Rune Fencer 2nd new job

[hideka]

totally calling it. the silhouette on the website is totaly a mystic knight.

[Zyla420]

would be epic +1, i'd totally lvl that shit

[Habu]

Why make a new thread when there's already a speculation thread?

[Daniel_Hatcher]

It's standing on a Rune, so could easily be Runic Knight.

[Merton9999]

It's standing on a Rune, so could easily be Runic Knight.

I'm speculating Runic Knight as the name too. Geomancer has been requested so often I'm saying SE is going to take another frequently requested ability and make a job that can finally use a Celes-esque Runic JA. And we'll have another entry into the hilariously long list of abilities appropriate for RDM that SE used to create a whole new job.

[Laurion]

totally calling it. the silhouette on the website is totaly a mystic knight.

Agreed. When me and the LS mates saw the silhouettes last night that was my first guess, our other guess though was "Squidmancer" since we thought that the other one could have been holding a giant squid and not a sword..

Mystic Knight seems more likely though.

[Zyla420]

i'm thinkin mystic knight or runic knight (whichever it will be called) isn't going to be something to replace or screw rdm. i'm thinkin it could be a new tank/dd job to compete with pld maybe. just speculation though

[svengalis]

Why make a new thread when there's already a speculation thread?

Because this isn't bg?

[Zumi]

I am thinking Runic Knight now.

[Edyth]

I wonder if they'll go with Spellblade as the job's name. That is the most recent name used for the Mystic Knight; it was in 2008's FF Tactics A2: Grimoire of the Rift.

A year before that, neither Mystic Knight or Runic Knight were in War of the Lions (there's no direct representation of the job, which involves dealing elemental damage with sword attacks), but Beowulf is a Templar whose abilities are called Spellblade.

Out of those names (Mystic Knight, Runic Knight, Spellblade, and Templar), I strongly prefer Runic Knight or Templar. Spellblade just has negative connotations with FFTA2's incredibly shallow job system for me. You know, the job system where BLM has a total of 9 spells.

Then there's another issue: what would Mystic Knight be doing in this game? RDM already has sword enchantment spells. Maybe Mystic Knight would turn its attacks into that element completely, rather than just added effect.

[Demon6324236]

Then there's another issue: what would Mystic Knight be doing in this game? RDM already has sword enchantment spells. Maybe Mystic Knight would turn its attacks into that element completely, rather than just added effect.

Just because RDM gets En-spells doesn't mean they get used, could just get better En-spells and it would finish the death RDM has been delt so long as it actualy gets to DD.

[Habu]

Because this isn't bg?

So you advocate the making of a useless thread when there's already an existing thread of the same nature? Glad to know you like such things.

[Iakothm]

I think its possible it could be a Mime job because It's Holding a sword and casting a spell showing the overall ability of the class.

[Nala]

Mystic Knight's spell blade did in fact fully modify damage dealt to elemental, if you used the wrong element you could end up healing mobs or doing less damage (going from the ff5 version here) while on the subject am i the only one who always thought the way that spell tiers scaled was kind of silly?

In most other FF's thunder 3 would be as strong as fire 3 (same base spell damage) but if you cast the right spell it would be twice as effective, however if you cast the wrong spell it could be half as effective or even end up healing a mob all together, would give great incentive to actually change up elements though would make meriting mage jobs more perilous.

Anyways just random musings of mine it always irked me how the tier spell system worked by comparison to every other FF. (hell it could give libra an actual use by revealing mob elemental weakness/strength in any case i do not forsee them ever bothering with this)

[Limecat]

Runic would be an awesome JA.

[Deadplaything]

Nightshade is my final guess, yet I do doubt due to the rune under the character in the silhouette.

[Merton9999]

Runic would be an awesome JA.

Hell yeah, it's been on my wishlist since '04 along with Blue Mage, Geomancer and Calculator jobs. There's actually be quite a bit of discussion about Runic on the RDM forums.

The JA could be interesting in a lot of ways. From a simple stun/absorption move for mob spells, to channeling that absorbed spell into large enspell-type damage or higher returns on WSs with matching elements of the absorbed spell. If they allowed XI Runic to work like VI's, you could even absorb player spells through your sword, with a new result of unleashing the energy to create a better combined teamwork effect. They'd have to make the result potent though, so people had a reason to go through the coordination, as we are even loath to do with SCs and MBs now.

Also, I don't think Runic Knight or whatever this is will compete with RDM, not that I would care if it did. Geomancer already looks to do that, and I've never described such as competition or "screwing", just a boon to people like me who like mage variety. When I laugh about the fact that a Runic ability was asked for by RDMs it's just because the cycle of "Give RDM this >>> new job" has happened so often.

Last, please don't let the job be called "Spellblade". Ugh, that just sounds too much like a move, not a job name. I'd be happy with Mystic Knight, Runic Knight or Templar, and would prefer it be meant as a tank class designed to absorb, mitigate, magnify redirect and repurpose magic from all casters.

[Daniel_Hatcher]

And the job is: Rune Fencer (shame on them: Their normal term is: Rune/ic Knight.)

Buh bye RDM.

[Habu]

Good job being wrong

[Demon6324236]

Yep, I will probably end up quiting the game soon. Thank you SE, gave a great reason for me to stop finally!

[Merton9999]

And the job is: Rune Fencer (shame on them: Their normal term is: Rune/ic Knight.)

Buh bye RDM.

Yeah "Fencer" is kind of odd with those very large swords in the image. Oh well, it was clear they didn't really know what Duelist or Estoqueur meant either.

[Dreamin]

Rune Fencer, just came across Twitter.

[Puck]

Pretty sure I heard them call it Mahou Kishi in Japanese, which would be Magic Knight or Mystic Knight.

[Scribble]

Pretty sure I heard them call it Mahou Kishi in Japanese, which would be Magic Knight or Mystic Knight.

It says Rune Fencer on their website (http://www.playonline.com/ff11us/adoulin/index.html) so it's probably not Mystic Knight...

[Mizuharu]

It says Rune Fencer on their website (http://www.playonline.com/ff11us/adoulin/index.html) so it's probably not Mystic Knight...

Or they mistranslated it from Rune Knight. Truth be told, the name for the job in Japanese can be translated into (Rune/Runic/Magic) (Knight/Fencer). :/

[Scribble]

Or, Heaven forbid, they mistranslated it from Rune Knight. But we all know that these things never happen. Ever.

There is a difference between a Mystic Knight and a Rune Knight. Since the official site says Rune Knight, I'd say it's a safe bet. Either way, kick in the teeth to Red Mages :D

[Mizuharu]

There is a difference between a Mystic Knight and a Rune Knight. Since the official site says Rune Knight, I'd say it's a safe bet. Either way, kick in the teeth to Red Mages :D

How is it a kick in the teeth to RDMs? This is suppose to be a tanking job that focuses on defenses against magic. They said so when they announced the job. >.>

PLD - Physical Tank
NIN - Evasion Tank
Rune Knight(Fencer. Whatever.) - Magic Tank

[Demon6324236]

How is it a kick in the teeth to RDMs? This is suppose to be a tanking job that focuses on defenses against magic. They said so when they announced the job. >.>

PLD - Physical Tank
NIN - Evasion Tank
Rune Knight(Fencer. Whatever.) - Magic Tank

There was a time when RDM was a magic tank, when not every single PLD had an Aegis. Also this takes Enspells and uses them as well, something that until now was the only real unique melee power RDM had. I have said before and will say again, RDM has no advantage over SCH/RDM except melee. As such taking away the only extra power a RDM has in melee kills that effect of it. This job kills the last 2 things RDM had left, elemental enspells & magic defense tanking.

[Scribble]

How is it a kick in the teeth to RDMs? This is suppose to be a tanking job that focuses on defenses against magic. They said so when they announced the job. >.>

PLD - Physical Tank
NIN - Evasion Tank
Rune Knight(Fencer. Whatever.) - Magic Tank

Don't get me wrong I'm not a RDM hater. I guess I just see it as a JoaT job that doesn't really excel at any one particular thing. Rune Knight looks like a RDM with melee ability minus the enfeebles. I know SE has plans for enfeebles so maybe RDM will shine here, although Geomancer looks to have debuffs as well, but I get the feeling that if you had to choose between a RDM and a RKT for melee the RDM would get snubbed again.

[Neisan_Quetz]

There was a time when RDM was a magic tank, when not every single PLD had an Aegis. Also this takes Enspells and uses them as well, something that until now was the only real unique melee power RDM had. I have said before and will say again, RDM has no advantage over SCH/RDM except melee. As such taking away the only extra power a RDM has in melee kills that effect of it. This job kills the last 2 things RDM had left, elemental enspells & magic defense tanking.


You can't be serious with what I just read...


Looks like a fun job but if it really is going to be taking a tanking role, doesn't really affect Rdm anyway. Closer to sharing slot with Pld but even then, it's not like tanks are viable for many strategies right now that don't involve holding adds.

[Llana_Virren]

You can't be serious with what I just read...


Looks like a fun job but if it really is going to be taking a tanking role, doesn't really affect Rdm anyway. Closer to sharing slot with Pld but even then, it's not like tanks are viable for many strategies right now that don't involve holding adds.

He was serious, and it's valid, RDM will have been successfully obliterated with SCH, RUN and GEO.
As an aside, with the introduction of a lot of "instanced dungeons" and such, I see an attempt to draw away from the zerg-fest that is VW and current end-game.

Only time will tell.

[Neisan_Quetz]

Melee and the short stint of tanking were never really advantages of Rdm (it was interesting, but ultimately impractical in the long term), hence I said it can't be serious.

Rdm has been useless long before RUN and GEO were announced.

[Llana_Virren]

Rdm has been useless long before RUN and GEO were announced.

