SE, can you tell us why you won't uncap our pets?

[Malthar]

Hello SE,

Can you give us a better explanation why you won't even consider uncapping our pets instead of the standing terse answer?

Uncapping our pets is a fantastic idea. It will immediately give beastmasters a plethora of pets that became obsolete and it would give beastmasters more versatility with which pet to choose for which battle.

I ask you, specifically the devs, to please reconsider uncapping our pets and set your inner furry free!

[dasva]

This a million times. WE all know you aren't going to release new jugs fast enough... it completely defeats the whole bestiary purpose of bst when there are only 2-3 worth using because of stupid caps and you guys not coming out with higher capped ones that don't completely suck (read we don't need another frog, mandy or crab)

Plus think of all the work it would save you. No pressure to make new jugs!!!

[ZoMBie343]

I agree as well!

When new content is released, new jug pets will never be released in a reasonable time frame for Beastmasters to be competitive.

Please reconsider, SE!

[WoW]

There are no plans to tell you why we will not uncap your pets;

[Mitruya]

When PUP and SMN get their 117/119 ammo, they choose between pets based on function; they're all the same level.
When a BST gets a 119 axe, has their merits and gloves and whatever, they have to choose from a short list of meh jugs that will be high enough level.
How is this fair?
Why can't BSTs choose from all the tools at their disposal like other jobs can?

[Olor]

It's ridiculous... I mean here we are, MONTHS after the Weaponskill update that left us even further in the dust and all we've heard is a vague promise to make us more powerful... but through means that we all know WON'T WORK. Meanwhile no new pets - just some half baked "HQ" jugs with no additional real utility - what a waste.

I'm sorry, if SAM can crap out massive weaponskills one after the other, I don't see why allowing the pets we have to go to max level is somehow overpowered. Frankly, none of them will make even the slightest difference to our usability unless beast affinity is turned into a boost above ilevel... considering that they won't even let us bring our mediocre stable of pets to 119... not feeling optimistic. I mean seriously, WHAT is overpowered about ANY of our old pets?

We've seen repeatedly that BST pets need to have a level bonus to be of any use on content - otherwise they are REALLY crappy.

[Malthar]

We're waiting for an answer, SE. Camate, let them know.

[Balloon]

As much as I hate the non-answers we get from the community team, let's not pretend that they have any say in whether or not this gets answered. They already passed on that we want them uncapped, and the devs said no, I don't think they'll have given a reason.

I can simulate what they devs might say if you like:

"Blah blah, balance, blah blah misrepresentation of how job is played, blah blah something to do about crafting. Because Beastmaster is a pet job we feel that giving them anything beneficial would be unfair to the jobs that do 3x as much damage, but we plan to give you a level 119 toad called ImpotentLarry that will flacidly attack and not have any tp moves. Please look forward to it.

We are not currently aware that when we raise the item cap again we will have to repeat this tedious process and outdate anything we release now. "

[Olor]

we plan to give you a level 119 toad called ImpotentLarry that will flacidly attack and not have any tp moves. Please look forward to it.


YES. This is precisely what they will do. Cause god knows all BST wanted was a COMPLETELY useless pet.

[Mitruya]

It's just as dumbass as the PUP and DRG updates. Nothing that really addresses the true problems with the jobs, nothing that boosts anything other than the same old cookie-cutter princess jobs. Nothing that gives any of us a chance to enjoy content like everybody else or a reason to continue playing.

[Malthar]

We're still waiting on an answer for this, SE.

[WoW]

We're still waiting on an answer for this, SE.

There are no plans to tell you why we will not uncap your pets;

Man, I should be a Dev :)

[Malthar]

Still waiting. ..

[Olor]

Yeah the silence is a real slap in the face :/

[Balloon]

The silence is because there's a small percentage of the NA community asking for the reason. A vast majority of community team responses are translated from their Japanese counterparts. Today we will see some feedback about STNPC for Trusts, if my google-translate fu is up to scratch.

[WoW]

The silence is because there's a small percentage of the NA community asking for the reason. A vast majority of community team responses are translated from their Japanese counterparts. Today we will see some feedback about STNPC for Trusts, if my google-translate fu is up to scratch.

Another reason why I am jetting.

