View Full Version : [dev1001] Treasure Pool Menu Additions
kingfury
03-14-2011, 12:38 PM
Hey Dev Team /salute
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Adding additional options to the Treasure Pool Menu:
This is sort of an indirectly related topic regarding items and such ^^, but It would help to greatly ease the cumbersome task of passing/lotting while in the heat of battle forever and ever lol. Zoning will in fact reset any current "Always Pass" or "Always Lot" options. It's pretty self explanitory, so I'll just leave the magic of figuring out how to bring it to life up to your capable hands. Thanks for listening. /farewell
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Additional Treasure Pool Menu Options Example (http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b167/soulchld4/TreasurePool-start.jpg)
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Add Option: Always Lot (http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b167/soulchld4/TreasurePool-AlwaysLot.jpg)
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Add Option: Always Pass (http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b167/soulchld4/TreasurePool-AlwaysPass.jpg)
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Add Option: Lot All (http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b167/soulchld4/TreasurePool-LotAll.jpg)
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Add Option: Pass All (http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b167/soulchld4/TreasurePool-PassAll.jpg)
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**Perhaps add a restriction that makes "Cast lots" and "Lot All" unable to activate at the last 30 secs of the treasure pool item time limit. This could potentially help Identify "Ninja Lotters" towards the end of the treasure pool item time limit allowing enough time for party leaders to act appropriately against such behavior.**
This would be incredibly useful. I'd love to see something like it added.
kingfury
03-14-2011, 01:10 PM
Thanks for the feedback ^^/
Atomic_Skull
03-14-2011, 02:24 PM
Thanks for the feedback ^^/
Could lead to people accidentally lotting things they shouldn't when they leave it on by mistake.
Pyrogir
03-14-2011, 02:27 PM
Could lead to people accidentally lotting things they shouldn't when they leave it on by mistake.
Then hopefully they'll notice, and go back into the treasure pool and pass them. You can always pass after lotting.
It could also be automatically disabled when zoning to help prevent that.
Nathos
03-14-2011, 02:38 PM
That can lead to mistakes and "mistakes".
Callidor
03-14-2011, 02:38 PM
or maybe a "pass from now on" option so that you could prevent your inv from being flooded with crystals/mats, etc. but still lot on what you need, and stay in the running for other stuff (seals/crests/etc).
That can lead to mistakes and "mistakes".
"Mistakes" already happen anyway, and this would not introduce a new problem.
or maybe a "pass from now on" option so that you could prevent your inv from being flooded with crystals/mats, etc. but still lot on what you need, and stay in the running for other stuff (seals/crests/etc).
What i got from the OP was that it would be on a per item basis. For example you could select a wind crystal, and select always pass. Then it would automatically pass all wind crystals (until you zoned, or otherwise stop autopassing). Then you could also set it to automatically lot all beastmen seals, etc.
JagerForrester
03-14-2011, 03:34 PM
I don't think the lotting system will be that smart for a per item basis. And I'm sure that the options will be abused by ninja lotters. Lottings would have be to under complete observation. And if we had a "Pass All" option, and something that we actually wanted dropped with that option on, you won't be allowed to lot unless the party can reinvite you after kicking yourself so you can lot. It's a hassle especially when it's in the middle of a heated battle.
And I'm sure that the options will be abused by ninja lotters
Not really. It wouldn't allow them to do anything they can't already do. It'd just be easier.
Actually, it'd be harder to get away with, since lotting manually allows you to wait until 4:59, and then lot without anyone being able to kick/d2/etc you.
Flunklesnarkin
03-14-2011, 03:39 PM
Sounds like a good idea.. but i fear it would be a looot of work to implement if it was on a per item basis (more than they would probably be willing to do )
If it was just general lot all / pass all... probably be more trouble than its worth :\
Easier to just let stuff free drop and lot what you want than lot everything and pass items you don't want lol
kingfury
03-14-2011, 08:59 PM
What i got from the OP was that it would be on a per item basis. For example you could select a wind crystal, and select always pass. Then it would automatically pass all wind crystals (until you zoned, or otherwise stop autopassing). Then you could also set it to automatically lot all beastmen seals, etc.
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Yep, this would be the functionality. I'll Edit the original post to reflect that zoning will in fact reset any current "Always Pass" or "Always Lot" options.
