ATTN DEVS: Attaining Mythic Weapons Needs To Be Reconfigured

[Razielrinz]

Currently Mythic Weapons take 100 times more gil then relics and 100 times more play time then Relics and Empy Weapons and most are not as good as their Empy or Relic conterparts. IMO I think they need to cut the number of Alex down to 3k with the reduced supply for Alexander pushin the prices into the 25-30k a piece range and cut the number of tokens to 10k. This reduces the time still take more time then either Relic or Empy with the number or Nyzul runs for tokens and still costs 75,000,000 to 90,000,000 gil at current prices if people are just buyin the alexandrite.

[Daniel_Hatcher]

lol, never happening.

[wish12oz]

The only thing wrong with mythics is alexandrite supply, which SE is trying to address, but not really doing a good job of.

[Mirage]

Just make everything drop alexandrite

how hard can it be?

same goes for all the other items that are ridiculously expensive but create weapons that are weaker than empys.

not looking at the fake-empys items here, not at all.

[Khiinroye]

From the census data on total number of relics, empyreans, and mythics since the last census:

Relics: +9928 (27.2 per day)
Empyreans: +56001 (153.4 per day)
Mythics: +66 (0.18 per day)

Relics are 150.4x easier to obtain than mythics, and empyreans are 848.5x easier.

[Garota]

This issue has been addressed tons of times... They thought adding Alexandrite to Nyzul would help, but Neo-Nyzul turned out to be not as efficient as many hoped. There is still hope with the Salvage renewal.

I personally think Alexandrite should be added to: Einherjar as a possible, single drop from all regular mobs, bosses could drop Cotton Coinpurses, Odins could drop Linen Coinpurses; all Assault Missions should have a possibility to drop a Cotton Coinpurse for successful completion located in the Ancient Lockboxes; all Qiqirn should drop these since they're said to have such a fixation for shiny objects. But that would be putting the game on stupidly easy mode.

My favorite part, get this, is when players stock up massive amounts of Alexandrite and they are still a Private Second Class, have no ToAU mission progress, have never done a day of Einherjar in their life, don't have any Nyzul Progress to floor 100 or better yet.... Have no idea what any of the prerequisites for a Mythic Weapon are. Alexandrite is only one of many tedious things a player has to do in order to make a Mythic Weapon, but if you don't do those first, Alexandrite is just going to take up inventory space since they won't be able to turn them into Paparoon.

Granted, Nyzul can be easily climbed to 100 with a competent group of experienced players in a matter of maybe a week, but players must still wait a minimum of 50 days until they can successfully complete all assault missions and well, I don't want to do the math for Einherjar... The level cap must have made a few of these easier... But I still want to see more Alexandrite land into my inventory so I can toss my ZNM trophies at Balrhan's face...

Mythic weapons are truly a chore compared to Relics (which are based mostly on gil now) and Empyreans (which are based mostly on time now). I'd like to see some aspects to be made more attainable, but it will truly take dedication from a player to go through to actually Forge a New Myth.

[Razielrinz]

This what I am talkin about! Relics and Empys are so much easier to get I think they need to rethink the whole quest outline. I mean the assaults are 50 days!!! To get that many tokens would take alot longer! Not to mention the Ichor! It's no wonder that only 66 Mythics exist. I think with the revamp of Salvage they should revamp the quests for Mythic and the total number of random crap you have to get to bring them in line with the time requirements of Empys and the gil requirement of Relics.

[Mittenz]

The only issue with mythics is the supply of alexandrites, really the easiest fix to this would be to allow people to enter salvage solo which would attract more farmers as the 3 person requirement puts people off. As of this post I need only 5447 to finish mine off and really I find the only issue is supply. gil is easy enough to make that between salvage and buying I can easily at current prices (15-20k) get 300 a day which puts it at about the same as the time required to complete things like the assaults or nyzul tokens or ein gathering as long as the alexandrites are there to buy so really its more a need to get people to farm it like dynamis rather than just altering the quests. with the new salvage in sept (unless they delay it) supply should pick up making it easier to complete it as long as the gear from it is relevent enough to get groups into doing it.

As for the other requirements really if you look at time spent doing things (most assaults take 5-15mins now you can do 15 floors in nyzul on a single tag and you can spam T3 ein with as few as 6 and clear it well before the timer) vs the time needed to farm a dynamis relic (2hrs a day for 100 days solo) its not really that far apart. As for empies meh they were easy from the start and only a few really are worth any investment at all (and most will never see Lv. 95 upgrades especially once VW becomes redundant).

[Vivivivi]

I may be alone with this opinion... but I think the Mythics are fine as they are. We have empyreans, which are effectively free weapons that are great, that just take a little time and patience to obtain, and for the VNMs on some, and Abyssea NMs, a few friends to help out.

Relics can be soloed for the most part, and also just takes some time and/or gil to obtain, and are also excellent weapons.

Mythics, are just as the name implies... weapons of legend, so rare that when you actually see one, you have to do a double take. I've actually only seen one player with one the entire time I've been playing. In my opinion, SE has already adjusted many of the things that would completely prevent someone from ever obtaining one. Alexandrite now drops from Nyzul uncharted region, you can enter Odin's chamber every time you do Einerjar (meaning you get more ichor than before) which were two of the major barriers to obtaining one.

I think when we already have Empyreans and Relics, which are challenging, but not impossible to obtain, I think just the idea of the existence of the Mythic weapons is what makes them so legendary... even moreso than their actual stats.