Yes, but the thing that upsets a lot of players is that the concept for GEO and RUN can all be traced to recommendations made for enhancing/fixing RDM. So basically, the Dev Team took all the good ideas for RDM, made a new job(s) with them, and left RDM completely untouched.

[Neisan_Quetz]

No, I doubt either would have fixed the job. Only an overhaul, which they seem to be partly considering would do that.

[Zumi]

Since they adding a new Tank job does that mean they will fix tanking? Everyone just hits the hate cap and the mob just bounces around to whoever hit it last.

[Llana_Virren]

Since they adding a new Tank job does that mean they will fix tanking? Everyone just hits the hate cap and the mob just bounces around to whoever hit it last.

With the introduction of "instanced dungeons" and the like, I think they are attempting to make tanking a viable option for certain events, however anything that is alliance+ in size will most likely never see tanking the way it used to be.

[Demon6324236]

Melee and the short stint of tanking were never really advantages of Rdm (it was interesting, but ultimately impractical in the long term), hence I said it can't be serious.

Rdm has been useless long before RUN and GEO were announced.

I pride myself on being one of few RDMs still willing to pick up a sword and take up a fight or tank when able, I play the job how it should, using all its abilitys rather than just magic or even limited to 1 form of magic. I was 100% serious, in saying that this is bad for RDM, because it takes the last thing we had to the job that was truely unique, the elemental enspells. DRK & PLD already hurt this with their own, but it was dark & light, elements RDM didnt have so it wasnt as bad, but this time it sounds like its steping directly into RDM's area.

Tank or no, you can not say RDM puts out a ton of damage, which is your point, so a RUN will probably be about the same damage wise or little lower, if the idea this job will be using Great Swords is correct, this is actually even worse because there is a 99% chance this will outdamage RDM, especially since alot of people have Calad/Rag now.


No, I doubt either would have fixed the job. Only an overhaul, which they seem to be partly considering would do that.

Fix, no, help, yes. Does it mean nothing to anyone that rather than fix the currently broken hybrid mage, they want to go out and make 1-2 more of them? If you don't know what your doing, stop doing it, or fix your current problem 1st!

[Demon6324236]

Yes, but the thing that upsets a lot of players is that the concept for GEO and RUN can all be traced to recommendations made for enhancing/fixing RDM. So basically, the Dev Team took all the good ideas for RDM, made a new job(s) with them, and left RDM completely untouched.

That is actually my biggest problem with it, they are making jobs with things that could have/should have been used for RDM. RDM has been left alone or with minor tweaks for to long and is showing no signs of being brought back into the mix. RDM is currently for old content soloing for the most part, very little outside of this, in fact, VW just lost use for RDM in its entirety!

When asked about why RDM got no update to its merits when other jobs were, SE said our update was more the update to enfeebling magic. If they remove resistance they are screwing RDM up even more! We have no hold on enfeebling magic as it is, SCH/RDM can do just as well or better, they can stack alot of magic acc + gear, have enfeebling gear, and best of all, if it cant land they have a strat to make magic acc higher(if merited) meaning things will likely stick more often than RDM.

Enfeebling is dead because WHM, BLM, & SCH/RDM can do it all. Healing is dead because of SCH & WHM, Nuking is dead because of SCH & BLM, Melee is dead because RDM does not have the proper DD power to do what needs done. Yet instead of fixing any of these aspects, they have introduced a new enfeebler/enhancer, and a new magic tank/enhancer. :confused:

This magic tank idea is stupid anyways. A magic tank (unless they know reflect, another spell suggested for RDM) it will not matter! PLD+Aegis+MDT/MDB set=Magic immune god! A magic tank will give people a gimp tank for magic mobs when no Aegis PLD is around to do the job right. Because I seriously don't see this job outdoing a PLD with the gear PLD is been expected to have now days.

This makes me feel uneasy, and as if I should reconsider continuing to play this game. Time and time again I have had the job I play, have played, and will continue to play, screwed and left for dead. I feel as if SE doesn't care about cleaning up their mess, they want to make new jobs, play with cool new toys, and leave RDM to rot for its evil ways in the past of actually being a good job.

[Keyln]

If the job updates were any indication, it sounds like they're changing alot of things on how tanking works. I wouldn't be surprised if they fixed defense to where people take less damage when hit with high defense, and how enmity works.

That would be the critical difference between PLD and RNF (I refuse to use RUN as the abbreviation for Rune Fencer). PLD is focused on blocking physical damage while RNF is focused on reducing magic damage. The question then is where does that leave NIN and WAR?

[Demon6324236]

I have a question about this job... Just how is this job, and its role it is being given, a good idea?

[Demon6324236]

PLD is focused on blocking physical damage while RNF is focused on reducing magic damage.

Unless they give "RNF" Aegis or something very similar it will matter nothing, PLD already has the single most amazing piece of magic blocking gear in the game, and unless they nerf it or they give the new magic tank something very much the same PLD will still be the goto guy for both of them seeing as Aegis also works very well for melee falling short only to the other super shield in the game.

[saevel]

Doesn't matter, not one bit

RKN (RUN) could have -100% MDT and complete Magic Immunity, and they still wouldn't be tanking nor effective.

Hate is now about how much damage you can do and how often your hitting once your at hate cap. Also monsters don't really kill you with powerful single target magic damage, they kill you with powerful aoe moves. So you can be the shining wall of invincibility, won't matter as everyone else around you will die.

[Milva]

I'm speculating Runic Knight as the name too. Geomancer has been requested so often I'm saying SE is going to take another frequently requested ability and make a job that can finally use a Celes-esque Runic JA. And we'll have another entry into the hilariously long list of abilities appropriate for RDM that SE used to create a whole new job.

Runic Fencer - everything RDM-tanking and RDM-meele could have been.
At least now we know why for the past 3 years they were taking EVERYTHING from RDM. Great way to kill off a flourishing job, SE...

[Demon6324236]

Doesn't matter, not one bit

RKN (RUN) could have -100% MDT and complete Magic Immunity, and they still wouldn't be tanking nor effective.

Hate is now about how much damage you can do and how often your hitting once your at hate cap. Also monsters don't really kill you with powerful single target magic damage, they kill you with powerful aoe moves. So you can be the shining wall of invincibility, won't matter as everyone else around you will die.

I speak under the idea that they would not knowingly make a job with the idea of tanking without fixing the fact tanking doesn't actually exist... I mean no one is that stupid... right?

[Llana_Virren]

I speak under the idea that they would not knowingly make a job with the idea of tanking without fixing the fact tanking doesn't actually exist... I mean no one is that stupid... right?

RDMs called, they want their unearned hope back.

[saevel]

I speak under the idea that they would not knowingly make a job with the idea of tanking without fixing the fact tanking doesn't actually exist... I mean no one is that stupid... right?

Tanaka is still in charge of development, meaning nothing will get fixed until after he leaves. Then and only then can we hope for tanking to be fixed.

Honest the issue is two fold, first being that damage far out stripes everything else for hate generation. A melee can hit the hate cap within two WS's. No modification to the hate cap itself will fix this. Second is that SE has decided to give all NMs super Abyssea like aoe moves of death. We simply don't have the HP to survive for long. This is why we've come to rely on PD / Embrava zerg fests.

They would need to dramatically reduce the hate gained from damage, we're talking 10% of it's current value for anyone not in full DD gear to have a hope in keeping hate. They would then need to reduce the aoe spam of death by 50% or more in order to allow players to actually stay alive in fights that last longer then 3~5m.

[Demon6324236]

Yes but my point is that this seems to be a time of change honestly. We are getting enfeebling change, a new expansion after all this time, a new UI for PC, much is changing in this time, and with it I hope they fix this broken part of the game before they try to add to it. My hopes are equally as doubtful because of my RDM, but hope is all I have left, if SE screws up this time, I label the game dead to me, simple as that.

[Reiterpallasch]

Hate is now about how much damage you can do and how often your hitting once your at hate cap.
Pretty much always been this way. At least since way back during the PLD/NIN days in any case. Damage has and (until they revamp it) always will be the #1 tool for enmity generation.

[Llana_Virren]

Yes but my point is that this seems to be a time of change honestly. We are getting enfeebling change, a new expansion after all this time, a new UI for PC, much is changing in this time, and with it I hope they fix this broken part of the game before they try to add to it. My hopes are equally as doubtful because of my RDM, but hope is all I have left, if SE screws up this time, I label the game dead to me, simple as that.

Enfeebling changes are going to be aimed towards making sure GEO is relevant. RDM has nothing to do with it, and I hope that you're not still playing FFXI under the hope that RDM will somehow be fixed.

If you are, just call it dead now and quit; save yourself the inevitable disappointment that is post-2006 RDM.

[Puck]

Tanaka is still in charge of development, meaning nothing will get fixed until after he leaves. Then and only then can we hope for tanking to be fixed.
Did you actually watch the stream? Like, all of it? Tanaka wasn't even present at the dev panels, and didn't speak a word of the new expansion.

If you saw the things they had him do during Vanafest, like grabbing numbers for Mog Bonanza and showcasing food during a filler spot and other unsubstantial things, it REALLY supported the idea that he's in that "we're not gonna fire you but your job will no longer have meaning" zone as punishment for FFXIV.

[Demon6324236]

Enfeebling changes are going to be aimed towards making sure GEO is relevant. RDM has nothing to do with it, and I hope that you're not still playing FFXI under the hope that RDM will somehow be fixed.

If you are, just call it dead now and quit; save yourself the inevitable disappointment that is post-2006 RDM.

I honestly have no idea what I want at this point, maybe I expect SE to at least try to fix the game. I ask them to try, show me effort, show me they care, maybe Ill be happy with that, or with them actually listening to a RDM who plays the job and knows what hes doing rather than thinking its just magic only or some shit. I know its not going to happen, but I rather see SE actually try.