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I would imagine that both "Always Pass/Lot" options would only be exercised with abundant items that constantly flood the treasure pool list during fast pace gameplay, so the super rare or valuable items should be safe from such /random mistake passes. The Always Lot option would have the same "Full Inventory" warning that you get now when attempting to lot with a full inventory as soon as new items hit the inventory pool, so you should again be safe from any mistakes.
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In my experience, it's the abundant crap drops while fighting massive amounts of mobs, like mob created drops (insect whatnot, feathers'n crap, buffalo butt'n stuff, etc.), that always sneak it's way into my inventory making lotting important things a possible trouble situation. Like the fact you may have full inventory and be *fighting right now*, but need to hurry and clear your inventory asap to lot that special item before it drops to the dirt lol. It can get crazy at times :)
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Thanks all for the great feedback /
kingfury
03-14-2011, 10:10 PM
Sounds like a good idea.. but i fear it would be a looot of work to implement if it was on a per item basis (more than they would probably be willing to do )
If it was just general lot all / pass all... probably be more trouble than its worth :\
Easier to just let stuff free drop and lot what you want than lot everything and pass items you don't want lol
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I sure hope not :( Besides, similar to the outcry by players in regards to streamlining the current cumbersome Atma selection menu (which I pray will be in the upcoming update lol) , the Dev team seems to understand the importances of correcting processes that weigh down on our productivity so long as we let them know :) It would take some thinking and planning I'm sure to write the functionality in, but it shouldn't be like recreating the system so much as just adding new pieces to it. The Atma selection menu, I assume, most likely needed a complete over haul, which is why they needed the extra time to redesign it.
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In any case lets hope for the best /
kingfury
03-14-2011, 10:14 PM
Not really. It wouldn't allow them to do anything they can't already do. It'd just be easier.
Actually, it'd be harder to get away with, since lotting manually allows you to wait until 4:59, and then lot without anyone being able to kick/d2/etc you.
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Great point!
Nathos
03-14-2011, 10:59 PM
"Mistakes" already happen anyway, and this would not introduce a new problem.
This would just give then a better excuse to lot everything.
And about ninjaing, they could just activate it just at the last seconds, could use that to afk after say afk and give an excuse after come back also. No need for more drama.
deathgod
03-14-2011, 11:58 PM
this would be an amazing tool for inside dynamis for sure. cant think of how many pools have been lost due to time out and ppl not passing stuff when they need to. this would be like a do it and forget type thing for currency. gone would be the times of lost 100 pieces cuz of timeout/failure to pass. and would make it easier on the person int he ls lotting to currency cuz they just have to hit always lot on one of each piece and bam no more constantly checking treasure pool and let htem focus
kingfury
03-15-2011, 12:36 AM
This would just give then a better excuse to lot everything.
And about ninjaing, they could just activate it just at the last seconds, could use that to afk after say afk and give an excuse after come back also. No need for more drama.
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lol Unfortunately, playing Devils advocate with MMOG's is easy since a huge number of things can't be helped in regards to what can go wrong with certain game mechanics. Like there's nothing anyone can do if you've lotted something but you D/C before it drops to you (that is if all folks don't pass the item before you D/C which is almost never the case lol).
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In the same vein, ninja lotters are just a problem that will take special tools to get rid of them. I personally say kick anyone that goes all silent and doesn't respond after being told to pass an item for more then 30 seconds :) Perhaps something that would lock the ability to lot when the timer is too close to dropping items to folks would help, but who knows.
kingfury
03-15-2011, 12:39 AM
this would be an amazing tool for inside dynamis for sure. cant think of how many pools have been lost due to time out and ppl not passing stuff when they need to. this would be like a do it and forget type thing for currency. gone would be the times of lost 100 pieces cuz of timeout/failure to pass. and would make it easier on the person int he ls lotting to currency cuz they just have to hit always lot on one of each piece and bam no more constantly checking treasure pool and let htem focus
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I feel your pain! >< lol
kingfury
03-15-2011, 09:54 PM
This would just give then a better excuse to lot everything.
And about ninjaing, they could just activate it just at the last seconds, could use that to afk after say afk and give an excuse after come back also. No need for more drama.
