Gay Marriage in Vana'diel

[Asymptotic]

Dear Devs:

It's time to end the medieval gender role discriminiation you've enforced upon the beautiful world of Vana'diel. While it's pretty well-known that Vana'diel has a sizable and visible transgender (http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Mithra) population, there's not much mention of Vana'diel's gay community. All we know is that gays are not allowed to get married unless they manifest in heterosexual gender identity pairs.

That's not to say the issue of gays in Vana'diel hasn't been addressed at all ...

http://unakowa2006.img.jugem.jp/20081210_533349.jpg

And yet, despite Mayakov's heroic deeds in the service of the Armed Forces of Altana, he never gets to wear that wedding dress he dreamed of! Do you know why! BECAUSE HE CAN'T GET MARRIED! It's preposterous. We modern gay adventurers get similarly shafted.

I talked to some prominent NPCs on the subject, and here's what they had to say:

King Destin of San d'Oria stated that while he has no personal ire for homosexuals, due to extrme pressure from the Papsque and the San d'Orian cathedral, he was forced to consider enacting a law which would forbid homosexuality in the Kingdom of San d'Oria, punishable by imprisonment in the Bostaunieaux Oubliette.

In response, the Star Sibyl of Windurst had the following to say:


In Windurst, we've always had the view that love is Magic - and we make no distinction of sexual orientation, gender identity, or gender expression - in the beauty of that magic. When lovers are crossed in the stars, it's a wonderful thing and we will be forced to invoke trade sanctions against the Kingdom of San d'Oria and cease all military aid and diplomatic ties if they follow through with such an egregious trampling of Vana'dielian rights.

President Karst of the Republic of Bastok was far less eloquent and seemed somewhat confused, "I don't get it," he said, "I thought all Elvaan were gay."

We tried to contact the Archduke of Jeuno, but he could not be reached. An alarum from the Jeuno Voidwatch, however, suggests that the Duchy at least does not discriminate on the basis of sexual orientation for the purposes of military service.

That aside!

The world is moving forward, Vana'diel should move forward too. Let us get gay married, SE. We didn't all play Mithra.

[Alhanelem]

Already beaten to death a million times, will never happen. SE is hardline against it.

[Asymptotic]

Already beaten to death a million times, will never happen. SE is hardline against it.

What are you, the "No" police?

[Doombringer]

lol, made me think of the star wars "gayest patch ever"

is this even an issue anymore? i mean, do they even still do straight marriage in ffxi? i thought now you just synthed the ring and gave it to you're partner? no in game ceremony involved either way. does the ring somehow know who you're giving it to?

but i guess if this is applicable then sure, why not. comon se, legalize gay.

[Camiie]

They should allow any two characters to marry regardless of gender (or lack thereof). Heck, aren't marriages pretty much player run events these days anyway? I haven't been involved in one since before they were changed so correct me if I'm wrong. Just let players run the wedding they want to run and have the rings and certificates simply list the names and ignore the gender of the characters. That way, while not endorsing it, they're not preventing it either. Not that I think their political concern, homophobia, or whatever is justified, but I gotta be realistic here.

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/2009_-_%2810/13/2009%29_Produce_your_own_wedding!_Presenting_the_new_wedding_support_service!

Only issue I have with the OP is the reference to Mayakov. While it's never made explicitly clear who he would marry if given the chance, he does state outright he'd do so wearing a tuxedo.

[SpankWustler]

Only marginally relevant to the topic, but some folks might enjoy the story.

Way back when, more than one person got the idea that my female best friend and I were boyfriend and boyfriend. Not people who knew each other, either, this was like the convergent evolution of a false idea. Of course, being the polite and refined young man that that I am, I'd respond by asking if they felt there was a top/bottom thing going and who the bottom was.

There was. Me. Always me. Glad they got that one part right, at least!


What are you, the "No" police?

I'm pretty sure he is. Literally. I'm pretty sure he even has a little badge with "NO!" emblazoned on it in every language.

[Asymptotic]

lol, made me think of the star wars "gayest patch ever"

is this even an issue anymore? i mean, do they even still do straight marriage in ffxi? i thought now you just synthed the ring and gave it to you're partner? no in game ceremony involved either way. does the ring somehow know who you're giving it to?

but i guess if this is applicable then sure, why not. comon se, legalize gay.

