[dev1048]nyzul comparison and impressions

[Ralos]

I got 3 people together and did a normal nyzul run and then an uncharted run so I could compare the two a little bit.

Went in as MNK99 RNG99 SCH99

the normal nyzul run was floors 96-100

I wanted to see how easy the normal run had gotten now that the level cap wasn't 75.

needless to say it went without a hitch. everything including NMs were easily soloable and the SCH waited by the rune of transfer most of the time to take us up.

We easily took down the floor 100 boss without any problems and then chose go to next floor and did floors 1-3 in the same run as 96-100.

Then we went into uncharted

I didn't expect to get far because there was only 3 of us as opposed to a party of 6 but we did really well.

for the purpose of testing the run out I had us choose go to floor ??? every time. The option made us skip ahead a couple of floors and each time we used it, we skipped more floors than last time (with 1 exception, which I'll comment on in a moment)

We managed to get to floor 35 in one run before we decided to call it due to us being about to time out.

The one time we didn't skip more floors than previously is when it took us to floor 20 where we fought a boss. due to this occurrence, I assume it won't let you skip over boss floors.

The boss was Medusa with a different name ("head boss 18" or something like that) We had a little trouble with her because the SCH only had Cure IV and couldn't cure faster than damage was being dealt to the MNK (me).

MNK died at 10% RNG finished her off, mostly an easy fight.

one weird thing I noticed was that on one of the floors our objective was defeat enemy leader. We found the frog NM (had another weird name like floor boss 8 or something) but he was casting tier 1 spells (namely water and waterga) for 1000-2000 points of damage. I'd be afraid to run into a boss with tier 4 spells, or worse, tier 5.

My one complaint about uncharted is the monster variation on each floor was the same as regular nyzul, nothing about uncharted was new or exciting to SEE except the medusa boss floor. (dunno about you all but I get tired of beating on the same mobs all the time) pretty much ran into draugers, collibri, birds, slimes, and archaic ramparts.

the inconsequential mobs on each floor were still pretty easy, most were soloable if you were careful, some required a very mild amount of help.

rawr

[Concerned4FFxi]

Live from Vanadiel, from the makers of kindred crest level cap quests, horrid log drops in WOE and VW, 500-1000 ADL kills for 99 relic, it's your new and revised (took one guy 3 whole days to code it) totally revamped, totally not the same thing from yester year, NEO-Nyzul Isle.

<applause?>
....ackward silence, crickets chirping.

[Concerned4FFxi]

I said it a million times, here's a million and one - quality not quanity. Rather have one new neo-whatever that's good, then 10 failures that are sloppy and unorginal.

[Psion]

Also, the reason the frog was doing so much with teir I spells is the same reason shantotto does so much in ToAU mission: they are much faster to cast than the higher teir versions, and there's just something quirky and funny about seeing a black mage cast a teir I spell for ridiculous amounts of damage.

I don't think mobs casting teir Vs would do much higher damage than that frog, so no worries there. ;3

[Michae]

Frogs have Int of 999 ^^

Smart little buggers those vana'deil froggies

[Ralos]

They have a secretly advanced civilization hidden in an inter-dimensional time rip that they created them selves.

[Transmit]

Just did a couple runs with a trio (BLU, PUP, PUP) and well theres not much to report on which has changed.

You select a seperate mission from the old nyzul, and you always start from floor 1. You can still select the same temp items for tokens as you could in old Nyzul as well.

We came across the following objectives

- Kill all (avoid gears)
- Kill the leader (Qirin named "Head 18", probably a place holder name, would drop bombs then run away)
- Kill family of impossible to gauge mobs (Had Flayers / Flans / Imps)
- Activate the lights (Specific order, entered with 3 people, had 4 lights to put into order anyway)

So we didnt see any new objectives so far. Once you've completed a floor you can advance by 1 or by ??? floors, we picked ??? every time and it moved us upwards only anywhere between 2-8~ floors from our experience.

We landed on floor 5 / 10 with nothing special on them. And the highest we got in any run before timing out was floor 11.

On one floor we killed Duke Deacon, who dropped a ??? Shield, which appraised to a maghony shield (hot lewt!)

So the only real change we can see is that the mobs are sporting more HP and hit you harder.

