Newest interview (abyssea was a mistake?)

[Runespider]

I will happily grind my way through WoE and VW until I get everything I want. I simply haven't gotten to it yet outside of my linkshell events. Easy gear is easy gear and, as this thread has proven wonderfully, once gear has become easy enough to obtain, you might get excluded if for some reason you don't have it. That's something happening in WoW. They call it gearscore.

You need 18 people to do VW, what happens when you can't get 18 people..punishing drop rates on soso gear turn people off the event. Also I've done a mass amount of VW in the last few months and have almost nothing to show for it, gl trying to get any of it playing as a casual.


It's much better than abyssea where 90% of the time I need to turn away from the mob so we can proc.

VW is all about procs, on the higher tier stuff it's proc or die and if you don't have fanatics/fools up you gtfo before you get killed by stupid high aoe.

[Neisan_Quetz]

If you're turned 90% of the time waiting to proc on not visions mobs you or someone else in your party is doing something wrong.

[Mirabelle]

If you're turned 90% of the time waiting to proc on not visions mobs you or someone else in your party is doing something wrong.

Why? Sometimes getting the WS clue takes a 7-8 WS. Then when only the WAR can do it, you have to wait for them to charge. And then sometimes you have a spammy mob that getting a clean WS off is a challenge. There's lots of times DD are spent "off" the mob waiting on proc or the proc clue to avoid an early non-proc'd death.
Or plenty of times getting that yellow proc takes time and no one wants the mob dead until then so DD are again turned around waiting for the "kirr" call.
Admittedly "90%" might be hyperbole by the author of the post, but its not totally without merit.

[Nynja]

Why? Sometimes getting the WS clue takes a 7-8 WS. Then when only the WAR can do it, you have to wait for them to charge. And then sometimes you have a spammy mob that getting a clean WS off is a challenge.

What the hell is a spammy mob? The only time a mob will be "spammy" to the point of being unable to get a clean shot in is if theres 6 people wailing away on it or theres multiple people on it sub 25%. You know those mobs that people claim "have regain at low HP"...they dont. Theyre just tools who throw 6 poorly geared melee at it then get overwhelmed by TP moves.

Which begs the queston, why the hell do you have a group of 6 melee in abyssea ?!?

[tyrantsyn]

What I think Aarahs is talking about is the short life span the mob has after all the proc's are made. Normally they don't last 20 seconds after melee is told to "KILL IT!" Any one who's not on the Tank/proc/thf squad basically gets in 20 seconds of useful time. Before they have to wait on the side lines for the next pop. When it come to VW and WOE there's a lot less of that. Tho in VW you do have to watch yourself. You can go down quick if your not careful.

[Greatguardian]

Why would you have anyone who's not on the tank/proc (same thing) / thf squad there in the first place?

Waste of resources. If you have spare people, go kill a second NM or have the extras farm pops or something.

[Aarahs]

You can only do that so much before you're overflooding the treasure pool with drops. It gets to the point where the leader has to tell people to stop popping/pulling. And I might have been overstating the 90%, but not by much. 20 seconds after all proc sounds about right for most NMs.

[Luvbunny]

I think voidwatch is not as bad as a lot of people feel - it sure can use some improvement. Points system similar to nyzul, einherjar and assaults would be a great fix so that if you want the gears - you use points, and let the accessories armor drop as normal since these you can sell for good amount of gils. The developer is right for not allowing trading - otherwise most people will have the gears and stop doing voidwatch. Since you do not need to kill x amount of NMs for random seals, and more NMs for plus 2 items, voidwatch drop has to be rare. But point systems would easily fix this and make the armors obtainable via point systems. There are great things about abyssea and good things about old contents - the developer needs to be able to learn from the past 10 years and pick the best system and move FF11 forward for the next 5 years. Think of the paying costumers and the brand itself - and put aside egos, pride, and office politics.

[tyrantsyn]

Why would you have anyone who's not on the tank/proc (same thing) / thf squad there in the first place?

Waste of resources. If you have spare people, go kill a second NM or have the extras farm pops or something.

Things could go wrong and you could use the support, you could be doing zone bosses, using up every ones pops at the end of the night. Need some ones random skills for some odds and ends. Could be a lot of reason's.

[svengalis]

What the hell is a spammy mob? The only time a mob will be "spammy" to the point of being unable to get a clean shot in is if theres 6 people wailing away on it or theres multiple people on it sub 25%. You know those mobs that people claim "have regain at low HP"...they dont. Theyre just tools who throw 6 poorly geared melee at it then get overwhelmed by TP moves.

Which begs the queston, why the hell do you have a group of 6 melee in abyssea ?!?
Sedna spans like hell even with one person on it there's more mobs that do the same. Ironclads can also be problematic because of their tp moves and their regular attacks.

[Neisan_Quetz]

Sedna is a special case because he replaces his normal attacks with a TP move.

Ironclads aren't that hard to time (maybe if you're trying to keep it still and timing spells is problematic).

[Greatguardian]

Honestly, I prefer magic on Ironclads to WS. You get a much better/more stable vantage point for procs as a mage.

[Neisan_Quetz]

Oh yeah, that is true, I hate it so much when I'm amnesia'd half the time... but whoever doesn't have hate usually has it alot easier.

[Nynja]

Sedna spans like hell even with one person on it there's more mobs that do the same. Ironclads can also be problematic because of their tp moves and their regular attacks.

WHO FIGHTS SENDA MORE THAN ONCE ??!?

inb4 emp staff...

[Sharnak]

I think voidwatch is not as bad as a lot of people feel - it sure can use some improvement. Points system similar to nyzul, einherjar and assaults would be a great fix so that if you want the gears - you use points, and let the accessories armor drop as normal since these you can sell for good amount of gils. The developer is right for not allowing trading - otherwise most people will have the gears and stop doing voidwatch. Since you do not need to kill x amount of NMs for random seals, and more NMs for plus 2 items, voidwatch drop has to be rare. But point systems would easily fix this and make the armors obtainable via point systems. There are great things about abyssea and good things about old contents - the developer needs to be able to learn from the past 10 years and pick the best system and move FF11 forward for the next 5 years. Think of the paying costumers and the brand itself - and put aside egos, pride, and office politics.

That is execly what i want to say.

[Mirabelle]

What the hell is a spammy mob?

examples are the Fly NM for carabosse pop that will spam WS if it gets Aeroga off. There are mobs like CC that do back to back WS. And of course if people didn't turn around they would feed mobs TP creating a Spam situation. Then you get into the mobs that have regular TP attacks accounting for WS. Lots of reason for anyone but the tank and procer to be involved.

[Neisan_Quetz]

Has anyone seriously had trouble procing CC... I mean, seriously.

Seriously.

[FrankReynolds]

That stupid gigas NM for Briareus pop spams that Ranged Attack move every other attack, that is considered a TP move.

[Greatguardian]

examples are the Fly NM for carabosse pop that will spam WS if it gets Aeroga off. There are mobs like CC that do back to back WS. And of course if people didn't turn around they would feed mobs TP creating a Spam situation. Then you get into the mobs that have regular TP attacks accounting for WS. Lots of reason for anyone but the tank and procer to be involved.

Premise: CC and La Theine Leige can be hard to proc

Conclusion: There are lots of reasons to have even more DDs than the tank/proc on the NM

DOES NOT COMPUTE.

[Mirabelle]

Premise: CC and La Theine Leige can be hard to proc

Conclusion: There are lots of reasons to have even more DDs than the tank/proc on the NM

DOES NOT COMPUTE.

There are no reasons to have anyone but a tank and proc'er on NM which is the argument for why DD's are always spending 90% of the time with their back turned waiting for red proc to go kill for 20 sec.

Of course the following argument that there should only be a NIN/WAR/WHM on all NM's and everyone else is superfluous becomes apparent which means anyone without said jobs is SOL. So as a DD, either you spend 90% of your time with your back turned or you don't come as that job. This is still fundamentally an indictment of the Abyssea system for DD's (or any other non-tanking, non-healing, non-proc'ing job).


Has anyone seriously had trouble procing CC... I mean, seriously.

Seriously.

Sure when the yellow proc is AM, and CC decides Mayhem lantern is his go to TP move.

[Neisan_Quetz]

I'm not even going to describe how badly you'd have to goof up for that to be the case.

[Greatguardian]

There are no reasons to have anyone but a tank and proc'er on NM which is the argument for why DD's are always spending 90% of the time with their back turned waiting for red proc to go kill for 20 sec.

Of course the following argument that there should only be a NIN/WAR/WHM on all NM's and everyone else is superfluous becomes apparent which means anyone without said jobs is SOL. So as a DD, either you spend 90% of your time with your back turned or you don't come as that job. This is still fundamentally an indictment of the Abyssea system for DD's (or any other non-tanking, non-healing, non-proc'ing job).



Sure when the yellow proc is AM, and CC decides Mayhem lantern is his go to TP move.

Yes. If you're a DD that's not NIN/MNK/WAR, you should be on a different job.

Do I think that's ideal? No. I don't like the Abyssea job system much either. But that doesn't make it any less true. DDs shouldn't have their backs turned because you shouldn't be bringing like 6-10 people to Abyssea. If you have extra DDs that are not your tank/proc (Which should be the same person), you're wasting slots.

Indict the system all you want. "TP spam" and "zomg everyone turn" should never happen.

[Sparthos]

Why are we still talking about Abyssea again? The content is old and the game has moved away from those zones.

[Greatguardian]

Why are we still talking about Abyssea again? The content is old and the game has moved away from those zones.

I don't even know, man.

[Xellith]

Why are we still talking about Abyssea again? The content is old and the game has moved away from those zones.


I don't even know, man.

Because abyssea was fun content and they are moving back to old grind content such as voidwatch. This game wont have much of a future if something we players regard as good is seen by the dev team as something that should not have happened.

[Greatguardian]

Because abyssea was fun content and they are moving back to old grind content such as voidwatch.

Voidwatch is fun. Drop system is not. Really need to differentiate between the two. Otherwise, things just get so convoluted.

[Mirabelle]

Do I think that's ideal? No. I don't like the Abyssea job system much either. But that doesn't make it any less true. DDs shouldn't have their backs turned because you shouldn't be bringing like 6-10 people to Abyssea. If you have extra DDs that are not your tank/proc (Which should be the same person), you're wasting slots.

This is relevant for those only interested in making the most of their time in getting gear. People play games for many reasons and an MMORPG is above all a social game. If you have 5 friends that want to do some stuff in Aby, there's no reason they shouldn't do so. If one of them doesn't have an ideal job he can still contribute. Virtually every job can proc something. A PLD can come and hit SWD, GSWD, Club and staff procs.

We run a 6 man static empyrean group. If 4 people show up we go WAR/NIN/THF/WHM and make out fine. If all six are on, we don't tell 2 to stay home. We go WAR/NIN/THF/WHM/BLM/whatever. I've seen plenty of groups that have tag alongs that don't have the most efficient setup. Those people contribute and the group has fun. So there is no such thing as "wasted slots" if people are enjoying themselves and each other in a social game.

Its always unfortunate that players spend so much time trying to bypass SE's time sink hurdles that they restrict jobs and make the game less fun for themselves and others. All that does is make SE create even more daunting hurdles that forces the player base to get even more pedantic about ultimate job setup and efficiency.

[Zaknafein]

Can always have the guy that has less desirable jobs be the "free roamer" looking for timed key item NM's, and random NM's who people in the group might want drops from.

[Aldersyde]

We run a 6 man static empyrean group. If 4 people show up we go WAR/NIN/THF/WHM and make out fine. If all six are on, we don't tell 2 to stay home. We go WAR/NIN/THF/WHM/BLM/whatever. I've seen plenty of groups that have tag alongs that don't have the most efficient setup. Those people contribute and the group has fun. So there is no such thing as "wasted slots" if people are enjoying themselves and each other in a social game.

This. It's the same way in my ls. Most of the people there had been playing together for years. When Abyssea came out, the leads didn't start handing out pink slips when it was discovered that the event could be effectively low manned. We went in and did our thing successfully without having the most perfect setup. For all I hear about FFXI having such a great community, the people on forums sure make friends and acquaintances sound completely expendable for the sake of efficiency.

[Raksha]

Voidwatch is fun. Drop system is not. Really need to differentiate between the two. Otherwise, things just get so convoluted.

This.

Two thumbs up.

[Nynja]

examples are the Fly NM for carabosse pop that will spam WS if it gets Aeroga off. There are mobs like CC that do back to back WS. And of course if people didn't turn around they would feed mobs TP creating a Spam situation. Then you get into the mobs that have regular TP attacks accounting for WS. Lots of reason for anyone but the tank and procer to be involved.

So battle mechanics dont make it a spammy mob...thats battle mechanics. Turn around, let it do Venom 2-5 times since thats all TP free TP moves (presumably), and then fire your WS when its done.