It's really only applicable to getting the marriage certificate and rings directly from the NPCs anymore.

[Asymptotic]

Only issue I have with the OP is the reference to Mayakov. While it's never made explicitly clear who he would marry if given the chance, he does state outright he'd do so wearing a tuxedo.

He sort of ... is wishy washy on that. He kind of implies it would be the dress, then acts embarrassed, and says tuxedo :P

[Sparthos]

To anyone of the LBGT persuasion I'll be happy to inform you that straight marriages are absolutely useless and you're missing out on nothing by being unable to wed.

[Asymptotic]

To anyone of the LBGT persuasion I'll be happy to inform you that straight marriages are absolutely useless and you're missing out on nothing by being unable to wed.

I want a marriage certificate. :|

Also wait are you talking about in game ... or ... IRL ... I can't tell.

It's funny either way.

[Doombringer]

It's really only applicable to getting the marriage certificate and rings directly from the NPCs anymore.

wait a minute, there's a certificate? i'm vanadielian straight married and i don't think i have a certificate? and this was way back when you had a third party sign you up and a GM performed the ceremony and made you macro the embarrassingly corny vanadiel themed vows.

of course now i'm vanadiel straight divorced so maybe that's where it went? is it a key item? now i feel compelled to go look....

[Asymptotic]

It's a furnishing.

[Asymptotic]

EX: http://www.ffxiah.com/item/347/win-marriage-cert

[Doombringer]

i don't think i have that.... lol, the fuck?

[Asymptotic]

Your marriage obviously wasn't good enough in the eyes of the Goddess Altana, either.

[Doombringer]

Your marriage obviously wasn't good enough in the eyes of the Goddess Altana, either.

ouch... i think i just felt empathy, and it did not feel good at all.

[Asymptotic]

Maybe if you hadn't undermined the institution of marriage with divorce...

[Ziyyigo-Tipyigo]

They should allow any two characters to marry regardless of gender (or lack thereof).

They already let Galka get married, just not to each other. Galka: putting the "T" in "LGBT" since 2002!

(And as for Mayakov, "effeminate" isn't the same thing as "homosexual." Foudeel, Wahboud, and Bashraf in Aht Urhgan, on the other hand...)

[Asymptotic]

Mayakov is gay. Trust me. We ... well we had too much Dawn Mulsum .. and uh .. he looks exactly like me ... and uh ... nevermind.

I know.

Also, I'm 100% sure that Lehko was hitting on me when he said we'd be "firm" friends.

[Rosalie]

http://www.myfacewhen.net/uploads/239-oh-look-its-this-thread-again.jpg

Old dead thread is here. (http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/1724-Same-Sex-Marriages)

[Camiie]

Also, I'm 100% sure that Lehko was hitting on me when he said we'd be "firm" friends.

Psssh. Lehko swings all kind of ways!


(And as for Mayakov, "effeminate" isn't the same thing as "homosexual." Foudeel, Wahboud, and Bashraf in Aht Urhgan, on the other hand...)

Well, those guys were under the influence if you know what I mean. I think the true non-hetero coupling in FFXI is Prishe and Ulmia! Come on... you know it's true!

[Asymptotic]

http://www.myfacewhen.net/uploads/239-oh-look-its-this-thread-again.jpg

Old dead thread is here. (http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/1724-Same-Sex-Marriages)

This thread is better, contribute or gladly show yourself to the door.
We don't need your childish reaction images and smart-mouth comments.

[Camiie]

What are you, the "No" police?

He is.... Dr. No...

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_96uP6vDZMT8/S8YeXSFHNUI/AAAAAAAAKiM/JUQ6YMpe6qI/s400/DR+NO16.jpg

[Ziyyigo-Tipyigo]

This thread is better

I believe you mean "more fabulous."

[cidbahamut]

There's really no reason not to implement this.

You know, other than homophobia.

[SpankWustler]

There's really no reason not to implement this.

Balance:

There are fewer homosexuals playing Final Fantasy XI than heterosexuals, and thus the detached hatred expressed per homosexual player has to be even higher than normal to balance things out across demographics.

