Reive Evaluations

[Camate]

Greetings pioneers!

Hopefully everyone was doing their best this weekend to contribute to the colonization efforts, which in most cases means a lot of Reives.

As we have been receiving quite a bit of feedback about this new content, we feel that adjustments are necessary and have decided to put it on a higher priority. However, we need your help! If you currently feel that you are not receiving enough experience points or bayld while doing Reives, please fill out the below template and post it as a response to this thread.

Please only post EXP and bayld data from Reives you participated in after this post was made.
(*This is limited to Colonization Reives and Lair Reives for the time being)

Please note the below important points:

Please only post the experience points and bayld for a single evaluation and NOT the total of multiple evaluations.
If you felt that the experience points and bayld you received were too low multiple times in a single Reive, please separate them into different sets and post them in the same reply.
Please make separate posts for different Reives.



Template
Please use the below template and post your data as a reply to this thread.

=======================
Job and level
(Please indicate the job and level you were when participating in the Reive)
　 Reive type
(Please indicate the type of Reive you participated in)
　 Area name and < pos > of the Reive
(Please indicate the area name and < pos > of where the Reive took place)
　 Conditions
---Set 1 start---
　 Amount of experience points and bayld for a single evaluation
(Please indicate the amount of experience points and bayld you received for a single evaluation.)
　 Actions performed at the time
(please indicate what you were doing and the frequency in which you were performing these actions during the Reive.)
　 How much HP did you damage the obstacle or lair for?
(Please indicate how much HP you damaged the obstacle or lair for. If there were multiple targets, please indicate them separately.)
　　
---Set 1 end---
　
=======================






Sample post:

=======================
Job and level
Main job: WHM99
Support job: BLM49

　 Reive type
Colonization Reive

　 Area name and < pos > of the Reive
Yahse Hunting Grounds (H-8)

　 Conditions
---Set 1 start---
　 Amount of experience points and bayld for a single evaluation
EXP: 50
Bayld: 100

　 Actions performed at the time
Cast Cure V on players (approx. 10 times)
Cast Protect V and Shell V on myself (1 time for each)
Attacked monsters with normal attacks and weapon skills (approx. 50 regular attack and 3 weapon skills)

　 How much HP did you damage the obstacle or lair for?
Obstacle HP: Reduced the HP by approximately 50% from full.

　　
---Set 1 end---
　
=======================

[Stan64]

This is only about the first evaluation, where you never get anything whatever you do. The best I did for the first one was the one below. Worth mentioning is that I get 150-250 for the same amount of work on subsequent ones.

=======================
Job and level
Main job: WHM99
Support job: BLM49

　
Reive type
Colonization Reive

　
Area name and POS of the Reive
Yahse Hunting Grounds (H-8)

　
Conditions
---Set 1 start---
　
Amount of experience points and bayld for a single evaluation
EXP: 0
Bayld: 0

　
Actions performed at the time
This is only about the first evaluation, where you never get anything whatever you do. The best I did for the first one was the one below. Worth mentioning is that I get 150-250 for the same amount of work on subsequent ones.
Curaga IV everyone from orange to Maximum. Damage the roots a bit. Buffing pro/shell.

　
How much HP did you damage the obstacle or lair for?
Obstacle HP: 1%

　
　
---Set 1 end---
　
=======================

[Lotto]

Job and level
Main job: BLM99
Support job: RDM49

　
Reive type
Colonization Reive

Every possible Reives position in Ceizak Battlegrounds

　
Conditions
---Set 1 start---
　

Amount of experience points and bayld for a single evaluation
EXP: 150/0 (the first amound happened 2-3 times but most of the time it was 0)
Bayld: 50/0

　
Actions performed at the time
Nuking Roots and spawned monsters (~10 tierV spells + Aspir/Aspir 2), occasionnal buffs like Stoneskin and cure IV on my self (2-3 times per Reives), Sleepga (~5) the adds.


How much HP did you damage the obstacle or lair for?
30-50% with each nukes on adds, 1-2% on the obstacle

While I get you probably don't want some low lvl to get xp from just spamming cures, just put a level requirement to be able to join Reives and the problem is solved. Most of the mages I played with just melee the roots to actually get some xp/bayld.

[hideka]

Job and level
99 SCH/ RDM
　 Reive type
Lair reive
　 Area name and < pos > of the Reive
Ciezak battlegrounds ( pick any pos)
　 Conditions
---Set 1 start---
　 Amount of experience points and bayld for a single evaluation
0
　 Actions performed at the time
Nuked the lair from 100 to 0% as the only source of damage on the lair utilizing Tier 5 nukes.

　 How much HP did you damage the obstacle or lair for?
900~2.5k per nuke.
　　
---Set 1 end---
　

[Nidhogg]

Job and level
PUP99/SCH49
　
Reive type
Colonization Reive
　
Area name and < pos > of the Reive
I-8 Yahse
　
Conditions
---Set 1 start---
　
For the very first Evaluation I recieved the message "You are unable to recieve bayld or experience points"
For the second evaluation I recieved 1,500 exp 700 bayld.
For the third evaluation I died.
For the fourth evaluation I home pointed.
I came back at the battle was over, so I received -2,540 exp and 700 bayld.
　
Actions performed at the time
I engaged the roots, and everything attacked me, the puppet kept me alive as long as it could but I eventually fell.
　
How much HP did you damage the obstacle or lair for?
Roughly 4,000 damage to the obstacle, I was using a Hope Staff.

[Alhanelem]

=======================

Job and level
Main job: GEO99
Support job: WHM49

　
Reive type
Colonization Reive

　
Area name and < pos > of the Reive
Yahse Hunting Grounds (H-8)

　
Conditions
---Set 1 start---
　

Amount of experience points and bayld for a single evaluation
EXP: 0
Bayld: 0

　
Actions performed at the time
Cast Geo-slow on multiple enemie in an area (twice, each bubble lasting a few minutes and affecting several enemies)
Cast Thunder IV ~3 times to different monsters
Cast Cure IV on allies ~4 times to various individuals

　
How much HP did you damage the obstacle or lair for?
Zero

　

　
---Set 1 end---
　

=======================

I gained EXP/Bayld one time out of 5 evaluations (287 EXP / 287 Bayld) despite performing similar hostile actions and cures as described above each time.

[Elderain]

Job and level
Main job: SMN99
Support job: RDM49

　
Reive type
Colonization Reive

　
Area name and < pos > of the Reive
Yahse Hunting Grounds any position

　
Conditions
---Set 1 start---
　

Amount of experience points and bayld for a single evaluation
EXP: ~200
Bayld: ~150

　
Actions performed at the time
Hastega more than 18 persons with garuda
Whispering wind more than 18 persons for more than 3k hp each time
Attacked the root with BP (wind blade and predator claw mostly) ~1400 dmg for each use of wind blade
Dia 2 the root

　
How much HP did you damage the obstacle or lair for?
I was doing ~1400 dmg to the root every 45 seconds

I saw that if I dismiss my avattar just before the evaluation, it ended with red message, 0 xp and 0 bayid, if I use the same avattar without dismissing it, I gain a very little amount of xp (compare to the xp I make with my mnk) and bayid. it seems totally random by the way. sometimes, I just don't get any xp for the whole reive, sometimes, I gain a little, but never more than 200 per evaluation.

[bigdave]

i thought they had a trial server to do this with

[Caketime]

i thought they had a trial server to do this with

So did I, but apparently they've fired the testing staff and would rather live test with paying customers. Better to have people testing your game that are paying for it, rather than paying people to tell you how much your programming blows.

[Calintzpso]

test servers not updated with this stuff yet i recall.

Just gonna go ahead and quote Alhanelem and change a few things, as I had the SAME experience.


=======================


Job and level
Main job: GEO99
Support job: RDM49

　
Reive type
Colonization Reive

　
Area name and < pos > of the Reive
Ceizak Battlegrounds (G-7)

　
Conditions
---Set 1 start---
　

Amount of experience points and bayld for a single evaluation
EXP: 0
Bayld: 0

　
Actions performed at the time
Tried Casting Geo-Paralysis/Slow/Languor on multiple enemies in an area. Self buffed with Indri-Acumen
Cast Tier III-IV multiple times to different monsters
Cast Cure I-IV on various individuals

　
How much HP did you damage the obstacle or lair for?
250-1100 depending on the spell. Multiple times. Saw Paralysis proc on multiple spiders.

　


　
---Set 1 end---
　


=======================

I gained no EXP/Bayld at the end, did not even qualify for those cruddy Arrowwood logs you like giving me.

[Babekeke]

I'd love to fill in your form with precise details, but there's maintenance right now (hopefully fixing this), but I can say for certain that as DRG/RDM meleeing adds when there is no damage being done to the root by anyone, I get 0/0 exp/bayld. If I cast Dia II on the root, then kill adds, I get up to 4/2 exp/bayld. If other people come in and attack the root but I only attack the adds, I get up to 1500 exp, 750 Bayld per evaluation. I can get similar amounts of exp if I am killing the root and others are sleeping/killing the adds. I never cure myself, only use barspells to activate healing breath, Jumps, auto-attack rounds and WS, and the occasional smiting breath.

However, when I try the same thing on BLM/RDM my exp/bayld is terrible. I try enfeebling the mobs, including sleepga, curing allies, nuking mobs, nuking the root and of course buffing myself with stoneskin, refresh, haste, protect/shell. Exp varies wildly between lots of no exp/bayld, and up to a huge 200 exp 100 bayld. This was even after the update where enfeebles etc. were supposedly fixed. Though I didn't try BLM again since I got Reive Unity KI. Does this make any difference to the amount of exp/bayld earned????

[Rhionhi]

I have gotten virtually no bayld, and up to about 300 exp per evaluation as 99 PLD/49 RDM, and again as 99 DRg/49 RDM. i have heard similar complains from others, as well as the majority of reives being close to unwinnable. the concensus in the group i was in is that they should link to the obstacle or lair, and each other, but not agro (everyone but PLD and a BLU was unable to raise safely, rest, or avoid constant attack by large numbers of mobs in a group of around 12 people)

[AinurBismarck]

I was able to complete an entire lair reive solo, so I will try to summarize from the chat log the evaluations and any actions taken.

Job and level
99 Puppetmaster/49 White Mage
　
Reive type
Lair Reive
　
Area name and < pos > of the Reive
Ceizak Battleground, J-6/7, west-northwest of the Frontier Biouvac
　
Conditions
Solo. Which gave me a very clean chat log to dissect for this.
　
Amount of experience points and bayld for a single evaluation:
0 Exp/0 Bayld 1 Barrage Turbine, 1 Armor Shatterer (hereafter AS), frequent puppet melee and ranged attacks)
59/11 (1 AS)
49/9 (1 AS)
0/0 (1 AS)
51/10 (1 AS)
56/11 (1 AS)
24/4 (1 AS but it missed)
53/10 (1 AS)
25/5
91/18 (1 AS, 1 Barrage Turbine)
56/11 (1 AS)
51/10 (1 AS)
55/11 (1 AS)
0/0 (1 Barrage Turbine, 1 AS)
57/11 (1 AS)
0/0 (1 AS)
58/11 (1 AS)
0/0
0/0 (1 AS)
58/11 (1 AS)
49/9 (1 AS) (Note: Reive Momentum Score: Attack Success, and Momentum Bonus: Status Ailment Recovery immediately followed this evaluation)
55/11 (1 AS)
58/11 Completed

　
Actions performed at the time
For myself, 5 Wind Maneuvers to trigger Barrage Turbine and for enhanced wind things and 1 Light Maneuver. Melee attacks were averaging 30-40 per hit, ranged was around 65-70 per hit, and Armor Shatterer was averaging 500 to 650.
　
How much HP did you damage the obstacle or lair for?
Every last hit point. Had Sharpshot head/frame automaton attack while I stood back and took notes. Puppet did all the damage to the Wasp Nest.

