Developers, SquareEnix: What are the REAL chances of us seeing NEW areas?

[Darkhaund]

And for areas i mean BRAND new zones, landmasses continents, etc?
Not reused zones of the future, or another "alternate vanadiel" or the past of the past?

Totally new, unseen, never-before-explored areas of vanadiel?

My guess is that the chance are slim to none at all!

Guys, what do you think of this?

If we get any new stuff will be [F] North Gustaberg, F = Future or some crazy thing like that.

I think it is about time we stop dreaming and hoping for new content in regards to land

[blowfin]

Guys, what do you think of this?

I think this is about the millionth time it's been asked. The answer is indeed "highly unlikely". They are basically out of room on the PS2 and would need to either a) take zones out of the game to replace them with new ones or b) drop ps2 support so the game can continue to grow.

[Starcade]

I think the answer is an effective zero.

With the current state of FFXIV, one has to wonder if the MMO division of Square-Enix is as healthy as we'd like it to be.

I think not.

[Octaviane]

SE will have to make a very conscious decision to stop supporting the PS2 in order for totally new areas to be incorporated. They are unlikely to do this in the near future since there are still a very large number of PS2 users. SE would lose considerable revenue. Sony wants nothing to do with expanding the HDD space on PS2, even though by far and away it is the most reliable platform for FFXI to be played on and FFXI was specifically coded for PS2. The only issues I, as a PS2 user have is that I sometimes get stuck at warp NPC's, Explorer moogles and event moogles, plus an occasional d/c. All other platforms have unique issues/problems. Ask most x-box and pc users. PS3 does not support the game except in rare instances.

Since, allegedly, FF14 is fail, SE is going to keep it's money on FFXI, but, as yet, I am guessing, does not have the money/staff/man hours to expand to new areas, nor can it afford to risk losing a lot of it's PS2 player base.

We can't all afford to buy an X-box, or PC/laptop, new or used, so that argument flies out of the window. :)

[Kuvo]

Maybe SE should develop a FFXI PC/laptop with logos and everything. Keep it in expensive since the amount of computer power used to run ffxi is next to nothing now. Or people can just stop being cheap! If you trade in all your old ps2 games and sell your OLD system you will have enough money for a newer PC. Maybe not an alienware elite MX series or anything but a much better system then what the ps2 can do. I work for an electronics retailer and I can tell you that even if you buy a PC or laptop from a retailer you can get a good low end machine that can run ffxi at max settings (which are low to begin with) and have more then enough memory for it. All for less then $400, even less if you already have a monitor to use. SE just needs to drop the PS2 and move on. What company stays alive in this economy working in the past. NOT ONE.

The point is unless your a 15 year old that can't get a job yet then stop being cheap and update your stuff.

[Octaviane]

First, I expected a response like "unless your a 15 year old that can't get a job yet then stop being cheap and update your stuff."

I am not 15, I work, and probably for a lot longer than you have had hot dinners or worn long pants. I have different priorities in life as you will someday. New or used is not in my budget, nor will it ever be. The same applies I am sure to a lot of people. My PS2 suits me just fine, and when SE stops supporting it, then I will quit FFXI. :)

[Kuvo]

My post wasn't directed right at you it was for everyone with that same excuse not moving on from past technology. But since you wanna open up that kind of a response then that shows the kind of person you are. Sure maybe your not a 15 your old that can't get a job but with your kind of response it looks like your a 30+ old with no life. And before you blast me, I run an electronics store that pulls down 40k a day in consumer electronics so for me staying up on technology is my life which i can easily afford.

Either way my point stands for SE get rid of old technology so not only your company can move on and grow but your client base can expand. Get rid of PS2 may drop in some of your current client bases but it will pick up a great deal in the long term because the limit restrictions are gone.

Back to the OP. Yes it would be great to see new areas, maybe not by adding new landmasses but just expand into new areas from existing land. I am getting a little sick of new content coming out with using the same areas in the past or like abyssea using same areas and soon with void and dynamis revisited we'll have a nice rinse and repeat going on. But SE can only work with what they have.

[Greatguardian]

The PS2 isn't holding back new zones anyways. All of the reskins are all entirely new zones and take up just as much space as an original zone would. The choice to stick to reskinned zones was purely creative (or lack thereof, really).

[Nubcakes]

We can't all afford to buy an X-box, or PC/laptop, new or used, so that argument flies out of the window. :)

The PS2 was released in 2000, FFXI was released in 2002 May. You've had close to 9 years to save up and get a 300$ Netbook or X360. Get Out!

[Kuvo]

The PS2 isn't holding back new zones anyways. All of the reskins are all entirely new zones and take up just as much space as an original zone would. The choice to stick to reskinned zones was purely creative (or lack thereof, really).

