Footwork

[Nvr]

To save the other topic from unrelated clutter, I decided to make a Footwork specific thread

With a build specifically for Footwork, through personal experience I have found that DMG can easily match H2H, but have the bonus TP from WS as an addition. There are already aspects of footwork that are beneficial like the +15% attack, full tp per hit durring WS, slower but stronger (excluding empy H2H) attacks.

However, in many situations, H2H outweighs Footwork, esspecially in Abyssea. But I feel Footwork could easily be altered to increase it's usefullness, maybe decrease the delay or increase the dmg so it can compare to H2H dmg.

That being said, imo, a MNK that has geared and build for Footwork is not gimp for using it, but it is pretty easy for that MNK to tell if it is worth them using or not. No one should refuse Footwork having any use. Esspecially when it can be put back into good use with one of two very easy adjustments.

[hiko]

kick arts: Grants a bonus to attack speed when using footwork (ja haste)

[Nvr]

Some trait that would increase kick speed like martial arts does with H2H would be nice.

[Mojo]

Kick Attack base DMG needs to go up by more than 18 for it to really work better or it needs to benefit from Martial Arts. Going from 2 hits per round at 280 delay to 1 hit per round at 480 delay screws you over pretty badly when the DMG increase is so low (even with Tantra Gaiters +2.)

[Cream_Soda]

If it were to benefit from martial arts though, you're going to lose your xhit and on average take more attack rounds to get to a WS. Depending on how much the delay is lowered, this may actually hurt footwork since it's more heavy on the WS side of DoT/WS distribution.

As far as the OP goes, in the CURRENT state of the game, the only use for footwork is for quick tp gain (w/ 2-4 h2h) for proccing blue !! when it's h2h during blunt time.

As far as damage goes, it can be about equal w/ non victory smite non relic h2h outside of abyssea, but totally worthless inside of abyssea.

Though, even when next update comes out, the DMG+ on footwork comes from foot weapon. h2h options are going to get stronger w/ higher base dmg and more new stats, while w/ footwork it's unlikely they're going to make new shoes that are better than af3+2

[MarkovChain]

Footwork is very usefull for stun locking a mobs with two monks on it. TP gains is faster than H2H and TP given is much lower lower. It's for when you want to play it safe. Things where I've used it are : glavoid and briareus. The killing speed doesn't matter that much on them, TP spam does.

[Cream_Soda]

I've never had any sort of problems on either of those mobs where stun locking would have been necessary, lol. If you need stun that bad, swap one of the mnks for a blu

[Bulrogg]

Why can't I kick while wielding a staff? Seems like something a monk could do...:confused:

[pheare]

Footwork is actually affected by Martial arts. at LV 65 Base delay for footwork is 500, with Martial Arts lv 75 it's 480, and at lv 82 it decreases to 460.

The lower delay results in less TP you're getting in return killing X-hit builds every new tier of Martial Arts. So if you're wanting to hit faster due to lower delay you're actually decreasing the usefulness of Footwork. (Gaining 100% TP with less hits).

The only way you are going to see Footwork become more powerful is:

a) Remove the effects of Martial Arts on Footwork so you can keep x-hit builds up.

b) Increase the # of attacks allowed under Footwork over 2 per round.

Another thing is that when going to higher levels, your h2h gets is a bigger increase in power % than footwork does. When you trade your weapons for higher base damage the difference is even more noticeable.

Here is a link to post research done for DPS and such for MNK. Includes both Footwork and non Footwork.

https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AkA0wGYYRRdadFpTbnVzSDNmajlXb25OM1lZR1JidGc&authkey=CKLFtcAO&hl=en#gid=3


Also, I admit I haven't messed with Footwork since the lv 85 cap, but i'm curious to see if footwork or h2h gets to 100% tp faster inside Abyssea. You can do it in less hits yes, but Footwork losing X-hit build and with all the DA/TA gear/atma now it may be comparable in getting 100% tp.