[tyrantsyn]

Empyreans = I have fun playing and don't have oddles of time to sink into the game

Relic's = I love the game a lot and wanted something that made a statement about how much I enjoy it.

Mythic = I've have way too much time on my hands, my GF left me, I haven't seen my family or sunlight out side of work in year's and I really really want every one to know how much I love this game and how much better I am at it over every one else.

P.S Empyreans weapon user are all noob's

[Arciel]

in some ways i agree. i posted a similar thread on another subforum with regards to the supply of alexandrite.

the effort-based activities are an issue in terms of comparing them with Relic and Empyrean but they're a lot harder to gauge.

if you compare 99 to 99 for each of them.. Mythic doesn't seem that bad.

you need to have done the 50 assaults before you start a mythic and the same 50 assaults again. This wouldn't be so bad if players weren't limited by assault tags but is the part i don't think they'll ever change.

einherjar - possible to reduce ichor. its not that hard anymore but costs money to do..

nyzul - definitely possible to reduce tokens. this is (imo) the hardest to accumulate out of all the events for Mythic (apart from Alexandrite).

if you look at Mythics past 75. the WS trials have had difficulty reduced.. and the NM trials are ridiculously easy. Mythic has the easiest path to 99 of the 3 weapon types because all the NMs for trials are from Lv75 content and (apart from PW) are things they must already have done before to get the weapon anyway.

Relic builders need to do Arch DL, which is more lv90+ content, and for Empyrean builders the effort comes in front - from NM camping and trophy gathering. only reason why its so imba-easy is because it was in Abyssea where players can become ridiculously powerful (and are now overleveled).

so bottom line, Empyreans still have it easy for effort. Empy money items to get to 99 have actually surpassed Relics tho.

Relic weapons require next to no effort/skill at all. You only really need to farm. All attestation/animated NMs are super easy now. Arch DL can be avoided if you pay lol.

Mythic, still the most time consuming, still the most expensive. Any adjustment it gets needs to be before acquiring the lv75 weapon..

i used to think it would be a good idea to make it so players can choose 3 out of 4 tasks for the duty,task,deed quest. lol but i think everyone would just skip alexandrite probably XD

[Mostfowl]

The ONLY adjustment I think should be made is not having to complete every single assault mission to obtain capt rank. Me and a buddy have been trying to get capt rank and a mythic for years and have not been able to find a steady group to complete all missions. Hell we havent found a group that will stay for the first round. Nyzul Isle was easy to complete 1-100, so much so we ran about 4 ppl 1-100 after we did our own, but ppl dont seem to want to do the other assaults.

So if they would allow us to spam nyzul or other assault missions to accumulate points and rank up, they should allow us to get that coveted capt rank that way too. They wouldnt even have to change the pace they currently have for point accumulation.

Mythics are not supposed to be owned by all....like empys

Our focus has alway been more on relic and mythic than empy. Although we are building empys (albeit sloooowly) we would much rather get our relics/mythics.

That being said if anyone have a ls that still does Salvage, Einherjar or Assaults on Odin. Me and a friend are interested in a ls.

[detlef]

Assaults are easy, Nyzul is easy, Einherjar just became easy. And that leaves us with alexandrite. Still not easy. This is the only thing that needs to be adjusted. Everything else is an insignificant obstacle not worth complaining about. A better argument can be made for ToAU beastman king spawn conditions, really.

[Oscar71]

They should make linen pouches 100% drops on the main bosses in each of the Salvage zones.

[Samosa]

I think the majority of us mythic makers are OK with the Assaults/Nyzul tokens/Ichor, it's just the Alex that let's us down a bit. On Shiva, the general price is 15k, which in itself is not a huge issue, but as others have said the supply is still incredibly low.
It's gotten a bit better with Nyzul Isle Uncharted, but there still needs to be a bit of an adjustment, even if it's as mentioned above, making linen pouches drop 100%.

[Garota]

Not all Empyrean or Relics are worth getting. I'm working on a Nirvana personally for the multiple use aspect of it. All Mythic weapons have some decent job specific aspects which the other weapons cannot fulfill. Here's another idea, they also should have also added Alexandrite to ToAU Voidwatch to get people rollin' with actual desire to play that content.

[Seha]

3k alex and 10k tokens is ridiculous.
I just think alex should drop in more places and more importantly, the tag limit should be removed.

[Daniel_Hatcher]

3k alex and 10k tokens is ridiculous.
I just think alex should drop in more places and more importantly, the tag limit should be removed.

I don't think the tag limit should be removed, it's as lenient as Dynamis, one tag per day. I don't think NI should take count for them, only ones where you can get assault points should. Maybe a different tag for NI if they still want to use that system.

(I realise no one does Assault's anymore unless it's for completion, or a mythic but I'm accounting for when NeoSalvage comes out)

I also think Alexandrite should be able to stack in a bag or something that holds 100 and stacks to either 12 or even 99. Expecting you to get that amount of Alexandrite and trade them in more or less instantly not allowing for if you could change your mind is stupid.

[Razielrinz]

I have read evertyhing and I like the idea of removing the tag limit (possibly remove the 3 people per assault too since 99s can run most of them solo) and increasing the alexandrite supply by alot. But I still think that 30k is a bit high. Make it 3k and increase the supply. I still think that Ichor and Nyzul Tokens should be reduced by a factor of 10 as well because that is still 10,000 Ichor and 15,000 Nyzul tokens. And to the people who say not everyone should have one of these I would like to point out that all content in this game is suppose to be able to be achieved by all players. And Mythics always seemed counter intuitive with the warning at hte begining of the game about have a outside life. To achieve a Mythic you need a group of people who never leave the game basically to pull it off. Relics used to be the same way but now they are attainable (still takes alot of time or gil) by everyone. Mythics should be the same way.