[Theytak]

Just did a couple runs with a trio (BLU, PUP, PUP) and well theres not much to report on which has changed.

You select a seperate mission from the old nyzul, and you always start from floor 1. You can still select the same temp items for tokens as you could in old Nyzul as well.

We came across the following objectives

- Kill all (avoid gears)
- Kill the leader (Qirin named "Head 18", probably a place holder name, would drop bombs then run away)
- Kill family of impossible to gauge mobs (Had Flayers / Flans / Imps)
- Activate the lights (Specific order, entered with 3 people, had 4 lights to put into order anyway)

So we didnt see any new objectives so far. Once you've completed a floor you can advance by 1 or by ??? floors, we picked ??? every time and it moved us upwards only anywhere between 2-8~ floors from our experience.

We landed on floor 5 / 10 with nothing special on them. And the highest we got in any run before timing out was floor 11.

On one floor we killed Duke Deacon, who dropped a ??? Shield, which appraised to a maghony shield (hot lewt!)

So the only real change we can see is that the mobs are sporting more HP and hit you harder.

it was duke decapod, yo, and it was like, a week ago XD

[Transmit]

Yeah this was a total copy paste from BG :P

[Xilk]

How about alexandrite drops?

[Lukielucas]

How about alexandrite drops?

It was said that the test server wouldn't have the alexandrite in neo-nyzle...

So they didn't add !! to Neo-nyzle... well i for one can bloody say thank god.....

[Transmit]

Yeah I've yet to see an Alex drop yet from Nyzul, but they did mention it that they wouldnt be including alex so soon. But yeah, thank god for no more !! proc systems... yet...

[hiko]

Yeah I've yet to see an Alex drop yet from Nyzul, but they did mention it that they wouldnt be including alex so soon. But yeah, thank god for no more !! proc systems... yet...

Because they can't add alex to "normal loot pool" (ie no proc needed) of NMs?, and they just mention they wouldn't include it ON TEST SERVER, but they will be there when nyzulT2 go live

[Transmit]

I thought it was implied I was talking about the test server when I said they mentioned alex wouldnt be included, seeing as we're on the test server feedback forums. If not, sorry for the confusion.

[Camate]

Sorry for the late announcement, but with the recent test server update, we have added/changed the below to Nyzul Isle Uncharted Region.



Added option to take a single item or all items when obtaining temporary items from the "Vending Box"
Made change so that when you reach each floor, the objective for that floor will be automatically announced
Adjusted the amount of tokens received
Added Alexandrite to the possible rewards


※The option to take all temporary items as well as the automatic announcement of floor objectives has been changed for Nyzul Isle Investigation as well.

[tyrantsyn]

I like all this, especially the announce floor objectives.

[Unleashhell]

Are the Alexandrites only in singles or are there possible linen purse drops?

[Camate]

I would like to announce some congestion measures to go along with the implementation of Nyzul Isle Uncharted Region.

As a way to alleviate the congestion after the implementation of this content, we will be establishing a cool down time before you are able to receive the same assault tag once you finish Nyzul Isle Uncharted Region.

※This cool down time will only apply when trying to repeat Nyzul Isle Uncharted Region and will not affect Nyzul Isle Exploration or other assaults.

Currently we are planning for a 30 minute cool down at first; however, if congestion ultimately is eliminated we are planning to implement a system where we can get rid of the cool down time.

While we understand that it may be a slight inconvenience for those of you who would like to play this content over and over, we would like to give a chance for a large number of players to enjoy this content even during busy times and we appreciate your understanding.

We will also be looking into other means for congestion countermeasures.

[Nightfyre]

Two steps forward, one step back...

[Helel]

I understand the why; it's just going to be a huge pain and the ass to get 6 people for this... and then have to wait 30 minutes between every run. It's going to make groups difficult to manage, either shout groups or even static groups. Nobody is going to want to stand and wait in front of the door for 30 minutes.

I can't really offer any suggestions off the top of my head, other than to make more instances of the zone, and make the other events more appealing at least so not everyone is flocking over to nyzul.

[wish12oz]

Currently we are planning for a 30 minute cool down at first; however, if congestion ultimately is eliminated we are planning to implement a system where we can get rid of the cool down time.


