Up the lvl to enter abyssea to 70 PLEASE

[jeopardy]

if anything we should be able to see party members stats, when looking at there bazzar/bio, to rid the game of gimps. if you book burn or cleave a job you should be made to suffer the long hours of skilling

[Rosina]

its part of the story line to enter @ 30 since you start it at 30. plus alot of the quests in abyssea are simple for a low lvl to do.
If they changed it to 70 they have to change the questline start point.

Its not an easy fix.

[Arcon]

How many times must these hater threads fly before they're forever banned?

[Daniel_Hatcher]

lol, get real!

I swear, it's the people that posts topics like this that are the gimps, if they really believe you can't skill up EASILY level 30~99

[Infidi]

It's not hard to skill up, nowadays more then ever with jewelry and food to help. I think there might be atma too? I forget. It's way too late in the game( pun intended :P ?) to change the level to enter. People are more often then not going to take the route of 30-99 then skill up.

[Luvbunny]

Yeah not this crap of a thread again... beating a dead horse over and over, like get over yourself OP, this is like done and done and so very done. Probably got butt hurt by some leechers, or keyers, and he could not leech or key himself.

[Kaisha]

If you raise Abyssea entry cap, all it'll do is just create cleave parties in GoV zones instead, and nothing is solved.

[jeopardy]

i just miss the good old days guys, sorry about the rant. come on you all know what im on about though. i got a tell asking me how TA works come one please

[jeopardy]

started playing in 2002 im capped on all, im saying that its too easy for people now 1-99 in aday come on. all im asking for is SE to show peoples stats in there bio to rid ptys of under skilled players

[jeopardy]

not the case at all, im saying under skilled players are killing other stuff in game, keying haha thanx for the offer but ill have to pass

[Kanjitai]

if anything we should be able to see party members stats, when looking at there bazzar/bio, to rid the game of gimps. if you book burn or cleave a job you should be made to suffer the long hours of skilling

I've burned a few jobs up through Abyssea and I'm just as good at those jobs as the ones I did the old school way before Abyssea. The reason why, I did research on each job after I burned it and before I played it. Remember the skill of the player is the main factor. If you have a bad player it doesn't matter if you grind or burn.

[Lynchilles]

not the case at all, im saying under skilled players are killing other stuff in game, keying haha thanx for the offer but ill have to pass

You're naive. Gimp/retarded players will be gimp/retarded players no matter how or where they level. It's just that with Abyssea, they level faster.

[hiko]

if anything we should be able to see party members stats, when looking at there bazzar/bio, to rid the game of gimps. if you book burn or cleave a job you should be made to suffer the long hours of skilling

lol skilling is not hard, leeched war for red proc (@90cap ) one day after i had all red proc, near capped GA skill (started from 0 since i lvled war to 37 when i started @ EU release and never touched it again)

[Morier]

You act like people not knowing about TA didn't exist before aby.

[Arcon]

You act like people not knowing about TA didn't exist before aby.

Choice quote by a certain Lv75 SAM main:
"Wiki says I can self-SC with Meikyo Shisui, but I don't have that WS."

[geekgirl101]

Actually Jeopardy, you asked SE to increase the entry for Abyssea to 70, and personally I'm with you on that. Originally the entry to Abyssea was 75. I don't know any of these quests you say that require you to enter Abyssea at an early level Arcon. I've done quite a lot and haven't come across those, but I have come across quests that require you to go into the past which is different place altogether as Abyssea is current day but in another dimension.

Abyssea is a lazy mans' way to get to 99, as are the level sync alliances inside dungeons doing repeated pages. I miss good old partying like back in the day when your job was a vital part of the party and everyone learned how to play their jobs and skilled up as they levelled up. To me it was more fun, I took part in skillchains and magic bursts (which I bet a lot of people don't remember anymore), I took risks when pulling mobs to camp, I balanced my spells and abilities to keep people alive without having to rest too much so we could chain the next mob.

All these skills are lost arts, and I'd love for them to find a place in FFXI once again as long as SE makes field of valor pages more appealing to encourage old school parties. The xp bonuses from field of valor pages is peanuts compared to the xp bonuses from grounds of valor pages and abyssea pages, plus the mob combinations in many of the pages are ridiculous, like the lizard + hare page in Valkurm. Yeah, let's make low level players to go to one side of the bat tunnel, fight lizards there, then travel through the bat tunnel where they get attacked by high level bats, avoid goblins as they reach the hare camp, then go back through the bat tunnel again to the lizards. Dreadful combination, way too much downtime in travelling back and forth, and then you wonder why nobody levels in Valkurm and spends their next 20+ levels instead in Gusgen Mines. Had the pages been designed to require mobs in the immediate area like lizards + goblins (level 10s can just about manage goblin ambushers that are very close to the Konschtat border), the xp from completing field of valor pages increase the more you complete them and stay in the zone like with the grounds of valor pages, and perhaps a special bonus for completing field of valor pages (maybe something like 10% more xp than a similar page from a grounds of valor page, or a daily regional point bonus), it may encourage people to explore and do them.

The other problem with old school levelling is that there is a cap on how much xp you earn from fighting a mob a few levels higher than you and that cap never gets any higher, so the higher the level you get the longer it takes to get 1 extra level even if you are constantly fighting mobs that are 4 levels higher than you. This is different in a lot of games where the higher level you get and the higher the level of the monster you fight, the more xp you earn. SE should change this so that it doesn't take an entire day at say level 75 to get to level 76 on just 200 xp per kill.

[Lollerblades]

I don't see a point in changing it - but by all means if you want to pt for 6+ hours and gain 2 levels go or it . I don't think anyone will stop you o/

[Tamoa]

Originally the entry to Abyssea was 75.

When was this?

[geekgirl101]

When was this?

Long time ago I heard.


I don't see a point in changing it - but by all means if you want to pt for 6+ hours and gain 2 levels go or it . I don't think anyone will stop you o/

A couple of months after people started doing Gusgen alliances I was with a level sync xp party in Valkurm. We were there for 3 hours I think and we gained 9 levels and had to move onto Qufim. At the same time the Gusgen alliance were needing a new sync, so we were roughly levelling at the same speed. The Gusgen alliance might've been levelling a bit faster, but we had the advantage of after about 7 or 8 hours with a couple of new syncs reached level 30 and our skills matching close to a level 30 instead of a level 20.

[Ica]

Originally the entry to Abyssea was 75.

Come again?


Long time ago I heard.

You heard really, really wrong. Also... Abyssea hasn't even been around for a "long time" considering how long the game has been out. Were you even playing prior to Abyssea?

[geekgirl101]

You heard really, really wrong. Also... Abyssea hasn't even been around for a "long time" considering how long the game has been out. Were you even playing prior to Abyssea?

Yes and no. I played years ago before WotG came out, then I quit the game and came back after Abyssea. I was told that the entry originally was 75, but they took the entry cap down to 30 and removed the WotG mission entry requirement after complaints and also took away the 1 page per game day from books so that people could spam books.

[Trisscar]

I don't see a point in changing it - but by all means if you want to pt for 6+ hours and gain 2 levels go or it . I don't think anyone will stop you o/

I strongly suspect the players here pinning for the Good Old Days forgotten just how terrible they really were.

And there were plenty of gimps around long before Aby.

[Tamoa]

Yes and no. I played years ago before WotG came out, then I quit the game and came back after Abyssea. I was told that the entry originally was 75, but they took the entry cap down to 30 and removed the WotG mission entry requirement after complaints and also took away the 1 page per game day from books so that people could spam books.

Abyssea has been level 30 from day 1.

[geekgirl101]

I strongly suspect the players here pinning for the Good Old Days forgotten just how terrible they really were.

And there were plenty of gimps around long before Aby.

I do remember the bad parts too, like hours spent shouting for specific jobs, hunting for camps and finding them all taken up, wipes in some out of reach parts with no nearby whms that you had to release and go all the way back again, competition for mobs, mage resting downtime, and level spread. Level syncing was supposed to aid with most of that, so that you could keep your levels together, and you could choose syncs for virtually any zone and not have to just rely on the one overcamped zone to level in, and the pages provide low level refresh and reraise. It's not as bad as it used to be and still requires using your noggin', that was until people decided to ally instead and fight easy prey instead of a 6-man team fighting IT. And you know what? I found that more fun and more rewarding than getting only 1-2 hits on a skeleton or running back and forth to the npcs in Abyssea for a new page only for it to be completed before I reach the rest of the alliance.