This might be right, but i'm not too sure how SE does it. I never really looked into it. I have worked on many games for local developers and when creating new zones and areas it does take more storage on the users end. But Greatguardian is right about the areas being reskinned. These only use a small amount of extra user memory because they are using already used space. Unless SE somehow uses things differently I think that if they add entire new zones the user will need more storage space hence why the PS2 is reaching capacity. Again I can't speak for SE but from the game projects I have worked on adding new zones will take more space that the ps2 can not do so removing those users will help to increase the games spectrum.

By the way Greatguardian, where did you get that sig?

[Karbuncle]

In the other thread about new zones, The Reps basically told us "We've got a lot planned, Theres no room For a new expansion."

I asked one of them "IS there any chance we might see an Expansion after this timeline finishes out? or next year, year after?"

I got no response

Its safe to assume that no, We'll never see another new Expansion or Continent/Zone ever.

Maybe 1-2 Re-colored Battlefields (The Concept art of the Giant Crystal Area comes to mind, My bet is a recolored Avatar Arena, or something similar to Riverne), but i don't think we're every going to see another Expansion-level amount of new Zones ever again.

[Octaviane]

Not 30 either, but it's all good and I have a life outside of FFXI too. My original post was constructive and realistic. Again, I have better things to do with $300/$400 dollars than spend it on something that will give me more problems than my PS2 ever does. I am happy for those of you that have the kind of money available to spend on every gadget/game/system. Long live PS2!

[Karbuncle]

I can respect someone in financial situations where they cannot afford 300$ Systems. But if money is so tight you can't find a way in the budget to afford 300$, Why not cancel your FFXI account for 3 years :D!

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(I don't know If I'm being serious.)

[Thicrobrian]

I'm sorry but everyone who saying that they would quit ffxi when they drop FFXI on ps2. Are you using a pc to talk on here? i mean i'm sure it would play ffxi without problems then with 14$ you could get a PS2--> USB and play it just how you did on your ps2. Seeing how you got a month free there your $ for the thing itself.

Even my 2002 can play FFXI on a 64mb mobo video card on pretty much high setting without issue.

[Darkhaund]

For me, it is not about the PS2 or this or that... it is about actually seeing new stuff. If no mayor interesting story is added and new, totally new, areas are included, once i finish WotG storyline, it is goodbye for me

[Kuvo]

For me, it is not about the PS2 or this or that... it is about actually seeing new stuff. If no mayor interesting story is added and new, totally new, areas are included, once i finish WotG storyline, it is goodbye for me

Ya I'm with you. We do need more story content but to be honest i haven't even finished CoP or any of the add on's other then the 3 abyssea ones. So i still have a lot of contect to work on but I'm with you on adding new areas and more content. The point started to turn to anger with the PS2 issues, since thats the reason why SE can't add new content due to the PS2 storage and processor power.

We can only hope and wish SE removes the old technology to make room to expand the world and gameplay.

[Greatguardian]

This might be right, but i'm not too sure how SE does it. I never really looked into it. I have worked on many games for local developers and when creating new zones and areas it does take more storage on the users end. But Greatguardian is right about the areas being reskinned. These only use a small amount of extra user memory because they are using already used space. Unless SE somehow uses things differently I think that if they add entire new zones the user will need more storage space hence why the PS2 is reaching capacity. Again I can't speak for SE but from the game projects I have worked on adding new zones will take more space that the ps2 can not do so removing those users will help to increase the games spectrum.

By the way Greatguardian, where did you get that sig?

While the zones are reskinned, they don't draw upon existing resources to generate in-game. Everything it just copy-pasted into a new zone .DAT, taking up the same amount of space as the original. This largely has to do with the way FFXI .DATs are packaged. You can't draw individual pieces from any particular .DAT for use in game, only the whole thing or none of it at all. Reskinning on their end just means they can unwrap an existing .DAT, change the textures, add/subtract objects, sometimes even adjust the terrain (eg, Gustaberg [S]), and then repackage their finished product as an entirely new .DAT.

Reskinning FFXI zones doesn't save any hard drive space for the end-user, but it does save a hell of a lot of development time. Instead of going through conceptualization, the creation and tweaking of the map, the implementation of terrain and mob placement, and so on, all the Development Team has to do is take a pre-made Map and change the monster placement.

Honestly, I'd love new zones. I really would. But I really don't think FFXI is receiving very much support from Square Enix in the personnel department. We do have a core Development Team, but it may or may not even include people who are experienced in the creation of new zones. As is, they're probably pumping out as much content as they can manage with the people and tools afforded to them. Unless SE is willing to hire on additional Developers, I doubt we'll be seeing another fullscale Expansion or Continent in the future.