[Olor]

Yeah it's almost like north american subscription money isn't worth as much as JP sub money. Sorry I happen to like a job that isn't the JP community's favourite SE.

[Malthar]

Still waiting, SE.

[ZoMBie343]

Also waiting.

[Malthar]

Bumping this thread so it doesn't die.

[Olor]

Waiting.

Yep.

[ZoMBie343]

Still waiting.

:(

[Olor]

Come on guys, give me a reason to keep subscribing!

[Malthar]

Still waiting... Is it really that difficult to respond?

[Olor]

apparently it is.

[WoW]

You guys know the drill; your adjustments will come in the form of crappy pets whom you will not seen til the updates notes (Aka rushed content). No clue why SE will not at least communicate with you guys as it pertains to your pets; i mean damn, can they at least work with you there?

How much does it take to do this;

Greetings; we will be adding blah, blah, blah, etc.

Here are their ready moves;

Here are the traits

And level caps.

Its called communication.

[Malthar]

How many days has it been? And still no response. Draylo kept his thread, asking if there are any plans to include alliance content in the future, alive and after weeks of nil response they finally answered. Maybe that's what it takes. A critical mass that spurs the devs to their keyboards.

[ZoMBie343]

Bump. Uncap our pets!

[WoW]

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/43854-THe-Development-Team-Does-Not-Currently-Have-Plans-Too...

[Olor]

I am getting to the point where I am starting to believe the only reason they won't uncap all jug pets is because they regret giving us TH1 with our pet. Yes, tons of jobs can get TH1 without subbing THF - and everyone can get it via Trust - but it's just about the only reason I can think of now.

[dasva]

Th1? I'm still waiting for the th equipment promised us when they took away th3

[Leonardus]

They can't allow 5 more levels on our Lv114 pets, but they have no problems completely wasting time making exact clones of some of them, and calling them "new."

SE: "We have no plans to plan your plans, so take this Jug of GooeyGerard v1.1 and leave our vision alone!"

[ZoMBie343]

Bump. Still waiting on an answer.

[WoW]

"We have no plans..........."

It is evident.......................

[Balloon]

They've already said they have no plans to do this - right? People just want a reason.

[SNK]

Reasons are "Barance" obviously. I think I'm one of the few BSTs who doesn't care what they do to the job right now. It's a lot stronger then it used to be sure but other then that it's a solo job which is all it was to begin with.

[WoW]

^^No, you are not the only one, lol. However, I do not consider myself a bst.

Edit: Imo, they are run dry out of ideas. I was on record saying XI may be around for awhile; however, when you are re-introducing WOE; SE is bone dry out of ideas.

[Louispv]

BST isn't a solo job and never has been. Back in the day literally anything/BST was better than BST main, and several jobs were better even without the sub. (PUP, DNC, NIN, BLM, SMN all come to mind.) And today soloing isn't even a thing. My PLD with 3 trusts solos literally everything better than my BST, (Normal or difficult battlefields solo on PLD vs very easy or easy on BST) and even on things I can't call trusts on, my SMN is better in every way. (Level 115 garuda in no pet stat + gear has higher acc att, def and eva than 119 Ibuki with pet gear, can drop 9k damage bloodpacts of either physical or magical damage, and can haste herself and me, and takes -50% from all forms of damage, because she's an avatar)

Unless each of these new jugs has an indi-spell on them constantly like some of the trusts, what the hell is even the point of BST as a job?

[SNK]

BST isn't a solo job and never has been.

I beg to differ sir. Beastmaster "Back in the day" was one of the only jobs capable of going out and soloing exp at a decent amount an hour without needing to interact with other players.


Back in the day literally anything/BST was better than BST main, and several jobs were better even without the sub. (PUP, DNC, NIN, BLM, SMN all come to mind.)

I kinda agree with that but going back further in the day, a lot of beastmasters who had the job as their mains were pretty good at soloing a lot of content where they didn't need to join parties. Exploring new hunting grounds and gauging what mobs worked good vs what, their weaknesses and the general layout of the zones made for some very intresting solo content.


And today soloing isn't even a thing.

This is 100% correct.


My PLD with 3 trusts solos literally everything better than my BST, (Normal or difficult battlefields solo on PLD vs very easy or easy on BST) and even on things I can't call trusts on, my SMN is better in every way.

