September Crafting Update Complaint

[Tptn937]

The crafting update didn't add to the success of high quality synthesis in a meaningful way. I hope this is addressed soon.

[Aysha]

What exactly do you mean by this?

Are you saying that the increase to HQ probability is so small that you don't notice the difference, or are you saying that the actual %s weren't provided?

[Selindrile]

Pretty sure he meant the former.

[Aysha]

Well, the way he worded it was kinda wonk.

So, is it true that the increase to HQ synths is barely noticeable whatsoever? If so, then what's the point of even doing that?

[Selindrile]

Seemed pretty straightforward to me, and yeah, pretty sure all 3 of us are on the same page on that.

[Urmom]

I see a lot of people saying this but haven't seen any actual solid testing yet. Mostly just eyeballing or small like 100 synth samples. I'd wait till that comes out first unless you were actually expecting everything to get shifted up a tier or something

[Shiyo]

I expected everything to be moved up a tier, because items that give less than a 1% DPS increase costing as much if not more than a RMEA is absolutely insane.

Crafting availability and prices are completely out of control and really needed to be fixed. At this point most crafted HQ items are "Hey look at me I'm rich and have nothing to spend gil on" and not actually a form of progression a normal player can work towards.

This is also two updates in a row that don't fix anything they intended to fix, I'm not really sure what's going on.

[detlef]

I see a lot of people saying this but haven't seen any actual solid testing yet. Mostly just eyeballing or small like 100 synth samples. I'd wait till that comes out first unless you were actually expecting everything to get shifted up a tier or somethingTo be fair, the crafting update changes as presented really should jump out even in a sample of 100. If you didn't see a difference in T0 over the course of 100 synths then that would be worrying. Or maybe the changes were just that minor in which case what was the point?

[Urmom]

To be fair, the crafting update changes as presented really should jump out even in a sample of 100. If you didn't see a difference in T0 over the course of 100 synths then that would be worrying. Or maybe the changes were just that minor in which case what was the point?

Depends on what you call minor. Even doubling or possibly tripling T0 and assuming the people doing this had precise known old values for their situation (doubtful since it wasn't tested the best over the years) you could easily not see a difference in 100. We'd need like 5 times that sample with much better testing conditions to really tell hence why I say wait and see... but serious math oriented crafts are making shields or doing content/campaigns right now so might be a little while. Plus T0 was one of the fuzziest ones. idk I'm almost done grinding thru 200 Ichor so maybe I'll throw a mule on getting a decent sample

Also iirc from some of the jp notes the main point was for the new rings. Something about how the various effects added together was making the rings suck so I'd guess most of the change would be how +hq rate helps. Might even depend on tiers somewhat since the only tests I know of on Rusks showed small but definite increases on a low level t1 but no change on a higher level t2

[Urmom]

In case anyone is curious a couple of people have done some preliminary testing (https://www.bluegartr.com/threads/130586-CraftyMath-v2-Post-September-2017-Update) with a few thousand sample size

The tl;dr is base rate seems more or less the same (at least on T1) but that +hq rate provides rather meaningful increases now and well esctrucheon will likely blow kupo shield out of the water any time you aren't breaking into another tier and even then T0-T1 might be close

[Shiyo]

That doesn't fix non-existent items on nearly every server and +5 acc HQ items selling for more than an RMEA(Sometimes literally equal to 3 or 4 RMEA's in price).

The prices of HQ items are completely out of control. They should be an obtainable goal you can work towards, not "Oh, I could make an RMEA or 4 RMEA's instead".

Honestly, for most of the new items added, and all the SU3 gear, HQ shouldn't even be an option that exists in the games code.

[Nyarlko]

That doesn't fix non-existent items on nearly every server and +5 acc HQ items selling for more than an RMEA(Sometimes literally equal to 3 or 4 RMEA's in price).

The prices of HQ items are completely out of control. They should be an obtainable goal you can work towards, not "Oh, I could make an RMEA or 4 RMEA's instead".

Honestly, for most of the new items added, and all the SU3 gear, HQ shouldn't even be an option that exists in the games code.

The lack of supply is mostly lack of players crafting per server. If you want to fix it, then start crafting! And encourage everyone you know to start crafting! :D Supply of crafted items can only go up if players are making them. If you don't want to craft, I wish you luck on your daily GobbieBox pulls.

