Bastion still sucks - news at 11

[Draylo]

Trying to get some AF3 base pants for my mule is pretty tiresome when the battles end in 5 seconds. The blms casting AOE spells on everything was fixed... now they cast tier4 and still bring crap directly next to the martello so it can AOE and kill the poor little 1% HP martello. Either get rid of the damn mages, move them far from the martello, or give the stupid thing some HP!

[Runespider]

I was hoping they would make the martello immune to AOE attacks instead the aga removal for mages, AOE damage should be limited to players and npc defenders. Makes a lot more sense that way.

[RAIST]

umm... notdoingitright?

Give it some support. As in, run an op to give it wards. Buff things up while waiting for them to show up. Run out a bit ahead of the NPC's and AOE them first.

[Draylo]

Wards do nothing, I can't buff as a DD job. I can do AOE but they still wind up near the 1% HP martello and ruin its everything.

[Alhanelem]

Wards dont do nothing, they get attacked before the core is targeted. Yes, their usefulness is limited when everything is always at 3% HP (unless you can get multiple people to do the ops at the same time as you, you'll never do more than one, possibly two ops before another battle occurs)

[Krashport]

Could just make Bastion like a mini-Besieged and get it over with, Or maybe put a magical and a Physical shield around the martello, Cause right now and as before it's still "LOL".

[FrankReynolds]

Could just make the martello start at %100 every time. It's not like it would change much if anything.

[Karbuncle]

Wards dont do nothing, they get attacked before the core is targeted. Yes, their usefulness is limited when everything is always at 3% HP (unless you can get multiple people to do the ops at the same time as you, you'll never do more than one, possibly two ops before another battle occurs)

They're useless when the Martello can still get hit by AoEs with the Wards up.

Which is the entire problem.

Because mages pull mobs back to the Martello and get AoE'd

Ending the battle.

You know, The OP's entire post.

They don't do nothing. But they do nothing to fix the OPs problem. Bastion Mages MPK'ing the Martello. That happens with or without wards. As far as actual suggestions to the OP, Whirl of Rage, try to tank all the mobs. They don't hurt too much. Especially on BLU. Should be able to handle most of them (Chariots might be tricky)

[RAIST]

Wards do make a difference, especially if you prot/shell them as well (as in, /WHM...it also give you access to several useful spells like diaga and reraise, etc). Quality of your reward is a reflection of the quality of your buff to bastion elements. If you get the highest reward, so do the NPC's/ Structures. Different Op's affect different aspects of bastion as well--for example, if wards are up, you can do one that buffs defense across the board.

As for having people there to assist you...yeah, it will always make it easier, but it's hardly a neccessity. I've gotten Vunkerl wins solo on single waves with various jobs (DRK, SMN, BLM, WHM, NIN, WAR...DRG, MNK....) and gotten wins on multiple waves at once with just one or two other people there. Take advantage of the round structure once you grab all their attention. Attowha is pretty good too also you can work the landscape to keep them away from the martello as well. Misereaux is a bit of a nuissance sometimes though because it's so open.

It isn't all that hard to turn the tide in your favor. If they are just flat out tearing them up in 10 seconds flat, then THEY NEED OPS RUN. Go in just before day change so you can run two back to back. You will be surprised how much a difference that one little bit makes on the next fight. Figure out the best way to stop them just before they breech the ward line, and pull them out and away from the martello--IT WILL FORCE THE NPC'S OUT.

As most every other event in this game, formulating some form of strategy goes a long way.....

[Draylo]

Or they could make the event more tolerable and not have to rely on such things. This is for a mule, not my main. Stop trying to defend a shit event lol.

[saevel]

The problem is the martello has 1~3% HP and dies in one to two hits. Everything else is just coincidental to the situation.

They need to make it so that the martello always spawns at 25% HP. This gives room to do OP's and buff it, but also allows it to survive more then a few seconds.

[Zirael]

What I used to do to get all 20 AF3 legs was buy Fanatic Drink from Bastion NPC (150 points) and either Fanatic->Blizzaga III -> T4 T4 T4 on small fry for points, or meele version: Fanatic-> 300TP Aeolian Edge -> meele small fry for points and spam Aeolian Edge.
This nets ~1000 points unless you get charmed by a chariot when fanatic wears or homing missile gets you.
I bet at 99 a turtled up RDM PLD or BLU doesn't even need Fanatic Drink.

