Yes Timed Pop Notorious Monsters In New Expansion

[Krashport]

Well I know this game is out-dated and started back in 2002, So I feel like dealing with the time/spawn NMs already in the game now and the ones that might be added. But seriously Square Enix, DO add more time/spawn NMs in future editions to this MMORPG. If you do, have more then ONE NM. "Most Members" likes paying monthly for a MMORPG, Where they can log-on and try to do something.

But they can't because their to scare of trading to a "???" to ONLY POP A NM that drops what they could use, That is also camped by so many other members and waiting in line to trade to a "???" to POP a NM takes very long and can't claim the "???" because said person isn't good at trading or just to scared of touching them is just not fair.

I'm not 100% sure but it "seems" -- likes standing around waiting to claim a ??? only to see someone else has traded already, Popped the NM over and over again. Do the developers even play this game? The NM in question is Heqet, I'm talking about. There are others like Gukumatz etc. I know you can Fell Cleave these mobs for the Key item.

The randomness of fell Cleavin for one(1) KI is very cool cause it gives Members more time on farming Cruor and getting those money items to sell to NPCs!, I don't expect Square Enix to fix this cause "Most Members" don't find this to be broken also they seem to be done with Abyssea anyways. I just want to see lots more of this style of content. I want to actually enjoy playing the game I am paying for you know?

There are more then one way to go about things, and having a one track mind leads into failure in most cases.

It's a Dog eat Dog world you have to claim on both systems.
Trying to Claim a ???.
Trying to Claim a NM.

Treasure.
Treasure Pool. < Best system ever, minus the logs.

[Flyinghippress]

:x Nice try at the counter-argument but Heqet and Gukumatz aren't force-popped/triggered NMs, haha.

As for the trigger NMs, that's an easy fix with allowing multiple people to pop it at once a la Abyssea zone-bosses and several other KI popped monsters.

[svengalis]

Wow at least come up with your own thoughts of why the system isn't flawed or how to fix it.

[Krashport]

Wow at least come up with your own thoughts of why the system isn't flawed or how to fix it. I have done that very thing. I didn't see the need to change much of what you wrote cause you did most of the work for me and saving me time is very nice!:) I just changed the direction of the argument As you can see for yourself -




Speaking for everyone that plays an MMO isn't very nice, Not everyone plays how said person or how I play for that matter. But having an open mind about other ways of playing one would be better off. Coming off this way seems very rude to EVERYONE.... some members.

No matter which way you look at it. Trying to Claim a ??? or NM it's the same thing.

[Demon6324236]

Except, a ??? repops much faster, doesn't have 30 other dud ???s next to it, you can run out of pops for the ??? NM, and run out of reason to fight it faster. ??? pops are better for accessing & overall better on the community, time spawns are bad. When making my Almace I fought with friends a few times because I was annoyed that the 15minute spawn NM was gotten by them 3 times in a row or some such because I had to wait hours to get this done anyways due to the time spawn itself. ??? NMs you can move to another NM for a bit, farm more pops, waiting on time spawns you can... wait, prep your voke macro, and pray a little.

[Mirage]

Timed pops are fine... When done right. Timed pops for highly popular NMs are a bad idea. Timed pops for NMs that people aren't waiting in line for killing isn't really that much of a problem, at least not if the repop timer is low, like for example just 15 minutes.

I would like to see both forced and timed pops in the new expansion, as long as congestion is avoided by not letting certain timed pops become bottlenecks.

[Tunasushi]

agreed more long spawn hnms plz

[Natenn]

Yes, we need new 21-24 HNM for Lv99 content, new 2-3 day and 3-5 day i welcome to.

[Habu]

Yes, we need new 21-24 HNM for Lv99 content, new 2-3 day and 3-5 day i welcome to.

quoted for truth

[Daniel_Hatcher]

lol, wow!

No, thanks!

[Demon6324236]

Yes lets all take a step backwards in gaming and make things boring & tedious so that no one wants to play because we will sit around and wait for a creature to pop up, once it does hoping that we can get it before others, so that we will be able to kill it, and make everyone around us hate us for it. I hope we never get this type of content again, because its not nearly as great as you try to make it seem, would only cause me & a few others to quit.

[saevel]

He's a level 1 mule, meaning Habu or Naten's alt, or one of their friends alt. I'll treat him the same way I do those two, click name -> add to ignore list.

[Tunasushi]

SE please consider long spawn king world hnms. you can also place the drops in a difficult bc, to the casuals won't have any room to cry about it.

Also... Habu.. thx for bumping that other dudes thread and starting it all over again.. I'm normally in support of people who enjoy content like me, but you are a freakin dumbass. Like.. that thread was dead until YOU bumped it numerous times... You are not helping. You just keep it going. Kindly stfu. If you want new world hnm, make new thread but dont bump someone elses thread askinhg for different content. ugh

[Rosina]

As a long time ffxi player from 2004-2012 (with breaks) (and a non casual) I say no thank you. I'm all for hardcore content but placing a "massive" cool down was asinine to how mmorpg work. It was rare in the mass hnm days where at times "pop" happen between 12am-3am est. Heck I recall brown belt. I stayed up all day just to get tod. Only to have to wake up @ 6am est to try and claim it. I much perfer how NM are done in Abyssea. At least it gives everyone a chance at killing it. Farming a pop then poping an nm is much more game like and enjoyable them waiting around for hours at a slight chance to see the NM in question.