Maybe if I bitch enough, or I raze hell, I might make a dent. So far as I have seen I make alot of people on Phoenix look at my RDM and say "damn, that guy kicks ass, I didn't know RDM could do that!" I thought I might be able to come to the forums and impact how people see the worthless job that it is. Perhaps I could help in some way the shape it takes in the future, to better this job and make it worth something again. I was wrong though, your right, perhaps I should quit this game, SE has screwed things up so bad, and fixed so little, that shows no signs of changing till this comes out, and then look at it, and see how the game is fucked up at that time.

[saevel]

Did you actually watch the stream? Like, all of it? Tanaka wasn't even present at the dev panels, and didn't speak a word of the new expansion.

If you saw the things they had him do during Vanafest, like grabbing numbers for Mog Bonanza and showcasing food during a filler spot and other unsubstantial things, it REALLY supported the idea that he's in that "we're not gonna fire you but your job will no longer have meaning" zone as punishment for FFXIV.

I apologize as I haven't been watching the stream, only the tweets / posted info. I watched some of the music though.

If it is as you say, Tanaka being completely sidelined, then there is hope that things will get fixed sooner rather then later. Still as long as he has a fancy title on his desk they can not undo anything that has his name on it, it would be to insulting to the company itself. They can not make any announcements of changes from things he did until after his leaves, and then they have to do it in a somewhat circumspect way.

[Demon6324236]

Did you actually watch the stream? Like, all of it? Tanaka wasn't even present at the dev panels, and didn't speak a word of the new expansion.

If you saw the things they had him do during Vanafest, like grabbing numbers for Mog Bonanza and showcasing food during a filler spot and other unsubstantial things, it REALLY supported the idea that he's in that "we're not gonna fire you but your job will no longer have meaning" zone as punishment for FFXIV.

It matters nothing, if hes in effecting it or not, they are still fucking up, and that in general says it all. Expansion=Good. Farming & raising monsters on your island=Bad. New Magic tank that will never replace Aegis PLD but tries to make up for it by killing off the rest of RDM=Bad. New AoE buffer using the idea of Sphere effects, so that the effects, or the buffer, can be killed by crazy AoE damage while keeping players buffed=Bad. Monster PvP=Bad. Everything else I saw about this expansion was either to vague for me to know what to expect, or was pointless enough I didn't think it important enough to commit to memory.

Yesterday I was happy, I admit, today, I am pissed, because I have been told as a RDM that they still arnt doing shit to help me out of being in the spot I'm in, and gave me no reason to think I am, rather, they keep digging my grave deeper and deeper in the ground.

[Llana_Virren]

It matters nothing, if hes in effecting it or not, they are still fucking up, and that in general says it all. Expansion=Good. Farming & raising monsters on your island=Bad. New Magic tank that will never replace Aegis PLD but tries to make up for it by killing off the rest of RDM=Bad. New AoE buffer using the idea of Sphere effects, so that the effects, or the buffer, can be killed by crazy AoE damage while keeping players buffed=Bad. Monster PvP=Bad. Everything else I saw about this expansion was either to vague for me to know what to expect, or was pointless enough I didn't think it important enough to commit to memory.

Yesterday I was happy, I admit, today, I am pissed, because I have been told as a RDM that they still arnt doing shit to help me out of being in the spot I'm in, and gave me no reason to think I am, rather, they keep digging my grave deeper and deeper in the ground.

Let me just take a moment to remind you (and others) that this Expansion is not due for another year. Many details were left out because they were not yet ironed out. So, that said, the only thing for certain is the 2 new jobs, and I will expect sometime within the next few months, for SE to announce they are deleting RDM as a job option.

Other than that, don't get bent out of shape yet. Don't even bother to theorycraft yet. We are getting ahead of ourselves here.

[Demon6324236]

I simply state content that was shown before me and how I see it. RDM might as well be deleted anyways, make Rune RDM2.0 and flip off everyone who actually likes RDM once again, seems to be their goal anyways.

[Llana_Virren]

I simply state content that was shown before me and how I see it. RDM might as well be deleted anyways, make Rune RDM2.0 and flip off everyone who actually likes RDM once again, seems to be their goal anyways.

SCH was RDM v2
GEO will be RDM v2.1
RNK will be RDM v2.1.1melee

[Demon6324236]

SCH was RDM v2
GEO will be RDM v2.1
RNK will be RDM v2.1.1melee

RDM's style has been using magic & melee in combo to create a destructive force about as strong as those lv0 bunnys near Windy.

SCH was as I have said before, WHM+BLM, excluding the WAR part that is in RDM. SCH honestly has little in terms of ideal in relation to GEO at all, only AoE buffs, which is a small detail of SCH. SCH's ideal is the use of strats to extend magical capabilitys while also focusing on "over-time" type spells & abilitys, shown by Regen/Embrava, Helix/Kaustra, and Stratagems/Tabula Rasa.

Geo is more a Sphere effects job, just another way to implement their "new" idea of sphere effects in a different way, a field which if you stand in, you get stronger.

Everything melee based in RDM is going into Rune, being enhancing, enspells, and seemingly survivability. As such it is more a 2.0 job than SCH or GEO have been/will be.

[Llana_Virren]

RDM's style has been using magic & melee in combo to create a destructive force about as strong as those lv0 bunnys near Windy.

SCH was as I have said before, WHM+BLM, excluding the WAR part that is in RDM. SCH honestly has little in terms of ideal in relation to GEO at all, only AoE buffs, which is a small detail of SCH. SCH's ideal is the use of strats to extend magical capabilitys while also focusing on "over-time" type spells & abilitys, shown by Regen/Embrava, Helix/Kaustra, and Stratagems/Tabula Rasa.

Geo is more a Sphere effects job, just another way to implement their "new" idea of sphere effects in a different way, a field which if you stand in, you get stronger.

Everything melee based in RDM is going into Rune, being enhancing, enspells, and seemingly survivability. As such it is more a 2.0 job than SCH or GEO have been/will be.

What you're missing is that enhancing and enfeebling abilities are equal to RDM as melee was in terms of what made it unique. SCH stripped the idea of unmatched Enhancing Magic from RDM. GEO will take the A+ Enfeebling Magic skill out of the equation. The only thing that RUN/RNK/RNF actually takes away from RDM is the melee.

Thus, all 3 of these jobs were in one way or another, the "next incarnation" of RDM.

[Scribble]

Yesterday I was happy, I admit, today, I am pissed, because I have been told as a RDM that they still arnt doing shit to help me out of being in the spot I'm in, and gave me no reason to think I am, rather, they keep digging my grave deeper and deeper in the ground.

SE has said they're working on enfeebles, which is supposed to be the main role for RDM anyway. For the love of Altana, stop whining like a baby. If you're gonna quit then quit, but at least quit bitching. Could quench the thirst of a thousand trolls with all these tears.

[Llana_Virren]

SE has said they're working on enfeebles, which is supposed to be the main role for RDM anyway.

They're not going to do anything to enfeebles until after GEO gets more thoroughly tested. Thus, they are working on enfeebles for the benefit of GEO.

RDM will get nothing.

[Lilia]

the enfeebling update? dont help the rdm... is more for the low skill whm,sch,blm or blu.
when all jobs can enfeeling a mob, why you invite a rdm? for ... idk.
The most thing you become from a ldr is "RDM? change job, come extra blm or extra sch or or or.....
enfeebling is so dead!
RDM with high skill can so many nm enfeebling, but want- no, in VW ? 100% you change job.

[Nakts]

Isn't this all just speculation now, if I'm wrong, please point it out to me.

[Keyln]

Isn't this all just speculation now, if I'm wrong, please point it out to me.

You're wrong.

[Zerich]

It matters nothing, if hes in effecting it or not, they are still fucking up, and that in general says it all. Expansion=Good. Farming & raising monsters on your island=Bad. New Magic tank that will never replace Aegis PLD but tries to make up for it by killing off the rest of RDM=Bad. New AoE buffer using the idea of Sphere effects, so that the effects, or the buffer, can be killed by crazy AoE damage while keeping players buffed=Bad. Monster PvP=Bad. Everything else I saw about this expansion was either to vague for me to know what to expect, or was pointless enough I didn't think it important enough to commit to memory.

but we don't have any actual abilities or traits that the Runic(whatever) will be getting, or the GEO. and i didn't know that you already were a master about the new NMs and jobs.

[Demon6324236]

but we don't have any actual abilities or traits that the Runic(whatever) will be getting, or the GEO. and i didn't know that you already were a master about the new NMs and jobs.

Simple way to say it, do you think this job will beat Aegis PLD in MDT/MDB gear? No? Then the role SE said it will have is pointless, thus if it is released without nerfing those things or making this new job nearly immune to magic, it will not matter, because they job will come as just a gimp PLD for magic mobs, nothing more it seems. It is fact as well they said that it will be using elemental enspells, something that is only RDM, but now for this job as well. What I said about it only goes from what they said about it, its a magic tank, PLD already mitigates 75% magic damage, reflect is the only way this job could possibly be better because the job would need to be to unbalanced to compete with the already unbalanced PLD magic defense tank. And as a DD, it takes RDM's enspells, the only thing about melee it had that made it special, and magic defense tanking was once a RDM's thing before Aegis PLDs were all over. Now, will be no longer true.

I don't need to be a master of new jobs or a member of the dev team itself to listen to what I'm told about the updates and point out its flaws. I doubt any abilities or traits will make Runic>Paladin due to how PLD is already, if I'm wrong, SE is smart and did something right with it, chances are, I'm not. I do not hate Geo for 2 reasons, enfeebling stacks with others, and its enhancing idea seems to kinda suck in current events at least.

