinite.net/2019/03/3-things-final-fantasy-xis-big-20th-anniversary-surprise-could-be/) when we were clearly making a much bigger deal about it than they were, at least in regards to the game itself.

So what exactly DID you expect? They added master levels. Sounds like they're about to add a new series of ultimate weapons, and reforging of Empyrean armor to +2 and +3 levels. But you seem to have decided that those don't count for some arbitrary reason.

I mean I keep hearing that this anniversary thing doesn't live up to anybody's expectations, but people aren't defining those expectations. Or they are, and the expectations are just unrealistic. I don't know how much you know about software development, but it's not "ask some Star Trek like supercomputer to do things and it happens". If they don't have the staff to implement something, they aren't going to implement it. If the product isn't bringing in enough money to justify hiring additional staff, they don't hire additional staff.

It isn't Square Enix's fault that a couple dozen malcontents let their imaginations run wild and infer statements that were never there. A round number doesn't magically create the business justification or the staff to make a huge remaster that virtually nobody except graphics nerds will care about, or a big new expansion.

[Fawkes]

So what exactly DID you expect? They added master levels. Sounds like they're about to add a new series of ultimate weapons, and reforging of Empyrean armor to +2 and +3 levels. But you seem to have decided that those don't count for some arbitrary reason.

Well for me, because of that quote "we're going to focus our development and operations on a long-term goal of the twentieth anniversary", I expected something timed specifically to the 20th anniversary. I cannot assume he was talking about TVR or master levels or new weapons or empy+3 armor, none of those things happened on the 20th anniversary. And none of them seem very anniversary-related, they seem like regular content updates that are only interesting to current endgame players.

[Sp1cyryan]

It will be just as useful as the "official" one so why not.

All we will get is "it's too difficult to do that!", yeah it's difficult for me to pay my sub lately too.

It may be even more useful. As it may very well draw wild conclusions from bad Google translate interviews and use that as explanations.

I also expect the questions to be better. Even the cheese sandwich tier ones.


It definitely has cathartic value for the vocal minority of people who are displeased with the game but for some reason keep playing.

Not sure dissatisfied customers are so small of a minority. Sure the ones that can't accept how things are rather than how they want them to be, no matter the justification. Will not be happy, but hey as long as they aren't winning over the public sentiment then it is all good.

[Alhanelem]

That is just how it is.It absolutely is telling people not to do it. If your intro to a peice of content in the game says "it's not popular and nobody does it," that stacks the deck against anyone else doing it. It's not something that needs to be said. It is biased against the content and discourages people from trying it.

A wiki article about a game feature should not be judging its merits. It should be simply presenting the details of the content and letting people make their own decisions. If something is unpopular, people can tell that pretty easily based on the details of it and coming to the conclusion themselves they don't want to do it because it doesn't seem interesting. That's called making decisions for oneself. This article effectively makes the decision for them.

Compare this to the FFXIclopedia article, which contains all the same information but not the jabs at its popularity. That by itself makes it a better quality article as it isn't prejuding the content for you, it's merely presenting the avialable information and letting the reader form their own opinion. It's things like this that get in the way of them improving their reputation. (side note, BG doesn't even have the correct area name for Diorama Abdhaljs-Ghelsba (whose page is also mostly blank), while FFXIclopedia has a complete page about the zone. Tell you what, I'll go ahead and make an account to rectify these deficiencies. Don't let it be said that people complain about these things but never do anything about them :) )




Sp1cyryan is one of the leading editors of BGwiki, if he quit today we would all be worse off for it.Based on his response to the above discussion, I can not agree with this statement, as he is advocating a biased writing practice.

And even if he quit today, BG would still exist, and the other resources out there would still exist, people would still disseminate information. If he quits, someone else will step up to the plate, it's that simple.

[Alhanelem]

So we are all in agreement on the importance of this secondary AMA then, right?
perhaps it's important to you, for some twisted reason, but that doesn't make it broadly important to everyone. You may be a significant wiki contributor, but facts like that do not mean you represent the playerbase.



