Voidwatch rares--are people giving up?

[Hashmalum]

On my server, I've been noticing fewer and fewer Voidwatch shouts for any monster except Qilin. There is however a mighty plague of Qilin shout groups upon the land, and I'm sure if I wanted to I could kill Qilin all day. Coincident with this trend, the price on heavy metal plates just keeps going down (to around 90k each at present). It seems that people are killing Qilin over and over simply to farm heavy metal plates, at the expense of killing anything else. I am guessing that Qilin is the victim of this because he is the easiest one of the heavy metal plate pouch dropping mobs to kill; Aello is a horrible shrieking bitch who strips you naked and takes a nasty bird crap on your ability timers, and while I have never gotten a chance to fight Uptala, he sure looks unpleasant.

Now, one of the criticisms that many players, including myself, made of the Empyrean level 95 trials is that once people got all their Voidwatch rares, the supply of plates would dry up, and Empyrean weapon holders would be stuck where would-be Mythic weapon holders are now. Could it be that we got it backward--that people have given up after going 0/several hundred, and now only do Voidwatch for the plates to make money? Or are my observations skewed, or my server atypical, or are people just that more desperate for Coruscanti and Fajin Boots than they are for anything else?

Because if I am correct, having most of Voidwatch nearly dead due to discouragement sure seems like a bad outcome. That's a lot of wasted content. It's certainly a bad thing if you were gone for 10 months and never got a chance to do most of this stuff. Should the drop rates be loosened up somewhat?

[Komori]

Lately on Bismarck, Uptala, Aello, Ig-Alima, Pil, Kaggen and Qilin are all still reguarly done, (Akvan too but not as much as the others). I know that I do not join most of them like I used to because I now that the odds stacked against me means that I'd spend my time much more productively standing in Jeuno then I would wasting voidstones on trying to get the pulse items because the drop rate is so low.

[Mayoyama]

Seems to be always the same people who get everything from VW, so after months and months of trying for certain items.. most people just gave up (or got that item a million times).

SE really should make more items able to be made into cells... or allow stuff to be transfered into party pool... but its not likely to happen

[saevel]

Many people I know of have given up on things like Toci's. After 300+ fights (yes they've beat it 300+ times) they just say f*ck it and use their time on other things.

SE's developers were downright stupid with the drop rates. I mean utterly and completely stupid.

[Komori]

No, no. What's worse is the people who keep getting the same item. I've trashed at least 5 Phasmida Belts, and the people who come to Kaggen have gotten 10 Mekira bodies but still no sign of belt. It's stupid, and it's frustrating that items keep appearing to people who no longer need them, or like in Ig-Alima the other day one of the mages ended up with Borealis. Had NO JOBS whatsoever that were melee and got Borealis.

[Siiri]

The tickets should have been 1 to get an item, not 5. 5 is ridiculous there is no movement on most of this gear at all. Most people are giving up. Anything that didn't get a ticket should have seen a massive increase to drop rate as well.

[tyrantsyn]

Shout's depend on 2 thing's. People who shout for them and people waiting for the shout's to join them. Once the people that shout get what they want they don't shout for them any more. So the ppl that want gear, sitting around waiting for those shout's to come are just out of luck.
Guess what I'm saying is, become the shouter and not the guy waiting around.

[Nawesemo]

Shout's depend on 2 thing's. People who shout for them and people waiting for the shout's to join them. Once the people that shout get what they want they don't shout for them any more. So the ppl that want gear, sitting around waiting for those shout's to come are just out of luck.
Guess what I'm saying is, become the shouter and not the guy waiting around.

^^ that's it. I don't like shouting, but it gets the job done, always helps when shout starts with 6/18, or at least core jobs covered. Scheduled ls runs is getting it done for us slacker shell mates who forgot there was a story line involved... But yeah, tired of waiting, start your own shouts....

[Hashmalum]

Guess what I'm saying is, become the shouter and not the guy waiting around.

But yeah, tired of waiting, start your own shouts....I knew I'd get this advice when I started the thread. But starting a group only works if there are people interested in joining it. I started this thread to see if there really was a general motivation problem here and so far signs point to yes; we've had one person report a positive VW server environment and several people report that they personally are discouraged. This isn't much data though, and I'd like to hear reports from other people about the VW environment on their servers, whether good or bad. For that matter if you too are on Ragnarok and think I'm full of shit I'd like to hear your perspective on VW on our server. I'm trying to gather data, not just support my preconceived notions.

