Lack of Incentive for old Add-ons

[cengeal]

The Add-ons are terrible. And by add-ons, I mean A Crystalline Prophecy, A Shantotto Ascensioon, and A Moogle-who-really-cares. BST can put this stuff to a little use, and I guess you can get a lackluster movement speed+8% for a few jobs, and a neat Fast Cast piece for heavy jobs. Beyond that, this stuff is laughably useless.

And now, nexus cape doesn't seem to work for the limited usefulness it had. Honestly, I'd rather this dumb thing just get trashed and we get something completely new. A statue would be more interesting. Honestly, a reraise item that doesn't run out of charges would be a good fit for this, IMO.

I know, I know, why bother? Because I spent $30 total on this crap when it came out. Now we're at a point where this money I spent is literally providing me nothing except another topic to rant about. How about a RoE with a 10% CP boost? Now that would definitely interest people in doing them.

What about a reward for completing all of them? Maybe a choice of rings: a melee ring, a tank ring, a mage ring, a pet ring, maybe even a crafting ring?

Honestly, anything would be an improvement. The new incentive doesn't need to be anything listed. I don't expect them to take my suggestions, I only hope they read this and acknowledge the problem. The very least they could do is make Nexus Cape useful by allowing you teleport to more areas.

[Kensagaku]

The thing is, back then? The gear was good. We had some pieces that defined a lot of jobs, and at that time, some of them were considered phenomenal. You could say that your money was "wasted," but if you got it when it came out, then you got the gear when it was good, and you made use of it. Your money's worth was given to you back when that stuff was relevant, when it was useful. Calling it useless now? Sure. That's like saying running around in Walahra Turban and Dusk gear is good in content now. Gear moves on and grows past what it used to be. You can look at other expansions too; the only earring worth anything from RoTZ's AAs is Suppanomimi. When's the last time you used your ToAU reward? Yes, you get a 10% CP bonus from finishing major content, but you spent the money back then to do current content whose gear at the time was good. Your money's value was rewarded when you spent it.

Nothing lasts forever; even Rajas Ring, which is one of the best examples of an old item (level 30!) maintaining its way to this use, is starting to get phased out in a lot of sets, to be replaced with better STP rings, or things like Epona's/Hetairoi, etc.

[Helldemon]

The head and legs for bst are some of the best gear available even today...

Where is the complaining about the money you spent(which was 30 dollars each) on RoZ or CoP or ToAU or WoTG gear being useless now?

[cengeal]

The five expansions all have a RoE bonus. With those rewards the content has at least progressed through the years, unlike the Add-ons. And you're right, the rewards from other expansions have lost their glory, but can still be a tad useful. Nothing is as it was back then. Doing the expansions is still worth it for a few different reasons, the RoE CP bonus probably being the biggest one.

At the moment, this is content that offers absolutely nothing to a vast majority of players. And I can't say that about any other content that cost money to experience. RoZ grants sky access, and by extension, VW. It also grants access to various High Tier Battlefields, and the same going for CoP and ToAU. From doing CoP you get access to sea, the chance to get other earrings that are useful (ethereal in particular), and maybe most importantly: access to WS gorgets. The earrings from WoTG have held up reasonably well. And SoA offers too much to list.

Now, I know these Add-ons, are just that, Add-ons. They are not full expansions. But all three Abyssea Add-ons are still relevant, all though not as significant as it once was. You don't even need to do any of the storyline for abyssea to make the content be useful. At some point, you'll wind up in abyssea. Whether you're just trying to get a twilight torque, Epona's Ring, Getting reforged empyrean armor, or going all out and making an Empyrean weapon. I have never once regretted purchasing these Add-ons. I can't say the same about the other three.

I know I probably sounded a tad hysterical, but that's because I'm angry. Not really about the $30, I got over that a long time ago. Not about the broken Nexus Cape, the one item that could actually make those purchases worth it. If it was just simply a better item, I wouldn't be here ranting. Okay maybe I would, who really knows the answer to hypothetical questions? But the worst part? The development team doesn't care that these three add-ons offer nothing worth while.