Something. Anything. Maybe an announcement of new content, new gear, some kind of news beyond "here's when you can expect these things you already knew about".


They DID announce new content. They DID announce new gear. Are you really saying becuase there were teases before that it doesn't count as new content, even though it's not out yet?



Teased in the last TVR update.I guess you are. But sorry, you're wrong. We don't have this content yet, we don't have these weapons yet, therefore it's new content. Vaguely referring to it in the past ("teasing") does not make the content suddenly not new, because we don't have it yet.



Do you, or do you not believe that many other people feel the same way I do?I don't. That's why the word "if" is in there. I believe you're embellishing the situation.





Also, some in this community who are the most vocal are also sometimes more important than just another subscriber. Every single player of this game is important both to the community and to the game's continued existence. Some particular individual person being vocal about their own personal opinion is not particularly more important than anyone else just because they're doing that.

Look at me, I'm pretty vocal. Do I think I'm more important than anyone else? No. We all have a role to play in the game community.

[Sp1cyryan]

It absolutely is telling people not to do it. If your intro to a peice of content in the game says "it's not popular and nobody does it," that stacks the deck against anyone else doing it. It's not something that needs to be said. It is biased against the content and discourages people from trying it.

A wiki article about a game feature should not be judging its merits. It should be simply presenting the details of the content and letting people make their own decisions. If something is unpopular, people can tell that pretty easily based on the details of it and coming to the conclusion themselves they don't want to do it because it doesn't seem interesting. That's called making decisions for oneself. This article effectively makes the decision for them.

Compare this to the FFXIclopedia article, which contains all the same information but not the jabs at its popularity. That by itself makes it a better quality article as it isn't prejuding the content for you, it's merely presenting the avialable information and letting the reader form their own opinion. It's things like this that get in the way of them improving their reputation. (side note, BG doesn't even have the correct area name for Diorama Abdhaljs-Ghelsba (whose page is also mostly blank), while FFXIclopedia has a complete page about the zone. Tell you what, I'll go ahead and make an account to rectify these deficiencies. Don't let it be said that people complain about these things but never do anything about them :) )



Based on his response to the above discussion, I can not agree with this statement, as he is advocating a biased writing practice.

And even if he quit today, BG would still exist, and the other resources out there would still exist, people would still disseminate information. If he quits, someone else will step up to the plate, it's that simple.

Our understandings are so far removed that we can't have a meaningful discussion on this, at least not here. So you can just think what you like on this.


perhaps it's important to you, for some twisted reason, but that doesn't make it broadly important to everyone. You may be a significant wiki contributor, but facts like that do not mean you represent the playerbase.

If I could suggest, observational skills are of value.

Probably for the best though that you just hang out here. It is going to be a good time if enough leg work goes into it.


Look at me, I'm pretty vocal. Do I think I'm more important than anyone else? No. We all have a role to play in the game community.

Lol.

[Alhanelem]

Our understandings are so far removed that we can't have a meaningful discussion on this, at least not here. So you can just think what you like on this.



If I could suggest, observational skills are of value.

Probably for the best though that you just hang out here. It is going to be a good time if enough leg work goes into it.



Lol.
We could possibly have a meaningful discussion, it's just you don't seem to be interested. The rest of your post is evidence enough of that.

At any rate, I of course intend to view the official AMA. There's enough silliness outside of parodies like yours to keep me plenty occupied if the need arises. I don't expect to be wowed by it, but I'm also not cynical enough to join in with a parody party of overtly-disgruntled players.

[Alhanelem]

Well for me, because of that quote "we're going to focus our development and operations on a long-term goal of the twentieth anniversary", I expected something timed specifically to the 20th anniversary. I cannot assume he was talking about TVR or master levels or new weapons or empy+3 armor, none of those things happened on the 20th anniversary. And none of them seem very anniversary-related, they seem like regular content updates that are only interesting to current endgame players.
the *announcement* was tied to the anniversary. And it's not like there wasn't an event at all in associatation with it. Aside from the usual campaigns, there was also a minigame event, the producer message, the new title music (which is honestly really nice imo), and the Yoshida interview on WE ARE VANA'DIEL, as well as the extension of its game history timeline.