HQ prices are set by crafters/players, not the dev team. If you want to blame someone, blame the farmers who set the price on materials, since those prices are what crafters base their HQ prices on. If everyone would at least be willing to buy NQs at cost, then HQ prices would be able to drop, but when a good chunk of the top end NQs sell at a significant loss, (which frequently doesn't even sell fast enough to be worth the AH slot,) that loss has to be made up elsewhere (namely HQs.)

Newer HQs also have a larger difference compared to NQs than they have in the past, and those differences are frequently enough to cause noticeable impact. For example, EA HQ set has an extra MBD+5%/MBDII+5%, which can free up an extra slot used by MBD1 and adds an extra MBDII+5% that can not be obtained elsewhere, and that is in addition to the other stat increases.

[Shiyo]

Not going to craft at all. No way am I crafting items for 2-3m loss per synth and spending millions to level a craft up.

Crafting is pretty much dead for anyone who hasn't been 100 for 15 years or isn't hoarding billions of gil. They also control the entire market and make it not profitable to craft anything that isn't an HQ.

By the way, all the SU3 gear requires 2-4m of NPC only materials that were LITERALLY set by the dev team :)

The devs also decided to make the items require vagary drops(content very few like, content people don't do often) for absolutely no reason when enough good items already require vagary mats.

So, yeah, the developers did set the price for these items. They literally said "this is worth 2-4m in npc mats" then "We're going to make this cost vagary mats which already cost millions" on top of the FIXED npc price costs.

[Urmom]

Pretty sure a huge bump in HQ rate (which this will be it looks like) is going to make things more available and by extension cheaper. Also don't like HQ don't get it lol. Why ya gotta hate on more stats for the rare person willing to spend 200 mil on a piece of equipment

[Shiyo]

Items that cost more than an RMEA that give minor bonuses like +5 acc is absolutely absurd. The only people who can afford that are RMT 6 boxing sparks farmers(like this one guy on my server) or crafters who control the entire market. No normal person will spend more than an RMEA on 5 acc or other minor bonuses.

HQ's should be a reasonably obtainable goal you can work towards. Right now they're too rare(thus too expensive) to ever be worth working towards one, plus the fact that on most servers hq's LITERALLY DON'T EXIST for many, many items.

SU3 gear for example is so rare it might as well not even have HQ coded into it.

[Nyarlko]

Items that cost more than an RMEA that give minor bonuses like +5 acc is absolutely absurd. The only people who can afford that are RMT 6 boxing sparks farmers(like this one guy on my server) or crafters who control the entire market. No normal person will spend more than an RMEA on 5 acc or other minor bonuses.

It's a lot more than just "acc +5" nowadays tho. :/

EX: Ea Hat NQ vs HQ
HQ gains: DEF+10 HP+20 MP+15 INT+5 MND+5 M.Acc+10 MAB+5 evasion+10 m.eva+10 mdb+1 mbd+1% mbd2+1%

That is quite a bit of improvement, and enough to have an actual impact on damage output. We'll have to wait and see how the boost to HQ rates pans out, but early reports point towards it being enough to at least lower our loss ratios significantly, so there's a really good chance that HQ prices will be going down eventually. ^^

[Shiyo]

There's plenty of gear that's 200-250m that's +5 acc. New gear being even less obtainable and stronger in stats just further emphasis the problem.

I don't think the HQ rates have changed in a meaningful way for anything to matter. Crafters are still going to charge 2 RMEA's for an item.

[Urmom]

HQ prices will be going down eventually. ^^
Of course we have to figure out how the heck the estrucheon quest works first lol. Seriously how the hell do you do it!?! Because right now +hq rate has really been improved which already will bring supply of hqs up but the estrucheons literally provide as much +hq as all other bonuses combined + skill.

[saevel]

The issue is the amount of NQ synths needed for a single HQ synth to occur, it doesn't match up with the supply / demand and creates that massive imbalance. Crafter's need to make so many NQ's that the market is flooded with them, forcing them to sell at a loss or be sitting on unsold inventory. All that loss then gets built into the price for the HQ, which inflates the price out of the market and it becomes a golden toilet. What needs to happen is the T0 and possible even the T1 HQ rates be increased in order to reduce the number of NQ's made per HQ synth which reduces the amount of loss suffered and overall cost to produce each HQ.

[Shiyo]

Allow people to trade in 50 NQ's for a guaranteed HQ at a npc. Gets the NQ's out of the game, gives people HQ's.