PLEASE - Try to think when scheduling maintenance, please! :)

[IBHalliwell]

Hello,

NOTE: This thread is not about emergency maintenance, but maintenance planned weeks / months in advance.

Tonight's (March 27, 2017) maintenance is from 17:00 PDT to 00:00 PDT. This period is both:


During several monthly events and
Covers 100% of today's "Gain XP" RoE Limited Time Challenage (20:00 to 00:00 PDT).


It would be WONDERFUL for SE to look at the game and not schedule planned maintenance during popular events, such as "Gain XP," Voidwatch, etc.

After all, scheduling new / replacement hardware has had to be in the works for weeks - most likely MONTHS. Choosing the next day (in this case) would showing consideration to the customers and NOT AT ALL DIFFICULT, say 1 to 2 months ago! Right? Right! :)

SUGGESTION: Right now all monthly events start on or around the 11th and terminate at the end of the month. Limited Time Challenges are on a set schedule. So, why not:

1) Schedule all non-monthly planned maintenance (such as server upgrades) during the time between the 1st and the 10th?
2) Look at the RoE LTC and avoid "Gain XP," as much as is humanly possible! I'm just saying avoid, if at all possible "Gain XP." If this isn't possible, well, OK, but at least let us know you tried, please.

Honestly, avoiding monthly events and "Gain XP" is NOT difficult, at all, WHEN you do it from the start of the planning!

In this case, the persons scheduling this maintenance, obviously, started months ago (e.g. ordering hardware). Choosing a time between say April 1 and 10 and avoiding "Gain XP" should be simple, when done at the beginning (weeks / months ago).


Thank you.

[Nyarlko]

Odds are good that this was not planned months ago. It doesn't take that long to order hardware. They most likely care less about ROE scheduling and more about labor scheduling.

[Raydeus]

It would be nice if they could schedule things like that, specially because it always seems to fall on the windows I have to play.


That said though, that kind of maintenance usually falls on the unplanned/urgent side of things so scheduling can be difficult. And while the hour may be unfortunate for people living around the GMT-6 zones the fact is it falls on JP morning, aka the beginning of the work day and the hours with the least player traffic that fall under Japanese work hours. So it makes sense they would schedule it for this hour specifically.

Remember years ago when people in EU complained maintenance always fell on EU peak times? That was because back then XI had people who would perform maintenance after Japanese midnight/early morning, which was the best for NA and JP players. But with the current crew chances are there aren't people that would perform midnight maintenance anymore. So now NA gets the maintenance fun times instead.

[Nyarlko]

It's starting at 10am JST I believe, which makes the timing make sense. Do you expect their workers to pull a graveyard shift (and SE to pay for the shift difference) just so you don't miss a "Gain Exp" RoE? XD

[IBHalliwell]

It would be nice if they could schedule things like that, specially because it always seems to fall on the windows I have to play.


That said though, that kind of maintenance usually falls on the unplanned/urgent side of things so scheduling can be difficult. And while the hour may be unfortunate for people living around the GMT-6 zones the fact is it falls on JP morning, aka the beginning of the work day and the hours with the least player traffic that fall under Japanese work hours. So it makes sense they would schedule it for this hour specifically.

Remember years ago when people in EU complained maintenance always fell on EU peak times? That was because back then XI had people who would perform maintenance after Japanese midnight/early morning, which was the best for NA and JP players. But with the current crew chances are there aren't people that would perform midnight maintenance anymore. So now NA gets the maintenance fun times instead.

I totally noticed when it starts in Japan, as I work a Japanese schedule (even though I'm US based). My point is a day's delay (e.g. Wednesday versus Tuesday) isn't hard for someone to schedule.

Please note: I wasn't talking about urgent maintenance, but non-monthly / non-urgent maintenance. Basically maintenance that one plans weeks or even months in advance. In fact (at the start of the message) I wrote:



NOTE: This thread is not about emergency maintenance, but maintenance planned weeks / months in advance.

[IBHalliwell]

It's starting at 10am JST I believe, which makes the timing make sense. Do you expect their workers to pull a graveyard shift (and SE to pay for the shift difference) just so you don't miss a "Gain Exp" RoE? XD

It started 08:00 Tuesday JST.

When did I suggest or say graveyard? I said a day's delay is all as an example for this non-monthly / non-urgent maintenance. Having the maintenance on Wednesday at 08:00 JST wouldn't mean graveyard for anyone or is Wednesday 08:00 JST a graveyard time?

If the SE management thought about the customer (e.g. FFXI players) in a positive say it would benefit us all, right!? RIGHT! :)

[IBHalliwell]

Odds are good that this was not planned months ago. It doesn't take that long to order hardware. They most likely care less about ROE scheduling and more about labor scheduling.

