[dev1057] Limbus renewal

[ThaiChi]

Let's get this started. First things first, take off the 72 hour cooldown. I really don't know where else I'd like to go from there. I guess perhaps Artifact +2. Dusk-Dawn restriction taken off Ninja Kyahan +1? {Yes, Please} -- well that's just one thing (I'm personally a bit envious of the THF/RNGs in my LS with Fajin boots), in light of the upcoming revamp to Relic Armor. Updated Homam/Nashiera would be great too. Hopefully something a bit less tedious than having to hunt someone down and put our Limbus gear into a synergy furnace. Some new purchasable items with Ancient Beastcoins would be welcome as well, I'm honestly amazed that ABCs still sell on Quetz, there's really nothing to buy once you've gotten your Brutal, Boxers, Loquacious, and whatever job associated earring you chose to have. Charger, Jaeger, and Gunner's Mantles have been severely outclassed by Atheling, Terebellum, and Libeccio. Maybe if you essentially paid Sagheera in ABCs to upgrade Nash/Homam a la AF+1 style?

[Xellith]

Sagheera: "I gotta send this to the near east. Shipping costs 20 whiteshells please!"
Me: "Whats the name of your contact in whitegate?"
Sagheera: "Why?"
Me: "It will cost me 300 gil and 20 mins to take it myself - so the name please".

I think that EVERY time I've ever upgraded anything...

[Runespider]

Limbus is already extremely low manable, inluding bosses. Since the idea of the level cap increase was to make this more viable I don't see they can do to make limbus matter again anymore. If they add moee floors for alliances again it defeats the point of the excuse for the level cap increase in the first place.

So much for waves of new content at 99, they are just gonna rehash all the old stuff they made invalid increasing the level cap in the first place. "Brand new" 99 content, Einherjar (cheap rehash), dynamis (cheap rehash), VW (rehashed aby nms/proc system with horrible loot allocation design to artifically extend it's lifespan) and Limbus (cheap rehash).

[Rezeak]

I'm sure SE will have problems with congestion for limbus but i have only one suggestion

Atma weapon ^^

[Vold]

I'm honestly amazed that ABCs still sell on Quetz, there's really nothing to buy once you've gotten your Brutal, Boxers, Loquacious, and whatever job associated earring you chose to have. Charger, Jaeger, and Gunner's Mantles have been severely outclassed by Atheling, Terebellum, and Libeccio. Maybe if you essentially paid Sagheera in ABCs to upgrade Nash/Homam a la AF+1 style?Just shows the truth of the matter, there be many players out there per server and they all have their personal goals. It's why I stress the fact that Empyreans are not as common and as easy as people on internet forums seem to think. Just about anyone who spends their time around forums are hardcore enough to care to do it, and there's many thousands more that play that never touch the forums or they do but never open their mouths. They'll never enjoy the fruits of an ultimate weapon, or +2 Empyrean armor, and any really great armor, and are forever doomed to being the laughing stock of BG threads and the like. Because they have real lives that dictate their time far more than FFXI can.

There's not a day that goes by that I don't feel guilty as hell for being enough of a loser that I'm as far progressed as I am in FFXI. But I shrug it off and push forward. I'll just say that my hats off to people who win at life and perhaps someday I'll join them. Until then, there be gils in them there mountains that need to be farmed.

[brayen]

New limbus areas, artifact+2, new items bought with ancient beastcoins, and removing the long re-entry.
Frankly updating limbus should not take much to revamp, as it was a great event back in its time. Never needed an alliance to work on it but at the same time an alliance can speed things up(collecting chips in alliance). Personally i hope they add enough to it without forcing another terrible proc system.

[Aarahs]

Add upgrade items for homam/nashira +1 from the opposite weapon so people must defeat both for full upgrade, then include +2 in new areas. Also, some kind of new use for the currency should be implemented.

[Ophannus]

Make the chips able to be turned into Chip Fragments with which we can Synergize Augment Nashira/Homam. I'd rather have individual and customizable augments relevant to the type of chip used similar to how the augments on Kirin gear depends on which sky god scrap you use. So Smoky Chip Fragment would add DRG relevant augments to Homam and Magenta could add THF stats to Homam etc. Having a generic +1 upgrade means the stats will be pretty static and probably low and situational like an additional 5HP/MP and a few points of Acc or M.acc on the pieces rather than potentially awesome augments like Jump TP Bonus or Store TP etc.

[Mahoro]

Just shows the truth of the matter, there be many players out there per server and they all have their personal goals. It's why I stress the fact that Empyreans are not as common and as easy as people on internet forums seem to think. Just about anyone who spends their time around forums are hardcore enough to care to do it, and there's many thousands more that play that never touch the forums or they do but never open their mouths. They'll never enjoy the fruits of an ultimate weapon, or +2 Empyrean armor, and any really great armor, and are forever doomed to being the laughing stock of BG threads and the like. Because they have real lives that dictate their time far more than FFXI can.