Ever been on a Long Leeping Lizzy hunt. Sometimes that nm may not pop in 3 hours. I had an 8 hour wait once. Now... If the "timed" pop in question was like hati/ bandit the nm that pops under conditions of new or full moon between 00:00- 5:00 then that is reasonable. As it still give ppl a chance. but anything like 24hr+ pop window is really too much. And hard to really be around for.

[Rekin]

Want to know what is awesome and great for a game to last?
A monster that is challenging and interesting that can be fought in a variety of different ways.
Want to know that will drive your players mad and quit?
Waiting a century to find/fight said monster.

[Natenn]

He's a level 1 mule, meaning Habu or Naten's alt, or one of their friends alt. I'll treat him the same way I do those two, click name -> add to ignore list.

I have no connections to Habu at all, also lol ignore list. Like i care about some whiney person on OF from another server. Seriously, when ppl do this do they think "Oh i'll blist him that'll make me superior derp derp derp"? Cause you just look mad when you do this.

Anyway, HNM are the future, can't wait for XI to bring back the HNMLS days/drama/competition, or maby so many ppl will QQ instead of making an attempt i can have the NMs to my group and just get decked out from the gate =D then frive up the prices on w/e drop and make boatloads of gil! Just like SW/DI days.

[Demon6324236]

HNM are the future

Let me take a second to explain something. You see, the future is something that will happen later, and is still yet to come, the past is something that has already happened, I think you are getting these two confused.

[Natenn]

Let me take a second to explain something. You see, the future is something that will happen later, and is still yet to come, the past is something that has already happened, I think you are getting these two confused.

and i think you mad, so were even.

[Demon6324236]

and i think you mad, so were even.

Nothing about being mad, you say HNM is the future, its done, its been in the game, it passed. To say its the future would mean its a step forward but as many people have said, its a step back, the game has become fast paced and this clearly goes against it. It is not smart for them to have a game that is both fast and slow paced, doesn't go well together in the game.

[Zerich]

timed spawn, 5~15 minutes = cool
timed spawn, 1 hour = meh
timed spawn, 1 day+ = lolyou'rekiddingme
you guys honestly sound like former bot-programmers who got screwed out of profits with the advent of abyssea. not accusing, just pointing it out.

6/5 stars, would read again!

[Natenn]

CLAIM










OR SHUT UP

[Zerich]

CLAIM










OR SHUT UP

u sure u aren't mad bro?
cuz u sound mad

[Demon6324236]

u sure u aren't mad bro?
cuz u sound mad

Admittedly he does, funny that its his 1st line of defense too.

[Natenn]

I claimed, so no.

[Demon6324236]

I claimed, so no.

You claimed that you want HNM, and then you got mad because people don't want it like you do. Ill tell you the same thing as anyone else who wants it, give me a good reason for it that is good for the game, till you can do that, nothing you say really matters.

[Natenn]

Its goood bc it severly limits the flow of "rare" items. things commoners don't have, things like the VW pulse gear should of been put on 21-24 HNM with a signifigantly higher drop rate. Not made so casuals can spam it 1000x. Drama and jealousy and everpresent in all MMOs, no matter what it will always be there, what made ffxi so great b4 is that this was embraced in the HNM community, i loved the drama and the thrill of claiming knowing theres anywhere from 30-100 ppl being mad cause im getting to fight the nm and they're not, it wasn't even about the drops for the first few minutes just the "OH YEA ITS MINE" feeling. Whats good for you and whats good for the game are two different things.

[Demon6324236]

Its goood bc it severly limits the flow of "rare" items. things commoners don't have, things like the VW pulse gear should of been put on 21-24 HNM with a signifigantly higher drop rate. Not made so casuals can spam it 1000x. Drama and jealousy and everpresent in all MMOs, no matter what it will always be there, what made ffxi so great b4 is that this was embraced in the HNM community, i loved the drama and the thrill of claiming knowing theres anywhere from 30-100 ppl being mad cause im getting to fight the nm and they're not, it wasn't even about the drops for the first few minutes just the "OH YEA ITS MINE" feeling. Whats good for you and whats good for the game are two different things.

Whats good for you should not be the feeling you get from being an asshole to everyone else and making them waste their time. Limiting items allows gloating, again, being an asshole to everyone else. Lastly, good for the game is good for the majority of players, so they are happy with said game, and continue to play and fund it through subscriptions, if things are bad for the game it means a minority of players are getting less so that the majority of players can still enjoy the game.

[Shadowsong]

Why must we make content for everyone? If you don't like world spawns, don't do tem. Care about the gear so much that you bitch? Good gear goes to good players, and yes, "good" in this game can mean "most determined".
You people who want everything custom crafted for their gameplay; were you only childs as a kid?

[Reiterpallasch]

While I think some NMs shouldn't have ridiculous spawn timers and not all good gear be hard to get, I also believe there should still be some amount of HNM that very few fight for some of the absolute best stuff. Not every last piece of content needs to be, nor should be available to ever single player. I don't know of a single MMO that is like this.