CC is once again, battle mechanics. Every time it does a TP move, its like it has Sekkanoki up. Its not that hard to work around it. In fact these battle mechanics make it easy to deal with, as charmga will always be in the second moveset, so you can pre-stun that second move all the time.

If you cant time your attacks between Ironclad's melee swings, you suck...the only person who actually SHOULD have a problem with that is your "dd/tank" combo who is probably going to be stunned or amnesia all the time.

[Sparthos]

Hey Arcon buddy, where are ya? SE nerfed Realmrazer after the WS was applauded by the players as a reason to finally utilize club beyond mere procs and it gets nerfed overnight in response.

SE could use an apologist and I think you're the man for the job.

[Arcon]

Hey Arcon buddy, where are ya? SE nerfed Realmrazer after the WS was applauded by the players as a reason to finally utilize club beyond mere procs and it gets nerfed overnight in response.

SE could use an apologist and I think you're the man for the job.

And this from the guy who used the "ad hominem attack, so you must be dumb!" argument. Anyway, you think wrong:


As for the current topic (Realmrazer nerf), I can't say anything that hasn't been said already. Although if I do, maybe it'll carry more weight, so here goes: Retarded. Another example in a long line of mistakes by the development team. Good going, guys.

[svengalis]

WHO FIGHTS SENDA MORE THAN ONCE ??!?

inb4 emp staff...
Sedna also drops +2. Yes I have seen groups spam him and yes I have seen someone with Empyrean Staff.

[svengalis]

That stupid gigas NM for Briareus pop spams that Ranged Attack move every other attack, that is considered a TP move.

And there's tons more abyssea mobs that spam TP moves without being fed TP. I am not going to sit here and list them all, Nynja must not do Abyssea much.

[Sparthos]

And this from the guy who used the "ad hominem attack, so you must be dumb!" argument. Anyway, you think wrong:

Except I didn't attack you? I simply asked for your response given your point of view has been as an apologist on behalf of the dev team.

It's good to know we both agree that the Realmrazer nerf is retarded though.

[Arcon]

Except I didn't attack you? I simply asked for your response given your point of view has been as an apologist on behalf of the dev team.

You're just a one-stringed banjo, aren't you. Calling me an SE apologist, even though I constantly pointed out their flaws (even in this thread), should have given you a hint that I might not appreciate that. The only thing I agreed on with them in a very long time just happened to be something that people got hung up on in this thread, which was that Abyssea was bad for the game. Even in my very first post I (repeatedly) questioned their competence, after which I cautiously admitted that, at least this one time, they got it right. It all escalated from there, about OldXI vs AbyXI vs NewXI. So, whatever, you obviously have your opinion of me and I couldn't care less.

[darkhorror]

While a total overhall of the graphics may be a bit much, something like raising max draw distance, and other smaller changes could help it out.

[Odintius]

For me it like they added an easy button to this game that killed it for me personally.

[Runespider]

For me it like they added an easy button to this game that killed it for me personally.

People that say this actually mean they are mad that others get to choose the difficulty and get gear, it's not anger over the game being made easy for them personally. First few months of Aby my group didn't bother to get any of the KI or atmas and the NM fights we did were really long and hard, Aby is as hard or easy as you want to personally make it.

If you still play (guessing you do since you can't post here if you don't pay for your acc) I assume you really enjoy VW? Fairly difficult fights, need 18 people to do them and best of all they have disgustingly low drop rates, you must be in heaven doing that.

[Xellith]

"the game is too easy" is a stupid excuse. Nothing is stopping you from having your tanks use weapons but no other gear. No atmas, cruor buffs, F- rated weapons. The game is easier of course because old content is old content. But there is nothing stopping you from going gimped to hell and playing it "hard".

[Nynja]

And there's tons more abyssea mobs that spam TP moves without being fed TP. I am not going to sit here and list them all, Nynja must not do Abyssea much.

please list them all...I'm curious which ones spam TP moves that arent in a predictable fashion? What mob will actually RANDOMLY spam TP moves?

[Vaness]

I am for and aggainst abyssea.

The fact it doesnt take 6 months to get at job 75 anymore is great.
But abyssea as killed the dedication that players had before.Most ppl got so used to the "lets get a new gear everyday" that as soon as a Ls tells them they will have to wait their turn, they leave.

Linkshells also tend to break fast compared to the pre-abyssea linkshells due to Core members getting bored fast after getting everything in 2 months.

Pre-abyssea grin or not, could show who was dedicaced and who actually deserved those gears.

I miss it ;_;

[Arcon]

"the game is too easy" is a stupid excuse. Nothing is stopping you from having your tanks use weapons but no other gear. No atmas, cruor buffs, F- rated weapons. The game is easier of course because old content is old content. But there is nothing stopping you from going gimped to hell and playing it "hard".

That's another thing people keep bringing up. "If you want it harder just don't use Atma, blabla", it's a ridiculous argument. Why shouldn't we use the tools we have available? Is it too much to ask from a game developer to choose the difficulty instead of the player? Gimping yourself is artificial challenge, it doesn't make the game any harder. The point of players in a game is precisely to try and make it easier for them: use tactics that will give you an advantage, gear for the situation at hand, react to the enemny's actions, coordinate with your teammates to increase your chance of survival. These are natural elements to any game that will make battles easier, and that's the point. If you just wanna zerg it, you'll likely die. If you do an effort, you'll increase your chances to survive.

You, on the other hand, suggest exactly the opposite: do an effort to decrease your chances. It's not how games are supposed to work. The game is supposed to inflict the limitations, you are supposed to try and break them and work around them to win at it.

[saevel]

please list them all...I'm curious which ones spam TP moves that arent in a predictable fashion? What mob will actually RANDOMLY spam TP moves?

Probably thinking about the NMs. All of the +2 NMs have some sort of permanent meditate effect. In the hero's zones some of the NMs can just use a TP move whenever they want, mostly the T3 weapon NMs.

I guess after SE saw all the players using subtle blow and soloing / duoing NMs they decided to make it harder for them. Where it gets really silly is inside Voidwatch, the NMs in there don't even need TP. I've had several chase me around before and their spamming TP moves with nobody hitting them. It becomes fairly obvious that some of their abilities are not TP moves but instead are just JA's.

[Zaknafein]

If there is one thing I find highly moronic it is people who say "If you want a challenge do x,y, or z." No buffs, no atma blah blah ...No TY. When players ask for a challenge they are asking for an event that is exactly that. A challenge. No extra buffs/temp items/freeRR. Period.

I want an event where it requires some teamwork, and if you don't have the social skills or game knowledge to work with the bare basics then you will fail. Not an artificially created difficulty for myself that some noobs can accomplish also simply because the event was designed WAY too easy in the 1st place.

SE needs to develop two paths for end game.

A path for people who just want to coast, and a path for those willing to organize to excel at it. Doesn't seem like that hard of concept.

[Limecat]

They seriously think the only major improvement the game has received in years was a mistake?

http://img831.imageshack.us/img831/8484/soniamdisappointk.gif

[Arcon]

They seriously think the only major improvement the game has received in years was a mistake?

I'm sure it's very convenient to skip 55 pages of reading, isn't it?

http://img831.imageshack.us/img831/8484/soniamdisappointk.gif

[Runespider]

That's another thing people keep bringing up. "If you want it harder just don't use Atma, blabla", it's a ridiculous argument. Why shouldn't we use the tools we have available? Is it too much to ask from a game developer to choose the difficulty instead of the player?

If you buy a new game on your xbox do you instantly put it on too easy and complain about difficulty? I'm saying if you are complaining it's easy why use all the best atams and curor buffs, the reality is you don't care it's easy you just care it's easy for other people. I did a lot of the NMs without any atmas or curor buffs at the start because we didn't know much about them then, had no ls at the time for them to get em for us etc so we did the nms without..and yes they were difficult long fights that way.


I want an event where it requires some teamwork, and if you don't have the social skills or game knowledge to work with the bare basics then you will fail. Not an artificially created difficulty for myself that some noobs can accomplish also simply because the event was designed WAY too easy in the 1st place.

SE needs to develop two paths for end game.

A path for people who just want to coast, and a path for those willing to organize to excel at it. Doesn't seem like that hard of concept.

What did you think of VW? I actually find the fights can be quite challenging and fun, they give you temp items but some of the nms are so crazy you can't win without them. They require teamwork and some need some decent strategies to win, still see quite a lot of people failing on the higher tier stuff. The time limit is the most difficult aspect of many of the fights...at least till peopel post strats for everyone to copy...but such is the way of all FFIX content that has ever been added. See AV.

[Zaknafein]

What did you think of VW? I actually find the fights can be quite challenging and fun, they give you temp items but some of the nms are so crazy you can't win without them. They require teamwork and some need some decent strategies to win, still see quite a lot of people failing on the higher tier stuff. The time limit is the most difficult aspect of many of the fights...at least till peopel post strats for everyone to copy...but such is the way of all FFIX content that has ever been added. See AV.

I enjoyed VW in it's early stages much the same way I enjoyed Abyssea in the 1st expansion b4 everyone had hints, overpowered DD atmas, Apoc/twilight. Honestly tho VW has become just as bad as abyssea. In fact I would argue worse.

With the proper set up, and moderately skilled players groups are able to stagger so often if the target isn't frozen the entire alliance has fanatics up. The sheer amount of temps being dumped on each participant everytime they are recharged is just silly imo.

The fights are enjoyable. However, the ridiculous drop rates taint the event. It would have felt less grindy if they had worked the percentages, and distribution differently.

As it stands VW is the only event my LS does. 3 days a week. It's cool. I enjoy going to it, but it very rarely feels hard. There have been like 3 NM's on the way to jeuno, and zilart chapter 3 that we've stumbled on. That never lasted more than one nights event tho.

Personally I'm holding out hope for a new sky or sea sized zone @99 with a mixture of timed roaming NM's, and some popped ones. Just a regular old zone where you go in with the jobs you have. No aids or crutches. Just your gears which we all have plenty of now.

[Kimble]

Honestly, I don't remember the last challenging thing FFXI had to offer. And im talking way before abyssea too.

[Zaknafein]

Sad, but true. It's either got training wheels on it. Or else it's AV. Has to be a happy medium there somewhere.

[Runespider]

Honestly, I don't remember the last challenging thing FFXI had to offer. And im talking way before abyssea too.

Only time things were "difficult" was when nobody shared information or at least few knew about places that did. Now with BG (and some others sites) it's all disected in a short time after events. If the nature of FF players changed to be more selfish the fights would all start to stump a large portion of the playerbase.

Salvage is probably main event I can think of that would of not been as widely done (or at least not so successfully) if not for "goto BG and find out how to do everything". Couldn't just watch fights like many crappy bot HNM shells did either since it was blocked off.

As with everything in FFXI a few of the "elite/number crunchers/dat searchers etc" find out the best way to do everything, full starts, the tricks etc and they post it and then the majority of the rest of us copy it and say how easy it all is. I'd love to see how easy all the new content would be seen as if all the sharing of info ceased overnight, vast majority of the playerbase would be unable to kill anything new..or even pop them.

[Nynja]

Probably thinking about the NMs. All of the +2 NMs have some sort of permanent meditate effect.

No...they dont. Go hop on thief, presuming you have it leveled, beat a mob down to 25%, then backtank it and dont give it TP. At 25% it will use TP when it hits 100%...if it uses TP moves without TP being given to it, it has a regain effect. If you can successfully backtank it without getting any TP moves

I went thru my logs for a lusca fight, but my mules mnk doesnt exactly evade anything, but I did find this Sobek parse where I was trying to coast thru it with an underlvled whm mule and trying to mooch thf xp for my other mule (so no stuns for tyrant), where I got 1shot early on:

[02:13:39]Sobek takes 110 points of damage.

[02:13:40]Kehhiko starts casting Cure V on Kehhiko.

[02:13:42]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:13:45]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:13:46]Nynja scores a critical hit!

[02:13:46]Sobek takes 147 points of damage.

[02:13:47]Nynja scores a critical hit!

[02:13:47]Sobek takes 78 points of damage.

[02:13:48]Sobek starts casting Sleepga II.

[02:13:49]Sobek is out of range.

[02:13:52]Nynja's Copy Image effect wears off.

[02:13:53]Vermy starts casting Cure on Nynja.

[02:13:54]Nynja is no longer asleep.

[02:13:55]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:13:56]Nynja starts casting Utsusemi: Ichi on Nynja.

[02:13:57]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:13:57]Sobek casts Sleepga II.

[02:13:57]Nynja is asleep.

[02:13:59]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:14:00]Vermy casts Cure.

[02:14:00]Nynja recovers 36 HP.

[02:14:01]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:14:02]Kehhiko starts casting Reraise on Kehhiko.

[02:14:03]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:14:05]Nynja casts Utsusemi: Ichi.

[02:14:05]Nynja gains the effect of Copy Image.

[02:14:07]Nynja scores a critical hit!

[02:14:07]Sobek takes 133 points of damage.