[Camate]

Hello!

Thanks for all the data thus far.

The development team and QA team have been performing on-going testing, and as long as there are no major issues, we will be rebooting the applicable areas to make adjustments sometime this week (the earliest would be tomorrow).

Once the testing has been finalized I’ll inform you all of the adjustment details, but to give you an idea, it will be similar to the adjustments that took place before.


Previous adjustment summary: Adjustments to the minimum value and the score given


◆Evaluation flow
Join a Reive
↓
Your actions are evaluated, and you will receive a score.
↓
This score is then matched against the minimum value to see if the value was met.
↓
If the value has been met: You will receive experience points and bayld
If the value has not been met: Your score will be carried over to the next evaluation


The bolded portions in the above flow are what we will be adjusting.


Once there are more details we will be sure to share with you all. :)

[Caketime]

How are actions evaluated, and which actions count toward evaluation? Healing/enhancing still delivers garbage results, why design an event that requires support actions and yet those support actions aren't factored into the evaluation score? At this point I would like one of the reps to just confirm that SE does not want healers to participate in this event instead of the constant lies.

[Mnejing]

Nothing is bolded?

[Sfchakan]

Nothing is bolded?
http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lmz2ooQ1oX1qgmqfoo1_500.jpg

Too late for April Fools.. :X

[Kalilla]

◆Evaluation flow
Join a Reive
↓
Your actions are evaluated, and you will receive a score.
↓
This score is then matched against the minimum value to see if the value was met.
↓
If the value has been met: You will receive experience points and bayld
If the value has not been met: Your score will be carried over to the next evaluation
Looking at the translated version on BG, I believe these are the words that should be in bold. Just to be sure I'm posting the version Slycer translated this morning.



Reive Evaluation
Participate in Reive.
↓
Player behaviors are evaluated and a score is granted.
↓
Score is compared with the threshold value.
↓
Threshold Reached: Bayld and EXP granted
Threshold not Reached: Bayld and EXP carried over to the next evaluation

We will be adjusting the components in red.

[Camate]

Sorry about that! I edited my post with the bold text.

[Miiyo]

Job and level
99 Blm/Sch

Reive type
x3 Colonization Reive. Spiders, Beetles, and Rabbits

Area name and < pos > of the Reive
Ceizak Battlegrounds

Blizzard V 2477; Fire V 2317; Thunder V 3082; Thundaja 2508, 2788
Total Dmg: 13172
689 mp remaining
Other Spells/JA used: Stoneskin, Manawell, Enmity douse, parsimony x2
369 exp 369 bayld
Beetles

Blizzard V 2560; Thunder V 2974; Blizajja 2174, 2174, 2174; Thundaja 3363
Total Dmg: 15419
153 mp remaining
Protection Spells/JA used: stoneskin, mana wall, parsimony x2, enmity douse
200exp 200 bayld
Bunnies


Fire III 723; Fire IV 1462; Blizzard III 1217; Blizzard IV 1869
Total Dmg: 5271
0exp 0 bayld
Spiders

[Kojo]

Might I suggest having an auto-reraise, like in Besieged and also a few seconds where you can't attack nor be attacked?

[Luvbunny]

Yes please!!! Auto-reraise!!! This will be so very very helpful for everyone who come as melee DD. Or any other mages not subbing sch or whm. Maybe a few refillable random temp items via Reive Unity KI would be great as well.

[Karah]

http://i45.tinypic.com/34ta8sw.png

This was the sum up of the entire last Reive I did, one evaluation, then one for the ending...

384+ 575 vs the previous 300~ x10 evaluations + the win

As per usual, you overshot the fix by quite a bit.

Can we just ONCE get some middle ground.

[Sambb]

I can confirm this I was in the same reives as Karah on carby and the total I got was 700. Usually its 3k-4k, A pld holding the mobs got 0 xp. In the next reive he was hitting the roots and for some reason still got 0 xp. It is offcially broken.

Dmg I did on drk/sam was in the region of about 11k ish looking at my chatlog.

[Camate]

Greetings!

As a follow-up I just wanted to direct everyone to the news that was just posted in Information regarding a version update for adjustments to Reive evaluations (http://www.playonline.com/ff11us/polnews/news22061.shtml).

Be sure to hop into some Reives when you have a moment and let us know your feedback now that it has been changed!

[Karah]

Just look at what we just posted. It BLOWS. B L O W S. fix it fix it fix it fix it.

[Sambb]

Camate I HOPE YOU READ the two posts above you before posting yours its BROKEEEEEEEEEEEEN

[Vivik]

Why the hell would you REDUCE mele evaluation points on the rieves? I swear this company just keeps shooting themselves in the foot. I can see increasing the magic and buffing evaluation points but mele was fine... Stop fixing shit that aint' broke.

[Nebo]

Greetings!

As a follow-up I just wanted to direct everyone to the news that was just posted in Information regarding a version update for adjustments to Reive evaluations (http://www.playonline.com/ff11us/polnews/news22061.shtml).

Be sure to hop into some Reives when you have a moment and let us know your feedback now that it has been changed!

Nerfing melee evaluations was completely the wrong decision.

What is needed is a way to properly reward and quantify healing/support/magic/other actions....not nerfs to melee.

This adjustment was terrible.

[Emitremmus]

The addition of auto-reraise w/out weakness would be a nice touch for those that like to come as one of the jobs that has absolutely no power with weakness active. I don't come as a job like this, but as much as you are prone to death in a Reive, I wouldn't ever consider it. I like not having temp items to use, so it's not like this is too much of a gain on our part to outweigh the work that needs to be put in.

Also a reduction in respawn would be nice, as waiting upwards of an hour is taking time away from other things I could be doing.

[Kojo]

I went in as melee before the nerf and wasn't getting but 600~ xp at the most, I was on RUN, tanking for that 600 and died for it, could have done better on DRK DDing the roots probably. Camate, please let the dev know that the reduction was a horrible idea, people are already seeing Rieves as dead in the water, this patch could very well be the nail in the coffin.

The FFXI community has suggested several great ideas to improve Reives, widen the battlefield, auto-reraise, lengthen the time limit to get back in the battle, eliminating knockback effects of Reive mobs, the list goes on and on, yet the dev team ignores these suggestions and instead of improving an already horribly bugged event, they make it worse, intentionally. It's not hard to see why the community is angry, it seems the dev team is actively trying to anger the FFXI community, subscribers who pay their wages.

I understand ignoring the gripes of "I am disappoint, SE, Y U NO MOAR CONTENT?!" and of course the "Higher damage than Relics!? SE do you even lift!?" I can also understand not translating and forwarding such concerns to the devs, but please forward the Reive suggestions to the devs.

[Asymptotic]

You don't receive Bayld based on your evaluation. Bayld is determined based on how much the obstacle is damaged by the entire participating force of the Reive. Your evaluation is a "Score" based on the number of eligible actions. Each action is worth a certain number of points. There is a minimum score to be eligible for Bayld. Everyone who meets the threshold gets that amount at the time of evaluation.

Everyone in my party was able to receive full points pre-update from the evaluations by having a PLD off to the side tanking all the mobs, while a DNC and WHM skillchained the root to death. It seems that the PLD was only eligible for XP if it damaged the root once, though. But after that, it was able to receive XP/Bayld by tanking the other mobs off to the side and never touched the root. The WHM was also able to achieve the same reward as everyone else if it stood off to the side and cast AOE Barspells on the party over and over.

So basically, they just lowered the amount of points received for melee damage. At the same time, they reduced the minimum number of points required to receive an award and increased the number of points available from other sources Before this change, if you were meleeing, you were earning WAY over the number of points required to reach the minimum threshold anyway.

[Mindi]

great now we have campaign-brd V2

[Insaniac]

What's with the "?" in the update notes?

[Asymptotic]

What's with the "?" in the update notes?

SE has been collecting underpants lately.

[Luvbunny]

Greetings!

As a follow-up I just wanted to direct everyone to the news that was just posted in Information regarding a version update for adjustments to Reive evaluations (http://www.playonline.com/ff11us/polnews/news22061.shtml). Be sure to hop into some Reives when you have a moment and let us know your feedback now that it has been changed!

Thanks for the recent changes, I will definitely hop to it as RDM and BLU to test it. Perhaps enlighten us on how Reive participation is evaluated and what is the purpose of doing this. All I am seeing is people focusing on whacking the roots and not killing the adds over and over which seems to bring more bayld the longer you do both activities. And please add Auto Reraise at the very least.

[hideka]

wow you guys are stupid... the melee reives were PERFECT at their current values. you needed to bring everything UP to that level not drop it to nill.

[Arkista]

I have been doing these on BLU/WAR and was getting around 3k per battle and today I got about 1500Bayld. This problem needs to be fixed along with the fact that we get crappy items for rewards 'Skull Locust".

[hideka]

SE has been collecting underpants lately.

Step1: Fix what wasnt broken
Step 2: Break what wasnt broken
Step 3: ?
Step 4: PROFIT!

[Luvbunny]

wow you guys are stupid... the melee reives were PERFECT at their current values. you needed to bring everything UP to that level not drop it to nill.

Maybe they started to catch up with the ungodly amount of bayld a lot of melee DDs were able to receive and immediately adjusted this before the Blinker Fiasco aka Gil Fountain Version 2.0 start happening with SoA.

[Karah]

Given this change, if this is our only option, I say put it back to what it was, sorry but, screw mages... I got alot more bayld on whm mule meleeing with a staff for 5 damage than I get now for curing.

Although I don't sit there and spam useless spells, if that's going to be your argument.

[Washburn]

And now going as rng isnt worth the cost...again

[Demon6324236]

Step1: Fix what wasnt broken
Step 2: Break what wasnt broken
Step 3: ?
Step 4: PROFIT!Really mage Bayld was broken, but I agree they screwed the melee Bayld way to badly, all they needed to do was boost everything so all jobs could average 2k a fight, and if you did really well 3k+, now doing really well means 1.5k+ at best.

[Unaisis]

So much for doing reives today.... am not going to even bother with it until its fixed....

[Alhanelem]

Given this change, if this is our only option, I say put it back to what it was, sorry but, screw mages... I got alot more bayld on whm mule meleeing with a staff for 5 damage than I get now for curing.

Although I don't sit there and spam useless spells, if that's going to be your argument.
Screw melees.

