Log in

View Full Version : Lack of battle content. Sheer boredom. Server Merges etc.



Kylos
10-12-2013, 04:36 AM
Just a bit of background information on my history on FFXI.

Started on the Hades server back in 2004, loved the game, made tons of friends, eventually got DRK to 75 in 2005. Loved the game to death back then, couldn't stop playing it every day. Helped so many players in my social linkshell. Got strong enough to do Dynamis and eventually lead a Dynamis Linkshell. Quit doing dynamis in 2009 due to real life issues, and not because of boredom/lack of rewards after doing it for two years.

Took a long break when Abyssea came out. Hated the SMN burns, hated the easy exp, hated how easy Abyssea was with all of its atmas/abyssites and its procing system that basically told me to "eff off your dark knight is useless".

I returned a year later, most of my friends gone, but I still managed to blast through Abyssea content. Some fun was had, though I still preferred the older content.
The game was revitilized, however Level Sync had created the downward spiral that we see in today's game.

Without level sync, SMN burns would never have occured, meaning Abyssea had to be very generous with EXP. The fact that level 30s could run in there and open boxes killed old school EXP parties, meaning that people would level to the max and be expected to know their jobs inside and out.

Abyssea provided an alternative to Relic and Mythic weapons, and this made Ultimate weapons feel less important. Not only that, but killing the same NM over and over and over was highly tedious.

So Voidwatch appeared... and so did the crazy heavy metal trial. So players were getting used to having temp items and crazy buffs at their disposal. EXP became completely irrelevant and so was dieing. You could die over and over and get that EXP back in no time, so players don't need to try as hard... because yea.. dieing is just a minor inconvenience. (Thanks Twilight & Warps!)

Voidwatch showed us just how bad a drop system can be, as many players raged over the stupidly random loot system.. because SE were scared that endgame linkshells would monopolize drops like they did on HNMs.

So by this time, Dynamis and Limbus became useless as the majority of equipment became outdated aside from some situational pieces. Legion, Neo Nyzul Isle, Neo Salvage and Neo Limbus were introduced so the players had more content to do.

Just before Seekers was released, we had a lot of content that still had some relevance:-

Abyssea - Afv3, Empyreans etc.
Dynamis - AFv2+2 augmented
Salvage - To get drops for Neo
Neo Salvage - Sidegrades, some are still useful.
Neo Limbus - Sidegrades, nothing useful anymore.
Neo Nyzul Isle - Fun challenging content with nice rewards.
Legion - Fulad Zereh?
Voidwatch - Heavy Metal, Pulse cell items, other situational equipment.
Meeble Burrows - Sidegrades, fun content.
Limbus - Brutal Earring, Loq Earring etc.

Outdated content before Seekers:-
Garrison, Ballista, VNM, Campaign, ZNM, Assault, Walk of Echoes, Sky, Sea.

When Seekers came out, the game was revitilized once again, for a short time. The initial excitement to explore brand new zones was high, and fighting new monsters was also refreshing. Reives were challenging in the beginning, and quite fun with a huge amount of players there.

Skirmish never really kicked off. The game still allowed players to go into older content, and players kept making relics/mythics/empyreans.

The day before Delve was released, I finished Ragnarok to 95. I had spent so much time and effort to create my weapon. I was really happy with it, I felt a great sense of achievement. It was soon ripped away when I saw the Bereaver and Senbaak.
I couldn't imagine how those players who had multiple R/M/E on 99 felt.

Delve was so tough in the beginning. I knew it was a matter of time until players killed the NM and acquired better equipment. Everybody progressed so much... and even managed to do Wildskeepers. Skirmish 2.0 came out and basically handed equipment to players for very little effort, and now it was definite that R/M/E were completely irrelevant.

So I did all this content. Not every single day, but I did plasm runs, I set up Delve NM runs, Skirmish runs, farmed bayld on reives, and made my Corsair decent so I could do Mega Boss runs.

I killed all the Wildskeepers, I killed Muyingwa, I lead an alliance to kill Tojil, and I went to many Foret runs only to see failure on the Shark,
After doing a Hurkan one day and getting an Iron Sand... the new content left a sour taste in my mouth. It was no longer fun to grind so much bayld to retreive such a petty reward. Delve also became very repetitive after a few victories.