[02:14:07]Sobek readies Awful Eye.

[02:14:08]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:14:08]Nynja scores a critical hit!

[02:14:08]Sobek takes 117 points of damage.

[02:14:09]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:14:14]Sobek uses Awful Eye.

[02:14:14]No effect on Nynja.

[02:14:15]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:14:15]Nynja scores a critical hit!

[02:14:15]Sobek takes 103 points of damage.

[02:14:16]Nynja scores a critical hit!

[02:14:16]Sobek takes 121 points of damage.

[02:14:17]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:14:17]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:14:20]1 of Nynja's shadows absorbs the damage and disappears.

[02:14:23]Nynja scores a critical hit!

[02:14:23]Sobek takes 126 points of damage.

[02:14:24]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:14:24]Nynja readies Evisceration.

[02:14:24]Nynja scores a critical hit!

[02:14:24]Sobek takes 115 points of damage.

[02:14:25]Nynja scores a critical hit!

[02:14:25]Sobek takes 99 points of damage.

[02:14:25]Nynja hits Sobek for 51 points of damage.

[02:14:26]Sobek is out of range.

[02:14:27]Nynja uses Evisceration.

[02:14:27]Sobek takes 1528 points of damage.

[02:14:28]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:14:30]Sobek starts casting Paralyga.

[02:14:35]Nynja's Copy Image effect wears off.

[02:14:35]Vermy starts casting Paralyna on Nynja.

[02:14:35]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:14:35]Nynja is no longer paralyzed.

[02:14:35]You must wait longer to use that spell.

[02:14:37]Nynja starts casting Utsusemi: Ni on Nynja.

[02:14:38]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:14:39]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:14:40]Sobek casts Paralyga.

[02:14:40]Nynja receives the effect of paralysis.

[02:14:40]Vermy casts Paralyna.

[02:14:40]Vermy successfully removes Nynja's paralysis.

[02:14:42]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:14:43]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:14:44]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:14:44]Nynja casts Utsusemi: Ni.

[02:14:44]Nynja gains the effect of Copy Image.

[02:14:45]Kehhiko starts casting Haste on Nynja.

[02:14:46]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:14:47]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:14:47]<Roseofsin> it's supposed to be easy

[02:14:50]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:14:51]<Roseofsin> mt

[02:14:51]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:14:52]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:14:53]Kehhiko casts Haste.

[02:14:53]Nynja gains the effect of Haste.

[02:14:54]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:14:56]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:14:58]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:14:59]<Nynja> sorry, Imeant to say

[02:15:00]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:15:02]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:15:03]<Nynja> 1shot by tyrant at 90%

[02:15:04]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:15:07]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:15:07]Sobek starts casting Dispelga.

[02:15:08]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:15:10]Nynja starts casting Utsusemi: Ichi on Nynja.

[02:15:12]Nynja's Copy Image effect wears off.

[02:15:12]Nynja's Haste effect wears off.

[02:15:17]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:15:17]1 of Nynja's shadows absorbs the damage and disappears.

[02:15:18]Sobek casts Dispelga.

[02:15:18]Nynja's Haste effect disappears!

[02:15:18]Vermy starts casting Haste on Nynja.

[02:15:19]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:15:19]Nynja casts Utsusemi: Ichi.

[02:15:19]Nynja gains the effect of Copy Image.

[02:15:21]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:15:23]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:15:25]1 of Nynja's shadows absorbs the damage and disappears.

[02:15:25]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:15:27]Vermy casts Haste.

[02:15:27]Nynja gains the effect of Haste.

[02:15:27]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:15:29]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:15:31]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:15:33]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:15:34]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:15:35]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:15:38]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:15:42]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:15:43]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:15:46]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:15:50]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:15:51]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:15:53]Sobek starts casting Sleepga II.

[02:15:57]Nynja's Copy Image effect wears off.

[02:15:58]Vermy starts casting Cure on Nynja.

[02:15:59]You must wait longer to use that spell.

[02:15:59]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:15:59]Nynja is no longer asleep.

[02:16:00]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:16:01]Nynja starts casting Utsusemi: Ni on Nynja.

[02:16:01]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:16:01]Sobek casts Sleepga II.

[02:16:01]Nynja is asleep.

[02:16:04]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:16:04]Vermy casts Cure.

[02:16:04]Nynja recovers 36 HP.

[02:16:05]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:16:08]Nynja casts Utsusemi: Ni.

[02:16:08]Nynja gains the effect of Copy Image.

[02:16:08]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:16:09]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:16:12]1 of Nynja's shadows absorbs the damage and disappears.

[02:16:13]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:16:16]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:16:17]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:16:20]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:16:21]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:16:24]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:16:26]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:16:26]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:16:28]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:16:30]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:16:32]Sobek starts casting Sleepga II.

[02:16:34]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:16:35]Vermy starts casting Cure on Nynja.

[02:16:35]Nynja's Copy Image effect wears off.

[02:16:37]Nynja is no longer asleep.

[02:16:37]Nynja starts casting Utsusemi: Ichi on Nynja.

[02:16:38]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:16:40]Sobek casts Sleepga II.

[02:16:40]Nynja is asleep.

[02:16:41]Vermy casts Cure.

[02:16:41]Nynja recovers 36 HP.

[02:16:42]Nynja's casting is interrupted.

[02:16:42]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:16:42]Gukumatz is paralyzed.

[02:16:43]Kehhiko starts casting Cure VI on Nynja.

[02:16:44]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:16:44]Vermy starts casting Cure IV on Nynja.

[02:16:44]Sobek hits Nynja for 382 points of damage.

[02:16:45]Nynja starts casting Utsusemi: Ichi on Nynja.

[02:16:46]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:16:50]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:16:50]Kehhiko casts Cure VI.

[02:16:50]Nynja recovers 420 HP.

[02:16:51]Vermy casts Cure IV.

[02:16:51]Nynja recovers 0 HP.

[02:16:51]Nibu readies Cyclone.

[02:16:52]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:16:54]Nynja casts Utsusemi: Ichi.

[02:16:54]Nynja gains the effect of Copy Image.

[02:16:54]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:16:56]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:16:59]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:17:01]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:17:02]1 of Nynja's shadows absorbs the damage and disappears.

[02:17:04]1 of Nynja's shadows absorbs the damage and disappears.

[02:17:07]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:17:10]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:17:10]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:17:12]1 of Nynja's shadows absorbs the damage and disappears.

[02:17:12]Sobek starts casting Sleepga II.

[02:17:15]Nynja's Stoneskin effect wears off.

[02:17:16]Vermy starts casting Cure on Nynja.

[02:17:16]You must wait longer to use that spell.

[02:17:18]Nynja is no longer asleep.

[02:17:18]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:17:18]Nynja starts casting Utsusemi: Ni on Nynja.

[02:17:19]Unable to cast spells at this time.

[02:17:21]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:17:21]Sobek casts Sleepga II.

[02:17:21]Nynja is asleep.

[02:17:23]Vermy casts Cure.

[02:17:23]Nynja recovers 0 HP.

[02:17:24]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:17:24]Nibu starts casting Utsusemi: Ni on Nibu.

[02:17:26]Nynja casts Utsusemi: Ni.

[02:17:26]Nynja gains the effect of Copy Image.

[02:17:26]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:17:27]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:17:28]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:17:33]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:17:35]Elvaanmoq starts casting Cure V on Nibu.

[02:17:35]Vermy starts casting Reraise on Vermy.

[02:17:35]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:17:37]1 of Nynja's shadows absorbs the damage and disappears.

[02:17:40]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:17:42]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:17:44]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:17:45]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:17:45]Nynja is no longer weakened.

[02:17:47]1 of Nynja's shadows absorbs the damage and disappears.

[02:17:47]Kehhiko starts casting Cure VI on Nynja.

[02:17:49]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:17:50]We had best step up our preparations.

[02:17:52]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:17:53]Sobek starts casting Paralyga.

[02:17:53]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:17:54]Kehhiko casts Cure VI.

[02:17:54]Nynja recovers 1188 HP.

[02:17:57]Vermy starts casting Paralyna on Nynja.

[02:17:57]Nynja's Copy Image effect wears off.

[02:17:58]Nynja is no longer paralyzed.

[02:17:59]Kehhiko starts casting Cure V on Nynja.

[02:18:00]Nynja starts casting Utsusemi: Ichi on Nynja.

[02:18:01]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:18:02]Elvaanmoq starts casting Dia II on Gukumatz.

[02:18:02]Nibu starts casting Utsusemi: Ni on Nibu.

[02:18:02]Nynja's Stoneskin effect wears off.

[02:18:02]Sobek casts Paralyga.

[02:18:02]Nynja receives the effect of paralysis.

[02:18:03]Vermy casts Paralyna.

[02:18:03]Vermy successfully removes Nynja's paralysis.

[02:18:03]Sobek hits Nynja for 74 points of damage.

[02:18:04]Nynja's casting is interrupted.

[02:18:04]Sobek hits Nynja for 391 points of damage.

[02:18:06]Kehhiko casts Cure V.

[02:18:06]Nynja recovers 623 HP.

[02:18:07]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:18:08]Nynja starts casting Utsusemi: Ichi on Nynja.

[02:18:10]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:18:11]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:18:12]Vermy starts casting Haste on Nynja.

[02:18:13]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:18:15]1 of Nynja's shadows absorbs the damage and disappears.

[02:18:16]Nynja casts Utsusemi: Ichi.

[02:18:16]Nynja gains the effect of Copy Image.

[02:18:18]Vermy starts casting Cure IV on Kehhiko.

[02:18:18]Unable to see Sobek.

[02:18:19]Vermy casts Haste.

[02:18:19]Nynja gains the effect of Haste.

[02:18:19]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:18:20]Kehhiko uses a dusty elixir
.

[02:18:21]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:18:23]Sobek misses Nynja.

[02:18:23]Kehhiko starts casting Cure V on Kehhiko.


Sorry for the long paste, but I wanted to prove my point. It used Awful Eye at 2:14:07, and then no TP moves for over 4 minutes until I finished unweakening? No...lol

[Greatguardian]

I can also confirm from way too much bloody experience with Abyssea NMs that even the Heroes T3Emp NMs don't all have Regain. It's fairly simple to feed them net 0 TP if you want to, it's just rarely worth the time.

[Kimble]

I remember it was like that for SW and Ixion battles. Was tough for like a week till it was figured out. Then just became easy like anything else in game.

[Sparthos]

Shinryu without brews @90 was tough.

[Psxpert2011]

The problem with Abyssea, as I've stated before, is that they didn't have a fourth add-on that carried it all the way to the new permanent cap. To put it another way, The worst part about Abyssea is that there isn't more of it.

Abyssea basically modernized FFXI. It finally came in line with it's successors. Heck, in some ways it crossed the line and became more player friendly than even the friendliest MMOs out there. As far as battle systems go, while not perfect, it is by far SE's best work.

...



Yes, some can argue that but it can be either an expansion all on it's own with a dead end which has no ties what so ever and SE can take the base story of Vana diel and create more new content. Maybe we will have a cap of lv.99 but I can only imagine the grins on the faces of the developers....

"We can cap everyone on the new expansion which has nothing to do with abysea, the main story line or Vana diel what so ever! Create the new system, get going! Abysea will be it's own world and <enter your own expansion name here> will be more tied into Vana diel then ever! We will bring back balance!" >=3

Since Abysea is an isolated scenario and you can't use your superman power outside, can this be based on truth? Could SE develop a whole new "Chains of Promathia" with lv. caps and better challenges than before up till the mega boss @ lv.99?



No...

...


Sorry for the long paste, but I wanted to prove my point. It used Awful Eye at 2:14:07, and then no TP moves for over 4 minutes until I finished unweakening? No...lol


...

(w... t... f...!) v.v

[Luvbunny]

If there is one thing I find highly moronic it is people who say "If you want a challenge do x,y, or z." No buffs, no atma blah blah ...No TY. When players ask for a challenge they are asking for an event that is exactly that. A challenge. No extra buffs/temp items/freeRR. Period.

I want an event where it requires some teamwork, and if you don't have the social skills or game knowledge to work with the bare basics then you will fail. Not an artificially created difficulty for myself that some noobs can accomplish also simply because the event was designed WAY too easy in the 1st place.

SE needs to develop two paths for end game.

A path for people who just want to coast, and a path for those willing to organize to excel at it. Doesn't seem like that hard of concept.

Perhaps you would like to play Dark Souls or Demon Souls? That game is exactly that - challenging and very hard. FFXI is perfect for me now - it has all kind of options and gazilion things to do - and all are doable with very minimal challenge, can be done solo or with small group and a lot less headache. The current playstyle is great - you no longer need big LS to accomplish most of the things in the game. I found Voidwatch is still a challenge for the majority of the players - with a downgrade contents and good accessories.