Someone has been looking for something really nasty to do to the dozen or so Eskimos who play Final Fantasy XI for at least the past five years. Something really, really nasty.

[Sparthos]

There's really no reason not to implement this.

You know, other than homophobia.

Or maybe.. because it's a fucking waste of resources?

Oh, since we're on useless additions (people dont even use the current marriage system much) can I have a dating simulator where I can choose from one of 12 NPCs to woo and eventually take back to MH for a little pixel on pixel action?

I can see it now:

1. Dodging my elvaan F girlfriends father to deliver a box of blood chocolates to her window. Make the dad true sound and if you're caught he spams doom and stun followed by the screen fading to black.

2. Taru on taru action. Those blood-curdling japanese orgasm screams can be dubbed in for the romance scene between the two taru when you finally take her back to the Mog House. A sure-fire hit!

3. Your Galka romance can involve roasting sausages over the fire which leads to a steamy romance in the wilds of Gustaberg. Since Galka have no specific gender, this wonderful romance would be open to members of both sexes. Balance!

[Rosalie]

There's really no reason not to implement this.

You know, other than homophobia.

SE says different--can "thank" the ESRB for it.


Hello Everyone!

Whatever your personal opinions on Same-Sex marriage, both sides can agree that it is a controversial topic world-wide. Because of its controversial nature, Same-Gender marriages are not currently available in Vana'diel in order to ensure the game is rated "T" (or its equivalent) worldwide.

We do appreciate to continue hearing your feedback on this, as policies are ever evolving and do change, and I'd like to add I personally do appreciate everyone that has particpated in this debate without flaming or being offensive, since it can be a very volatile subject. I do hope we can keep the conversation going if possible.

Also:


Squre-Enix ninja-added gay marriage in over a year ago with their automated marriage system. They couldn't just come out and say they added it due to political and social pressure, so they stuck it in and just let people figure it out for themselves. Here is a basic rundown on how to marry someone of the same sex:

Step 1: Get a friend of the opposite gender (your best man or maid of honor or witness or whatever) to buy two rings.
Step 2: Use an HQ earth crystal to sign the rings.
Step 3: Exchange the rings (whether through a ceremony or juat right there at the NPC who acts as a justice of the peace.)
Step 4: Buy your friend a ring.
Step 5: Talk to the NPC one at a time while partied with your friend to get your marriage certificates. Marriage certificates aren't actually signed. They're just furnishings. congratulations! You're married.

[SpankWustler]

2. Taru on taru action. Those blood-curdling japanese orgasm screams can be dubbed in for the romance scene between the two taru when you finally take her back to the Mog House. A sure-fire hit!

http://i2.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/103/740/c2c.png

[Ziyyigo-Tipyigo]

Tarutaru are the only race that actually, demonstrably have sex to begin with.

How often have you seen a complete family unit consisting of a mother, a father, and a child where they weren't Tarutaru?

[Asymptotic]

The ESRB is lame.

[Windwhisper]

I love the Original Post. It shows great creativity. Please stay the way you are :)

[Meyi]

Of course, being the polite and refined young man that that I am, I'd respond by asking if they felt there was a top/bottom thing going and who the bottom was.

There was. Me. Always me. Glad they got that one part right, at least!



2. Taru on taru action. Those blood-curdling japanese orgasm screams can be dubbed in for the romance scene between the two taru when you finally take her back to the Mog House. A sure-fire hit!


[Me gusta]

Well you know, I too am a taru, and I am many fabulous shades of the Pride Rainbow.

...Brb jumping to Phoenix and proposing to Spank.

[Ziyyigo-Tipyigo]

As I've mentioned elsewhere, ESRB isn't worldwide, it's NA-onry.

Meanwhile, XIV also has a T rating, in spite of S-E's relentless quest to be "darker and edgier" with "obligatory swearing" and regular, frequent allusions to lesbian sex.

[Asymptotic]

Really though, I meant this thread to be more of a playful commentary (hence the NPC interviews) D:

Still, sucks that the ESRB is dumb.

[cidbahamut]

Or maybe.. because it's a fucking waste of resources?