As for the gimps they were mostly the product of power levels overhealing to aggro so all they had to do was swing their weapons and not worry about outthreating the power leveller.

[geekgirl101]

Abyssea has been level 30 from day 1.

Hmm, maybe it was on the test server then.

[Arcon]

I don't know any of these quests you say that require you to enter Abyssea at an early level Arcon.

That wasn't me. And they meant that the quests do not involve fighting and can thus be done by a Level 30 player, not that they were intended for one.


When was this?

Never.


Hmm, maybe it was on the test server then.

No, the test server came out almost a year after Abyssea.

[geekgirl101]

It must've been higher than 30, because I'm pretty sure the mobs I fought that were originally part of the WotG mission chain that led to the entry requirement for the maws were higher than level 30, unless it was that in order to survive those missions you had to be 75 and then could enter Abyssea with any 30+ job. Either that or the guy who told me there was a level 75 entry cap and that you had to be on the cat sith mission to be able to start the missions to enter Aby was talking out of his backside.

[Demon6324236]

You never fight anything to get access into abyssea.

[geekgirl101]

I know you don't now, but I was originally told that before you got access to the Abyssea missions you had to be on the cat sith mission or higher. Maybe the guy who told me that either didn't have a clue himself or was referring to something else.

[Trisscar]

It must've been higher than 30, because I'm pretty sure the mobs I fought that were originally part of the WotG mission chain that led to the entry requirement for the maws were higher than level 30, unless it was that in order to survive those missions you had to be 75 and then could enter Abyssea with any 30+ job. Either that or the guy who told me there was a level 75 entry cap and that you had to be on the cat sith mission to be able to start the missions to enter Aby was talking out of his backside.

I strongly suspect it's the last sentence there.

[Tamoa]

I know you don't now, but I was originally told that before you got access to the Abyssea missions you had to be on the cat sith mission or higher. Maybe the guy who told me that either didn't have a clue himself or was referring to something else.

Getting to the Cait Sith mission in WotG doesn't require you to fight anything either, nor do you need to be of a specific minimum level.

[Trisscar]

I know you don't now, but I was originally told that before you got access to the Abyssea missions you had to be on the cat sith mission or higher. Maybe the guy who told me that either didn't have a clue himself or was referring to something else.
They were probably talking about Waste of Event.

[geekgirl101]

They were probably talking about Waste of Event.

LOL!!!! You referring to Walk of Echoes right? I was warned to stay away from that like it was the plague. Random strangers wandering in and looting on everything everyone else worked for, [No thanks].

[Ica]

They were probably talking about Waste of Event.

I can't believe I've never heard this before. So fitting!

[Luvbunny]

LOL!!!! You referring to Walk of Echoes right? I was warned to stay away from that like it was the plague. Random strangers wandering in and looting on everything everyone else worked for, [No thanks].

I think you were misinformed on a lot of things by your "random strangers" friend on Abyssea info, as well as Walk of Echoes, it is never a waste of events since you get tons of craps plus some very good ones that still sell millions on AH - which pretty much also apply to Voidwatch events. It is also an alternate way to skill ups beside Besieged. The reason only japan players do this is because it takes a few extra steps to get there and most western players just too lazy to do that. Newly revamped Walk of Echoes is a lot more fun.

[Rosina]

I've burned a few jobs up through Abyssea and I'm just as good at those jobs as the ones I did the old school way before Abyssea. The reason why, I did research on each job after I burned it and before I played it. Remember the skill of the player is the main factor. If you have a bad player it doesn't matter if you grind or burn.

he isn't saying that... but tbh if u only read up on a job... you just mimic what u read... learning by doing is in some cases better and shows ur less lazy. But what he saying is all the "new school" ppl don;t get is we vets have to teach ppl @ cap what their jobs skills do. which barely happen till leeching was "ok" There is more to rpg/mmorpg then lvl cap and endgame. I seen level 50s with out a sub job... as a vet player i find that silly. I see cap blue mages w/o blue magic spells, i see that as weak. @ 99 in good gear if ur weapon skill is low you still are worthless all lvl does is slightly raise stats att and def.

[Rosina]

I don't see a point in changing it - but by all means if you want to pt for 6+ hours and gain 2 levels go or it . I don't think anyone will stop you o/

this is was never the case, and they raised exp amounts.
You prob just had bad parties with ppl who back then got away with leeching before wiki was out.

[Trisscar]

this is was never the case, and they raised exp amounts.
You prob just had bad parties with ppl who back then got away with leeching before wiki was out.

Yes, it very much was the case. It was a very rare party you could join and gain more than a couple levels in it, in more than a few you could sometimes walk away with a lower level than what you went in with. This, of course, was after flagging/building a party for hours on.

And that was only if you were on one of maybe five jobs.

I'm still waiting for the GOD adherents to explain how this was more preferable to current party system.

[geekgirl101]

Funnily enough it was a western American who told me all this too, that FFXIV was so badly broken that SE threw a carrot to the players to stop them from storming off so they dropped the level entry in FFXI to Abyssea from 75 to 30 and made the books repeatable, and to avoid WoE. Guess I'll start joining them and wave 2 virtual fingers in his direction.

[Luvbunny]

Go do WoE around 8am-12pm ish EST time, which is nite time in Japan, that's where most people are there or during weekends. Its a great source of income for some people so they make sure no one else bother to do it so that not to crash the market since a lot of void watch items are crashing down in price due to market flooding.

[Lynchilles]

If I want to learn something about a job (like for example how SA/TA work) I just grab a friend or two (or even solo), go out to an area with some EP mobs, and mess around with the mechanics and gear to understand it better. If I need more help, I'll read up on it in a wiki.

I don't see why it is necessary for me to learn these things in an 6-man non-Abyssea experience points party somewhere between level 30 and 70.

To reiterate: there will always be unskilled/gimps whether the level cap for Abyssea is 30 or if its 70+

[Anapingofness]

http://limewoody.files.wordpress.com/2006/03/aw_jeez_not_this_shit_again2.jpg

^Well put.

People seriously need to get over Abyssea. If anything is done to it then it should be something to improve it, not make it worse. Having level 30's in Abyssea does not prevent people from being gimp nor does it really do much otherwise. Leave the level of entry alone. =_+;;

[Zerich]

It must've been higher than 30, because I'm pretty sure the mobs I fought that were originally part of the WotG mission chain that led to the entry requirement for the maws were higher than level 30, unless it was that in order to survive those missions you had to be 75 and then could enter Abyssea with any 30+ job. Either that or the guy who told me there was a level 75 entry cap and that you had to be on the cat sith mission to be able to start the missions to enter Aby was talking out of his backside.

troll poster is a troll

but this is a troll thread, so...

(btw, what's a western american?)

[FrankReynolds]

troll poster is a troll

but this is a troll thread, so...

(btw, what's a western american?)

Someone from California? Who knows.


I Vote that they create a script that automatically deletes any thread / post relating to Abyssea Level caps.

There is a huge problem with this line of thinking anyways:

Anyone who thinks that you need to spend large amounts of time leveling a job in order to get your skills up, or learn to play your job, is clearly someone who doesn't level their skills (if they did, they would know how easy it is) and / or has a learning disability (you can learn almost everything from wikis) that keeps them from quickly grasping game mechanics. Which means that they are probably someone who you would not want to spend large amounts of time in a six man party with (or any other event for that matter). The irony being that the people who want to get rid of abyssea xp are most likely the people who made six man parties suck so bad that most people never want to do them again.

OP is his own worst enemy.

[RAIST]

Pandora's Box....all that needs to be said about it. And if you don't understand that.../facepalm.

As for the whole bit about WotG requirements for abyssea access....that wasn't any gameplay requirement, it was an INSTALLATION requirement. You had to have the expansion installed so the game could recycle it's assets. Sometimes I wonder if people even RTFM, or at least the requirements notice (like all those that claim their fairly currnt PC can't run FFXI).

[Xantavia]

I'm still waiting for the GOD adherents to explain how this was more preferable to current party system.
I don't think anybody is asking for the lower xp rates or long invite rates (which I never experienced, even though blu was my first 75). What I liked was the sense of working together as a group to take down a mob. Now, it feels like a bunch of people soloing who just happen to be in the same party. You used to be expected to be a contributing member to the success, and if you were discovered to be AFK for too long, you got the boot.

Just for a minute forget about the amount of xp you got then or now. Do you (generic you, not directed at Trisscar specifically) think one method was more fun than the other?

