Trial NM's

[Doctrine]

'ello

i've been around awhile, but havent really found much to fault with the game untill now

my major issue is that the NM's needed for the early weapon trials need to be changed

these nm's are usually long respawns, have many placholders spread out over too large an area, and require multiple kills.

now normally, i wouldnt have a problem with any one of these. the problem lies with all three being present.

the NM's like tottering toby, ishtar, bugbear, etc all need vastly shorter respawn timers, or lowered the required kills to 1. im not asking for trials to be easier, and there should be a sense of accomplishment in finally obtaining an empy weapon.

what im asking for is the trials to be reasonable. there are many things to keep players occupied in game, and retarded NM spawn timers shouldnt be one of them

[Luvbunny]

Totally agree with you 100%!!

[Kaisha]

Need to make them one kill of each period. There's no difficulty to killing these NMs. It's just an endurance run of your boredom levels. Strictly a time waster that's unneeded nowadays when there's a whole extra tier of trials to do nowadays compared to back then.

[Zerich]

lrn to wiki/camp lottery spawns

[Andreja]

Doesn't really take long to get to the vnms even with the current trials, you can always be doing other stuff while waiting you know.

[svengalis]

Yeah some of them are annoying especially the one that only spawns at night. Usually though if you kill them 5 minutes before their window they usually spawn right at that one hour mark. Doesn't work all the time but it does seem to help on most of them.

[svengalis]

I think they should turn them all into vnms and put them in different zones around the game that way there's still a time sync and more zones would be used.

[Doctrine]

to clarify, im NOT talking about VWmn's

im talking about the normal low level, lottery spawn nm's in the various zones

liek serpapard ishtar, tottering toby, drooling daisy, megalobugard, etc

the VWnm's are fine as-is

the other nm's however, need to be either lowered to 1 required kill, or have them respawn every 10-30 minutes

[Vivivivi]

Agreed.
You'll be plenty busy with think like Glavoid and dealing with Tunga to occupy your time lol. Even while those can be frustrating, they are at least fun and challenging. Camping a lottery spawn mob in a low level zone isn't bad if it shows up in an hour, but going 3/30 in-game nights for Black Triple Stars is just frustrating, not fun, and not challenging.

[Camiie]

Camping NM spawns has got to rank up there as some of the absolute worst MMO content ever implemented, and I hope that whoever created the concept always gets stuck in the longest, slowest line wherever he goes. There's no fun here unless you have the personality of a gambling addict. It's the epitome of tedium and busywork, and whatever the ends are (Adaberks, Ridills, Emp. Pins, Bounding Boots, or Empyreans) they do not justify the means.

Reduce the timers or reduce the number needed to at least dull the pain. I know SE is as addicted to the concept as the HNM botter hotshots from back in the day, so they sadly won't be doing away with this nonsense. It's just a shame they see fit to put some of the best weapons behind the most mindnumbing, tedious, time-wasting, and un-challenging content. I'm sure someone will be along shortly to extol the virtues of this ridiculous system, but you're just wasting your keystrokes on me.

[Kaisha]

lrn to wiki/camp lottery spawns
Still doesn't stop the NM from randomly taking 4-8 hours after window opens to pop.

[Luvbunny]

They should adjust these NMs to 20-30 mnts spawn and not lottery. The thing is, these current group of developers will not do ANYTHING to please their current subscribers. Their vision is to make sure the game is the most inconvenience thing with the biggest hamster grind wheel of death that you ever play. And that you will need some sort of cheat hack tools to accomplish some of these retarded challenges. The list of fail is rather long unfortunately... I mean, it is ok if they actually listened and went back to revise them, but their attitude toward player feedback is rather clear, they don't care what we think or want.