Delve = Challenging, very difficult without the right players, but zero replay value
Skirmish = Extremely easy, extremely rewarding, might as well just send the equipment to out Mog House and cut out the event completely.
Wildskeeper = Fun, but the loot system is a complete shambles and insulting.

Oh, so then SE releases Mog Gardens and Monstrosity! Wow... where was this back in 2004? That would have been epic back then, but with so little actual content to battle, it feels like unneccesary filler. Don't get me wrong, some players love Monstrosity, and the system is great, but it's just easy EXPing, something most of us have done to death already.

After so many years of playing this game, I have never felt that it was a waste of money. Even when I took my long break, I kept paying for my account to make sure my character wasn't deleted.

It is depressing to come online and see 400-500 players online. It is difficult to find quality players to do Delve with, because half of those players are mules or AFK, and you really need quality players to do Delve. I am tired of joining Delve runs where players cant follow instruction and everyone leaves after the first NM.

Even endgame linkshells have trouble in Delve, and are continuing to look for quality players. It is evident that there is a complete lack of content. and that content which is there, a lot of players have grinded it to death, or players like myself have no interest in repeating it.

I got Mikinaak Body, Feet and Bereaver to Rank 15. I ranked other pieces up, and also used some Verdigris stones on Cizin. I saved up gil for a Senbaak so players would take my DRK, but they always want my Corsair instead. COR/WHM is boring in delve, but I am required to play it most of the time.

The game promoted the need to level multiple jobs, but the amount of merits we can spend, and the amount of inventory space showed us otherwise. It is extremely difficult to keep track of equipment for multiple jobs. I have trouble handling 3-4 jobs at any given time, nevermind 10-20 jobs.

FFXI is boring now. Sadly I would rather play other games, old and new. I would rather play the original Final Fantasy then FFXI right now. Final Fantasy has lost the magic. It has lost it;s identity and spirit. Where did the fun go?

I might be back someday... if you guys can go back to the drawing board and produce something that is worth my time and money. I loved this game, and spent way too much time and money on it, and I have never seen the game as boring as it is right now.

I am not angry. Just incredibly frustrated. You have tried to produce quality content, but yet, it is not the quality we expect of you.

Kylos
10-19-2013, 10:35 AM
What I miss most is the magic and spirit of FFXI. I recently cleared FFVII Crisis Core, and was totally amazed at its storyline, graphics, characters, battle system and replay value. I think it was the last great game Square Enix made.

Please go back to FFVI, VII, VIII and IX and study them, because they were all great games in their own way.
Squaresoft > SE.

MarkovChain
10-21-2013, 07:37 AM
I've always said it, 6-man-only content to make people happy. This skirmish is not even a content. Make the next delve instance 6-man, with limited entry per day (or requiring something rare to enter). Think of a mix of dynamis (for duration and the once a day system), skirmish (for rewards) and old salvage (for strategies).

Tennotsukai
10-22-2013, 01:56 AM
I've always said it, 6-man-only content to make people happy. This skirmish is not even a content. Make the next delve instance 6-man, with limited entry per day (or requiring something rare to enter). Think of a mix of dynamis (for duration and the once a day system), skirmish (for rewards) and old salvage (for strategies).

Actually a good idea! I really like the part with 6 people :)

predatory
10-22-2013, 07:31 AM
I've always said it, 6-man-only content to make people happy. This skirmish is not even a content. Make the next delve instance 6-man, with limited entry per day (or requiring something rare to enter). Think of a mix of dynamis (for duration and the once a day system), skirmish (for rewards) and old salvage (for strategies).

I'm not a huge fan of all this instanced crap they've been pushing on us, or at least this whole one alliance or smaller thing, it leaves too many jobs out in the cold, and one of the reasons I am a fan of WKRs, especially the tier 2s which are much stronger than delves because they are designed for more players and can last hours on end, depending on the colonization rate in that given area.

Demon6324236
10-22-2013, 07:36 AM
So you like battles that require an army of people and take multiple hours just to get a pebble?

predatory
10-22-2013, 01:46 PM
So you like battles that require an army of people and take multiple hours just to get a pebble?