[geekgirl101]

btw, what's a western american?

Someone who lives in PST as opposed to someone who lives in EST.

btw why do people say that these posts are "troll posts"? Isn't is obvious that a fair number of people prefer the old system because it made them feel useful and that this sitting in Aby all day having someone kill mobs for you isn't "playing the game"? When my husband started playing again last year he cancelled his account because he said and I quote "it isn't a game anymore, I don't get to play my role because the mobs die before I can attack, where is the fun in having someone else level for you?" I would really like the old system back, but I'd like it to have some major changes to it so it's not a horrendous grind the higher the level you go and doesn't take all day to find people to team up with.

[Jackstin]

I fully support this so long as they come up with a fun and interesting way to level up to 70. Too many of the cool exp options are weighted towards the later levels. FoV and GoV are a basic idea and it can last a little way, but its still not interesting, especially when you have 20 jobs to get to level 99.

[Luvbunny]

I would really like the old system back, but I'd like it to have some major changes to it so it's not a horrendous grind the higher the level you go and doesn't take all day to find people to team up with.

The last thing I would like to have is the old system back, NO MORE - GOOD RIDDANCE, I am sorry but grinding for level is NOT FUN or it was ever fun to begin with. I want to do other things, exploring, crafting, missions, bcnms, all the various end game activities, but please no more of these so called level grinding to 99. If you do not know how to play your jobs, then its your own fault for not making an effort to research read and practice. Stop blaming others for leeching etc... This is just a video game, this is not a brain surgery, should not take that long to understand the gameplay mechanic. If you need time to practice, there are various activities that let you just do that. So let's all take instant level to 99 and have fun immediately, not two years later after you created your character.

[Limecat]

http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/5681/ralphno.jpg

[Arcon]

btw why do people say that these posts are "troll posts"? Isn't is obvious that a fair number of people prefer the old system because it made them feel useful and that this sitting in Aby all day having someone kill mobs for you isn't "playing the game"? When my husband started playing again last year he cancelled his account because he said and I quote "it isn't a game anymore, I don't get to play my role because the mobs die before I can attack, where is the fun in having someone else level for you?" I would really like the old system back, but I'd like it to have some major changes to it so it's not a horrendous grind the higher the level you go and doesn't take all day to find people to team up with.

I have no issues whatsoever with people wanting to EXP the old way. I know plenty of people who do just that, because they dislike Abyssea for it. I also don't have a problem with people asking for old EXP back, even though that is objectively pointless, because old EXP is not gone at all. The only thing I have a problem with is stating that old EXP was somehow building better players and the new way to EXP is a mass-production of noobs. These statements are stupid, and people making those statements deserve to be called out on it.

I fully acknowledge that Abyssea EXP is less "playing" the game than other EXP and more like letting other people play for you. And that is perfectly fine with me. EXP is the one aspect of FFXI that I have always hated. If I can get someone else to do it for me, I'll gladly do it, I'll even pay them to, which I did more than once. I simply don't think that all parts of the game are worth playing, and EXP is one of those parts.

[Rosina]

Yes, it very much was the case. It was a very rare party you could join and gain more than a couple levels in it, in more than a few you could sometimes walk away with a lower level than what you went in with. This, of course, was after flagging/building a party for hours on.

And that was only if you were on one of maybe five jobs.

I'm still waiting for the GOD adherents to explain how this was more preferable to current party system.

it was perfered because it taught you how to play ur class in line with other jobs.. you never blindely zerged as you do now. ppl talked and gave tips to each other on how to better play.

You guys in the wiki generation are lucky... we didn't have a 1 stop shop online to learn our classes we had to do trial and error. I perfer it because u can infact weed out the "gimps" and the "leeches" if u was either or both everyone knew it. PPl made u work for ur stuff... now i see ppl leech content cuz of the proc system...

[Rosina]

@ acron tell tgat to my book burn party... we had a smn using fire spirit... they was pulling bendersnatches nearling wiping the party every 4th pull.

how is THAT not mass producing noobs... i left after I got 1 lvl...

" I fully acknowledge that Abyssea EXP is less "playing" the game than other EXP and more like letting other people play for you. And that is perfectly fine with me. EXP is the one aspect of FFXI that I have always hated. If I can get someone else to do it for me, I'll gladly do it, I'll even pay them to, which I did more than once. I simply don't think that all parts of the game are worth playing, and EXP is one of those parts."

this would be noob talk back then and showed how u was a lazy person... why would ppl even want you in doing end game if "you don't feel like doing the work" exp gain is part of the rpg... ever since D&D... are you gonna play that and tell ur DM that u gonna leech... u'd be kicked out...

[Arcon]

@ acron tell tgat to my book burn party... we had a smn using fire spirit... they was pulling bendersnatches nearling wiping the party every 4th pull.

What's wrong with Fire Spirits? Did it occur to you to tell them not to pull Bandersnatchers? Maybe he didn't know, if no one told him? And if he did know and still did it he's simply an idiot, and no amount of old school EXP will help with that affliction. In a party three years ago he may have pulled Valkurm Emperor with a confused look on his face "where the hell is everyone running".

For every example of a new era noob I can show you two old school noobs. One example or two or three or fifty examples change nothing. There's no discussion here. Abyssea doesn't magically reduce your IQ somehow and make you stupid. If you're stupid, you'll be stupid no matter how you EXP. If you're willing to learn your job you'll do it regardless of how you EXP. The only reason I can imagine there being more high level noobs now is that people who were bad before were simply not allowed in parties and were never able to reach 75 and quit out of boredom.

Edit to reply to your edit:

" I fully acknowledge that Abyssea EXP is less "playing" the game than other EXP and more like letting other people play for you. And that is perfectly fine with me. EXP is the one aspect of FFXI that I have always hated. If I can get someone else to do it for me, I'll gladly do it, I'll even pay them to, which I did more than once. I simply don't think that all parts of the game are worth playing, and EXP is one of those parts."

this would be noob talk back then and showed how u was a lazy person...

I am a lazy person, extremely lazy. But laziness has nothing to do with noobs.


why would ppl even want you in doing end game if "you don't feel like doing the work"

Because I'm a really good player and I can do my job. And I never let other people down, I don't quit after I get what I want if I don't feel I didn't repay my debt to the people who helped me get it.


exp gain is part of the rpg... ever since D&D... are you gonna play that and tell ur DM that u gonna leech... u'd be kicked out...

I couldn't care less about D&D or what you consider RPG. I don't play FFXI because it's an RPG, I play it because there's things about it that I enjoy. EXP isn't one of those things, so why should I play it? EXP gives me nothing. No fun and no feeling of accomplishment. And it doesn't make me a better player.

[Zerich]

@ acron tell tgat to my book burn party... we had a smn using fire spirit... they was pulling bendersnatches nearling wiping the party every 4th pull.

how is THAT not mass producing noobs... i left after I got 1 lvl...

" I fully acknowledge that Abyssea EXP is less "playing" the game than other EXP and more like letting other people play for you. And that is perfectly fine with me. EXP is the one aspect of FFXI that I have always hated. If I can get someone else to do it for me, I'll gladly do it, I'll even pay them to, which I did more than once. I simply don't think that all parts of the game are worth playing, and EXP is one of those parts."

this would be noob talk back then and showed how u was a lazy person... why would ppl even want you in doing end game if "you don't feel like doing the work" exp gain is part of the rpg... ever since D&D... are you gonna play that and tell ur DM that u gonna leech... u'd be kicked out...

This is really funny, because everything that you say is lazy, inefficient, noob-talk for current-day ffxi. In-fact, you are living proof that you can level up the old way and still be a terrible player.

And what the hell is it with you referencing other rpgs to try and get your p.o.v. across?

D&D =/= FFXI
FFXIV =/= FFXI

The game has evolved, you haven't. Two words: Haste-gear.

[Kristal]

While I agree that Abyssea needs a lvl 70 level requirement, it should have been done from the start. Changing it now is pointless. The damage has been done, and it would be unfair for new players (or anyone that didn't level all their jobs to 99) to suddenly increase it. The market for leveling gear and items was annihilated, save a few that are usefull at any level.

[Komori]

What people really don't realize is if they raise it now. People will make cleaves in Gusgen and bring back Astral Flow and RMT will take up that; and we'll fuel the RMT market and get levels that way.

[Camiie]

People who propose these changes are just lazy and want everything handed to them. They don't want to have to put forth any effort to get good players to choose from. Maybe they'd like to be able to go to their moogle and have him teleport good players to their mog house for free? Just push a button and have an uber WHM appear out of nowhere? Where's the challenge in that?