As for my sig, it's a parody of an English translation of a very old JP sig. I think Tsukino_Kaji posted a thread in General Discussion a week or two ago with links to the "Blank" versions after mine was custom-made by Phear.

[TwistedAx]

So I just checked my PS2's Hard Drive's free space. Out of 38,144MB, 24,441MB is still free... More then half.. Hard drive space issue? And with the fairly recent update to how the PS2 updates the files for FFXI? I smell a pile of Bull Sh*t somewhere nearby. They have plenty of room to expand, if they wanted to. Even if other games are installed on the Hard Drive, there would still be an abundance of room left over.

[Catsby]

So I just checked my PS2's Hard Drive's free space. Out of 38,144MB, 24,441MB is still free... More then half.. Hard drive space issue? And with the fairly recent update to how the PS2 updates the files for FFXI? I smell a pile of Bull Sh*t somewhere nearby. They have plenty of room to expand, if they wanted to. Even if other games are installed on the Hard Drive, there would still be an abundance of room left over.

There are other parts of your PS2 besides the hard drive that do important things so you can play your games. You understand that right?

[Greatguardian]

There are other parts of your PS2 besides the hard drive that do important things so you can play your games. You understand that right?

^ This. There were also significantly more games that utilized the PS2 HDD released in JP-only than those that made it to the states. The problem is not the total size of the HDD, but the size of the FFXI partition which is capped at 8GB. Changing that partition size, if it is even possible at all, is a Sony issue. Square can't just decide to do it on their own.

[TwistedAx]

Yes, I am well aware that the PS2 has to use the rest of the system besides the HDD... but wait... isn't that kinda redundantly OBVIOUS?! I was merely pointing out that their claim on HDD space being so limited is just slightly bogus.

No, the partition is NOT capped at 8gb, because all I have on my PS2's HDD is PlayOnline at 1gb, FFXI (which I just checked) is currently at 10,240MB, Tetra Master at 128MB, and Socom II at 256MB. Nothing else installed.

I am also WELL aware there are over 100+ Japanese games that utilize the HDD, and barely 29 USA games that do. the thing is... How many of those games is one person really going to own? I mean, seriously. And the fact that, most of them, once played.. Will most likely be uninstalled. The MAJORITY of the PS2 games (USA, Japanese, Otherwise...) still do NOT use the HDD. I've owned well into 70~80 PS2 games (Lost track, lol). 3 Of them utilized the HDD at all, And it was NOT by much.

I'm all for new zones. I would LOVE a real, new Story Line. New, Unique enemies. I DO love my PS2, but I am NOT a PS2 fanboy. I play on PC, I USED to play on PS2 when that's ALL THERE FK'N' WAS to play on (During Pre-US release, Mind you. Yes, I had a Japanese PS2. Just for playing XI.) (Love for ones console is VASTLY different from fanboyism.)

The thing is, they DO do things very differently. Each of the zones may be just a reskin, but the entire zone is packaged in its in its OWN .dat file. This is done for EVERY zone. Its the reason a game that should now only be about 7gb is actually more like 10gb now on the ps2. And it has always been at LEAST 8+gb.

Adding new Content is one thing. But changing the base code to lower space required is impossible. Changing the code for any truly brand new features is also more less impossible (Such as disabling character blinking when changing gear, For PC making a REAL, decent windowed mode [no, their windowed mode is not a real windowed mode, its a wannabe. it puts the entire game in its own special little emulated instance and forces that into a window.. in extremely simple terms.], parses, information overlays, ......how the game accesses data it has stored on the system thus making it impossible to save much space compared to the current system [the .dat system]).

Take into consideration, that its far to late in the game for them to change such base coding, the data is buried FAR too deep in the game for them to change anything so drastically game changing because they just don't have the resources to do so or the documentation on what everything does where and how, because old people left and never made the proper documents on it (most likely scenario..) They would have to completely reverse engineer their own games base coding.

Also. If the PS2 is a bane on FFXI, then you would have to count xblolx as well, since they use the same code, just repackaged to work on that platform. (PS3 in rare instances too, Such as my Release 60gb [500gb upgraded hdd] PS3 Phat, which runs XI quite happily. Not to mention every other PS2 game in existence.)

[Catsby]

It seems like the technical design for the game didn't plan on exceeding the PS2's life span. (once again) Hopefully development is seriously considering a ground up rebuild of the game or a migration to existing tech so they have more to work with.

[Laraul]

They're are six or so unused area id numbers. Do you people realize though, that creating a new area from scratch is the most time intensive part of development? The development team isn't anywhere near the size it was. Besides no one started complaining about areas until Abyssea came out.