Yeah actually I do, granted the prizes could be better, but the battles are epic, and i find it exhilarating, and from the response (by response I mean the number of people who show up), to my Sunday WKR shouts, quite a lot of other people on Bahamut like them as well. If you're actually doing WKRs and hoping for a good drop, chances are you're wasting your time, the gear isn't all that great compared to skirmish and delve, and ffxi has a very long history of dropping crap after hard battles anyway, i mean all you have to do is look at the old (not sure if it's been changed), drop rate on drings for confirmation of that.

WKR to me is all about the fun and excitement, vast numbers of people doing something together and if you screw it up, oh well, wipe and get up, dust yourself off and get back to it. It's endgame content where your mob can't be stolen, and you actually have to have the pre-reqs done to get in. It doesn't matter how you're geared, what job you bring, or even if you're a total noob who doesn't know his ass from a hole in the ground, it is something that everyone can participate in, and to me that's a good thing, it makes the game funner for more people, and let's face it, the more people who are having fun, the more often they will play, and the more people who will be active on the servers, which mean more people can get things done. WKR is actually about the only part of SoA I actually do like

Halldir
10-22-2013, 01:58 PM
I'm exactly the same boat. I stopped pay/playing a few months ago due to sheer boredom and frustration about the "end game" which is basically Delve.

WKR cape system drops are flat out disgusting. I was after pup which for me turned out to drop 19/22.

The new content reduced the game of 22 jobs to just a few. Sad.

Maybe a few updates later I might resub.

Draylo
10-22-2013, 07:52 PM
I would hate to be a DEV atm with all these whiny babies with their nostalgia goggles on tight. Good grief.

Zohno
10-22-2013, 09:36 PM
I would hate to be a DEV atm because they destroyed a game.

Return1
10-26-2013, 08:34 AM
Draylo is so full of it. He's hating on people who don't like the way the game is going because he was terrible at 14, then realized the population of 11 is deathly low, and is scared the game might die along with his entire identity.

The truth is, Seekers of Adoulin was the single biggest failure in the history of this game, and possibly second only to the abortion that was ffxiv as the biggest FF failure. They took a long lasting MMO, with a respectable player base considering its age, and annihilated its population.

No ARR isn't what happened to FFXI. Taking a game that relied on a decade of lateral progression, outdating almost all of the gear in the game, including the time consuming legendaries, with easily obtainable gear, all in a new vertical progression model is what killed FFXI. The devs are fully at fault for not realizing two gigantic flaws with their plans. First, you need to release new content much faster than their "glacial at best" pace to support vertical progression, or people outpace content and grow complacent. Second, and even more important, the entire game was designed around lateral progression! A large percentage of the people who were playing were playing because that was a fairly unique trait for an mmo in this day and age, and now its gone so the devs can pretend they're making a "modern" MMO out of this empty husk of an ancient game. That's why over 90% of the population is gone.

Such a genius move to annihilate a decade's worth of relevant content that could offer many players, new or old alike, hundreds of hours of playtime, just so people will buy an expansion with one city, three missions, a handful of areas, and a bare-bones, blatant test for the Fate system of FFXIV:ARR.

The smartest thing the devs have done since before Adoulin released is realized they screwed the pooch, and now they're desperately trying to upgrade old content back to relevance. Yeah, fix the AF1 and REMs, rebuff some BCNMs and Mission Battles for rewards. Then, get your @$%#* on AF2 and AF3, upgrading Limbus, Nyzul, Salvage, and ZNM. Add higher tier versions of Sky and Sea gods, and expand on a ToMs like system. Finally, remove your heads from your %#@%&$# @$^#$ and stop adding more of this asinine vertical progression that the majority didn't want and you can't maintain with your tiny crew.

Once enough content is revamped to keep people busy, they should offer a free month or two, something, for all players as an apology for the underdone abortion they released, in an effort to keep/renew some subscriptions, while they go back and look at events the old dev team nailed perfectly the first time through:

1) Limbus: Good reward system, the more capable your group was the more coins and upgrade materials you got, and the faster you could fight the mega-bosses. All jobs got something useful from this event, either through AF+1 or from coin gear. On top of that, like Dynamis, the coins could provide a means to accumulate gil, giving players a reason to help others after their own gear was done. You could go in with a group as small as you wanted or as big as you needed, with a lenient time limit that didn't add too much artificial difficulty, so you didn't have to rush to kill mobs and you didn't need to exclude "weaker" jobs. On top of that, all drops went to a SHARED loot pool.