GEO was clearly spelt out to us about 3 things, enfeebles (weird I thought RDM did that) and casts spells on themselves that give nearby party members a buff (sphere effects anyone?) or can cast similar spells on party members, but the effect doesn't move with the player. The problem with GEO for now at least is this AoE on self buff, for now its worthless to melees. Last I checked everything has big evil AoE attacks from hell that are not fun nor friendly to mages, which your asking to stand... right next to all the DDs getting hit with massive AoE so they can die... yeah, totally not flawed at all.

[Demon6324236]

SE has said they're working on enfeebles, which is supposed to be the main role for RDM anyway. For the love of Altana, stop whining like a baby. If you're gonna quit then quit, but at least quit bitching. Could quench the thirst of a thousand trolls with all these tears.

You tell me why I should be happy with a piss poor excuse for an update to "help" my job when it helps every single job with an enfeebling magic skill at the same time! This doesn't really help RDM, I wonder when people will actually realize this.

[Neisan_Quetz]

Simple way to say it, do you think this job will beat Aegis PLD in MDT/MDB gear? No? Then the role SE said it will have is pointless, thus if it is released without nerfing those things or making this new job nearly immune to magic, it will not matter, because they job will come as just a gimp PLD for magic mobs, nothing more it seems. It is fact as well they said that it will be using elemental enspells, something that is only RDM, but now for this job as well. What I said about it only goes from what they said about it, its a magic tank, PLD already mitigates 75% magic damage, reflect is the only way this job could possibly be better because the job would need to be to unbalanced to compete with the already unbalanced PLD magic defense tank. And as a DD, it takes RDM's enspells, the only thing about melee it had that made it special, and magic defense tanking was once a RDM's thing before Aegis PLDs were all over. Now, will be no longer true.

I don't need to be a master of new jobs or a member of the dev team itself to listen to what I'm told about the updates and point out its flaws. I doubt any abilities or traits will make Runic>Paladin due to how PLD is already, if I'm wrong, SE is smart and did something right with it, chances are, I'm not. I do not hate Geo for 2 reasons, enfeebling stacks with others, and its enhancing idea seems to kinda suck in current events at least.

GEO was clearly spelt out to us about 3 things, enfeebles (weird I thought RDM did that) and casts spells on themselves that give nearby party members a buff (sphere effects anyone?) or can cast similar spells on party members, but the effect doesn't move with the player. The problem with GEO for now at least is this AoE on self buff, for now its worthless to melees. Last I checked everything has big evil AoE attacks from hell that are not fun nor friendly to mages, which your asking to stand... right next to all the DDs getting hit with massive AoE so they can die... yeah, totally not flawed at all.

- Enspell 1s are subbable, the only reason anyone started caring was because a job ability came along that could AoE it.
- Rdm melee has never been anything special, it's in direct competition with a healing job as a melee.
- Aegis didn't kill Rdm tanking, better methods of 'tanking' (dealing damage) in addition to a spell enmity reduction did.

And no Pld has never been a good DD...

[Teraniku]

Let's see the gist of this thread boils down to:

Paraphrasing: "I was this game's God-Mode at the 75 cap and now that that they've raised the cap to 99 and I'm no longer relevant, You give stuff to these new jobs that should have been given to me in the 1st place!"

It's the nature of the game. BLMs were top dog until ToAU and the very specific mobs targeted at them to make them totally undesirable there. SMN have been crying for years for relevancy and to be brought up to par. PLDs, even properly equipped are barely usuable at endgame even now. Give it time, job adjustments are coming but the "balance" you want and what SE thinks the game needs are 2 totally different things. If you don't like the direction the game is going than take a break and come back.

[Demon6324236]

Yes, job adjustments are coming, last time RDMs asked SE about our adjustments we were told the same thing I'm being told now, the enfeebling changes, which don't actually help RDM, they drive it even further into the ground.

[Lilia]

"you become new enfeebling spells rdm"...

addle but whm have too
gravity2 ... "you can stack with gravity"

sorry but this "new spells for rdm" is so disappoint

[Daniel_Hatcher]

Since they are for magical defence, my money's on this job will be the one to get Reflect.

[Nala]

Not that im disagreeing with you Demon but i'm under the impression that runic knight's damage will be more spell blade style (mystic knight FFV style) so its not exactly en spells... on the other side of things though you could probably view these as Enspell 3 with a different name /sigh.

In anycase mystic knights spell blade converted all their damage to the element of enhancement VS additional damage... this'd make them potent vs high PDT- mobs, and as far as the magic tank totally with ya there, they'd have to make them stupidly broken to beat out aegis pld.

On a side note making protectra V fully merited 4x as powerful think that might actually make defense relevant again?

[Demon6324236]

Not that im disagreeing with you Demon but i'm under the impression that runic knight's damage will be more spell blade style (mystic knight FFV style) so its not exactly en spells... on the other side of things though you could probably view these as Enspell 3 with a different name /sigh.

In anycase mystic knights spell blade converted all their damage to the element of enhancement VS additional damage... this'd make them potent vs high PDT- mobs, and as far as the magic tank totally with ya there, they'd have to make them stupidly broken to beat out aegis pld.

On a side note making protectra V fully merited 4x as powerful think that might actually make defense relevant again?

It might, problem is that it being so strong though sounds like if it is more relevant a WHM casting it on everyone in the party will be needed, which means less spots for other jobs, or more annoying cycling like with COR & BRD. I do like the fact they have seemed to take notice that some things are not as effective as they need to be and are trying to improve, like with Cure1~4 and now Protect. Somewhat surprised they didn't just make it PDT like shell is with MDT though, or perhaps thats when they meant and threw a random number at us, who knows.

[Zerich]

Simple way to say it, do you think this job will beat Aegis PLD in MDT/MDB gear? No? Then the role SE said it will have is pointless, thus if it is released without nerfing those things or making this new job nearly immune to magic, it will not matter, because they job will come as just a gimp PLD for magic mobs, nothing more it seems. It is fact as well they said that it will be using elemental enspells, something that is only RDM, but now for this job as well. What I said about it only goes from what they said about it, its a magic tank, PLD already mitigates 75% magic damage, reflect is the only way this job could possibly be better because the job would need to be to unbalanced to compete with the already unbalanced PLD magic defense tank. And as a DD, it takes RDM's enspells, the only thing about melee it had that made it special, and magic defense tanking was once a RDM's thing before Aegis PLDs were all over. Now, will be no longer true.

I don't need to be a master of new jobs or a member of the dev team itself to listen to what I'm told about the updates and point out its flaws. I doubt any abilities or traits will make Runic>Paladin due to how PLD is already, if I'm wrong, SE is smart and did something right with it, chances are, I'm not. I do not hate Geo for 2 reasons, enfeebling stacks with others, and its enhancing idea seems to kinda suck in current events at least.

GEO was clearly spelt out to us about 3 things, enfeebles (weird I thought RDM did that) and casts spells on themselves that give nearby party members a buff (sphere effects anyone?) or can cast similar spells on party members, but the effect doesn't move with the player. The problem with GEO for now at least is this AoE on self buff, for now its worthless to melees. Last I checked everything has big evil AoE attacks from hell that are not fun nor friendly to mages, which your asking to stand... right next to all the DDs getting hit with massive AoE so they can die... yeah, totally not flawed at all.

sorry, but RDM tanking died when they reduced enmity from enfeebles. i hope you didn't think that rdm melee was ever strong enough to keep hate on anything with real dd's on it...the concept that rdm melee being a relevant magic tank is as real as whm melee tanking all enemy magic attacks (btw they can absorb more magic damage than rdm) not going to make any statements, but i'm sure that runic is intended to be magic-def tanking, however will probably find some other niche place in the game, unless it comes with respectable DD qualities.

i'm not trying to fight, just pointing stuff out that you might overlook.

[Melraen]

Haven't seen anything about this so far, so I'm not quite sure I heard it now, but on the NA stream didn't they mention that they could put barriers around party members to protect them from magic damage? That sounds like it could be useful, maybe it'll help with magical AoEs at least. ^^

[Merton9999]

Haven't seen anything about this so far, so I'm not quite sure I heard it now, but on the NA stream didn't they mention that they could put barriers around party members to protect them from magic damage? That sounds like it could be useful, maybe it'll help with magical AoEs at least. ^^

Yes the live feed did say this. It immediately gave me the impression that this "tank" class would be less like the traditional "Keep the mob's attention and avoid/endure its attacks" and more focused on protecting the party from the recent waves of massive AOE. I get the feeling that old hate mechanics will not be expected to return and that they're going with a different idea of tanking here.

I remember posts after BLU and DNC were announced, and people weren't even close on how those jobs were eventually implemented. Whatever pessimism I have about these new "play as monster" and outpost building systems, I've seldom been disappointed in the dev teams' ability to make a creative and fun new job. They might not always be the flavor of the day, but in my experience they're always enjoyable to play, regardless of how some people end up feeling screwed for whatever reason.

I don't think any of the fears posted here are going to be lost on the developers. Well maybe the "RDM marginalization" one, but I don't care about that. For example, my first thought about GEO auras was the need to stand in AOE range, then I noticed the description said the spheres would be "large". I might be reading too much into that adjective, but I really think that they'll handle the damage proximity issue pretty quickly if half the job's functionality is rendered useless.

[Merton9999]

Since they are for magical defence, my money's on this job will be the one to get Reflect.

I was thinking that too. While I think a well-thought-out implementation of Reflect could give me something fun to think about on RDM again, I'll be happy if it gets introduced on Runic Knight.