There's not a day that goes by that I don't feel guilty as hell for being enough of a loser that I'm as far progressed as I am in FFXI. But I shrug it off and push forward. I'll just say that my hats off to people who win at life and perhaps someday I'll join them. Until then, there be gils in them there mountains that need to be farmed.

While I understand (hope?) that you are speaking in generalities, I would hope that not everyone who reads these forums (if they are even on here and not out "winning at life") thinks that one must sacrifice real life to have "an ultimate weapon, or +2 Empyrean armor, and any really great armor." If the revamps to the game have resulted in anything, it's rewarding a more casual playstyle.

[Registeel]

First things first, take off the 72 hour cooldown.
Yes, yes, yes please. I cannot support this enough! I've been trying to get the limbus mats for +1'ing my Ninja Chainmail, but bad luck has left me waiting on the accursed 3 day cooldowns.

[Unleashhell]

Long as they don't do anymore proc systems I'll be ok with w/e changes happen. So tired of the proc system for every... single.. event... >.>

I'm hoping they don't ruin the game any further making Limbus Salvage Einherjar with proc systems.

[Dreamin]

No worry, I'm betting Tanaka will. Because they wanted to get back to the glory days of HNMLS where all events are 12-18+ ppl with only a few selected ppl ever getting anything decent with long time sync.

Granted, I must say having loot being completely randomly dropped into ppl's pool is such a great idea. I did VW Qilin last night, 1 person got another boots...which is great except that it's his 5th boots that he has to let dropped to the ground. Everyone else? ton of Logs and Ores. Thank you for that wonderful loot, SE. Another 18x2hr (4 run including travel/gather) time wasted.

Score: SE +1, Playerbase -1.

[Atomic_Skull]

Add upgrade items for homam/nashira +1 from the opposite weapon so people must defeat both for full upgrade, then include +2 in new areas. Also, some kind of new use for the currency should be implemented.

better yet add new armor sets that use the homam and nashira as base pieces but with new skins enhanced original stats and new stats added.

[Atomic_Skull]

Make the chips able to be turned into Chip Fragments with which we can Synergize Augment Nashira/Homam.


NO NO NO!!!!


NO MORE SYNERGY!


FOR THE LOVE OF ALTANA NO!

[Insaniac]

I'm fine with synergy as long as it's a recipe for new armor and not a random bullshit augment system. Homam body + random assortment of chips = something new. AND NO HQ VERSION OF THE SYNTH!!

[Ravenmore]

All they should do is reduce the soap time and be done with old content. How about some new story lines with new areas and new events. They really did mess up big leaving 75 cap for so long.

[Runespider]

First things first, take off the 72 hour cooldown.

Bear in mind that limbus is not instanced, when it was popular it was quite common to not only be unable to do the zone you wanted but any zone at all, due them being already taken. Now that it's very low manable it would be even worse if it became popular again with low cooldowns.

I can see them possibly going the way Dyna is now with it (making it an open zone), cause it's easier than the alternatives.

[Rie]

Not sure how open zone would work, since there's different conditions for how to be able to go up to the next level, and if you end up having to wait for certain mobs to repop, you'd potentially waste a lot of time if there's a soloer fighting it, or if they're just killing slow for whatever reason. That's assuming they don't change the criteria for 'winning'. Although I guess they might just revamp everything completely and have the first mob always open Vortex.

Another thing I was thinking about is that a lot of the pulls are designed so that you have to time it correctly to not link the mobs (of course that doesn't matter if you have more than 1-3 people, but I'm picky!). I know it's dumb, but that's one of the things I enjoy about Limbus, having to think about your pulls rather than just diving in, head first. I think an open zone would ruin some of this, and just make it another 'pull all nearby mobs and AoE them for max effect' event. If I want that, I go to Abyssea.

I didn't like the idea initially of open zone Dynamis, but it works out pretty well if you just check the zones before picking one and being flexible on which mobs you kill, because every BST in the game and their mothers (guess that makes it a duo, or a trio if you count Dipper Yuly) are out there soloing since they like to fight 5+ at a time, not leaving many for other people unless you like to jack their mobs (I don't, I won't even camp the same mob as someone else unless they specifically say it's fine with them) Anyway, apologies for the slight derail, I'm just tired of BSTs.

I don't know if they could make it instanced easily, but I think it should have been instanced from the start, given the sometimes annoying waits for RDM/NIN's at 75 who liked to take their sweet time. It seems to always be the (inefficient) soloers holding people up!

Also, I do hope they add new items to purchase from Sagheera or just find new uses for them. ABC prices have dropped pretty low on my server. Last time we sold ABC's, we had about 150, it took a few days to sell at 5k and the person buying was someone trying to re-sell for 8k. As far as I know, they're still trying :D

[Quetzacoatl]

I had a thread about revamping limbus entry that got some attention, and here were my ideas:



I believe it would be nice to see the 3-day entry limit removed and reset at every JP Midnight like Dynamis. Reasons being:

• Opens up more casual activity and small-group activity, especially for players who don't have Linkshells for the event.

• Allows unpenalizing solo play for players who want to run on their own time. Player Died? They can try again tomorrow instead of waiting for 3 painstaking days.