Any job can pretty much solo a lot of stuff with trusts now but like I was saying previously, Beastmaster was *the* solo job where you could literally not have to sit in town seeking for a party & go out and exp. I'm not sure if you had played as long as me but I remember seeing people sitting in jueno on SAM, DRG, MNK and w/e other job that wasn't an RDM BRD WHM or RNG seeking for hours & hours & hours without an invite. I originally was an RDM at the time but even then I decided to join a static within my playtimes and got my 1st 75 of course being RDM. Beastmaster was something on the side originally for me but then I met a few amazing players who were damn good at the job & really made me want to take a chance at playing it.

I liked the aspect of how beastmaster worked back then and it taught me a lot about hate mangement, building gearsets *lolCharm*, and how to exploit zones and mobs to my liking.



Unless each of these new jugs has an indi-spell on them constantly like some of the trusts, what the hell is even the point of BST as a job?

It's not even a standard job to a lot of people and sadly it probably will never will be. I love the job and I still do even with all the "Fuck you"s the dev team has dumped on it. I can't totally blame them tho because in a way I can see how adding too much to Beastmaster might in turn make it a very very broken job. I'm not saying it's fair compared to SAMs, RNGs, & MNKs but that's how the devs are rolling with it at the moment. I'm sure something will come along that'll make people happy about beastmaster for a short time but in the end I'm sure they'll find something else new to complain about which in turn will make more beastmasters miserable. I refuse to let myself hate the job or how it's been treated because deep down I leveled it for my enjoyment even with the limitations it has always has.

Anyone who leveled beastmaster thinking it would be a viable end game content job where most people prefer SAMs, RNGs, & MNKs, really need to just realize that this game will never be as balanced as you'd like it to be. Have fun with your favorite job and do what you can with it but don't be so smug as to think people should take it on an event where most people prefer "easy" & "safe" wins over a random chance at losing. :(

[dasva]

BST isn't a solo job and never has been. Back in the day literally anything/BST was better than BST main, and several jobs were better even without the sub. (PUP, DNC, NIN, BLM, SMN all come to mind.)
When I think of back in the day and bst soloing I think of before pup and dnc existed... and some of the bst solos back then were right up there with the legendary rdm solos

[Malthar]

Just because a job can solo doesn't mean it's a solo job. And, aren't we getting off topic here?

[SNK]

Just because a job can solo doesn't mean it's a solo job.

I never said it was a solo only job, I said that at the time when the job came out, it was one of the only jobs able to solo a decent amount of exp without having to interact with other players. Truthfully, I liked being in parties with my BST back in the days of the Boyada Tree with 5 other beastmasters whacking on those Gobubuus on the upper level with each of us with a mandy pet each. Good times!

[Balloon]

I never really thought the nm solo part of BST was necessarily that interesting. Anything worthwhile would get stolen from you in pet swaps (Despot comes to mind) and the fights are usually just attrition. The NM solos were really reliant on the mobs in the area, too, and later Abyssea solos were probably even more tedious, relying heavily on Pet Damage Taken and sitting back.

I solod it to 75, apart from the occasional duo, but that paradigm doesn't exist anymore, and I really dislike when people seem to imply that BST should be underpowered because of it's heritage as a solo job. As the game changes, so too should the roles of jobs. Ninja made a formidable tank at some point, but it no longer does. BST was a healthy solo job at some point, but it no longer is.

That's not at anyone in particular in this thread, mainly just that I have seen the idea that because BST can solo stuff "For lots of gil" that it should be less powerful than it's cohorts, and I don't think it was true then (Anything worth soloing was stealable at 1%) and it certainly isn't true now. Perhaps dynamis, but it wasn't alone in this. I did it on PUP/THF, people did it on BLU, DNC and THF.

[Malthar]

I never said it was a solo only job, I said that at the time when the job came out, it was one of the only jobs able to solo a decent amount of exp without having to interact with other players. Truthfully, I liked being in parties with my BST back in the days of the Boyada Tree with 5 other beastmasters whacking on those Gobubuus on the upper level with each of us with a mandy pet each. Good times!