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Perhaps I can Edit in a restriction against activating "Lot All" that prohibits the use at the last 30sec or minute of the item(s) being in the treasure pool. Which could help greatly against Ninja lotters overall. Prolly should suggest that for "Cast Lots" as well.
this would be an amazing tool for inside dynamis for sure. cant think of how many pools have been lost due to time out and ppl not passing stuff when they need to. this would be like a do it and forget type thing for currency. gone would be the times of lost 100 pieces cuz of timeout/failure to pass. and would make it easier on the person int he ls lotting to currency cuz they just have to hit always lot on one of each piece and bam no more constantly checking treasure pool and let htem focus
The easy workaround for that is actually to not pass anything. When you are kicked out, everything in the pool goes to whoever last entered. If that person already passed, then it is lost. You can simply have a mule enter at the end, or have someone with space in their inventory log out and back in towards the end, and you'll never lose any currency.
kingfury
03-15-2011, 10:08 PM
EDIT to MAIN POST **Perhaps add a restriction that makes "Cast lots" and "Lot All" unable to activate at the last 30 secs of the treasure pool item time limit.**
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At least this would give party leaders 30 secs to identify nin lotters with 30secs to kick'em should they go all silent on ya when you tell'em to pass. Any other suggestions would help.
I'm extremely against not being able to lot in the last 30 seconds. That is a terrible idea. What if someone was afk for 4.5 mins? Not going to work.
However such a restriction does make sense for lot all.
Kirana
03-15-2011, 10:43 PM
I'd like to add that players should be allowed to lot items while KO'd, and also drop items from inventory while KO'd. I have witnessed situations where players had died from battle (with no mage around to raise), but could not get an item they needed from the loot because their inventory happened to be full (thanks to the previously stated issue of junk items filling inventory from previous farming).
Arcon
03-15-2011, 11:15 PM
How about not adding a "Lot All" feature in the first place? I can't think of a situation in which a player would generally want to lot all items. This would be mostly to keep your inventory clean. The other suggestions are pretty good, even the "Always lot x item" would be nice for dynamis/limbus or something similar. Nothing in here (not even the "Lot All" feature) would encourage ninjalotting with one simple restriction: just don't make it lot anything that's currently in the pool, but only active on stuff that enters the pool. will give everyone enough to time lot, pass or kick possible lotting violators.
How about not adding a "Lot All" feature in the first place? I can't think of a situation in which a player would generally want to lot all items. This would be mostly to keep your inventory clean. The other suggestions are pretty good, even the "Always lot x item" would be nice for dynamis/limbus or something similar. Nothing in here (not even the "Lot All" feature) would encourage ninjalotting with one simple restriction: just don't make it lot anything that's currently in the pool, but only active on stuff that enters the pool. will give everyone enough to time lot, pass or kick possible lotting violators.
Answered your own question.
kingfury
03-16-2011, 03:57 AM
I'm extremely against not being able to lot in the last 30 seconds. That is a terrible idea. What if someone was afk for 4.5 mins? Not going to work.
However such a restriction does make sense for lot all.
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I would think if you're in a respectable group, everyone would just Pass the item you needed if you were AFK so that it would just drop to you. If you're lingering AFK during an important battle for 4.5mins, imo you deserve to miss your chance to lot lol (D/C's are understandable but it's rare that folks can ALWAYS get back online in under 4.5mins).
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I would think if you're in a respectable group, everyone would just Pass the item you needed if you were AFK so that it would just drop to you. If you're lingering AFK during an important battle for 4.5mins, imo you deserve to miss your chance to lot lol (D/C's are understandable but it's rare that folks can ALWAYS get back online in under 4.5mins).
And if others are afk?
kingfury
03-16-2011, 04:00 AM
I'd like to add that players should be allowed to lot items while KO'd, and also drop items from inventory while KO'd. I have witnessed situations where players had died from battle (with no mage around to raise), but could not get an item they needed from the loot because their inventory happened to be full (thanks to the previously stated issue of junk items filling inventory from previous farming).
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Yeah, I've been there before >< lol. I truly don't understand the reason behind this functionality currently. Perhaps SE wanted to really drive home the idea of "Survive, or you get Zilch lol while solo'ing, Muhahahah!" I would agree with your suggestion.
Thanks for the input /
kingfury
03-16-2011, 04:01 AM
And if others are afk?
< CALL 1> x 10 Spam?? lol
annewandering
03-16-2011, 04:03 AM
What if you had the pass all only apply to none r/e items? that way you could pass all the junk and not miss out on the good stuff.
< CALL 1> x 10 Spam?? lol
and...if they don't hear that? Many people mute calls, or ffxi entirely.
Sorry, but i'd rather see drops go to ninja lotters than to the ground because someone wasn't able to lot within 4.5 mins.
kingfury
03-16-2011, 04:41 AM
and...if they don't hear that? Many people mute calls, or ffxi entirely.