No really, why cant we find a setup where everyone is able to get a reaosnable amount of points?

enhancing and enfeebles should count for something. IDC if it's crappy, should at least get minimal points for it- Yes, it can be done in a manner that doesn't contribute, but it can also contribute greatly when done with purpose.

Still, I don't see why mage bayld couldn't be made better without also nerfing melee.

[Karah]

Between what we have now, and what we had, as the only options, as I said, the previous way was better, screw (magic) the blms schs blus rdms geos whms etc etc can all melee with staves/clubs.

[Karbuncle]

Maybe they started to catch up with the ungodly amount of bayld a lot of melee DDs were able to receive and immediately adjusted this before the Blinker Fiasco aka Gil Fountain Version 2.0 start happening with SoA.

No idea what you can buy in SoA with Bayld that warrants this nerf.

Unless those 8,000 Bayld Deoderizers were going to cause problems with their 0.0034 Bayld to gil conversion :P

[Alhanelem]

Between what we have now, and what we had, as the only options, as I said, the previous way was better, screw (magic) the blms schs blus rdms geos whms etc etc can all melee with staves/clubs.
in the spirit of your perspective I agree, but I would prefer another solution to either the past and present state of the system.

[Luvbunny]

No idea what you can buy in SoA with Bayld that warrants this nerf.Unless those 8,000 Bayld Deoderizers were going to cause problems with their 0.0034 Bayld to gil conversion :P

Well since we have not unlock all the access on SoA, it could be that they are doing preventative measures before it gets out of controls since a lot of them already reaching over 100ks in less than a week lol. Plus I dont get it - now they are encouraging all the other jobs beside melee DD to come out and play and encouraging skill full team play by grouping together. Or is the goal still zerg that root with melee DD who do nothing but auto attack and WS, apart from constantly wiped when there is no PLD + WHM duo nearby doing some crowd control. Now they have to take damage, deal damage, and heal with waltz to get some points.

[Unaisis]

These reives will eventually slow down to a crawl or even stop altogether... like besiege and Campaign... only a few people will be interested and they will not be able to do it without the right jobs to provide back up. Combine the best of both besiege and campaign and add auto-reraise, no exp loss, temp items and MAYBE some NPC support~ then it could be enjoyable and plausible at winning for future generations lol

[LCofPandy]

They should have left melee stay the way it was and boosted mage up. No reason to nerf everyone. At this rate no one will do this content, because what's the reason if there isn't a little benefit besides opening up the zone. It's pretty much dead on Asura. And as for the whole "blinkers" fiasco. Nothing is really viable to sell. They really shot us in the foot on this one. Especially since it was the only real viable way( let's face it no one wants to do lair reives, only doing them to level up peacekeepers).

[Luvbunny]

Tested the new ways, and yup its broken overall for melee or mages lol. The entire zone pretty much dead and dried up now, can't even find enough people to clear one in a decent amount of time. Oh dear SE, perhaps use the test server first?

[Tohihroyu]

Why even ask for our suggestions when they get ignored? So the JP can laugh at our "Baka" suggestions?

[Kojo]

I wonder if anyone will comment on the issue today. Let's just not shoot the messenger, but I hope they bring Reives back to life, people seemed to stop doing them on Phoenix, just the occasional soloer getting mauled in one. I think people are doing other things to earn Batld at a slower pace.

[LCofPandy]

I wonder if anyone will comment on the issue today. Let's just not shoot the messenger, but I hope they bring Reives back to life, people seemed to stop doing them on Phoenix, just the occasional soloer getting mauled in one. I think people are doing other things to earn Batld at a slower pace.
I'm not holding my breath. They seemed to have taken on Tanakas stance of "nerf nerf nerf! = MOAR BARANCE" and I had such high hopes for this new crew.

[Kojo]

I'm not holding my breath. They seemed to have taken on Tanakas stance of "nerf nerf nerf! = MOAR BARANCE" and I had such high hopes for this new crew.

I don't believe they'll leave it this way, SoA depends on Colonization too much, if they wanted to leave it this way, they'd have to change alot of other things.

[Emitremmus]

Yeah my 2-3kish per Reive dropped to ~500ish per Reive as BLU. Doing the same exact actions I've always done. However, that is from attacking the roots. For the first time ever, actually attacking the mobs was giving me good amounts of bayld. Never once did I attack the roots, as the death butterflies were far too numerous to even get close to the roots. It was just me and a single PLD, him holding several of them, and I was helping pick them off one by one. There was no way we could have won the reive, but I did come out with about 6k bayld after several minutes of fighting the never-ending flock of pink and fuschia mist of damnation.

I think a good suggestion would be to have a fine ratio of enemy : players in a Reive. Perhaps if one person went to a Reive then a maximum of 3 death butterflies could attack you at once. But not 3 enemies for EVERY player in a Reive, I don't want my computer to explode anymore than it already wants to with the lag I experience, so of course a cap on the amount of enemies present would be in order.

[Camate]

Greetings everyone!

I hope you're all looking forward to the weekend, and perhaps even taking part in the double EXP campaign to catch whatever job or merits up to where you want them to be! :)

As there have been quite a few posts about the changes that were made to Reive evaluations yesterday, I wanted to follow-up and give an explanation about the system and the development team's thoughts.


Balance of the amount of bayld obtained between content

Broken down content-wise, the below is the order of how much bayld we imagined players receiving listed from highest to lowest:
Coalition Assignments > Colonization Reives > Lair Reives

The reasons for establishing it in this way are due to the following:


Coalition assignments consume tickets.
If the order of Reives and Coalition Assignments were reversed, the necessity to do Coalition Assignments would decrease.
If Coalition Assignments are not completed, the Coalitions' ranks will not increase, which means that no one would be able to receive Coalition support perks.
If no one is receiving Coalition support perks it would become difficult to colonize.


Envisioned amount of Bayld obtainment
Coalition Assignments: 4000 Bayld/day
Colonization Reives: max of 1000-1500 each time
Lair Reives: max of 700-800 each time

The cost of items that can be purchased with Bayld have been established based on these envisioned numbers.
*These numbers are what were envisioned for a single Reive, and not the amount to be received at each evaluation.


Why the evaluation value and the threshold were high for enhancing magic, elemental magic, enfeebling magic, and healing magic

Enhancing magic: We wanted to protect against situations where you could earn a lot of Bayld by only casting enhancing magic.

Elemental magic/enfeebling magic: We were considering cases where AoE magic would be cast.

Healing magic: We wanted to protect against situations where players could gain Bayld by swapping HP boosting equipment in and out to heal themselves.


Based on the aforementioned reasons we have implemented the adjustments up until now.

In other words…


The amount of Bayld that was being obtained via melee attacks was lowered because it was much higher than what we had first envisioned.
The increase in the evaluation values for healing magic, enfeebling magic, and elemental magic were performed because it was much stricter than initially envisioned.
The reason changes were made so that a message does not appear when the threshold is not met at the time of evaluation was because it would cause people to incorrectly think that not meeting the threshold means that the evaluation value was reset.

Also, we are closely watching how everyone is actually playing as well as the information exchanged on the forums, Twitter, and fan sites, and there is an impression that the difference in Bayld is connected to the destruction of obstructions/lairs.

In the event that the obstruction or lair is not damaged, you will not be able to receive experience points or Bayld, but even if you go all out and destroy it right away you will not receive the maximum amount.

Please try and divvy up the responsibilities so you are damaging the obstruction/lair, defeating monsters, and then supporting other players doing these things.

Additionally, obtaining the "Reive Unity" key item and receiving effects from Ionis will go a long way in helping you out.

In regards to plans moving forward, we are exploring adjustments like the below:

Adjustments to the increase rate of the Colonization Rate
Reducing the penalty time for leaving a Reive (10 minutes > 5 minutes)
Adjustments to each of the threshold values


We're also looking into a variety of other things and once they have been confirmed I will be sure to share them with you all.

In the meantime, happy pioneering and get those Coalition ranks up!

[Godofgods]

•Job and level
Main job: Blu99
Support job: Whm49

　
•Reive type
Colonization Reive

　
•i-8 ceizak battle grounds
　
　
•
Evaluation
EXP: 81
Bayld: 81

Win
xp: 40
bayld: 40

　
•Actions performed at the time
Sleepaging mobs, dual weild sword atking root, blu magic atks on root.


121 bayld for helping kill three roots? Seriously? And this is happning on multiple fights..
Im done with any coloinazation rieves untill its fixed

[Luvbunny]

Thanks Camate, for the very insightful info on Reive, really appreciate you took some time to explain this, it was sorely needed. Could you let them know about the pet enmity imbalance and how enhancing magic seems to draw massive amount of hate from PLD.

[Kojo]

Thanks for commenting on the issue, but to be honest, the reduction has turned people away from Reives, and as cool as the 3 new sets of armor are, they really aren't worth the grind. As a 99 RUN, all the gear that makes a decent set is either annoying to get after SCH's Embrava being nerfed (Thaumas) or pointlessly expensive, like Wraithwing Nails which are 35mil on Phoenix, last I saw. For RUN, the only thing Thurandaut I was interested in was the hands, which I got. The rest is either at the moment unavailable or useless for RUN.

My suggestion is add more, more epic gear to the Bayld Vendor. Maybe even add Crafting Apron-like clothing to all Coalitions, and/or the ability to enhancee R/M/E via Bayld at the Inventor's Coalition.

[Karah]

While I appreciate Camate's post, a very good one indeed, the system is still heavily flawed. I personally don't feel the need to stand there and kill waves upon waves upon waves of repopped mobs for 1000 bayld.

The objective is to clear the tree, the mobs defend the tree, it's like capture the flag, no one cares about the participants, JUST THE FLAG.

You kill the tree you win, the mobs kill you, you lose. You kill the mobs... they just repop.

I (we) don't want to sit and fight (more so than we do already) for hours @ one Reive killing endless streams of pain in the ass enemies for miniscule gains, we want to go in, accomplish the objective, receive a reasonable reward, and move on to the next one, in a TIMELY manner.

[Luvbunny]

While I appreciate Camate's post, a very good one indeed, the system is still heavily flawed. I personally don't feel the need to stand there and kill waves upon waves upon waves of repopped mobs for 1000 bayld.

The objective is to clear the tree, the mobs defend the tree, it's like capture the flag, no one cares about the participants, JUST THE FLAG.

You kill the tree you win, the mobs kill you, you lose. You kill the mobs... they just repop.

I (we) don't want to sit and fight (more so than we do already) for hours @ one Reive killing endless streams of pain in the ass enemies for miniscule gains, we want to go in, accomplish the objective, receive a reasonable reward, and move on to the next one, in a TIMELY manner.

Remember how Campaign used to be when it was first introduced? And all those abandoned Campaign Ops that no one bother to do because low reward vs risk? Sadly this is being repeated again now with SoA lol. It didn't take very long before everyone is abandoning reive, I could not really get much with just a PLD and a THF, participation dropped drastically after this adjustment, now not even mages want to touch this. They are indeed putting a stop to the bayld fountain lol.

[LCofPandy]

Greetings everyone!