[Daniel_Hatcher]

I have read evertyhing and I like the idea of removing the tag limit (possibly remove the 3 people per assault too since 99s can run most of them solo) and increasing the alexandrite supply by alot. But I still think that 30k is a bit high. Make it 3k and increase the supply. I still think that Ichor and Nyzul Tokens should be reduced by a factor of 10 as well because that is still 10,000 Ichor and 15,000 Nyzul tokens. And to the people who say not everyone should have one of these I would like to point out that all content in this game is suppose to be able to be achieved by all players. And Mythics always seemed counter intuitive with the warning at hte begining of the game about have a outside life. To achieve a Mythic you need a group of people who never leave the game basically to pull it off. Relics used to be the same way but now they are attainable (still takes alot of time or gil) by everyone. Mythics should be the same way.

Yes, at a certain difficulty. Mythic's are obtainable by all, just not easily obtainable.

[Alistaire]

Make alexandrites mineable! (not really a serious suggestion, but they are precious stones, so the idea works in theory)

[Mirage]

I don't think the tag limit should be removed, it's as lenient as Dynamis, one tag per day. I don't think NI should take count for them, only ones where you can get assault points should. Maybe a different tag for NI if they still want to use that system.

There is a difference, though. Dynamis can be done for 2 hours every day, while an assault is at most 30 minutes.

Dynamis was reduced from 3-4 hours every 3 days to 2 hours every day, which is something like twice as much time to spend inside dynamis, while assaults are still the same. Assault rewards (except as a mythic prerequesite) are also less relevant now than the dynamis rewards are. Dynamis still offers sellable currency, and a few all right drops from the neo-dynamis content. From assault, you get... I can't even think of anything that sells well or is worth equipping anymore. Chiv chain, maybe? lol.

Personally, I'd like for us to not need tags at all and just do assaults and old-nyzul as often as we want, but I would probably be satisfied with something like getting assault tags 2-2.5 times as fast.

If SE really wants to keep the assault tags relevant for anything, I suggest they do a hard-mode for the assaults, giving super-assault-points that can be used on new and relevant gear. Assault tags could be used for these, while old assaults would be unrestricted, and a requirement for attempting the hard-mode version of each corresponding assault.

[sc4500]

What they really should do since they are so hard to get is just increase the damage and fixed some the stats on the mythic weapons so they are super elite and do nothing to the quest lines, so those that have earned them feel justifyed. I would feel bad for the 66 people that worked there butts off, only to see thousands of them. bad enough they made the relics so easy, from the old days. Keep something so people can wish full think or dream or have few hundred linkshell members help them get it .

We do not need ever thing handed to us on a silver platter, but they should make the reward feel special and for the players that got them should feel proud or like a kid in a candy store.

[Razielrinz]

What they really should do since they are so hard to get is just increase the damage and fixed some the stats on the mythic weapons so they are super elite and do nothing to the quest lines, so those that have earned them feel justifyed. I would feel bad for the 66 people that worked there butts off, only to see thousands of them. bad enough they made the relics so easy, from the old days. Keep something so people can wish full think or dream or have few hundred linkshell members help them get it .


We do not need ever thing handed to us on a silver platter, but they should make the reward feel special and for the players that got them should feel proud or like a kid in a candy store.

Thinking like this is why the game is dieing. Too many people only wanna think about the uber elite. I keep hearing Tier 1 like its a badge of status. All items, content, and accolades should be available to everyone in the game in this life time. Not everyone is either wealthy, has mom or dad to pay for all their bills, or has a job where they can sit in game all day doing stuff to earn one piece of equipment. The resurgence in the game of new players was because of the new stuff they did to give access to all areas solo or grouped and did not require 8 years of time to do. Nothing in this game should be just for the super elite, no life having, I do nothing but play FFXI all day people.

[Camate]

Happy Monday everyone!

We have still been seeing quite a few requests for increased Alexandrite circulation to help facilitate players’ journey towards their mythic weapons.

While Alexandrite can now be obtained in Nyzul Isle Uncharted Area Survey, circulation is increasing, but the volume is not quite there yet. One reason for this is that Salvage activity is much lower now than it was previously. However, as we will be expanding Salvage and revamping it later this year, the amount of Alexandrite in circulation should see a steady increase, so we’d like to ask you all to give us some time until then. Once this is implemented we would like to hear any feedback you have in regards to the amount of Alexandrite in circulation.

[Arcon]

The amount in circulation is not the issue. The amount required is.

[Kari]

The amount in circulation is not the issue. The amount required is.

I don't see how it is?
If you get Alex quicker/easier, it's about the same as reducing the amount required.
Except it doesn't screw over people who farmed 30k nearly as much.

They already said before they weren't ever changing the requirement, just changing the methods of acquiring.

[SpankWustler]

While Alexandrite can now be obtained in Nyzul Isle Uncharted Area Survey, circulation is increasing, but the volume is not quite there yet.

If the standard for circulation is what was happening two days before Neo-Nyzul Isle was released, of course circulation looks better now.

This way of thinking is akin to newly homeless man cheerfully commenting, "Now that my house is no longer on fire, it is not actively trying to kill me, but the burnt husk still provides little protection from things such as heavy rain, opportunistic thieves, or hungry bears!" then doing a happy little dance.