[pheare]

Why can't I kick while wielding a staff? Seems like something a monk could do...:confused:

lol. I just imagined Matrix where Neo uses the pole and swings around/kicks all the Agent Smiths. Monk should be able to kick using staff. :(

[Cream_Soda]

Footwork is actually affected by Martial arts. at LV 65 Base delay for footwork is 500, with Martial Arts lv 75 it's 480, and at lv 82 it decreases to 460.
That was a glitch. That got patched (if i recall correctly). I remember ppl bitching about their xhit going down at the 80-85 update. (which if you didn't have enough store tp gear, that martial arts trait actually lowered your damage)

[Mojo]

Yeah, I suppose the only thing they can do then is increase the allowable (and possibly even base) number of kicks per round under footwork, or increase the amount of DMG+ that is added.

[Syntex]

Why make a footwork build?

No really, why?

What does a footwork build offer you over an equally good H2H build? Why should I take the time and inventory space to get one made?

This is what I want to know.

[Dfoley]

Currently nothing snytex.

The goal of footwork was give monk a samurai type ability that allows us to feed less tp while still doing similar damage to our currently hand to hand build. AKA 1 larger hit instead 2-3 smaller hits, but then you lose out on DA and TA and the crits that come with them. Footwork will never compete with h2h for DD.

Personally I would like to see footwork just become our "defensive" stance, in that we do less damage, but cant be parried/blocked/guarded/countered (can still be dodged).

[Nvr]

You all make good points. There is not much incentive to make a footwork build, but some people alrwady have them. Footwork is surely not of par with a good H2H weapon, but there are some simple things SE can do to bring it back into popularity. If it could exceed 2 hits, I think that would pretty much do it, but it would also be pretty broken I think. If you have a 2-4 H2H and could kick up to 4x... even in Abyssea you would be able to do 1.8k dmg in an attack round. Not to mention you would get over 60tp from it. But here is hoping lol..

Outside of Abyssea, without empy, I would almost always use footwork build. I have killed thousands upon thousands of mobs completing trials for various H2H weapons, and in my experience, Footwork speeds up kills pretty noticably.

[Cream_Soda]

Because the trial h2h are rather pieces of crap, lol. That's like comparing h2h to non kick shoes footwork.

[Nvr]

Because the trial h2h are rather pieces of crap, lol. That's like comparing h2h to non kick shoes footwork.

I think you missunderstood me, I usually use a stronger H2H weapon and change to trial weapon doe the final hit. I don't use those terrible trial weapons to actually kill the mob all the way through. Outside of Abyssea on the trial mobs, I find that my Footwork build kills mobs alot faster than Heofon Knuckles. Asc. Furry is nothing outside of abyssea compared to inside. A footwork build with Tornado Kick does 1.6-1.9k on the trial mobs. Much more that I have been able to do with Heofon Knuckles and any of the H2H WS's.

Keep in mind, this does not apply to Empy. or Coin H2H.

[Neisan_Quetz]

Heafon Knuckles are bad and you should feel bad for not killing Shere Khan.

[Cream_Soda]

I think you missunderstood me, I usually use a stronger H2H weapon and change to trial weapon doe the final hit. I don't use those terrible trial weapons to actually kill the mob all the way through. Outside of Abyssea on the trial mobs, I find that my Footwork build kills mobs alot faster than Heofon Knuckles. Asc. Furry is nothing outside of abyssea compared to inside. A footwork build with Tornado Kick does 1.6-1.9k on the trial mobs. Much more that I have been able to do with Heofon Knuckles and any of the H2H WS's.

Keep in mind, this does not apply to Empy. or Coin H2H.
Heafon are awful and you use Asuran anyways, and of course footwork is going to be faster when w/ h2h you have to swap it off and lose your tp for each kill and start each fight from 0 when u put the DD h2h back on.

[Nvr]

Heafon are awful and you use Asuran anyways, and of course footwork is going to be faster when w/ h2h you have to swap it off and lose your tp for each kill and start each fight from 0 when u put the DD h2h back on.

You make a good point, but dmg output was higher with footwork, WS's aside. What do you use other than Heofon Knuckles? and other thank empy.

[Neisan_Quetz]

Furor, Taurine, Str Taipans.

[Nvr]

Furor, Taurine, Str Taipans.

But then you don't get Final Heaven! jk, Final Heaven was a severe dissapointment to me.

[Shoko]

I'd assume at the least, STR Taipan +2 or Taurine Cesti if you don't have time for the Taipan. Actually I've been using Heofon since forever since I was doing trials up for Vere... I should upgrade as well to Taurine, lol.

