2 crafts to 100

[Ezekieal]

So i remember this being in some announcement and the 2012 road map but havent heard zip on this in a while.

Can you tell us when this will be happening?

I dont care whether is the raise subs to lvl80 idea or the keep subs at 60 and have 80 lvls to spead around 60+ crafts idea, hell flip a coin just hurry and implement one please.

Thanks

Nevermind its all in the sticky but still the subject seems to of died which is intolerable.
This needs to be made a higher priority than it currently is.

[Raksha]

People complained and they changed their minds about it.

[Ezekieal]

ugh... why would people complain? thats it people are officially stupid

[Randnum]

If you look at what exactly it allows, I for one prefer that they focus on improving crafting itself in little ways rather than simply slapping on a band aid of 'you can level more crafts'.

There are very few recipes that directly matter for this. At best you require less people in your synergy parties or it becomes easier to find people with the crafts leveled for it, but you don't change anything other than giving crafters more to do with their time.

Do you think it would even revitalize the economy or crafting itself? Is there any great piece of gear that requires two crafts in such a way that you would be improving something?

Unless they then added more recipes that required specific combinations of 100 crafts or similar, it would probably just add another time sink to crafting.

As one who has watched multiple crafters push to 100, I cannot see the benefit to this unless there were a much bigger effort to help crafting itself over the course of multiple updates.

The above is why I for one am officially stupid.

[Godofgods]

Randnum does bring up some good points.

Raising the crafting lvls its self wont relay effect the economy of XI much IMO. Their are so few synths from the REAL crafts left are are worth making. If you want proof of that just realize; half the nin tool makers (formally one of the highest demand crafts) don't bother anymore.

So looking to improve the actual crafts themselves would be of great value. (unfortunately at this stage, probably very hard to do).

The only current benefit of raising the caps would simply be for those, like myself, that like to craft. Now granted I don't mind the idea, but effectively, their would be very little reason.

[Raksha]

If it makes little difference to current recipies, but makes it easier for ppl to craft their stuff (don't have to log to mules for example) then what's the problem with doing it?

I would think making it easier to craft big ticket items would be a deterrent, actually.

[saevel]

This would be a good idea in general. They should allow all crafts to go to 100, AND raise the cap so that one craft can go to 140/160 or ~insert new level here~. Level 75 was skill 100 era, we are now at level 99, time to bump up the crafting levels to compensate.

[Randnum]

People want different things. Some people like leveling their crafts, because it gives them a feeling of accomplishment. Some people like to actually have reasons to craft to sell or make things. And of course there are people who like both.

If you let more people raise more crafts, people can do more alone. It's similar to making Assault soloable. I don't object to this in itself, I even know what I'd do with my new 40 points. Yet I can say that I really would not hurry because FFXI's crafting just no longer works like that.

I suppose my point is, why two crafts to 100? Why not 3? 4? All?

Any argument that currently applies to 'why we shouldn't be able to max all crafts' applies, in a much MUCH reduced version, to why we aren't able to max two. It isn't like leveling jobs. It is for the sake of an economy that isn't even working directly.

No one is going to make more gil, at most they will diversify their craft portfolio and create bigger gaps between those who put a lot into crafting and those who don't.

If crafters are bored now, they need better/more things to make. Giving a particular player more things to make by giving them another craft to make them with, just decreases diversity and makes crafting markets more annoying. Niches cut in half, not to mention the number of HQ tiers that will suddenly be 'broken by twice as many people'.

I'm not saying 'this is an overall bad thing to do'. I'm saying that it's like adding a cheap thrill that would need to be balanced in order to somehow not make crafting more annoying in the end.

The totally personal 'do I want it' question's answer is no. I don't even like people much and I can see the great benefit in requiring me to find people who have the craft skills I need, for things.

[Raksha]

People want different things. Some people like leveling their crafts, because it gives them a feeling of accomplishment. Some people like to actually have reasons to craft to sell or make things. And of course there are people who like both.

If you let more people raise more crafts, people can do more alone. It's similar to making Assault soloable. I don't object to this in itself, I even know what I'd do with my new 40 points. Yet I can say that I really would not hurry because FFXI's crafting just no longer works like that.

I suppose my point is, why two crafts to 100? Why not 3? 4? All?

Any argument that currently applies to 'why we shouldn't be able to max all crafts' applies, in a much MUCH reduced version, to why we aren't able to max two. It isn't like leveling jobs. It is for the sake of an economy that isn't even working directly.

No one is going to make more gil, at most they will diversify their craft portfolio and create bigger gaps between those who put a lot into crafting and those who don't.

If crafters are bored now, they need better/more things to make. Giving a particular player more things to make by giving them another craft to make them with, just decreases diversity and makes crafting markets more annoying. Niches cut in half, not to mention the number of HQ tiers that will suddenly be 'broken by twice as many people'.

I'm not saying 'this is an overall bad thing to do'. I'm saying that it's like adding a cheap thrill that would need to be balanced in order to somehow not make crafting more annoying in the end.

The totally personal 'do I want it' question's answer is no. I don't even like people much and I can see the great benefit in requiring me to find people who have the craft skills I need, for things.


The problem is that the hardcore crafters DO have all their crafts levelled to 100, they just did it on separate mules.

Lots/most people only have 1 or 2 crafts anyway.

