[dev1242] Question about the Accuracy update

[Shirai]

The maximum accuracy of one-handed weapons equipped as the main weapon will be increased from 95% to 99%.

A question raised on the FFXIAH.com forums was if Hand-to-hand is also included.
To be frank, I am also pretty curious about this, and since noone else bothered to ask in here...

[Roja323]

Doubt it is.

H2h is neither one handed nor two handed in the eyes of the developers.

We get no grips, and we cant use off hand weapons.

[Shirai]

Don't be so sure of that.

I remember that when they adjusted the STR and DEX values for one handers to match that of two handed wielders that they initially didn't specify Hand-to-hand either, yet it was included.
It would be nice if they could clarify it on this one too. :)

Well geared H2H wielders will still be powerful without it, so if we don't it won't really sadden me either but the cat is curious.

[Dragoy]

Shirai, et al.,


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Thanks!

[BurnNotice]

I just want to know why they left out adjustments for Scythe and Great Axe. They need weapon skill damage adjustments urgently.

[Camiie]

I just want to know why they left out adjustments for Scythe and Great Axe. They need weapon skill damage adjustments urgently.

Because those aren't 1-handed weapons?

[Grekumah]

The accuracy cap increase will not be applied to hand-to-hand, two-handed, ranged weapons, or physical blue magic spells. Additionally, it will not be applied to one-handed weapons that you equip in the off-hand slot.

This adjustment will, however, help with landing dancer’s steps much more easily and also improve the accuracy rate of Violent Flourish.

[Shirai]

Thanks, that's all I wanted to know. :)

[Ataraxia]

This sound good I like it. Time for Dancer and Thief to shine =)!
However, I am concern about the low HP of DNC and THF and that War, Nin, Run and PLD have much higher HP. I hope in the future they will treat DNC and THF the same since they are front line jobs.

[Ulth]

Well Dancer and Thief tend to sub War, Nin, or Run, so they get some hp that way. I would much rather have evasion tweaked so it would actually be useful. Maybe lower the accuracy of AoE attacks against players who don't have hate.

[Protey]

This sound good I like it. Time for Dancer and Thief to shine =)!
However, I am concern about the low HP of DNC and THF and that War, Nin, Run and PLD have much higher HP. I hope in the future they will treat DNC and THF the same since they are front line jobs.

PLD and RUN should have much higher HP. They are tanks.

[Shirai]

This sound good I like it. Time for Dancer and Thief to shine =)!

Don't expect too much of an increase in this direction, the accuracy buff only counts on stuff where your accuracy is capped already, and only for the main hand.
You should lay your biggest hopes on the buffs that the weapon skills are getting, really.

[Crevox]

the accuracy buff only counts on stuff where your accuracy is capped already

Are you ever doing content where your accuracy isn't capped? That's like the first thing you do when it comes to stats, and the first thing that is resolved with buffs if necessary.

[Shirai]

Are you ever doing content where your accuracy isn't capped? That's like the first thing you do when it comes to stats, and the first thing that is resolved with buffs if necessary.

I can think of a couple of things, High level Incursion comes to mind, and sure buffs solve a lot but you get to a point where in the conventional setups the buffs won't compensate for the rise of evasion meaning that you need to add more support roles.
Adding an extra support means you're going to have to get rid of another role, which usually ends up being the weaker DDs.
As jokingly said elsewhere (FFXIAH I believe) your level 135+ incursion DD party setup may end up looking like the following:
Samurai - Bard - Summoner - Geomancer - Corsair - White Mage

Another situation is doing D/VD High level battlefields with pugs, when you don't have an army of corsairs and bards (mules) standing outside to buff the living crap out of the group before they go in.
Although gear can compensate a lot, without meaning to sound too mean, a lot of people don't carry more than your cookie cutter TP and WS sets and start raining cold sweat at the mention of Accuracy gearsets.

But yes, on most content:
http://davidadamsuski.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/thumbs-up-borat.jpg

[FrankReynolds]

Even if you can cap accuracy on most things, there comes a point where you are better off spending the gear, buffs, food etc. on other stats instead like attack and haste spells. The guy with the best accuracy isn't always at the top of the parse. And 5% is still a nice buff.