[SpankWustler]

Given how well Blue Mage and Corsair and Puppetmaster and Scholar and Dancer worked before a number of adjustments and additions, particularly Puppetmaster and Scholar, I am expecting both Rune Fencer and Geomancer to be mediocre at absolute best for the first six months of their existences.

That said, I've found all of the newer jobs to be very involved and fun to play, even in their early periods when some were average performers and others were flat-out useless. Of course, fun is a super-duper subjective thing.

[Nala]

ya know just had a thought, probably been put before but honestly considering we can just party cycle anyways to accomplish the same basically why cant they make aoe buffs allinace wide vice party wide...

Main issue i could see with that would mean you'd only need 1 smn and sch for a full alli... was thinking in terms of geo cor and bard type buffs however along with protectra... anyways ill refrain from discussing that here further since its off the topic.

[Mavrick]

ya know just had a thought, probably been put before but honestly considering we can just party cycle anyways to accomplish the same basically why cant they make aoe buffs allinace wide vice party wide...

Main issue i could see with that would mean you'd only need 1 smn and sch for a full alli... was thinking in terms of geo cor and bard type buffs however along with protectra... anyways ill refrain from discussing that here further since its off the topic.

Consider this, Rotation takes time to set up. Especially if you're aiming for 2x11s rolls with a COR and rotations only work as a pre-fight set-up. You cannot do a rotation after the fight has started... vs a constant stream of buffs where everyone constantly has ~6 bard songs (even more if bard has emp99), and 6 Cor Rolls for however long the fight/event lasts. In a rotation, if the Song/Roll effect gets dispelled or wears off you're out of luck for the remainder of the fight. In a system where songs/rolls hit alliance members it does not matter because a brd/cor would simply reapply the buff and it would hit all alliance members in range. Long story short.... broken.

[Camate]

Looking at the name “rune fencer” it is actually not a magic based job, as they will be consuming runes to gain special effects. To give a bit more insight into the actual name, I will share a quick Japanese lesson with you all. Red mage, black mage, and other “mage” jobs utilize the kanji
“魔道士” which denotes a mage or wizard-type role. On the other hand, rune fencer in Japanese
is “魔導剣士” which uses a slightly different kanji “魔導.” Both are actually pronounced the same way (madou) but are different in the sense that the latter is used to denote more of a sage-type character. With that said, it might seem to overlap with the image of red mage, but it is in fact completely different.

On another note, for all of you who may still be wondering what the main weapon for rune fencer will be, as many has guessed it will be great sword. However, they will still be able to fully utilize one-hand swords as well.

Attack wise, since they are using great sword, we are planning to have them deal higher damage than paladins. As a tank role though, generating higher enmity than your melee and other damage dealers with attacks alone is quite impossible, so we will be looking into other methods to gain enmity.

In regards to their defensive capabilities, as was stated their specialty is magical defense and elemental resistance, but they will not be able to have all resistances enhanced at once and will have to use runes skillfully to enhance themselves.

[Teraniku]

Finally a Job that will (hopefully) be A+ in Great Sword.

[cidbahamut]

Attack wise, since they are using great sword, we are planning to have them deal higher damage than paladins. As a tank role though, generating higher enmity than your melee and other damage dealers with attacks alone is quite impossible, so we will be looking into other methods to gain enmity.


Is the development team going to look into changing the enmity system itself? I think that's the first step.

[Milva]

My two concerns:

1) If Rune Fencer is going to utilize consumable "runes" to charge it's abilities, are you planning on killing their inventory the same way as Ninja's? Fire rune, Dark rune, Enhance rune, Defense rune...? And then bags of each type of rune etc.?

2) Will there be any "ultimate weapons" for Geomancer and Rune Fencer? Will there be a new mythic weapon types they will use? What about relic and empyrean weapons? Will Rune Fencer use Ragnarok/Excalibur? There is no "bell" ultimate weapon; will Geomancer be put on Clubs/Staves for meeling purposes?

[Vivivivi]

My two concerns:

1) If Rune Fencer is going to utilize consumable "runes" to charge it's abilities, are you planning on killing their inventory the same way as Ninja's? Fire rune, Dark rune, Enhance rune, Defense rune...? And then bags of each type of rune etc.?

2) Will there be any "ultimate weapons" for Geomancer and Rune Fencer? Will there be a new mythic weapon types they will use? What about relic and empyrean weapons? Will Rune Fencer use Ragnarok/Excalibur? There is no "bell" ultimate weapon; will Geomancer be put on Clubs/Staves for meeling purposes?

There are technically bells in the game, they're classified as clubs. I would assume new bells will be added to enhance Geomancer spells or abilities similar to bard's instruments. Just my assumption though.

[tyrantsyn]

Just curious so I figured I'd ask. Is the job going to pick up a one handed grip trait that we've seen from other FF game's?

[Agerknux]

This isn't entirely about Rune Fencer or Geomancer, but I recall you talking about looking into adding jobs to relics if they fit the lore. Will Rune Fencer and Geomancer be considered? Also what about pre-existing "end" weapons such as Empyrean and Mythic weapons?

[Daniel_Hatcher]

My two concerns:

1) If Rune Fencer is going to utilize consumable "runes" to charge it's abilities, are you planning on killing their inventory the same way as Ninja's? Fire rune, Dark rune, Enhance rune, Defense rune...? And then bags of each type of rune etc.?

2) Will there be any "ultimate weapons" for Geomancer and Rune Fencer? Will there be a new mythic weapon types they will use? What about relic and empyrean weapons? Will Rune Fencer use Ragnarok/Excalibur? There is no "bell" ultimate weapon; will Geomancer be put on Clubs/Staves for meeling purposes?

They wont get put on Relic's.

I'll imagine Geomancer will get the club trials, and Rune Knight the Great Sword ones.

As for Mythic's they'd best get one, I also wouldn't be suprised if new weapons were added.



This isn't entirely about Rune Fencer or Geomancer, but I recall you talking about looking into adding jobs to relics if they fit the lore. Will Rune Fencer and Geomancer be considered? Also what about pre-existing "end" weapons such as Empyrean and Mythic weapons?

DNC and SCH fit the lore, but are still not on Relics.

[Arciel]

time to hoard great swords...

[Laurion]

My two concerns:

1) If Rune Fencer is going to utilize consumable "runes" to charge it's abilities, are you planning on killing their inventory the same way as Ninja's? Fire rune, Dark rune, Enhance rune, Defense rune...? And then bags of each type of rune etc.?

2) Will there be any "ultimate weapons" for Geomancer and Rune Fencer? Will there be a new mythic weapon types they will use? What about relic and empyrean weapons? Will Rune Fencer use Ragnarok/Excalibur? There is no "bell" ultimate weapon; will Geomancer be put on Clubs/Staves for meeling purposes?

As far as runes go I assume that they'll offer individual runes like you listed, but also add in Universal Runes in the way that they added Universal tools for NIN. I mean I really don't see why they wouldn't add the option of universal ones.

Highly doubt they'd get put on relics or get mythic weapons. I'd bet my money on new "ultimate weapons" being added with the expansion, one for each job including Geomancer and Runic Fencer.

[Bulrogg]

Well as clogging as most jobs are on the inventory already I hope using a Rune is as simple as activating job abilities requiring no items. Something like SCH and stratagems would be nice.

[Alistaire]

In regards to their defensive capabilities, as was stated their specialty is magical defense and elemental resistance

How do you plan to have this compete with Aegis?

[Daniel_Hatcher]

How do you plan to have this compete with Aegis?

Indeed, as it is PLD is already amazing at magic damage and Physical damage resistance.

[Washburn]

Stratagems?

[Kojo]

Please don't kill our inventories.. COR cards take up too much. >.>

[Hayward]

Please don't kill our inventories.. COR cards take up too much. >.>

Might want to consider making a trip to Nashmau for Trump Card Cases.

[Hayward]

I won't even attempt to speculate what either job will be like or how they'll affect the 20 jobs we already have at our disposal. Rune Fencer is, for all intents and purposes, an altogether new job that really can't be guessed at based on past FF episodes. While the consensus here points toward some similarity to Celes of FF6, even that's a fuzzy comparison that doesn't escape the realm of blind speculation. I would hope the (new?) development team leader intends to give the job an identity all its own in addition to doing so further for all current jobs (Thus far, melee jobs have become little more than a blurry imitation of each other with few significant traits that make any one job stand out amongst the others).

[Tsukino_Kaji]

Looking at the name “rune fencer” it is actually not a magic based job, as they will be consuming runes to gain special effects.So it's ninja 2.

[Stromgarde]

http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Mystic_Knight_%28Final_Fantasy_V%29

Kanji is 魔法剣士, same as here.

[Daniel_Hatcher]

Camate, can't you change the thread title to the correct job name.

[Edyth]

In regards to their defensive capabilities, as was stated their specialty is magical defense and elemental resistance, but they will not be able to have all resistances enhanced at once and will have to use runes skillfully to enhance themselves.

Sounds like SCH's stratagems, and SCH's stratagems are awesome.

[Keyln]

http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Mystic_Knight_%28Final_Fantasy_V%29

Kanji is 魔法剣士, same as here.

Probably when translating, they took certain liberties to help names make sense.

It's SE's game. They can call the jobs whatever they want.

[Ophannus]

Since a PLD gains massive MDT with Aegis and with Shell4 and Rampart, even though they are a 'physical based tank' would Rune Fencer likewise be able to reduce physical damage taken as well since as we all know mobs tend to auto-attack more often than casing spells(especially true at low level.) Rune Fencer sounds like a nice concept for end game but really, how many EXP mobs out there in low level content that cast magic besides specific beastmen types or NMs?