Things are more grim than "not quite there".

[Arcon]

I don't see how it is?
If you get Alex quicker/easier, it's about the same as reducing the amount required.

There is a difference. If there's more in circulation, but the same amount is required the value of each single piece will drop, meaning there'll be less incentive to farm them. Meaning there won't be nearly as many sold and all of them will have to be farmed. It will hurt the supply for Alex a lot. It would only help people who can get enough other members to do the new Salvage with. For people to farm and sell them they'll have to be worth money. And if people can't make decent money off of them, they won't farm them.


They already said before they weren't ever changing the requirement, just changing the methods of acquiring.

I must have missed that, but don't remember that statement.

[Ophannus]

I love back in 2006 when they said Mythics would be the casual-player's alternative to Relic weapons.

[Kiriah]

I love back in 2006 when they said Mythics would be the casual-player's alternative to Relic weapons.

*laughs pop on her screen and quickly wipes it up*

[Windwhisper]

Make Salvage soloable without the 3 people entry obstacle and we are good. Because usually people exploit the game mechanics by force disconnecting and soloing after anyhow. Salvage can be solod and there is no reason why this obstacle exists, not anymore since 99 cap.

[Edyth]

Happy Monday everyone!

We have still been seeing quite a few requests for increased Alexandrite circulation to help facilitate players’ journey towards their mythic weapons.

While Alexandrite can now be obtained in Nyzul Isle Uncharted Area Survey, circulation is increasing, but the volume is not quite there yet. One reason for this is that Salvage activity is much lower now than it was previously. However, as we will be expanding Salvage and revamping it later this year, we will the amount of Alexandrite in circulation should see a steady increase, so we’d like to ask you all to give us some time until then. Once this is implemented we would like to hear any feedback you have in regards to the amount of Alexandrite in circulation.

I truly expected the next mythic-related developer post to ruin my FFXI life and squash my hopes and dreams, but this didn't do that. Alexandrite supply has definitely increased, but so has the price. Mythic weapons cost over 600 million gil for the level 75 versions. Level 99 relics and empyreans cost less than level 75 mythic. Increasing supply may just mean that there will be more jackasses (more accurate term than mule, with extremely close animalistic meaning) sitting with 4000 alexandrite at 20K each in their bazaar. Increasing supply with Neo-Nyzul doubled alexandrite prices. Why? Because they still can't be farmed solo, your helpers always want their cut out of the few that piddle into the loot pool, only a couple enemies in Salvage and Nyzul can even drop alexandrite, and in Salvage, you have to trudge through grueling nudity before you can even think about farming alexandrite. Unless the Salvage revival is similar to the Dynamis revival, 30,000 alexandrite will still cost both arms, both legs, and more body parts than one human has.

[Keyln]

The key thing here is that the devs need to increases not only the amount of supply, but the access of the supply. The biggest problem right now is that Salvage still requires a minimum of three people to enter, so one can not simply walk into Salvage solo and farm Alexandrite. The one thing that the devs can do to make earning a Mythic much easier is to increase the access to the supply of Alexandrite by making Assaults and Salvage entry allowable with solo party members.

[Fusionx]

I think adding solo content for alexandrite would be better than simply relying on a revival of Salvage for more circulation. Circulation is great, but it needs to be most easily obtainable so the price will drop.

[Jackastheripper]

Wait, wait, wait. Complaints that a weapon name "Mythic" is to hard to get. Really?

[Arcon]

Circulation is great, but it needs to be most easily obtainable so the price will drop.

Only if the price will drop, people won't do it anymore. It needs to be comparable to Dynamis in terms of making money for people to actually do it. If the price drops, that is no longer the case and people won't do it to sell anymore, but only to keep. Hence, it will hurt the amount of Alex in circulation.


Wait, wait, wait. Complaints that a weapon name "Mythic" is to hard to get. Really?

No wonder they call you Jackass.

[Samosa]

Being able to enter Salvage and Assault solo would be a good start. At least that way those working on Mythics wouldn't have to rely on 2 others to be available.
The main reason the supply of Alex was so good a few years ago was because everyone wanted the gear from Salvage. If the devs can recreate this, then there is a good chance that a decent amount of Alex will enter the market again.
If the only change is an increase in supply of Alex available from Salvage, then yeah, it probably won't get much cheaper.

[Myo]

You guys are beating a dead horse.

On that note; I wonder if the new expansion will introduce a new version of "Legendary weapon" that Rune Fencer and Geomancer can also use... :o

[Scribble]

The only thing wrong with mythics is alexandrite supply, which SE is trying to address, but not really doing a good job of.

Seconded. Maybe thirded or more I guess. I didn't really read through the rest of the thread as it could have ended here XD

[Sayomi]

Im sure a new breed of weapons will arise with the expansion RNF doesnt look like any normal sword, and bells aren't really a weapon class we can pick as well, besides those event ones, so with any luck hopefully waiting for this expansion to come will change the game a bit, or will turn out to be nothing special and insanely hard to obtain anything new or alone like previous expansions have shown us thru history.

Before Expansion: "Maybe this expansion will change everything!" . . . After Expansion hits: "OMG these zones are so COOL and everything is so AWESOME!" Hours later when all your friends log off and everyone you know: "Ummmm so....lets see if I can kill this by myself......anyone online? I need a raise..." (Back then people cared about getting K.O'd losing exp stunk)

Ah what the hell, I hope this expansion changes everything!