Olde FFXI was plenty successful with this in place, and would continue to be so with it. Did it put some gear a bit too far out of reach of some players? Sure. But that doesn't mean they can't find a nice middle ground between casual and hardcore content.

[Sargent]

I agree with the idea. The one thing the game has lacked since Abyssea was NM camping.

I don't think anyone wants to go back to HNM camping though, 21 hours+ to wait for a mob was horrendous. Endgame should not come down to a single chance of getting to fight an NM once a day. The batch of NMs released in November 2009 were far more suitable, and I'd like to see them add more like these not only to the new expansion, but to the newer "EXP" camps that they added to GoV etc as well. Just don't make the drop rates as terrible as said NMs (20% ish is fine, but 5~10% is urgh).


Why must we make content for everyone? If you don't like world spawns, don't do tem. Care about the gear so much that you bitch? Good gear goes to good players, and yes, "good" in this game can mean "most determined".
You people who want everything custom crafted for their gameplay; were you only childs as a kid?
Completely agree. The option was there before, and still is there. People just choose not to utilize it (and yes, some of the timed drops are still relevant).

[Zerich]

Why must we make content for everyone? If you don't like world spawns, don't do tem. Care about the gear so much that you bitch? Good gear goes to good players, and yes, "good" in this game can mean "most determined".
You people who want everything custom crafted for their gameplay; were you only childs as a kid?

>.>
<.<
but your whole argument is the "mine and only mine" syndrome.

btw, if you're going to call someone a child, be certain that your grammar is correct.

[Demon6324236]

They meant only childs as in children without brothers sisters or other siblings of the same type. The difference is there are alot more kids fighting here, and most seem to say no to the HNM things returning, parents normally can see when kids ask for something bad, and even more brought to their attention when 50 say no, and 5 say yes.

[Shadowsong]

>.>
<.<
but your whole argument is the "mine and only mine" syndrome.

btw, if you're going to call someone a child, be certain that your grammar is correct.

This is the EXACT opposite of what I said. I said there should be content for everyone, from the hardcore to the people who play for 2 hours a week. Reading comprehension.
Lol@ the grammar thing

[Tunasushi]

This is the EXACT opposite of what I said. I said there should be content for everyone, from the hardcore to the people who play for 2 hours a week. Reading comprehension.
Lol@ the grammar thing


It's Taruina. Lol. Even when you're right, she just keeps on going.


YES TO MORE LONG SPAWN WORLD HNM SQUARE ENIX!

put the drops in a bc so NO ONE, ABSOLUTELY NO ONE WILL HAVE ROOM TO COMPLAIN!

[Vortex]

Big fat NO to timed spawns, last thing i want to see again is hours of needless camping, people going back to bot programs just to claim, and the massive drama that ensures when people don't get the claim.

unless the timed spawn is like a maximum of 1 hour, maybe 2 if it actually drops something good, maybe, but even then, not really.

no, no, and no.

i don't know how anyone would want to go back to that crap, there are other ways to 'earn" something.

I understand this it self is a time consuming game and you want a sense of accomplishment, but timed spanwed nms are NOT the way to do it, it will just lead to a few shells monopolizing certain nms, like the old HNM days back in 2005, and the childish "lawl you can't out claim me so quit the game" BS speeches.

ok i could go on about this, but i think i made my point.

[Natenn]

If i can claim em all then yes, it is mine and mine alone is'nt it? MOre exclusive drops and content to the hardcore player base pls SE.

[Triffle]

Yes we need more, longer time popped, popular NMs, because nothing makes my day by camping something that has a 24h window and having it stolen by someone with a claim bot. Seriously, we need more of these!

[Habu]

Needs more timed spawned HNM please

[Natenn]

More once a day/week/2 to 3 day world spawns please.

[Habu]

They've already announced that they plan to release a wyrm for every element so there will be new timed spawned HNM sometime in the future.

[Demon6324236]

If i can claim em all then yes, it is mine and mine alone is'nt it? MOre exclusive drops and content to the hardcore player base pls SE.

No reasons for people to gloat about items to others please SE.

[Demon6324236]

They've already announced that they plan to release a wyrm for every element so there will be new timed spawned HNM sometime in the future.

You know these are timed because~? You know this content will be how you expect it because~? And if you already think this is the case why are you fighting with people still? You speak as if you are getting what you want, wouldn't now be the time to gloat & relax after your fighting?

[wish12oz]

MOre exclusive drops and content to the hardcore player base pls SE.

This is totally fine with me. Hardcore players need fun stuff others cant get. BUT, random 21+ hour repop NMs dont give hardcore players anything. They give gear to bots, and only bots. You can be as hardcore as you want and stand somewhere all day, but if you dont have the means to win claim, you'll never get anything. Im ok with random lotto pop NMs, as long as their repop timer is 2 hours or less. To add more "Land Kings" at this point in the game will just drive away a ton of players, while all the people who removing them would drive off have already left.

[Zerich]

inb4 new wyverns will be popped and/or instanced, just like every relevant thing in FFXI at the moment.
inb4 (literal) circular reasoning jpg because someone can't form a logical argument.
inb4 a clever troll types another response on his cell-phone.

hardcore players should be good with their macros and communication, not with their (assumed) bots.