[Kensagaku]

A tad hysterical? You're ranting over add-ons whose purpose was not to extend far into the unknown future. They were short mini-scenarios for single gear pieces. These were released seven years ago. Their gear was relevant at the time. Hell, they're lucky some of the gear is relevant now; Anwig Salade is fantastic for BST and PUP pet DT sets, Selenian Cap is a similar vein of good for GEO if you don't need to be in the frontline (Pet: DT and Pet: Regen), the ASA legs give 8% Movespeed for anyone who doesn't have the few pieces of movespeed gear in the game, along with potent bonuses like Waltz TP Cost -50 (500 -> 450 has saved me a few times with Curing Waltz III, or 150 TP Healing Waltz instead of 200), Ready bonuses for BST, Elemental Siphon for SMN, or a Phantom Roll recast for COR. Mirke Wardecors offers Call Beast down for BST, as well as Quick Draw delay for COR, letting a good COR build TP faster when you're not QDing for damage, or giving a faster cooldown for elemental enhancement with their AF3 feet.

I have no regrets purchasing these expansions. I enjoyed the short stories, and some of the gear is still useful today, especially since I play BST and PUP, so I enjoy the Anwig Salade and Tatsumaki Sitagoromo. I've gotten some decent pet aug'd gear from the keys too, such as my Acc+6/Pet: Acc+4 ring, a hybrid combination you won't see offered on any other ring. Until this recent break of the Nexus cape (frustration over which I could understand, as it's quite clearly broken rather than just not "working as intended"), I enjoyed the ability to quick-travel to places such as Altepa when I didn't have the Titan Home Point, getting me there faster. Just because content hasn't held up to current standards, seven years later doesn't mean it wasn't worthwhile or that it was pointless.

[Seiowan]

If you think the sum value of an add-on is what new gear it can bring to the table, then I think you're missing the whole point. It's like watching porn for the plot.

The story is what tied everything together neatly for me. It takes you through a variety of locations, some of which you might not normally visit these days, through some interesting battles. Some things are about the journey, not the destination. The ultimate reward for Treasures of Aht Urghan was a novelty crown and an Assault ring, yet I still thoroughly enjoyed playing through the missions and taking down Alexander.

I wonder what you might think of FFXIV, where all gear except the newest is considered utterly irrelevant and old content is completely glossed over.

[Limecat]

Wouldn't hurt to have the final gear rewards upgradable to i119, if nothing else. Always gets me a bit twitchy to have to use lower level gear in switch-ins these days, with as huge a chunk of stats you and your trusts will lose for a few seconds.

[Ceinwyn]

Wouldn't hurt to have the final gear rewards upgradable to i119, if nothing else. Always gets me a bit twitchy to have to use lower level gear in switch-ins these days, with as huge a chunk of stats you and your trusts will lose for a few seconds.

Yes, please.... This should be a Standard Service.... just as relics are getting uptades, other hard to get Equipment should also get uptades... i mean why should i do the Long quest line just to get a useless lv 75 Body? you say for the lore and the CS's, well, sry but not These are Long quest series and not all of them are so funny... and i dont have Motivation to do something that isnt fun for nothing ):

[AoiX]

I already mentioned in another post that all expansions, add-ons and in general missions should get a "Master Quest" treatment. Not just a high tier battle to teleport you through a HP to the relevant fight, which doesn't include a ton of forgotten content. And in return get gear relevant to master jobs and maybe even add heroic gear (gear that used to be for example by Lion, Aldo, Prishe, Lilisette, etc etc etc)

[Teraniku]

Godzilla sized Shantotto's Fighting each other, worth the price of Admission...

[cengeal]

If you think the sum value of an add-on is what new gear it can bring to the table, then I think you're missing the whole point. It's like watching porn for the plot.

The story is what tied everything together neatly for me. It takes you through a variety of locations, some of which you might not normally visit these days, through some interesting battles. Some things are about the journey, not the destination. The ultimate reward for Treasures of Aht Urghan was a novelty crown and an Assault ring, yet I still thoroughly enjoyed playing through the missions and taking down Alexander.

I wonder what you might think of FFXIV, where all gear except the newest is considered utterly irrelevant and old content is completely glossed over.

I like the crafting system in XIV. That's about it.

[cengeal]

I still use Anwig Salade and Desultor Tassets as slot-in situational pieces on my PUP. I still wear Mirke Wardecors as /lockstyle body for stylishness.

The add-on mission storyline plots and NPCs / villains are awesome.

The final mission fights were thrilling at 75, it was a lot of fun and challenging too.