[Cream_Soda]

You make a good point, but dmg output was higher with footwork, WS's aside. What do you use other than Heofon Knuckles? and other thank empy.
Well I have both Vereth and Rev fists+2, before those, I used Tapian fangs+2

[Daremo]

Why make a footwork build?

No really, why?

What does a footwork build offer you over an equally good H2H build? Why should I take the time and inventory space to get one made?

This is what I want to know.

I use a foot work build for soloing/duoing. Keeps mob TP down, gives me enough TP to self-SC/heal myself/stun spells and TP moves(depending on sub). It's quite handy.

[MarkovChain]

I've never had any sort of problems on either of those mobs where stun locking would have been necessary, lol. If you need stun that bad, swap one of the mnks for a blu

Considering you don't have your level 90 weapon 4 month after release I'd say you are not in position to giving advice. Claiming TP spam is not an issue on a mob that can do a 9k damage tp damage and another one that can instantaneoulsy rape you if unlucky with the 1111 is proof that you don't know what you are taling about. Go duo glavoid then go back to me.

[MarkovChain]

Why make a footwork build?

No really, why?

What does a footwork build offer you over an equally good H2H build? Why should I take the time and inventory space to get one made?

This is what I want to know.

It costs zero slot lol ; Full AF3+2, what else.

[Mojo]

ToM H2H weapon, which is a lot of killing pointless mobs for a pointless weapon.

[Ryozen]

Considering you don't have your level 90 weapon 4 month after release I'd say you are not in position to giving advice. Claiming TP spam is not an issue on a mob that can do a 9k damage tp damage and another one that can instantaneoulsy rape you if unlucky with the 1111 is proof that you don't know what you are taling about. Go duo glavoid then go back to me.

Heaven forbid you run away from Briareus after a 1111 Mercurial. Seriously, shit isn't that hard. And if you don't have a contingency plan for Disgorge, you're doing it wrong.

[Cream_Soda]

Considering you don't have your level 90 weapon 4 month after release I'd say you are not in position to giving advice. Claiming TP spam is not an issue on a mob that can do a 9k damage tp damage and another one that can instantaneoulsy rape you if unlucky with the 1111 is proof that you don't know what you are taling about. Go duo glavoid then go back to me.
Yea, cause glavoid/Bri really has everything to do w/ Verethranga!

Ok, so I guess the way to duo glavoid with 2 mnks is to have both of them use footwork so you can stun lock him!

[Nvr]

This thread is really getting offtopic.
Let's just agree that:

1) Footwork atm is, at best, situational.
2) There are some simple things that could make it much more usable (like more than 2 hits)

Arguing over it's use compared to good H2H weapon is really getting nowhere, let's just hope SE makes it a little better someday.

Also, I really want to ask, did you lose a bet Cream_Soda? Because your sig is just awesome.

[MarkovChain]

ToM H2H weapon, which is a lot of killing pointless mobs for a pointless weapon.

WTF do you need this weapon for footwork. Do we really need OAT weapon TP spamming when we care about TP feeding. I think you are out of the loop.


Heaven forbid you run away from Briareus after a 1111 Mercurial. Seriously, shit isn't that hard. And if you don't have a contingency plan for Disgorge, you're doing it wrong.

Inbefore : 6 box


Yea, cause glavoid/Bri really has everything to do w/ Verethranga!

Ok, so I guess the way to duo glavoid with 2 mnks is to have both of them use footwork so you can stun lock him!

The best way to kill something is to brew it, but I think your are the specialist.

[Cream_Soda]

This thread is really getting offtopic.
Let's just agree that:

1) Footwork atm is, at best, situational.
2) There are some simple things that could make it much more usable (like more than 2 hits)

Arguing over it's use compared to good H2H weapon is really getting nowhere, let's just hope SE makes it a little better someday.

Also, I really want to ask, did you lose a bet Cream_Soda? Because your sig is just awesome.
Lol, that's not me

[Yarly]

but I think your are the specialist.

Everything anyone knows about MNK is largely due to Cream Soda.

If you got mnk advice from LS members, they probably got it from a post he made, or got it from someone who got it from a post he made, and so on.