The xp wasn't that good. x.x
Some days it was two steps forward and three steps back. On those days I just threw my hands up and did something else.

[Olor]

The xp wasn't that good. x.x
Some days it was two steps forward and three steps back. On those days I just threw my hands up and did something else.

yeah, this. BST could scrape together exp but it was rarely even slightly close to what a party could get and a couple mischarms could wipe it all out.

At any rate, whether or not BST used to be good at soloing exp - EVERY JOB is good at soloing EXP now so it's really irrelevant. In fact, BST is WORSE now than other jobs because you can't call trusts with a charmed pet - really hurting BSTs a lot.

And none of that has anything to do with uncapping all our old jugs so we have a good selection of pets and they can focus on making new, interesting pets than giving us the EXACT SAME PETS over and over again at different caps. It's an insult.

I really raged when I saw a frigging white sheep, a brown lizard ... etc. Like seriously... ugh. Not even a reskin? Like SERIOUSLY.

[SNK]

I never really thought the nm solo part of BST was necessarily that interesting. Anything worthwhile would get stolen from you in pet swaps (Despot comes to mind)

I remember seeing this shit happen to so many people. What's amusing is I never had anyone really attempt to steal a mob from me other then RMTs and Aquarius but w/e. lol


and the fights are usually just attrition. The NM solos were really reliant on the mobs in the area, too, and later Abyssea solos were probably even more tedious, relying heavily on Pet Damage Taken and sitting back.

I remember really wanting an Assault Jerkin *lol at that piece* and I would swap Toramas back and forth soloing Ose. It was a lot of fun but damn it was always that one time when you got a misscharm and you ending up nearly dying because of it!


I solod it to 75, apart from the occasional duo, but that paradigm doesn't exist anymore,

This is a very true fact I can't agree with more.


and I really dislike when people seem to imply that BST should be underpowered because of it's heritage as a solo job.

I know the limitations of my job and I'm always happy when I get invited to group events on my beastmaster. The job does need a buff I won't deny it but I know most people would prefer to bring the usual cookiecutter jobs to get an easy win. It's pretty much fighting in uphill battle to join events on a job like beastmaster.


As the game changes, so too should the roles of jobs. Ninja made a formidable tank at some point, but it no longer does. BST was a healthy solo job at some point, but it no longer is.

Even more so with the advent of the trust system, any job is pretty much a solo job now. lol


That's not at anyone in particular in this thread, mainly just that I have seen the idea that because BST can solo stuff "For lots of gil" that it should be less powerful than it's cohorts, and I don't think it was true then (Anything worth soloing was stealable at 1%) and it certainly isn't true now. Perhaps dynamis, but it wasn't alone in this. I did it on PUP/THF, people did it on BLU, DNC and THF.

Beastmaster for a lot of people in Dynamis was a "comfort" job. A job where you didn't really have to gear up well to make gil and not worry about dying when your pet could do it for you. Nowadays I think I can count on one hand how many seriously geared Beastmasters are on my server outside of myself. :|



The xp wasn't that good. x.x
Some days it was two steps forward and three steps back. On those days I just threw my hands up and did something else.

I won't deny I had a few rough patches on beastmaster solo but then I had those times I was soloing Chain 6 or 7s depending on where I was exping, Bombs in Garliage, Red Kissers vs Colibri, Western Altepa Desert, The Basement in Gusgen Mines, Crawlers vs Goblins in Yuhtunga Jungle which was so much fun as well!


yeah, this. BST could scrape together exp but it was rarely even slightly close to what a party could get and a couple mischarms could wipe it all out.

It was all me gearswapping into a Monster Signa until level 51. There was a reason that staff along with Whitebox CHR gear was so much gil back then.


At any rate, whether or not BST used to be good at soloing exp - EVERY JOB is good at soloing EXP now so it's really irrelevant.

I'm just stating my expereince from what another poster said that beastmaster was never a solo job when in reality it was a very good solo job compared to other jobs at the time *Talking 2003/2004 here* which couldn't handle anything over even match at a certain level.


In fact, BST is WORSE now than other jobs because you can't call trusts with a charmed pet - really hurting BSTs a lot.

What's thie Charm thing you're talking about again?