In any case, those three mini-expansions are part of the rich tapestry of Vana'diel now, they are part of the world we know.

New players can still experience those missions, enjoy the cutscenes, and they always have the option of fighting the last bosses in level 99.0 gear without ilvl, if they want to experience some challenge thrills. Its easy, you just unequip the ilvl stuff and equip some lvl 99.0 gear, and the content is no longer a pushover, infact it is ferocious.

So I'm really happy those three add-ons still exist, and people can go play them when they want to. There's thousands of new ilvl gear pieces you can use, so there's really no need for more. The three add-ons offer some really awesome Cut-Scenes, unforgettable NPC characters, and some nice slot-in macro pieces and /lockstyle fashion pieces.
:)

I really admire your love for this game's story lines Stompa. Unfortunately, I don't share it completely. I loved CoP, RoZ, and SoA. I think WoTG would be better if you could skip all the stupid sub quests. ToAU was good, but I wouldn't say I loved it. The Abyssea storyline was interesting, and short and to the point. I loved how RoV intertwined everything. But man, I really hate everything about these add-ons.

[Kjara]

A Crystalline Prophecy is by far the content for which I hold the worst grudge yet to this day. I had to level up a whole new job (WHM) to 75 because no one would accept my DRG for the boss fight. Worst Jobish content ever.

[Kensagaku]

Welcome to most of FFXI's history, where we've long had issues of "lolJob" going on. Back in the day, PUP, BST and BLU were considered "lol" jobs and wouldn't get party invites, forcing you to level solo, because parties were RDM BRD PLD AllTheSAM, and maybe a THF. Events excluded BLMs when it became a melee zergfest, and PLDs went heavily by the wayside about then because you could just have your DDs hold hate by smashing face rapidly. BRDs are quickly becoming a dying breed now because GEO is just too strong, with the exception of a few fights. Most melee now aren't brought along because of current content (but there are other threads for that particular rant). This game has always had a history of either players or content blocking out different jobs because they're not optimal; it's not that you can't win, in most cases, it's that the price of it is too high and most people don't want to deal with it.

In your case, with ACP, the crystal's charmga move heavily encouraged pet jobs and ranged jobs, making melee seem inefficient and thus not wanted. I'm just remembering spamming Cannonball on BLU, myself, and not being allowed in melee for that reason. It wasn't a particularly bad example of its type, just part of the norm, really.

[OmnysValefor]

... This game has always had a history of either players or content blocking out different jobs because they're not optimal; it's not that you can't win, in most cases, it's that the price of it is too high and most people don't want to deal with it. ...

While it's technically nearly always players as most people seem to blame the players, I believe it's more on the content than the players. However, like you said, there are [plenty] of other threads on the topic.

Anyway, yeah, when you're using a pop that cost hours of time or millions of gil, you want to bring the winning strategy. There's no time to fool around with a strategy that has a discouraging (literally, losing sucks) success rate. Take Neak for instance. Aside from his 2000 eva, he also can chainspell meteor. It's so much better to have mages on that fight so that you're not trying to supply sufficient acc to melee and vex/attune or fend/wilt.

[Helldemon]

It also doesn't help that you can't have melee/mage/ranged DD in the same party due to having separate buffs for each type. Instead of an acc buff that gives melee acc, ranged acc and magic acc, Atk buff that gives ratk/atk/mab etc etc

[OmnysValefor]

Even despising the the imbalance of jobs right now, I don't think MAB + Physical Attack (likewise for Accuracy) should be rolled into the same buff. However I do think melee and ranged should be the same buff.. and Flurry is pretty silly in itself.

[Helldemon]

Any particular reason for not wanting that?

[OmnysValefor]

It seems so generic, too easy, "Here's your make-stronger and more-accurate buff everyone."

In all fictional universes, magic is different from physical attacks. It has different properties, different strengths and different weaknesses.

[Helldemon]

Ya, but it's impossible to have the differing types in the same party on anything hard as it's too time consuming on the buffer which keeps them from being able to cure/na and in cor's case, DD. Also, cor can't even overwrite old buffs, can they?

[Urmom]

They also scale and cap way differently and oddly

[Helldemon]

They obviously would give a differing amount of each type based on what each buff did which shouldn't be an issue at all. Food does this.