[Keyln]

Since a PLD gains massive MDT with Aegis and with Shell4 and Rampart, even though they are a 'physical based tank' would Rune Fencer likewise be able to reduce physical damage taken as well since as we all know mobs tend to auto-attack more often than casing spells(especially true at low level.) Rune Fencer sounds like a nice concept for end game but really, how many EXP mobs out there in low level content that cast magic besides specific beastmen types or NMs?

Well, I could see it being handy for things like Slimes, Flans, bombs, and other things that make heavy use of magic spells and magic abilities. As far as being better than PLD, I could see these runes absorbing a certain element one time in lieu of damage.

Besides, doesn't everyone level in Abyssea nowadays?

[Kojo]

If it can raise its resistances to certain statuses, it'd be useful against alot of things. (Like Tunga; I HATE Tunga.) I would hope it'd also have a high Parrying skill as well as a job trait that raises it's parrying rate when using Greatswords or through certain runes.

[Zerich]

Sounds like SCH's stratagems, and SCH's stratagems are awesome.

not sure if sarcastic >_>

[Teraniku]

Well as clogging as most jobs are on the inventory already I hope using a Rune is as simple as activating job abilities requiring no items. Something like SCH and stratagems would be nice.

Just throwing this out there, that the job might work like BLU, but instead of monster abilities, you Equip a set of Runes that act like Spells / Job Abilities.

[SpankWustler]

Looking at the name “rune fencer” it is actually not a magic based job, as they will be consuming runes to gain special effects.

As other people have mentioned, I see two ways Rune Fencer's relationship to runes could go and I'm wondering which is more in-line with the Development Bros current plans.

Will a Rune Fencer literally consume runes from his or her inventory, similar to a Ninja consuming ninja tools or a Corsair consuming cards?

OR

Will a Rune Fencer figuratively consume runes through job abilities with charges or charge-like things, similar to a Scholar consuming stratagems or a Dancer consuming Finishing Moves?

The former seems much more likely to me, but then again, my first guess was that Rune Fencer would just use a lot of job high-enmity abilities to compliment a small and focused Enhancing magic selection. Obviously, that was way off.

[Zerich]

cool, more expendible items!
just what i wanted.





change this

[Llana_Virren]

cool, more expendible items!
just what i wanted.





change this


No no, let's have them stack to 12 first, then maybe to 99 after a few months. Come on, Z, you know we can't get things right the first time. :)

[Zerich]

No no, let's have them stack to 12 first, then maybe to 99 after a few months. Come on, Z, you know we can't get things right the first time. :)

hun, i think you mean years*

[Kensagaku]

An interesting way of handling runes might be to use them in a manner similar to a PUP's automaton or like the MMM frames; you can equip X amount of runes in a grid as long as they fit certain requirements, making your Rune Fencer highly customizable and allowing for a lot more freedom of play.

Personally I'd prefer the PUP attachment style versus the MMM one. They could be a slight bit weaker so that you can be more flexible without being overpowered; instead of something like +30 Fire resistance/damage on one rune, you can get them in 10s so you can tailor just how much you need (this is just pulling numbers out, frankly I would like them higher with all the resist+ gear we get). And then you have specific runes for MDT, PDT, DEF, ATK, etc. These wouldn't be too powerful (-1~4% physical damage taken, for example. Like -1% PDT rune, -2%, etc) and there would be a limit as to how many slots can have a PDT rune (let's say... 3? 9% PDT is still a fair amount while using regular TP gear, reducing the damage you take).

Imagine the character flexibility you could get with 15 rune slots, even if none of them are "amazing" but are all fairly decent. Of course cookie-cutter builds would still come about as people find the "best" style of play, but it still provides a fair amount of customization for those who like a flexible job.

[SleepStudy]

Granted ths is gross speculation on my part, but in the conception art, it does look like the rune fencer is "casting" so to speak, so Im guessing NIN-esque consummables

[Stylin]

Categorized job abilities ala DNC with an activation system similar to PUP's Maneuvers, minus the overload.

[Camate]

http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Mystic_Knight_%28Final_Fantasy_V%29

Kanji is 魔法剣士, same as here.

While classically "魔法剣士" was used in previous FINAL FANTASY titles, they adopted "魔導剣士" for the FINAL FANTASY XI job name.

[Kojo]

So, Camate, any way of giving us any info on whether our inventories will be clogged or not?

P.S. Whoever mentioned Trump Cards, earlier, I've tried that; they go WAY too fast. I suppose I could buy Trump cards for the 6 elements and stacks of Light and Dark for Sleep and Dispel. >.>

[Mindi]

P.S. Whoever mentioned Trump Cards, earlier, I've tried that; they go WAY too fast. I suppose I could buy Trump cards for the 6 elements and stacks of Light and Dark for Sleep and Dispel. >.>

You only need 2 Slots for trump cards.. one for the Case-Stack and 1 for the Cards. No reason to carry any other cards.. they cost double of single element cards but who seriously cares? Buy Trump Card case and forget about singels. Those few Light or dark shots you would do you can even use Trumps aswell.
I hope they add a system like this or like the nin-multitools for rune fencer aswell. I dont mind if they cost double of single-rune-price aslong as i save inventory.

[cidbahamut]

You only need 2 Slots for trump cards.. one for the Case-Stack and 1 for the Cards. No reason to carry any other cards.. they cost double of single element cards but who seriously cares? Buy Trump Card case and forget about singels. Those few Light or dark shots you would do you can even use Trumps aswell.
I hope they add a system like this or like the nin-multitools for rune fencer aswell. I dont mind if they cost double of single-rune-price aslong as i save inventory.
They also need to be available immediately upon release of the job, not months or years afterwards.

[Kojo]

I'll try buying a whole stack of cases instead of a few stacks.

[Bulrogg]

How about not requiring an item for the use of Runes? Make it an ability. Just saying.

[Kitkat]

How about not requiring an item for the use of Runes? Make it an ability. Just saying.

I'd have to agree with this idea. Possibly make it a charge system similar to how Dnc works. Use of lower tier runes give access to higher more potent runes or specific actions/ws charge abilities of the rune fencer that can be unlocked as the charges build up.

Thinking of having another job that relies on disposable items (such as tools, bolts/bullets/arrows, or cards) really stresses the players given current inventory issues limiting how adaptable multiple jobs can be in different scenarios since the need for space to hold these disposable items can be daunting (even with the specialty card/tools eventually made). I would much rather see some type of ability charge system rather than another job that needs disposable items. Camate could you please stress this to devs if at all possible?

[Bulrogg]

What I had in mind, perhaps activating Runes could be similar to a scholar using ARTS/Stratagems with the different Runes falling under different Tomes.

[Delvish]

What I had in mind, perhaps activating Runes could be similar to a scholar using ARTS/Stratagems with the different Runes falling under different Tomes.

This is actually what I was picturing when they said that Runic Knight would be using runes instead of MP. JAs that stack similar to stratagems and you can adjust your defensive or offensive line-up based upon the runes you currently have active. In essence, utilizing runes like stratagems that don't dissipate upon first use (except in certain situations). Oh, and the 2hr will likely be either magic damage does 0 damage for 30 sec a-la Magic defense paladin, or unlimited rune use for 30 sec a-la Tabula Rasa unlimited stratagems.

[Kojo]

This is actually what I was picturing when they said that Runic Knight would be using runes instead of MP. JAs that stack similar to stratagems and you can adjust your defensive or offensive line-up based upon the runes you currently have active. In essence, utilizing runes like stratagems that don't dissipate upon first use (except in certain situations). Oh, and the 2hr will likely be either magic damage does 0 damage for 30 sec a-la Magic defense paladin, or unlimited rune use for 30 sec a-la Tabula Rasa unlimited stratagems.

Or 30 second absorb magic dmg a-la Celes Chere.

[saevel]

Rune's will be consumable items similar to ninja tools. Just watch.

[SpankWustler]

I'm going to be the half-dozenth person to say that if Rune Fencer uses items, there should be a universal item available the very first day the job is playable. Not a year later, now that the Development Bros have decided universal tools are cool, but the very first day. There's no reason for dalliance on something so simple.

[Daniel_Hatcher]

I'm going to be the half-dozenth person to say that if Rune Fencer uses items, there should be a universal item available the very first day the job is playable. Not a year later, now that the Development Bros have decided universal tools are cool, but the very first day. There's no reason for dalliance on something so simple.
They might do it in the form of said item grants a temporary buff, there could be no way for a universal item like that.

[SpankWustler]

They might do it in the form of said item grants a temporary buff, there could be no way for a universal item like that.

http://alltheragefaces.com/img/faces/large/surprised-gasp-l.png

[Zerich]

http://alltheragefaces.com/img/faces/large/surprised-gasp-l.png

thank you for making my merlot induced sloth more enjoyable

10/5

[Merton9999]

I'm throwing in my vote for leaving consumable items out of the picture. Charges like SCH strategems, BLU set points, or any other similar system that doesn't clog my inventory would be vastly preferable. In fact, if runes do take up inventory, and the expansion does not come with a significant gobbie bag increase, I predict RNF will join RNG as my second job stuck at level 1.

I'm also voting for this job to get Reflect and Celes-Chere-Runic, but only if the job does not use consumables!!!

[Camate]

Camate, can't you change the thread title to the correct job name.

Went ahead and changed the thread title :)

[Daniel_Hatcher]

Went ahead and changed the thread title :)

Much appreciated.

[Tsukino_Kaji]

How about not requiring an item for the use of Runes? Make it an ability. Just saying.Consumable items or GTFO, we don't need the job to be a cor/pld and runes will help the economy.

[Camiie]

Consumable items or GTFO, we don't need the job to be a cor/pld and runes will help the economy.

Instead of "shovel ready jobs" we have "AH ready jobs?"

[Bulrogg]

"They should just play Ninja if they want a tank class job to stimulate the economy." There are enough ways to clog up inventory as the game is currently, no need to muck it up even more.