[Ulth]

Yeah, the amount of accuracy needed to cap on some content is getting ridiculous. Some how I doubt this is what people had in mind when they wanted more support jobs relevant for end game. Pretty sure they meant it like you could use a brd or a geo, not that you would need a brd and a geo, and a smn, and a rdm, and some more geos...

[Shirai]

Even if you can cap accuracy on most things, there comes a point where you are better off spending the gear, buffs, food etc. on other stats instead like attack and haste spells.
Mind rewording this, because I have absolutely no clue what you mean by this.


Yeah, the amount of accuracy needed to cap on some content is getting ridiculous. Some how I doubt this is what people had in mind when they wanted more support jobs relevant for end game. Pretty sure they meant it like you could use a brd or a geo, not that you would need a brd and a geo, and a smn, and a rdm, and some more geos...

I think it's intended, at some point conventional setups won't work anymore and you're going to have to start thinking outside the box to be able to beat certain content.
Which unfortunately boils down to bringing the best damage dealers you have and buffing the crap out of them.

[Ulth]

I don't think it's intended. I think they thought it was impossible. Like the case about the 143 incursion. I also agree that it is pretty unfortunate. That plan doesn't sound like thinking outside the box. The buffs on the DDs isn't enough, give them more buffs. Still is impressive though.

[Shirai]

I don't think it's intended. I think they thought it was impossible.

Then they don't know their top tier players, and their patience and persistence.

[Metaking]

hmmmm anyone remember more than a few years back and a certain chair demon shirai >.>, im pretty sure se added him believe it impossible to kill.... im alittle foggy but i think some shell fought it for like 15 hours or something, after that... yea...

[Zeargi]

Well, Until SMN gets a BP that increases ACC at a reliable rate, I doubt we'll see too much action. The Hastega II might help us as we can be teamed up with a BRD then and they give ACC and us give haste, but a 3/4 Song bard will always win. I was also disheartened to see that Diamond Storm is far weaker at lvl 90 when we get it than Distract I.

[dasva]

Well, Until SMN gets a BP that increases ACC at a reliable rate, I doubt we'll see too much action. The Hastega II might help us as we can be teamed up with a BRD then and they give ACC and us give haste, but a 3/4 Song bard will always win. I was also disheartened to see that Diamond Storm is far weaker at lvl 90 when we get it than Distract I.

Depends on the fight. For mobs that have really high dmg abilities that normally one shot non pld/runs EA+Scherzo is a popular and faster alternative to rng + pld strats. Depending on potency I could also see Crystalline Blessing and Pacifying Ruby being rather popular buffs as well. That with hastega II I could definitely see smn becoming a rather buff heavy job... even more so if they improve favor some more and they keep adding pet DT gear

[dasva]

Don't be so sure of that.

I remember that when they adjusted the STR and DEX values for one handers to match that of two handed wielders that they initially didn't specify Hand-to-hand either, yet it was included.
It would be nice if they could clarify it on this one too. :)


Doing a search thru the English dev tracker the earliest mention I could find of the adjustment (http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/34239-dev1143-One-handed-and-Ranged-Weapon-Adjustments?p=440577&highlight=accuracy#post440577) did in fact list h2h and ranged as being part of it.

While it might not be on their radar it should be noted that raising the cap on acc would do more for mnk than most 1hders not just because it's already a better DD than most but because of how much more ridiculous impetus would be with a 99% hit rate

[Catmato]

Additionally, it will not be applied to one-handed weapons that you equip in the off-hand slot.
Why? Why are you so afraid of dual-wielders?