Sarcasm aside, while you're asking for people to be forced to level in a way that you deem appropriate, what are YOU doing to help people to rise to YOUR standard in the meantime? Are you building skill up alliances? When you see people who are in sub-par gear do you offer to help them improve? Or do you just think lolGIMP and go on to make posts like this?

[tyrantsyn]

Last 9 thread's like this fail, hmmmmm

:D

10th times the charm

[Trisscar]

Last 9 thread's like this fail, hmmmmm

:D

10th times the charm

It appears not.

[Andreja]

It's not rocket science to learn how to play your job efficiently, even with GoV book burns and aby burns. There's always going to be bad players in any mmo you play, no matter how they gain their xp. Even with the old-school way, there's always been bads in the game. If anything, the new ffxi just makes them stand out more since they can level fast and get into end-game quicker. There's really no point to change the lvl requirements of abyssea now sense it's become the new standard, and won't make anyone better at their jobs. Bads will always be bad. Stop beating this dead horse of a topic already, there's no reason to do anything about it.

[Tsukino_Kaji]

if anything we should be able to see party members stats, when looking at there bazzar/bio, to rid the game of gimps. if you book burn or cleave a job you should be made to suffer the long hours of skillingYes SE, please let us get rid of this one burn method so we can all go to GoV or even back to smn burn instead.

[nyheen]

dont think most people dont understand. we just want the challenge like the way it was back in the old school pt. we not talking about going back too 150-200 exp a kill on IT mobs. but the kinda fun we had in the old days of exping.

now n days it all about leeching/keying, afking, you tell me what kinda of challenge is that? this is mainly happening in abyssea cause anyone can enter at 30+. even in GOV and FoV people just leeching there, also spaming easy prey mobs is really no challenge,
when i started a pt with 6 members. (took a long time getting members cause abyssea leech/key only people) at 34+ we was getting like 600+ a kill chains. oh + pages with 2 healer 4 DD, could make any set up work if try. anyways it was FUN & challenging.

most of the people that dont want it at 70+ abyssea only because they lazy and wanna leech to 99. that like if i was to buy FF 13 and put a game shark code right at the start for max stat etc, would be a boring game.lol

[Tsukino_Kaji]

dont think most people dont understand. we just want the challenge like the way it was back in the old school pt. we not talking about going back too 150-200 exp a kill on IT mobs. but the kinda fun we had in the old days of exping.You obviously don't know what a challange is then. This was pointless grind that was, all be it accidently, gotten rid of. Having to take 1 month to a year to level a job dose not add difficulty to a game, it's nothing more then a time sink in order to gain access to the game's other time sinks. Leveling a job in is no way, shape or form a challange.

Edit: FFXIII was a boring game and deserves to be hacked. Linier leveling is a stupid and lazy was to artificialy inflate the difficulty from people who can't figure out how to construct a propor game. If I want to be lvl50 right after the theater ship crashes in FFIX, I can. If I want to to get Ridia Meteo before I even get Tellah, I can. If I want to be lvl99 5-7 hours after I hit 30, I can. t's your choise weither you want ot grind of not. You're free to go solo that job to 99.

[Gannon]

Things are only a challenge when they're new. It doesn't take long for people to figure out the easiest way to do something and stick to that method until an even easier one is discovered. Endgame and exp are no different in that regards.
The option of old school PTs never went away either. If you want to fight IT++'s in 6 man pts all you need to do is find 5 like minded people on your server.

[Zerich]

Things are only a challenge when they're new. It doesn't take long for people to figure out the easiest way to do something and stick to that method until an even easier one is discovered. Endgame and exp are no different in that regards.
The option of old school PTs never went away either. If you want to fight IT++'s in 6 man pts all you need to do is find 5 like minded people on your server.

some people just really want to smack crabs for hours on end...let them.

[thinktank909]

It is easy make it lvl 30 to enter, but to be fair lvl 61 to exp.

[Dreamin]

Did I miss something? How many of these threads do we need to see?

Last I've seen, those colibris/imps camp are all wide open. For those ppl who love and desired to do the old style xp party, here's your chance. No more worry that when you get to camp, there would be 5 other groups there all fighting for the repops. Have fun and enjoy yourselves while you're at it.

[Luvbunny]

dont think most people dont understand. we just want the challenge like the way it was back in the old school pt. we not talking about going back too 150-200 exp a kill on IT mobs. but the kinda fun we had in the old days of exping.

You want challenge? Go do Legion!! Please don't be lazy and do a lot of legion and all these so called neo anything without hacking. That should give you plenty of challenge, while you are at it try to get your shiny weapon and armors, should be challenge enough for you. Leveling to 99 should not be a challenge or grind. The game has evolved since 2010, get with the program dude, or find those delusional people who still yearn for the good old days and make your own old school anything with them. I am sure you can find 5 other like minded persons for that. OPTIONS are the new deal now, fast, convenience and fun. Now that the unmentionable is properly resigned, hopefully the future will be bright and a whole lot more fun activities similar to abyssea crack.

[Merton9999]

I swear people asking for Abyssea level caps never did anything in the game except xp parties. SE announced before Abyssea was released that the focus of the game was going to switch to end-game events. They followed up on this well. XP became an obstacle to get to the actual game, not the game itself. Leveling was made appropriately easier so that people could actually play new content using a variety of jobs that most people previously never experienced a fifth of.

The mistake people are making is thinking only about old xp parties as "the game" and assuming when that changed that nothing was created to provide that sense of teamwork and participation. I won't go as far as saying they're challenging, but Abyssea empyrean gear NMs and Voidwatch NMs provide as much potential to learn a job, work as a team and participate as beating on plants and crabs ever did. What's better, they also let you earn gil and gear at the same time you're partying, and you can fight monsters that actually look like monsters instead of household pets.

Personally I think of my time in actual events like Neo-Nyzule, Voidwatch, ADL, Sea, and Abyssea item farming as a vacation from real life. When I go on vacation I take a plane or car to get there, then enjoy the hell out of the event by participating in as much as I can when I'm there. Insisting people xp the old way is like telling people they need to walk to Disneyworld. Riding in a plane isn't the lazy man's way to get to his vacation - it's the affluent smart man's way.

[nyheen]

You want challenge? Go do Legion!! Please don't be lazy and do a lot of legion and all these so called neo anything without hacking. That should give you plenty of challenge, while you are at it try to get your shiny weapon and armors, should be challenge enough for you. Leveling to 99 should not be a challenge or grind. The game has evolved since 2010, get with the program dude, or find those delusional people who still yearn for the good old days and make your own old school anything with them. I am sure you can find 5 other like minded persons for that. OPTIONS are the new deal now, fast, convenience and fun. Now that the unmentionable is properly resigned, hopefully the future will be bright and a whole lot more fun activities similar to abyssea crack.

talking about low/mid lvl. all of that stuff is endgame but ya they do give a great challenge if people would stop cheating on it

[Luvbunny]

talking about low/mid lvl. all of that stuff is endgame but ya they do give a great challenge if people would stop cheating on it

Game has changed, there is no longer low and mid level challenge unless you want to do bcnm battle or just level synch and do FoV old school party (can also do GoV old school party). There is also moblin maze maker if you want another variety of fun with level synch or assault with a level synch. The bottom line is this, people value their time, they want to get rewarded with something they can use, since low level and mid level barely exits - interests are almost non existent to do those things because the gears are outdated very quickly. Bcnms and Assaults are still valid since they have other drops/incentive that are valid for end game (ninja scroll, assault point for salvage). This upcoming update with the Heroines BCNM should give you some fun to do.

[SpankWustler]

dont think most people dont understand. we just want the challenge like the way it was back in the old school pt. we not talking about going back too 150-200 exp a kill on IT mobs. but the kinda fun we had in the old days of exping.

The only challenges I remember from those days were ones imposed on me by really horrible people I was stuck in a party with.

The White Mage who preferred to Silence bats rather than cast spells such as Cure III and Haste and Dia II. Actually, I met two of these within a week. My friend suggested they were each-others' Adventuring Fellows and thus blameless for their bad AI.

Legions of people who were seemingly allergic to all food items. A gazillion dumb hippies who think they have Celiac Disease existed in Vana'diel before the modern world, apparently.

A thousand healers who wandered away from their computers for a thousand years each. This a hyperbole, obviously, but I like that it sounds more like an ancient proverb this way.