Abilities > Consumable items, or let the good door hit ya where the good Lord split ya.

[Rubicant82]

So does that mean we can have inventory 99 now?
I mean just saying that would help alleviate some of the concerns about inventory space.
Not to mention I am sure there will be multi-runes just like there are multi-tools... oh ... yea.. right... those are main job only and useless for subjobing the job... my bad. Ability charges like stratagems or some other kind of charging system was mentioned earlier in the thread that sounds like a fair compromise. OH! right I forgot there isn't much compromise in this game it silly me I'll just go back to my corner with my nine years of subscription and playing and twiddle my thumbs waiting to see what happens.

[Kojo]

Instead of "shovel ready jobs" we have "AH ready jobs?"

Why did THIS come to mind?
http://ff11db.sakura.ne.jp/database/graphi/buki/Caver's%20Shovel.jpg

[Twille]

Went ahead and changed the thread title :)

I gotta say, Mystic Knight sounds a whole lot cooler than Rune Fencer. :)

[Infidi]

I gotta say, Mystic Knight sounds a whole lot cooler than Rune Fencer. :)

I like Rune Knight myself. :) I thought what job was called in one of the old final fantasies but I don't remember lol. A fencer bears to mind someone using one handed thin blades not great swords but I digress. Change it to Rune Knight Camate! I know you have the poweeeer! :) Like He-Man I guess ? >.>

[Cabalabob]

I gotta say, Mystic Knight sounds a whole lot cooler than Rune Fencer. :)

Or just rune knight, I just think knight makes more sense, fencer suggests its a sword user not greatsword and if it's gonna have sword skill people with no background info will get confused. At least knights have a history of using 2 handed swords

[Daniel_Hatcher]

I gotta say, Mystic Knight sounds a whole lot cooler than Rune Fencer. :)

If it was a Mystic Knight yes, it is not, it is a Rune Knight.

[Nala]

I get the feeling they wont be able to wear heavy armor hence the fencer vice knight, although that would make little sense considering they were announced as being primarily GS users... in anycase for the sake of cool points and the like camate pass on the name change idea, Runic Knight or Rune Knight sound much more bad ass. RKN FTW!

[Phogg]

Or just rune knight, I just think knight makes more sense, fencer suggests its a sword user not greatsword and if it's gonna have sword skill people with no background info will get confused. At least knights have a history of using 2 handed swords

I'm with you on that, especially considering the job trait fencer cannot be active with 2-handed weapons, bit confusing.

[SleepStudy]

Yeah, Rune Knight sounds a whole lot cooler. I wonder why they chose Rune Fencer? There has to be some kinda explanation for that..maybe its b/c they won't be using heavy armor (the AF, or whatever that was, certainly doesn't look like heavy armor). Or maybe they will get the armor choices that NIN does (see: haubergeon / RK Chainmail) so the armor between leather and plate (chainmail essentially.) I'd like to see how / if they are gonna address any of this.

[DarkFire82]

It appears that the theme of the new expansion is just that new. I have often thought myself about the way this game works, and how things could be changed to allow a number of potential FF jobs that do not currently exist. That being said, I have the following thoughts about how this class could work:

(1) Barriers.
I have heard multiple people mention that RNF will have one or more barrier based abilities. This could have the effect of an AoE Third Eye that could eliminate one AoE spell or effect by re-directing it to the RNF itself. Thereby the RNF would be king VS magic AoE at high levels.

(2) Runes.
I have personally seen two different messages dealing with runes. While my current PC is not capable of copying the specific Kanji, I remember reading both about "Setting" or "Equipping" runes as well as "using up runes". This would lead me to imagine a system closer to a combination of PUP and DNC. Basically using maneuvers through equipped runes to build charges, and having some abilities that would use up these charges.
Another possibility that might work for the RNF would be to do things based on Temporary Items. Lets say for example that the RNF had a job ability that granted a number of temporary "Runes". This would let the RNF stock up over time (though probably no more than a stack of each "Rune" due to limitations on Temporary Items) and would allow the use of these "Runes" to use their Job Abilities. The original thought of this came from an idea of mine for making the FFT Chemist as a FFXI class (I still would like some way to use normal items like potions on party members. You could in most of the previous games).

Runic/Reflect.
I remember reading earlier in the forums that there could be problems with "Reflect" due to targeting issues. Mostly this comes in the case that a mob dies before the spell itself is reflected. This would likely occur in the event that Reflect is defined as a "buff" that can be placed on allies, but could possibly be averted if the RNF had a form of "Spell Counter". Literally countering the effect of a Spell targeted at it just as a MNK does for physical attacks. If combined with a barrier that reduces an AoE for the party, this could actually allow for a "Reflect (spell counter)" ability.
Runic sounds more like a Spell based Third Eye. Originally Runic would absorb a spell and recover MP based on the cost of the spell. If used with one of the earlier systems I mentioned, this could absorb a spell and grant a number of "Maneuver Runes" or "Temporary Item Runes" based on the level and power of the spell absorbed. Either that, or it could be a lightning rod effect, causing the AoE to target and effect the RNF alone.

All in all, I could see this class as an effective AoE controller that would do better than a PLD against magic (by protecting the Party like a Tank should) whereas the PLD would still work effectively with Physical (very few mobs if any have an AoE auto-attack).

As to the RDM thing... I really don't see this class eliminating RDM in the least. I also have a feeling the Enfeeble adjustments might help them. Basically, the adjustments could allow for other classes to land enfeebles while still allowing RDM to land stronger Enfeebles. Mostly by increasing the "effect" of the enfeeble based on skill and leaving the accuracy as separate.

[Volarione]

how about giving rune fencers the option to buy runes like spells you buy the runes and they can only be used after you hit a certain level, you can equipt different runes for different effects and "cast" certain combinations of runes for different attacks, spells, or debuffs.

so say at lvl 5 I have 3 runes A B C

rune A> attack rune boosts attack
rune B> def rune boosts MADEF
rune C> Fire Rune attacks with fire

at level 10 you can link runes and/or get new runes for instance rune A+ rune C= gives your attack fire stat dmg while rune B+rune C= Fire Spikes (fire ele def)

wouldnt be hard to implement I wouldnt think

[Daniel_Hatcher]

how about giving rune fencers the option to buy runes like spells you buy the runes and they can only be used after you hit a certain level, you can equipt different runes for different effects and "cast" certain combinations of runes for different attacks, spells, or debuffs.

so say at lvl 5 I have 3 runes A B C

rune A> attack rune boosts attack
rune B> def rune boosts MADEF
rune C> Fire Rune attacks with fire

at level 10 you can link runes and/or get new runes for instance rune A+ rune C= gives your attack fire stat dmg while rune B+rune C= Fire Spikes (fire ele def)

wouldnt be hard to implement I wouldnt think

They said it's not like Magic, so it wont be.

It's either Items, Job Ability or Equipment.

[Volarione]

They said it's not like Magic, so it wont be.

It's either Items, Job Ability or Equipment.

Could still use it in a similar way as this though, nin uses abilities that aren't technically spells.

[Daniel_Hatcher]

Could still use it in a similar way as this though, nin uses abilities that aren't technically spells.

You want to pay Gil for the spells and items to use them again, not to mention all the spaces to store them?

[Demon6324236]

Honestly the way they should make Runes would be make it like PUP has its Automaton. You buy them, use them, they become an item you can equip, and they have a separate menu than your normal equipment. That way they do not take alot of space, they still must be bought, it works well for balancing great items because you can make them rare not at certain levels, and it keeps all spots open and free on the normal character themselves meaning ammo/ranged spots and the like are not taken up by them.

[Volarione]

You want to pay Gil for the spells and items to use them again, not to mention all the spaces to store them?


Isn't that how nin works?

[Daniel_Hatcher]

Isn't that how nin works?

Yes, and no one likes it.

[Volarione]

Yes, and no one likes it.

Lol, fine ok I would like something similar to ache strategems too, but for some reason I don't see it. I will be pleasantly surprised if I'm wrong.

[Camate]

Greetings!

I have the answer to the question that has been asked since VanaFest:



Will rune fencers utilize consumable items for their runes or is it a charge-type abilty?


No, runes will not be generated through consumable items like ninja tools. Instead, they will be generated/used via an ability. There will be a recast timer associated with runes, which is currently planned to be around 10 seconds. With that said, I think you can consider the system to be quite close to how dancers function.

Hope this clears up the debate :)

[SpankWustler]

HAPPY FISH...
http://cdn.partydrag.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/smiley-fish.jpg
...IS HAPPY.

[Twille]

Greetings!

I have the answer to the question that has been asked since VanaFest:



No, runes will not be generated through consumable items like ninja tools. Instead, they will be generated/used via an ability. There will be a recast timer associated with runes, which is currently planned to be around 10 seconds. With that said, I think you can consider the system to be quite close to how dancers function.

Hope this clears up the debate :)

This is fantastic news!

[Volarione]

I love you camate.

[Vandheer]

:O Epic. Thanks for the update Camate.

[tyrantsyn]

Greetings!

I have the answer to the question that has been asked since VanaFest:



No, runes will not be generated through consumable items like ninja tools. Instead, they will be generated/used via an ability. There will be a recast timer associated with runes, which is currently planned to be around 10 seconds. With that said, I think you can consider the system to be quite close to how dancers function.

Hope this clears up the debate :)

Your news is good, perhaps were allow you to live for another day ;)

[Luvbunny]

So how is this make rune fencer as a viable tank? Evasive one like dancer, ninja and thief which has plenty of damage mitigation ability or self cure - or blood tank like Paladin who can cure but deal rather ok damage - or your typical DD blood tank who needs Whm to babysit them?

[hideka]

Greetings!