To be honest I am not looking forward the "go back to the old days" type of content where it takes years to get anything done (which some players called "dedication"). At the same token, I can quit and come back six months later knowing nobody gets anything done since it's not yet a year or more lol - so I don't feel like I get left behind :)

[Nynja]

...

(w... t... f...!) v.v

Since the "playstation expert" cant read logs...thats me backtanking Sobek while I'm weak and dont want to feed TP since with 800 HP Tyrant Tusk will clearly 1shot me. That's me shooting down the theory of "all abyssea mobs have regain and are spammy".

[saevel]

Since the "playstation expert" cant read logs...thats me backtanking Sobek while I'm weak and dont want to feed TP since with 800 HP Tyrant Tusk will clearly 1shot me. That's me shooting down the theory of "all abyssea mobs have regain and are spammy".

It was never all, but the hero's zone super NM's clearly do. It's not nearly as bad as VWNM's but its enough that even if your not hitting it at all it'll still use a TP move. Interesting about Sobek, although honestly we always had him dead in minutes anyway. I'm more thinking about Bukhis and his evilness.

[Nynja]

whats a super NM? anything that requires a key item to pop instead of tossable items?

[Psxpert2011]

Since the "playstation expert" cant read logs...thats me backtanking Sobek while I'm weak and dont want to feed TP since with 800 HP Tyrant Tusk will clearly 1shot me. That's me shooting down the theory of "all abyssea mobs have regain and are spammy".



Ah okay,it's cool, thanks!
Something i know a little about is tanking! ^^ (ah, the old days of PLD tanking are gone forever, sigh) ; ;

[svengalis]

whats a super NM? anything that requires a key item to pop instead of tossable items?

I am not sure what point you are trying to prove. Most people I know don't try to proc red/blue on a NM with their backs turned to it.

[Nynja]

It was never all, but the hero's zone super NM's clearly do. It's not nearly as bad as VWNM's but its enough that even if your not hitting it at all it'll still use a TP move. ... I'm more thinking about Bukhis and his evilness.

Then stop spitting out this garbage about everything having regain when they clearly dont. I think I still have a Bukhis set I need to use, I'll gladly back tank that to prove that too has no damn regain, though I think me and my friends all finished our voyage stones. I'll gladly backtank a heroes "super NM" to prove that that too does not have TP regain. In fact most mobs that people claim to have "TP Regain" actually dont.

Thats my point.

[Zaknafein]

Perhaps you would like to play Dark Souls or Demon Souls? That game is exactly that - challenging and very hard. FFXI is perfect for me now - it has all kind of options and gazilion things to do - and all are doable with very minimal challenge, can be done solo or with small group and a lot less headache. The current playstyle is great - you no longer need big LS to accomplish most of the things in the game. I found Voidwatch is still a challenge for the majority of the players - with a downgrade contents and good accessories.

To be honest I am not looking forward the "go back to the old days" type of content where it takes years to get anything done (which some players called "dedication"). At the same token, I can quit and come back six months later knowing nobody gets anything done since it's not yet a year or more lol - so I don't feel like I get left behind :)

That is my point entirely. There is zero reason why both groups of players should not be catered to. We all have fantastic gear now. That's what abyssea was all about. A vehicle to accelerate our xp to 99 cap while simultaneously making exceptional gear available to everyone. What SE decides to do with the game once we are 99 is the key. I hold out hope that they lay out two paths to the 99 end game experience.

Take empyreans for example. You had a choice of making them through the traditional method. Or collecting coins solo in an event (that had it worked correctly) could have been the new campaign. A place for you to make suitable progress on your own time. Solo if you so chose. That is hopefully the approach that will be taken. Two divergent paths of end game garnering similar, yet distinguishable results.

That is the best case scenario. It would be just as much of an oversight for the game to swing completely to the casual side as it has been in years past. When end game catered only to hard core players, and subjugated casuals.

[Kimble]

All they have planned for the next 6 months is more VW so yeah, nothing really to look forward to.

[saevel]

Then stop spitting out this garbage about everything having regain when they clearly dont. I think I still have a Bukhis set I need to use, I'll gladly back tank that to prove that too has no damn regain, though I think me and my friends all finished our voyage stones. I'll gladly backtank a heroes "super NM" to prove that that too does not have TP regain. In fact most mobs that people claim to have "TP Regain" actually dont.

Thats my point.

BS, I've had Apandamek chase me for long enough to use two TP moves without anyone hitting him. Long story short is that our brewer's time ran out and we had to hold him long enough for someone to run back and get one for the last few we had left. If these NM's don't have regain then they have ridiculously high store TP or their AI's are programmed to give them free moves periodically.

[Arcon]

All they have planned for the next 6 months is more VW so yeah, nothing really to look forward to.

And new Limbus, Einherjar, Nyzul and the Last Stand and the dungeon crawl system. So you only missed about 84% of the stuff they announced.

[Runespider]

And new Limbus, Einherjar, Nyzul and the Last Stand and the dungeon crawl system. So you only missed about 84% of the stuff they announced.

I doubt they will do very much at all with tweaks to current events, last stand will probably be fail like WoE and the dungeon crawl system will probably never happen. Doesn't even have a freaking name. They still haven't added the "don't lose curor buffs" etc things they promised let alone that kind of stuff.

So yeah, more VW.

[Arcon]

I doubt they will do very much at all with tweaks to current events, last stand will probably be fail like WoE and the dungeon crawl system will probably never happen. Doesn't even have a freaking name. They still haven't added the "don't lose curor buffs" etc things they promised let alone that kind of stuff.

So yeah, more VW.

Good point. I missed the new WoE walks. So he missed ~86% of the announced content. I missed ~14% too, so can't really blame him. That's what happens when they announce so much new stuff.

Stop being such a fucking hippie, Runspider. Now you're just talking to argue, nothing else. So what if it actually is fail? You called VW fail too. So why should he count VW but not that? And when have they ever announced something and not released? And what does their inability to fix losing cruor buffs have to do with it? If the last ten years have taught us anything it's that they'll keep releasing content regardless of how broken the old content (or even new content) is. Stop spouting bullshit already, crawl back to the hole from whence you came and go stab your Tanaka doll with a letter opener, since you obviously love blaming him so much for everything bad in your life.

[Runespider]

So angry XD

I never said VW was fail itself, I think most people that do the event find it quite enjoyable. Whoever was in charge of the drop system messed it up is all *stabs voodoo doll*. If the drop system wasn't crap it would among the better things they added to the game, since they want to keep the crappy drop system though yeah..not so much.

The tweaks to old content will be just that, tweaks. I doubt they do major additions (if they do I'll be pleasantly suprised) so that's not stuff to look forward to. What I said about the curor buffs/daily reward system not happening was more to state that they want to do a lot of things but since they cut the staff and budget they can't follow through on most of it, I'm not making stuff up it's just what's happening.

[hiko]

BS, I've had Apandamek chase me for long enough to use two TP moves without anyone hitting him. Long story short is that our brewer's time ran out and we had to hold him long enough for someone to run back and get one for the last few we had left. If these NM's don't have regain then they have ridiculously high store TP or their AI's are programmed to give them free moves periodically.
=>
Casts Thunder IV and Thunder V on himself occasionally to heal for a small amount of HP. More importantly, after any type of thunder damage is absorbed (player-cast or self-cast), it will level up and follow up immediately with Fulmination.
AI!
and even if it was not a "forced fulmination" 1mob having regain doesn't mean everyother have. Nynja never said that no monster have regain but
In fact most mobs that people claim to have "TP Regain" actually dont.

[Nynja]

BS, I've had Apandamek chase me for long enough to use two TP moves without anyone hitting him. Long story short is that our brewer's time ran out and we had to hold him long enough for someone to run back and get one for the last few we had left. If these NM's don't have regain then they have ridiculously high store TP or their AI's are programmed to give them free moves periodically.

Once again...battle mechanics. If you allow Apademak to be healed from any Thunder element, it gains a potent Regain effect and unlocks Fulmination.

so yes, what I bolded is true. Congratulations, you're getting the point.

[Meyi]

If he kills anyone at all he levels up and gains access to Fulmination. If he kills someone with Fulmination, he levels up and gains access to it again. If he casts any sort of Thunder on himself, he levels up and gains access to Fulmination. Basically, you need a fast cast Black Mage (or two normal Black Mages) with Stun at all times on him.

[Kimble]

Actually, the revamp stuff is on the tail end of the timeline they gave us and that is when it gets added to the test server so most of that stuff you listed wont even be in game for 7-8 months.

And I meant as far as new things, not "lets update old events and slap new stuff in it but basically do the same content we have been doing for 5-7 years"

Honestly it isnt "new" stuff. If all we are getting is more VW and rehashed events, the future is kinda bleak.

Last Stand and Dungeon crawl we have be given no info on.

[Luvbunny]

Honestly it isnt "new" stuff. If all we are getting is more VW and rehashed events, the future is kinda bleak. Last Stand and Dungeon crawl we have be given no info on.

Yes the future is kinda bleak unless they take notes from Phantasy Star Online and Monster Hunter, 2 japanese games that are very successful - SE kinda copied this in the form of Moblin Maze, Walk of Echoes, Campaign, ToAU Assault, Einherjar, Nyzul Isle and Salvage to an extent. But they did half ass jobs and leave them there without revisiting and tweaking it.

As for Last Stand and Dungeon Crawl - look no further than Moblin Maze + Assaults + Walk of Echoes, it won't be that groundbreaking. They can create several mini dungeons with objective (assault), same boring dungeons that you have to do over and over (walk of echoes, moblin maze, nyzul) or just one very looooong dungeon/area (dynamis). Whichever they choose, it would be fine as long as we are not being given the usual "super low drop rates" and hamster wheel grind for 2-3 years to get one item done :)

[Neisan_Quetz]

If he kills anyone at all he levels up and gains access to Fulmination. If he kills someone with Fulmination, he levels up and gains access to it again. If he casts any sort of Thunder on himself, he levels up and gains access to Fulmination. Basically, you need a fast cast Black Mage (or two normal Black Mages) with Stun at all times on him.

He actually levels up if anyone dies at all regardless of whether he killed them or not.

[Greatguardian]

He is Apademak the world-eater. He devours the souls of fallen heroes in the realm of Sovngarde and gains access to stronger shouts.

Just make sure to use Dragonrend whenever he tries to fly, or like cast thunder on himself, man, and he won't shout you to pieces.

Also, shoot him in the knee.

[Zemarin]

They coulda just made Dynamis mobs give 600-1000xp a piece and bam there would be Abyssea in a nutshell. They wanted money so they made us pay 30 dollars for 3 new areas that do nothing more then breed ppl who afk for bypassing most the games content and making the older parts of the game "obsolete"...

also toss up Magian Trials as a bust to, it only makes sense for empereyan weps and ele staffs... killing 70000 mobs for a 'weak' weapon is boring and takes alot more time then it looks.

[HimuraKenshyn]

They coulda just made Dynamis mobs give 600-1000xp a piece and bam there would be Abyssea in a nutshell. They wanted money so they made us pay 30 dollars for 3 new areas that do nothing more then breed ppl who afk for bypassing most the games content and making the older parts of the game "obsolete"...

also toss up Magian Trials as a bust to, it only makes sense for empereyan weps and ele staffs... killing 70000 mobs for a 'weak' weapon is boring and takes alot more time then it looks.

Yeah they could have done nothing and let the game die QQ. Funny how cliueless people are on the fact the old ways and this balance BS the game was going via the dinosaur its the reason all those servers shutdown. Abyssea was a shot in the arm the game needed not another 8 years of praying for a drop or playing which LS has the best claim bot FTW. Yeah it wasn't perfect but neither is the game by any means...

[tyrantsyn]

You know what I remember about pre~abyssea:

1: Waiting around for hours on end for a party due to the fact there was no healers, no tanks, or you were on one of those jobs that didn't fit into the party role of the time. And the best you could hope for was a pity invite right as a party started to fall apart.

2: Waiting around for endless hours with 30 other guys for 1 mob to pop just to have the one guy sitting @ home running 8 players all spamming claiming programs to end up with it. And than that shinny new weapon/armor goes to some guy who's so torque out that mobs examine him when he goes by.

3: End game content you can't ever seem to get any help with. Because It was such a pain in the ass at times most ppl that have experience with it won't even consider doing it again.

4: Waiting month's to years for a drop from some end game nm that seems to know that you and 17/18 other guys are only killing him to get it. Which normally lead's to all sorts of chaos and friend ending conflict's when one finally hit the treasure pool and someone sez "So and So shouldn't be lotting because he missed last weeks run."

5: Remember soloing decent xp before abyssea, lol.

I too miss the good olde party days. Running threw the strip out canyon's of Gustaberg and the sandy beach's of Valkrum. But than I think of all the hours I spent sitting around just for a few levels a day. And the almost endless camps on things like Charybdis and I'm only too happy with the way things have changed.