[Babekeke]

Only if the price will drop, people won't do it anymore. It needs to be comparable to Dynamis in terms of making money for people to actually do it. If the price drops, that is no longer the case and people won't do it to sell anymore, but only to keep. Hence, it will hurt the amount of Alex in circulation.

The price isn't going to change much, I shouldn't think... price drops = more people willing to buy them instead of just soloing their own = price rise = more people doing salvage to sell alex = price drop etc. etc. etc. eventually it'll find a niche price and stay there.

Edit: not to mention, people might actually want to do salvage for new gear^^

[Arcon]

The price isn't going to change much, I shouldn't think... price drops = more people willing to buy them instead of just soloing their own = price rise = more people doing salvage to sell alex = price drop etc. etc. etc. eventually it'll find a niche price and stay there.

This would hold somewhat true if there was a constant demand for it. But there's not enough people even trying to build a mythic, and a majority of the ones who do are not willing to pay anything near the amount required to make the event profitable for people farming to sell. Reducing the requirements would actually achieve that. It would, in fact, motivate even more people to actually build them, because even if the Alex price stays the same the total price would still go down. This solution won't help, because if the Alex price drops, people won't farm them anymore and supply will stall. But if the price goes up again, more people will stop building their mythics, because currently they cost up to 600M, and almost no one is willing to pay that price.

[Helel]

Really getting tired of the devs saying that they are aware of the issue, don't worry, X event will fix the problem. Nyzul didn't fix the problem; it made it worse. How hard is it, seriously, to sit down for 5 minutes, and increase the drop rate in salvage. That's all you have to do. All you have to do is increase the drop rate in salvage . . . increase the drop rate in salvage . . . in salvage. Stop deferring this issue again and again while it gets worse and worse. This should have been fixed six months ago.

[Camiie]

How about the devs make it so we don't need an entire server farming up items just to make ONE weapon.

[Kiriah]

Id be happy with a in game mini map :( oh so happy

[Arcon]

That was random.

[Phupafighters]

Happy Monday everyone!

We have still been seeing quite a few requests for increased Alexandrite circulation to help facilitate players’ journey towards their mythic weapons.

While Alexandrite can now be obtained in Nyzul Isle Uncharted Area Survey, circulation is increasing, but the volume is not quite there yet. One reason for this is that Salvage activity is much lower now than it was previously. However, as we will be expanding Salvage and revamping it later this year, we will the amount of Alexandrite in circulation should see a steady increase, so we’d like to ask you all to give us some time until then. Once this is implemented we would like to hear any feedback you have in regards to the amount of Alexandrite in circulation.

Then I would suggest fixing order lamps in neo nyzle. Once you patch that dat swap "bug", no one will clear neo nyzle and supply will spike down again.

[detlef]

if the Alex price drops, people won't farm them anymore and supply will stall. But if the price goes up again, more people will stop building their mythics, because currently they cost up to 600M, and almost no one is willing to pay that price.If you can 2-box SSR, your total take will be comparable to a Dynamis run. The issue is of course, now you need 2 characters to play and a 3rd to help get you in. I think this is the largest obstacle to getting people to farm Salvage for gil. And if you have to split the alex it immediately loses its appeal.

Another issue is that only one of the zones is consistently profitable (SSR) and everybody would want to farm it. So while people have suggested removing the 3 person requirement to enter, there would then be competition for that single zone. I've read that you can only have 3 Salvage/Nyzul instances at a given time, which may or may not be accurate.

[Arcon]

If you can 2-box SSR, your total take will be comparable to a Dynamis run. The issue is of course, now you need 2 characters to play and a 3rd to help get you in. I think this is the largest obstacle to getting people to farm Salvage for gil. And if you have to split the alex it immediately loses its appeal.

And that's my point. Right now it's worth farming. But if the price of Alex drops it won't be anymore, especially not if you have to split it. Hence less people will actually farm them and supply will drop. And don't kid yourself if you think new Salvage will put out more than 100 Alex per run per person (my current average in SSR).


I've read that you can only have 3 Salvage/Nyzul instances at a given time, which may or may not be accurate.

That statement would be hard to disprove, and I have no hard information either way, but nothing I currently know supports that theory.

[Helyos]

And that's my point. Right now it's worth farming. But if the price of Alex drops it won't be anymore, especially not if you have to split it. Hence less people will actually farm them and supply will drop. And don't kid yourself if you think new Salvage will put out more than 100 Alex per run per person (my current average in SSR).


Dude I'm not getting what you're saying. If it's more accessible and the price goes down, more people are going to want mythics. And, like the dyna revamp, currency will fly off the shelves. I farm dyna knowing within 2 minutes of being back in Jeuno I'll already have sold them all. People will farm Alexandrite (if Salvage is made daily and soloable) knowing it will actually sell.

[THD]

Having made a Mythic (Tizona), I can attest to what a pain in the ass obtaining one is. I was lucky that I caught the tail end of people doing Salvage right as Abyssea picked and and no one wanted level 75 content. Alexandrite were only 3-4k each then, and I still had a difficult time finding them (I lucked out, found someone who gave up trying to get one and sold me 9000). Now they're 15-20k each, and there still isn't a great quantity out there, despite Neo-Nyzul.

Overall, they are the most difficult to obtain, and are disproportionate compared to relics and empys. Based on the data from the 10th (2012) Vana'diel census, there are (for all levels, and excluding the gimped WoE empys):
Empyrean: 89208
Relic: 16568
Mythic: 578

SE already lowered the number from 50,000 to 30,000. Given the other ridiculous requirements (repeating all 50 assaults, 150,000 Nyzul tokens, 100,000 Therion Ichor), lowering the amount needed is a option, on top of increasing circulation of Alexandrite.