[Starcade]

Since, allegedly, FF14 is fail, SE is going to keep it's money on FFXI, but, as yet, I am guessing, does not have the money/staff/man hours to expand to new areas, nor can it afford to risk losing a lot of it's PS2 player base.


The fact is that I believe that their entire MMO division is failing. Partially, IMHO, because of their unwillingness to discipline their playerbase (why think they can work two MMOs properly if they can't do one?), and partially because they tried to rush out XIV so they could kill XI.

[Simian]

It has already been stated more than once that we can not get the new translations everyone wants without sacrificing some old ones due to the space limitations of the PS2. Microsoft will in the near future pull support for Windows XP and will only officially support Vista and 7 but we all know there will still be XP users just as there are still some Win98 users still out there, but those older systems can not handle newer web content and if you do not need the newer content then people are happy with their old reliables.

The point is that PS2 is near capacity as it is. There will be a point in time where support for it will have to be pulled for the game to improve beyond reskinning the areas we currently have.

There are several ways this can go. SE can offer slightly different versions for each operating platform or perhaps link up with a computer manufacturer to offer a better economical system in a partnership as it was already suggested. Players want new stuffs. SE has taken the track of adding content to old areas to breathe life into them. Is this merely lazy on their part, or a keeping the cost down measure, or is it simply because the PS2 can not handle new content. I think it is likely a combination of all three.

[Retsujo]

I don't know about you guys, but I would absolute love to see Batallia Downs, Beaucedine Glacier, and Qufim Island before the Zilart fucked it all up.

Other than that... The Far East would be nice, just to have a completed continental map of sorts. Also to see the origins of practically every item and piece of equipment ever.

[Camate]

New areas are definitely in high demand and the development team is well aware of this. For the year ahead of us, the development team’s main focus is on raising the level cap to 99, the adjustments surrounding this, as well as the addition of content to go along with it. Due to this, the development team does not have any immediate plans to implement new areas; however, they would like to try their best to do so going forward.

[Kagato]

Basically, the possibility is still open. Just not the current agenda.

That's a HELL of a lot better than saying "Unfortunately, chances for new areas are low."

[Zarchery]

The fact is that I believe that their entire MMO division is failing. Partially, IMHO, because of their unwillingness to discipline their playerbase (why think they can work two MMOs properly if they can't do one?), and partially because they tried to rush out XIV so they could kill XI.

I'm surprised at how many people who don't work for SE nevertheless apparently have access to their balance sheets and sales records.

[Mirage]

You're talking as if it is a secret how few players there are in FF14.

[Jykia]

id personalty like to see the Far East and maybe the Mithran home islands

[Kraggy]

I'm surprised at how many people who don't work for SE nevertheless apparently have access to their balance sheets and sales records.
Well, actually, we all do, since they just published their annual report that showed something like a $150m loss instead of the projected massive profit they forecast at the start of the year.

Yes, this is a small percentage of SE's cash reserves and clearly sustainable for a time, but they can't be happy about it.

[Rhianu]

One question I have is this: if the dev team is currently working on raising the level cap to 99, wouldn't there be new leveling zones to go along with that? Or are we just expected to stay in Abyssea areas clear until 99?

[Kogenta]

New areas are definitely in high demand and the development team is well aware of this. For the year ahead of us, the development team’s main focus is on raising the level cap to 99, the adjustments surrounding this, as well as the addition of content to go along with it. Due to this, the development team does not have any immediate plans to implement new areas; however, they would like to try their best to do so going forward.

I always tought that we would never see new areas because of PS2 limitations. Am i wrong?
It is hard to think that we are going to see new areas, since we are recently getting only reskins of old areas to save PS2 HD space. How is it possible to have new areas without leaving PS2 behind?

It's a serious question, not trolling or flamming for PS2 users intended. I'm just curious about how they are going to manage what have been a problem until now

[Arcon]

[..] It is hard to think that we are going to see new areas, since we are recently getting only reskins of old areas to save PS2 HD space. [..]

I hope I'm stating nothing wrong here, if so, feel free to correct me. But my understanding is that it isn't PS2 HDD space, but more the lack of time involved in creating new areas, since all the new zones, even if reskinned, are still stored seperately from the other zones on the hard drives.

[Zarchery]

Well, actually, we all do, since they just published their annual report that showed something like a $150m loss instead of the projected massive profit they forecast at the start of the year.

Yes, this is a small percentage of SE's cash reserves and clearly sustainable for a time, but they can't be happy about it.

Is that an itemized list? Last I checked, Square-Enix had multiple product lines beyond their two MMORPGs.