An one day delay in this case wouldn't cause to many issues, would it? Wednesday versus Tuesday!

As for the planning time, I said weeks or months.

FFXI runs on high-end blade servers and these run into the hundreds of thousands (I suspect millions of dollars for all worlds). A company doesn't spend this type of money on the spur of the moment (a few days). SE would set this upgrade during the budget cycle for this year, which would occur during last year's budget cycle.

If you look at the length of the outage, it clearly shows SE is doing major hardware upgrades! This isn't cheap PLUS the coordination of getting hardware out, in, and tested in the window means they started planning this a good while ago.

I worked for two computer hardware manufactures - IBM and Cray Research - and seen what it takes to do this type of work. It is not quick and requires detailed planning. Adding in some customer consideration, as I'm suggesting, is not asking too much.



I'm just saying if SE management could think about us, it would be a benefit!

All I am asking is two things:

1) Schedule between the 1st and 10th (or 1st and the monthly maintenance) all non-monthly / non-urgent maintenance. In simple terms: maintenance you know is coming and isn't the once a month one.

2) Avoid popular Limited Time Challenges, such as "Gain XP." The times of these are well known and can be factored in during the planning!

[Nyarlko]

It started 08:00 Tuesday JST.

When did I suggest or say graveyard? I said a day's delay is all as an example for this non-monthly / non-urgent maintenance. Having the maintenance on Wednesday at 08:00 JST wouldn't mean graveyard for anyone or is Wednesday 08:00 JST a graveyard time?

If the SE management thought about the customer (e.g. FFXI players) in a positive say it would benefit us all, right!? RIGHT! :)

If they scheduled maints to be convenient for us, that would most likely put them in the middle of the night for them. I'm just looking at the time frame, not the day. I was actually looking forward to this GainExp btw... I took a short break and came back to no Yoran on 13x characters, so figured this would be the easiest way to fix that. Still not upset, and still think it's not something that we should be that upset about either. Although, it would have been nice if we got more than a day's notice, especially once they have all their logistics in place and are ready to roll.

You mention "high-end blade servers", but I've never heard about SE saying anything about the hardware this runs on. Do you have proof of some sort? (Not being mean, genuinely interested.)
I've always been curious about how difficult it might be for them to keep the server software running fine given 15yrs of hardware advancement.

[Songen]

you are one of a few that consider gain exp to have any importances, when they schedule a maintance, they schedule, get over it, don't whine over something like that, where ever you live, or w/e your doing, at some point someone is gonna get hit with the maintance, the world is a massive place, try feeling for the people who get hit with it other times.. it landed this time during something you want to do, whooptido, now realise there are thousands of other people that get affected during other days, hell someone probably woulda been pissed if they did it on a tuesday,

YOUR NOT THE ONLY PLAYER PLAYING THIS GAME!!!!

[IBHalliwell]

If they scheduled maints to be convenient for us, that would most likely put them in the middle of the night for them.

I totally disagree and for two reasons:

1) I did not mention any specific customer or location! As I mentioned earlier (maybe you missed it), my work requires I follow a Japanese day. Thus I wake up in the US evening and go to sleep in the US morning.

I am not advocating in anyway shape or form SE make their maintenance convenient for North or South American customers.

I am advocating SE management try to be convenient for ALL customers anywhere in the world!

2) I gave an example: Moving the maintenance from TUESDAY 08:00 JST to WEDNESDAY 08:00 JST.

Maybe I missed something, but how is Wednesday 08:00 JST in the middle of the night for them? Honestly, I don't understand how someone can complain about a 24 hour difference. It isn't in the middle of the night for them, but it would have been more convenient for every player, in the world.

Also I seriously wonder if having it between April 1 and 10th at 08:00 JST wouldn't have been possible. I suspect, though, they wanted to spend the Yen during this quarter and not the upcoming one, thus scheduling it this week not next. If this is the reason they scheduled it for this week, well, they did the right thing. I'd only suggest next time try to do it between the 1st and 10th of March.

But again doing it on WEDNESDAY at 08:00 JST would NOT put it in the middle of the night for them is my main point!



You mention "high-end blade servers", but I've never heard about SE saying anything about the hardware this runs on. Do you have proof of some sort? (Not being mean, genuinely interested.)
I've always been curious about how difficult it might be for them to keep the server software running fine given 15yrs of hardware advancement.

Sure! I read it several years back, but don't have the link on me right now. As I read, each area (or some are groups of areas) run on a blade. Thus Bastok Mines (for example) runs on say blade 15, while Port Sandy run on blade 25. In some cases, it might be a group of areas running on one blade. This is one reason, when you change areas there is a delay or why when entering certain battle fields there might not be room for you.