[Juilan]

They really should learn, if they piss us off enough to quit this game, we ARE NOT GOING TO PLAY FINAL FAIL FOURTEEN, we'll play something like sudoku or angry birds

I'm personally loving "The Last Story" PAL i imported from france

[Zerich]

but this is complaining about content that was added before level cap increase if i remember correctly. they already left. just looks like you're getting to the content pretty late. but if this is the thing that's stopping you, omg are you going to hate life when you get into aby for your nms.

[Luvbunny]

Look, they just responded how they may change the repop timer for Shikigami Weapons NM and other old content NMs. So yeah they can easily change the repop timer for these trial NMs to be more bearable, 20-30 mnts should works and not have to change the actual magian trial itself. The Abyssea part is actually the easiest one to do, since you can control how fast you want to get it done, the more social connection you developed, the easier to get the trial done.

[Zumi]

These things are horrible the killing a bunch of weak NMs that die in 2 or 3 hits for trail of the magians is one of the biggest time wasters I ever seen. There is no challenge or skill its just make someone waste 1 to 8+ hours camping a NM that may or man not spawn in a giving time frame. The only challenge is not falling asleep or making sure you alt tab back in time to kill the NM while you watch Youtube videos or something while waiting on place holders to respawn.

Can you SE please switch low level NMs that are required for trail of the magians to FFXIV style NMs where they just pop and are on a 5 min resapwn timer after killed, and repop. There shouldn't be any issue with raising the respawn rate of these weak NMs required for trails because their drops are not good or sought after at all anymore.

[nyheen]

yes please change the trial NM time!
VNM are fine the way it is. please change Low level NMs to one of the following or all

1: Lower the repop time for the NM 30 - 60 mins
2: NO place holders on NM just all Time pop
3: Lower the required trail from 3 to 1 kill a NM
4: have "???" to pop up these NM with the item
5: or BCNM

these low level NMs should NOT take hours to respawn with place holders like serpapard ishtar, tottering toby, Black Triple Stars list goes on!

the VNM are great and challenging with only 1 hour repop that Perfect!
The Low level NMs need to be change yes please!

[Aarahs]

Everyone else who wanted an empyrean successfully camped these NMs and completed the trials. Why do you think you're a special snowflake that they should change the game for?

[RAIST]

Everyone else who wanted an empyrean successfully camped these NMs and completed the trials. Why do you think you're a special snowflake that they should change the game for?

http://i13.ebayimg.com/01/i/000/8c/3f/065f_1.JPG
can I has it?

[Camiie]

Everyone else who wanted an empyrean successfully camped these NMs and completed the trials. Why do you think you're a special snowflake that they should change the game for?

I made one, and I STILL think it should be changed. It's not about difficulty, it's about quality of content. It's about fun over tedium. This kind of crappy content makes the game look bad. Imagine showing FFXI to your friends and they see you standing around camping NMs and swatting Too Weak placeholders for hours on end. They have every right to criticize the game as being boring and laugh at you for playing it.

[Esvedium]

Because the game isn't easy enough, right? Why not just ask to pick a lv85 empy up from the box next to the moogle? Dog forbid you have to actually put some effort into getting shit in this game, even shit as easy to get as an empy...

[FrankReynolds]

Because the game isn't easy enough, right? Why not just ask to pick a lv85 empy up from the box next to the moogle? Dog forbid you have to actually put some effort into getting shit in this game, even shit as easy to get as an empy...

Okay, standing in one place for 9 hours = difficult now huh? I bet you're undefeated at watching paint dry... if only the rest of us had mad skillz (nothing better to do with their life) like you.

Games are supposed to be fun. I don't need a computer, a game, or a monthly subscription to sit and do nothing. As a matter of fact, I get less strange looks from people when I do nothing without all those things.

You are not working hard, or showcasing skill when you do these trials. Get over yourself. When people hear that you finished one of these trials, they don't think "wow, he's a hard working skilled player." They think "Wow, those trials are friggen lame. I bet he's glad he's done wasting time on that crap.".

[cidbahamut]

ITT: Stockholm Syndrome and defending bad game design...again.