And none of that has anything to do with uncapping all our old jugs so we have a good selection of pets and they can focus on making new, interesting pets than giving us the EXACT SAME PETS over and over again at different caps. It's an insult.

An insult to who? I'm not insulted by this. Amused maybe but not even the least bit upset about it. If you're going to be so angry all the time over these minor nuggets of w/e the devs are giving Beastmaster, Maybe you should take WoW's stance and take a break. This game... hell any game at all isn't worth yours or anyone else's stress. :|


I really raged when I saw a frigging white sheep, a brown lizard ... etc. Like seriously... ugh. Not even a reskin? Like SERIOUSLY.

It doesn't really matter to you that much does it? We don't even know how good they'll be yet so there's no reason to get up in arms yet right? It's obviously these new jobs will all be in Item Level range so it just comes down to how solid they are in terms of accuracy, attack, evasion and HP.

[Olor]

Just because a job can solo doesn't mean it's a solo job. And, aren't we getting off topic here?

SNK is only here to argue that everything's fine, BST doesn't need help - from here on in I am ignoring their posts as they clearly don't actually want BST to be a viable job.

OH HO HO! A white sheep! We're in luck folks!

Why you angry that BSTs getting shafted again!

Sure BST is underwhelming, but I'm going to argue against every fix anyone suggests!

[SNK]

SNK is only here to argue that everything's fine, BST doesn't need help -

Please don't put words into my mouth.


from here on in I am ignoring their posts as they clearly don't actually want BST to be a viable job.

"Their"? And I never said I wanted beastmaster to not be a viable job. Again with the words in people's mouths.


OH HO HO! A white sheep! We're in luck folks!

Why you angry that BSTs getting shafted again!

This BST isn't angry at all. I just don't give a rat's ass so much to the point that I'm not going to rage over it on a message board where I know any and all suggestions about this will be ignored.

Reality is a motherfucker isn't it?


Sure BST is underwhelming, but I'm going to argue against every fix anyone suggests!

I swear you're really trying too hard here Olor. All I'm seeing is a load of vemon/hate over a game that's 11+ years old. When does it stop mattering to you that you finally get a clue that beastmaster will never be what you want it to be? The sad part is I'm probably a lot better geared then your beastmaster *In fact I'm sure of it since you're complaining about CoP cockblocking you from getting your relic reforged* and even then with all the shinys I have for the job, I'm still just a beastmaster.

The End?

[Malthar]

Bumping the thread so it does slip into that great bit bucket in the cyber sky.

[Malthar]

Bumping again; I can't wait to see these awesome, new pets!

[dasva]

Bumping again; I can't wait to see these awesome, new pets!

I'm fairly certain you are being sarcastic but I'm not sure everyone got that

[Malthar]

Bumping; still no word from SE.

[Malthar]

Bumping again.

[dasva]

Bumping the bump

[Olor]

why is this so hard to answer...

also was I reading correctly in the other thread that our augment on our monster gloves is worthless for ilevel?

[Falkirk]

The "Augments Call Beast"/"Call Beast"+2 is useless for iLvl pets, yes.

The "Enhances 'Beast Affinity' Effect" is still necessary for most pets of course. :)

[Olor]

The "Augments Call Beast"/"Call Beast"+2 is useless for iLvl pets, yes.

The "Enhances 'Beast Affinity' Effect" is still necessary for most pets of course. :)

Thanks for confirming. That's pretty bogus.

:D

[Olor]

I guess they figure if they just ignore pet users completely we'll go away.

[ZoMBie343]

The "Augments Call Beast"/"Call Beast"+2 is useless for iLvl pets, yes.

The "Enhances 'Beast Affinity' Effect" is still necessary for most pets of course. :)

Wow Really?! ...What should we do with the extra Group 2 merits?

[Falkirk]

You still need 5/5 Beast Affinity (assuming you want the largest selection of pets), it's just that there's no random level variance with iLvl pets which the "Call Beast"+2 would otherwise correct.

[ZoMBie343]

You still need 5/5 Beast Affinity (assuming you want the largest selection of pets), it's just that there's no random level variance with iLvl pets which the "Call Beast"+2 would otherwise correct.

With 5/5 BST affinity and Call Beast+2, what does this do an uncapped 99 job pet, like falcor?