Incidentally, the Complainer's Rule (if you keep quiet for a long time about not getting something, then once you finally complain the game will give it you) holds true once again; a little while after my initial post, I saw and joined an Uptala shout (although it took a long time to fill up). The Gimp Rule was also validated, as I went 1/3 on Ace's Mail that I can't equip. Now if I can just get Botulus Rex down that will be all VW monsters cleared.

[Tile]

SE killed VWNM themself. if everything wasn't r/ex and near .5% drop rate people wouldn't mind doing any of them. But making 90% of it r/ex and with such a low drop rate no one is willing to do anything cept for Plates and Riftdross/cinders

[scaevola]

One could just as easily argue people are "giving up" on many VWNMs because they are slowly but surely getting the actual rare drops they want and subsequently having an ever-decreasing number of targets worth spending stones/dust on. It was fear of this that probably gave rise to VW drop rates as we know them to begin with.

If we've seen more Qilin shouts of late, it's because pouches are always going to be worth money.

[Hashmalum]

One could just as easily argue people are "giving up" on many VWNMs because they are slowly but surely getting the actual rare drops they want and subsequently having an ever-decreasing number of targets worth spending stones/dust on. It was fear of this that probably gave rise to VW drop rates as we know them to begin with.

If we've seen more Qilin shouts of late, it's because pouches are always going to be worth money.This possibility had occurred to me, yes. However, the recent announcement of Seekers of Adderall... Ritalin... whatever... and departure of Tanaka brought a number of players back to the game. I doubt they've all got all their Voidwatch rares already, but it is quite plausible they've either given up after dozens of attempts or looked at the testimonies of people who have 0/several hundred and gone "LOL, screw this".

[Dantedmc]

A lot of people blame it on the drop rate, but if it were reversed and everything was quickly attainable, people wouldn't be doing them as much either due to already having all the pieces they wanted, for example Abyssea. This doesn't mean I support horrible drop rates, I'm just saying that after a time people will do the event less and less for one reason or another unless it has a reason for continued interest / profit such as currency.

[scaevola]

This possibility had occurred to me, yes. However, the recent announcement of Seekers of Adderall... Ritalin... whatever... and departure of Tanaka brought a number of players back to the game. I doubt they've all got all their Voidwatch rares already, but it is quite plausible they've either given up after dozens of attempts or looked at the testimonies of people who have 0/several hundred and gone "LOL, screw this".

I don't know, man. Leaving aside the issue of whether enough people came back (right now) to trigger a noticeable bump in event participation at all, and whether enough of those people were "done" with Abyssea so as to devote themselves fully to spamming VW, issues I doubt either of us have the numbers to answer, I wonder how many of them quit recently enough to have started accruing stones, as none of the SoA returners I know did so.

Voidwatch is the most consistently-financially-rewarding event in the game outside of high-output Dynamis farming Random Player X is probably not going to be able to recreate; even if you never get a single noteworthy rare/ex in your life you'd be dumb to let your voidstones rot.

Occam's Razor, man. Your position requires a lot of assumptions to make work; mine can rely on the simple statement that I got a Ganesha's Mala last night and thus will never go out of my way to fight Hahava ever again.

[Komori]

Thing is, all of the voidwatch monsters with the desired drops have a chance drop at least something for a type of magian weapon (empyrean and other physical magian). And the fact that they'd added pulse cells, I have seen some people who have all drops from a monster join specifically for a chance at cells since they're so rare but can be sold for great amounts of money if you manage to obtain them. I just got Mekira body earlier today, and I only play mage jobs for the most part, but later when we did Qilin, someone claimed to be 0/800+ and finally broke down and bought 5 cells.

[scaevola]

And?

The argument is that people will inevitably stop doing most VWNMs, not that they'll stop doing any of them.

[Kysaiana]

There's definitely been a lull in VW shouts of any kind lately on Siren, at least when bother to stand around jeuno for any give amount of time. It's kind of a bummer too since I never got any of the Ogier's set besides the body. Eventually all VW will go the way of WoE and be completely dead content. I can't say when that will be, but I'm sure it will be at the very least after the new expansion is out.

As far as shouting yourself for crap, good luck. Sometimes my VW group will do some of the more unpopular VW fights and it will take hours to fill slots just because no one cares about it anymore. Horrible drop rates coupled with a lack of any "gil" drops means people just won't bother most of the time. Can't blame them. It's a waste of stones/dust.