The Red Mage who cast En-Aero and engaged a Puk. After an hour, someone else finally noticed this and found it less amusing than myself. Several strangely racist insults later, he began casting the en-spell for the current Vana'diel day instead. For the first time in my life, I read the label on a bottle of cologne to find out if drinking it would blind me.

Unfortunately, it did not. I met the thousand-and-first wandering healer the next day. Damn my eyes.

I'll admit that sometimes the parties with no one like the individuals mentioned above could be fun if somebody I liked to talk to was around, but usually, it just felt efficient because nobody was doing anything stupid. A lot like working on an assembly line in a solid workplace.

There's nothing wrong with liking that kind of thing, but it's not right to equate being present at a keyboard to poke at some buttons now and again with challenge. Not that there are many challenging activities in Final Fantasy XI, but fighting your ten-thousandth bat or crab is really the most mindless thing possible.

Coincidentally, meeting people like that is the main reason I am very happy it is possible to streamline leveling up now.

[Rosina]

If I want to learn something about a job (like for example how SA/TA work) I just grab a friend or two (or even solo), go out to an area with some EP mobs, and mess around with the mechanics and gear to understand it better. If I need more help, I'll read up on it in a wiki.

I don't see why it is necessary for me to learn these things in an 6-man non-Abyssea experience points party somewhere between level 30 and 70.

To reiterate: there will always be unskilled/gimps whether the level cap for Abyssea is 30 or if its 70+

this game was out b4 wiki... so we old school vets had to learn the hard way. Now a days its pretty much ever question is met with "look up wiki". kinda shitty tbh but o well.

also personal experience in some cases beats reading and mimicing...

much like ppl coulda figured out the /fume trick just by messing around....

now a days ppl just read wiki vs experiment.

[Rosina]

some people just really want to smack crabs for hours on end...let them.

you do realise this opinion is contradictory cuz all ppl do is kill (or leech) skeleton for hours on end. then kill crawlers and bees for hours on end, then skill worms/bluffolo/dolls hours on end.

6man you killed worms mandies crabs lizards fish giga crawlers, crawler who spit fire, imps, flies.

you infactr barely fought crabs unless u was ina skill up party...

all ppl do is exp in 2 caves and 1 of 3 aby zones. tbh book burning dull compared to 6 man where every 10 lvls you was somplace different.

[Komori]

you do realise this opinion is contradictory cuz all ppl do is kill (or leech) skeleton for hours on end. then kill crawlers and bees for hours on end, then skill worms/bluffolo/dolls hours on end.

6man you killed worms mandies crabs lizards fish giga crawlers, crawler who spit fire, imps, flies.

you infactr barely fought crabs unless u was ina skill up party...

all ppl do is exp in 2 caves and 1 of 3 aby zones. tbh book burning dull compared to 6 man where every 10 lvls you was somplace different.

Are you joking? You encountered Dunes Crabs, Qufim Crabs, Kuftal, Boyahda and probably more than that.

I just can't recall them off the top of my head, and since old-school leveling took forever, that was weeks to a month or so for each stage of ten levels in each of those zones. Screw you, it was only crabs, birds and mandies for levels until imps.

[Meyi]

Do you really think upping the limit will keep leeches out of Abyssea? AHAHAH! Please. At least keyers at level 30 help contribute to the party.

Protip: unless you're maxed or almost maxed on your gear, atmas, skills, and merits, you're a leech.

[Lynchilles]

this game was out b4 wiki... so we old school vets had to learn the hard way. Now a days its pretty much ever question is met with "look up wiki". kinda shitty tbh but o well.

also personal experience in some cases beats reading and mimicing...

much like ppl coulda figured out the /fume trick just by messing around....

now a days ppl just read wiki vs experiment.

How do you make such broad sweeping generalizations with zero support?

Also, how does "testing job abilities/weaponskills out for oneself" not equate to "personal experience"?

I understand how people learned jobs back in the "old school" because I did it to. However the game has changed. Why must someone only learn how to play their job the "old school" way? Why is that better than researching it on their own? looking it up on wiki? asking a friend/mentor via chat? etc. There is now more information available for people to learn how to play a job effectively and this is a good thing rather than an inconvenience.

This thread is effing retarded just like every other thread on the subject. Raising the level cap for Abyssea will do absolutely nothing. People will still find a way to get fast exp with minimal effort (such as book-burning, astral flows, whatever).

To the OP and everyone that agrees with him: Stop force-feeding people the bullsh*t that all players must level in 6-man experience points parties like was done in "old school FFXI" in order to learn how to play their job. It a f*cking absurd argument.

[Vivik]

we old school vets had to learn the hard way.

Rosina, you are the poster child of what not to do in this game.

I cannot believe you keep using the "we vets" shit in here. You are the perfect example of someone that has no clue even though they leveled the old way. I would really hate to see the kind of "advice" you give people.

[hiko]

this game was out b4 wiki... so we old school vets had to learn the hard way. Now a days its pretty much ever question is met with "look up wiki". kinda shitty tbh but o well.

.

you haven't learned anything, if you had, you'd swap gear.

[Trisscar]

Now a days its pretty much ever question is met with "look up wiki".
If someone asks me for advice and I can answer them I will. If I can't answer them I'll refer them to someone else. In any case, I'll still provide them with a link to the wiki.

Why shouldn't I provide someone with such a valuable tool?


now a days ppl just read wiki vs experiment.

And people shouldn't learn from the experience of others.... Because?

[Andreja]

now a days ppl just read wiki vs experiment.

Maybe you should "experiment" with gear swap macros, and see how much of a difference it really makes on your damage and abilities. People like you show that this thread has no purpose really since people who are too lazy to learn how to maximize their performance on their job will not do any better even with all that time spent with old-school partying.

[FrankReynolds]

Ahh yes, I remember the good old days before wiki, back when you could get useful advice from your fellow player instead of being forced to follow links to some cold, useless wiki. Here is some great advice I've received in parties. See if you can figure out why learning in parties sucks.

"You should sub WHM on paladin. That way you can cure yourself more."
"Blu is a mage job. Please get back with the RDM and help cure."
"please cast bio, not dia. Bio does more damage."
as level 30 thief "There's no point in lining up. SA/TA does more damage if you use them separately."
"beastmaster needs chr. you should sub bard when you solo."
"Bard should not be pulling. Thief go pull a colibri"
"We should party in present day misereaux coast at birds. The mobs in abyssea only give like 30-40 xp."

[Trisscar]

"Blu is a mage job. Please get back with the RDM and help cure."


People actually said that? Wow.

[FrankReynolds]

People actually said that? Wow.

Lol yeah, one group actually tried to make me get off nin sub and go /blm.

[SpankWustler]

6man you killed worms mandies crabs lizards fish giga crawlers, crawler who spit fire, imps, flies.

you infactr barely fought crabs unless u was ina skill up party...

Some of the monsters listed here didn't even exist until Treasures of Aht Urhgan. Others were only fought for a short time in one location at a low level. Crawlers make me think, "I loved fighting those because they weren't crabs!"

What did people fight before imps existed? More crabs. What did people often fight at the higher levels that were more time-consuming? More crabs. What did people fight after graduating from crabs? Various animated weapons forever and ever.

The further back in time you go, the less adaptable and more monotonous gaining levels and merits was. There's a reason that some people have a very strong and often very bad memory of fighting the same thing over and over. That monster was one of the only two options in the whole game, and the other option required at least a half-hour's walk.


this game was out b4 wiki... so we old school vets had to learn the hard way. Now a days its pretty much ever question is met with "look up wiki". kinda shitty tbh but o well.

also personal experience in some cases beats reading and mimicing...

much like ppl coulda figured out the /fume trick just by messing around....

now a days ppl just read wiki vs experiment.

And people were terrible at Final Fantasy XI. Flatly terrible. I was terrible. Almost everyone I met was terrible.

What works in Final Fantasy XI just isn't apparent to the naked eye in most cases. Very little is displayed and the Development Bros have rarely explained how mechanics work. Because of that, experimenting usually has to involve recording a lot of data.

Why would people even try random emotes towards Voidexhibitionists with no indication that such action would do anything? No monster within Voidwatch, no NPC within Voidwatch, no deranged Development Bro who birthed Voidwatch; not a single one of those said anything about emoting towards the monsters.

Trying new things generally doesn't involve running around naked with a chocolate sundae on your head with a Siberian dwarf hamster on that sundae in the place of a Maraschino cherry because you've never done that before. It generally involves trying things that, based on some form of reasoning, a bro thinks might work or give him or her pleasure.

