Summoner's Magic Skill

[solodragon1984]

I was looking at the Skills for Summoner and I noticed something very off why do we Smn only have a A- Rank in Summoning and that's our Main skill we do yet White Mage has A+ in Healing and Black Mage has A+ in Element Magic and Red Mage has A+ in enfeebling magic and that's their main casting now the sub casting for Whm, Blm and Rdm are different class for me like enfeebling magic,enhancing,healing,divine,dark yet we Summoner got screwed with our A- Rank in our Main Skill and yet I've been seeing ton of Smn subbing Whm so they can Main Heal ; ; yeah sometimes a Smn can make do but when that Smn trys to Skill-up their Skill the party don't like it.
Sorry for long Ranting but this is a good topic that needs to be Set out there so that other people can think about it.
I was looking at Bard and they even got Screwed when it came to their magic skills Singing,String,Wind all C Rating and that's is Their Main Skill which isn't right for both jobs cause that is our Main skill yet it's low

[Kaych]

In previous FF-games, there has been the jobs Summoner and Evoker.
Summoners summoned the Avatar and had them fight next to you. Evokers summoned the Avatar for one big attack. I think SE was thinking ahead when they made the job Summoner. They may have made room for the job Evoker in the future and that they were gonna get A+ ^_-

(But then again, it is SE. They arent always the brightest:)

[Sargent]

I was looking at the Skills for Summoner and I noticed something very off why do we Smn only have a A- Rank in Summoning and that's our Main skill we do yet White Mage has A+ in Healing and Black Mage has A+ in Element Magic and Red Mage has A+ in enfeebling magic

I'm gonna start by saying I'm all for additional Summoning Magic. However, it's simply not needed for Summoning Magic. Summoner is the only job which utilizes Summoning Magic, the skill differences were designed to make one job more proficient at a certain skill then others (i.e. WHM having a higher Healing skill than RDM/SCH, RDM having a higher Enfeebling skill than BLM), and it is the same with Combat skills. Do note, Summoning Magic is not the only magic skill that caps across all jobs at A-; Ninjutsu, Dark Magic, Divine Magic and Enhancing Magic are affected by this.

[Babekeke]

And with regards to BRD, their skills are added together, so using a horn = singing + wind. This is why theirs is so low. It's done like this to encourage the use of instruments, and to give /brd a dam good gimping.

[Sickel]

I was looking at the Skills for Summoner and I noticed something very off why do we Smn only have a A- Rank in Summoning and that's our Main skill we do yet White Mage has A+ in Healing and Black Mage has A+ in Element Magic and Red Mage has A+ in enfeebling magic and that's their main casting now the sub casting for Whm, Blm and Rdm are different class for me like enfeebling magic,enhancing,healing,divine,dark yet we Summoner got screwed with our A- Rank in our Main Skill and yet I've been seeing ton of Smn subbing Whm so they can Main Heal ; ; yeah sometimes a Smn can make do but when that Smn trys to Skill-up their Skill the party don't like it.


You get an A+ for talking without stopping for breaths.

[Malamasala]

And you are all ignoring that the only thing that matters (except for siphon) is skill over cap, from items. So even if SMN had 0 skill in summoning magic, we'd be equally good thanks to armors and merits. The system actually makes A- the third worst grade we could have, until Siphon was added.

[Soranika]

Unless I'm mistaken, they've adjusted how summoning magic effects buffing Blood Pact: wards as far as duration is concerned, without worry of being undercapped thanks to level increase, such as Hastega lasting 5+ mins instead of 3. Summoning magic also reduces spell interruption rate of summoning, which is useful when catching surprise aggro and needing something stronger than elemental spirits to take stronger hits for you to get to safety or defend yourself with a counter attack.

Given the next MP boost trait, without summoning magic gear or the ones that increases potency of elemental siphon, the amount restored can negligible with low summoning magic, increasing reliance on your subjob for MP management. But even go so much to say that SE has already increased the capped on how much MP you can get back from elemental siphon some time ago.