[Komori]

My point that I was trying to make was in reference to the person that said if they had a high drop rate instead then everyone would get them, no one would do the mob and that's not true. If there was more of a chance to get them then we might actually see a steady supply of cells going to market and maybe even a decrease in price so that others besides "elite" could buy them and get them item if they really really have bad luck.

Abyssea might be dead for the most part, but it had so many great pieces of gear to be had, some that are even still being merced and sold. They should add all notable drops to the cell system and since there's no "pulse" in them, have them only need 1 cell to re-create and then people would have a reason to re-do other mobs for a chance of selling them.

Or it would give people like me hope on some mobs, before yesterday when I finally got Mekira. I continously would get Phasmida Belts which one of my friends needed and got at least two-three more mekira trying to obtain it. It would have been much easier to sell him one of the belts and at least be happy that I could make a friend happy while still rolling my dice at the casino.

[Cymmina]

Shout's depend on 2 thing's. People who shout for them and people waiting for the shout's to join them. Once the people that shout get what they want they don't shout for them any more. So the ppl that want gear, sitting around waiting for those shout's to come are just out of luck.
Guess what I'm saying is, become the shouter and not the guy waiting around.

Oh yes, because there are tons of people milling around Jeuno chomping at the bit to go fight Akupara for the opportunity to watch watch someone else get a Deluxe Animator while your box is full of logs. If VW had the standard loot system, my LS would be doing it right now instead of having everyone do it with shout groups of questionable quality in their free time.

Organizing a shout group is not an easy task, and you can't even reward yourself with one guaranteed item as payment for your efforts.


A lot of people blame it on the drop rate, but if it were reversed and everything was quickly attainable, people wouldn't be doing them as much either due to already having all the pieces they wanted, for example Abyssea. This doesn't mean I support horrible drop rates, I'm just saying that after a time people will do the event less and less for one reason or another unless it has a reason for continued interest / profit such as currency.

And when people finally got their W.Legs or Homam legs, how many stuck with their crappy sky/Limbus shells? People stop doing stuff once they or their friends get what they want. That's reality and it has nothing to do with drop rate.

[tyrantsyn]

Oh yes, because there are tons of people milling around Jeuno chomping at the bit to go fight Akupara for the opportunity to watch watch someone else get a Deluxe Animator while your box is full of logs. If VW had the standard loot system, my LS would be doing it right now instead of having everyone do it with shout groups of questionable quality in their free time.

Organizing a shout group is not an easy task, and you can't even reward yourself with one guaranteed item as payment for your efforts.
Well you could always use void clusters and low man it. And I'm sure there's other's out there that would be more than happy to get a D.Animator. It might be a situation of making a static in order to get the job done.



And when people finally got their W.Legs or Homam legs, how many stuck with their crappy sky/Limbus shells? People stop doing stuff once they or their friends get what they want. That's reality and it has nothing to do with drop rate.

ppl on my server still do these event's for these item's all the time. And while you can low man the pop item's I'm pretty sure you won't have a hard time finding ppl that wouldn't mind going up and giving Kirin what fur just because.

Also let me just add in that I also believe these drop rate's suck, and there is very little to drag most back out to fight's after the fact of getting the item's they desire. My server is okay on VW shout's. You see a lot of the normal's but you also see the oddball ones as well. If I was going to add a solution to the problem. I would just add VW drop's to other event's as time goes on. The Dev's have already said that if there's a drop off in VW participation they'd add HMP, cinder and dross in other area's so the supply would keep coming. Perhaps the same could be done for some of the more odd ball drop's ppl want but no one does.

[Vivivivi]

Most VW shouts on my server tend to be for Qilin or Uptala, although you will see shouts for the mobs that drop Ogier's, Athos or Rubeus pieces, and the occasional path clear.

I think what happens though is one person will really want one piece from VW, and will shout every day for that mob, when or if they finally get it and don't give up, they stop shouting for it.

I think VW is a lot of fun as is, I simply would like for an "add to lottable spoils" option on the rewards.

[Siviard]

I gave up on Voidwatch ages ago. Horrible system, horrible implementation, horrible treasure system (or lack therof in this case), horrible drop rates.

Did I say horrible???? I'll say it again, Voidwatch is horrible!!!

[Vagrua]

Mostly only Qilin is spammed on Bahamut. I do see lots of clear shouts though. Good to know people are trying to get those done. Most people gave up on Pil. I'm around 0/400+ on Tocis. -_-

[Waldrich]

In the near future, Heavy Metal Plates will cost like 300k each!!! Good luck 450mil or more for 95 upgrades!! yay

Square Enix always wait for that time to come out before making changes yay(2)!