If I was too make a suggestion for revamp content for nostalgic players to the Dev team it would be to re~work conquest/besiege/campaign so there would be reason to revisit older area's and take down troublesome mobs for new weapons, armor, accessories and everyone's favorite "MORE LOGS" because we can never have enough of those damn things!

[Ritsuka]

you know the ppl that bit#$ about no party invites why don't you just make a party it isnt hard. If you dont want too and wonna wait days for an invite then don't bit@# that you didn't get an invite~

[FrankReynolds]

you know the ppl that bit#$ about no party invites why don't you just make a party it isnt hard. If you dont want too and wonna wait days for an invite then don't bit@# that you didn't get an invite~

lol ok, I'll just hop in the delorean and head back to 2006.

failboat.

[Luvbunny]

you know the ppl that bit#$ about no party invites why don't you just make a party it isnt hard. If you dont want too and wonna wait days for an invite then don't bit@# that you didn't get an invite~

The old ways of party set up required you have xyz jobs, yes you can get creative with some of the jobs combo and force people to go out of their comfort zones (example: 2 thieves, 2 dancers, blm and rdms can easily kill bats or mobs that are weak to dagger and require no tanks, sata back to back to both dancers). Most people won't do this, easier to do the normal set up, hence even if you make your own party, it may take you another 30-60 mnts to find the right jobs. 6 melees may not last fighting IT mobs, and if you chain kill tough - very tough mobs, half your groups will leave, even if that method is entirely doable. Leveling was a big chore in the past, everything in the game was a big chore - people will only put up with this for so long. Abyssea rewards pretty much everyone who is willing to put some time - not everything is handed out to you, you still have to work for some of them - but yes it also has its own share of problems. But this problems are mostly "people's problems" (lack of knowledge of the jobs and not even want to research, test, or put some time to play the job correctly).

[dragoon_apprentice]

leveling parties of 6 people were my favorite thing in the game. I spent most of my time doing that, until i wanted better gear for endgame. Then i joined big LS, most of which would mess with me with their over inflated point systems, making me follow the blackmages around on corsair and always having more points for the items i really wanted regardless of how many i had managed to save. I would take breaks from the game, coming back trying desperately to get some decent gear from a sky or NM camping ls, wasting hours of time standing in a spot for items pretty much all of which i didnt get to lot.

Its this sort of thing, which makes me not miss the old style of play compared to abyessea, but..

with abyessea, all of my hard earned time i spent leveling so many jobs in parties of 6, waiting for parties, making them, learning game mechanics and enjoying the slow progress of the game simply turns into a few months of me watching people sit either afk earning multiple levels by the hour and/or opening boxes with keys in order to level insanely fast.

People still do much of the same things they used to, after they get empy weapons and what have you, there is still a good chance they will get bored and not care or ditch LSs when it is now your turn to farm. This creates a never ending supply of new recruits to be KI holders, pullers, and healers, trying to get somethign out of it until they either get fed up and leave quickly, or stay just long enough to get what they want and vanish. Not that people dont stick around still for friendships and playtime after they get what they want; ffxi is a great community with some relatively friendly people, compared to many other more casual games.

The game hassort of turned into a giant farmville. Lets go farm empys, or +2, or items from VW. great! i got it! now what do i do. Does there happen to be a new zone i can explore or new mobs i can take down with my friends with out worrying about procing something? And by the way, reusing an old zone is bad enough, we can stand it i guess though, but does it have to become the norm?
Can i just enjoy the fight, with my aftermath ws, getting back to mechanics of actaully being able to fight the mob. Not being worried about TP feed because 40 people are on one mob, eccessive 1 shots unless i have temps on, procing some stupid ability midfight takeing all the wind out of my sails, doing 5k dmg in one zone with a ws or spell that does 900 dmg in another.

RANT:
why are certain aftermath weaponskills weaksauce? camlann's torment almsot made me quit when i got it. why? why??? does this suck so bad. The idea of people spamming the same ws over and over for years and being amazed and motivated by the damage number they put out during the ws was effectively slapped in the face by abyessea. Now SE doesnt know what to do with their new weaponskills they jsut made, because some of the old ones are too powerful alraedy. I was so happy when i got chante du cynge and almace. That is why i came back to ffxi, b/c i thought i had a decent shot at a weapon that was somewhat like a relic weapon (a relic i wanted but it was something simply too hard for me to care about). It has its own unique weapon skill, i can take it and use it outside abyessea in the normal vanadiel, much like a relic user finally got to take his unique relic ws out of dynamis and show it off.
The fun was getting to take your unique weapon and go kill some monsters with it. Now its like you need one to even get into a party to go sit procing something. Getting VW parties on empy blu with all spells is easy as being a cor seeking for a merit party back in the day. But i dont ENJOY sitting in one spot scrolling thru the magic list casting random spells. Do u think people will continue to pay to do that stuff, especially when the random element is brought back into it so heavily with these boxes?

procing annoys me, but at least it helps get things done faster. Abyessea lets people at least make progress in some form or another. Yes in many regards linkshell leaders still have an obligation to be fair to the members and divy up points correctly and show up to lead people. At this point starwars looks attractive to many, as many games do to ffxi fans over the years. I am sure many people are similar and go thru cycles and stop playing ffxi to try other games, see that the other mmo is not as good, then come back.

ff14 was a disaster, so were many other new mmos. The thing is, starwars is threatening the vary foundation of this game, and WoW, among others. That game will probably be at least decent, and not flop due to oversights like server lag, stupid undertested concepts, and lack of content.
I love ffxi, because it is hard to play. I want it to be hard again, while im playing it. I dont want it to be hard to proc, or a hard drop to get. I want the monsters to be hard and fun to fight, like they used to be. I dont feel like killing 5 monsters in 5 seconds all the time, and having to watch my ~~~ruuubbbyyy~~ . ZOMG DONT RUBY, we are farming moer and more and more ki for more and more and more empy for more and more and mroe people.

Dont feel like watching out for stupid lights all night? oh, there really isnt much content outside of abyessea, cept more procing and slim chances at whatever randomly falls from the box. No cumulation of who put the most effort in the teamwork over time, just random. For other people its either this, or be left at the mercy of some guy's integrity. and that guy is probably only a few years older than you are, and hes telling you what to do every night, and possibly getting much more out of the deal than you are. This is how the game always worked i guess.

And by the way, every minute you dont spend doing something in abyessea, save for making money another way, you are losing money standing around. converting crour into gil is easy for people, and really easy for those who simply bought a second account, gaining twice the number of crour as others effectively making their time worth twice as much. Leveing this mule took 5 seconds because of abyessea as well. Maybe not everyone that plays this game feels like paying SE 24 dollars a month to do something i could have fun doing with a couple people. but becuase of minkins and other stuff like it, dual boxing characters have this distinct advantage. NO SE, i wont buy a mule. i thought about it, hell i even have the name jiin stored. The game simply is not fun enough for me while i farm empys or +2 for other people in abyessea or go proc stuff to justify me paying that much and constantly picking up another controller or pressing alt+ tab all the time. I want to play my jobs, i want to fight mobs lol.

And BTW, ty for making camlann's torment suck for no reason really. jishnu radiance does over 10k from some people, and this ws camlann's is arguably the worst dmg empy ws there is. Id be more exicited about stardiver if it ambered mobs or somthing, make more ws ruby, we need more ruby. Imo i'm not sure you could put any more time and effort into not letting me spam a ws that i want to, be it because it has bad dmg or i will ruby a mob because it kills it in 1 shot, on a job that is meant to spam weapon skills, in the one zone type that has decent combat content that flows (not proc and temp item spam). And then you have the reverse, blu being so rediculously over powered inside with the eccessive stuns self skill chains aoe sleeps massive aoe power amazing crit ws, everyone wants you to do everything and never play another job again. Darn, i feel like playing drg, not pld, not rdm, not blu atm. I can use empy ws outside abyessea, how about letting my use atmas too? yea voidwatch gets atmas. who cares? Thats during voidwatch status. How about just making every high level normal mob aroudn vanadiel mob balanced to abyessea standards and then adding more hard ones that require atmas to take down, b/c ur too weak to do it otherwise, or something? just leave the procing for inside abyssea. Introduce the atmas for outside, lose the procs maybe.

yes im a bit negative. dont get me wrong, i like ffxi, and ill keep playing. it is definately going through a strange period however. people who have most of what they want in abby are tired of seeing people leech and get tons of +2 for doing minimal effort. They want out. They want something new. They want to team up with other long time veterans, be it the decent people to the insanely good with no life people, and start to take monsters down together again. Fights maybe where things happen? one mob dies, 3 more appear? omg its not just 1 monster that we proc and it dies, or we dont proc and it dies, or a few that we sleep or aoe and they die. Can we get a little rythm to the action maybe, new kinds of teamwork, a new inventory system, a new drop system, and new weapon skills that we can improve over time if we want to, because we like the way they look and are very tired of starting at the same ws for years? oh sorry, i forgot i got camlann's. wait, oh yea. i get laughed at by pretty much everyone if i use that twice in a row. its bad enough using it once.
pros, and cons, to both sides of abyessea vs the oldschool game. but thats just me.

i <3 u tho SE, and ffxi

if u read all that, my bad im so bored

[Jackstin]

Dude, in the time it took you to write all that you could have got an empyrean o_O

[dragoon_apprentice]

hehheh. yea probably. im so bored

[FrankReynolds]

Starting your own party does nothing for you when there is no one seeking. XPing wasn't nearly as popular bacck when xp sucked, and many people only bothered to level a few jobs.

[HimuraKenshyn]

Starting your own party does nothing for you when there is no one seeking. XPing wasn't nearly as popular bacck when xp sucked, and many people only bothered to level a few jobs.

The game was moving to life support getting low level parties already was a pain in the a$$ on many worlds and peeps just had a few jobs at cap and wouldn't dream about leveling another before abyssea. Now they added Abyssea, FOV and GOV and they are perfect for solo, low man teams or full alliances something SE done right lol. Yeah most peeps in many shells started to look elsewhere for fun and Abyssea brought huge numbers of friends I haven't seen in years back to the game what a FAILURE LMAO!!!! So out of touch with this generations player base they have TONS of choice back in the day not so much and the new devs want to go throw back they done lost they freakin minds imho...

[geekgirl101]

Want to know what is killing this game? Giving everyone everything they want when they want it and making every other job useless. Back 5 years ago everyone (or almost everyone) had a role in a party. WHMs healed, BLMs nuked very carefully while watching their threat, did elemental enfeebles, and timed big nukes for magic bursting, melee DPS would time their weapon skills in order to create skillchains, THFs would line up behind tanks or "SATA buddies" in order to set up for SATA, RDMs were there to refresh anyone with MP and kept up with hastes, enfeebles, back-up heals, and did a little nuking if they had MP, BRDs and CORs were there to buff people with special buffs.

Almost everyone had a role and that got destroyed with Abyssea. RDMs are no longer a requirement to keep mages refreshed because abyssites are much more powerful, and they aren't a requirement for enfeebles because WHM and BLM enfeebles work just as well with little to no resistance. BLMs are only required to create azure lights and proc yellow. BRDs aren't required for anything other than proc yellow, so BLMs having little else to do sub BRD in order to proc both BLM and BRD spells. THFs aren't required to proc NM drops because those are now done by procc'ing blue, during half the fight they're stood there doing nothing with the rest of the DPS because the NMs need to be procc'd first before it can be killed or they give too much TP. Melee DPS rarely ever attempt at skillchaining in fear that they kill the mob with their weaponskills and results in creating ruby light, this fear of procc'ing ruby means that most DPS have never had the chance to skillchain and have gotten used to just spamming their TP whenever they feel like it.

Then SE dropped the requirements to enter Abyssea. No more venturing deep into WotG missions and being level 70+, you can now go there just by visiting the maws at level 30 and leech xp all the way to 99, not getting to play your job and become familiar with any of the abilities until late on after you've already gimped several parties for not knowing how to play, and not having developed any decent skills which you then have to spend countless hours or even days skilling up fighting crabs and lizards and running endless self-casting macros while you sleep.

So much of the game has been lost. People say that GoV was an excellent move because it means you no longer have to be xyz class in order to partake in a party. But what about all the joys that made you feel that you were genuinely contributing to a group and that each battle was a small challenge to defeat and chain the next fight? And what about at the end of it when your class feels just as useless as it sits there waiting for yellow, red and blue procs before you can engage or you're told to just watch because you'd feed too much TP?

Now while I'm saying that Abyssea broke a lot of the old game I'm not saying that the old game was overall good either. There was a lot of drawbacks to the old game such as the endless waiting around for a party invite, always being stumped because there was no tanks/healers/refreshers flagged for a party, not being able to get in a party because your job wasn't deemed suitable (DRGs and BSTs just never got invited), struggling to find camps in popular zones or having that one super-awesome group nearby that was claiming 5 mobs to your 1. SE could've done better, Abyssea just did too much change imo.