[nyheen]

Because the game isn't easy enough, right? Why not just ask to pick a lv85 empy up from the box next to the moogle? Dog forbid you have to actually put some effort into getting shit in this game, even shit as easy to get as an empy...

why for godsake people need to wait hours and hours of camping and killing place holders for just 1 Too weak NM? like the other guy said game are supposed to be fun.

No one on here complaining about VNM, why? it 1 hour only, no dumb place holder, and it a bit challenging and fun to team up with people. but you tell me how sitting at a pc screen sitting around a low lvl spot killing place holders for who knows how long with 5+ is fun? it boring and Just stupid that these NM take hours to pop. that part need to be changed

[Luvbunny]

I guess some people love these dumb challenges, and consider it accomplishment to do nothing but watch paint dry, it is a test for their dull boring mind. Or probably jealous that if they adjust this, then he felt he is entitled for something because now everyone no longer have to do these dumb boring stupid challenge.

[Zumi]

I made one, and I STILL think it should be changed. It's not about difficulty, it's about quality of content. It's about fun over tedium. This kind of crappy content makes the game look bad. Imagine showing FFXI to your friends and they see you standing around camping NMs and swatting Too Weak placeholders for hours on end. They have every right to criticize the game as being boring and laugh at you for playing it.

True story I got a friend to play FFXI he bought the downloadable abyssea edition for $10. He leveled up well we helped him a lot in abyssea. Then he got started on making the H2H weapon and he didn't like the camp weak NMs for hours part and stopped playing FFXI only after about 2 months.

Its true that if you haven't played FFXI for a long time, most people would not be able to put up with camping lottery spawn nms for hours on end.

SE could get rid of the whole camp weak nms part and just start on VNMs. The newer upgrades shield and harp don't even have a weak NM phase because I think by then SE knew that people didn't want to do that crap and they very well could of had it. If they don't want to change that much of the game they can easily shorten repop times to 5 min and have them just pop instead of lottery. FFXIV has this and it works fine. Many quests in FFXIV require killing NMs and its not big of a deal because they have a 5 min repop and just pop in to the game and are not lottery.

[wish12oz]

I cant believe someone would make a thread about this and seriously think those trials are hard and need adjusted. You should just quit FFXI now, it's going to be very hard for you when it comes time to actually do stuff.

[Doctrine]

I cant believe someone would make a thread about this and seriously think those trials are hard and need adjusted. You should just quit FFXI now, it's going to be very hard for you when it comes time to actually do stuff.

see the problem is that its not hard.it's actually quite easy. what it is is extremely, and unnessecarily time consuming and in no way provides any kind of challenge. i have no problem actually 'doing stuff' as you put it, and am now at the vwmn phase, and am having fun with the trial, because im not sitting in one zone for hours on end doing nothing but killing extremely low level mobs waiting for an extremely low level nm to pop.

doing stuff isnt the problem. NOT doing stuff is. get off yer high horse, and develop some reading comprehension

[wish12oz]

see the problem is that its not hard.it's actually quite easy. what it is is extremely, and unnessecarily time consuming and in no way provides any kind of challenge. i have no problem actually 'doing stuff' as you put it, and am now at the vwmn phase, and am having fun with the trial, because im not sitting in one zone for hours on end doing nothing but killing extremely low level mobs waiting for an extremely low level nm to pop.

doing stuff isnt the problem. NOT doing stuff is. get off yer high horse, and develop some reading comprehension

The challenge lies in the ability of someone to go do the trials and actually finish before giving up out of boredom. Personally I find doing other things and only paying attention when the PH is about to spawn best. If you look at the wiki the widescan order for the PH is generally listed, if it matters, so you actually only have to kill 1 mob every 5 minutes. Right now I would recommend Diablo 3, its not as good as 2 honestly, but its new and still pretty fun to play.

[Camiie]

The challenge lies in the ability of someone to go do the trials and actually finish before giving up out of boredom.