That's never stopped them from implementing and updating frivolous stuff before. Lack of resources only ever stops them from implementing worthwhile gameplay changes.

[Asymptotic]

That's never stopped them from implementing and updating frivolous stuff before. Lack of resources only ever stops them from implementing worthwhile gameplay changes.

Something something something sange.

[Sparthos]

That's never stopped them from implementing and updating frivolous stuff before. Lack of resources only ever stops them from implementing worthwhile gameplay changes.

And much like the other frivolous stuff before it, I think adding something like this would be a waste of time.

Put gay marriages in a game like XIV with a budget, not the game that can't even get normal content nevermind bells and whistles. The current marriage system is a waste of time, the Kokba hostel is the waste of time (I bet most dont even know the SE sanctioned cyber rooms exist) and this too would be a waste of time.

[Camiie]

Or maybe.. because it's a fucking waste of resources?

The Great King Sparthos has spoken! Vana'diel be His land to rule over as He doth see fit! Let us move along fellow peasants and be thankful that our Lord has graced us with his berating! Even His wrath is an honor to which we are less than worthy!


Oh, since we're on useless additions (people dont even use the current marriage system much) can I have a dating simulator where I can choose from one of 12 NPCs to woo and eventually take back to MH for a little pixel on pixel action?

I can see it now:

1. Dodging my elvaan F girlfriends father to deliver a box of blood chocolates to her window. Make the dad true sound and if you're caught he spams doom and stun followed by the screen fading to black.

2. Taru on taru action. Those blood-curdling japanese orgasm screams can be dubbed in for the romance scene between the two taru when you finally take her back to the Mog House. A sure-fire hit!

3. Your Galka romance can involve roasting sausages over the fire which leads to a steamy romance in the wilds of Gustaberg. Since Galka have no specific gender, this wonderful romance would be open to members of both sexes. Balance!

I would totally play that game. I think you're on to something here! Hail to The King, baby!

[cidbahamut]

And much like the other frivolous stuff before it, I think adding something like this would be a waste of time.

Put gay marriages in a game like XIV with a budget, not the game that can't even get normal content nevermind bells and whistles. The current marriage system is a waste of time, the Kokba hostel is the waste of time (I bet most dont even know the SE sanctioned cyber rooms exist) and this too would be a waste of time.

Obligatory:
http://i443.photobucket.com/albums/qq157/Just_Bri_Thanks/bells.jpg

I tend to agree with you that there are more pressing matters, like making the game not suck and adding more content, but resources permitting there's no reason this shouldn't be something that's slated to get changed eventually.

[Alhanelem]

I'm pretty sure he is. Literally. I'm pretty sure he even has a little badge with "NO!" emblazoned on it in every language.
Hmm...

*buys one off the internet*

Look, I really don't care about it in either direction, I have no plans to marry anyone in a video game. I'd rather keep that to real life. I'm simply pointing out in this case that this topic has been beaten to death until it's been totally bled out and the remains are just a pile of dust about to blow away int he wind. SE has already answered it and posting again isn't going to change their minds on it. It's kind of sad, really, but beating the dead horse some more isn't going to do anything.

[Asymptotic]

Hmm...

*buys one off the internet*

Look, I really don't care about it in either direction, I have no plans to marry anyone in a video game. I'd rather keep that to real life. I'm simply pointing out in this case that this topic has been beaten to death until it's been totally bled out and the remains are just a pile of dust about to blow away int he wind. SE has already answered it and posting again isn't going to change their minds on it. It's kind of sad, really, but beating the dead horse some more isn't going to do anything.

It got me 290 emails.

[wish12oz]

not this s#&$ again..............

[Verytus]

Hello Everyone!

This is quite a sensitive topic, and we are pleased that so many of you care so much about Vana'diel and have taken the time to voice your opinions on this issue. Unfortunately, as is so often the case, the argument here seems to have shifted from in-game matters to the real world, and although we understand that many of you have strong opinions on the matter you would like to continue to discuss, this thread will now be closed.

Please remember that lively, relevant debate and discussion about the world of Vana'diel is encouraged. However, respect for your fellow Vana'dielans should always be maintained (especially when you disagree with them).