[RAIST]

Or they could make the event more tolerable and not have to rely on such things. This is for a mule, not my main. Stop trying to defend a shit event lol.

not trying to defend it.. trying to give you some insight on how to do a very simple event.

If you read the details about Bastion and the martello, and how it all affects abyssea, you can see how it benefits everyone to fully participate. For a while there, the JP were essentially running it with small groups to support the efforts of groups/alliances elsewhere in the zone because of how it is all integrated. It's a very simple mechanic, and participating in it properly can make things better for everyone in the zone.

But...guess that just may be too much to hope for from the the more casual, me-first crowd that seems to be cropping up these days.

[RAIST]

The problem is the martello has 1~3% HP and dies in one to two hits. Everything else is just coincidental to the situation.

They need to make it so that the martello always spawns at 25% HP. This gives room to do OP's and buff it, but also allows it to survive more then a few seconds.

Resistance Ops (http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Resistance_Ops)

Some of these things only take a few minutes to run down, and can go a long way towards success in Bastion. Run two Desert Rains back to back at change of gameday (one before, one just after) and you will see a marked difference in the defense. Alternatively, you could do a Ward Warden first to get the clone wards back out, then buff defenses, etc.

[Kincard]

It's pretty well-documented that in order for something to progress as intended, it either has to be something you can do on your own (Say, chocobo racing or pankration), or the rewards need to be attractive enough so that the system is self-sustaining (You're not going to get a shadows of the mind group anymore because it's just not worth it, for instance). The fact that the system CAN work doesn't mean it is, and if it isn't working, then the design is fundamentally flawed.

If they want people to do the ops so much they're going to need to make each run significantly more worthwhile because most people don't bother with them.

[Daniel_Hatcher]

umm... notdoingitright?

Give it some support. As in, run an op to give it wards. Buff things up while waiting for them to show up. Run out a bit ahead of the NPC's and AOE them first.

You can do this RDM/BLM it should be a doddle for BLU.



I bet at 99 a turtled up RDM PLD or BLU doesn't even need Fanatic Drink.

Didn't need it at 85. Phalanx, and 1 or 2 regen ATMA and you're done.

[RAIST]

It's pretty well-documented that in order for something to progress as intended, it either has to be something you can do on your own (Say, chocobo racing or pankration), or the rewards need to be attractive enough so that the system is self-sustaining (You're not going to get a shadows of the mind group anymore because it's just not worth it, for instance). The fact that the system CAN work doesn't mean it is, and if it isn't working, then the design is fundamentally flawed.

If they want people to do the ops so much they're going to need to make each run significantly more worthwhile because most people don't bother with them.

Maybe it's more that some players way of thinking may be flawed....or more appropriately, lacking in an understanding of just how they are getting rewarded for participation. This isn't an instant gratification system. In general, this game was NEVER designed as such. Until recently, it has always been more along the line of investment for long term gains.

Ops improve Bastion results. As more Bastions are won (or more specifically, more cores are obtained), the ZONE as a whole improves. Better Cruor Buffs, better drops, better chest rates....more frequent Bastions as well.

Your rewards come in various ways: potential seal rewards, or an increase in your rewards from Bastion (if you do the Ops and it improves your Bastion, you get more xp and more credits), or if you want assistance with farming feet it can have an impact there as well. Guess it all depends what you are after as your reward at the particular time.

Here is an example. When I was going after feet I would check martello cores. If I didn't see a setup that looked like my chances for feet would be good, I'd run Ops and fight in the hopes of improving the cores. In doing so, I'd often nab upwards of 10k a pop from the fights, and after core(s) affecting chest rate and treasure were captured, I'd go farm my feet. Get feet dropping, a few merits, a nice chunk of aby currencies (credits/cruor). Seems like a pretty decent list of rewards......

[Nightfyre]

AoE mobs
run
PCs and NPCs finish off mobs
collect easy 500+ points per fight on any job

[Muse]

Here's how I earned my Bastion Points for Emp pants.