[Habu]

You know these are timed because~? You know this content will be how you expect it because~? And if you already think this is the case why are you fighting with people still? You speak as if you are getting what you want, wouldn't now be the time to gloat & relax after your fighting?

Because every other elemental wyrm is? Because I want more?

[Tunasushi]

inb4 new wyverns will be popped and/or instanced, just like every relevant thing in FFXI at the moment.
inb4 (literal) circular reasoning jpg because someone can't form a logical argument.
inb4 a clever troll types another response on his cell-phone.

hardcore players should be good with their macros and communication, not with their (assumed) bots.

You're trying way too hard sweety.

Let it go honey, or put it in the book.

[Kiakasha]

No Thanks...

[Tyrion]

More timed spawn HNM's please SE

[wish12oz]

More timed spawn HNM's please SE


Tyrion

Posts
1
Character
Renly
World
Carbuncle
Main Job
WHM lv. 99



Ah look, one of the 2 people who wants HNMs back logged onto their WHM mule and made a post supporting their thread.


Habu

Character
Bechyne
World
Carbuncle

I wonder which one of them it could have been!

[Natenn]

I liked camping several HNM every day vs large groups of ppl.

[Teraniku]

Yes lets all take a step backwards in gaming and make things boring & tedious so that no one wants to play because we will sit around and wait for a creature to pop up, once it does hoping that we can get it before others, so that we will be able to kill it, and make everyone around us hate us for it. I hope we never get this type of content again, because its not nearly as great as you try to make it seem, would only cause me & a few others to quit.

Personally if SE wants to put this type of content in. What's the big deal, I'm not going to do it anyway, because:
A) I find it boring and tedious just standing around waiting for the thing to pop
B) Don't have time to do it.
If some people like that stuff why not let them enjoy that type of content. See let's get to the real issue you all have problems with. It's basically the rewards associated with doing said NMs and whether it will be worth it to do so. That's really the main issue this all boils down to.

[Demon6324236]

Personally if SE wants to put this type of content in. What's the big deal, I'm not going to do it anyway, because:
A) I find it boring and tedious just standing around waiting for the thing to pop
B) Don't have time to do it.
If some people like that stuff why not let them enjoy that type of content. See let's get to the real issue you all have problems with. It's basically the rewards associated with doing said NMs and whether it will be worth it to do so. That's really the main issue this all boils down to.

I have openly stated many times my problem is with the rewards. If the rewards are rare, it will let people be rude because they have a piece of rare gear, giving them a big ego. I have watched it happen on many games including this, happens today too, just less often because as many people point out the best gear is either extremely luck based, or easy to get. It would be one thing if you earned this rare piece of gear even, through a hard fight, and the work to get it, but if all you need to do is have the time to stand around for hours with some friends to claim it, then kill it, no, you deserve nothing special.

My other problem I have stated as well, its content that could be for alot more people. Since abyssea, we have received Voidwatcher, an event that is still alive today, however this is likely due to the Heavy Metal exclusive to it and the extremely rare gear that is almost never dropped from its NMs. Neo-Nyzul Isle, a piece of content many feel is impossible without cheating, and is to limited both in restrictions, and party setup. Legion, an event that has almost no activity, and is considered by many to have been dead on arrival. Neo-Limbus, yet another event with little activity and is largely thought to be dead already. Neo-Odin, this may be slightly more active than other DoA content, I am not sure, and have not heard much about it, which does not bod well for the content.

What point do I make with all of this? A large amount of content being put out is not often done, and is not holding the attention of the player base, this means any time and effort put into content for a small amount of people, is less potential content that may not fail in the eyes of players. The new expansion sounds good, but we have also had many people complain in the past about how gimmicky alot of the new features seem, and you have to wonder, how much work is going into them? Play as a monster, your own island with farming/mining/monster raising, there are a few things people may not bother to play, and could end up like Pankration, if this happens, we will need that extra content we lose out on because SE used that time, money, and manpower to make HNMs for a small group to actually enjoy or participate in, while half the players will never even see the monsters, let alone actually fight them.

[Siviard]

Lets get the REAL TRUTH out there, shall we?

1. People who SUPPORT long-time spawn NM / HNM are most likely members of HNM Linkshells. (duh)
2. These people most likely still have claim bots such as NASA or some other new program they're being all secretive about.
3. These people want to MONOPOLIZE these NMs/HNMs and make millions upon millions of gil for themselves and their linkshell members by selling drops, selling lotting rights for rare/ex drops, or selling the claim to another linkshell willing to pay an outrageous fee just to be allowed to fight an NM/HNM.
4. These people will then sell this gil to RMT companies and make IRL money for themselves.
5. These people make posts here, and then make fun of people's reactions to those posts over at www.bluegartrls.com in a thread entitled "The Official Forums: Nuked" in the "Media" section of the Final Fantasy 11 forums.

If anyone cares to refute these sad truths, be my guest.

[Rosina]

i have a question, I asked this in the "no" thread and it wasn't really replied to.

Why must mobs aka hnm be on a timed pop style of spawn? How is that good for the game and the community?