A footwork build is pretty useless without the 2-3 Ursine Claws and the two mobs you listed are hardly a threat.

Also, inbefore 6box? You can kill Briareus solo on some jobs. Duo for sure on any DD+WHM. What the hell would you need SIX characters for?

[Greatguardian]

Everything anyone knows about MNK is largely due to Cream Soda.

If you got mnk advice from LS members, they probably got it from a post he made, or got it from someone who got it from a post he made, and so on.

A footwork build is pretty useless without the 2-3 Ursine Claws and the two mobs you listed are hardly a threat.

Also, inbefore 6box? You can kill Briareus solo on some jobs. Duo for sure on any DD+WHM. What the hell would you need SIX characters for?

This ^.

Meikyo Shisui is not a threat at all for anyone, solo or otherwise. Glavoid is also quite duoable Whm/Blm + DD; and I've heard of RDMs solo'ing it (though it takes forever). NIN/DNC could probably do it too with Migawari to block Disgorge, kiting if the timer was down, etc.

[MarkovChain]

Everything anyone knows about MNK is largely due to Cream Soda.


Lol, he is just repeating motenten/kinematics works.

[Cream_Soda]

Lol, he is just repeating motenten/kinematics works.
Now, I do. Why? Because he does all that stuff on his own time anyway. I was around before he started making major contributions and doing the math myself when he wasn't around to do so.

Currently, though, w/ his spreadsheet and knowing his math is good first hand, there's no reason to repeat the same math that's already been done.


either way, I don't need 6 people to do Bria, lol

[Shoko]

Lol, he is just repeating motenten/kinematics works.

Nah, CS is the original. Kinematics based some of his work offa the stuff Cream did.

Anything more than 3-4 people on Bria is too much imo, lol.

[Cream_Soda]

Nah, CS is the original. Kinematics based some of his work offa the stuff Cream did.

Anything more than 3-4 people on Bria is too much imo, lol.
Nah, not at all. Kine gets all the credit for his work. I've done general math. He goes complex as hell into it like factoring in tp overflow and just every minute detail

[MarkovChain]

Nope on a scale from 0 to 10, kinematics knows 8, cream soda 1. Nothing in the spreadsheet has been done by creamsoda, ranging from subtle use of probability theory, independance, approximation etc. Stop acting like he bases his work on yours. Like all BG posters, you can only read his work, nothing else.

[Cream_Soda]

Nope on a scale from 0 to 10, kinematics knows 8, cream soda 1. Nothing in the spreadsheet has been done by creamsoda, ranging from subtle use of probability theory, independance, approximation etc. Stop acting like he bases his work on yours.
I guess you can't read


Nah, not at all. Kine gets all the credit for his work. I've done general math. He goes complex as hell into it like factoring in tp overflow and just every minute detail


Like all BG posters, you can only read his work, nothing else.
Again, I'm not kinematics, but lol to say I know nothing is pretty dumb. Again, if you read before you argue, you may not look as dumb.

[Shoko]

Nope on a scale from 0 to 10, kinematics knows 8, cream soda 1. Nothing in the spreadsheet has been done by creamsoda, ranging from subtle use of probability theory, independance, approximation etc. Stop acting like he bases his work on yours. Like all BG posters, you can only read his work, nothing else.

I only just posted incoherently. Definitely seen Creams work before Kine's however (even if it was basic maths), because I remember it making me interested in MNK so long ago. I'm not acting like he bases his work on mine... I have not ever posted a sliver of mathematical information pertaining to MNK (unless you picked your words incorrectly and was referring to Kine).

Personally, I don't care about mathematical stuff unless it pertains to BLU. And even then, it's not my strong suit, so I ask questions to people that are more apt to it. Not sure at all why you have a grudge vs Cream Soda, me, or anyone else on BG, but it's becoming quite hilarious.

You must be one of those people that believe "thinking outside of the box" will make you better than a player than someone that plays by the maths, huh? You sound like a fool.

[Neisan_Quetz]

You can't do math. It's okay, a lot of people can't either.

[Shoko]

Ey, no shame in saying I'm not a math person.