1: Level SCH
2: Get Embrava
3: Do Resistance OP to get wards up
4: Do Bastion and Embrava everything. This will regen the Martello and Wards to 100%
5: Kaustra the incoming wave
6: Get ISL and repeat until you're done

[Daniel_Hatcher]

Here's how I earned my Bastion Points for Emp pants.

1: Level SCH
2: Get Embrava
3: Do Resistance OP to get wards up
4: Do Bastion and Embrava everything. This will regen the Martello and Wards to 100%
5: Kaustra the incoming wave
6: Get ISL and repeat until you're done

Shouldn't of mentioned the Embrava thing here, they'll fix it now.

[Kincard]

stuff

I probably should've clarified. I wasn't implying that they should make the ops give more bastion credits/cruor or whatever, but that the ops should at least have a larger effect on the Bastion battles per run because of the low amount of people that actually run them anymore.

But I should note that any time the astral candy is stolen, people are decently quick on the trigger for stealing it back. That's the system done right, because the system is self-sustaining. It has nothing to do with wanting things to be instantly gratifying or whatever (It's really tiring when people assume that that's the reason people want something idiotic in the game to be changed), but rather if the system actually runs as they way they intend it to. If it doesn't, then the design is flawed because them really, really wanting us to play a certain way doesn't mean that the players will magically start doing just that.

With besieged/astral candy, people see the candy as worthwhile for saving. For bastion, most people just bite the bullet and go through the battles without bothering to do the ops because the cost/reward for doing the ops isn't worth the trouble, and it isn't even fun like rescuing prisoners/fighting the BC for the astral candy might be.

[Krashport]

I agree 100% Kincard.

Edit: Add Brews to Resistance Credits for 400,000 pts. Also give Bastion mobs the capability to steal the Ability to equip Atma's and we have to get it back! >.> I bet that will get more people doing Bastion!

Could also maybe let us buy one seal of our liking for emp+1 once a tally with Resistance Credits 100,000 pts.

[RAIST]

umm a 3 minute (or less sometimes) run to buff things up so I can better secure a win with upwards of 1k xp on most kills(as well as the adjusted credits--note that it's not uncommon for me to max the xp on several kills on many jobs thanks to the AOE and buffing strategy)....I hardly call that not worth my time to run the ops before going to Bastion. It's not like I have to run all over the place to kill something and rescue a prisoner. I'm just running to a specific point (using a conflux to cover 90% the distance), clicking something a few times, then running back.

[Brolic]

what can my whm alt do?

[RAIST]

what can my whm alt do?

for starters.....if nothing else, you can do the ward quest if they aren't up, then go buff the martello, npc's, wards and nab up to 800 or so xp when someone kills the first mob (/SMN and putting up Shining Ruby helps a lot in this area too). Cast enfeebles and cures. Pretty much all the normal stuff a WHM can do. If it's leveled decently, you can even smack things with your club or staff if it's leveled--Cataclysm is great for pissing thngs off and pulling them away from the martello.

[Castoth]

Oh wow, didn't know about the Embrava strat. When I needed Bastion points, I used to just load up on temps and kill off an entire wave on BLM solo. Mobs still got to the Martello once in a while though.

[Draylo]

lol that is interesting.

[Starry]

Worst event in the game just because 85% of the time it can't sustain itself for any number of players.

[hideka]

Trying to get some AF3 base pants for my mule is pretty tiresome when the battles end in 5 seconds. The blms casting AOE spells on everything was fixed... now they cast tier4 and still bring crap directly next to the martello so it can AOE and kill the poor little 1% HP martello. Either get rid of the damn mages, move them far from the martello, or give the stupid thing some HP!

just a FYI for anyone who still hasnt realized this: Scholar can fully heal the martello and revive ALL clone wards by casting AOE embrava on the NPC combatants. it WILL hit the dead wards and bring them back to life, and it will regen the martello to full. even if these units are killed, they will revive and still have the effects of embrava within seconds. so if your having trouble getting points, just get on/ get help from, a scholar.

[hideka]

Shouldn't of mentioned the Embrava thing here, they'll fix it now.

mebe they will, i made a post about it when it first happened in the bugs thread, and it got ignored(shows you how much they actualy read the NA forums)

[Quetzacoatl]

AoE mobs
run
PCs and NPCs finish off mobs
collect easy 500+ points per fight on any job
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Embrava strat is pretty amazing too.