I agree it's not too dramatic, but I'm seeing all this expectation of things they never hinted at or promised. They didn't say anything wild was going to happen, like a giant moon falling from the sky, or whatever other dramatic event you could imagine.

[Sp1cyryan]

AMA thread will be posted by 19:00 EDT (23:00 UTC) today in r/FinalFantasy11 for questions to be answered. 21:30 EDT begins the start of questions being answered. Until 23:00 EDT.

Feel free to simultaneously address posts to u/FFXI_DevTeam

[Sp1cyryan]

Annnnd here we go: https://www.reddit.com/r/finalfantasy11/comments/uwcz44/20th_vanaversary_unofficial_ffxi_developer_ama/


Ask the hard questions in the AMA, see if you get any answers, and then maybe I'd support this if they aren't good.
So do you support it now?

I will leave the parody AMA open for a few days or so.

[Alhanelem]

So do you support it now?

The actual AMA wasn't amazing or anything (too much "we can't" and not enough "we'll look into it"), but it was better than I could have expectations for, as they addressed things I honestly didn't expect them to.

[Sp1cyryan]

The actual AMA wasn't amazing or anything (too much "we can't" and not enough "we'll look into it"), but it was better than I could have expectations for, as they addressed things I honestly didn't expect them to.

Basically then no matter what the outcome you "maybe" weren't going to ever support it?

[Dragoy]

Will we ever see the thing posted here, I wonder. (I don't like going to reddit.)

[Alhanelem]

Basically then no matter what the outcome you "maybe" weren't going to ever support it?
I suppose it might be entertaining to read at some point. But I can't say I'm in a big hurry.

Maybe you didn't like the real AMA. But I thiought it was "okay", and probably better than the last one they did, low a bar as that may be.

[Alhanelem]

Will we ever see the thing posted here, I wonder. (I don't like going to reddit.)
You don't have to have an account to read it. The official AMA thread does not have any user comments in between, it is only the questions and answers, so no trolling or silliness.

But they will probably repost it elsewhere at some point.

[Sp1cyryan]

(I don't like going to reddit.)

Yet somehow being the only editor on the entire site of GE is okay?

[Pixela]

The AMA and the 5 hour stream were both PR disasters, even JP players are mad if you check 2ch. Wtf is the point doing an AMA if you have no positive news to tell and every answer is no. Why would you even waste your time doing that? It's almost as if they are trying to kill the game at this point.

What they need to do is throw a bone, and reconsider adding an exciting new zone at the end of TVR and tell us that now. If they do that minimal thing, they can turn around a lot of the damage they just did in the minds of their audience.

Sadly they are so set in their ways, they will probably just do nothing and retreat back into their shell.

[Sp1cyryan]

The AMA and the 5 hour stream were both PR disasters, even JP players are mad if you check 2ch. Wtf is the point doing an AMA if you have no positive news to tell and every answer is no. Why would you even waste your time doing that? It's almost as if they are trying to kill the game at this point.

What they need to do is throw a bone, and reconsider adding an exciting new zone at the end of TVR and tell us that now. If they do that minimal thing, they can turn around a lot of the damage they just did in the minds of their audience.

Sadly they are so set in their ways, they will probably just do nothing and retreat back into their shell.

They aren't trying to kill the game. The best question asked was what they would do with an unlimited budget. It shows that they do care. It is corporate bureaucracy that has the game hamstrung as they run anything out of the XIV team. The game is likely a discretionary footnote because (hyperbole incoming) some old capitalist practicing kyudogi in the back of SE's HQ doesn't see the potential return on investment.