[Mirage]

What if heavy metal plates are really common on the continent of audolin? :p.

[Demon6324236]

I am guessing that the void of which the VWNMs come from is the cause of the Metal being so heavy for its size, it was simply compressed on the other side in some way. If this is the case, the continent couldn't really have much of this metal. The only possible way would be for them to have had rifts in their region, at which point the monsters would be free and roaming over there it would seem. Then again that also would make sense on how strong things have to be over there for this content to really be for lv99 players right now, so could go either way in my eyes, though I rather doubt they have an abundance of it, if its cause is truly the void itself.

[Ryanx]

I think voidwatch should have been done with 1 loot pool but armor had higher drop rates if it just had 1 pool you could actuly do this with a linkshell and decide who gets what peice and go after peices for people.

[Sapphires]

Time is money and voidstones dont replenish fast enough for most people. If you want to make gil and suffer the wait to assemble an alliance for voidwatch then you do Qilin if you value your time and options to make gil with a limited stone supply.

Few can be bothered to setup or even manage find enough people for an alliance for clears so there isnt an influx of new people out there that can attend+have x6 stones+vw teleports lately. People get to Qilin and pretty much dont ever look back as far as going to other vw runs.

Also with a server primetime population of 1k-1200 people, its taking sometimes over an hour just to get enough people for a voidwatch run.

If they removed the purchase limit on weakeners and made more items convertable to pulse cells, i think it would reinvigorate participation some and we'd see people doing some more midrange tier vw.
As an example, I spammed stachysaurus until i got my ogiers hands, but theres no reason to ever bother doing him again, this is how alot of people feel about certain vwnms if there isnt something in the loot pool that can be pulse cell'd.

[Winrie]

On my server it's gone from extremely active voidwatch to nothing but qilin(and very few of them and only one guy is shouting ever) and an occasional kaggen. Jus the other day I seen an aello shout and that's the first I've seen in months, along with jueno t1-2 shouts least once every two weeks at most. Personally I have given up on voidwatch completely due to how many hours I've wasted trying to get pils body and boots, rubeus gear and aces mail ect. Out of months of dedicated spamming I've only come out with a akvan body and kaggens body and were talking damned near 300 kills here. I've run out of stones a few times and had to invest is dust to keep trying. So to answer the ops question, yes I've given up on voidwatch, I think most of my server has as well, sides metal plates which are rapidly decreasing in price. Pulse cells was a stupid concept they coulda did a better job at to make vw rewarding to even those who were done and looking to make Gil or get plates even. Being able to convert shit like Phasmida belt and mantis eye, aliyat chakram ect into one cell wouldn't have hurt no one at all, it would of made getting bodies more realistic, neither would it have killed them to make cells for rubeus, ogiers, and athos ect. Or even something to let us trade gear for metal pouches or something.

[Komori]

They should make cells for all voidwatch exclusive gear and weapons and change it to a 1:1 ratio or a 1:3 ration instead of 1:5 and increase drops across the board by at least 5% or at least remove synthesis/crystal petrifacts from HQ slot or allow voidwatch exclusive items possible to fall into all slots in the chest so that getting blue would actually be useful and would boost people to buy cobalt cells.

[Dawnn]

What if heavy metal plates are really common on the continent of audolin? :p.

OMG PLEASE! DEVS READ THIS! *hint hint*

[SNK]

Mostly only Qilin is spammed on Bahamut. I do see lots of clear shouts though. Good to know people are trying to get those done. Most people gave up on Pil. I'm around 0/400+ on Tocis. -_-


Welcome to the 0/400+ on Toci's club brother!

[Neisan_Quetz]

They should make cells for all voidwatch exclusive gear and weapons and change it to a 1:1 ratio or a 1:3 ration instead of 1:5 and increase drops across the board by at least 5% or at least remove synthesis/crystal petrifacts from HQ slot or allow voidwatch exclusive items possible to fall into all slots in the chest so that getting blue would actually be useful and would boost people to buy cobalt cells.

Where are people getting this? If petrifact shows up at the top, you didn't get a rare drop anyway, it's no different than emperor fish or kitron.

[Demon6324236]

The simple fix for the top slot is to make it always drop Mirrors, Sands, Metals, Cinders, or Dross, depending on the NM, unless you get a rare drop. It would make the top slot the most useful and so long as good items can drop in the other spots too they would get use as well.

[Vivivivi]

The fix is "add to lottable spoils" :P

Went back to back on getting ogier's leggings last night and the group wanted to throttle me.