[Zeargi]

Depends on the fight. For mobs that have really high dmg abilities that normally one shot non pld/runs EA+Scherzo is a popular and faster alternative to rng + pld strats. Depending on potency I could also see Crystalline Blessing and Pacifying Ruby being rather popular buffs as well. That with hastega II I could definitely see smn becoming a rather buff heavy job... even more so if they improve favor some more and they keep adding pet DT gear

True, but most people are afraid to try out strategies outside the norm. More people ask for Marchesx2 until it's known that people can't hit, then it shifts to Madrigals. Which that in of itself is 45+ ACC(Not counting extras from equipment). COR which is 40, and I believe 55 with a RNG, but that's also on a lucky roll. GEO I don't know, because I haven't skilled it up high enough to know the full extent, but I'm sure it's on par with both of those. SMN's ACC BP... 25+ and only on Full Moon. Hastega II is a big step in the right direction, but it's the lack of giving ACC to the party that'll keep them out, even with the boost to Avatar Acc... Still it's baby steps, baby steps.

[dasva]

True, but most people are afraid to try out strategies outside the norm. More people ask for Marchesx2 until it's known that people can't hit, then it shifts to Madrigals. Which that in of itself is 45+ ACC(Not counting extras from equipment). COR which is 40, and I believe 55 with a RNG, but that's also on a lucky roll. GEO I don't know, because I haven't skilled it up high enough to know the full extent, but I'm sure it's on par with both of those. SMN's ACC BP... 25+ and only on Full Moon. Hastega II is a big step in the right direction, but it's the lack of giving ACC to the party that'll keep them out, even with the boost to Avatar Acc... Still it's baby steps, baby steps.

Well I doubt they will make smn all the way good a buffer as actual buffing jobs since it isn't one. Sure they might not get much acc (though when combined with -evasion move are comparable to cor) but they are getting plenty other stuff and like you mentioned most people don't even pay attention to acc in the first place. A lot of it just convincing people to try new strategies

[Zeargi]

A lot of it just convincing people to try new strategies
Can you come to talk to the people on my server. K, Thanks :D

[dasva]

Can you come to talk to the people on my server. K, Thanks :D

Sure once I convince more people over here lol. Took me a couple of weeks to convince people of using height difference on avatars and that's a strategy back from when they originally came out lol

[FrankReynolds]

Mind rewording this, because I have absolutely no clue what you mean by this.

Depending on the defense etc. of the mob, accuracy begins to have diminishing returns in comparison to strength, crit rate, attack, etc. dual wield jobs have a harder time capping attack in particular on harder mobs, so when your accuracy is decent (80% - 85%ish) it is more beneficial to use food or gear that pushes things other than accuracy. That's why you see people eating attack food in events even though they aren't capped on accuracy. Just hitting the monster isn't enough. You have to do good damage with those hits.

Additionally, only applying the increased cap means that any accuracy food, gear etc. that you apply to get from 90 - 95% has no effect on the off hand. In other words, you are better off not worrying about trying to hit 95% on anything but steps. It really doesn't do much for the damage phase.

DISCLAIMER: This varies from monster to monster / event to event. I'm just generalizing. this isn't always true.

[Afania]

PLD and RUN should have much higher HP. They are tanks.

And NIN :)



Depending on the defense etc. of the mob, accuracy begins to have diminishing returns in comparison to strength, crit rate, attack, etc. dual wield jobs have a harder time capping attack in particular on harder mobs, so when your accuracy is decent (80% - 85%ish) it is more beneficial to use food or gear that pushes things other than accuracy. That's why you see people eating attack food in events even though they aren't capped on accuracy. Just hitting the monster isn't enough. You have to do good damage with those hits.


What the....stop giving misleading info, thanks. 80%-85% hit rate isn't acceptable at all, and that's why PUG DDs parse low because they think they're ok with that, the fact is it isn't. Your hit rate directly affects your WS frequency, if you're not doing WS fast enough or miss a lot of WS, no crit-hit rate/attack/STR can save you.

[Shirai]

Grem,

Can you please reconfirm with the development team that Hand-to-hand has not been adjusted this update?
I know I am blatantly admiting that I parse, but that's beside the point.
I have noticed that in capped accuracy situations my own accuracy on monk has gone up to 98%, similar to other one handed weapon wielders.

According to your previous reply this should not be possible.

[edit]

Seems to have been an incidental thing. never mind this