I hope you're all looking forward to the weekend, and perhaps even taking part in the double EXP campaign to catch whatever job or merits up to where you want them to be! :)

As there have been quite a few posts about the changes that were made to Reive evaluations yesterday, I wanted to follow-up and give an explanation about the system and the development team's thoughts.


Balance of the amount of bayld obtained between content

Broken down content-wise, the below is the order of how much bayld we imagined players receiving listed from highest to lowest:
Coalition Assignments > Colonization Reives > Lair Reives

The reasons for establishing it in this way are due to the following:


Coalition assignments consume tickets.
If the order of Reives and Coalition Assignments were reversed, the necessity to do Coalition Assignments would decrease.
If Coalition Assignments are not completed, the Coalitions' ranks will not increase, which means that no one would be able to receive Coalition support perks.
If no one is receiving Coalition support perks it would become difficult to colonize.


Envisioned amount of Bayld obtainment
Coalition Assignments: 4000 Bayld/day
Colonization Reives: max of 1000-1500 each time
Lair Reives: max of 700-800 each time

The cost of items that can be purchased with Bayld have been established based on these envisioned numbers.
*These numbers are what were envisioned for a single Reive, and not the amount to be received at each evaluation.


Why the evaluation value and the threshold were high for enhancing magic, elemental magic, enfeebling magic, and healing magic

Enhancing magic: We wanted to protect against situations where you could earn a lot of Bayld by only casting enhancing magic.

Elemental magic/enfeebling magic: We were considering cases where AoE magic would be cast.

Healing magic: We wanted to protect against situations where players could gain Bayld by swapping HP boosting equipment in and out to heal themselves.


Based on the aforementioned reasons we have implemented the adjustments up until now.

In other words…


The amount of Bayld that was being obtained via melee attacks was lowered because it was much higher than what we had first envisioned.
The increase in the evaluation values for healing magic, enfeebling magic, and elemental magic were performed because it was much stricter than initially envisioned.
The reason changes were made so that a message does not appear when the threshold is not met at the time of evaluation was because it would cause people to incorrectly think that not meeting the threshold means that the evaluation value was reset.

Also, we are closely watching how everyone is actually playing as well as the information exchanged on the forums, Twitter, and fan sites, and there is an impression that the difference in Bayld is connected to the destruction of obstructions/lairs.

In the event that the obstruction or lair is not damaged, you will not be able to receive experience points or Bayld, but even if you go all out and destroy it right away you will not receive the maximum amount.

Please try and divvy up the responsibilities so you are damaging the obstruction/lair, defeating monsters, and then supporting other players doing these things.

Additionally, obtaining the "Reive Unity" key item and receiving effects from Ionis will go a long way in helping you out.

In regards to plans moving forward, we are exploring adjustments like the below:

Adjustments to the increase rate of the Colonization Rate
Reducing the penalty time for leaving a Reive (10 minutes > 5 minutes)
Adjustments to each of the threshold values


We're also looking into a variety of other things and once they have been confirmed I will be sure to share them with you all.

In the meantime, happy pioneering and get those Coalition ranks up!

The cap of 1000-1500 bayld per reive seems pretty fair. The only problem is, meeting the requirements have become to high, least in my eyes. I play with two characters (dual box) I haven't changed anything that I do during reives, but there will be times where I go all out and not receive a single thing. I think there needs to be tweaks to the cap. I was thinking why not make it like campaign. While the reive battle is going on all damage is calculated towards the cap. When I player hits that the cap, that's it. This gives players who aren't shoha sams or berserked wars time to hit that cap and get rewards. Otherwise the cap needs brought down and when players hit that cap they are locked in.

[Cowardlybabooon]

All I'm hearing is that people want more free and easy stuff. Don't listen to them SE. No Free Stuff. Challenges are good (and I know SE agrees with that philosophy). It was enough that the friggin starter gear that people are able to get within 2-3 days of release puts existing armor nearly out of business. Don't lower the requirements to get it too, unless you intend to make all the old gear obsolete and add a slough of uber gear in the next update.

Also though, Camate you mentioned in your post that you are closely monitoring how people are actually playing. I understand forums, but could you expand on that other part? Are there invisible GM's watching our reives? Or undercover players alongside us? Or do you just have a viewer program that gives you a window into whatever you want? I'm sure many people are curious, spill those beans!

Now I've put you in a dilemma of whether or not to "like" my post huh. Fellow forum goers probably like the second paragraph but maybe not the first!

[Shadax]

Greetings everyone!


Reducing the penalty time for leaving a Reive (10 minutes > 5 minutes)


Dear Altana, this!!!

[FrankReynolds]

All I'm hearing is that people want more free and easy stuff. Don't listen to them SE. No Free Stuff. Challenges are good (and I know SE agrees with that philosophy). It was enough that the friggin starter gear that people are able to get within 2-3 days of release puts existing armor nearly out of business. Don't lower the requirements to get it too, unless you intend to make all the old gear obsolete and add a slough of uber gear in the next update.

Unfortunately, SE is exactly the company to grant a ridiculous request like "Don't do what all your customers are asking you to do". /sigh


Also though, Camate you mentioned in your post that you are closely monitoring how people are actually playing. I understand forums, but could you expand on that other part? Are there invisible GM's watching our reives? Or undercover players alongside us? Or do you just have a viewer program that gives you a window into whatever you want? I'm sure many people are curious, spill those beans!

Now I've put you in a dilemma of whether or not to "like" my post huh. Fellow forum goers probably like the second paragraph but maybe not the first!

I didn't push "like" but I am curious as well.

[Unaisis]

I like the whole "Let us know your feedback" and then saying "Lol nupe~ we keeping it like this either you like it or not :P"

[Luvbunny]

All I'm hearing is that people want more free and easy stuff. Don't listen to them SE. No Free Stuff. Challenges are good (and I know SE agrees with that philosophy). It was enough that the friggin starter gear that people are able to get within 2-3 days of release puts existing armor nearly out of business. Don't lower the requirements to get it too, unless you intend to make all the old gear obsolete and add a slough of uber gear in the next update.

Have fun trying to gather people to do Reive. It's already becoming somewhat difficult to find people in the area let alone clearing one in reasonable time. It's good that they explain what we should do and what are expected from the new content - very refreshing. But it seems like the general consensus are not liking these recent changes. If less and less people are doing it, less progress are being made. Just look at how WoTG is a complete dead zones now, while every other Abyssea zones are still drawing more people, and ToAU contents are still far from dead.

[Unaisis]

in 2-3 months, if things are kept the way they are~ Adoulin will be overrun with wild life and not a single fudge would be given.

[Karah]

in 2-3 weeks, if things are kept the way they are~ Adoulin will be overrun with wild life and not a single fudge would be given.

Fixed that for you.

[Cowardlybabooon]

Valid feedback on my post above. It just seems to me that 1 week of commitment is acceptable for what I would consider pretty good gear.

[LCofPandy]

All I'm hearing is that people want more free and easy stuff. Don't listen to them SE. No Free Stuff. Challenges are good (and I know SE agrees with that philosophy). It was enough that the friggin starter gear that people are able to get within 2-3 days of release puts existing armor nearly out of business. Don't lower the requirements to get it too, unless you intend to make all the old gear obsolete and add a slough of uber gear in the next update.

Also though, Camate you mentioned in your post that you are closely monitoring how people are actually playing. I understand forums, but could you expand on that other part? Are there invisible GM's watching our reives? Or undercover players alongside us? Or do you just have a viewer program that gives you a window into whatever you want? I'm sure many people are curious, spill those beans!

Now I've put you in a dilemma of whether or not to "like" my post huh. Fellow forum goers probably like the second paragraph but maybe not the first!

No ones saying to give us free stuff dude. I had a feeling some one was gonna say something like this. All we are asking is that the rewards be even with the content. Which right now isn't. I can barely make 700 bayld/reive. And you can't always rely on imp. tags either. So if a new person comes a long who hadn't done this content yet sees that shiney new gear, starts working toward but then gets frustrated Bc it will takes literally weeks/month to obtain a few pieces, going at a snails pace and grinding is not fun. Then they give up out of frustration. That's how content dies. This expansion is a week old and it already got nerfed? People aren't going to get very far. It's being contemplated that you need KIs to do wilds keeper reives. Guess what? Those will cost bayld as some people are suggesting. And if it's a lot, no one will be able to do them. Except maybe at a months time. We paid $30 for good content. And that is not good at all.

[Cowardlybabooon]

If there is no reason to do reives other than getting the armor with bayld as you are implying, then why would it be any more effective to make it earnable in a day or two? The content would be dead in a month in either scenario. I think SE has plans to use bayld for a number of other things, and the balance of what is earnable in a day matters. So there :-)

[LCofPandy]

What I'm saying is, it's the best way to get bayld, was anyways. Eventually there will be things we will need to buy with bayld, I'm not arguing there won't be. I'm saying that aquaring those items will come at a snails pace. Think people wanna wait months to do a single event, then repeat? All because aquaring the necessary items takes forever. Oh wait we already do in some cases. This not about procuring the gear sets with in a few days. If you read any of the post that have been said (especially mine) the reward just isn't enough to motivate people to keep doing reives. And guess what? If people don't do them, you sure as hell ain't getting any where in that wilderness. Get off your high horse dude, no likes smug remarks.

[Seyomeyo]

1000-1500 bayld would be fine for one reive, if people weren't artificially forced to drag it out with the adds. People aren't getting that with the new system.

[Ilax]

We paid $30 for good content.

And that is not the content i was expecting at all.. I mean seriously 30$ for Campaign Battle V2?

0 BCNM/KSNM/KCNM
0 VWNM
0 POP NM.
0 Lottery NM
0 HNM
8 Campaign Battle Zone....

Bunch of more situational gear (like we don't already have inventory issue.)

And all you guy complain is how hard is to get bayld when is not hard at all?

So that is what i came back for?, bad taste... What a waist of time/effort from SE, sometime i wonder who approve they expansion project...

6 day and the 30$ fun is already over. (Ya, let pretend the million ROOT/Rock/NEST was fun to do). I might just deactivate my account for couple month till they add real content in this expansion, not like i can get a refund for it...

[Caketime]

I'd like to know who decided to make the demolishing skill tied to mining a rare piece of material. You Sir, are a monster.

[Vivik]

If they don't change it back the zones will stay dead. It's not the players fault SE wants a weeks worth of content to last us a couple months. Maybe next time plan ahead and release an expansion worth the box price.

I feel completely ripped off by this expansion. Can't even hold a candle to ToAU and there was more content in ONE of the Abyssea xpacks.

[Unaisis]

It's like the first release of 14 all over again!!! T_T...... wait... 14 was worse...

[Karbuncle]

And that is not the content i was expecting at all.. I mean seriously 30$ for Campaign Battle V2?

0 BCNM/KSNM/KCNM
0 VWNM
0 POP NM.
0 Lottery NM
0 HNM
8 Campaign Battle Zone....

Bunch of more situational gear (like we don't already have inventory issue.)

And all you guy complain is how hard is to get bayld when is not hard at all?

So that is what i came back for?, bad taste... What a waist of time/effort from SE, sometime i wonder who approve they expansion project...