Actually, after thinking about the latter, I urgently need to go buy a Siberian dwarf hamster and some ice cream leaving me unable to finish thi

[Trisscar]

Lol yeah, one group actually tried to make me get off nin sub and go /blm.

I know I'm going to regret asking, but dare I ask why they did so?

Now Rosina, when I first started playing Blue Mage 4 years ago in the Titan server the general advice when I asked was "Don't level BLU, it's a lol job" and other such 'helpful' advice. So I had no one to help guide me and no parties to level in since no one recruited Blue Mages for experience points.

If not for the many different wiki out there, I doubt I would have been able to take Blue Mage as far as I have. The persistence has paid off, these days I feel like a juiced up HNM and I have gotten the last laugh in the end.

[hiko]

I know I'm going to regret asking, but dare I ask why they did so?



because it's called blue MAGE and not blu KNIGHT? and had no idea of its melee capacity
hope it was back when blu was a new job

[Trisscar]

hope it was back when blu was a new job

I wish it was, as well. But the mentality of "If you have MP you're a healer" persisted up to when Aby came around, so it wasn't. Another demonstration of why people who hold the view proposed by the original poster have no clue.

[Tsukino_Kaji]

Lol yeah, one group actually tried to make me get off nin sub and go /blm.Makes me think of a LS member who was just saying, back in the day, they were kicked out of an XP pt on DRG for being /sam and not /war.

[FrankReynolds]

It was back when blu was first release. It had been out for maybe 6 weeks.

[Kagetachi]

started playing in 2002 im capped on all, im saying that its too easy for people now 1-99 in aday come on. all im asking for is SE to show peoples stats in there bio to rid ptys of under skilled players

so your on a Japanese account then?
and TA worked totally differently back in 2002.

[Kagetachi]

Hmm, maybe it was on the test server then.

The test server came out after all of Abyssea was released

[Kagetachi]

this game was out b4 wiki... so we old school vets had to learn the hard way. Now a days its pretty much ever question is met with "look up wiki". kinda shitty tbh but o well.

also personal experience in some cases beats reading and mimicing...

much like ppl coulda figured out the /fume trick just by messing around....

now a days ppl just read wiki vs experiment.

um actually, there were information sites out long before this game came to NA. overall, the wiki was just a reposting of those sites.
mysterytour, seems to have gone offline long ago
somepage.com is still active and predated the wiki.
there are also countless JP sites that have been around for a long time

[Spiritreaver]

dont think most people dont understand. we just want the challenge like the way it was back in the old school pt.....

You said other stuff, but i stopped right there. And i think i DO understand. EXP flows like wine at a frat-house now...but it didn't for you and yours? sheesh...

You like challenges, how about this-would you consider the following having been a challenge?

Back in the day when i was lvling my THF(which was 'subjob only' to most), i had all of 2 parties from 61-75. Had to to get the vast majority of that exp from killing EP mobs. There was no such thing as exp rings or fov/gov pages of burns of any kind and there had been no adjustment to boost exp. Come home from work, spend hours flag up, killing EPs. For months. Even my LS at the time wouldn't invite me to exp...

Well? What do you think? Did i get good at the mechanics of THF during the obscene amount of time it took me to get THF 75? You bet i did. Was it a challenge? I surely think it was. Since i did it that way, it should be good enough for everyone else too right? Way wrong.

FFXI isn't brain surgery. All the jobs are variations on a theme and fall into DD, healer, buffer, or tank; or some mixture thereof. Having it take a rl year to reach max lvl cap was a challenge, but it wasn't an ideal one then and an even worse one now. Took forever but eventually even SE saw that and took steps to ease lvling.

There were gimps(lots of them) in '04 when i started and i've actually seen the number of just piss-poor players go down as time has progressed. If ppl having it easier than you did irks you...tough, that's life. My remaining grandparent was born in 1929 and i've never seen her once whine about all of us ingrates goin' about willy-nilly in our horseless wagons. Nope, not once and she was married with kids before she ever even saw a car in person.


My advice: worry about yourself ingame. Play the game to the lvl of excellence you feel is appropriate to challenge yourself and let the next guy worry about challenging him or herself, or not as the case may be. You'll enjoy the game tons more. If i hadn't adopted this outlook ways back, i don't think i would have lasted a year in FFXI.

[Rosina]

do ppl not know how to play an rpg anymore >.>

man this internet age is bugging the crap out me.

for all the trolls in here, you guys are full of stupidity. First off exp was raised outside abyssea. so it don't take long to lvl in 6man. With ring you can get 800+ exp chains after only 5 min of fighting.

Learning your class is done by DOING not reading. All you do is read or mimic

O btw just to clarafy... Troll post: a post made by a troll that does nothing but insult a poster or posters, does nothing to contribute to the topic.

trolls on this forums : Zerich and cidbahamut for starters. All theit posts seem to just berate other posters. And do nothing but this.

I seen more bad players then good on this game since leeching happen. Again more to this game then lvling and end game. Being good at the game is also knowing the lore, knowing the quests , knowing what to do and not to do.

I bet no know here knows of a quest line about a elvaan soldier ordelles cave and a time staff.

[Rosina]

um actually, there were information sites out long before this game came to NA. overall, the wiki was just a reposting of those sites.
mysterytour, seems to have gone offline long ago
somepage.com is still active and predated the wiki.
there are also countless JP sites that have been around for a long time

which didn't get too much referal in game. All i said was one stop info center. Barely anyone on garuda or lakshni made mention of those.... typically my question would be answered not "go to wiki"

[Arcon]

do ppl not know how to play an rpg anymore >.>

Who are you to tell me how to play? There is no one way to play it. Stop being a fascist about this.

As to your other points:
- A troll is someone who posts with the intention of illiciting flame.
- EXP still sucks outside. 800 chains are nothing compared to Abyssea and the ring burns out in no time.
- If you need use it fifty times to realize that Provoke pulls hate, when you could as well have read about it, you're stupid.
- Knowing the lore is knowing about the game, not being good (or bad) at it. Case in point, I know about those and I'm still a good player.

[Slaxx]

Rosina, I would guess I've been playing RPGs (both pen & paper and computer/console) since before you were born. I assure you I know how to play RPGs. Part of that extensive experience is in finding time efficient ways to level. You yourself have said that you've started 70 characters (I believe that was the number) over the years. You obviously enjoy leveling and have no problem doing it in a slower manner than I do, and that's fine. But your crusade against speed leveling (not everyone leeches) is beyond tiresome.

The sad thing is from your statements here I would bet that my level 30 job keying chests contributes far more than whatever level 99 job you may bring to the table. And guess what? Once I get that job to 99 I won't bring it to anything until I've properly skilled and equipped it.

Right now I have 10 jobs at 99 and I'll probably have 3 more in the next 2 weeks.

Right now I will take one out for general use and a second (THF) out if my LS is trying to raise TH value and my other job isn't needed.

Right now the rest of my jobs are in various states of skill/gear. When they get to a level that I find acceptable I will make them available to my LS for events. When I feel comfortable with my knowledge of the job (from various online resources and direct experience) then I will use it in general.

[Lynchilles]

um actually, there were information sites out long before this game came to NA. overall, the wiki was just a reposting of those sites.
mysterytour, seems to have gone offline long ago
somepage.com is still active and predated the wiki.
there are also countless JP sites that have been around for a long time

Wow that brings me back. Somepage.com & Mysterytour were the places to go for maps.


I bet no know here knows of a quest line about a elvaan soldier ordelles cave and a time staff.

There you go again. Making sweeping generalizations. I know about that quest because it was one of the first "major" quests I did since I am an Elvaan from San D'Oria. Every now and again, when I'm back in Sandy, I'll change my title to "Obsidian Storm" just for kicks and because it reminds me of that obscure quest.

You keep throwing around the word "troll" but honestly I think you need to look in the mirror. You are making absurd claims based on anecdotal evidence (i.e. "I see more bad players around now after Abyssea was released then there was before). This is not factual evidence in support of your conclusion. That is you presenting a myopic experience, running it through the filter of inductive reasoning, and using it to support a faulty argument.

You need to just stop posting already.

[Rosina]

If someone asks me for advice and I can answer them I will. If I can't answer them I'll refer them to someone else. In any case, I'll still provide them with a link to the wiki.

Why shouldn't I provide someone with such a valuable tool?



And people shouldn't learn from the experience of others.... Because?