Where's the dislike button?

[JiltedValkyrie]

Everybody stands around forever after something anyway.

[Babekeke]

I understand the why; it's just going to be a huge pain and the ass to get 6 people for this... and then have to wait 30 minutes between every run. It's going to make groups difficult to manage, either shout groups or even static groups. Nobody is going to want to stand and wait in front of the door for 30 minutes.

I can't really offer any suggestions off the top of my head, other than to make more instances of the zone, and make the other events more appealing at least so not everyone is flocking over to nyzul.

Anyone trying to make a mythic will be interested in this, since they're adding alex to it.

[Mindi]

Anyone who complains about a 30 min cooldown NEVER did Nyzul Isle back at 75 when it was kinda new... the Zone can only take a few groups... and it was a pain in the ass to get into it, especially in JP Time (and Cerberus was allways a Server with lots of Jap)... Depends how many will do Neo Nyzul Isle but when its just half of the Number of groups who went at 75 i am happy about this 30 min cooldown.

[Economizer]

Currently we are planning for a 30 minute cool down at first; however, if congestion ultimately is eliminated we are planning to implement a system where we can get rid of the cool down time.

Is there anyway to implement a dynamic cool down system for this sort of thing? It might be congested the first week or two, but there will be busy hours later on... perhaps it would help if there was a system that detected congestion with a variable timer on reentry. You could also apply such a timer to other assaults too - they'd rarely be affected but it would allow the dev team to lower the timers for assault tags since it wouldn't be the only method to control congestion, allowing more people to enjoy the content while having minimal congestion issues.

[Garota]

Four hours to burn through four tags rather than two hours? Makes sense to me...

[Brolic]

this works out perfectly for my shell actually(at a lot others in my age group i'd imagine), we're a 6 man shell with about 2 1\2 hrs to pay during the weekdays. enough time for 1 dyna and 1 nyzul during the week

[Dreamin]

Anyone who complains about a 30 min cooldown NEVER did Nyzul Isle back at 75 when it was kinda new... the Zone can only take a few groups... and it was a pain in the ass to get into it, especially in JP Time (and Cerberus was allways a Server with lots of Jap)... Depends how many will do Neo Nyzul Isle but when its just half of the Number of groups who went at 75 i am happy about this 30 min cooldown.

Not sure what you meant, I was there when it 1st came out and my set was doing Nyzul 4x a night on Fri/Mon ~9:30/10:00 pm EST.

There might be some lag issue near the entrance but other than that, there's no big issue at all.

This is supposed to be a new event, if SE hasn't learned their lesson and make this instanced in such a way that it can take in many concurrent run then they have failed harder then even the VW failed drop rate. There's absolutely no reason for us to have to deal with a 30min wait cycle anymore especially given the fact there's the tag wait time in place already and it would restrict people to a max of 4 run in a row already.

[Bayohne]

One option to counter congestion would be to systematically manage the order of entry — Specifically, an idea we had was that when there is a request, the order will be looked up to reserve an entry time, but we ran into the following issues:


As a specification for assaults, the entry times are shared with other assaults
If Nyzul Isle areas were used in missions and such, the reserved entry time is not guaranteed
If the area is bugged, the reserved entry time is not guaranteed


As a result, we cannot provide a reliable entry time, so we decided against this idea.

It would be best if it would be possible to fundamentally eliminate congestion and we are continuing to look into ways to do this. However, finding a simple solution is easier said than done, since all of our options require a complete overhaul of the server program, which will take a long time.

We feel that not releasing new content for several months while the server program is being reworked would be a bad result for everyone involved, so we will continue to search for a fundamental solution, while we make slight adjustments as necessary to alleviate server stress. One of our temporary solutions is the idea shared in this post.

With the current waiting time setup, we are aware of the fact that players may still have to reserve a time even during non-congested times and we decided to make the waiting time system flexible, so that it is only applied when the area is congested. We are doing our best to take in player feedback to provide the least stressful playing environment possible, so we hope you understand the reasoning behind our current direction.

