Allowing Some Mobs to be Enfeebled Causes The Balance to Explode!

[Karbuncle]

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/21162-dev1093-Enfeebling-Magic-Resistance-of-Monsters

Hey RDM's, Your Core abilities and Uses will no longer be completely worthless on Every single piece of endgame content Ever!

maybe.

However, Allowing RDM's core reason for existing to be used on something stronger than a Tiny Rarrab will have devastating consequences on Game balance, so they're going to test it for a long time.

Goodness knows they never planned on NMs being debuffed, This contingency is unplanned and needs much studying.

----

Sarcasm/Kidding around Aside. Good to know sometime in the near future We may actually be able to use Gravity/II to Lower Enemies evasion to some use! You guys happy about this? THOUGHTS?!

I kinda look forward too it, I know it was announced already about a week ago, But hopefully they open up Enfeebles to a lot of enemies.

[saevel]

Yeah but ...


While there will remain a select group of exceptional monsters with complete resistance to certain effects, the vast majority of monsters will become susceptible to enfeebling effects.
*This does not guarantee that enfeebling magic will always be successful. Furthermore, effect duration may be reduced for monsters with high resistance.

and this is SE. For all we know they could be planning to make all level 90+ NM's resistant and just remove the resistance on the older stuff. Plus even if they remove it's resistances its not like RDM has much to throw at them now. They need to create new enfeebles that let us reduce the target stats (crit / STR / INT / attack / ect..). I'm not talking about effects that do similar things but something that actually puts the effect of "X / Y / Z down" on the target. Like what many mobs and NM's do to us.

[Karbuncle]

Yeah but ...



and this is SE. For all we know they could be planning to make all level 90+ NM's resistant and just remove the resistance on the older stuff. Plus even if they remove it's resistances its not like RDM has much to throw at them now. They need to create new enfeebles that let us reduce the target stats (crit / STR / INT / attack / ect..). I'm not talking about effects that do similar things but something that actually puts the effect of "X / Y / Z down" on the target. Like what many mobs and NM's do to us.

i'm aware of that Excerpt, I ignored it in hopes they just meant stuff like Elementals and Avatars remaining immune. I man, theres a good chance they're going to completely muck this up and do something dumb like just remove the resistance of all those NMs added around the ToAU era (You know, Those level 5~50 mobs that are immune to almost ever enfeeble?).

But Deep down i Hope they actually do something meaningful here.

[saevel]

i'm aware of that Excerpt, I ignored it in hopes they just meant stuff like Elementals and Avatars remaining immune. I man, theres a good chance they're going to completely muck this up and do something dumb like just remove the resistance of all those NMs added around the ToAU era (You know, Those level 5~50 mobs that are immune to almost ever enfeeble?).

But Deep down i Hope they actually do something meaningful here.

I used to hope .. once ... long ago...

[Karbuncle]

Not like it'll matter much. By the time this is implemented I won't be around :(

[cidbahamut]

All I heard was "Notorious monsters will get to keep their immunities or dilute the effects to the point where enfeebles are completely trivial".

[tyrantsyn]

You know whats funny? In a world where proc'ing cause mob's to be unable to act at all, enfeebling magic is still consider too powerful to let go un~checked. Give me a break!

[Halifax]

Why is this change even being considered? I don't quite understand the issue that this change is attempting to solve...

[Luvbunny]

So basically anything that actually make one job somewhat useful and benefits the player to have a little bit of edge over the NM is considered game breaking.... What they have been smoking over there? It seems that their only idea is to make the NM has tons of HP and annoying AOE moves that kill everyone in range. No strategy here other than proc and temp items, and stun timing. They need to come up with a better alternative and if they decide to "tweak" existing content, which is a cheaper solution, just make the rewards better. Tons of older contents could use smaller boost and tweaking in terms of rewards given.

[Daniel_Hatcher]

Basically at the end of the day SE don't know what Balance is themselves.