I want hnm in game, not for the reward, but i want to fight large boss style mobs. So why do they need to be on 21-48 hour timers? I like the force pop Idea. Much like Optical hat. Outside the fact runs ran about 16 hours. It was a fun concept. You hunt out various hecteye for a different eye. Then get all the eyes crafted into a cluster. Which you use to pop a mob who you fight to get said item. That i feel is the better way to do hnm.
I enjoy doing content. More content the better. But its only fun if I can do content with my friends. 21-48 timed pops that are random based around last death from server reset isn't ideal for that.

[Krashport]

i have a question, I asked this in the "no" thread and it wasn't really replied to.

Why must mobs aka hnm be on a timed pop style of spawn? How is that good for the game and the community?

Black Mage; Level 1-99 person can farm their spells or buy them off the AH.
Blue Mage; Level 1-99 person has to "farm" their spells.

It all boils down to personal preference and having choices, People are gonna to do, what they want if a person likes it or not.

What makes me laugh, There are so many people (not everyone, but you know who "you" are lol) That worry about others and what they have and how big their plates are and don't even worry, know or even wonder what to do with their time, At the end of day this is just a game.

[Rosina]

@Krashport
That doesn't answer me question.... Infact that reply has absolutely nothing to do with what I asked.

content is content... ppl gonna do it or not do it.
but what does any of that have to do with suff being on a 24hr+ timer...

honestly i'm starting to think you started this topic just to start a topic, you have no actual reason or a "why" you want it. you want it just to want it. That is far from a good reason. Just as much as not wanting it for sake of not wanting it isn't a good reason. Ypu and a few other who are for time based hnm (aka 24+ hr time pop) have yet to establish a good reason for your cause. All i read want "i want this, because i want this" While a few who are against timed pop mobs have sited good reasons for not seeing a return of them.

Here is my 2 cents... everyone loves a good boss battle. Thats why we play final fantasy games is it not? For good story and a good boss battle.
So why make said bosses be put on a once a day/week timer. That makes it hard ppl to see it.

[Krashport]

Here is some homework; http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Category%3AHigh_Notorious_Monsters. When you're done with that I'm sure you can surf the internet to find more info on this, rather then always asking for a handout on info. ^^b

Note: The player invented the use and the nickname HNM not the company. So understanding your own "H" that you're using in HNM is half the battle.

[Tunasushi]

point is, some people enjoy thios type of content and as long as the drops are made available via something like einherjar or legion, it's not unreasonable at all to implement it.


endgame is clearly headed in a direction that requires a LS and or group, abyssea was never endgame or the direction of endgame in ffxi.

HNMs are not at all unreasonable if the drops are made available elsewhere, but then you'll complain THAT content is too hard or the drops are too rare.

welcome to ffxi endgame, everything is either tedious and rare or difficult without a specific setup. If u dont like it, don't DO ENDGAME or play a different mmo.

[Rosina]

@ Krashport
I'm not sure about you.. but i've been playing this game since 2004. I've also played other mmorpg. And have been playing rpg video games since age 6.

You just grasping staws. Just reply my question... it isn't hard.

my question
part 1
Why must hnm be on 24-48 hour (or more) time base spawns?
How is placing hnm on such a long cool down good for the community?

[Rosina]

point is, some people enjoy thios type of content and as long as the drops are made available via something like einherjar or legion, it's not unreasonable at all to implement it.


endgame is clearly headed in a direction that requires a LS and or group, abyssea was never endgame or the direction of endgame in ffxi.

HNMs are not at all unreasonable if the drops are made available elsewhere, but then you'll complain THAT content is too hard or the drops are too rare.

welcome to ffxi endgame, everything is either tedious and rare or difficult without a specific setup. If u dont like it, don't DO ENDGAME or play a different mmo.

My question has nothing to do wuth the reward... it is simply about killing said hnm and doing said content. Reward is a non issue.

[wish12oz]

5. These people make posts here, and then make fun of people's reactions to those posts over at www.bluegartrls.com in a thread entitled "The Official Forums: Nuked" in the "Media" section of the Final Fantasy 11 forums.

If anyone cares to refute these sad truths, be my guest.

Last time this topic came up on BG pretty much everyone was against the idea of allowing bots back into the game and allowing them to have dominance over which LS you want to join. So basically, BG is anti-24hour+ NMs. Dont believe me? well, maybe you should read BG yourself instead of just acting like you know about it.

To back up my claims I present to you this thread/poll on BG:
http://www.bluegartr.com/threads/104897-Does-BlueGartr-want-more-world-spawn-NM-HNM
The winner with almost 50% of the votes is "You can't be serious. All world spawns will be botted." Which shows just how much distaste the BG community has for bots and world spawns.



Note: The player invented the use and the nickname HNM not the company. So understanding your own "H" that you're using in HNM is half the battle.

Back in the day we called them Hyper Notorious Monsters, I dunno why that lame webpage says High.

P.S. I kinda feel like I should gouge my eyes out for agreeing with Rosina, I hate all of you.

[Tunasushi]

Last time this topic came up on BG pretty much everyone was against the idea of allowing bots back into the game and allowing them to have dominance over which LS you want to join. So basically, BG is anti-24hour+ NMs. Dont believe me? well, maybe you should read BG yourself instead of just acting like you know about it.