[Alhanelem]

Bayohne: Unless I'm mistaken, Nyzul Isle Investigaiton didn't have any sort of severe congestion issues when it was new. On top of this, there are way fewer people milling about in Aht Urghan. I cast doubt on 1) congestion being any worse than when Nyzul was new and 2) that any special measures are needed to address it, simply because these measures were never needed before, and there are fewer people now than then.

[Helel]

It might be more prudent not to implement the 30m cooldown, and then if it really is a problem, implement it later. Of course, then you're going to have players complaining to you about not doing something sooner so... good luck!

[Babekeke]

Bayohne: Unless I'm mistaken, Nyzul Isle Investigaiton didn't have any sort of severe congestion issues when it was new. On top of this, there are way fewer people milling about in Aht Urghan. I cast doubt on 1) congestion being any worse than when Nyzul was new and 2) that any special measures are needed to address it, simply because these measures were never needed before, and there are fewer people now than then.

Might have been server specific, or just time-zone specific, but there certainly has been a lot of congestion in that area in the past. I believe that you're EU? If so you probably didn't see it much, as I only saw it when I was working shifts and ended up playing at prime NA/JP times.

[Tashan]

Bayohne: Unless I'm mistaken, Nyzul Isle Investigaiton didn't have any sort of severe congestion issues when it was new. On top of this, there are way fewer people milling about in Aht Urghan. I cast doubt on 1) congestion being any worse than when Nyzul was new and 2) that any special measures are needed to address it, simply because these measures were never needed before, and there are fewer people now than then.

Congestion was actually a huge issue not when Nyzul Isle Investigation was implemented, but when the Mythic Weaponskill quest was added.

At times it was almost unbearable. You'd be spending an hour+ towards making a party, but then find you couldn't play for another hour because there were too many people trying to gain access at one time.

[Byrth]

An arbitrary half hour limit sounds retarded and is retarded, but it doesn't actually matter. New Nyzul Isle is very likely going to take half an hour every run. You won't be running into the half hour time limit unless you wipe out.

[Transmit]

Well according to the dev post, the 30 minute cool down period starts when you FINISH the run, not when you enter.

[Dreamin]

Since the delay is set to be flexible already as Bayohne has stated. One would think that there's a very simple solution whereby each time a new 'team' enter, a counter gets bumped up by 1. Each time a team exit, the counter gets bumped down by 1 again. The delay is then based on this dynamic counter value.

You can then do many different things:
1. Absolute Control - once the counter value reaches 10% of the limit on number of concurrent zone that can be supported, then the wait time would increased to the max value (say the 30min).

2. Dynamic Control - each time the counter value incremented by 10% of the limit on the number of concurrent zone, the wait time is increased by 3min.

3. A combinations of the 2 options above.

This is just a very simple counter inc/dec issue and since the delay value is already 'flexible' (god forebid if SE is stupid enough to make that into a HARDCODED value). The above solution should make it so during heavy usage, there will be a delay for everyone to repeat runs while at the same time, in times when there are little to no usage, there's no delay for repeat. This will give ppl better control on when they schedule their run time.

[Yoky]

Oh welcome back congestion of nyzul... Of how I didn't miss those days. The spamming the entrance point in hopes to get in. spending 4 hours trying to do 4 runs...It's all coming back.. people complained bout it then and they will again now.. Hope SE has a plan.

[Geabrielle]

Does the Uncharted Nyzul give tokens? Just wanted to throw that out there .. since it will kinda matter for a few people I know.

[Byrth]

Yes, but not many. I got ~500 for a floor 20 clear. To add to this, I suspect we are going to come out in the red for tokens because some of the monsters were difficult enough to warrant temp items.

[Geabrielle]

Well crap. I needs to find me some non-mythic wanting people to front the token bill. :p Time to sell some skills into slavery. Or we can hope that's just test server and that the token reward will be adjusted. If not...

Adjust the token reward! The addition of alexandrite is much appreciated but don't make us sacrifice tokens!

Yet somehow I think that's a hinge trap to keep us doing normal Nyzul so nobody forgets its there. Bummer.

[Byrth]

tbqh, I think people will likely alternate New and Old NI runs to keep tokens up. There is no token warp fee in New NI, but the 3+k tokens they charge for all the Temp would add up quickly. I was doing the runs duo though, so we probably leaned on temp items more than you would have to in a party.