[CapnSavaHoe]

A lot of people are overlooking the most important part of the whole "no more support for expansions" arguement. It is a business, and businesses will always try to give the customers something to keep them hooked at the lowest cost possible. With that said, once the reskinning and reusing zones no longer has the ga-ga effect on the users, they WILL do what needs to be done in order to keep the cash flow coming in. It is not about "they don't have the resources", f%ck yeah they got the resources. Even if they spend 10M to address an upgrade to the game, they will at least make double that back in revenue; as long as the book does not dip into the red, they WILL keep making content for the game, just not the particular content people expect, just enough to give people that itch that keeps them coming back for more.

[Glamdring]

too bad they aren't on the menu, the new high level mobs in lower-level zones is a pain to anyone working on lower level content, like leveling another job. New areas would keep some of that away. yes, I know S/I... have you ever tried to open a coffer while invisible? other than the fact you can't it works fine! Need to fight the mob for an AF weapon? well let's hope it's in a clear area. check a ??? for a quest? Hope.

[CapnSavaHoe]

too bad they aren't on the menu, the new high level mobs in lower-level zones is a pain to anyone working on lower level content, like leveling another job. New areas would keep some of that away. yes, I know S/I... have you ever tried to open a coffer while invisible? other than the fact you can't it works fine! Need to fight the mob for an AF weapon? well let's hope it's in a clear area. check a ??? for a quest? Hope.

From what I remember, the mobs around the coffers for AF, RSE, and such are way higher than the lv at which you go to get them [if you go early or when you can actually equip them]; so adding higher level mobs is not that big a deal. Everything ties into balance, I guess that is why they lowered the exp you lose when K.O.'ed now.

[sruon]

never going to happen

[Nephilipitou]

First, I expected a response like "unless your a 15 year old that can't get a job yet then stop being cheap and update your stuff."

I am not 15, I work, and probably for a lot longer than you have had hot dinners or worn long pants. I have different priorities in life as you will someday. New or used is not in my budget, nor will it ever be. The same applies I am sure to a lot of people. My PS2 suits me just fine, and when SE stops supporting it, then I will quit FFXI. :)

You can't afford a PC that costs less than 300 dollars and you're running on 5-7 year hardware... you need to stop playing this game and save up. If you're that broke, that you can't come up with a couple hundred dolllars, you need to stop playing FFXI because if you're computer dies, and you can't afford to replace it, or your car has a failure, and you can't afford to replace the parts, then you're screwed. Just a tire blow out alone is 1/6 or so of the cost of getting a PC or netbook that can run FFXI.

I hope they drop PS2 support so that you can get your priorities in order. You apparently need the 150 dollars a year that your subscription costs, for more important things.

Drop PS2 support SE. If for no other reasons, than to give the people who can't afford to upgrade, the ability to eat something other than ramen once in a while. Cause apparently this game sucks up their reserve cash because they have no ability to save up.

[Crusader]

Why not only release new data for people outside PS2?
Like if you didn't buy WoTG can't go to those areas, make new releases for Xbox and PC. That way the PS2 players that are happy playing old content can continue to do so, and players that which to go to the next level can?
Is that possible? I'm sure there's a way.

[Teraniku]

Why not only release new data for people outside PS2?
Like if you didn't buy WoTG can't go to those areas, make new releases for Xbox and PC. That way the PS2 players that are happy playing old content can continue to do so, and players that which to go to the next level can?
Is that possible? I'm sure there's a way.

The problem with this is, the dev team has to keep track of 2 versions of the game, not one. Even though the code base for the PS2 version will remain relatively the same as long as they would maintain it, Any job addition updates, etc would have to be applied to both versions. This leads to even more time making sure any job updates, any new Battlefields (like Voidwatch) don't cause problems and would actually slow down the amount of updates / adjustments we would get.

[Deception]

remembers Phantasy Star Online :cool:

[LeaderofAtlantis]

Here's a small, fairly simple thing to implement as far as a zone goes - there's a cave that utilized as the spawn spot for a ANNM in Batallia Downs [S], but does nothing in the present. Have the path blocked in the past by a guard or magic seal, but utilize it in the present as a short cut to a new section of Behemoth's Dominion where we might see regular Behemoth type creatures or just a shortcut to Qufim. The tunnel doesn't have to be overly complex but could be a great spot to put some new NMs or high level creatures for us.

There are doors that clearly have hallways behind them inside The Shrine of Ru'Avitau. Giving us a way to open them and go after some new stuff would be nice. Sure it's an old zone and things wouldn't be all that different looking, but perhaps a new path way with new challenges would give us a little bit of a new adventure.