• Not many people touch Limbus anymore, merely because it's either already been done by higher-tier groups, further dividing the audience who want rewards from Limbus and people who already have them.

This event should be more available to those who want to participate, especially since I see a lot of friends of mine who can't find a group worth their life for Limbus. This was always a noticeable problem and it would help to enjoy the game a little more. The other part to this change would be to reduce the cost of the Cosmo-Cleanse from 15,000 gil to 5,000 gil. If Limbus is done actively, it would cost the same as if you were buying the Cosmo-Cleanse after you waited for the entry restriction to be lifted. However, If resetting the entry time to JP Midnight is not an option for balance purposes, I would like to suggest an alternative option.

• If Entry Reset at JP Midnight is deemed imbalancing, at least keep the Cosmo-Cleanse available for purchase after the time the player last entered a zone and reduce the cost of the Cosmo-Cleanse to 5,000 Gil, but lock out a specific area if they win or lose for 3 days. For example, if a player wins/loses SW Apollyon, you will not be able to enter again until the next 3 days.

Those were just some ways to adjust it, and let's face it: the 72-hour cooldown is pretty disabling in this time of the game.

[Dragonlord]

My idea for making content relevant to 99 is basically making HQ versions of the events. In other words, for limbus, keep the current system for those who want to lowman coins/wins for omega/ultima. But, upon entering you're given an option "Would you like to enter the lv. 75 area or the lv. 99 area?"

Lv. 99 would be the same zone, with different lv mobs geared to a party or more of lv 99 players that drop items needed to HQ homam and nashira. Say 1 item comes from the apol/temenos regular zones, and the second item drops from the HQ omega/ultima. And you need the coins from the HQ zones to pop the HQ NMs of course. They could also make HQ ABCs and offer lv 99 gear for them from sagheera.

I would like to see this remain instanced but with 3 or so iterations of each zone similar to BCNMs. Whether this is possible currently, I'm not sure. But reducing the 72 hour entrance to a daily entrance and keeping it as a single instanced zone simply wouldn't work if the HQ homam/nashira was worth getting.

[Zinato]

First of all, Limbus has always been my favorite endgame event both 75 and beyond. I am hoping something I say sticks and prevents a future disaster.

The major point I want to make is with little exception (and ill cover that) the Limbus that we know should stay untouched. By all means, add new zones of a higher level, dropping better items, with bigger better bosses. But, do not change what is currently available. (and personally i think the system even in new zones should stay intact)

First off, the maximum duration of Limbus ranging from 60-120 minutes is directly in line with the current Dynamis and should not be changed. Dynamis gained an adjustment since it was unrealistic to low man/solo for 4 odd hours, and this was compensated by a reduced entry time. This leads into #2, while a 3 day wait period is somewhat obnoxious, I am willing to bet if we saw a reduced wait time we would also be penalized by a shorter run duration. As a side note, with very rare exception a player should not be in a situation where Reraise is not available, this should not be an issue.

The second thing i wish to cover is the instanced nature of the zone. As things stand Limbus zones are rarely occupied and assuming all new content is placed in new zones, this should remain the case. Opening up the zones to multiple players could result in a lack of enemies to defeat, competition for chests, and well as require respawning enemies for farming/floor transfer purposes. The floors are very large not like a full Dynamis zone, and if you have ever tried to farm memories back at 30 cap with other people in the zone, you will understand why open zone is not acceptable.

Last thing I wish to mention is the soloability of current Limbus. Even at 75 many zones could be low manned with a select group of jobs. Now nearly every job can earn a decent sum of ABCs in many of the zones. Increasing enemy strength and adding enemies will very likely hinder that aspect of Limbus. More importantly the introduction of ANY form of proc or trigger system will almost certainly hinder that aspect. As I stated nearly every job can make use of Limbus at this time, however if a proc system was introduced it would reduce viable jobs for currency drops. Take Dynamis for example, were it not for procs any job could enter and gain benefit from the drop rates of currency. However, since currency is dependent on how you attack specific enemies (not to mention your ability to gain time extensions) players have found specific jobs such as bst, dnc and blu can gain 100-200 pieces of currency with ease. To the contrary, jobs like pld, war, smn, drg, nin and even thf in many cases find themselves with much lower overall currency. (I chose those jobs to list since many of them are common solo jobs I have seen in Dynamis) Therefore much like Abyssea, many jobs have been alienated from enjoying the event to its fullest. (Excuse me while I go level bst.)

Hopefully, this information will help prevent Limbus from gaining a disadvantageous overhaul, since once it has been implemented, there is 0 chance of a reversal. Bottom line is Limbus has nothing wrong with it so there is no need to fix it. I understand the one thing players want is a reduced wait time, but as I have stated that will not come without penalty, if it does GREAT (Limbus fixed time to move on) I fully endorse it. If it lacks purpose add something that uses the items within Limbus or bought with ABC to give it purpose, but do not change the event itself.

TL;DR Limbus is fine as it is, please do not reduce low man/soloability or add procs.