6 day and the 30$ fun is already over. (Ya, let pretend the million ROOT/Rock/NEST was fun to do). I might just deactivate my account for couple month till they add real content in this expansion, not like i can get a refund for it...

Ilax , I respect you as you're a pretty damn good THF, But, you're pretty far off on this point.

While your breakdown isn't entirely wrong, This "Campaign" System is actually a lot more involved than Campaign was. Building Bio's and colonizing areas takes a near server-wide effort.. Couriers Guild is involved in building, pioneers, all of that jazz. While the basics are campaign-y (Taking over specific areas), Its a lot more fluid and fast paced than campaign was and is. No need to talk to NPC to get tags, wait in town for the right battle, so on, so forth. I mean if you sit in Ceizac all day like a sheep with the herd of uneducated, it may feel slow cause half the GD server is there and most of them quite stupid.

But if you take a group to Yahse, Battles are plentiful, Exp/Bayld is amazing because its not a 45 Second fight of Zerging the FK outta the roots, and Its way more fun talking with an alliance than sitting alone waiting for a Wall to pop.

Further more, on your no BCNM/etc comments, I guess you didn't read anything about "Skirmish"? Look it up. Its an Instanced event with great rewards. 3-6 People, 2 Goals, Rewards spelled out, and access to the new "Augmentable" Weapons. Skirmish is the event people dont realize exists (Even though there was plenty of info on it lol).

On top of that, there are a good handful of quests, on top of all the Coalition stuff (which i admit the coalition crap is pretty pointless, especially voting, until they add an "Abstain" option so the ignorant masses dont make voting completely pointless and worthless)... And Skrimish's plus the HNM that drop those great weapons.

On that note you forgot to mention the ~3-8 or so Elemental HNM bosses that come with this "Campaign" System. All with ridiculously amazing gear/weapons.

Half of this armor isn't even "Situational", the Heavy-Armor Legs/Feet are the best WS pieces for a few jobs on the list. The Light-Armor body/hands and the new Choc Head are the new top pieces for Exenterator... and the list goes on. Most of this armor is clear upgrades, and they introduced more Clear-Upgrade weapons than i can shake a stick at.

IDK if you all saw the D:180something great Axe with STR+7 Augment from Skirmish. (Could have been a little better/worse i don't recall exact numbers). Theres also a Katana with DMG:72(I believe)... some of these weapons are even clear winners to people with ~90 Empyreans.

This Expansion has added a lot, just people >Focus< On reives and forget some of the content exists. Seriously, raise your hand if you knew what Skirmish was before i mentioned it in this post?

-------------

Honestly, I think i have to admit the only thing im disappointed in is

0 Lottery/Time Notorious Monsters.

Everything else you added doesn't even phase me. I knew there'd be no more VWNM because VW is over. Provenance happened. Though i expect they'll be adding more things in the future... Theres a lot of content players haven't even accessed. I don't think we can call this expansion a failure until people actually Beat the 3 HNM bosses, and Have full runs of Skirmish.

[Luvbunny]

Did you read the description of Skirmish? I think over complicated is a bit downplaying it - why can they make its SIMPLE like Assaults and Meeble Burrows. I have to agree with Ilax though, this is kind of Campaign V2.0, and a very bad one at that - the reasons being they do have at least 3 experiences under their belts when it comes to "whackaton fest - everyone welcome" : Besieged, Campaign and Walk of Echoes. The fact that there are so many missing components (like auto reraise) and the rest of the mechanics are just rather stupid (5 seconds warning lol) - this just points to a beta SoA, and we are paying $30-40 for it.

At the end - it's like chicken and egg dilemma. SE wants all players to participate - but the obvious events are not fully well explained, and the rather popular activities are far from fun and not very intuitive other than whack da roots for more logs and misc crap. So most players are abandoning the said events in droves, and no progress made - and it is not fun for everyone at the end. Unless they are basically buying time - stretch it as long as they can possibly can and milk us dry one more time lol.

I am taking Ilax's advice - taking a few months to maybe a year (gasp - not sure if this is possible hah hah hah) break from this game. It is not going anywhere - and looking at SE's history, things do get much better after 3-5 big updates. You either play their game or you can decide for yourself, nope not gonna fall for the same BS again every expansion lol.

[Luvbunny]

I'd like to know who decided to make the demolishing skill tied to mining a rare piece of material. You Sir, are a monster.

LMAO - well if it is too easy and you can buy it from AH, then it is not "fun and challenging" and you need "to explore" and deal with the new mobs since they are so "easy to kill solo". Yes I am being sarcastic. And yes, welcome to WoTG V.2 all over again, come back after 3-5 big updates though, maybe things will get much better (or worse - no one left to do Reive).

[Luvbunny]

in 2-3 months, if things are kept the way they are~ Adoulin will be overrun with wild life and not a single fudge would be given.

LOL like Karra said, it is already dying right now and will dried up in 2-3 weeks. And word of mouth spreads faster than wildfire, the people who are sitting on the fence don't even bother buying the SoA expansion now. The 2 new jobs are half baked, and geomancer spell effects are giving some people massive headache. The rest of the casuals still busy grinding abyssea party (and la theine worm party drama), and other non SoA content. In 2-3 months it would just put an official DoA stamp on this expansion, but congratulations to all the opportunist out there who do take the time to farm and explore and making some gill in the process :)

[Karbuncle]

Did you read the description of Skirmish? I think over complicated is a bit downplaying it - why can they make its SIMPLE like Assaults and Meeble Burrows. I have to agree with Ilax though, this is kind of Campaign V2.0, and a very bad one at that - the reasons being they do have at least 3 experiences under their belts when it comes to "whackaton fest - everyone welcome" : Besieged, Campaign and Walk of Echoes. The fact that there are so many missing components (like auto reraise) and the rest of the mechanics are just rather stupid (5 seconds warning lol) - this just points to a beta SoA, and we are paying $30-40 for it.

At the end - it's like chicken and egg dilemma. SE wants all players to participate - but the obvious events are not fully well explained, and the rather popular activities are far from fun and not very intuitive other than whack da roots for more logs and misc crap. So most players are abandoning the said events in droves, and no progress made - and it is not fun for everyone at the end. Unless they are basically buying time - stretch it as long as they can possibly can and milk us dry one more time lol.

I am taking Ilax's advice - taking a few months to maybe a year (gasp - not sure if this is possible hah hah hah) break from this game. It is not going anywhere - and looking at SE's history, things do get much better after 3-5 big updates. You either play their game or you can decide for yourself, nope not gonna fall for the same BS again every expansion lol.

I wouldn't consider an Auto-Reraise "Required" For these events. Thats why Reraise Earrings, Items, and Scrolls exist. Theres no excuse in todays economy to not be able to afford the 20k price tag on these things. now, I know this doesn't help if you Die > Reraise > Die, But there is no real resting area in these events anyway, so Auto-reraise would be useful for... Zombie-ing. Though in my event suggestion i did mention they should expand the areas.

Plus, they are not designed to be solo'd, while neither is beseidged, Beseidged is a 1 area event that takes place scarcely, in which being dead at the end = no Exp... Its also a fairly large combat area and quite laggy, getting raise can be a problem in the midst of all the enemies and the fact you might be in a hard place to find, or not even load on screen until they've done run past you, plus its a timed event (1 hour)... Reraise seems logical here. Same for WoE, since its a timed event.

Where as for this, Its a small area, intended for multi-people combat, and no time limit on it... Auto-reraise while it'll be a decent convenience, is not something i'd peg as a "Required effect or its a failed event".

And regardless of Skirmish being "overly complicated"... which i do agree with you on, that does not suddenly mean it was not included in the expansion. Its not SE's fault the masses of this game have the memory of a goldfish and cant remember or be assed to look up the content that came with the expansion even though this is the most informative and detail-giving expansion to date, people just refuse to read or understand it. (though as i say below, I do believe the entrance requirements for this event are a little too extreme)

While the expansion is far from perfect, I think these events are pretty well fleshed out except for the few things that are easy to over-compensate for or mess up... Like drop rate on Skirmish items being too low, or Exp for mages/melee being less/more than they intended. These adjustments are going to be necessary.

I'm not really one to aimlessly defend SE, but while this expansion isn't exactly busting from the seams with content, its got a fair amount going for it.

3 HNMs with wonderful drops.
A Multi-variable Instanced Event (Skirmish)
A more fluid Campaign System linked to several Coalition assignments, that are also linked to overall progress and potency of several things, Like Crafting bonuses, Attack/magic attack, so on, so forth... I.E Ionis benefits.

While I do believe its missing the Lottery/Pop NMs that i do so hope they add... i'm certain they'll add more events later, but as of right now, there's only a handful of people who have even touched some of the content this has to offer.

If anything, I agree in that they did make the content a little to convoluted to access, while i don't think this is "Milking" (wrong term), it is drawing out our progress.

[Bureikun]

Job and level
PUP99/DNC49
　
Reive type
Colonization Reive
　
Area name and < pos > of the Reive
Morimar Basalt Fields (H-10)
　
Conditions
---Set 1 start---
　
Amount of experience points and bayld for a single evaluation
38 exp 11 bayld
　
Actions performed at the time
Nothing. Allow pet to auto-attack the Bedrock Crag.
　
How much HP did you damage the obstacle or lair for?
~10%

The problem here is I'M SOLOING THE REIVE and being poorly rewarded.

[Ilax]

Further more, on your no BCNM/etc comments, I guess you didn't read anything about "Skirmish"? Look it up. Its an Instanced event with great rewards. 3-6 People, 2 Goals, Rewards spelled out, and access to the new "Augmentable" Weapons. Skirmish is the event people dont realize exists (Even though there was plenty of info on it lol).

That correct, i was not aware about that new instance, i need read more about it as it sound very interesting.


On that note you forgot to mention the ~3-8 or so Elemental HNM bosses that come with this "Campaign" System. All with ridiculously amazing gear/weapons.

Hmm, where can i find these and fight it with my LS? Let me get it straight to the point, if we need to win all region to gain access (like it was in campaign v1) this is a REAL BAD IDEA FROM SE, and the one who proposed that should be fired right away...

Ya, let me recall you about those famous battle in V1, i think on our server (FENRIR) we got access once or 2 time max, it is the worse c0ckbl$ck system SE ever invented

* Limited by entire server progress.
* Limited by [Your+Friend] tag quantity.
* Limited by Time frame. (when server finally get access)
* Limited by [Your+Friend] Rank system.

Overall, it was a miracle if you could even manage a fight, and yet, i am not even talking about the drop rate... Please tell me i am wrong again and is not how we get access to these NEW HNM?


IDK if you all saw the D:180something great Axe with STR+7 Augment from Skirmish. (Could have been a little better/worse i don't recall exact numbers). Theres also a Katana with DMG:72(I believe)... some of these weapons are even clear winners to people with ~90 Empyreans.

I can't talk for everyone, but i spent so much time in Abyssea it is absurd, i did it to be ready to fight something, and that "something" not happening much.

It had a very good use in VW and Legion, but that is already getting old, i was hoping this expansion would raise the fun with bunch of new zone where we can actually use our gear to fight something strong and challenging, yet all i find is campaign V2 were you can go naked SMN, toss Carbuncle to the root/rock, go AFK and collect bunch of point.