Sorry, but i'd rather see drops go to ninja lotters than to the ground because someone wasn't able to lot within 4.5 mins.
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Well ^^ you'd technically still have 4.4 1/2 mins since we're talkin' about 30 seconds here lol. That still should be plenty of time to safely lot a drop while protecting from last second Ninja Lots. Plus, I think the protection from sneaky lotters outweigh the "what if i'm afk" argument /stagger Best solution for such a problem is to simply communicate with the folks you're with before anything important happens :) Unless your hair is on fire... but then I would think you'd have bigger worries than if you missed a lot...I would think.
kingfury
03-16-2011, 04:47 AM
What if you had the pass all only apply to none r/e items? that way you could pass all the junk and not miss out on the good stuff.
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Well, you have the order just a tad backwards on how you would use the "Pass All" option. You would 1st lot on the "Good Stuff", and then hit "Pass All" after you've received your reward(s) to save yourself the task of having to pass individual items that you didn't want raiding your inventory.
Plus, I think the protection from sneaky lotters outweigh the "what if i'm afk" argument /stagger Best solution for such a problem is to simply communicate with the folks you're with before anything important happens :) Unless your hair is on fire... but then I would think you'd have bigger worries than if you missed a lot...I would think.
This is where i disagree. How often is ninjalotting really a problem? I mean really? It doesn't happen every day. It happens even less now that everything is so easy to get. Even one lost item because the person meant to lot it was afk or dead before 4:30, but not before 5:00 outweighs any benefit of preventing ninjalotting.
kingfury
03-16-2011, 05:19 AM
I wouldn't be able to accurately give a percentage, since I personally don't participate with pickup groups anymore, but I'd guess it still happens quite often from the horror stories I've heard from my LS mates on occasion. I recall witnessing it happening during a Odin run a while back where the guy did it and lotted and ran around so he couldn't get D2'd, and no one could do a damn thing about it. That was lots of work all down the drain for someone that truly deserved the gear. It happened again during a Rani run where the guy snuck his lot in at the very last second and won, so I'd say as long as there's desirable equipment that drops from NMs, Ninja lotting will thrive.
Again, your argument sounds more like folks being lazy or not communicating with folks. It's a hard lesson, but it'll teach folks to just pay attention during such times in my opinion.
That would be incredibly useful for botting. That being said, I seriously doubt they'll add it.
That would be incredibly useful for botting. That being said, I seriously doubt they'll add it.
because lotting is hard for a bot?
Cylock
03-16-2011, 07:13 AM
What I would love to see is something similar to TreasureView or Booty. The twist for this is that only the party leader and alliance leader would be able to view it with a contextual menu ready for leader viewing. I think this would make it easier to maintain order in a party and certainly in an alliance for all those people that like to sneak lots in without people noticing.
Lynde
03-16-2011, 07:40 AM
You know what should be allowed to the Treasure Pool setup?
A chance to lot or view the pool WHILE IN KO.
I cannot tell you how many times this has gotten in the way.
Dynamis is a prime example of this.
I dont like to compare MMOs to one another, but in Aion, when a rare item is found on the mob and put into the pool, the "roll" screen comes up (when you choose to lot or pass), regardless of if you are alive or dead. Oh and on a side note, if you are in the party when the mob dies, regarless of if you are STILL in that party, you can still "roll". (I assume this was to prevent kicking players so another could ninja lot)
While the FFXI's schematics are totally different than Aion's my point still remains...
Let us lot/pass while KO'd? It would help... Anyone else agree with me?
kingfury
03-16-2011, 01:22 PM
Originally Posted by Kirana:
I'd like to add that players should be allowed to lot items while KO'd, and also drop items from inventory while KO'd. I have witnessed situations where players had died from battle (with no mage around to raise), but could not get an item they needed from the loot because their inventory happened to be full (thanks to the previously stated issue of junk items filling inventory from previous farming).
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"Originally Posted by Kingfury:
Yeah, I've been there before >< lol. I truly don't understand the reason behind this functionality currently. Perhaps SE wanted to really drive home the idea of "Survive, or you get Zilch lol while solo'ing, Muhahahah!" I would agree with your suggestion."
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Yep I agree with ya, and so does Kirana in cased you missed this on the previous pages :)
Thanks for the input /
kingfury
03-17-2011, 12:50 AM
Has SE ever addressed the issue of not being able to lot/pass while K.O.'d before? Like at a Vana'Fest or something?