LMAO. Yeah that's the sign of a great game. What a challenge! I managed to not get bored and I got this awesome weapon!


Personally I find doing other things and only paying attention when the PH is about to spawn best.

Should put that in a game review as a positive aspect and see how well that goes over. "The best part about this game is the hours I spend with it running while doing other things!"

[Zerich]

I made one, and I STILL think it should be changed. It's not about difficulty, it's about quality of content. It's about fun over tedium. This kind of crappy content makes the game look bad. Imagine showing FFXI to your friends and they see you standing around camping NMs and swatting Too Weak placeholders for hours on end. They have every right to criticize the game as being boring and laugh at you for playing it.

but everything about empys/mythics/relics is tedium...

[Zumi]

I cant believe someone would make a thread about this and seriously think those trials are hard and need adjusted. You should just quit FFXI now, it's going to be very hard for you when it comes time to actually do stuff.

Camping weak NMs for hours on end is bad game design. I am not actively attentively playing FFXI I am doing other stuff on my PC or watching TV and occasionally killing PH and checking back on my FFXI window to see if my nm spawned. The game I am playing should be engaging not sit around doing nothing but kill place holders every 5-15 min hoping for a NM to spawn that will die in 2-3 hits.

Part of the problem with the FFXI player base is they are willing to put up with this stuff and argue that it is ok.

[wish12oz]

It is bad game design, but the whole idea behind the series of quests for empyreans is killing NMs to make a weapon stronger. It's fine the way it is (up to level 90, 1500 plates is retarded) you start on weak monsters, and they get progressively harder as you do more trials. It's designed to be a time sink so you can't pump them out every other day, and to prevent people from doing tons of them unless you're really motivated. And seriously, if you don't like this system for obtaining ultimate weapons, go make a mythic, you'll never be bored and playing Diablo 3 doing those. Relics would work out the same way if you don't buy any of it.

[Caketime]

All I'm getting from this thread is I should be playing Diablo 3 instead.

[cidbahamut]

ITT: defending bad game design

[nyheen]

why people keep saying go to wiki or Diablo 3 how is that gonna help with the long hours of waiting for 1 NM? wonder why the pup whm pet got fix? angry mobs with pitchforks busting down SE door for that pup whm pet change. hopefully this NM pop time will be changed.

i been there and done that. hard time camping the dagger NMs , h2h swords, and few others for hours, :(

[Arukia]

Time sink is not a problem for relics(emp, mythic) if needed be, but time sink where you spend 4 hrs afk? bad game design. If it was more like the relic path where I had to actually spend time to kill shit for thousands of currency I wouldn't mind. At least I'm playing the game.

[Camiie]

Arukia nailed it. I don't mind a time sink. I don't mind a challenge. I DO mind being bored. I DO mind having my time wasted and my intelligence insulted, and that's what these trials do.

I've commented before that all aspects of a game should strive to be fun, which this aspect doesn't even attempt to do. I've actually gotten the response that if it were fun everyone would do it and the weapons wouldn't be rare and special. How can a reasonable human being not facepalm at a statement like that? As scary as it is, I think some of my fellow players are more deranged and deluded when it comes to content than the devs are. Pardon me while I huddle in a corner and shiver in terror at that thought.

[FrankReynolds]

LMAO. Yeah that's the sign of a great game. What a challenge! I managed to not get bored and I got this awesome weapon!

Should put that in a game review as a positive aspect and see how well that goes over. "The best part about this game is the hours I spend with it running while doing other things!"

I laughed hard at this. This really would make a great game review.

[Anapingofness]

It should be one kill each, period. No lottery spawns and a set spawn time. The stupid pot in Garliage Citadel nearly made me quit my dagger trial. It was just brutal.

Personally, I am against *waiting* for an nm to spawn. I would rather do a quest to get a pop item and kill NM then just sit and do nothing. Or kill mobs for a pop item then use it to spawn the NM that's needed.