Of course that why SE nerfed the point system, something Camate did not mention. Anyway i am getting off the point a bit...

What is the deal about those new augment/Weapon and so on, we have nothing to fight, don't you think we all have enough joy/toy to look at day long while we bored? Do we really need better weapon/gear to bash Root/Rock? This have to be a bad April joke.. (Of course they released this expansion on April fool) go figure lol...

[Ilax]

Another concern i have about all this is.... Why they had to make us pay another 30$ to make a campaign V2 instead of FIXING the first one that is still a major failure.

Sometime i really wonder, is the next 30$ for Besieged V2?

[Luvbunny]

We can easily agree that to create content that is simple to get into, takes awhile to master, and progressively addictive and challenging is hard. Right now we are beta testing SoA for $30 early access and the usual monthly fees. They are making adjustment based on our feedbacks (mostly complaints) but it is slower in weekly basis type of thing. So you can safely assume the somewhat decent intro of SoA will be ready by Sept 2013 after numerous adjustments - a few updates, etc.

Now, if this is like a second or third attempt for expansion, we can give SE some slacks. But it is not, its their fifth major one, after the blockbuster that is Abyssea, and in 2013. Yeah you can say, blame FF14 for this fiasco - I rather them selling SoA game for $10 and added a couple add-ons of SoA within 6 months and 12 months later for another $10 each. The usual tactics that is employed by SE and pretty much everyone else these days. You know, so they can justify the amount of contents added. And if people have buyer's remorse, it's only $10 bucks.

[Ilax]

Also, here some of the problem i found in reive that should be issue A.S.A.P:

"Knock back + Stun effect" from turtle = Out of range and kick you out of Reive in 5 sec =D 10 min /wait to resume, is this even intended?

If i die and reraise, i still have hate on monster so i die again as soon i reraise, so where go the hate reset, and what exactly is the point of having Reraise? We should get kick out of reive instant on KO, that way is safe to use reraise.

Restriction on raise for player outside reive is also not smart, someone in my PT got knock back + died outside reive, our whm had to exit reive to raise him then both of them had to wait 10 min.

The hate system in reive is completely absurd, a single Stoneskin is able to pull hate off invincible from pld.

[Luvbunny]

Another concern i have about all this is.... Why they had to make us pay another 30$ to make a campaign V2 instead of FIXING the first one that is still a major failure. Sometime i really wonder, is the next 30$ for Besieged V2?

I totally agree with you on this. Campaign and Besieged can use some revamp even WoE, VW, Meeble and a few magian trials. I mean it should be blatantly obvious by now that the last 3 years all they are doing is buying some time, add a little, get more monthly payments etc. So the best strategy is play for a month or two, take 4 months off, repeat. You pretty much only need max 3-4 months of the year to play this game since most of the good contents are added every 6 months.

I mean if you break it down, games cost $50-60 new releases. That should buy us a good 4 months or 5 months if you add extra few dollars. More than enough playtime to consume the update added for that year.

We all come back - we never just leave, but we can also show that we are not buying these BS and just play when we feel there are enough contents added then take a few months off after. It's good for your sanity :)

[Ilax]

So that why i paid 30$, to catch up a bit of the 10 month i was not paying they monthly fee? Nice catch =X

Oh well, they have 22 day left to make me happy, or they lose 17.95$/m again hehe, they have plenty of money anyway, is not like i do any difference in they income =D

Like you said, i am not going to pay 17.95/m to beta test they expansion.


*edit*: Glad i did not buy the expansion x3 also, ya my other 2 account are not reactivated as i wanted to test this before.

[Ilax]

Main job: PLD99
Support job: DNC49

　
Reive type
Colonization Reive

　
Area name and < pos > of the Reive
Moh Gates < I-7 >

　
Conditions
-------------------------------Set 1 start-------------------------------
　
Amount of experience points and bayld for a single evaluation
EXP: 250~539
Bayld: 79~154

　
Actions performed at the time
Ochain tank all monster + Spam WS CDC (Self Light SC) on Root
Divine Emblem + holy II Magic burst.

How much HP did you damage the obstacle or lair for?
Obstacle HP: 150% ( 1 full root + half one )

Started with: 64,333 Bayld
Ended with: 67,534 Bayld

00:21 --> Ilax has joined the Colonization Reive! 　
01:18 --> Ilax is victorious in the Colonization Reive!
---Set 1 end---

So about 3,201 bayld / hours.

-------------------------------Set 2 start------------------------------- '

*Same setup as above*

Started with: 67,534 Bayld
Ended with: 71,047 Bayld

04:52 --> Ilax has joined the Colonization Reive!
05:30 --> Ilax is victorious in the Colonization Reive!
---Set 2 end---

This time was 3,513 Bayld in 42 min. so like ~5k Bayld / hours.

-------------------------------Set 3 start-------------------------------

*Same setup as above, except was in Yahse Hunting Grounds < H-7 >'

Amount of experience points and bayld for a single evaluation
EXP: 240~2041
Bayld: 68~583

Started with: 71,047 Bayld
Ended with: 74,513 Bayld

06:02 --> Ilax has joined the Colonization Reive!
06:16 --> Ilax is victorious in the Colonization Reive!

3,466 Bayld in 14 min. so like ~14,854 Bayld / hours? ...

---Set 3 end---

-------------------------------Set 4 start-------------------------------
06:43 --> Ilax has joined the Colonization Reive!
07:18 --> D3 myself as i was tire hiting this thing alone.

Started with: 74,513 Bayld
Ended with: 75,891 Bayld

---Set 4 end---


So yes, is clear that Moh Gates < I-7 > not worth it as Yahse.

The fastest the ROOT die, the more exp/bayld you get... (By time the thing not dieing too quick and allow some evaluation to proc...)

*I'm done beta testing this for the Camate.

[Kincard]

This "Campaign" System is actually a lot more involved than Campaign was. Building Bio's and colonizing areas takes a near server-wide effort.. Couriers Guild is involved in building, pioneers, all of that jazz.

Let's talk content without considering the gear. If you're a gear-junkie I'm sure it's paradise for you to be looking at screenshots of gear that you arn't even close to obtaining because you lack a single skirmish simulacrum. (Don't get me wrong, I love looking at new gear as much as any other endgame player...but ultimately that's not actual game content)

Unless the Naakuals are unlocked soon I have every reason to believe that this new system isn't any more rich than Campaign, which also offered things like Splitting Heirs/Cracking Shells/Plucking Wings/Fiat Lux (which also required server-wise cooperation, unless you never joined one of the influence-raising parties that attacked Beadeaux/La Vaule/Oztroja/Zvahl), as well as SCNM and ANNMs, which were also not added to the game until several months of the expansion's release.

Skirmish pieces are appearing so rarely that they're comparable to being able to fight Sandworm.

So all you have left is Reives VS Campaign, and the latter was definitely far more interesting because it had multiple NMs with different traits. Offensive campaign might've been boring when the enemy retreated but it was still overall more interesting than having an Ochain hold everything and have everyone else kill a tree.

[Ilax]

Offensive campaign might've been boring when the enemy retreated but it was still overall more interesting than having an Ochain hold everything and have everyone else kill a tree.

+1, totally agree with your post, as i have the same feeling about all this. I would also add, as much it seem interesting to hold 18 monster with ochain and have your view totally wrecked by it, IS NOT FUN AT ALL

It is even more frustrating when a whm cast haste on you and you unable to grab back the hate from it because hate holding is that bad in Reive, all you know... the whole set of monster are in your back, and guess what, PLD don't have ochain in they back, so they die quick as everyone else and then the whole group wipe.

Of course there is a work around for this, /blockaid on + stay outside any group. (That is all except cooperation)

*Edit: Blockaid is not working in reives...

[Razielrinz]

The xp and bayld is horrid and the fact taht I have to melee in Twilight so I can get back up cause death is almost instantaneous without a Pld to hold the mobs is horrid too. Also it tells me that my xp and beyld are stored then gives me 0 when I get up and we win...... So stored in the trash? Yay! Auto-reraise with no weakness would definitely make it so that you do not have to wait till a Pld shows up to hold stuff so you can get in there. Also making you be invincible for like 3 seconds after you say yes to raise would be nice too so your not dead before you can do anything. Not sure why they never fixed that in the entirety of the time that this game has been out. I would also recommend a difficulty based on the number of players involved or in area at the time cause during non peak times this is a pain in the butt to try and get done. And the 10 minutes for stepping out for 2 seconds is ridiculous too. 10 minutes is insane. 5 would be far more appropriate and the 5 second warning should be at least 10 seconds imo too. That way you can actually have a shot at getting back in. This is just my 2 cents on what is broke with this event.

[Karbuncle]

Let's talk content without considering the gear. If you're a gear-junkie I'm sure it's paradise for you to be looking at screenshots of gear that you arn't even close to obtaining because you lack a single skirmish simulacrum. (Don't get me wrong, I love looking at new gear as much as any other endgame player...but ultimately that's not actual game content)

Unless the Naakuals are unlocked soon I have every reason to believe that this new system isn't any more rich than Campaign, which also offered things like Splitting Heirs/Cracking Shells/Plucking Wings/Fiat Lux (which also required server-wise cooperation, unless you never joined one of the influence-raising parties that attacked Beadeaux/La Vaule/Oztroja/Zvahl), as well as SCNM and ANNMs, which were also not added to the game until several months of the expansion's release.

Skirmish pieces are appearing so rarely that they're comparable to being able to fight Sandworm.

So all you have left is Reives VS Campaign, and the latter was definitely far more interesting because it had multiple NMs with different traits. Offensive campaign might've been boring when the enemy retreated but it was still overall more interesting than having an Ochain hold everything and have everyone else kill a tree.

I don't directly disagree with anything you say, But i do want to point out As you said, all those "Campaign Tag" Events were added several months after WoTG.

Plus, the difficulty of accessing this content does not discount the fact the content is still in the game. Right now, Skirmishes are really way too stupid to get into, but their rewards are super good. Honestly, SE is probably taking the "NNI" Route with this, making the "Dumb luck" Factor prevailant cause they somehow think that warrants the good rewards, in reality, it just means super exclusive content with nothing but Luck being the entrance fee... which is F**KING RETARDED.

*cough*

Sorry, Got a little upset there. Moving on. I don't think Campaign is any more or less interesting than Reives. Its all the same "Beat up minions while working on a master goal". Campaign was just slower and clunkier, and I don't think any degree of 50hp/tic 100% Proc Enpoison is going to make me like it anymore than Reives... Though each his own of course.

I think the only thing Reives are missing is rewards that don't include more LOGS, i swear its a f**king inside joke now to add LOGS to everything. its level 99 content and i'm getting LAUAN AND ARROWOOD LOGS, I can buy those from an NPC For less gil than you get from killing a level 7 goblin.

I admit the event has its completely shitacular aspect and is downright sad in terms of accessibility and reward. So, In retrospect, this expansion is pretty bland and empty, and I can't help but wonder why they weren't more forthcoming with information on how to unlock the Nakuuls and so forth. I mean, they have all these wonderful new toys to show us and so little is known to get them (Nakuul drops that is).