To back up my claims I present to you this thread/poll on BG:
http://www.bluegartr.com/threads/104897-Does-BlueGartr-want-more-world-spawn-NM-HNM
The winner with almost 50% of the votes is "You can't be serious. All world spawns will be botted." Which shows just how much distaste the BG community has for bots and world spawns.



Back in the day we called them Hyper Notorious Monsters, I dunno why that lame webpage says High.

P.S. I kinda feel like I should gouge my eyes out for agreeing with Rosina, I hate all of you.

Why would you link to that thread?

If anything, it shows there IS as desire for them.

Theres no question a larger percentage of people didnt enjoy hnms, but you're delusional if you don't notice the numbers and percentages of people who do.

90% OF PEOPLE, don't/didn't want more voidwatch either. Saying "xxx amount of people don't want this" is not a good enough reason to warrant not putting something reasonable in a game, if there is are people who enjoy it. Reward is a non-issue, as said.

That was not a good example at all to use. All that thread shows is 1 in 4 people do want new world nms/HNMs..

[Rosina]

Why would you link to that thread?

If anything, it shows there IS as desire for them.

Theres no question a larger percentage of people didnt enjoy hnms, but you're delusional if you don't notice the numbers and percentages of people who do.

90% OF PEOPLE, don't/didn't want more voidwatch either. Saying "xxx amount of people don't want this" is not a good enough reason to warrant not putting something reasonable in a game, if there is are people who enjoy it. Reward is a non-issue, as said.

That was not a good example at all to use. All that thread shows is 1 in 4 people do want new world nms/HNMs..

Yes that is due to fighting large/ hard creatures is fun. But who is to say they want them on the 24 hour timer? You can have the content with out the timer... you do realise this right?

[Siviard]

I think you're all missing the point here.

Regardless of the fact that, according to a thread on BlueGartr, "the winner with almost 50% of the votes is "You can't be serious. All world spawns will be botted."" the fact of the matter is, there WILL be those who support World Spawn NMs/HNMs and THEY WILL BE BOTTED HEAVILY!

Even if it was only 5% of the entire FFXI playing population that supported all world spawns, all it takes is those 5% (I'm using a random % btw) to ruin it for everyone else.

[Tunasushi]

Yes that is due to fighting large/ hard creatures is fun. But who is to say they want them on the 24 hour timer? You can have the content with out the timer... you do realise this right?

Did you read the thread title? Did you read the poll options?

Can't help but assume no, because the thread isa clearly titled world monsters.

I think the majority of people who don't want world monsters are afraid of being excluded, AND HONESTLY, I HAVE A GREAT DISDAIN FOR WHINERS or players who think they are entitled.

I'm really happy for the top shells and groups that conquer legion, neo einherjar odin, and neo nyzul. Call me elitest if you want, but the only thing worst than a dude who will do whatever it takes to beat someone, not included to scamming and cheating, is a whining casual who wants things dumbed down for his or her playtime/capabilities.

I don't think some of you get it. The only thing missing from 99 cap from 75 cap when endgame is concerned is competition. The drops are still incresdbily rare, and you still need a larger group to defeat the most difficult content. You are already excluded if you're a whiner and too casual.

I can't stress the facts enough that abyssea did not revive ffxi, just as many quit during it, as they did come back, it evened out. The only thing that improved was the morales of the player base. When cheating and gil was obselete, which isn't the case now that we are recapped. Abyssea was never endgame, it was filler content.

Abyssea reward-ratio content will never be endgame, get over it. HNMs may never return but the games sense of social climbing in stronger/larger groups is and will be primarily what ffxi endgame is about.

In case you haven'tnoticed, SE doesn't devolope content based on what "people DON'T want" they give what people "Do what" IF ANYTHING. They don't care what you DON'T want, especially when their are others who do want it.

Enjoy the content you do like, and stop complaining about content that doesn't effect you: the content you cannot do.

In case you all missed the memo, the new expansion is geared towards bringing back OLD PLAYERS and retaining them. It's not going to be something that geared towards bringing in new players or fleshing out content you can finish in a week.

You're delusional if you think SE is going to add massive zones and not fill them with notorious monsters that spawn in the real game environment.

I love competition, please bring back long spawn world hnms, and support stronger groups of players who are dedicated to the game and support it without the need for filler content.

[Demon6324236]

I think it is becoming clear more and more of the people who want HNMs cant read posts, because they give replies that have nothing to do with the question they are meant to answer. The question was... what is good about 20+ hour respawn times? So far your answers have stated random opinions or facts, but nothing pertaining to this at all so far as I have seen.

[Trisscar]

I think it is becoming clear more and more of the people who want HNMs cant read posts, because they give replies that have nothing to do with the question they are meant to answer. The question was... what is good about 20+ hour respawn times? So far your answers have stated random opinions or facts, but nothing pertaining to this at all so far as I have seen.

So far as I read it, their argument is that 20+ hour spawns (which have been demonstrated require very little in the way of skill and effort) will somehow weed out 'noobs' and 'casuals' in a way that Voidwatch/Aby HNM (which all require you having all your relevant skills skilled, be able to read/know/relate/exploit weaknesses, have half way decent gear, etc, etc) can't. In other words they're lazy scum.