Also, while we're on the subject of trial nm's... I really wish they'd make some of the aby nm's less of a pain. By less of a pain, I mean they should streamline the process especially for zones like Aby Tahrongi and mobs like Glavoid, only to have it drop 1-2 shells. They should either increase the number of possible drops, reduce the number of shells needed, or streamline the nm's needed to kill so you could get Glavoid pop items.

Otherwise, I 100% agree with the OP. Ty for bringing this up!

[Anapingofness]

Everyone else who wanted an empyrean successfully camped these NMs and completed the trials. Why do you think you're a special snowflake that they should change the game for?

Speak for yourself. I wouldn't want this time wasting crap on my worst enemy. Furthermore, the way the bloody trials are now (specifically the NM camping at start) is deterring me for doing this for other jobs.

It's players like you that keep this game in the bloody stone ages. Just because you, me, and countless others had to go through this crap doesn't mean that newer players should have to. It also doesn't mean that we should have to go through the same crap if we wanted another weapon.

[Annex]

...Black Triple Stars......3 days.....real life days.....nough said....

[nyheen]

...Black Triple Stars......3 days.....real life days.....nough said....
this is the worst and also Hovering Hotpot took over 8 hours to pop on me. and yes i was killing place holder after every the first hour non stop UP to 8 hours, every 5 mins.><. sorry but i don't wanna do that again>.>

[wish12oz]

moooo
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c243/r5n/mooooooo.jpg

[wish12oz]

http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c243/r5n/herdingstaff.jpg

http://www.diablowiki.net/images/2/26/Easter-ghost-cow-king1.jpg

You know you want to.

[Arukia]

Blizzard can ban for ez mode map hacking you know ;)

[wish12oz]

Blizzard can ban for ez mode map hacking you know ;)

no idea what you're talking about, if its something in one of the in game SS's, I took both those off google, only the staff I took in-game.

[svengalis]

Noone said you were talking about VNMS I said they should turn all the spawn NM into VNMS.
to clarify, im NOT talking about VWmn's

im talking about the normal low level, lottery spawn nm's in the various zones

liek serpapard ishtar, tottering toby, drooling daisy, megalobugard, etc

the VWnm's are fine as-is

the other nm's however, need to be either lowered to 1 required kill, or have them respawn every 10-30 minutes

[svengalis]

He didn't even experience half of what this game has to offer and he quits?
True story I got a friend to play FFXI he bought the downloadable abyssea edition for $10. He leveled up well we helped him a lot in abyssea. Then he got started on making the H2H weapon and he didn't like the camp weak NMs for hours part and stopped playing FFXI only after about 2 months.

Its true that if you haven't played FFXI for a long time, most people would not be able to put up with camping lottery spawn nms for hours on end.

SE could get rid of the whole camp weak nms part and just start on VNMs. The newer upgrades shield and harp don't even have a weak NM phase because I think by then SE knew that people didn't want to do that crap and they very well could of had it. If they don't want to change that much of the game they can easily shorten repop times to 5 min and have them just pop instead of lottery. FFXIV has this and it works fine. Many quests in FFXIV require killing NMs and its not big of a deal because they have a 5 min repop and just pop in to the game and are not lottery.

[Camiie]

He didn't even experience half of what this game has to offer and he quits?

Many don't even make it that far, and I don't blame them. We all have our own tastes and FFXI is a VERY acquired one.
Call me a hypocrite, but even though I play it I tend to steer people away from it for their own good.

[wish12oz]

Many don't even make it that far, and I don't blame them. We all have our own tastes and FFXI is a VERY acquired one.
Call me a hypocrite, but even though I play it I tend to steer people away from it for their own good.

I totally agree, we should all just play Diablo 3. I'm half through Inferno on my Barb now, and its a lot of fun when I don't run into random unkillable champion packs. I'm hoping I can clear act 4 before the Inferno nerf, but I doubt I will.
http://images.bluegartr.com/bucket/gallery/c328b02c1240f04756f49b4f989d3487.jpg