[Kitkat]

I'm not sure how allowing Slow II/Paralyze II/Blind II/Gravity II will destroy balance >.> Most of these mobs have TP-type standard attacks, high Regain, can use moves in quick succession, and typically deal 40~60% damage to use compared to the 1~10% damage we deal to them. Slow II and Para II won't stop a quick succession use of TP moves, Blind II might be nice for the chance of being missed once in a blue moon to the higher eva jobs, and gravity II would go a long way in stopping some of these mobs running all around destroying an alliance with AOE (even after adjustment).

I still don't expect bind/gravity/silence to work on anything even of worth after this....but all the same I'm not seeing the balance upset they are worried about when the mobs we've wanted to use enfeebles on already have a lot going for them offensively and defensively.

Then again, this is SE...anything that is at all like 75 content fights (IE: faf/nid/beh/etc) that doesn't have you running around trying to stay alive is "too easy" and "unbalanced." If I could cast Dia III and kill something instantly..that would be unbalanced..if I could cast Para II and see the VWNM struggle to get a hit in else wise...that would be unbalanced. No one expects this..people just want to be able to cast enfeebles and have some chance at making the fight a little more manageable, not a walk in the park.

[ManaKing]

I'm almost dreading this, sadly. If all goes well then at least RDM will be able to....land enfeebles (do what it was intended to do from the start? WOOOO we need an update for that.....)

If all goes poorly, SE tells us it's fixed and that they won't be looking into it for another 3 years.

It really feels like they just left RDM out of the entire aby content and now that it is winding down they figure, 'hey aby was already broken by design, no reason to leave RDM out now that it's over. Teehee.'

[SpankWustler]

An optimistic reading tells me, "We're going to test this for a long time because it really is a dramatic change that will make a huge difference. Part of the big deal is the inclusion of Gravity in the change, and that really is a big deal."

A pessimistic reading tells me, "I just inhaled whatever comes out of a fluorescent bulb when it is broken. The giant insect to the left of the graphics department is telling me that everything from the Magical Land of Voidwatch-Land shall forever be immune to Paralyze and Slow. Gravity II shall be a farce, a farce like the human skin worn by the demon who 'works' on the fourth floor. We'll be watching the effects of these changes like the black helicopters watch me - always watch me, always watching."

[Kieron]

What the hell is the point of having enfeebles in the game if they don't even work on anything important? Another question, why the hell are enfeebles part of the VW procs if the monsters are immune to them? How does that make any sense?

[Neisan_Quetz]

A lot about VW doesn't make sense, enfeebles being procs when monsters are immune is just one of them.

Wyvern procs of same element as the NM too...

[Belmonts]

*sigh* i see this just as another way that things are gonna be the same, but "shut up RDM's". Kinda sad...

[Quetzacoatl]

I feel that this is going to be RDM's last glimmer of hope before SE completely destroys it by keeping enfeebling resistance high. Having to be unable to land enfeebles on things that matter just hurts the job by a chunk, and it's not like it could solo Voidwatch mobs, if not at least low-manning some of the starting tiers.

I don't think we're asking for something that makes an overwhelming change in battle, but a change that can help to turn the tides better. The lower the resistance rates, the better chance Red Mage has to make a comeback as a wanted job again. Otherwise, I just may finally hang up the Chapeau until something better comes along for it.

[ShadowViper]

Wont matter in the end, even if they allow the enfeebs to stick SCH WHM and BLM will be able to stick them, still giving us 0 role or use past refresh whores (least outside abys). Until they give us a true party role like crowd control enfeebler and group buffer (aoe enfeebs, ability to use more non self buffs) we will never have a real role since all but one of our enfeebs are available to other jobs.

[tyrantsyn]

Lol refresh, I can't even think of the last time I had to Refresh someone.

[CapriciousOne]

Basically at the end of the day SE don't know what Balance is themselves.

Yea that seems to be the case or SE has dyslexia and balance reads as ecnalab and it confuses them.