I seem to recall that near the beginning of the NA launch, I heard they did a server wide event to trigger Outpost warps on that server. Maybe I misunderstood, but if so, why not have a server wide quest/mission where you work to gather supplies to support an effort to re-open the paths to Fort Karugo-Narugo, Grauberg, and Vunkerl Inlet in the present? Yeah it's a rehashing of old zones, but with no interaction with the outside world since the end of the Crystal War, these zones might be over run by really nasty new creatures.

Or they could finally open up the path way to the old Tavnazia. It's clearly over run by Wyverns and possibly Wyrms among other creatures. We can see it from the Blueblade Fell in Lufaise Meadows and these creatures, as big as the buildings, moving out there.

Having dimensional tears bringing nastier creatures into the areas we already have access to is fine and all, but there is still so much story that can be explored in this game, and even if we had to pay to gain access to these new zones, exploring that story would be well worth it I think. Why did the Orcs and Gigas leave their homes in the far north initially? Why are the Mithra so stand offish in their homeland? What of the Empire to the east of Aht Urhgan that once existed? Do remnants still exist? Do the Yagudo still flourish there?

The story is one of the major draws to this series and the stories in this game have been amazing. I hope those stories aren't over.

[Psxpert2011]

I don't see what the big deal is. There are players out there with more than one account, and rumors say almost all Japanese still support the PS2. Now to keep things practical, why can there be reason for new zones. I have more than one character on my account and I use one for basic zones (which means I don't need to play on a PC but have one anyway).

There can be servers to support players with low-end graphic cards or PS2s but we need to expand for a ruling majority.

*I want to make a point also that areas, graphics doesn't make the game. Replay value is equal to gameplay, content and interface which is easy for players with half a brain of a chimpanzee.
** I think SE is setting us up for something big and down the FFXI road, bigger and tougher beast and hordes will be introduced to alliances to defeat and may exceed level 99. There might be devils in hell which have power lv. over 9000! So I do hope for new areas introducing us to new mob and new NMs (maybe fighting on the moon?).

[Psxpert2011]

I think it is about time we stop dreaming and hoping for new content in regards to land

If we keep pushing for new content, new areas, and better equipment, it'll become apparent what SE will focus on next. Use the suggestion box or how I like the Manga I read: "Medaka Box". =P

ご意見ボックス <<< go here!!! 新規

[Afin]

Its a shame, i would've loved to have seen tavnazia S, imo the 1 city that was relevent to the wotg and sandy mission storyline

[DukeDudeston]

I would love to see brand new zones in the game, but I don't think the reason why its not top of list, isn't because of the PS2 limitations. I think its got more to do with the actual development of the zones.
The game has got big, the story line has been writen with the most care, adding new zones isn't as simple as the actual development of the zones, they have to write a story line to go with them, why have these zones just been made available, why would you want to go to them?

Its that, thats the reason why its easier just to recycle what they already have. its easier just to come up with a "Past" or "Alternate Reality" version of the same zones, then it is to create whole new ones.

Again I don't think it has anything to do with PS2 limitation "HDD space issue" I heard that the PS2 limits each game to 10GB to help with space allocation, but I am sure there is probably a way to "trick" the PS2 in thinking a new expansion pack or something is a stand-alone game, there is always a work around I am sure.

EDIT: just found this on another post while looking around the forum


Just to clarify one misconception I have been noticing for a while now...

"PS2 limitations" is not a factor for adding new areas to the game and we will in fact be adding new areas in the future, so please do not worry about this.
Well... nuff said really.

[Kristal]

I would love to see brand new zones in the game, but I don't think the reason why its not top of list, isn't because of the PS2 limitations. I think its got more to do with the actual development of the zones.
The game has got big, the story line has been writen with the most care, adding new zones isn't as simple as the actual development of the zones, they have to write a story line to go with them, why have these zones just been made available, why would you want to go to them?

Its that, thats the reason why its easier just to recycle what they already have. its easier just to come up with a "Past" or "Alternate Reality" version of the same zones, then it is to create whole new ones.

Again I don't think it has anything to do with PS2 limitation "HDD space issue" I heard that the PS2 limits each game to 10GB to help with space allocation, but I am sure there is probably a way to "trick" the PS2 in thinking a new expansion pack or something is a stand-alone game, there is always a work around I am sure.

EDIT: just found this on another post while looking around the forum

Well... nuff said really.

Games cannot use resources from other partitions, so a new partition would require you to shut down FFXI and POL to switch to the other 'game'.