[FrankReynolds]

meh, the old party thing sucked. I used to get friends to play this game, but 2 months later when they are still level 60, have no cop, and no zilart mmissions done, no money, and can't go do any of the end game stuff that I spend all my nights doing.... their like "why the hell do you play this Sh*t? this game sucks!".

Then I would tell them "Nah man, i swear, when I finish p leveling you, and helping you with all those missions, your gonna have tons of fun camping HNM with me.".


Now new players can participate in events with older players after just a couple of days. Like it or not, it makes the game a lot friendlier to new player, and returning players.

[HimuraKenshyn]

Man peeps delude themselves that the game didn't need a change in direction just ask your self one thing how many peeps are duo, triple, quad or more boxing to keep this thing alive lol. Abyssea gave the game new life nothing more nothing less the old ways are dead bury them. So many mules in this game that use to be real players it's not funny y'all peeps crying about Abyssea know it's true lmao MMO of mules is what was happening without a change and Abyssea at least got real people playing again. Cry me a river about leveling the game had become stale and as much fun as watching paint dry 200 people trying to claim one mob playing who has the best bot was awesome. Nothing like spending 3 hours waiting for a spawn to be botted YAWN!!! old school sucked hard new school allowed the fun back in I admit after 8 years of the old school its about damn time to change it up and make the game fun and exciting again.....

[Ilax]

Want to know what is killing this game?

Chapter 1: 2002 ish
SE made us hard work 6yr long hunting a dream that never came true.

Chapter 2: Abyssea
All hard worked gear, relic, mythic turned trash by Abyssea content, not RIVAL, i say TRASH.

Chapter 3: December 2011
SE want to make us work hard again, a new nightmare born!!!! The evilness side of Tanaka is back!!! But don't worry because he told us that he will reduce difficulty again to please casual player. huh? really?

Man... I am so happy to have to kill the new DL 1,000 time for +1 dmg on Mandau, ya that real worth it when i know that goign to take me 2yr, and in 2yr SE will reduce it to 5 HQ DL, or wait, maybe they going to make Chapter 4: Abyssea part 2, and make all our hard worked gear trash again ^^

Tanaka.... PPL had TRUST in you before you trashed all our hard work gear, now you ask us to do it again??? What kind of evil person are you...

[Kimble]

Honestly, its not like they could have gone to 99 without old gearing turning into outdate gear.

If we would have had the same gear and just more side grades from 75-99, I'm sure most people why have left a long time ago.

Hell, 90-99 has mostly been side gear.

[Ilax]

Kinda doubt on that, ZM, COP, AU, altena was all side gear, and player was enjoying the challenge, Abyssea could give Rival gear to please casual player, it also open the door to experience new job without need to spend 6yr into it. It could also give some special hard work gear to please hardcore player.

Imo the entire 75 to 99 was a big mistake so is abyssea erassing all hard worked gear.

[Ravenmore]

Kinda doubt on that, ZM, COP, AU, altena was all side gear, and player was enjoying the challenge, Abyssea could give Rival gear to please casual player, it also open the door to experience new job without need to spend 6yr into it. It could also give some special hard work gear to please hardcore player.

Imo the entire 75 to 99 was a big mistake so is abyssea erassing all hard worked gear.

Yeah it was. Only thing was really out of reach of casual player was king drops but a couple of mil could get any adj you wanted every thing else had cool down timers. Limbus, enhj, dnya all could only be done 2 times a week. ZNM limiting factor was people willing to waste their time farming Pics for almost all sidegrade. How many kirins were killed and all is non-W.legs adjs hit the floor at 75. Still doesn't matter I know some that quit over noct mail being better then their hauby +1 for sam back when it was added its not even a common thing to see. If you leave gear from any event the best for to long it just becomes stagnation.

[Ilax]

Yeah it was. Only thing was really out of reach of casual player was king drops but a couple of mil could get any adj you wanted every thing else had cool down timers. Limbus, enhj, dnya all could only be done 2 times a week. ZNM limiting factor was people willing to waste their time farming Pics for almost all sidegrade. How many kirins were killed and all is non-W.legs adjs hit the floor at 75. Still doesn't matter I know some that quit over noct mail being better then their hauby +1 for sam back when it was added its not even a common thing to see. If you leave gear from any event the best for to long it just becomes stagnation.

You know what probably frustrate me the most in all that? They made abyssea gear destroy all those event, then DEV spend they whole time to fix the issue with those event (Dyna, hnm, ect..) when the gear is totally outdated.

I wish someone would explain me why... just why they fix the fun stuff when is pointless to do it anymore. Hopefully is not what waiting us with VW, but... we all know....

[SpankWustler]

You know what probably frustrate me the most in all that? They made abyssea gear destroy all those event, then DEV spend they whole time to fix the issue with those event (Dyna, hnm, ect..) when the gear is totally outdated.

I wish someone would explain me why... just why they fix the fun stuff when is pointless to do it anymore.

They later go back (http://wiki.bluegartr.com/bg/Category:Relic_Armor_%2B2) and update the drops as well. (http://wiki.bluegartr.com/bg/Armada_Hauberk)

Yeah, the stuff is situational and obviously meant to be macroed in and out, but it's not any more situational than most stuff from Voidwatch. That's one thing about equipment that hasn't changed in almost a decade.

[Ravenmore]

They should have killed all that gear gear along time ago and came out with fresh gear case in point how long was kitty pants the best legs for any non rng to tp in. Its not the fact they killed gear its they left it the best for far to long before doing something about it. If they had left the game at were it was pre-abyssea it would have kept bleending players and more mergers would be happening.

With a few tweaks to VW that the players have been asking for it would be far better. Even not giving us the option to pool gear adding a simple check to the chest and adding that ra/ex drop if the player already had it to another players loot would help and still keep most of the grind but it would at least appear that they are listening. Then there is the BS that taking blu into them is that would get me to go back. I don't maind using ever job I have but getting stuck on the one that no one wants to play cause the pain it is to play (proc all its there for) is not fun.

[Summoner]

Because I speak English, the following is Google Translate

When the topic among Japanese users have this interview, producer Ito on Twitter, "What a pity on like I fueled reputation and retranslating maliciously articles interviews Overseas own board certain somehow. 'Comments.

Japanese people in the forum said: "Please tell the truth if there is a mistranslation"
"Abyssea is fun, VW is boring"

Even though we only asked for explanation, GM is "Name Remember Where I have gotten different opinions, Lamas stated that is found with some emotional expression. The discussion is continued in this state If you were, it is considered likely to develop into a violation described in terms such as slander, I very sorry, this thread will be closed. "forcibly closed thread .

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/18688-

This interview is very unfortunate because high interest from users in Japan.

[Runespider]

When the topic among Japanese users have this interview, producer Ito on Twitter, "What a pity on like I fueled reputation and retranslating maliciously articles interviews Overseas own board certain somehow. 'Comments.

Japanese people in the forum said: "Please tell the truth if there is a mistranslation"
"Abyssea is fun, VW is boring"

Even though we only asked for explanation, GM is "Name Remember Where I have gotten different opinions, Lamas stated that is found with some emotional expression. The discussion is continued in this state If you were, it is considered likely to develop into a violation described in terms such as slander, I very sorry, this thread will be closed. "forcibly closed thread .

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/18688-

This interview is very unfortunate because high interest from users in Japan.

So basically this is saying that they are blaming the anger over this interview as a mistranslation and that it's the fault of the western players/press. (god remember them saying this about the fatigure system in FFXIV too?)

At least it's nice to see the JP players thinks the same as us.

The dev team are ignoring players worldwide here, Abyssea was good and in total honesty that should be down to the players to judge not them.

[Runespider]

Quite a lot of rage going on over on the JP forums about the Abyssea intervew where they said it was a mistake and indeed over VW being crap. Nice to see it there too, their threads are getting locked too cause of people getting angry lol

Oh and some big time rage over Ukon nerf too.

http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?act=url&hl=en&ie=UTF8&prev=_t&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=ja&tl=en&twu=1&u=http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/forums/17&usg=ALkJrhiWr0bpWSoEkbCvDdTNHkZiFYGkAw

[Glacont]

Quite a lot of rage going on over on the JP forums about the Abyssea intervew where they said it was a mistake and indeed over VW being crap. Nice to see it there too, their threads are getting locked too cause of people getting angry lol

http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?act=url&hl=en&ie=UTF8&prev=_t&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=ja&tl=en&twu=1&u=http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/forums/17&usg=ALkJrhiWr0bpWSoEkbCvDdTNHkZiFYGkAw

I agree. It is Good news to know the views do not just reside in N/A Gamers but over in Japan, as well.

[Neisan_Quetz]

Google translate is some of the funniest shit I've ever read.

[Runespider]

Google translate is some of the funniest shit I've ever read.

read the "There are questions Americans." post XD

[Meyi]

read the "There are questions Americans." post XD

Supposed to translate to "This American has a question", but yeah, damn, that was the worst translate I've ever read in my life. Just so you know, 「にがて」 means 'bad', not what Google translates it as...

[Summoner]

Ito　Comments　JP forum
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/18909-

[Runespider]

Jp players annoyed = the director himself makes a post (wish I could read it...google is failing) the english players annoyed = thread deleted or just ignored. Oh well, glad they are on our side with this.


Ito　Comments　JP forum
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/18909-

Thank you summoner.

[Seriha]

Yeah, a more precise translation would be nice. General gist seems to be, though, "We didn't say that! Someone just screwed up the translation!" Even looking past the context of Abyssea, it doesn't really allude well to other complaints players have been having.

[Meyi]

I'm going to try and translate it, but please forgive me if it's wrong. I'm fearful of Google translate, but my own skills are awful. If anyone finds errors with this translation and is decent in Japanese, please let me know so I can correct it. (I will give you credit!)


ディレクターの伊藤です。

ZAMによるインタビュー記事の内容が、第3者による某匿名掲示板への誤訳と捏造を含む無責任な投稿によって誤って日本のユーザーに伝わっている件について、改めてインタビューの質問の趣旨と回答の意図をご説明したいと思います。（なお、海外コミュニティでもかなりネガティブな印象なのでは？と言った投稿や、スレッドが荒れているという投稿もありましたが、概ねポジティブに捉えられ、建設的に議論されています。）

某匿名掲示板には、【伊藤「アビセアは失敗作だった」】というタイトルで以下の文が掲載されました。

This is Director Ito.

The ZAM interview article content was falsely translated by a third party person and so once again I am regarding the interview's questions and answers.

Furthermore, the foreign communities seem to have a negative impression. This submission [I'm assuming this very topic] has started a heated discussion.

An anonymous bulletin board titled "Ito: Abyssea was a failure" [again I'm assuming it's this topic] says there is a downward movement.





アビセアはプレイヤー的には好評だったが、運営側としては失敗だった
特にアートマやジェイドでの強化はやりすぎた

これらはアビセアに関する質問と回答の中から、前後の文を無視して抜粋されたようです。

インタビューの趣旨は「アビセアの成功で得たものは何か？」でした。
それに対しては次のように回答しています。



アビセアで得たものは成功ばかりではない。
プレイ感覚も価値も、他のコンテンツとの格差が生じるという問題が浮き彫りになった。
アビセアは概ね成功だが、アビセアに関してユーザーから指摘のあったそれらの問題点を開発チームは強く認識している。他のコンテンツをテコ入れすると共に、新規コンテンツの教訓にする。つまり、アビセアは失敗ではなく、他のコンテンツに今後の課題が出来た。

なお、インタビュー記事でも概ねそのように書かれています。



* Abyssea was a success among the players, but a failure among developers.
* Special atmas and abyssites made the players too powerful.

This question and answer concerns Abyssea, which seems to have been disregarded.
The purpose of the interview was to answer what was gained from the success of Abyssea.
The opposition is next to be answered.

• We were merely questioning the triumphs of Abyssea.
• We wanted players to feel that other content was worth doing as well. However, there were problems of disparity that Abyssea had engraved into the game.
• Abyssea in general was a success, but, developers realized the strong issues of identification at hand. We want players to participate in new content.

In short, Abyssea was a failure and we are now presenting the new content's theme.

Furthermore, interviews will be written generally.



ヴォイドウォッチはアビセアの失敗を受けて製作された
バランス、ジョブ、戦利品の仕様など、今までの中でも完成されたコンテンツと思っている

これらはヴォイドウォッチの現状や問題点についての質問の回答を、投稿者が逆の意味に翻訳し、脚色した文章のようです。

インタビューの中では、ヴォイドウォッチの戦利品仕様やバランスなどの現状の問題点の例を挙げ、「ヴォイドウォッチにはまだ今後の調整課題が残されている。」という趣旨で、賛否両論のあるコンテンツと話しています。


* Voidwatch is the production of Abyssea's downfalls.
* Jobs and drop rates are complete, I think. [Note that Japanese often attach 'I think' at the end of sentences to sound polite. However, I can't decide if this is out of politeness or if he's genuinely considering a change, so I decided to leave this in.]