And yeah, I used a broad brush there. Deal with it.

[DangerousCalled]

I remember old days once ppl camping faf/Nid
I just log in to complete my yesterday stuffs , My LS called me Faf window Open ...

After losing 3h of camp , we lost the claim ...

then we got run Bahmut V2 > Omega

got canceled because KB might pop while half LS getting Tod of Adman/aspi

My day just lost coz its just Behe not the KB poped & here my day lost 8h for camping...

WHAT DAMN WASTE OF TIME

in 4 h enough to farm 5-10 pieces of Emp wpn...
in 2h enough to pop 6-12 VW
another 2h left to do Dynims/Ein/Leigon / etc run

even as LS its gonna be sux when cancel his run for camp HNMs

ofc I would love to c New type HNM as Kings @ new land , but plz by new method
our Hours is gold we can't play 8h a day like befor.

[Rosina]

@ Tunasushi
You didn't read any of my posts did you..... Guess not. What that wall of page you nicely typed has no refernce to anything I typed at all. But in all seriousness. HNM do not need to be on a 24-48 hour timer. They can be force pop'ed or if you want a timer so bad how about time of vanadiel day. Much like hati in kon. highlands. once a real life day timers are iffy, can turn random rather quickly and exclude many time zones. Remember ffxi is global, not regional. And the current hnm got changed for a reason.

Content is content. It should be accessable to any and all players at any given time. That is the ideals of the mmorpg genre.
This is soley about doing said content not the possible reward.
Due to the iffy-ness of hnm I barely saw them. I was always sleeping. Even under 20hr game session, or id be doing something else. I see no point in wasting my time going to every hnm soawn point to see if it may or may not be there wait 12 hrs at each spot just incase it may spawn.

[Camiie]

I think the majority of people who don't want world monsters are afraid of being excluded, AND HONESTLY, I HAVE A GREAT DISDAIN FOR WHINERS or players who think they are entitled.

I'm really happy for the top shells and groups that conquer legion, neo einherjar odin, and neo nyzul. Call me elitest if you want, but the only thing worst than a dude who will do whatever it takes to beat someone, not included to scamming and cheating, is a whining casual who wants things dumbed down for his or her playtime/capabilities.

Don't you think the pro-HNM crowd are guilty of the same line of thinking? They're whining that their preferred style of play is no longer supported. They want endgame to be dumbed down to their level of play where the only real challenge is who has the best ping time, bot program and/or trigger finger. Ultimately that was the only real challenge in the world of HNM unless the other groups decided to try to MPK.


I don't think some of you get it. The only thing missing from 99 cap from 75 cap when endgame is concerned is competition. The drops are still incredibly rare, and you still need a larger group to defeat the most difficult content.

If competition is what's most important to you then you should be all over Ballista, Brenner, and the new Play-As-Monster system. If it's really about competition then these events would be overflowing with you guys, but they're not are they? Because these things are REAL competition that you can't luck or bot your way through, and there's nothing shiny at the end that makes you feel special.


You are already excluded if you're a whiner and too casual.

I seem to recall there were PLENTY of whiners in the world of HNM, so they really weren't ever excluded. If there were no whiners there would have been no drama, and many of you would never have gotten your jollies from the HNM scene.


I love competition, please bring back long spawn world hnms, and support stronger groups of players who are dedicated to the game and support it without the need for filler content.

Calling HNM competition is like George Jetson calling his 3 hours a day of pushing one button a job.

[Dazusu]

I am in full support of more HNM. If you don't want to do them, there's lots of Voidwatch, etc for you to do ^_^

[svengalis]

Not every last piece of content needs to be, nor should be available to ever single player. I don't know of a single MMO that is like this.

Star wars the old republic.

[Sparthos]

World-spawn NMs that are available for anyone to attack is the answer obviously.

[Camiie]

World-spawn NMs that are available for anyone to attack is the answer obviously.

So like Campaign or Besieged mobs? Yeah, that actually sounds kinda fun.

[Rekin]

There is something wrong with a game if you spend more time waiting around than actually being entertained by said game. If your reason for some content is to lord over people and not the desire to derive pleasure from the actual content itself then the game is nothing more than a glorified chat room to you. No smart business would cater to such an audience in order to sustain itself.

To take a page from one of my favorite franchises once more, Monster Hunter. The game gives a perfect balance separating players according to their actual skill. That is what Hardcore people want to prove to others most of all right? Skill. In Monster hunter your able to team up with others and take down stronger enemies that you'd probably never have a chance against. Can this be exploited? Certainly, its entirely possible to get to the game's endgame by piggie backing on others more skilled than you, but once you reach that stage your inept ability hinders you greatly when facing those mobs regardless of your gear. My point in this is to say that having content accessible to all is the best way to retain customers. Using the challenge presented by said content is how a game company should separate the more skillful from the general populous. In monster hunter better gear came from monsters on higher tiers reached by accomplishing a number of quests and having a certain amount of points allowing progression. Voidwatch did a great job of that while still weeding out those less skilled than others in the form of having the monsters challenging in that players had to have a sense of cooperation and teamwork to actually conquer the challenge presented.