The biggest issues with new zones are
1. PS2 HD partition size, which can be addressed by smarter use of resources. Augments are an example of this, or a culling of a large number of rarely/unused resources. Most of sub-75 gear comes to mind.
2. Zone ID limitation. We are approaching 256 (1 byte) zones. This might be a big issue (1 byte reserved), or a non-issue (2 bytes reserved).
3. Development time. Refurbishing existing zones (WotG, Abyssea) takes less time and effort then building new ones from scratch, but it still isn't free. Apollyon, Walk of Echoes and that new crystalline zone they announced are all pretty barren places, a few plots of walkable area surrounded by nothingness. Those are a lot easier to make then a fully fleshed out zone like we saw in Treasures of Aht Urhgan. (And that's just the zone. There need to be mobs, npcs, quests, etc.)

[Retsujo]

You can't afford a PC that costs less than 300 dollars and you're running on 5-7 year hardware... you need to stop playing this game and save up. If you're that broke, that you can't come up with a couple hundred dolllars, you need to stop playing FFXI because if you're computer dies, and you can't afford to replace it, or your car has a failure, and you can't afford to replace the parts, then you're screwed. Just a tire blow out alone is 1/6 or so of the cost of getting a PC or netbook that can run FFXI.

You're pretty ignorant if you don't know how many people in this world actually only scrape by in life without the ability to afford anything, or have anyone in their lives to help support them when times get tough. I don't mean to derail this thread, but holy crap you need to open your damn eyes and realize that some people just can't afford to do anything. At least s/he's spending $15/month on a video game, and not $200/month on crack or some other type of drug.

[saevel]

The problem with this is, the dev team has to keep track of 2 versions of the game, not one. Even though the code base for the PS2 version will remain relatively the same as long as they would maintain it, Any job addition updates, etc would have to be applied to both versions. This leads to even more time making sure any job updates, any new Battlefields (like Voidwatch) don't cause problems and would actually slow down the amount of updates / adjustments we would get.

Not how that works. The server is the same for whatever client your running on, thus they only need to maintain one set of code. Server is also by far the most complicated part, its a set of massive databases that process hundreds of thousands of transactions per second. Clients just maintain a set of local resources and display them based on what the server tells them. All calculations happen on the server, only thing that happens locally is movement.

SE is currently maintaining three different client code bases, PS2 / XBOX and x86 code are not interchangeable. The closest are the 360 and PC's code bases as MS has tools to try to make 360 code semi-x86 compliant. The code is only game engine specific, it has nothing to do with the models / zones / textures / animations / special effects or other "data".

The only thing keeping the devs from adding more zones or adding additional features is their desire to keep the "play experience" the same across all three platforms. Thus if they want to add a feature to the PC client they also want to add the same feature to the PS2 / 360 client, and if the PS2 is making that feature difficult to add then their reluctant to add it. Heck only recently did they move to add additional fonts / icons to the PC world.

Also when they talk about "PS2 space limitations" their not talking HDD, their talking system memory. PS2 has 32MB of RDRAM (4Mb eDRAM for video unit) which the entire game client and all loaded data needs to fit inside. That is an incredibly small space to fit something the scale of a MMO.

[Juri_Licious]

You're pretty ignorant if you don't know how many people in this world actually only scrape by in life without the ability to afford anything, or have anyone in their lives to help support them when times get tough. I don't mean to derail this thread, but holy crap you need to open your damn eyes and realize that some people just can't afford to do anything. At least s/he's spending $15/month on a video game, and not $200/month on crack or some other type of drug.
The community shouldn't have to suffer due to people who can barely afford to pay their bills and keep up with time.
It's not our fault they can't. Our priorities shouldn't be limited by theirs.

[Retsujo]

How are your priorities, or the community as a whole, suffering because some people don't have the means to upgrade their systems? Square-Enix is aware of the hindrances FFXI is having on the modern world, and have openly been showing things they've been trying to do to improve upon that and keep the game afloat. Continuing to support older hardware is their own decision, and I'm sure that's based on a good chunk of the player base.

You may not give a shit about the middle and lower classes, but Square-Enix is trying to be the most fair to everyone, and I think they're doing a pretty good job of it. If it bothers you and Neph so much, maybe you two should stop playing FFXI and find a game that better suits your higher standards.

[geekgirl101]

It's not all about people not being able to afford a proper PC etc, there's a lot of players with PS2 accounts who would have to terminate their PS2 accounts in order to get a PC or Xbox version and start all over again with a brand new account or shell out for an account transfer. For a lot of people this is perhaps too much hassle and expensive if they have multiple mules. It would be nice if SE could do away with PS2 support and tailor the game for PC and Xbox players, but that can't and never will happen unless they come up with a means to provide a free download or CD for people who want to ditch the PS2 and free transfer of all their characters from PS2 to whatever model they'll be using instead. I doubt SE would be up for doing something like that, so the game will continue to suffer and players will either have to suck it up or go play something else. It's been nearly a decade now, the game has reached its limits with level 99. There's nothing more SE can add after this.