[Alhanelem]

The AMA and the 5 hour stream were both PR disasters, even JP players are mad if you check 2ch.citation needed

I mean, I won't say I was impressed or anything, but "PR disaster?" come on lol. This AMA was far better than the last one, even if that really isn't saying much.



They aren't trying to kill the game. The best question asked was what they would do with an unlimited budget. It shows that they do care. It is corporate bureaucracy that has the game hamstrung This. But to clarify, Naoki Yoshida, Producer/Director on FFXIV and also the head of the SE business unit that controls both MMOs at one point actually saved the game from potentially coming to an end. He doesn't want to see that happen either, but even as the head of the business unit, he still has to convince the corporate executives that investing more in it is a good idea. And that's probably just too hard of a sell.

Note also they seemed warmer to the idea of a combined subscription than they have previously. So maybe that will happen at some point.

[Dragoy]

Yet somehow being the only editor on the entire site of GE is okay?
I forgot I actually posted that thought... oopsies.

It's just that I don't like the Reddit UI and such... at all... similar to how I can't deal with wikia/fandom at all.

But yeah, I guess it might seem a little silly for me to work on GE, but it is the most comfortable option available for me at this time. The other options have other issues, or maybe it's me having issues with them. Next best one would be a local instance, which I could do because I do run mediawiki servers locally for testing purposes...


You don't have to have an account to read it. The official AMA thread does not have any user comments in between, it is only the questions and answers, so no trolling or silliness.
Yeah, I just rather not go there at all. I don't like the way they do the site in general, similar to wikia/fandom...

[Pixela]

Note also they seemed warmer to the idea of a combined subscription than they have previously. So maybe that will happen at some point.

And on that day, FFXI dies because all new content will have ceased.

[Alhanelem]

And on that day, FFXI dies because all new content will have ceased.
There is zero correlation between making an offer like this and stopping content. Look we spent a whole th read establishing your misguided reasons for thinking a 2 game subscription discount is bad. We know already, but this is an even more ridiculous leap than your previous statements.

Money from an existing customer to play another game, even if it's less money, is still more money than they had before. Retail establishments online and otherwise have sales and discounts of various sorts all the time. Getting a new person through the door (or in FFXI's case, even someone who played once upon a time)

SE getting a dollar or two less from a few people who would not have played the game otherwise is still more money that they would not have gotten at all otherwise. This concept seems to be alien to you, as does SE's profit margin on a subscription fee, which likely far greater than you think. SE can absolutely afford earining a couple dollars less than the full sub price from a bunch of people who are *already* giving them $13-15 a month excluding extra services. Plus those people could also buy the mog wardrobes later and that really costs them nothing so that already makes up for it.

Maybe you're not aware of this but there are plenty of people who play FFXI who have been paying a discounted sub fee since the beginning. Oddly enough, SE hasn't stopped content for that game despite offering a significant discount to thousands of players for the last 8 years. You might also be forgetting all the people who currently play FFXI and whom have no interest in FFXIV, whom will still be paying full price subs, and given the game has been running for years in its current state, that is clearly enough to keep the game running with updates as usual, regardless of the number of FFXIV players that would take SE up on such an offer.

And as far as the other possible meaning of your post, "They'll only do this when they stop updating the game," Well, everyone would probably be getting a discount at that point. So that would be meaningless.

[Pixela]

If they stop content additions they better reduce the sub for everyone.

[Cesil]

If they stop content additions they better reduce the sub for everyone.

I agree, if they aren't adding anything new and just rehashing the same content, then something has to give.

[Alhanelem]

I agree, if they aren't adding anything new and just rehashing the same content, then something has to give.He didn't say "rehashing," he said stop content. Period.

[Sp1cyryan]

If they stop content additions they better reduce the sub for everyone.

They have never raised the sub price. So they also should not lower it.

That being said , they aren't stopping content.

[Catmato]

Thank you SquareEnix for finally delivering the 20th Anniversary surprise that you announced, in the form of of the Bonanza weapon voucher, even if it is three years late.

[radar]

They should make it a tradition to give a new one every anniversary, then people can get multiple.