HNMs in the past is terrible content in the fact your not actually playing the game you are just waiting around while others go about provoking people from other groups. Content that has others antagonize others creates a friction in the player base. Also I doubt not many people new to the game will be super excited to hear that fun stuff happens after waiting around for hours when the person would just rather play another game where they are actually entertained.

TLDR: A game that makes you wait around= not fun. A game that lets everyone challenge the content(doesn't mean they have to succeed)= fun.

[Hercule]

I WANT THEM BACK!

[Randwolf]

Claiming a mob takes almost no skill, pure an simple. Especially, with a large group trying to claim in a small space. It revolves around luck. Considering yourself 'elite' for making a claim is the same as me calling myself a 'high stakes gambler' because I won on a slot machine. No skill involved whatsoever. So, please quit equating HNM's to being anything other than lucky.

To make it worse, the fact is that it can be botted. And you're lying to yourself and others if you say otherwise. I watched shells that didn't have bots start using bots because the bots gave whoever used them a strong upper hand. Feel free to argue on and on for them. But, from someone who did them for years, it was a horrible system.

[Rekin]

I WANT THEM BACK!

We all want what we cannot have, I want to be able to manually jump in game as a means of getting around environmental blockades but that won't be happening... ever I'd imagine.

Simply put content in which you spend more time finding a way to burn time for content to bear fruit isn't entertaining and liable to make the game look bad. Imagine this scenario if you will:

You get home with a friend, you remember its time for X HNM to spawn so you log in. Your friend comes to watch whatever it is that has you so excited. He finds you moving your character to X location and just waiting around with other people for several minutes. Nothing happens. Your friend gets bored and comes to the conclusion that the game isn't worth checking out. Now when you friend goes around and is asked by others about the game, he tells them how boring it is contrary to what you may say. How can you disprove him when you've spent perhaps the better part or an hour or two literally doing nothing? Thus your friend and any who care to inquire about the game conclude that the game isn't worth their time and as a side effect SE's name is thought less of because now those people think that the company makes boring games.

TLDR: SE has little to no reason to make HNMs with long spawn times as it'll besmirch their reputation as entertainment providers. Example of bad design reaching the ears of the general public: Yahoo's article on PW when an ls fought it for several hours.

[Rosina]

like I said I WANT hnm. JUST not on a 24 hr timer for respawn which is still random. cuz its rare they pop on the hr.

as for content made for everyone... every mmo after ffxi and every MUD already does this. FFxi does, heck ffxiv is making content open for everyone.

the more open ur content is the more stuff ppl with have to do, the longer they play. once u start making content for a select group only.... people run outa stuff to do. Content don't need to be easy to do... just needs to be ready and avaliable to anyone at any given time. Thats the appeal to video games. You can turn them on and have something to do. You always progress.
I'm a pretty harcore gamer, but i have my head on right and i know what is and isn't importent. What most of the so called hardcore in here seem to not understand that. And tbh their mindset isn't what i feel is very hardcore.
so again my question, i'[m not looking for ur opinion... but why must a hnm be on a 24+ hr spawn rate? there is no value or competition in this.

[Natenn]

21hr on the dot? in multiple zones/locations

[Rosina]

21hr on the dot? in multiple zones/locations

why though how is that a good thing? that leaves our a lot of players from alot of time zones.

[Natenn]

If it pops 21hrs on the dot it has to move back ToD wise every day, that actually ensures it has to pop in a different time zone after a few days, day 1 - pop 9 PM, then 6 PM, then 3 PM, then noon. how will this exclude if ToD is constantly moving back? 20hrs on the dot sounds better since they need to make NM unzergable and take at least 30m to kill.

[Rosina]

If it pops 21hrs on the dot it has to move back ToD wise every day, that actually ensures it has to pop in a different time zone after a few days, day 1 - pop 9 PM, then 6 PM, then 3 PM, then noon. how will this exclude if ToD is constantly moving back? 20hrs on the dot sounds better since they need to make NM unzergable and take at least 30m to kill.

simple fact... ppl may not be on when it hit that 21 hour mark... that still excluding conent for ppl to not do it. >.> or do u realise that....

conent shouldn't be on a timer for no more then 1hr at best. thif open the content to alot more ppl. And tbh is how ffxiv is going with their nn/hnm, and well most their content. i'm for epic fights but really 30 min.... ant that a bit much? even for a boss fight >.>;; Then again that could be my ADD thinking lol. content needs to be open to everyone for an mmo to last now a days. This isn't to say that it can't be challenging.
I'm a hard core and that still irks me. I

[Rekin]

If it pops 21hrs on the dot it has to move back ToD wise every day, that actually ensures it has to pop in a different time zone after a few days, day 1 - pop 9 PM, then 6 PM, then 3 PM, then noon. how will this exclude if ToD is constantly moving back? 20hrs on the dot sounds better since they need to make NM unzergable and take at least 30m to kill.

This is perhaps the most worthwhile suggestion for a timed spawn HNM aside from the one proposed by myself and some others. However it doesn't prevent monopolization that was seen in previous HNMs. Remember the main issue against timed spawn is that is it a terrible way to bottleneck people from experiencing content. Right now I'm in the mind to think that the HNMs we are likely to see in SoA is in instanced battlefields since one of the major points of the expansion is to support battles that directly effect the local area.