A- isn't horrible as was considered during the early days for summoners, but I suppose it's really odd if you're looking at it from more than just a numerical standpoint. How could we not be masters of our own and only native magic?

[Malamasala]

You could also wonder how you get so good at summoning, but can't even cast stone or cure on your main job. It is like we skipped all basic magic school and just read crazy mythical books.

[gheldhart]

From my experience, there is so much more equipment out there that add to summoning magic skill that it really doesn't matter. My summoner at 95 (uncapped skill) has 430 summoning magic. I think i'll eventually cap around 450ish, so I don't see the A- as being a problem. Especially considering how little it really affects summoners. I'll admit, it is nice getting about 500mp back with elemental siphon...but aside from that it's not all that great. If you are playing the job effectively you wouldn't need that 500MP in a pinch anyways.

If summoning magic skill affected more than siphon and buffs it would be worth while to look into increasing the skill level to A+, but I don't see that as very probable given SE's summoner history. Something to consider... If you are in abyssea and doing 5K damage with a blood pact, sure it may not be as frequent as say a black mages Blizzard V, but you aren't going to suffer the brunt of the attack after you land the spell, not to mention no magic aggro. There are negatives and plusses to summoner, it's all about utilizing the job effectively given the situation you are in. Summoner is not a job for a magic spammer, or a WS spammer, it takes actual contemplation and skill to be a good summoner.

[Mirage]

It doesn't even matter. What does matter, however, is how slow it levels up. That should be fixed.

[Sargent]

It doesn't even matter. What does matter, however, is how slow it levels up. That should be fixed.

Spam nukes/debuffs on EM+ mobs, capped mine very quickly doing Voidwatch.

[Soranika]

It's easier for us long time SMN to cap it over some one who burned the job. But... that's always been the case. I've been only touching my SMN for Voidwatch since 90+ level cap but smn magic raises every time. 2 levels away from cap.

[Dreamin]

Easiest way to skillup: spam BP against NM mobs. I find the Abyssea VNM T1's the best to do this against (or just go solo other Abyssea NMs). And rage usually gets better chance of skillup vs ward but spam both.

[Soranika]

Easiest way to skillup: spam BP against NM mobs. I find the Abyssea VNM T1's the best to do this against (or just go solo other Abyssea NMs). And rage usually gets better chance of skillup vs ward but spam both.
Astral Flow spam during besieged is still a good way to skill up if skill level is still near, if not over original 75 cap. Past that, normal mobs and NMs till the 90 cap then VW 95+

[Dreamin]

agreed if only besieged happened more often though. my suggestion on using Abyssea VNM T1's is just that they're very easy to get at and die very quick and offer a quick and sure ways to get skill without having long travel (tree) or wait (besieged).

[Dekusuta]

I'm fine with skill, but I feel like there's a cap to the acc bonus for rage, and too much of it is still abstracted.

With empyrean set bonus, I've made the trade off to switch out my accuracy pants to just full timing +2 legs; maybe that will change again when we get relic +2s, but that's about it for now.

I wish summoning skill also buffed avatar stats. 5 skill over cap = +1 to all stats? and skill over cap = extra HP. Things like that with a direct noticeable effect would be great.

[Malamasala]

5 skill over cap = 1 DA would be nice. Or 1 haste. Stats play so very little role (Even if it plays more than attack)

[Dekusuta]

5 skill over cap = 1 DA would be nice. Or 1 haste. Stats play so very little role (Even if it plays more than attack)

Stats like STR/AGI/DEX/INT will matter on bloodpacts. And from a gameplay point of view makes sense. Higher skill = stronger avatars.
We can quibble over formulaes obviously. 5 skill = 1 or 2 = 1? That will make a difference.

I also suggested applying skill over cap directly as an HP bonus to the pets.