Dancer Gift Dual Wield and TP Penalty

[Flareon]

Dual Wielders have always been subject to penalty over TP and this is the reason i do my best to let all my Dual Wield gear go when i have enough haste.

I don't own a mythic weapon and still i have been able to continuously make skillchain sequences without even using any job ability when under capped haste.

At least i was until i hit 550 job points on Dancer and won the 5% dual wield gift. That one is something i can't get rid of when i am hasted, and it also doesn't contribute at all in that situation. Its nocive because it compromises my TP gain while not adding anything to the haste i already have. Since i won the gift, my capacity to link my weaponskill without using abilities have been seriously cut.

Before it, I had been able to pop Plouton by doin the 6-skillchain sequence by my own (of course, with due buffs). Now i am having trouble to pop Perfidien, because I time out the window sometime between the 4 skillchains by not being able to gather TP fast enough.

Nothing have changed in my gear recently and the only difference i can think about is the "gift" i earned.

That said, it would be very nice if one of the two suggestions were implemented:
- Dual wield earned by gift system should not be subject to TP penalty. It's meant to be a gift after all.

- Dual wield shouldn't impact at TP gain at all. If not in all situations, at least when haste is capped.

Of course this is an issue that impacts every dual wield job out there, but Dancers, as dependant on skillchains to stand out, could be relieved from that penalty. Even more now, with an exclusive gift to the job that cannot be taken out.

[Tidis]

So according to my maths, a 550 DNC with capped gear and magic haste is at capped delay reduction, I don't know DNC gear, are there pieces that have DW on them that you can't drop in a magic haste capped situation?

Either way I certainly agree with the point about DW and TP but I wonder if it fully not affecting TP would be too much, there should be a limit at least, like maybe only the first 25% affecting tp gain.

[Flareon]

I think that up to 20% of Dual Wield does not apply penalty. Not sure. But Dancers have 30% from job traits. So even if you are fully hasted and replace all your gear by multi-attack pieces, you will still have 10% of Dual Wield if my reasoning is correct. Now with gifts, you will have 15% DW impacting on your TP gain.

[Meril]

Just single wield.... Done

[Ulth]

They could make the minimum tp for a hit 50 again. That would solve the dual wield problem. Would give a nice boost to monk and pup too.

[YosemiteYogorockBlondelle]

Well how bout..:confused: -or- they could just create a new job point category to fix the dual wielding issue with the TP gains in which the situation that's causing it is alleviated!?

[Flareon]

Well, something is definitely messing up with my TP gain i'm trying to find a culprit. As i said, no changes in my gear, being the only recent change, the 550 jp gift.

[Ulth]

With 35% Dual Wield with capped Magic Haste and capped Equipment Haste (43.75% and 25%, respectively), you are just under attack speed cap (or exactly at it, depending on how they do rounding).

With 35% Dual Wield, you will gaining 52 TP per hit, before StoreTP, assuming you are using two Delay 200 daggers. With 30% Dual Wield, you will be gaining 52 TP per hit, before StoreTP, assuming you are using two Delay 200 daggers.

StoreTP has no effect here, because those two values are floored, that is to say that they are integer values and there are no decimal values that remain hidden. All but the integer is discarded.

So that extra 5% is literally doing nothing to hurt.

What's the formula for tp? I used the one on BG wiki, 32+((Delay-12)×11÷64), and got 54 tp per hit with 30% dual wield with two 200 delay daggers.

[machini]

You're right, there is a two TP difference. I shouldn't do math before I have caffeine.

Having just said I suck at math, 2 TP per hit -- without knowing the exact set up with multiattack, what weapons are used in case of OAx, it's hard to say exactly how this would affect Rounds/WS. He would go from needing 18 attacks to WS to 19 attacks to WS, so depending on exactly how many attacks/round he's getting, that very well could be it.

I apologize for my poor math. I have no idea how I came up with the wrong value for 52.

[Urat]

At 35% dual wield on dancer, you need 70% haste to cap delay reduction.

With samba and gear, you only need 35% magic haste to cap delay reduction. Haste II and double marches from trusts goes way over that.

Guess what? Any pieces of dual wield gear you put on under these circumstances wont lower your attack speed, but will lower your tp/hit.

Every piece of dual wield gear for dancer lowers your dps if you have 35% magic haste (easily done)

SE needs to either fix this or stop throwing dual wield on all the new 119 gear. The dual wield makes the gear WORSE not BETTER :(

[Ulth]

Too true, Adhemar jacket +1 has the best triple attack on a body piece, and will probably be even better once we find out what it's augment paths are. Only it also has 6% dual wield.

[Flareon]

All in all, it seems we have to be grateful that there were no Dual Wield "gifts" between the 551 ~1200 Job point range. I hope it stays like this when they decide to increase the cap again.