[Neisan_Quetz]

Was referring to nero lol

[Shoko]

Was referring to nero lol

lol. Still, no shame at all. XD

[Mojo]

WTF do you need this weapon for footwork. Do we really need OAT weapon TP spamming when we care about TP feeding. I think you are out of the loop.

A little bit late on the reply for this, but you've got to be kidding me. Weapon DMG does not factor into kicks damage or TP gain per strike while under Footwork. So with Ursine Claws +2, you're going to do just as much damage per hit and the mob will get just as much TP from them. The mob will accrue TP faster but it's directly proportional to the amount of damage you're doing. You might as well advise someone to remove their Haste gear or flat out disengage if mob TP using Ursine Claws +2/Footwork concerns you.

[Yarly]

A little bit late on the reply for this, but you've got to be kidding me. Weapon DMG does not factor into kicks damage or TP gain per strike while under Footwork. So with Ursine Claws +2, you're going to do just as much damage per hit and the mob will get just as much TP from them. The mob will accrue TP faster but it's directly proportional to the amount of damage you're doing. You might as well advise someone to remove their Haste gear or flat out disengage if mob TP using Ursine Claws +2/Footwork concerns you.

Don't mess with MarkovChain, he'll put you on a scale of 0 to 10!!! D:

[MarkovChain]

A little bit late on the reply for this, but you've got to be kidding me. Weapon DMG does not factor into kicks damage or TP gain per strike while under Footwork. So with Ursine Claws +2, you're going to do just as much damage per hit and the mob will get just as much TP from them. The mob will accrue TP faster but it's directly proportional to the amount of damage you're doing. You might as well advise someone to remove their Haste gear or flat out disengage if mob TP using Ursine Claws +2/Footwork concerns you.

Like I said you are out of the loop. Claiming that TP spam is the same due to the fact that you feed more tp but do more damage is proof enough. You are comparing tp given over time (more precilely : tp given per round) to tp/damage ratio which are completely different things.

In order to compare the TP spam from 2 weapons you are going to keep the same haste gear in both case so I don't see how your haste remark is anywhere close to being relevant. Also high haste or low haste doesn't matter for TP spam. Until the point where regain is decisive enough (=never with footwork), what matters is after how many of your rounds the mob is going to get his TPs so if it's getting tp after say 10 of your rounds, wether you have 60% haste or 25% will not change anything ;

faceplam

[Greatguardian]

Like I said you are out of the loop. Claiming that TP spam is the same due to the fact that you feed more tp but do more damage is proof enough. You are comparing tp given over time (more precilely : tp given per round) to tp/damage ratio which are completely different things.

In order to compare the TP spam from 2 weapons you are going to keep the same haste gear in both case so I don't see how your haste remark is anywhere close to being relevant. Also high haste or low haste doesn't matter for TP spam. Until the point where regain is decisive enough (=never with footwork), what matters is after how many of your rounds the mob is going to get his TPs so if it's getting tp after say 10 of your rounds, wether you have 60% haste or 25% will not change anything ;

faceplam

Admittedly, seeing as kicks give TP to the mob equal to the TP you'd feed them with a punch, yet give you significantly more TP per kick, you could argue that you WS more often with respect to TP fed to the monster. However, because of how significant the gap is between Victory Smite and Tornado Kick, I'm not sure you'd have a case for dealing more *damage* per TP fed.

I'm not really sure what requires the extreme reduction in TP feed anyways? MNK can easily cap Subtle Blow, and they have Penance up 60% of the time (100% if a second Mnk is around). Trying to reduce TP feed that low just seems superfluous.

[Mojo]

Like I said you are out of the loop. Claiming that TP spam is the same due to the fact that you feed more tp but do more damage is proof enough. You are comparing tp given over time (more precilely : tp given per round) to tp/damage ratio which are completely different things.

In order to compare the TP spam from 2 weapons you are going to keep the same haste gear in both case so I don't see how your haste remark is anywhere close to being relevant. Also high haste or low haste doesn't matter for TP spam. Until the point where regain is decisive enough (=never with footwork), what matters is after how many of your rounds the mob is going to get his TPs so if it's getting tp after say 10 of your rounds, wether you have 60% haste or 25% will not change anything ;

faceplam

Are you actually trying to argue that intentionally reducing your attack speed for no benefit other than the mob getting hit less is somehow a good idea, ever? That's all you're accomplishing by using any hand-to-hand weapon other than Ursine Claws +2 while under the effect of Footwork. If you don't see how this would be nearly exactly like removing Haste gear (or simply disengaging) then I suppose I can spell it out for you...