[Godofgods]

This would be a good idea in general. raise the cap so that one craft can go to 140/160 or ~insert new level here~. Level 75 was skill 100 era, we are now at level 99, time to bump up the crafting levels to compensate.

I have said that for a long time. New high levels should have been reflected in the crafts and their levels. Either higher levels for the craft, or redo all previous synth lvls to compensate for new level caps.

However... Its rather irrelevant now since synergy killed the main crafts. Their is no real equipment made for the post 75 era that uses a real craft and only a real craft.

[CapriciousOne]

Personally I agree with Randnum.

My biggest problem with crafting is that is too cumbersome after 60 for any one craft let alone additional ones. Crafting as a whole is too restrictive even and especially with the crafting key items. Increasing the level cap without fundamentally address base functionality is just not going to excite people to want to bother getting stuff above 60 in multiple crafts if they havent already.

For example, Synergy was supposed to be able to enhance pre-existing Synthesis items beyond what they are but is very limited to which sets can be enhanced and even within the same set only certain evolith can be etched onto each piece. Even more why arent there more recipes that can create basic 76+ general gear using synthesis only especially if synergy is truly supposed to supplement and not replace synthesis?

Key items is another example, the ones where you can enchant ingots but only a select few ingots. When I first started leveling smithing I was thinking " would be cool to make enchanted armor with say protect 1 for low level non mage gamers to help them out through earlier job levels but this isnt oblivion as I soon found out so that killed that thought. Still once you get an key item, why limit it to only a select few ingots, cloths, etc when u spend so much time leveling up crafting to create more powerful items for later levels, only to not be able to enhance it without synergy?

As mentioned what gear can you make past 75 without synergy? Even the stuff u can make that is level 75 the drop rates for ingredients is so horrible that it hardly make it worth going after, especially when you factor in the rarity of skill at that point despite the recipe being higher than your actual skill and even when you do it is rarely higher than a 0.3?

People arent stupid because they dont like their time monopolized in this way by SE and wont "go along to get along" just for a cosmetic 3 digit number next to a craft. Not everybody is that vain. I'm not and neither is Randnum. What is stupid is not seeking to understand before passing judgment.

[Duzell]

The only real advantage i see in another 40 points isn't a 2nd craft to 100, its 2 subcrafts going to 80 for better HQ rates.

[saevel]

I have said that for a long time. New high levels should have been reflected in the crafts and their levels. Either higher levels for the craft, or redo all previous synth lvls to compensate for new level caps.

However... Its rather irrelevant now since synergy killed the main crafts. Their is no real equipment made for the post 75 era that uses a real craft and only a real craft.

"Synergy" was SE's attempt at creating level 101+ crafts without having to actually raise the cap. One one hand it worked in creating a new way to make stuff, but on another hand it destroyed the previous crafting system. ~Everything~ is now synergy and while SE thought it would be a good idea to require multiple crafting skills, all this did was reward those who had multiple crafting mules.

SE should also alter the skillup system for crafts, you shouldn't be struggling for .1's and .2s when your within a few levels of the recipes cap. They already boosted the magic / melee skillup system, need to do the same for crafting.

[Godofgods]

They already boosted the magic / melee skillup system, need to do the same for crafting.

But that would take away all the fun of crafting!

[Randnum]

In my opinion what separates crafters is where they put their Guild Points.

Unfortunately, something like Alchemic Purification does one thing.

It's a fairly awesome 'one thing' given the number of things that now have Doom, but this is basically the main example of what I'm talking about.

Giving us something to actually do with crafts is not the same as 'giving us more crafting to do'.

[Ezekieal]

welll i have my crafting spread out to be as this siuted my rng thf and nin being able to make all the mats for demon arrows shihei and bloody bolts with tier5 on bolts and tier3 on shihei (alch76 ww70 cloth68) but now this is obsolete (bloody bolts and demon arrows)

was looking forward to taking ww to 100 to make gargouelle(sp) arrows as i have synergy75

on a side note finding people willing to help with synergy with w/e craft you need is pretty hard which is a good reason imo why 2 lvl 100 crafts is a good idea

[CapriciousOne]

welll i have my crafting spread out to be as this siuted my rng thf and nin being able to make all the mats for demon arrows shihei and bloody bolts with tier5 on bolts and tier3 on shihei (alch76 ww70 cloth68) but now this is obsolete (bloody bolts and demon arrows)

was looking forward to taking ww to 100 to make gargouelle(sp) arrows as i have synergy75

on a side note finding people willing to help with synergy with w/e craft you need is pretty hard which is a good reason imo why 2 lvl 100 crafts is a good idea

Well me personally this is why i say why bother with just 2 to 100 and just allow them all to goto 100 on one character. The fact is when you have to depend on somebody for something what winds up happening is they either want a cut of what you are crafting or charge you a pretty steep fee for their services which TBH neither I am willing to accept. I rather take the long monotonous road of leveling each craft up individually then either of those. At least this way if I'm not willing to take either as a concession at least I have an alternative instead of being forced to give a cut or pay a steep fee or any fee at all when i can do it all myself for free.

[CapriciousOne]

The only real advantage i see in another 40 points isn't a 2nd craft to 100, its 2 subcrafts going to 80 for better HQ rates.

Some how I doubt this will increase that rate as this seems like apart of whatever randomized crafting formula they use and probably will never modify it to increase these rates for items that you are at least 2 and 3x beyond the recipe cap.