The contributions to Voidwatch's current drop rate system are dramatized because of the article's improper translation.


Inside of the interview the balance of Voidwatch was brought up. We are still reserving adjustments to the drop rates, and are weighing the pros and cons.



今のプレイヤーはストーリーよりも強敵との戦闘がしたい、と考えている
　なので、今後はヴォイドウォッチがFF11の主流になる

こちらは今後についての質問と回答の中から抜粋したものを、投稿者が逆の意味に翻訳し、記事中で述べていない内容でかなり脚色した文章のようです。

インタビューでは、「アビセアとヴォイドウォッチはバトルに焦点を当てたコンテンツでしたが、ストーリーのあるコンテンツが待ち望まれているため、次はこれまでとは異なる新しいものを考えている。」と答えています。



* I think the balance between jobs and the drop rates are complete.

The article was dramatically incorrect in displaying information about this.

In the interview, it was said that Abyssea and Voidwatch battle systems were the main focus, and that story has a desirable wait to it. Here we are still deciding new considerations.
　


12月のバージョンアップで弱いジョブというものはなくなった、次からは強すぎるジョブのバランスを取る
新規を増やそうと色々頑張ってる

これらは投稿者の捏造のようです。あるいは記事中の様々な単語を持ってきて繋げたのかもしれません。


* In December's update there were no longer weak jobs and strong jobs needed a balance.
* There were new augments preserved.

It is possible that the article had varied vocabulary in this section. The connection is not yet known.
　
　

ZAMに限らず、海外でインタビューや発表が記事になる場合、校正や事前の確認を行えないため、何をどう書かれるかは公開されるまで分かりません。

ただ、今回の記事の原文を見る限りでは、私たちが伝えたかった内容はインタビュワーには概ね伝わっており、記事の内容に関しても否定する部分はありません。

機械翻訳などのツールを用いて私的に記事を読むのは問題ないと思いますが、それを投稿する場合にはそれなりの責任を伴うはずですし、読み手も充分に注意する必要があると思います。
今回はこうして誤った情報を前提として議論が過熱してしまったところがあり、私も開発チームもだいぶ困惑しているというのが正直なところです。

一方で、この投稿からアビセアとヴォイドウォッチの評価についてフォーラムで皆さんに真剣に語って頂けたことにより、皆さんと私たちの認識がそこまでズレていないことが確認できたことは意味があったと考えています。

私のTwitterのアカウントにも誤った情報を前提としたコメントが寄せられたため、その内容を確認しましたが、フォーラムではない場所で過熱していたためにフォーラムで急に語るわけにもいかず、Twitterで疑問を投げかけさせて頂きました。その結果、余計に混乱を招くことになってしまいました。申し訳ありません。

折角フォーラムがあるのに･･･という点は仰る通りだと思います。案件の大小や内容に関わらず、今後はこう言った部分も含めて、フォーラムを通じて皆さんへ意図をお伝えしたり、ディスカッションをさせていただきます。

最後になりますが、ここまで大きな拗れになったことは、私の信頼のなさも要因のひとつになっていると受け止めています。今後は信頼を得られるよう、より一層、開発に励んで参ります。どうぞよろしくお願いいたします。

As of this ZAM article's limitations, we have decided to proofread foreign interview announcements beforehand to validate their translation accuracy.

Now we are converting the subject in the interview in a suitable time. [I don't understand this sentence but I tried my best. orz]

Maybe machine translation tools (like Google) pose a problem. Take necessary caution when reading machine translated articles, as they may be inaccurate. It can cause gossip and overheating. Both I and the development team are bewildered at the honesty and integrity of the place.

One day, the assessments about Abyssea and Voidwatch from the forums concerning everyone's seriousness will be recognized, but the current premises are fresh and will be changing.

My Twitter account made a mistake too. If it happens again, comment there, but don't overheat on the forums. Don't rush to the forums, but rather leave me a comment, otherwise there will be unnecessary chaos created.

The forums have great pains although, said points have been received. Subject sizes from now on version drafts of said portion will include everyone and will convey the report of those who have had the privilege of discussing. [I may have butchered this, I'm sorry.]

In conclusion I trust things will not become progressively worse. I have faith that we will obtain the correct method, but we must brace ourselves until the time comes. Please, let us all be nice to each other.

*****

As I stated earlier, this might be inaccurate, and, judging by their dislike of the ZAM "third party" translate, I'm not quite sure how this post will fair. Um, I tried my best. ^^; You can take it or leave it and my feelings won't be hurt. From what I gathered though, it seems Mr. Ito is upset at the uproar the "improperly translated article" has caused. I think he's genuinely concerned for us and will be going to great measures to make the interview more understandable for us nonJapanese members. I don't think they considered Abyssea a failure in the sense that we took it as, but rather as something that would be difficult to outmatch and therefore, have decided to take a completely different turn because of it. They also seemed upset at how powerful atmas and abyssites had made us, so maybe that was their biggest concern.

[Ravenmore]

That just makes them look even worse if they couldn't see how strong atmas or the like would make us. Right back to "we don't play our own game". No matter how they spin it they are so out of touch at this point as a whole the writing is on the wall. The player base had already accepted that any WS numbers, solos in abyssea was in abyssea and didn't mean much once you left abyssea. It still fels like they are back tracking from the last hurrah feel of abyssea over powering.

[Meyi]

That just makes them look even worse if they couldn't see how strong atmas or the like would make us. Right back to "we don't play our own game". No matter how they spin it they are so out of touch at this point as a whole the writing is on the wall. The player base had already accepted that any WS numbers, solos in abyssea was in abyssea and didn't mean much once you left abyssea. It still fels like they are back tracking from the last hurrah feel of abyssea over powering.

No, I think the * bullets were from the article's translation to which they were referring to. It's not that atmas made someone too powerful or just right, but that they are more concerned with future development being weighed against Abyssea and being judged by Abyssea's standards.

[Seriha]

I don't think anyone really expected Abyssea itself as the form of new content, but it seems weird for them to imply they learned from it and tailored Voidwatch around those errors, only to pretty much have it blow up in their face by disregarding one of the most dominating aspects of Abyssea in that effort is actually rewarded.

In the broadest sense, VW did further expand the proc system, taking us beyond a small party having all triggers covered at the expense of the majority of other jobs. However, just because a given job has a unique ability or two doesn't automatically make them desired by players. This is further confounding by their thought that there are currently no weak jobs and that recent nerfs have been justified in reigning back those they feel too powerful. Players with a good knowledge on how jobs currently fare, especially without Atma holding them up, will more than likely disagree with this sentiment.

I dunno. People still want answers about the new WS and their justifications for sidegrades/weaker WS. VW will never be as popular as it could be if they maintain poor drop rates and/or refuse to implement a point system. There are still jobs out there who need help, to be more than just a trigger spell or ability. There is still the issue of trials being unreasonable grinds, maybe even taking matters away from player effort toward how big your wallet is. People do want more stories.

Continued ignorance of these pleas have nothing to do with Abyssea directly. However, it does add fuel to the fire of a lingering sense of disconnect, especially if the interview itself was translated properly. Ultimately, I fear some kind of censorship coming from this as a result, where details expressed on the JP side might be omitted from other languages. Or worse, the rare interview is so watered down and lacking with substance that it would be no real loss if it never happened.

I don't know if the Japanese have an equivalent phrase to "Actions speak louder than words," but what hits the game is representative of the dev's thoughts. In absence of more frequent discourse, game changes are the only communication we get, and it's painfully one-sided. We're mean because we're mad. We're mad because we feel ignored. These are issues that can be fixed, but blaming it all on a mistranslation just emphasizes the current disconnect.

[Runespider]

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/forum.html?forum=10&mid=1324903542301021635


Mizuki Ito made a thread saying the contents of the interview were mistranslated by whoever posted it for Japanese players, which set off some crazy "sh*tstorm." He says someone irresponsibly posted a slipshod version, basically.

To help clear this up, I went through and did a quick summary translation. I'll keep an eye on the thread a bit to field any questions you might have, as well.

---

First, he addresses the idea that the devs think Abyssea failed.

Ito says: This quote is taken out of context. Abyssea wasn't all successes. The problem is the Abyssea created a rift between itself and other content in terms of play and price. Abyssea was an overall success, they agree, but it brought up some key issues they need to address in existing content and keep in mind for new content.

Then questions concerning the current state and issues involving Voidwatch were translated to give opposite meanings.

Ito says: The issues concerning the Voidwatch drop system were raised, and they will be adjusted. The pros and cons are being debated.

Next, players got the impression that devs are saying "players want big mobs over story, so let's focus on Voidwatch."

Ito says: This was again taken out of context and the meaning was completely reversed in translation to Japanese. The answer was that Abyssea and Voidwatch had focused on battles, and people were waiting for a good story, so they are going to do something different (different than straight battle content)

Lastly, the player who posted the Japanese translation said devs dropped weak jobs in the Dec. update and worked to balance only the strongest jobs. Also, the devs are doing lots of stuff to attract new players.

Ito says: A complete fabrication. At best, he just strung together random words from the article.


Ito goes on to say when interviews like this are done, you cannot simply assume and fabricate what the content is and then present it as fact. Despite the outcry, as far as the original article stands, there is nothing he objects to in terms of what I wrote.

He warns against the problems that machine translation can cause, and says that writers need to accept some responsibility for what they put out there, and readers need to take these translations with a grain of salt.

He also apologizes for not responding quickly enough, but, naturally, he couldn't rush to the forums immediately without understanding the problem. All the while, he's being deluged on Twitter with overly angry and impassioned criticism and questions.

Ito says he is a little disappointed that although they took the effort to create official forums for discussion, things got out of control so quickly. However, he admits that part of this reaction is rooted in a mistrust of the development team, something he genuinely will work to improve.

[Meyi]

Yay, Elmer translated! ^^ Tell him thank you for me on Allakhazam.

[Greatguardian]

So is the complaint about the reverse-translation of the interview from English back to Japanese? Or about the original translation from Japanese to English?

If it's the former, this really doesn't mean anything to the English-speaking playerbase as our translation of the interview was correct, yes?

[Avelonia]

So is the complaint about the reverse-translation of the interview from English back to Japanese? Or about the original translation from Japanese to English?

Yes I'm pretty sure this post by Ito was in reference to the reverse-translation.


the contents of the interview were mistranslated by whoever posted it for Japanese players


Despite the outcry, as far as the original article stands, there is nothing he objects to in terms of what I wrote.

[saevel]

So this is SE tap dancing now that the JP and EN community is starting to get on the same page here. They delete our posts put are quick to answer the JP's. Makes sense considering the NA's can't do jack to effect SE's business operations, but the JP players can interact with the JP gaming community and cause all sorts of press problems over here.

Now to the real question, will they start listening now that the JP's are questioning them? Or will they insist 500 PW kills is "jobs and drops complete".

[Olor]

If they think that the reason we like Abyssea over other content is Atma and feeling powerful - they are nuts (although atma did help fix some serious shortcomings in otherwise lacklustre jobs) - it is the effort to reward ratio - and steady progress over endless RNG

That said - as a BST, having atma show me how crapped on the job was because pets don't usually get buffs - definately did expose how underpowered the job is in normal group content outside of abyssea - but maybe they should work on FIXING that instead of wasting time with the nerf bat.

[Karbuncle]

Really, I'm not entirely convinced whoever is in charge over there isn't just a giant masochist. Just because Abyssea was a great expansion doesn't mean you have to counter-act it with something as incomprehensibly retarded as the Voidwatch Drop rates, and Distribution system.

Its like they enjoy watching us suffer, they enjoy thinking about us screaming at our computer because some pick up guy in full aurore just went 1/1 on a Body you're now 0/182 On. Oh, and he can't even equip it.

It doesn't matter if they realize Abysseas Failings and Successes, Its obvious they've learned nothing from either of them. As far as I'm concerned, this clarification was not needed, as its not like it changes anything. They're still ignoring their playerbases cries when it comes to the flaws of the current system, which is the only thing that matters.

They throw us a bone every now and again for some meaningless content or fix we ask for, to make us think we're making a difference... but really, Has anything of true consequence come from these forums? The only thing i can think of ix 3x ??? for the Abyssea NMs.

Its hard to quit an MMO, you grow attached to your characters, the people you play with, What have you. but its sad to think after 7~8 years, FFXI has become more like a Girlfriend I just don't love anymore, and the only reason I'm staying with her is because I hate being alone more than i hate her.

Give me another good MMO or Single player game though, And I'm dropping it like its hot. Hell, I'm about to cancel this Month just from Skyrim and Saint's row the Third alone...

I hope for FFXI's future, But things do not look good... At all. The Nerfs are back full-swing, the only thing we're truly missing is world-spawn 24-72 Hour NMs to bring back the Bots and E-peen fights between Linkshell to truly ruin this game for good.