As for operating system, it has its basis in Unix / Linux, but is specific to the game.

I will try to find the articles and threads I read.

I can say this immediately: There is a private server for FFXI play and they use "The server is hosted on enterprise level hardware and a 75mbit connection, so speed isn't an issue." (http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/index.php?threads/anyone-want-to-play-ffxi-before-it-got-bad.88965/) Also if you look at the main website, they show multiple servers supporting the one world of Nasomi (http://nasomi.com/about.php) at: http://nasomi.com/status/

(Please note the above paragraph includes 3 links to help you understand.)

Of course this information is not about SE directly, but again I don't remember right off my head where I read the information on the SE hardware and software. I'm giving you what I remember off the top of my head.

[IBHalliwell]

you are one of a few that consider gain exp to have any importances, when they schedule a maintance, they schedule, get over it, don't whine over something like that, where ever you live, or w/e your doing, at some point someone is gonna get hit with the maintance, the world is a massive place, try feeling for the people who get hit with it other times.. it landed this time during something you want to do, whooptido, now realise there are thousands of other people that get affected during other days, hell someone probably woulda been pissed if they did it on a tuesday,

YOUR NOT THE ONLY PLAYER PLAYING THIS GAME!!!!

I never said or thought I was the only one playing this game, in any way shape or form! I'm sorry you are having trouble reading what I am saying. Changing from Tuesday to Wednesday wouldn't have been too hard would it have been?

FYI: Changing it to Wednesday at 08:00 JST (in the morning Japanese time not the middle of the night, as some wrote) would have affected both Crack Treasure Chests and Vanquish Aquans, which are much less important in making gil and/or unity points than Gain XP.

As for Gain XP having importance, maybe you don't see its importance. Several players on Ragnarok use it to gain up to 16M of gil a week. 16M * 52 week = 832M gil/year ... that is a bit of change, isn't it? Personally, I solo Gain XP and only earn 2 to 3M per session, or 6 to 9M per week, or 300 to 450M per year. Why do I go for less gil? I also like to solo Job Points during this time, as I find it relaxing.

It is the only LTC where one can make enough gil in a year to do 2 to several REMA weapons.

On top of the gil from the sparks, it is a chance to both buy special material and keep a full tank for Unity Concord fights!

Again, though, all I'm asking is SE take everyone's play into consideration when making non-urgent / non-monthly maintenance decisions. I don't think this is too much to ask and don't see why you think it is too much to ask.

I would like to understand your position, but saying I am advocating them working the graveyard is NOT a valid position -- as I am NOT advocating them working graveyard in anyway shape for form! Saying this is my position shows you don't understand my request / suggestion.

[Nyarlko]

IBHalliwell: I do not understand why my comment about graveyard shifts seems to be bothering you. :/ It was somewhat in response to Raydeus's comment about how maints used to mess w/ EU players. Again, I was focusing on time frame, not day (and shifting by a full 24hrs was not mentioned in your original post.) I agree that moving by a full day would not be likely to cause any additional issues, though I still think that it is most likely determined by labor availability and not something the dev team has full control over.

[IBHalliwell]

IBHalliwell: I do not understand why my comment about graveyard shifts seems to be bothering you. :/ It was somewhat in response to Raydeus's comment about how maints used to mess w/ EU players. Again, I was focusing on time frame, not day (and shifting by a full 24hrs was not mentioned in your original post.) I agree that moving by a full day would not be likely to cause any additional issues, though I still think that it is most likely determined by labor availability and not something the dev team has full control over.

The reason the graveyard shift bothers me is because it isn't what I was saying or thinking. It is the exact opposite of what I was thinking and trying to say - 100% opposite.

As for the 24 hour shift, I didn't include it in the original message because I didn't think it would be necessary. What I was asking SE was to consider players, when making non-urgent / non-monthly maintenance decisions.

I didn't suggest the 24 hour delay fix, as my goal was only to ask for them to include customers / players in their decision making process. Leaving it up to them to make the decision, while including consideration for players is ALL I WANTED TO SAY.

I gave the 24 hour delay example ONLY once I realized people thought I was asking the Japanese to work at say midnight their time. NO WAY WOULD I WANT OR THINK THEY SHOULD WORK AT MIDNIGHT THEIR TIME, especially when a simple 24 hour delay would be so simple.

As for the development team, I suspect they didn't control the hardware upgrade from the start, but did have control over the day, itself, but after someone earlier set the day.

The start to finish would be management, as the control of the budget and planning of events is higher up the food chain. They plan things far enough out a day change wouldn't matter to them during the initial planning phase.

It is easier to make good and cost effective decisions, when considering everything from the beginning. Customers are something a company should consider from the first day of the planning cycle. Isn't it?????