[MarkovChain]

TP spam has nothing to do with TP speed, read again. If you give 2 TP per hit the mob is getting 100% after 50 hits, regarless of the amount of haste. Haste is irrelevant ; what matters is the base TP given per round, and mainly this if you exclude regain and store tp on the mob and you. This is different than considering the amount of TP moves done on you per minute, which would be relevant if your mage is likely to run out of MP due to it not regenering fast enough. That's not what is being discussed here, I am discussing stun locking a mob with shoulder tackle, in which case what matters is the amount of WS that you can do until you are ready to stun and the mob gets 100 tp ( 2 ws duo, 4 solo typically).

[Bulrogg]

Why can't I kick while wielding a staff? Seems like something a monk could do...:confused:

On a scale of 0 to 10... I want to swing my staff and kick.

[Nvr]

I can't believe the arguments in this topic. I've learned not to even bother.

[hiko]

TP spam has nothing to do with TP speed, read again. If you give 2 TP per hit the mob is getting 100% after 50 hits, regarless of the amount of haste. Haste is irrelevant ; what matters is the base TP given per round, and mainly this if you exclude regain and store tp on the mob and you. This is different than considering the amount of TP moves done on you per minute, which would be relevant if your mage is likely to run out of MP due to it not regenering fast enough. That's not what is being discussed here, I am discussing stun locking a mob with shoulder tackle, in which case what matters is the amount of WS that you can do until you are ready to stun and the mob gets 100 tp ( 2 ws duo, 4 solo typically).

learn how much TP monster get when hit before saying crap

[Nvr]

I don't even believe posts anymore. Too many people from the BG forums acting stupid on purpose just for their own entertainment.

[Lynchilles]

Lol you guys just got trolled by Pchan (MarkovChain). This dude has been crudding up forums with his nonsensical idiocy for years. He's been laughed off about every other FFXI forum, but seems he found a new playground.

Same guy that argues that a Monk should get Counter +3 and Regain on their Moonshade earrings lol

[Ryozen]

You got me for a second there. It sounded like a pretty good idea, until I realized they were in the same category. It wouldn't be a terrible earring, if MNK was the only job you planned to use it on.

[Greatguardian]

Lol you guys just got trolled by Pchan (MarkovChain). This dude has been crudding up forums with his nonsensical idiocy for years. He's been laughed off about every other FFXI forum, but seems he found a new playground.

Same guy that argues that a Monk should get Counter +3 and Regain on their Moonshade earrings lol

This^. MarkovChain, aka Pchan, has been banned from BG for ages. Even before being banned he was on most people's ignore list. You're pretty safe just ignoring him.

[MarkovChain]

learn how much TP monster get when hit before saying crap

lol ¿

base tp (H2H) => 4.8
base=>7.8
50% subtle blow =>3.9
dAGI thanks to atma(s) of the easy mode : at least -25% => 2.9
penance up =>2.1

ding, failed attempt to look clever.

[magnius]

Too many people from the BG forums acting stupid on purpose
Not entirely. I've been keeping up with this MNK thread and I have yet to see them be anything but informative. Using math to prove something isn't acting stupid, sorry.


lol ¿

PChan definitely.

[Yarly]

I don't even believe posts anymore. Too many people from the BG forums acting stupid on purpose just for their own entertainment.

How can we be sure you're not one of them???
Are you just trying to gain our trust and then BAM troll us? :(

I'm just so very concerned for my safety right now.

[Draylo]

lol can tell it Pchan with his retarded upside down ?

[wish12oz]

U GUYZ R ALL RONG! PCHAN IS AWESOMZ AND SUPR KEWL!

[Vortex]

Arguing with pchan is like arguing with a rotting corps, no matter how much you complain that it smells, over time, it will just stink even worse untill you learn the inevitable and back away.