A couple of things i guess you are not getting, Pretty much asking question is a good ice breaker when your in a LS or meeting people. And also not everyone is on a PC/ has access to a PC. So getting "look up wiki" as the ONLY responce can be seen as rude, or anti social, or even lazy.

If all you do is read wiki and follow it to a T, you may not learn your own tricks on how to do things that maybe no one has tried. I mean all you are doing is mimicing what you read. Only item I ever use wiki is if i'm stuck on a quest that no one has done.

This community has been slowly becoming not as social then in the past. That what I was trying to get at.

[Rosina]

@ lynch

I'm kinda doing that on purpose because certain people have been making the same generalizations about others as well. I'm not trying to say it in a rude way, it is more of a personal comment on how much the ffxi community change in how they address people. It does make me wonder how long some of you have been here. Considering a few (about 5) posters infact act so snarky and do NOTHING but post rude comments to anyone who disagrees with them. AkA calling THEM trolls, white knights, telling ppl they suck w/o actually seeing them, making up things about them like being on a crusade of some kind. When in reality people are just posting their 2 cents on the game, about what they see in the game, and only seek to improve the experience for new/returning players.

A few posters don't even post about the topic, they just take comments out of context and make it appear they are being rude. Then people jump on the bandwagon and twist what other posters are saying, which does nothing but start unneeded drama

[Lynchilles]

This community has been slowly becoming not as social then in the past. That what I was trying to get at.

Here you go again...

Your experience as far as I can tell, is limited to leveling jobs to 70 (or whatever) and then starting another character because you get bored or you have some crippling form of ADD or whatever your excuse of the day is.

For me (notice I am introducing this statement as a personal experience, not as a sweeping generalization about every other player in the game) the game is very social because I work with various linkshells on endgame activities such as voidwatch, neo-limbus, einherjar, etc. Or I work with friends on things like Dynamis, Assaults, Abyssea farming, etc.

The game in my experience is just as social today as it was when I first started playing in 2003.

In my opinion, based on my experienceThe social aspect in this game has shifted over the years from being "exp-party centric" to becoming "endgame-activity centric" because leveling via experience points parties has become less a part of the game due to alternate means of leveling.

[Rosina]

@ lynch
highest job before i quit for 6mnths was dnc lvl 95 thf sub. I di just give my personal opinion. But i can only assume as you guys assumed... you guys just skimed my post and twisted 90% of what I said. I only give what I personally see. I do not care of ppl speed level, not against it. I do it on occassion, but I don't leech or try not to leech.

I've personally been playing rpg since I was 6 years old. I'm 27.5 now.

If my posts seem rude, it unintentional. I am just extremely frustrated on how rude i've been treated JUST for playing the game the way I enjoy. I can't even make a post with out someone making a snide or snarky remark on my play style. Which had nothing to do with what I said.

My thing on what deems a bad players is laziness... aka leeching etc.

I also say or me or in my personal experience. You may want to reread some of my posts as I do say this.

[Komori]

I think the only reason people make comments about your playstyle is because your trying to call people out for being bad for theres. You call us lazy for leeching jobs and yet your too lazy to even attempt to gear your characters.

If your going to try and bark and call out people like an elitist, you better be able to back it up and show us that your way has made you better than the rest of us. When it's made you worse, I'm not the "complete optimal, number cruncher" player, but I at least have TP and WS sets, evasion or PDT for some jobs. As well as try to gear my jobs and upgrade it to a spot where I'm comfortable.

If your going to dish it out, be ready to take it. You call out others on their playstyle so they call out your's.

[Vivik]

I can't even make a post with out someone making a snide or snarky remark on my play style.


I'm sure I'm not alone here in saying that every thread you post in you manage to derail and turn into a thread about how people are bad and anyone who does not share your opinion are just trolls.

[SpankWustler]

do ppl not know how to play an rpg anymore >.>

Many times, I have pretended to be a lonely Deep Gnome with a fear of falling upward into the sky and a raging foot fetish while playing Final Fantasy XI.

I have yet to be awarded role-playing experience for my efforts by the sadistic weirdos who are running this game.

[Zerich]

Can't Rosa just RP as someone who isn't retarded for one post?

She does claim to be an RP veteran, after all.

[RAIST]

I'm sure I'm not alone here in saying that every thread you post in you manage to derail and turn into a thread about how people are bad and anyone who does not share your opinion are just trolls.

or how everyone is apparently out to get her for some reason.

And about her calling people trolls....
http://www.strategicdc.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/inconceivable.jpg

[Infidi]

Many times, I have pretended to be a lonely Deep Gnome with a fear of falling upward into the sky and a raging foot fetish while playing Final Fantasy XI.

I have yet to be awarded role-playing experience for my efforts by the sadistic weirdos who are running this game.

Maybe your GM was too busy banning a fishing bot that day? :)

[Scuro]

Well this certainly is getting heated lol.

You don't get "bonus points" or increased street cred for having leveled your job up the long way, and whose to say it really is as such? I mean I could say I spent the time and leveled my RNG up for years! But the fact of the matter is its 99 and I got it in 3 days. I've seen people that have taken the time to level up their jobs be just as worthless as a BLU with 15 blue magic skill that zerged it to 99. The player is what matters and its hard to judge someone by using the most effective and efficient method to level. Thats like presenting a race and giving the competitors the ability to use an up hill and windy path vs a straight path that is down hill. Of course it makes no sense to burn yourself out winding around up hill when the ability to win is straight and down hill. All that matters is that you get to the end goal, it doesn't matter how you get there as long as you keep yourself strong. Why waste your time in nostalgia of how jobs "should" be leveled when the game has evolved from that. If you are so determined to cling to your ways of the past, than either get used to playing solo (because people don't level outside of GoV and Abyssea in old school parties) or do what all the people that couldn't move along with the prosperity of the game, quit.

I mean damn, people are always saying how GoV and Abyssea's exp system is ruining the game, thats BS, than how about bone parties with MNK's way back in the day? Or Colibri parties to get those merits? They were fast means of exp that eliminated past methods entirely, yet nobody b*tched than other than the real old school players. So to say that this system is "broken" is to be ignorant of what FFXI is, because if you think its a 1 year grind to 75 killing easy prey mobs solo or teaming up with 6 people killing maybe 150 exp a mob parties.... Than you are dead wrong.

Also, I'm sorry but if you are playing this game and you don't use Wiki, you need to step up your game, now granted the guides of the jobs are dated, and not as reliable as they used to except for a few but still it is the most reliable source of information to learn how to play at your most optimal abilities. I highly doubt someone playing this game doesn't own a computer that has basic internet connection, and if you do, what stone age rock are you living under? And if you really don't, go to a public library or something, and if that doesn't work, I'm sure you can ask a friend to access it for you, but to not use wiki is like...

WHM's NOT using <STAL> macros to heal better and yelling at DD's to be less efficient with gear swaps so that they can cure.

NIN's that haven't bought Utsusemi scrolls Ni and Ichi because they are a "DD" and they merited into Sange.

RDM's that think they should be a front line DD because they have high sword skill

BLM that doesn't skill up elemental skill or dark skill and doesn't understand why he isn't proc'n that Grellow or why the stuns and sleeps don't' land for shit.

.... I could go on but you see my point, to not use Wiki is to just be ignorant of the game, its eating cereal with out a spoon.

[FrankReynolds]

I leveled thief the long way. Soloed from 60ish to 75. Didn't get to try trick attack with assassin job trait til a merit party. Turns out people don't line up, and thiefs don't tp with a crossbow equipped because bards do all the pulling. Stand there and shoot acid bolts at colibri, and see how long it takes for the sam leader to kick you. Most of what you learn leveling is thrown out and you are left with what gear sets and macros you learned to make. all of which can be learned in a few minutes on the interwebs.

TLDR: leveling the old way is a waste of time unless you really enjoy leveling. Most people don't.

[TybudX]

I want Abyssea to have a higher entry limit because I'm petty and I can't find 5 other people that want to waste hours and hours of their time getting junk drops in an exp party instead of hitting the level cap quickly so they enjoy the fun parts of the game. Obviously I have a mental condition that prevents me from being able to keep my mouth shut for more than 2 minutes, so the few people I do meet end up hating me by the third minute. It's only right that SE should force the entire population of FFXI to suffer so that I can go on not having any social skills whatsoever.

[Krystal]

Interesting...it seems the "minority" isn't so minor anymore.... I see a thread every 2-three days like this, each from a different user...so much for that "shoot down tactic" you've been using to disregard these threads..:P

[Zerich]

Different sock puppets making different threads about the same gripe.