2) Assaults: Bite sized, pick up and play content. Objectives didn't all involve killing as fast as possible, which was great and lead to diverse strategies being employed for different assaults. Had a points system to reward all players, and a SHARED treasure pool at the end. The only reason this wasn't higher is because the treasure pools usually sucked terribly. If the good loot was a bit more like a 20% drop, I would say it was perfect.

3) Nyzul: Original Nyzul. Bite sized content, again. Checkpoints allowed for specific targeting of monsters/loot, let weaker players eventually claw their way to their loot, and rewarded stronger players for competence. The only reason this falls below normal Assaults is because it focused very heavily on killing mobs and could exclude players on "weaker" jobs.

Now you take the personal Points/Tokens system from Nyzul/Assault, add the checkpoint system of original Nyzul, throw in the varied objectives of Assaults, add the coin/upgrade system and chose your own path/party leniency of Limbus, and you have the greatest event in this game. Go make that event and give it to us.

Demon6324236
10-26-2013, 08:41 AM
In the Steak vs Cold Dog Guts comparison, its not really the same. The ideas they are putting in FFXI right now are similar to the same ideas and features other companies have been putting in MMOs, such as ilevels, faster paced content, faster progression through content, latter based content, and so on. A better comparison would be to say they served steak, then someone bought the place and they started serving another popular dish instead of the steak due to its popularity in other restaurants while the steak your used to, has been dying down a bit.

Return1
10-26-2013, 08:57 AM
It's more like your sawdust steakhouse's chef is having a midlife crisis and is tired of cooking steaks, so he tries to class the place up with French food. French food he has no idea how to cook, doesn't have the ingredients or tools to make, and his red-blooded steak-eaters hate.

Kuvo
10-28-2013, 08:08 AM
In the Steak vs Cold Dog Guts comparison, its not really the same. The ideas they are putting in FFXI right now are similar to the same ideas and features other companies have been putting in MMOs, such as ilevels, faster paced content, faster progression through content, latter based content, and so on. A better comparison would be to say they served steak, then someone bought the place and they started serving another popular dish instead of the steak due to its popularity in other restaurants while the steak your used to, has been dying down a bit.

You have a valid point but at the same time this game has been active for 10+ years without doing what other MMOs have done. And where are the majority of these MMOs now? How long did they last? I'll be honest I don't pay attention to all the MMOs out there but how many can say they have held success for over 10 years like ffxi can? Now they change the entire thing that has been what ffxi population loves and wonder why ppl are leaving.

Demon6324236
10-28-2013, 10:31 AM
I never said it was smart, I just said its a better comparison. If a person buys a shop and stops selling the usual, which sold well, and instead starts to sell what other popular shops sell, well, it never goes well. The shop often ends up being not but a copy, taking some of the good, but not enough to be the same, and often not adding enough to make it special, so it fails to impress, and crumbles, rather than if they had kept selling what they had before, and continued to make money off of it.

predatory
10-28-2013, 02:13 PM
I never said it was smart, I just said its a better comparison. If a person buys a shop and stops selling the usual, which sold well, and instead starts to sell what other popular shops sell, well, it never goes well. The shop often ends up being not but a copy, taking some of the good, but not enough to be the same, and often not adding enough to make it special, so it fails to impress, and crumbles, rather than if they had kept selling what they had before, and continued to make money off of it.

That is a perfect analogy. Here's an even better one because it's based on a real life major corporation and a decision to change their product that almost drove them into bankruptcy.

Once upon a time there was Coca-Cola, (not classic Coke, just Coke), and after doing some taste testing in the early 1980s they found that people liked Pepsi better than Coke, so they came out with New Coke, and stopped making Coca-Cola altogether. This went on for a little over a year maybe two, (can't remember it's been awhile now), and were on the verge of going out of business, when they decided to go ahead and add Coca-Classic to their product line, and keep New Coke there as well. They did this for another year or so until it was decided New Coke was just a waste of profits, and took it back off the shelves.