[Windwhisper]

i love during VW "The fiend appears to be weak against ice based white magic" and you know you wont ever land paralyze on it at all. but its "weak" against it. paradox created.

[ShadowViper]

I love during VW when "ice WHM" is called and the whm says my spells are all light.

[Ladyofdragons]

I feel that this is going to be RDM's last glimmer of hope before SE completely destroys it by keeping enfeebling resistance high. Having to be unable to land enfeebles on things that matter just hurts the job by a chunk, and it's not like it could solo Voidwatch mobs, if not at least low-manning some of the starting tiers.

I don't think we're asking for something that makes an overwhelming change in battle, but a change that can help to turn the tides better. The lower the resistance rates, the better chance Red Mage has to make a comeback as a wanted job again. Otherwise, I just may finally hang up the Chapeau until something better comes along for it.

And my Chapeau is hung up until something good actually does come along rdms never get used now ; ;

[hideka]

Yeah but ...



and this is SE. For all we know they could be planning to make all level 90+ NM's resistant and just remove the resistance on the older stuff. Plus even if they remove it's resistances its not like RDM has much to throw at them now. They need to create new enfeebles that let us reduce the target stats (crit / STR / INT / attack / ect..). I'm not talking about effects that do similar things but something that actually puts the effect of "X / Y / Z down" on the target. Like what many mobs and NM's do to us.

i think you hit the nail on the head. you can expect everything 90+ to be immune still and all old abyssea content to be able to be hit (so rdms have something to do while theyre inable to get groups for anything, due to being the new "LOLjOB")

[hideka]

actualy i normaly have no problem landing Para 1&2 on rdm >_> gogo 180 total mind. makes capping and landing enfeebles a joke.

[Quetzacoatl]

Wont matter in the end, even if they allow the enfeebs to stick SCH WHM and BLM will be able to stick them, still giving us 0 role or use past refresh whores (least outside abys). Until they give us a true party role like crowd control enfeebler and group buffer (aoe enfeebs, ability to use more non self buffs) we will never have a real role since all but one of our enfeebs are available to other jobs.

>implying enfeebling skill has no impact on resist rates and duration whatsoever

[Neisan_Quetz]

actualy i normaly have no problem landing Para 1&2 on rdm >_> gogo 180 total mind. makes capping and landing enfeebles a joke.

You can eleseal Para I/II and it still won't land on many NMs. same for Gravity. I'm not sure what you consider 'landing enfeebles a joke' when scores of NMs are outright immune to them.

[macross]

I can already slow any mob in the game with ukon, well maybe not all but most. It's prob weak slow but doesn't seem to affect anything.

[Kaisha]

Looks like we get to wait yet another month for this adjustment at any rate. Zero mention of it in today's update notes.

[Daniel_Hatcher]

Yeah, they'd already said it would take longer to implement.

[Demon6324236]

What the hell is the point of having enfeebles in the game if they don't even work on anything important? Another question, why the hell are enfeebles part of the VW procs if the monsters are immune to them? How does that make any sense?

I ask myself that same question, and why is Modus Veritas a proc, SE already nerfed it to hell so it never lands, procing with that is rarer then getting the drop you actually want off the NM!
I stopped trying to use RDM in VW for enfeebling procs because one day a taru COR/RDM landed para after 30+ tries by me using para 1&2 in enfeebling gear with magic acc gear using drinks... and he did it on his 1st cast... VW makes no sense to me.

[Yukichibi]

They will just make the fights impossible to win (or hard as hell) without debuffing the highly resistant monster (that only a 500 enfeebling skill and a lot magic accu can pass through).

[Neisan_Quetz]

Or they'll probably do what they've been doing all this time, and give monsters attacks that enfeebles don't affect in the first place.

[Demon6324236]

Like making all the attacks it uses (including standard attacks) TP attacks, so that para does nothing except spells which would be unlikely to be effected seeing as 8 DDs hitting it doesn't interrupt it.