[Arcon]

It's not all about people not being able to afford a proper PC etc, there's a lot of players with PS2 accounts who would have to terminate their PS2 accounts in order to get a PC or Xbox version and start all over again with a brand new account or shell out for an account transfer. For a lot of people this is perhaps too much hassle and expensive if they have multiple mules. It would be nice if SE could do away with PS2 support and tailor the game for PC and Xbox players, but that can't and never will happen unless they come up with a means to provide a free download or CD for people who want to ditch the PS2 and free transfer of all their characters from PS2 to whatever model they'll be using instead. I doubt SE would be up for doing something like that, so the game will continue to suffer and players will either have to suck it up or go play something else. It's been nearly a decade now, the game has reached its limits with level 99. There's nothing more SE can add after this.

There are no "PS2 accounts" and "PC accounts". Every account can be played on every platform. There is nothing to transfer. This isn't an argument.

[Nephilipitou]

How are your priorities, or the community as a whole, suffering because some people don't have the means to upgrade their systems? Square-Enix is aware of the hindrances FFXI is having on the modern world, and have openly been showing things they've been trying to do to improve upon that and keep the game afloat. Continuing to support older hardware is their own decision, and I'm sure that's based on a good chunk of the player base.

You may not give a shit about the middle and lower classes, but Square-Enix is trying to be the most fair to everyone, and I think they're doing a pretty good job of it. If it bothers you and Neph so much, maybe you two should stop playing FFXI and find a game that better suits your higher standards.

If I remember right the last poll that came out about how many people play on PS2... is not a good chunk of the player base. At least not compared to the amount of people who are getting fed up with, have gotten fed up with, or have left because they want new story content. The PS2, and the 360 versions have way more issues and lock ups than the PC versions. Plus you can use controllers on the PC version.

I'm more concerned about this game dying off just because it continually grows stale. Some of the new UI enhancements are great, I like them. Being able to fully expand the chat log to look for weakness' that have been triggered, while being able to see what's going on with the combat is a massive improvement.

This whole argument though shouldn't have anything to do with poor people. I'm one of them. My whole argument is that if someone can't afford to get a 200 something dollar netbook, then they shouldn't paying 150+ a year for an MMO just so they can run it poorly on a PS2 in lowest quality because if their car gets a flat tire, or their starter goes out, they're going to need money to fix it, and they are going to be screwed if they can't save up, and it's quite obvious they can't save up any money if they can't afford to get a 200 dollar computer. My Netbook cost me 200 dollars. I've seen some on clearance lately for 180. ANY PC in stores right now shouldnt' have an issue running the game. There's no excuse. They are bad with their money, therefor they should stop playing this game and start saving up money for emergencies and I'm not backing down from that position. I don't understand how you can have an alternative position. They're going to need more than a PS2 eventually. I'm not cold, or heartless, I'm being realistic. Learn to manage money better if you can't pay 200 or less. Get a used PC for crying out loud for like 100 or something. This game is NOT expensive to run.

[Shadowshear]

Interesting concept I play the same account on my PS2 as my PC and XBox ther is no need to transfer anything just access the account number of one system by the other.

[Effilil]

after reading much of this thread, I think a few points can be made

1) the introduction of new zones/battlefields/areas would indeed take up more HDD space on the users part. there are actually several ways to solve this, the first being drop ps2 support as suggested, the 2nd that comes to mind is what SE has done in reskinning old areas, and the 3rd that I can think of is to find a new data compression method for the older hardware
to keep everyone happy, the 3rd method would be best, but it would also still take a while to create and implement. if they chose to do it

2) unless you are single, don't have any other vices, live in your parents house, have no children, don't own a car, and don't have any other bills whatsoever, you have priorities other than upgrading gaming equipment, including, but not limited to, insurance, rent or mortgage payments, health and dental needs (though I question why those are separated by the medical community), food, clothes, college funds for the kids, utilities, and other bills....$12.99 a month for a game to relax and enjoy isn't a lot...and giving it up for a year to upgrade to a cheap computer? what if the game is gone by then?

3) for each update, SE has to keep track of not 1, but 3 types of code...PS2, PC and x-box..yes the OS is similar between PC and X-box, but it is different in many fundamental ways...after all, you can't play a pc game on x-box, and I've never gotten an x-box game to work on my pc (an emulator is a program to simulate the game system and in this example, would be cheating) each system has to have it's own update package ready at the time of the update, and while SE has streamlined this process, it still requires much work

[Concerned4FFxi]

The story is one of the major draws to this series and the stories in this game have been amazing. I hope those stories aren't over.

Stories have been replaced by magian trial bs, see adventuring fellow cap 71-95 and our limit breaks 76-95, another horrible disappointment.