I have the answer to the question that has been asked since VanaFest:



No, runes will not be generated through consumable items like ninja tools. Instead, they will be generated/used via an ability. There will be a recast timer associated with runes, which is currently planned to be around 10 seconds. With that said, I think you can consider the system to be quite close to how dancers function.

Hope this clears up the debate :)

oh god no... INCOMING 2003 BOOST STYLE MACROS!!! RUNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN

[tyrantsyn]

IDK, have to wait for the job to drop to find out. But at least we won't be dropping coin on disposable item's or over priced spell's :D

[FrankReynolds]

Greetings!

I have the answer to the question that has been asked since VanaFest:



No, runes will not be generated through consumable items like ninja tools. Instead, they will be generated/used via an ability. There will be a recast timer associated with runes, which is currently planned to be around 10 seconds. With that said, I think you can consider the system to be quite close to how dancers function.

Hope this clears up the debate :)

Will they be instant use abilities like dancer? Macroing gear for that stuff is a pain in the arse with the current macro system.

[Dazusu]

Will they be instant use abilities like dancer? Macroing gear for that stuff is a pain in the arse with the current macro system.

Name one ability that isn't instant-use.

[FrankReynolds]

Name one ability that isn't instant-use.

Perhaps what I should have said was: Will they have any sort of reasonable duration? or will rune fencer be invisible 90% of the time riding 20 different abilities on a 10 second timer with a bunch of gear that is only useful while performing those abilities?

Most jobs have a lot of gear swapping going on due to casting and / or weapon skills, but dancer seems especially annoying in that sense due to the short duration of abilities / timers. It would be ideal if the new job didn't have to swap 15 pieces of gear to perform 1 action every 3-5 seconds.

[katiekat]

tell me about it i think i swop more on dnc then any other job lol

[saevel]

So how is this make rune fencer as a viable tank? Evasive one like dancer, ninja and thief which has plenty of damage mitigation ability or self cure - or blood tank like Paladin who can cure but deal rather ok damage - or your typical DD blood tank who needs Whm to babysit them?

It doesn't.

Best case scenario it tanks the same things PLD does, worst case is it will what NIN does.

After the initial "ohh look shiny!!!!!" period is over with, it's usefulness will be determined by it's damage output.

[Theytak]

It doesn't.

Best case scenario it tanks the same things PLD does, worst case is it will what NIN does.

After the initial "ohh look shiny!!!!!" period is over with, it's usefulness will be determined by it's damage output.

Sad, but true, unless SE completely overhauls the enmity system to coincide with the new expansion, suddenly revitalizing tanking.

The way I've read it, it seems like Rune Fencer will basically be designed for magically oriented fights. My guess is that it'll play as a sort of reverse pld, in that it will easily deal with and mitigate magical damage, but also be entirely capable of mitigating physical damage as well, it will just not do so as well as it does magical damage.

In other words, it'll be pretty useless as far most of the mobs currently in the game go, because of melee attacks. Though, I guess it's likely that SE intends to release at least a few mobs that deal magical damage as their melee attacks. Time will tell, though.

[Kristal]

Will they be instant use abilities like dancer? Macroing gear for that stuff is a pain in the arse with the current macro system.

I think you mean RDM SESD macros? If RNK is similar to RDM in that aspect, it's going to be a pain in the posterior indeed...

[Karbuncle]

The way i see it, Tanking is dead. The best we can hope for is the job to have good JA/Defensive AoE buffs to a point they could actually become a Support/DD like COR instead of a tank and suck and die in a pile of SMNRDMPLD sh*t.

We all know from experience SE is like "Why Can't i balance all these jobs?!" on us when it comes to figuring out which job should do which:

I.E -
RDM Getting Mostly Single Target spells, While being described as an expert at enhancing others.
THF Being described as a master of Enmity, with a total of 2 (1 is shared timer with another) Enmity Abilities.
and so on.

So for all we know, RNF could turn into, as i said above, a SUpport/DD, Use Runes to buff the real tank (I.E probably the WAR) and use the GS to deal some decent Resolution damage.

Its up in the air at this point, But honestly, Defensive (PLD/RNK) Tanking is a dead art in this game, the best slot this job will fill is as i've described above, a Support/DD, if the Runes are good enough to warrant a spot. On one hand, COR Passed this test, and became a good Support DD, on the other hand, DNC Failed this test with its JA's not really warranting a spot overall to most players. RNK is still up in the air.

But as it stands, Expecting this job to do any sort of tanking is silly, PLD is dead, This job will be too unless its JA's warrant a spot in the Main DD Alliance for Magic/Defensive purposes, and its GS options are decent so it can pump out some okay damage.

[saevel]

But as it stands, Expecting this job to do any sort of tanking is silly, PLD is dead, This job will be too unless its JA's warrant a spot in the Main DD Alliance for Magic/Defensive purposes, and its GS options are decent so it can pump out some okay damage.

So far it won't be able to use the OaT GSWD which puts its damage into the drain. Try to think of a GS WAR without Rag and without Berserk. Yeah ....

[Merton9999]

Greetings!

I have the answer to the question that has been asked since VanaFest:



No, runes will not be generated through consumable items like ninja tools. Instead, they will be generated/used via an ability. There will be a recast timer associated with runes, which is currently planned to be around 10 seconds. With that said, I think you can consider the system to be quite close to how dancers function.

Hope this clears up the debate :)

Thanks, Camate, this is great news. Though we'll have to wait a loooong time to see how the overall effectiveness of the job plays out, the fact that it won't use consumables is a big deal to me.

[Llana_Virren]

So far it won't be able to use the OaT GSWD which puts its damage into the drain. Try to think of a GS WAR without Rag and without Berserk. Yeah ....

I see your pessimistic argument, and raise you one /war sj!

[FrankReynolds]

I see your pessimistic argument, and raise you one /war sj!

Screw that, /dnc for button mashing madness.

[saevel]

Nahh gotta be true hardcore /RDM for enspells yo

[Lastranger]

Nahh gotta be true hardcore /RDM for enspells yo

Well i wouldnt be surprised if rnf/rnk got not only all the enspells + fixed tier 2's ( proc on evry hit ) and some way to further boost enspells soo far they come closer to doing double the dmg their main weapon would have done as well as posibly getting a tier 3 and of course topped of with the add to insult of them also getting enlight/endark endrain/enaspir and en form of enfeebles. ( or the ability to add them onto enspells with rune's )


Though im curious as evryone else how the runes will be put on, will it be like BLU spell set menu only u get access to new runes as u level and can set a few by rune points creating JT's and activating difrent bonuses off them with a JA kinda like PUP get their pet to do difrent things with difrent elements.

Or will runes be craftable and then set into slot's in PUP equip like menu ?


Im expecting the new job's to get butloads of stuff thats been sugested for other jobs, but i wouldtn be too quick deeming rnf/rnk tanking a fail, for all we know the dev team might make it more of a DD/tank or even give it the ability to simply lock enemy on itself for short time true ability/rune or spell.
Also i wouldnt rule out they would get some JT or whatever making En-effect carry over into WS as long as it is physical further boosting dmg.
( Funny thing, in some of the ff series ENspells double ur dmg done)


Somehow i kinda imagine it might get more mp then pld/drk and little less then rdm, for all we know they might implement some kind of perpetuation through Set runes to bolster dmg done by enspell/spike's as well as a price for getting super magic defence from runes, making the rune setting a balance off Refresh effect off runes vs boost too dmg or defence.

Anyways we still a long way from release i guess we have to wait and see, but im willing to bet it will be fairly powerfull at start just to promote the fact that it is the new job.

[Oakrest]

Attack wise, since they are using great sword, we are planning to have them deal higher damage than paladins. As a tank role though, generating higher enmity than your melee and other damage dealers with attacks alone is quite impossible, so we will be looking into other methods to gain enmity.

As a PLD by choice, I find a great deal frustrating and just faithless about what is said here. In short, it's suggested that Rune Fencer will do more damage than Paladins - that's fine - but "as a tank role" ... wait a minute, you're going to make this a tank too? How about fixing paladin first and make it the tank it was intended to be? The fact that you acknowledge some jobs have a 'tanking' purpose at all is discouraging. As many fellow players point out, there are no tanks in FFXI right now except those who attack the fastest. To be specific, you acknowledge the enmity for the RF to tank cannot be achieved through "attacks alone" - so how else do you plan on doing it? With job abilities? Perhaps with a trait? The thought about enmity should be happening at a much larger scale, because whatever is concluded there - should be applied to existing broken tank jobs like Paladin.

Honestly if you release this expansion/job without first fixing PLD I just can't see how I could continue playing without cringing every time I logged in to realize I was playing Rune Fencer not because it was an exciting new challenge, but because I knew it would be more effective/useful for endgame content. It seems it would be the closest thing to a Paladin (which is my fav job choice) but doesn't have to be a useless 'tank' as Paladin is now. I have Ochain and Almace, and am working on Aegis and Excalibur to complete my paladins damage mitigation and damage dealing diversity - yet this all feels in vain now.

I love the idea of a new expansion and new areas. I've been asking for it in some of my other posts. But this is just wrong on so many levels. Let's back burner the expansion, and focus on really making the jobs we have better. Agreed?

[Demon6324236]

Sorry but you are a little behind, they said it would be a tank since back when it was announced. They have talked of making actions take alot more enmity and damage take less I think, or something similar. Basically they are attempting to work with enmity and fix it I think, but I'm not sure.

[Tamarsamar]

Realistic scenario, Rune Fencer gets Kamla'postrophe's "Absorb the same element" Enspells.

And Red Mages get +1 BAC for drowning their sorrows.

[Kuroganashi]

Seems interesting, Eager to find out more about Rune Fencer