[FioryGriever]

been away from forums for a bit, heres my op on h2h to use w/ footwork, IF tp per kick isn't ur focus .. Taurine Cesti / Ursine 2-4 .. if it is, +15 STP Barracudas from ToM. havent used my Footwork build lately cuz of tanking reasons, but iirc im @ 18 tp per kick w/o losing haste cap on gear all while /drg and spamming WS, most of the time people argue about the usefulness of Footwork w/o understanding the builds behind them.. even if i were to use Verthganda w/ Footwork id have 15 TP kicks and id still self SC.. admitedly i dont know the numbers between a Verth h2h DoT > WS vs Verth Footwork WS > DoT (not entirely sure if the AM effects Footwork either which would be a downside too). Either way i play mnk/drg + Footwork for fun sake~

[Ryozen]

If you've got Vereth and you're not using Victory Smite... do I need to finish this sentence?

[Cream_Soda]

been away from forums for a bit, heres my op on h2h to use w/ footwork, IF tp per kick isn't ur focus .. Taurine Cesti / Ursine 2-4 .. if it is, +15 STP Barracudas from ToM. havent used my Footwork build lately cuz of tanking reasons, but iirc im @ 18 tp per kick w/o losing haste cap on gear all while /drg and spamming WS, most of the time people argue about the usefulness of Footwork w/o understanding the builds behind them.. even if i were to use Verthganda w/ Footwork id have 15 TP kicks and id still self SC.. admitedly i dont know the numbers between a Verth h2h DoT > WS vs Verth Footwork WS > DoT (not entirely sure if the AM effects Footwork either which would be a downside too). Either way i play mnk/drg + Footwork for fun sake~
It was 70%+ double kick rate on 2-3 ursine. I'd only imagine that being higher w/ 2-4. No way 15 stp is beating Ursines ever, lol.

[Swords]

My Footwork Build:

2-4 Ursine Claws +2
Tantra Tathlum
Tantra Crown +1
Backlash Torque
Brutal Earring
Kemas Earring
Loki's Kaftan
Tantra Gloves +1
Raja's Ring
Spiral Ring
Amement Mantle +1
Black Belt
Tantra Hose +1
Tantra Gaiters +1

Depending on my sub, what's being fought, atma's, and so on single kicks...

Average damage range with Tank Setup: 200-450 (Including Crits)
Average WS damage range with Tank Setup: 1700-2700 (With Kick WS)
Damage range with Pure DD Setup: 250-760 (Including Crits)
WS damage range with Pure DD Setup: 2500-3500 (With Kick WS)


It was 70%+ double kick rate on 2-3 ursine. I'd only imagine that being higher w/ 2-4. No way 15 stp is beating Ursines ever, lol.

It is, I have roughly a 85-95% Double Kick rate outside of abyssea.

[Diasetsu]

It was 70%+ double kick rate on 2-3 ursine. I'd only imagine that being higher w/ 2-4. No way 15 stp is beating Ursines ever, lol.


Actually depending on Atmas, there is a decent chance 15 store tp would beat Ursine in certain gear situations. It wouldn't be by a ton, but even barracudas could get 1.677 hits per round avg with all the DA and TA now. Ursine 2-4s should come out to 1.858 hits per round, once ya throw in that Store TP, Barracudas could technically have a higher footwork WS frequency.

[Swords]

At the same time though the proc. rate for the 2-4 hit Ursine claws when using Footwork is extremely high, so much so you could sacrafice any DA/TA atma's and gear and probably see little to no difference in the proc. rate. Granted the rate of probability in this game is high, so I imagine there are some situations where it might be more beneficial, even the 2-4 hit Ursine claws have their uses outside of footwork.

[FioryGriever]

And I totally agree w/ the Ursine users, I'm going to make a pair just because i like having multiple things to test w/.. but in a case where I'm getting 18 TP return on kicks, it'd only take me the 3-4 kicks after WS instead of the 4-5(Depending on if CTP procs, w/ my setup i have @ least +20 CTP 3 earring 7 belt 5 head and assuming 5 as trait from /drg), which pretty much negates the instant DA, prolly not always the case, most certainly not during initial TP phase b4 you have TP return from WS, and as /drg the 2-4 hits procs normally on Jumps and isn't limited IIRC (which is rather sick <.<), id have to get em and test it. Again, not perfect to VS h2h dps builds but it's a work in progress and for me a fun way to play MNK~