[Arcon]

If it's more accessible and the price goes down, more people are going to want mythics.

If the price goes down it won't be worth farming and supply will drop heavily while demand increases. Hence, almost no one will be able to buy them at all and most people will have to farm them themselves. Which should be easier, if what they say about new Salvage is true, but it would still hurt the market for it. And honestly, I don't even believe what they're saying. Think about it, they wanna release a new event, which means it'll be aimed at 90+. Meaning the probability of you being able to solo it is unlikely. So even if you do get 300 Alex per run in the new Salvage, you'll still need to split it with several people and effectively make less than you already do now. Unless they up the Alex yield up to 600 or something, then I could see it being a possible solution, but I doubt that very much.


And, like the dyna revamp, currency will fly off the shelves.

Very big difference. After the Dynamis revamp it was not only easier to farm currency but more importantly you could farm more of it. That is not currently the case with Salvage. Currently you can't farm more Alex per run than you could at 75. And it doesn't scale either. If you farm Dynamis with three people you can get almost three times as much (even more if you play efficiently). That's not the case here. If you trio Salvage you can clear it faster, but the amount you obtain is still the same. You just have to split it with more people.

And the reason for that is that Salvage is a dungeon and has progression. Dynamis is actually designed to be farming ground. And unless they design the new Salvage with farming in mind (i.e. make mobs repop, large open areas, longer time limit, no different floors, etc.), which I really doubt, it will never compare. It won't fix the problem.

The best thing they could do would be to a) reduce the requirements from 30k to 10k and b) remove the minimum person entry limit. That alone would fix mythics big time. You could build them solo farming for ~4 months or buy them at current prices for a total of under 200M (instead of the current up to 600M), which would compare to relics. And with less Alexandrite required, the market would allow for more people to go after a weapon as well, because the buyer's market wouldn't be quite as competitive (or rather, not as long-lived for each single buyer).

[Kristal]

If the price goes down it won't be worth farming and supply will drop heavily while demand increases. Hence, almost no one will be able to buy them at all and most people will have to farm them themselves.

The demand for alexandrites is off the scale. The supply is a trickle. If anyone sells considerably below the average, their alex will be swooped up quickly and resold for the 'proper' price before anyone's the wiser. Droprates and prices will stay balanced. If SE changes droprates by 100% and improves salvage accesibility, alex price drops by only 25% due to increase in demand.

[Arcon]

The demand for alexandrites is off the scale. The supply is a trickle.

I can only speak for my server, where that statement is blatantly false (at any given time there are more than thousand Alex in bazaars and price has fallen already), but it doesn't really matter anyway. There's two kinds of demands, the one that affects the market and the one that affects only the person. The latter is for the people who wanna farm their own Alexandrite, because the price is off the hook, and that's precisely why most people don't even bother starting one.

If the price doesn't fall much, why would the demand increase? I think you have it backwards. Demand is determined after theprice. The supply does not affect the demand directly. The price does. Increase in supply leads to a decrease in price. However, if you say that the price won't fall much the demand won't go up much. The weapons don't get any better just because the supply increases, so that alone is not an incentive. When people are faced with the decision of making a mythic several questions spring to mind but the most decisive one is the price, because right now it's at 600M. If someone would go for it for 450M they'd also go for it for 600M so I don't see where the extra demand comes from. The only way the price wouldn't be affected much by it is if the new Salvage actually does put out more than the current one, which is ~80 per person which I doubt.

Also, a 25% in price is still quite a bit. That will put Salvage a good bit behind Dynamis in farming it for money. And that's still assuming you actually don't have to split the rewards, which does not apply to everyone. The only people who won't be affected by this all that much are the people farming both, but that takes a good 4h out of your day and I don't think that applies to many people either.

[Nala]

Eh while we are on the subject i think originally alex drop rates were lower because you could do salvage once per day (twice if you bought your permit before jp mid) so as long as you did it every day it could generate more currency over time then old dyna, that advantage is obsolete furthermore considering 1 mythic requires nearly 2x the currency of a relic (forget if the 17k/18k is after the refund or before) or at least a bit more than 50% greater requirement.

Compared to NeoDyna i know a few peeps that solo 200 currency consistently, 250-300(on a good run) considering that you likely are not soloing salvage either, that further halves personal gain (is 80 an acceptable average take for 1 person? idk dont do salvage atm) either way untill corrected i will assume 80, so not only do you have to acquire over 50% more alex but you acquire it at nearly 50% the rate of soloing dynamis.

Mythic acquisition is in my opinion one of the more flawed concepts the dev team has come out with, least the way i remember it being announced as being the casual's weapon, easier to get but required more questing, any one know how long it'd take to get the 100k nyzul tokens assuming a group of 6 with just enough tokens to buy floor 100 entry each? (rotating who buys in each time) not to mention their original concept of 50k alex.

At least with the most recent einherjar adjustment getting ampules is one hell of a bit easier especially if you're going with a large group and splitting the costs (taking turns buying in)

Also got to remember the ZNM pre adjustment between the old zenni acquisition rate, tiered progression, and the biggest slap was that the tier IV trophies were not 100%, never mind if your group had any interest in PW.