Let's talk content without considering the gear. If you're a gear-junkie I'm sure it's paradise for

I'm pretty tolerant and understanding of other peoples opinions... But I really have to ask, what the hell is the reason to even own or pay 13~+$/month on an MMO if you don't care about the only thing that makes MMOs live on... Gear Grind/etc. If you're going to tout Social aspects go play Guild Wars 2, all the social without the monthly fee.

I'm just curious what you play for, that isnt improving your character (hint: What RPGs are known for, which adds more confusion to why you'd pay a monthly fee to a mmoRPG without caring about upgrading/RPG factor of your character), thats worth 12.95$ or more, and thats an honest question despite my complete baffle-ment at it.

[Kincard]

I'm pretty tolerant and understanding of other peoples opinions... But I really have to ask, what the hell is the reason to even own or pay 13~+$/month on an MMO if you don't care about the only thing that makes MMOs live on...

I wasn't saying I don't like looking at gear and improving my character like every other player, but when I'm done looking at gear on community sites and fantasizing about owning it I would like to actually play the damn game. There's only so many times I can whack a giant tree or nest before it gets boring (not a lot).

Campaign was/is a lot more fun than Reives. People compare attacking roots to attacking fortifications but at least on my server that's exactly why offensive campaign areas were empty a great amount of the time.

If it's going to take us months to unlock Naakuals because of gated progression/takes me months to scrounge up the gil to buy a Skirmish set I don't see how that's much different from needing to wait months for them to implement Sandworm guts/Ixion.

When I spend $30 on a boxed expansion, I expect it to keep me occupied for more than about a day of play before I run out of things to do. Campaign had much better lastability because of the way the game was structured at the time- exp was actually hard to come by and it was the most effective way of gaining xp solo.

What they should've done is add some kind of lower level Skirmish that was easily purchasable with Bayld.

[Luvbunny]

So basically this new content is extremely NOT casual players friendly and pretty much lock out the majority of those dual boxers (or triple quadruple boxers) out there lol. Smart move indeed from SE part, say goodbye to those nifty extra incomes. In a year from now, they will "reborn" this shitacular expansion, I don't think they have many choices left. Certainly this ill feelings are not a good incentive to push people to try FF14 - since who wants to get "hoodwinked" three times.

[Ilax]

So basically this new content is extremely NOT casual players friendly

I don't see much what a hardcore player can do better there, as he stuck like everyone else...

So ya, unless the whole server willing to turn totally boredness hitting the root, nothing will happen and is not matter what type of player you are.


pretty much lock out the majority of those dual boxers

I don't really see how that will prevent someone to toss his mule bashing a non aggressive taget (ROOT), i think is actually a good deal for them.


When I spend $30 on a boxed expansion, I expect it to keep me occupied for more than about a day of play before I run out of things to do.
For sure.

[Karbuncle]

I wasn't saying I don't like looking at gear and improving my character like every other player, but when I'm done looking at gear on community sites and fantasizing about owning it I would like to actually play the damn game. There's only so many times I can whack a giant tree or nest before it gets boring (not a lot).

Campaign was/is a lot more fun than Reives. People compare attacking roots to attacking fortifications but at least on my server that's exactly why offensive campaign areas were empty a great amount of the time.

If it's going to take us months to unlock Naakuals because of gated progression/takes me months to scrounge up the gil to buy a Skirmish set I don't see how that's much different from needing to wait months for them to implement Sandworm guts/Ixion.

When I spend $30 on a boxed expansion, I expect it to keep me occupied for more than about a day of play before I run out of things to do. Campaign had much better lastability because of the way the game was structured at the time- exp was actually hard to come by and it was the most effective way of gaining xp solo.

What they should've done is add some kind of lower level Skirmish that was easily purchasable with Bayld.

I agree on the purchasing Skirmish pieces with Bayld, Maybe those Skirmishes only have a chance to drop the new weapons, and the Rewards would be "Midrium Ore" rather than "midrium ingots" like advanced smirkishes, so on so forth.

Or they could just add a Set of the currently obtainable Skirmish items to Inventor's Coalition for say, 100,000 Bayld, So while very high, you'd have a reason and goal when you're punching Crickets or Roots. Personally I did have a goal, the Peacekeeper body armor, but thanks to a bullshit voting system All i got to look at was really terrible weapons with a new coat of paint. *grumblegrumble*.

However, I have purchased the ~4-5 Pieces of armor i need from whats available, and even the Bayld SMN Staff (Cause im too lazy for Magian and it was easier)... Now im sitting at about 3k Bayld and decreasing reasons as to why bother getting more lol.

I admit, There are way to many forced walls with this expansion, the fact no one even knows how to begin the second Mission (it starts with the guy in Pioneer's Coalition, something about a banquet), and the fact no one has a clue how to progress toward Nakuuls says something.

I admit the expansion has a lot of flaws, and half of its out-of-box content is really hard to access, or just lackluster. I think that they had a lot on their plates (Expansion zones, Skirmish, new 2hrs, Play as a monster) to the point it was all too spread out and they didnt really have a lot of time to focus on the expansion.

Personally I still like the expansion, its fun for me, and I have things to do in it I just got little time to do it. I never expected this content to be remotely casual friendly as it was designed as 99 player content which means you're not going to be able to phone this one in like Abyssea.

Honestly, This is the most casual friendly expansion to date. Quests spell out their locations, A slew of CRAFTABLE level 99 Equipment that is amazingly good and easy to obtain (cant blame SE on crafters price gouging), most of which are clear improvements to anything else available short of R/M/E... And armor thats fantastic and super easy to obtain. These new sets even beat some old Best-in-slot pieces and are super casual to obtain.

This entire expansion introduced a lot of casual-friendly content, and some Hard-core friendly content. I just wish when they looked into "hardcore" content, they didn't think to themselves "Hmmm, How much of an unwarranted and Bullsh*t "Luck" factor can we shovel into this?".

[Kincard]

Honestly I don't even know why people are hitting roots all day the way they are. By doing the quests around town and only killing roots as needed (That is, from your ticket things), I'm getting the armor I want at a decent enough pace. Not like there's much else to spend it on, though I guess people are preparing for the inevitable rank 10 gear that'll cost 500,000 Bayld or whatever.

Basically my complaint comes down to when you remove reives (which is fun if you do it maybe once a week or something), you can do about two dozen quests and after that there's basically no content at all. They were probably banking on Reives being the moneymaker event to kick things off similar to how Campaign kept people really busy, but the problem is that the conditions of the game have changed considerably since WOTG and there's no incentive to do something as boring as Reives continuously.

Hopefully they'll take that into consideration and adjust Reives to be a bit more dynamic.

[Demon6324236]

Not like there's much else to spend it on, though I guess people are preparing for the inevitable rank 10 gear that'll cost 500,000 Bayld or whatever.I haven't paid much attention to .dats and such as of late so idk if this is known or not, but does anyone know if they even go above rank 3? I have been assuming after the 3 upgrades in each one of the coalitions because we only have 3 upgrade options anyways, maybe perhaps a fourth hidden one after the first 3. I'm only asking because if they cap at three then it also will kill off even more reason to do Reives unless they start to rapidly degrade after time, because otherwise it will simply let us get them all to 3 and kill off all need to do different ones, people will simply do the most rewarding and ignore the rest.

[Ilax]

Honestly I don't even know why people are hitting roots all day the way they are. By doing the quests around town and only killing roots as needed (That is, from your ticket things), I'm getting the armor I want at a decent enough pace. Not like there's much else to spend it on

NPC Dimmian sell Naakuals KIs for only 100k Bayld, and is not even clear yet if you lose it upon entry, but they are in temp KIs section so let assume you do lose them...

Also, they found the NM immune to all dmg, maybe we also have to buy these potion at 40k bayld each =/

... /joy

[LCofPandy]

NPC Dimmian sell Naakuals KIs for only 100k Bayld, and is not even clear yet if you lose it upon entry, but they are in temp KIs section so let assume you do lose them...

Also, they found the NM immune to all dmg, maybe we also have to buy these potion at 40k bayld each =/

... /joy

Exactly this ^ you'll be spending easily +300k Bayld for a single nakuual. Which would take months just to acquire enough bayld to do so. Now am I saying these should be spammed daily? No. I know these give very good rewards, but it shouldn't take half a year to acquire either. Maybe 2 months at tops, because you have to factor in these two things: 1) drop rate, I'm sure these pieces of gear/weapons won't flow like candy. So that slows progress for LSes doing them. 2) multiple people on the same item coupled together with drop rates and it's going to take awhile to get everyone in your LS the gear/weapons they want. That alone should be enough of a wait. Not having to take months to acquire pop items and what not. Hence why they need to let reives give the amount of bayld they once were or give a good fixed amount of say 1500 that they wanted.

[Ilax]

one week or month bashing root/rock just to access the new content for couple minute, seem all except fun, who know, maybe they will add something more interesting in this expansion, but right off the box, this sound like a ripoff.

I don't even understand the rush of nerfing bayld in this case, maybe Camate can explain us about it, but to me it sound like the company trying to buy more time... So i can conclude that the only balance this "nerf" do is in the SE business account.

[LCofPandy]

That's the thing there was no reason to nerf it except to slow our progression down, which is bullshit. I liked doing reives in all honesty, it was fun for me. Knowing at the end I was going to get a good reward for the work I was putting in to killing the mobs with my fellow players was nice. Now I can do the same amount of work and get nothing. Why should I participate in that event if I'm not going to get what I put into it. I would love to do skirmish but finding this entry pieces is like finding a needle in a haystack. And those that do find em sell em for outrageous prices.

[Luvbunny]

Yup, they know there is not enough content, so what they do is to slow our progression to a crawl. This way they can justify charging us for the monthly subscription. Basically Abyssea is way too accessible, so they decided to put all these ridiculous gates with VW and Meeble (20 hours for stone and tag) and 20 limits for Meeble tags (instead of letting it be unlimited).

If you want some changes, you gotta put some action. Abandoning SoA is one way to show developers that their content sucks. They will have to change it, if players see there is no reasons playing SoA, word of mouth will spread and the people who are on the fence will not buy it. Or they would just create add ons - Abyssea V2.0 to get us buy again lol. WoTG was DoA and for 2 years after 2007 release, players abandoned the game - so Abyssea was born.

Do something if you are unhappy!! Show them the consequences of making way too complicated contents. Vote with your wallet!

[Karbuncle]

That's the thing there was no reason to nerf it except to slow our progression down,

Actually, This is not the first time they released something and underestimated their players.

In this case, They didn't expect DD to be so darn good in it, and on the flip side, they forgot there were jobs in the game that weren't SAM, so all them Buffers/MagicDD got screwed... NOT REALLY, I they mentioned they nerfed those jobs because they expected players to AoE the buffs/Debuffs... Which in was a good idea in practice, absolutely horridly terrible in execution.

Basically Reive was a big pile of limitations that just screwed eachother from the beginning. They fixed most of it, But I do agree that the way they lowered it makes it feel a lot more slow than before.