=.=

Negative Nancy Aside. Thanks for translating that.

[Cowardlybabooon]

I would like to see an analysis of posts from people saying they hate FFXI now. It seems like its always the same people and they just post a lot.

[Runespider]

I would like to see an analysis of posts from people saying they hate FFXI now. It seems like its always the same people and they just post a lot.

Lots of content with godo rewards to keep you busy (aby) = good.
Tiny amount of new content (reused stuff from abyssea no less) with .0001 drop rates to make you redo it over and over due to a tiny budget = bad?

Can swap those 2 around for people like you apparantely, but most people see things the way I listed it above.

[Nynja]

I would like to see an analysis of posts from people saying they hate FFXI now. It seems like its always the same people and they just post a lot.

Thats because the other ones actually stopped playing and arent around to voice their opinions.

[Luvbunny]

To sums it up:

- generally players want options, a balance between harder content and more casual ones
- players hate the hamster wheel grind of death, abyssea introduced a much better risk/effort/rewards ratio so that you get some things done a little at a time for a much better reward at the end, the grinding is reasonable and you do not need 18 people
- voidwatch is great in paper but poorly implemented, also unless you have dedicated LS, it is a bit harder to progress and enjoy this content since you need clear of each chapter before able to join the battle. They should get rid of this pre-requisite so that all can participate, after all it's a grind to get better gear and you can go 300 battle and get zero drop.
- yes all future contents will be judged against abyssea from now on, it's not a bad thing, it forces developer to actually use their brain cells to come up with something interesting rather than recycle old stuffs/
- SE REALLY NEED TO PUT SOME EFFORT AND ADD MORE FUNDS to FFXI development. Many people, more than FF14 player base, pay for FF11, so we need better content!!

[Avelonia]

I think I'm more upset at the fact when we rage-post, all we get are temporary bans and deleted threads. When the Japanese rage, they get a fancy official post from one of the lead Devs, during a holiday break for them nonetheless.

[Luvbunny]

I think I'm more upset at the fact when we rage-post, all we get are temporary bans and deleted threads. When the Japanese rage, they get a fancy official post from one of the lead Devs, during a holiday break for them nonetheless.

Totally agree - but maybe our rages inspired the other players aka Japanese ones to rage as well - and more raging players mean more heat to the developers. Our rage basically justify the rage for others, even Japanes and EU players, that they are not alone - there are others who feel the same way - therefore more fuel to their rage. Rage on!!!

These days - publicity matters, and bad news spread faster than wildfire, one raging players will rage on 20 other players thus spreading the hate news and further increasing the damage dealt on the company's public image. Bad publicity combined with craptastic product pretty much forced SE to publicly admit the failure of FF14 and worked very hard to reverse the damage. I just wish that they too, take extra careful look on what is happening with FFXI and actually put some more funds to develop new contents instead of churning new IP that is craptacular spectacular. SE has company image to maintain and it used to be associated with great quality games.

[Arcon]

I think I'm more upset at the fact when we rage-post, all we get are temporary bans and deleted threads.

Who got banned? Only people being insulting are getting banned. You can complain all you want, that's why there's a shitload of retarded threads still out, with people like you posting all over it. No one cares. Not even the mods. They're not gonna care for whatever bullshit you think, if it's insulting, they're gonna delete it, if it's just random rage and criticism, they will ignore it. All you're doing is effectively spamming these forums. Congratulations, you may feel special now.

[saevel]

I think I'm more upset at the fact when we rage-post, all we get are temporary bans and deleted threads. When the Japanese rage, they get a fancy official post from one of the lead Devs, during a holiday break for them nonetheless.

It's simple really, the senior executives, team lead members and the developers do not speak English, or don't speak it well enough to read this gamer speech laden forum. They rely on the CR's to translate and submit reports, probably held at weekly meetings where the team leads mostly just dismiss them. The Japanese players on the other hand write in Japanese and thus the seniors can easily read their feedback directly. But most importantly, bad press or some angry foreign fan sites aren't going to impact SE Corporate proper, sure they may make a bad name for SE but only amongst the MMO playing community of FFXI. The Japanese gamers on the other hand will make posts and reports to the Japanese game sites and fan clubs. In Japan that sh!t is taken seriously and bad press on FFXI will make major game reporting news, that in turn will negatively effect the SE brand image in Japan, something the CEO and senior executives will not tolerate. East Asian companies react extremely fast to protect their brand image, but only in their respective country's. I don't expect Samsung to give a damn what Japanese, America or British citizens think about them, but if South Korean's got all pissed you can bet they would rapidly fix whatever the issue was.

In short, no SE doesn't care about us. We don't speak Japanese, we don't post on Japanese forums, we don't interact with Japanese gaming publications. We don't effect their Japanese brand image in the slightest, their senior executives will never read your posts, will never hear what you wrote, will never ever, not even for the slightest moment, know what you think. The CR's do not translate the negative posts, they don't relay the bad news, and in all actuality their probably under orders to disregard all negative responses.

[Runespider]

I think I'm more upset at the fact when we rage-post, all we get are temporary bans and deleted threads. When the Japanese rage, they get a fancy official post from one of the lead Devs, during a holiday break for them nonetheless.

The JP devs can read the forums themselves and see these things, they can't do the same here so it's down to the reps to pick things and for them to them be translated over (translating stuff over is a pain in the ass I guess too). As for the bans/deleted topics etc that's more a fact that the english forums have people like arcon that report people constantly, I don't think the JP players really enjoy that practice as much so you don't see the same kind of problem there.

[Avelonia]

Who got banned?

Several people have admitted receiving temporary bans recently from this forum on other forums.


All you're doing is effectively spamming these forums. Congratulations, you may feel special now.

And what is it exactly that you contribute to these forums? All i see are 1300 posts belittling people who have a different opinion as your own. It's like you come on here just to get off on being some sort of virtuous voice of reason on all things FFXI. I don't need this forum to feel special. I come here to be entertained by the train wreck while I'm bored at work.

[Arcon]

Several people have admitted receiving temporary bans recently from this forum on other forums.

It was rhetorical question. I answered it myself in the next sentence, if you bothered to read it:

Who got banned? Only people being insulting are getting banned.


And what is it exactly that you contribute to these forums? All i see are 1300 posts belittling people who have a different opinion as your own.

Then you're either blind or didn't read my posts. Or you don't understand them. I believe it's the latter.

I don't care for different opinions. I care for bullshit. If someone comes here and says "I like Abyssea" I will say "Hey, good for you! Want a cookie?", however, if they come and say "Abyssea was good and the old game was bad and now the devs aren't listening to us anymore!", that's different. That's not you expressing your opinion. That's you stating assertions about the game, which can be debated. And I will debate them.

People like you think everything they say is an opinion. That's garbage. If people are being retarded, I will try to straighten them out. Sadly, in this forum that's quite a bit of work, but I'm not easily discouraged.


I come here to be entertained by the train wreck while I'm bored at work.

Good for you. The first opinion you have expressed in the last few posts. Which is why I won't argue it. I will, however, point out that you calling me belittling of others' opinions, yet yourself admitting you come here to "be entertained by the train wreck" doesn't exactly put you in a strong moral position over me.

[Runespider]

Arcon

You're a very angry person Arcon, it's the holidays...go get drunk or high..or something XD


People like you think everything they say is an opinion. That's garbage. If people are being retarded, I will try to straighten them out. Sadly, in this forum that's quite a bit of work, but I'm not easily discouraged.

You think you are fixing peoples views but you don't actually understand that people can't argue without someone to argue with, you are actually giving us all someone to argue with and make our random rantings on the forum more entertaining. Keep up the good work mr angry arcon! :D

[Avelonia]

Then you're either blind or didn't read my posts. Or you don't understand them. I believe it's the latter.

So you're subtlety calling me a idiot, touche!


I don't care for different opinions. I care for bullshit. If someone comes here and says "I like Abyssea" I will say "Hey, good for you! Want a cookie?", however, if they come and say "Abyssea was good and the old game was bad and now the devs aren't listening to us anymore!", that's different. That's not you expressing your opinion. That's you stating assertions about the game, which can be debated. And I will debate them.

Fair enough, but there is a positive way to debate things without sounding like a condescending douchebag. It honestly makes you no better than the people you go after.

[Arcon]

You're a very angry person Arcon, it's the holidays...go get drunk or high..or something XD

I'm not nearly as angry as I seem on here. I'm kinda like Avelonia, just bored and nothing else to do. Also, I'm not here to argue with you. You're either a troll or an idiot, either way I know I won't convince you. But my conscience won't let me just stand by and let you spew your bullshit without any opposition. It's for people with half a brain who come here to find out that this forum isn't just populated by retarded baboons like the FFXIAH, BG and ZAM forums so unanimously say.


You think you are fixing peoples views but you don't actually understand that people can't argue without someone to argue with, you are actually giving us all someone to argue with and make our random rantings on the forum more entertaining.

Good to know this is also just entertainment for you. Either way, that's bullshit, as usual. You were ranting long before I came along and will rant long after I've given up. You say I'm angry? Deflect much? You're the one starting thread after thread (which get deleted time after time), ranting, rallying and insulting people on the development and production team. Call me angry if you want, you're obviously not any better.


Fair enough, but there is a positive way to debate things without sounding like a condescending douchebag. It honestly makes you no better than the people you go after.

Probably, but I'm not out to win a popularity contest. If my bullshit radar goes off, I will call people out on it, regardless of how it makes me seem.

There's also a subtle difference. I know it won't make it any better either, but it's a matter of who deserves it. I'm kind of an eye-for-an-eye kinda guy. If people are being insulting, stupid and stubborn about it, I have no issues being insulting, stupid and stubborn about it in return (although I try to avoid the stupid part wherever I can). I'm more than capable of arguing normally (and agreeing normally, as strange as it may sound sometimes), and I will show respect to whoever is respectful towards me and others. He's not one of those people. Simple as that.

And here's the thing: if we knew for a fact that Tanaka is the evil guy Runespider believes him to be, I would have no issue with this whatsoever. But it's not a matter of opinion that his arguments are retarded. He doesn't even argue when I call him out on it, if that's a sign of anything. Yet he keeps going on and on about it, making new threads several times a week, with absolutely the same content, only to shut up again when I tell him how stupid he is (or when they get deleted). And then he turns and says I'm angry or whatever and thinks that makes him more popular or whatever (well, I guess he is, given the likes on his posts), but worst of all, he thinks it makes him right. Which it doesn't. He's a sad little boy who got his toys taken away, and he's angry about it, so he comes on here and rages about it. I only wish mods had a strict bullshit policy, then he would have been gone long ago.

[Runespider]

He's a sad little boy who got his toys taken away, and he's angry about it, so he comes on here and rages about it. I only wish mods had a strict bullshit policy, then he would have been gone long ago.

I'm not angry at all and I don't think my posts ever reflect anger unlike you, I get a bit irritated after a marathon run at VW with no drops but not angry. I leave that to you, I still laugh when you get really angry and spout hippy! like some old war veteran or something.. XD

I post here ultimately because I have a lot of time invested in the game and I care about how it evolves, I want the game to be the best it can be for me and everyone else that plays it (I know you agree on some things with me, ie VW loot systems etc and not on others, thats fine). Old FFXI won't make FFXI more successfull (lets agree to disagree on this but most agree with me on that), I don't want to play another game because none of them appeal to me and as such since we have an avenue to communicate with them about what we like and dislike about FFXI we will use it.

Ultimately what we post has almost no impact on anything aside from the our fellow posters, it just makes us feel better about our respective views. I've long since come to terms that that the JP players are the decision makers in terms of player views..luckily most of them seem to have similar views to those of us that aren't happy about recent developments.

Also I don't think the guy you mentioned is evil but I know his ideas are outdated, unpopular and generally not nice for players, judge people on what they put out last (ff14).

[saevel]

Dealing with Arcon is simple, click his name then click "ignore this poster", *poof* problem solved.

[Gouka]

Thank you, saevel. You have saved me the tedium of scrolling past long-winded, pointlessly angry posts. Now I just have to scroll past a couple of lines and know that I'm still not missing anything.

[Xellith]

Here is a picture for your enjoyment.

http://i172.photobucket.com/albums/w13/Xellith/TANAKAtombstone.jpg

The dev team knows what we want but to give us what we want would compromise their skewed views of "balance". "balance" being content that takes years to complete just so they do not have to add newer content.

[Lokithor]

The dev team knows what we want but to give us what we want would compromise their skewed views of "balance". "balance" being content that takes years to complete just so they do not have to add newer content.
This. The main issue I have with the current game is a lack of new content. Love it or hate it, Abyssea was an absolutely massive amount of new content with a very high degree of participation that has kept players busy for quite a while. My concern is that the new content now is very thin and the developers are taking care of the "keep players busy" part simply by adding low random drop rates and absurd requirements for repeating the same event over and over to accomplish the goals. I prefer the former style but SE seems to not want to make the investment.