To top it off requiring basically to make captain 2x most people list the fact that you have to redo the assaults, but many peeps never did all them in the first place although you have to make captain just to start the mythic quest that's a min of 100 days. Also remember in the mean time your tags are competing with nyzul as you acquire tokens, never mind NNI as well (these really need a separate tag/traverse stone type system)

Mind you, the ability to do each of these events in one day and chip away at the progress bit by bit is there but thats one hell of a full day (minus nyzul/assualt tag share limitations).

[Razielrinz]

I agree with a lot of the sentiment here, glad to see a lot less of the it's perfect cause only the Elite can get it type responses. I am still of a mind that the Alex is a huge part but that the whole process needs revamping. The quests are fine but the Ichor, Tokens, and Alex requirements need to be chopped in addition to increasing the amount of each that you get. And I was thinking what about the people who already built one of these fine weapons at full price? Well that should be easy they should be able to trade their completed Mythic to a NPC that will refund them the difference in Alex from what they used. Maybe even credit them the difference in Ichor and Tokens as well, which will put them back on the road to making a new mythic if they want too. I still say there is no way making a weapon on any game should take 2-3 years. Especially if they are trying to appeal to the casual player who still wants to be able to do anything.

[detlef]

Tokens aren't too bad though. With a couple of DDS you can easily find yourself getting 5k tokens per run (old Nyzul). That puts you at 30 runs, compared to 50 assaults which people seem to grudgingly accept. So roughly 3 months to take care of those two requirements.

Ampoules still suck though. If you do Odin every other run, you're barely coming out ahead in amps. Or you'd have to buy feathers somehow. If you did the usual T1/T2/T3 > Odin it would take you 28 weeks.

[Sapphires]

Happy Monday everyone!

We have still been seeing quite a few requests for increased Alexandrite circulation to help facilitate players’ journey towards their mythic weapons.

While Alexandrite can now be obtained in Nyzul Isle Uncharted Area Survey, circulation is increasing, but the volume is not quite there yet. One reason for this is that Salvage activity is much lower now than it was previously. However, as we will be expanding Salvage and revamping it later this year, the amount of Alexandrite in circulation should see a steady increase, so we’d like to ask you all to give us some time until then. Once this is implemented we would like to hear any feedback you have in regards to the amount of Alexandrite in circulation.

I have never seen this mentioned, but I think more people would be willing to farm salvage for alexandrite if you made it more enjoyable by adjusting the inventory issues the 'cells' that remove the pathos (equipment, subjob locked, etc) cause by currently not being stackable.

Having to constantly pass/toss cells you or your party members no longer need quickly becomes tedious by the time you get to the 2nd floor and are killing large quantities of monsters. Making cells stackable *to 99 in quantity* would alleviate the tedium of having to pass cells since they would autosort+stack so players have room for the loot items they want such as single alexandrites/alex purses.

[Meldity]

I for one appreciate the time it takes to gather 30,000 alexandrites. While it may be near impossible I think it's an awesome way to define yourself from the other person. I love the exclusiveness factor. Suck it casuals.

[Camiie]

I for one appreciate the time it takes to gather 30,000 alexandrites. While it may be near impossible I think it's an awesome way to define yourself from the other person. I love the exclusiveness factor. Suck it casuals.

You should be nicer to the people who subsidize your game experience. FFXI wouldn't be here with "hardcores" alone.

Folks at SE do realize that it's been rather common for people to go cross-server to obtain Alexandrite, right? Isn't that a pretty telling sign that something is broke with the system? Is that "working as intended?" Of course I guess that's not a problem since it makes SE money right?

[Razielrinz]

You should be nicer to the people who subsidize your game experience. FFXI wouldn't be here with "hardcores" alone.


It's about time someone got this.

[deces]

Make all of ToAU solo entry... enough said.

P.S. not sure if its been said yet.

[Nawesemo]

Yeah, cuz being level 99made it soooooooo much harder.....wtf is it about sharing that is sooooooooooo difficult? Think about it, people "teamed" up to do this before, at...level.....75..... Now 24 levels later, its easier, not harder, and people just dont want to team up to get it done because they'd have to share.... And that is the way the cooki crumbles...

[Arcon]

Think about it, people "teamed" up to do this before, at...level.....75..... Now 24 levels later, its easier, not harder, and people just dont want to team up to get it done because they'd have to share....

Naturally. What else? It requires less people, so of course it should allow less people. How does that not make sense?

[Nawesemo]

/Facepalm.....

[Mirage]

It does make sense, actually.

[deces]

Your "cookie crumbles" is blind to the fact that 19 servers collapsed do to lack of progress and boredom and a few less responsible factors. People should not have to beg and bribe people who do not want to help others, A exiled CEO and a 19 server collapse is proof of that. SE recognizes that elitism runs rampant and has spoon feed whats left of us countless necessary adjustments to counter the problem. This is not an echo chamber for a failed delusional black hole ideas.

[Nawesemo]

Lol, yeah.....putting porn in seseme street can only keep the kiddies watching for so long after they hit 28, ..... Maybe some just out grew seseme street? Porn or not. (It's an analogy, you figure it out), yet we are still here, they must've done something right.

[Rezeak]

Overall, they are the most difficult to obtain, and are disproportionate compared to relics and empys. Based on the data from the 10th (2012) Vana'diel census, there are (for all levels, and excluding the gimped WoE empys):
Empyrean: 89208
Relic: 16568
Mythic: 578

SE already lowered the number from 50,000 to 30,000. Given the other ridiculous requirements (repeating all 50 assaults, 150,000 Nyzul tokens, 100,000 Therion Ichor), lowering the amount needed is a option, on top of increasing circulation of Alexandrite.