[Urmom]

Food always scales a lot differently than buffs and does things like give up to 150 att but only what 15 mab for the best mab food? Which is what I'd be afraid they'd do if they put them together.

There also becomes the what's the point of eva and meva down when you can give a +all kinds of acc for example. Or what about hybrid stuff getting bigger benefits?

[Helldemon]

So you're asking why a hybrid job would be able to get buffed for both types of damage like they already should? You know that 15 mab could do more for a mage than 150 atk for a melee right? Why would they do that anyways, it would be an easy way to upset a lot of players to weaken a buff meant to allow more people to do events.

You know the acc requirements for several high end fights are utterly insane and require several support just throwing all their acc buffs and eva down debuffs on a mob just for melee to hit anything right? A mage can pretty much cap macc on anything by themselves with gear alone I believe. A melee is short about 500-600 acc alone on the most evasive monsters

[Spectreman]

It would be nice if they upgraded those gears to ilvl 119. Lots of people would do it again for new characters and help new players with them.

[Helldemon]

Lvl 199 gear would be awesome :D

[Jile]

Lvl 199 gear would be awesome :D

lol - solo the world with your eyes closed <you can have this>

[Urmom]

So you're asking why a hybrid job would be able to get buffed for both types of damage like they already should? You know that 15 mab could do more for a mage than 150 atk for a melee right? Why would they do that anyways, it would be an easy way to upset a lot of players to weaken a buff meant to allow more people to do events.

You know the acc requirements for several high end fights are utterly insane and require several support just throwing all their acc buffs and eva down debuffs on a mob just for melee to hit anything right? A mage can pretty much cap macc on anything by themselves with gear alone I believe. A melee is short about 500-600 acc alone on the most evasive monsters

Are you asking me why I'm asking something about hybrid jobs that you have a different opinion on? Should have already been in what I said but yeah I was saying they'd get a bigger boost. It'd be like asking why don't all those buffs hit pets too. Also I didn't say job I said stuff. That was meant to include attacks that cared about both magic and melee stats at the same time. Some jobs might even not like it. The pld might want some acc to melee but extra macc on it could actually hurt them. Of course I do it's almost like I just said the work and cap differently.... As to why would they do that? Well why when they raised the pdif caps barely touch ranged the least used melee dmg source and actually boost non ranged to be higher than it for the first time since the game was made? Why does h2h get ignored in both 2h and 1hd updates? Why when they were balancing melee ws did they make the strongest ones the ones that are used by the most self sufficient DD to the point where in a lot of things bringing non cdc jobs (read mostly blu) is a dps loss?

Sure do though all is a bit of an overstatement and hit anything is more of a have capped/near capped acc. A mage aint gunna come close to capping macc on harder stuff in just gear unless they take out most the mab and which point meh. And that's even magic bursting and getting the macc bonuses from that. I also don't see what the heck this has to do with combining buffs at all. If anything this is a call to help melees. Though a large part of that has to do with the fact that there are like 2-3 times as many buffs/debuffs to effect acc/eva then macc/eva so things are designed with that in mind and probably in no small part due to old tactics of doing super buffed melee zergs. Though the real problem is getting the buffs to deal dmg while also getting the buffs to survive with all that tp feed while also limiting the number of people because of hp scaling.

[Helldemon]

A mage aint gunna come close to capping macc on harder stuff in just gear unless they take out most the mab and which point meh. And that's even magic bursting and getting the macc bonuses from that.

They'll still be doing 10-15k(maybe more?) Magic Bursts even if they have to go full macc. Melee going full acc and sacrificing everything else will still be at capped miss rate and hitting for double digits on the same content when they do hit. No point in mentioning WS cause those will miss most of the time too even the single hits with their 100 acc bonus.

I mean I could land unresisted /blm nukes on blu 25-30% of the time with crappy gear and no buffs on T2/3 vagary bosses

[OmnysValefor]

It just seems lazy to me. One size fits all "do harder" buff makes the jobs cheap. Do you also want to include pets in that buff, because at that point, not doing so is 'not fair' to them.

[Helldemon]

I don't really see why not, smn doesn't melee and bst very rarely does so on anything as well and they are the only job that would really benefit from master and pet buffs. People have been asking for buffs that affect both master and pet for years now though. What do you suggest then to allow more then one type of DD to be able to be in the same party and be able to contribute?