[TybudX]

There are lots of us! We should form a club, where we can get together and talk about how much better we are than people with more high level jobs than us because we take the time to learn our jobs the old fashioned way! A Linkshell even, and then we can go line up SAs and have PLD tanks and wait three minutes for TP so our BLM can MB every single fight!

But then I guess we'd have no reason to announce to the world how much our anger is seething inside of us. I don't want to enjoy the game if other people aren't being unfairly forced to play at my incredibly slow and mind numbing pace.

[Trisscar]

Interesting...it seems the "minority" isn't so minor anymore.... I see a thread every 2-three days like this, each from a different user...so much for that "shoot down tactic" you've been using to disregard these threads..:P

Are we supposed to be fooled by all you sock puppets?

[Luvbunny]

I mean damn, people are always saying how GoV and Abyssea's exp system is ruining the game, thats BS, than how about bone parties with MNK's way back in the day? Or Colibri parties to get those merits? They were fast means of exp that eliminated past methods entirely, yet nobody b*tched than other than the real old school players. So to say that this system is "broken" is to be ignorant of what FFXI is, because if you think its a 1 year grind to 75 killing easy prey mobs solo or teaming up with 6 people killing maybe 150 exp a mob parties.... Than you are dead wrong.

The old school party system was bitched to oblivion back in the days, it was horrendous, horrible and elitist. First the all warrior, ranger, monk, blm exclusive club, then came ToAU that gave us even more faster way to level that was a big massive complaints among the old schooler before ToAU, which brought us the death of Black Mages in party and the rise of every other melee DD + RDM + BRD + COR combo. So to have all these so called "old schooler" getting nostalgic is a tad ridiculous. But overall I agree with your post. Here are something people need to understand, basic human nature:

- People will always take shortcut over chore, leveling to 99 is a big massive useless chore.
- People then do not want to take time to master the job they just lvld fast to 99 because that is another chore.
- Most people are way too lazy to open up FFXI Wiki and read up information on their jobs, or use FFXI AH for more information on how to set up gears and spells etc....
- In general SE do very little to help with skilling up, and most abynoobieboobies do almost nothing to skill ups either, laziness and ignorance comes first.
- People do not learn how to work in small party set up, which is great if you can make it work but horrible if you have a bunch of people who have no clue how the dynamic works. Plus some people got offended if they are being told what to do...
- There are a lot of jobs that require you actually spend time on your own figuring out after you hit 99, blue mage comes to mind, one of the most complex jobs, as well as puppet master. Abyssea is there to give you advantage in battle, with mix and match atmas to suit your need vs mob, but people just do not want to figure it out.... reading problem..

[Krystal]

Are we supposed to be fooled by all you sock puppets?

oh! So that's the new fail tactic your using now to disregard the overflowing amount of threads...simply amazing how much people will go to great lengths to try and ignore something...

[Trisscar]

oh! So that's the new fail tactic your using now to disregard the overflowing amount of threads...simply amazing how much people will go to great lengths to try and ignore something...

How is it a fail? You are a sock puppet. You attempt to make it look like your position is shared by more people than what it actually is by spamming the same stupid shit time after time under a plethora of different accounts.

Do you honestly think we're as stupid as to buy into it?

[Neisan_Quetz]

You're stupid if you think those 3 are sock puppets actually. Organized, coincidence maybe, but not socks.

[TybudX]

edit - Wrong link, sorry.

[nyheen]

i wanna cry now. was in abyssea pt with mnk that didn know the main weapon was h2h and only used staff:(

blu that still dont have head butt or any of the spells other then power attack, pollen. what!, did he just leech a book pt 1-30 then abyssea to 99?

bst that dont use any pets not even the frog

and for god sake dont leech the pup job to 99.;; and ask me why the pet keep missing><

and the leech of all leeches goes to the whm with no debuff spells (Paralyze etc) at all, and only cure 1-3. but missing haste and all bar spells. wears Empyrean set as a lvl 94 asking why these cures so weak, i got a light staff and cure buffs

lady and gentleman the future of FF11

[Trisscar]

coughhttp://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/1847-Haste-and-You...-A-guide-to-the-misinformed.?highlight=Hastecough

I'm not sure what haste has anything to do with the conversation at hand, sorry.

[Demon6324236]

I'm not sure what haste has anything to do with the conversation at hand, sorry.

I am just as lost as you actually.

[FrankReynolds]

Broken logic. There are 3+ people who are making threads about how abyssea level cap needs to be changed (because they are retarded) and 0 people making threads about how it needs to stay the same. Why are there no people complaining about how things need to stay the same...hmmm...maybe because they are fine?

People who don't want shit changed don't make threads about it until it gets changed and it sucks. It doesn't suck right now so there are no threads about how it needs to stay the same. They aren't needed because it's fine.

The irony of this whole crap is people complaining that leveling in abyssea makes noobs. Good players have capped whatever jobs they want to play at this point. If they raise the level cap on abyssea, the only people xping will be either new players who legitimately don't know crap about the game (and will probably quit because leveling is tedious), or dumb asses who think taking forever to level a job is fun (but are too stupid / antisocial to team up and leave the rest of us to our abyssea parties) because most of the good players are done exping .

Why haven't you all teamed up together to create a utopian old school exp linkshell yet? Perhaps if you guys could get together and create even one legitimate linkshell people might take you serious. There seem to be thousands of shells participating in abyssea and not a single one based on your ideology. I don't understand why you guys want to play with people who don't want to play with you? You guys all talk about making friends etc and learning. I don't feel like being forced into performing an action that you don't care for is very conducive to friendship or learning.

You know who sucks 1000 times more at white mage than that white mage that doesn't know how to increase his cure potency and doesn't have all his spells?

Answer: You. Because you don't have white mage leveled at all. Your white mage is still in the dunes. No amount of telling people how good you would be if you had it leveled is gonna change the fact that he has it leveled and you don't. Really wanna be a team player? Get your jobs leveled and stop wasting time killing crabs.

The worst white mage ever is someone who is not a white mage. Stop posting on the interwebs and read the wiki to learn your job. When you done pick up a copy of "How to gain friends and influence people" and realize that people want to know what you can do for them. Not what you think they should do for you. If your spending a lot of time with people who suck, you are either helping them not suck, or you are just fitting in.

[Scuro]

The old school party system was bitched to oblivion back in the days, it was horrendous, horrible and elitist. First the all warrior, ranger, monk, blm exclusive club, then came ToAU that gave us even more faster way to level that was a big massive complaints among the old schooler before ToAU, which brought us the death of Black Mages in party and the rise of every other melee DD + RDM + BRD + COR combo. So to have all these so called "old schooler" getting nostalgic is a tad ridiculous. But overall I agree with your post. Here are something people need to understand, basic human nature:

- People will always take shortcut over chore, leveling to 99 is a big massive useless chore.
- People then do not want to take time to master the job they just lvld fast to 99 because that is another chore.
- Most people are way too lazy to open up FFXI Wiki and read up information on their jobs, or use FFXI AH for more information on how to set up gears and spells etc....
- In general SE do very little to help with skilling up, and most abynoobieboobies do almost nothing to skill ups either, laziness and ignorance comes first.
- People do not learn how to work in small party set up, which is great if you can make it work but horrible if you have a bunch of people who have no clue how the dynamic works. Plus some people got offended if they are being told what to do...
- There are a lot of jobs that require you actually spend time on your own figuring out after you hit 99, blue mage comes to mind, one of the most complex jobs, as well as puppet master. Abyssea is there to give you advantage in battle, with mix and match atmas to suit your need vs mob, but people just do not want to figure it out.... reading problem..

Agreed, also the reason why Abyssea is still in affect is because SE acknowledges that alot of the groups are not 18 parties anymore, but more like 3-4 and sometimes even 2. So Why not make t easier for people to level a wide range of jobs quickly rather than taking forever to have to level another job in order to be effective.

[Scribble]

One does not simply get rid of gimps.

Increasing the level cap in abyssea doesn't guarantee that people will all of a sudden know how to equip and play their jobs. It also forces people who already do know how to play jobs to grind. Why would SE implement something that hurts legit players. Oh, wait... they already do that. Nevermind. Carry on.

[Camiie]

lady and gentleman the future of FF11

And the past and present as well. There's always been people who were ignorant or unskilled, and there always will be. Play with who you want to play with and help the people around you get better. That's all you can do.