[Falkirk]

Here's the breakdown. :)
Let's say you've got the maximum level mainhand Axe equipped (level 119):

FaithfulFalcorr's natural cap is level 99.
The 5/5 Beast Affinity (+2 levels per merit) makes FaithfulFalcorr level 109.
The "Enhances 'Beast Affinity' effect" on your Augmented Monster Gloves +2/Ankusa Gloves/Ankusa Gloves +1 adds one extra level per Beast Affinity merit,
so FaithfulFalcorr is level 114.

And since we're in iLvl territory, the "Call Beast"+2 does absolutely nothing. Back before iLvl pets were a thing, that was used to remove the random level variance for capped pets (so you wouldn't be poppin' out level 97/98 pets), and thankfully they've done away with that awful mechanic for pets level 100+. So as it stands, the "Call Beast"+2 might as well not even be there.

[dasva]

Wow Really?! ...What should we do with the extra Group 2 merits?

He is just saying that ilvl pets no longer range 0-2 levels below the cap or ilvl weapon like they used to

[Malthar]

Bumping; No, we did not forget SE.

[Olor]

So much disappoint, SE.

[Leonardus]

It's probably a glitch with the item level system. If you guys bother SE enough, they'll fix it, so without the gloves you'll have your random 0-2 levels back.

Problem resolved!

[ZoMBie343]

SE, please fix call beast +2 for iLvL pets!

[Malthar]

Beast Affinity should call pets 0-2 levels *above* the master, depending on merits and equipment. And require the caller to have Guttler equiped, make Guttler talk, dammit!

[Malthar]

And...
Ku-ka-chau!
Bump

[Olor]

hey we got sub 100 acc extra this patch... and absolutely nothing that will make us relevant in any relevant content! GO US!

COME ON SE. DO YOU EVEN PLAY THIS GAME?

[Malthar]

Still waiting for SE to answer.

[ZoMBie343]

Bump. I think BST is still pretty undesirable despite the +84 accuracy on 119 pets :(

[Malthar]

I like the little bump they gave bst, but the pet's attack is still lack luster. I asked the following in a previous post:
Why do we have a sic/ready timer? Getting rid of the sic/ready timer and allowing the pet to TP when it has TP would be a much better improvement, and would actually put bst on the board when the master has companion's and a pet attack roll on.

[Olor]

wish we could get an answer

[Dorgon]

Just returned after a 5 year break and dang, this question was asked back in 2004 and it still has not been answered? I want to be surprised, however I am not.

[Olor]

yeah it's sad.

[Selindrile]

The amount of time that's passed without this being addressed is ridiculous.

[Olor]

Yes, it is.

[Malthar]

I wonder if the devs realize the pets still suck balls? This may be good for the feline pets 'cause kitties love balls, but for the others? And why are there not any canine pets?

[Olor]

I wonder if the devs realize the pets still suck balls? This may be good for the feline pets 'cause kitties love balls, but for the others? And why are there not any canine pets?

No, I am sure they think that it's totally A-OK for a DD to parse at (if we are lucky) 50% of top DDs and to be nothing but a joke for anything but joke content.

[Malthar]

And bump; still no response from SE.

[Dorgon]

Think there will be a response before the year is out?

[Malthar]

Happy Monday! Bump.

[Olor]

Don't worry guys they put some cure potency gloves in the game for us.

[Malthar]

And... Kaching! Kachow! Bump.

[Glamdring]

I'm noticing a trend Mal, you keep bumping and they keep ignoring you. Any way we can start a betting pool to see who gives up 1st?

[Malthar]

I'm betting on them. lol

[Glamdring]

oh Mal, you forgot to bump...

[Malthar]

Yeah, they're making me tired. :-(
SE, that is.

[dasva]

Yeah, they're making me tired. :-(
SE, that is.

For a second there I thought you meant all the bumping.

[Olor]

It would be nice to get some reason, some day.

[Dorgon]

The answer wont come this year it seems.

[Jile]

The answer wont come this year it seems.

Well, considering

2:03 AM
Thursday, January 1, 2015 (GMT+9)
Time in Japan

I'd say that's 100% accurate. lol

[Olor]

so.... yeah....

[Railer]

Makes you wonder if it has something to do with level capped events.