SE has a chance to turn this around, but they have to move quickly, and they're actually going to have to spend development money to do it, because quite frankly FFXIV feels alot like New Coke to me, and it was designed under the same premise that New Coke was put on the market for, Coca-Cola wanted to make a deeper slice into Pepsi's market share, just like SE wanted a bigger slice of WoWs market share, and the results are obvious. SE needs to prop up both games to keep the market share they have, and let players decide which game they'd rather play, rather than trying to force us out of one and into the other.

Demon6324236
10-28-2013, 03:43 PM
I agree, they should be 2 completely different games, both worked on at the same time and kept alive. I wish SE would see that, but it seems like we just share everything or get scraps from FFXIV. Everything from our forum servers to our reps to our man in charge, all of it is shared, its no wonder things go slow around here normally.

predatory
10-29-2013, 04:25 AM
I've decided that since the product is so inferior right now, I'm simply not going to pay for it, and hope that some day it will become worthy of me spending my money on again, when that day comes I will be happy to lay out my subscription fees again, until then SE doesn't get another dime from me for any of their products, but then that's how capitalism works isn't it? You supply me with a quality product I want to buy and I do so, you supply me with garbage and I don't spend money on your products, Simple

Demon6324236
10-29-2013, 06:42 AM
On the basis that a single one of the games made by Square Enix has dropped in quality to the point you no longer think it worth your money, you will not be buying or paying for any other product of the company? Seeing as its multiple different development teams and even different genres let alone different games, that doesn't make any sense, it seems like a poor choice to me, but simply my opinion.

predatory
10-29-2013, 07:57 AM
On the basis that a single one of the games made by Square Enix has dropped in quality to the point you no longer think it worth your money, you will not be buying or paying for any other product of the company? Seeing as its multiple different development teams and even different genres let alone different games, that doesn't make any sense, it seems like a poor choice to me, but simply my opinion.

Actually not really, most of the titles in my house come from Ubisoft, Activision, Bethesda, and EA, the only two SE product in my home is FFXI (which is my favorite game), and FFXIV that my son wanted but never plays. So me saying I'm not going to buy another of their products isn't that big a stretch of the imagination, it was just added in to emphasis my distaste for what SE has done to my favorite game.

predatory
10-29-2013, 10:16 AM
FFXI is my favourite game too.^^

If you haven't played FF7 and FF8 I urge you to buy those games, then you will have three Squaresoftenix games in your house. And will be busy for a long time playing those two earlier titles.
Most of the games in my house are "Ultimate - Play The Game", they are from the mid 1980's, original boxes and still run which is why I have a burglar alarm lol because I have crates of those things and I know people would pay a lot for them. But after UPTG cassette games, the most games I have are by Square/SE, I always said FF7 and FF8 are the two greatest Playstation games of all time (followed by Syphon Filter and Tenchu). Brand-loyalty is cool if the brand has made as many world-changing games as Squaresoft made.
I also have copies of FF10, 13, 14. I don't play those but I use them for swatting flies, and wedging under wobbly table legs. So SE even gave me a bug-free house and stop me spilling my coffee.

I played 7 didn't play 8 but I loved 12, when it was released it was like ffxi without the dumbasses who couldn't play their jobs, and seeing as how we're taking this off topic some of my other favorite games are fallout, and new vegas, and of course oblivion and skyrim, but those are bethesda titles, and of course I've been watching their upcoming MMO title like a hawk

Makenshi
11-04-2013, 04:45 AM
Even after everything they have done to the game its still my favourite MMO and much better than 14.

Draylo
11-04-2013, 06:32 AM
I agree :) best game ever and FFXIV suck

FrankReynolds
11-04-2013, 11:44 AM
On the basis that a single one of the games made by Square Enix has dropped in quality to the point you no longer think it worth your money, you will not be buying or paying for any other product of the company? Seeing as its multiple different development teams and even different genres let alone different games, that doesn't make any sense, it seems like a poor choice to me, but simply my opinion.

For me it's not about one game sucking. If they just made the game suck, that would be sad. But, they made the game suck and treated the fan base like crap in the process. They ignore 99% of all feedback and then reply with complete nonsense to the other 1%.

Teraniku
11-05-2013, 01:49 AM
FF8 is awesome, I even enjoyed it marginally more than FF7. FF8 really is my most replayed and favourite playstation title. Highly recommended.

Once you actually learn the battle system it is awesome, but you have to make the effort to do so.