While i don't disagree with the op the way people are using the census no.s is wrong i mean there are
32 Relic Staffs
135 Mythic swords
So that means Relic staff is harder to make than a mythic sword by that logic.

Cost wise on my server 500mil would make a 99mythic and 180mil for a 99 relic so the gil cost is 3x more

So basically a Mythic is 4 X harder + 50 Assusalts you need to do + Ich/Tokens/Stuff u havn't done yet
So it's 5-10X harder (not 100 X harder)

The reason there are more Relics than Mythics is simple it's this question.
Do you want 5-10 99 relics/Emps or 1 99 mythic ?

[detlef]

500m for alex and scoria vs. 180m for currency and marrows is about 3x. The effort required to acquire the ampoules, tokens, and assaults clears is probably equivalent to a level 99 relic (maybe less). So you're looking at a mythic being 4x the cost of a relic.

[Zuidar]

They also need to introduce better methods in accessing assaults more readily. Although I think they mentioned not increasing stock of tags because of nyzul isle but, what about assault missions as a whole? That needs to be taken into consideration as a whole in general and not just for nyzul isle. If they can't then they should introduce new methods to be able to obtain new assault tags like they did with voiddusts to voidstones. We're at level 99 cap now so the progress with the assault missions needs to be looked at and adjusted and not nerfed. Now, looking at new Dynamis, the progress towards obtaining relics were increased significantly.

[Afania]

Your "cookie crumbles" is blind to the fact that 19 servers collapsed do to lack of progress and boredom and a few less responsible factors. People should not have to beg and bribe people who do not want to help others, A exiled CEO and a 19 server collapse is proof of that. SE recognizes that elitism runs rampant and has spoon feed whats left of us countless necessary adjustments to counter the problem. This is not an echo chamber for a failed delusional black hole ideas.

Lol do you honestly think 19 servers are gone just because Mythic is unobtainable?

The reason why population decrease is because:

1. Time passed: for any MMO, after 10 years of release, the active player will drop no matter what. A 10 years old MMO isn't going to get new player(unless they do major overhaul such as FFXIV Realm Reborn), when old player leaves the population dropped, and game company has to server merge.

2. Lack of resource: When a MMO is 10 years old, and not a lot of active players, game company won't put that much resource on new expansion etc. You're not going to see a 200 ppl team work on FFXI 2.0 with brand new game engine/story and some sort.
Without large amount of total new content, old players leaves and new player also won't come.


Server merge is inevitable for any MMO, MMO active subscribers bound to decrease, no matter what(FFXIV 2.0 may be exception due to sheer amount of resource they used to "save" it), it's certainly not because Mythic is not obtainable.

I mean, seriously, there are only a few Mythic that has a use. BLU, PUP, DRG, BLM, SMN, SAM, WHM, PLD, maybe BST. And out of all those Mythic that has a use, only KKK and polearm are truely job changing, everything else makes very little difference and not even worth the effort.

You honestly think 19 server worth of player quit just because they can't get KKK for their PUP or Rynohige for their DRG? Even if SE going to hand Mythic to every player in their Dbox, server merge is still inevitable. Not be able to obtain items(mythic) that makes very little difference in terms of performance for majority of jobs isn't going to make 19 server worth of player quit.

P.S, Server merge happened during Abyssea era also, when Empy outperforms relic/Mythic in every way and everyone and their mother have one/almost done with one. Majority of players have empy during Abby era, and yet server still merged, proved that population decrease has nothing to do with players can't get Mythic.

[Mirage]

If the price goes down it won't be worth farming and supply will drop heavily while demand increases.

So supply will drop, demand will increase, but prices won't increase to a level where it's worth farming? Sounds strange to me.

If the supply was lower than today and the demand was higher, how would that possibly not increase the price of alexandrite relative to what it is today?

[Rubicant82]

Relics cost less because one can solo Dynamis now, I remember the days where these prices were flipped Alex was 8k and AC was 11-16k depending on the coinage, granted that was YEARS ago. I don't know many people that run more than 2 people groups for dyna, or more than 4 max 6 for making empy weapons. So it would make sense for SE to lower the entrance req to 1 player if someone wanted to farm salvages, or do solo assaults.

[Rambus]

Happy Monday everyone!

We have still been seeing quite a few requests for increased Alexandrite circulation to help facilitate players’ journey towards their mythic weapons.

While Alexandrite can now be obtained in Nyzul Isle Uncharted Area Survey, circulation is increasing, but the volume is not quite there yet. One reason for this is that Salvage activity is much lower now than it was previously. However, as we will be expanding Salvage and revamping it later this year, the amount of Alexandrite in circulation should see a steady increase, so we’d like to ask you all to give us some time until then. Once this is implemented we would like to hear any feedback you have in regards to the amount of Alexandrite in circulation.
The amount of Alexandrite in circulation was never the issue, it is the amount required to get one, see:


I love back in 2006 when they said Mythics would be the casual-player's alternative to Relic weapons.

30000 was ALWAYS too much to fit ^ that concept.

With what i see from medel plates floating around is this the real order of difficulty to obtain a 99 weapon?:
Easy > hard
Relic>emp> mythic

and 99 afterglow anything is just obnoxious. Why that is even in the game is beyond my comprehensions so much so that is harder to get that then a relic in 2003-2004. Making everything easier then throwing that in the mix is..... can't even find a word for that.