However, this was the level in which it was intended to be gotten, I can still get ~1,500 Bayld per Reive or more if i Try hard, work with my team, and, unfortunately, am on the right job...

---

On a real note, this is not to say I'm completely okay with their design direction right now, and I'm running out of room to give them in understanding. I mean, It is really content light, and a lot of the content is riddled with barriers and luck(Skirmish)... While the rewards look super good, I don't think that makes up for the fact half the content is super hard to get into, let a lone any known information on it (rakuuls)

[Luvbunny]

There will be more uproars soon once people discovered that Skirmish is all about 0.05% RNG on drop hah ha hah :) And more RNG on items needed to unlock, and more bayld needed. Just piles of barriers to make sure no one will be able to get anywhere in a decent speed and casuals can only dreams about participating once every few months. Even VW and Meeble is not as bad as this. VW lets you stockpile your stones, and Meeble at the very least give you 10 to begin with.

With anything this company does, it really does not pay to be early adopters on anything they do. Best to leave it alone till they deemed it's a failure - even on their own terms, then actually do some works (hope to listen and read the feedbacks) and adjust the said contents to be playable.

I sure hate to read any further "Adjustment" news from them though, it never is a good thing.

[Rekin]

So Today I did two rieves, a lair and colonization as a blu. Both times I did roughly 4-6k dmg to the objective(root/hive) before it ended and both times I ended up with no exp/byalds yet still managed to clear colonization OPs. Did SE do something today whilst I was away? btw I'd say dmg was 60-70% spell based.

[BurnNotice]

Camate,

***IMPORTANT***
See if the time penalty can be omitted as well. It's a bit unnecessary to have to wait 10 minutes to reenter to assist your comrades for an event like this.

=======================

Job and level
Main job: WAR99
Support job: DNC49

　
Reive type
Colonization Reive

　
Area name and < pos > of the Reive
Yahse Hunting Grounds (H-8)

　
Conditions
---Set 1 start---
　
Amount of experience points and bayld for a single evaluation
EXP: 250
Bayld: 75

　
Actions performed at the time
various weapon skills
Curing Waltz & Haste
Attacked and defeated monsters and attacked the tree.

　
How much HP did you damage the obstacle or lair for?
Obstacle HP: Reduced the HP by approximately 20~30% from full.

[LCofPandy]

Actually, This is not the first time they released something and underestimated their players.

In this case, They didn't expect DD to be so darn good in it, and on the flip side, they forgot there were jobs in the game that weren't SAM, so all them Buffers/MagicDD got screwed... NOT REALLY, I they mentioned they nerfed those jobs because they expected players to AoE the buffs/Debuffs... Which in was a good idea in practice, absolutely horridly terrible in execution.

Basically Reive was a big pile of limitations that just screwed eachother from the beginning. They fixed most of it, But I do agree that the way they lowered it makes it feel a lot more slow than before.

However, this was the level in which it was intended to be gotten, I can still get ~1,500 Bayld per Reive or more if i Try hard, work with my team, and, unfortunately, am on the right job...

---

On a real note, this is not to say I'm completely okay with their design direction right now, and I'm running out of room to give them in understanding. I mean, It is really content light, and a lot of the content is riddled with barriers and luck(Skirmish)... While the rewards look super good, I don't think that makes up for the fact half the content is super hard to get into, let a lone any known information on it (rakuuls)

What job do you go as? I'm guessing Smn from your sig. I've gone on Blu and Bst on both of my characters, I either come out with nothing or very little. 1.5k would be nice to hit but it seems no matter how much damage I do, I can't hit the cap. Which is ridiculous because I can do good damage.

[Karbuncle]

PUP Generally. I put my WHM Automaton on a Root, and I'm usually punching roots or punching mobs. However, I do battles in Yahse more than Ceizac... Since Ceizac has entirely too many people with no clue how to maximize Bayld lol.

If your battles end in ~2-3 Minutes its probably why your getting so little Bayld... You're on the right job, You just gotta get in the right battles. Generally if you see 20-40 People afk next to a Reive location? You're in the wrong area lol.

[Ilax]

Well from my experience, the % DMG ppl do on the ROOT/ROCK is the exp/bayld multiplier in evaluation.

So if there no progress done on root, there is almost no bayld/exp reward when evaluation kick in, is simple you have to kill the root at a decent speed (not too quick, not too slow) and you get the maximum bayld possible, and from what i saw, 14~15 min is the perfect time frame.

Sad system too as everyone (like me) knowing this stay in Ceizak or yahse and now the progress in Morimar and Forest are non-existent... I mean seriously what SE was thinking when they put Mining Point behind these rock, blocking everyone from doing dmg on ROCK.

Yes Camate, i don't like bashing ROCK in Morimar for 2 hours long to get 3k bayld when i can get the same amount in Yahse or Ceizak in 15 min...

Morimar had some decent amount of player bashing these rock to finish some quest that rewarded us 200~300 bayld! (ahahaah what a April joke) and some got lucky and was able to get they KIs from mining, but now the zone is totally DEAD so even if people want to work on the mining quest, they are stuck by a ROCK that they can't DMG, and the only way is to ask player like me if we want to spend 2 hours on the rock for 3k bayld, no need to say how is not interesting.

Took like 3 day to colonize Yahse + Ceizak on Fenrir server, i estimate a good month or 6 to colonize Morimar as the progress still at 0%. (almost 2 day after tally)

[Luvbunny]

I have a feeling they will adjust all of these in the summer updates. Assuming we are all still here playing and paying. I don't know, suddenly other games looks very inviting than these bashing rocks and stones for more logs. Give it time, and like always they will adjust all these craptacular contents. It took a good 2 years to make Campaign somewhat playable. And it took a year for Voidwatch to be popular. I am sure a year from now, there will be a lot of great things coming from SoA. Or maybe 2 years? Depends on how fast they are with updates and adjustment. May have to wait 4 years if you want to see the conclusion of SoA storyline. Or you can just watch all the CS on youtube.

[LCofPandy]

Thing is since the nerf, barely any one does reives. If what you're saying is true then getting bayld doesn't seem particular bad, though it does need adjusted, there is no doubt about it. But since the nerf it turned a lot of people away. I'll try to hit up some reives and see if I can't put these observations to the test. Maybe I'll pull out the old automaton on my main and go bst on my other character. Only thing is if there aren't enough people, it's moot to even bother.
Edit: also just wanted to mention info on the nakuaals is coming in over on BG forums. Seems they are tied in with the colonization rate. So guess what everyone will be pushing for these next few weeks. Either way the KI to enter is 100k which is very steep if you ask me.

[Concerned4FFxi]

Increase the size of the area the battles can take place in. On paladin some nests are near impossible to pull because by the time you get the mobs chained and lined up against a wall or something your out of bounds. . . or get hit with knockback, and go out . . .

Then you can't re-enter for ten minutes.
So yea, please shorten re-entry to five minutes, and increase the area the fight can take place in.

Also, 5 seonds is way too short, ten seconds would be a fair alarm system to players to get back in the area to battle before getting the boot.

[Delvish]

Job and level
Main job: SCH99
Support job: RDM49

　
Reive type
Colonization Reive

　
Area name and < pos > of the Reive
Ceizak Hunting Grounds (G-7)

　
Conditions
---Set 1 start---
　

Amount of experience points and bayld for a single evaluation
EXP: 80
Bayld: 80

　
Actions performed at the time
Cast Protect V, Shell V, Stoneskin, Phalanx, Blink, Aquaveil, Animus Minuo, and Voidstorm on myself (1 time for each)
Cast Manifestation Bio II, Aspir II (368 MP total from 2 roots, capped out MP on second of 3 roots. 0MP from Spiders) (1 time each)
Cast Break (1 time)


　
How much HP did you damage the obstacle or lair for?
Obstacle HP: 30dmg on root plus short DoT. 1%

　



　Note: Reward seems normal for actions given.

---Set 1 end---
---Set 2 start---
　

Amount of experience points and bayld for a single evaluation
EXP: 0
Bayld: 0

　



Actions performed at the time
Received 23 attacks at 100dmg to me each.
Cast Manifestation Drain at 200hp to 3 roots each, 300hp to 4 Spiders each (capped HP after 200 HP on 1 root and 600 HP over 2 spiders).
Cast Manifestation Sleep (oops bio).
cast Manifestation Break (too much enmity).
Died.
Reraise.
Cast Reraise III, Protect V, Shell V, Stoneskin, Phalanx, Blink, Aquaveil, Animus Minuo, and Voidstorm on myself (1 time for each)
Reive End.

　



How much HP did you damage the obstacle or lair for?
Obstacle HP: 300dmg on root plus prior DoT. 3%

　
　Note: Received message: "Delvish's Experience points have been stored because he has been defeated" "Delvish's Bayld has been stored because he has been defeated"
Upon raising, Received message "Delvish has joined the Colonization Reive!"



---Set 2 end---

Theory: Reives are bugged in that Reive status is likely reapplied upon raise, resulting in a fresh-start to the Reive and 0 Bayld rewarded between raise and next evalutation.

Edit: Another round



Job and level
Main job: SCH99
Support job: RDM49

　
Reive type
Colonization Reive

　
Area name and < pos > of the Reive
Ceizak Hunting Grounds (I-8)

　
Conditions
---Set 1 start---
　

Amount of experience points and bayld for a single evaluation
EXP: 0
Bayld: 0

　
Actions performed at the time
Cast Accession/Perpetuance Regen V on myself. 4 members total affected.
Cast Stoneskin, Phalanx, Blink, Aquaveil, Animus Minuo, Voidstorm, and Klimaform on myself (1 time for each)
Cast Manifestation Gravity and Break on Root. (No effect, no Chapuli in range)
Cast Manifestation Aspir II (318 MP, 123 MP, 290 MP over 3 roots capped out MP.(1 time each)
Cast Blizzard V, Thunder V, Fire V for 1000 dmg each (1 time each, Blizzard V twice).
Cast Manifestation Aspir (122MP from root, 0MP from Chapuli)
Reive End


　
How much HP did you damage the obstacle or lair for?
Obstacle HP: 3000dmg on root. est 10%~

　



　Note: In 4 member party. Did not zone between first and second Reive.

---Set 1 end---

[Sargent]

General suggestions on Reives themselves:
- Increase the range on reives
- If you run out of range of the reive without performing any action or having any action performed on you (by the mobs), you will not be subject to the 5 minute penalty.
- Increase the EXP given from Lair Reives, the low reward make less people want to do them.
- When you die and raise/reraise, EXP and Bayld that was carried over is lost. Have it so it carries over when you raise up.

[Calintzpso]

http://waffles-production.com/public/Fraps_pol_32x_041513_012022.png

Solo'd a Cragrock wall on Ranger with some cheap leftover ammo I had(resorted to throwing weapon at the end) so I could find more mining points for your stupid quest SE. Got this about 200 times before I finally finished.

Thanks for the 800 Limit points and 200 bayld, but I'm capped on Limit points. Could have used more Bayld tho for the AMMO I SPENT ON IT. Whens that Recycle Fix? Also Scavenge doesn't work in Adoulin areas, AT ALL, I haven't even gotten a Arrowwood lumber like i usually get with that lolcrap JA.