2 Hour....Part Deux?

[Wolfandre]

Ignoring the fact that Overdrive is awful and SE shouldn't even start a sentence pertaining to new 2hrs without considering changing it....


What do we want? I've heard talk of x3 Maneuver effects (personally, what Overdrive should include...), dual puppets, more personal control over the auto (like, access to JAs that control magic use, WSs, etc.)...

I'd personally love something, ANYTHING, that didn't only prove useful during G5 fight. Amirite?

So. I'll pose the question again:

What do we want?

[Kristal]

Use the two empty spaces where players have ranged/ammo, one of which could be an Overdrive Attachment slot.
Overdrive effect could then be altered by an attachment giving Full HP, Full MP, Full TP, Cool Down, Attack++/Accuracy++, Defense++/Evasion++, Magic Attack++/Magic Accuracy++, Capped Haste/ Capped Snapshot/ Capped Fast Cast, etc.

The other could be an Elemental Core, giving one extra capacity to a specific element.

[Zhronne]

I'm at a loss of ideas atm.
Whatever they do I hope they'll "fix" Overdrive as well. Atm Overdrive should rather be a 20m cooldown JA rather than our 2hr.
A cool idea would be to have a 2hr that gives different effects according to the currently called out Automaton.

[Dfoley]

Sense they are meritable I would assume they start off at decent, but you have to pick (between 4) on which 2 you want to max.

Duration is as follows 15s at rank 1 then 30/45/60 seconds
Maneuvers are disabled for the pet ones.

Ranged - Reduces ranged delay (range attack every 8/4/2/1 seconds), increases acc and the damage every shot does by (x2/2.5/3/3.5)
Melee - Adds double attack (15/25/35/50) haste (25/40/65/80) and acc/atk (50/100/150/200)
Nuke - All spells are mana free and have no cool down. Each rank adds MAB /MAC (25/50/75/100)
Master - Makes maneuvers last until the 2hr wears off, and will not be consumed during WS. The master shares the attribute bonuses from the pet associated with maneuvers. AKA Fire - Thunder -Wind => Master has + atk +ws dmg +haste +double atk etc.

I would personally go 4/4 master and 2/4 ranged 2/4 spell

[Nezha]

Please, dear God, let this 2 hour summon a second automaton pet... With increased merits it could lower the time it takes to use the Job ability again. You could technically make your own party with your pets: Valor Edge (Tank), Master (DD), and soulsouther (Healing)... The combinations would be endless... Creating controls for two pets at a time might be hard, but you could target a pet specifically when using manuevers, or the manuevers you use could apply to both pets which might be a good consequence for having two pets out.

[Annahya]

I think it would be interesting if Overdrive was altered to give the Automaton its "job's two-hour" based on the head that is equipped.

For instance:
Harlequin Head - Hundred Fists(?)
Valoredge Head - Invincibility or Mighty Strikes
Sharpshot Head - Next /ra opportunity is an Eagle Eye Shot
Stormwaker Head - Chainspell
Soulsoother Head - Next curing spell opportunity triggers a use of Benediction
Spiritreaver Head - Manafont

As for additional two hours, I just don't see a second automaton to be a likely outcome. If I had to guess, and this is complete speculation based on what my feelings say about SE's thought process:

There could be one option where the master is enhanced by the puppet; another where the puppet is enhanced by the master; and a third that does the other things that Overdrive was rumored to do, but SE would not have included due to imbalance.

Totally fabricated theory 2-hours:
Embodiment - Through concentration, the puppetmaster is able to infuse their automaton with his or her own essence. Until the duration of Embodiment expires, or until the Puppetmaster takes any form of damage, all effects of enhancing magic, enfeebling magic, equipment, cruor buffs, atmacites, etc. are applied to the puppet. (In effect, your puppet is wearing all your gear, and has your buffs/debuffs).

Coordination - The automaton begins a routine of harrying, confounding and distracting an opponent instead of harming them directly. This allows the master to take greater advantage of their opponent. Until the duration of Coordination expires, all auto-attacks an automaton makes inflict 0 damage but give an opponent Harrying Daze. This daze effect allows the automaton's master to build, with each successful attack, their accuracy, evasion, critical hit rate and critical hit damage. (Think the opposite of an effect like Enlight, where instead of decaying, the more successful hits you get in before the effect ends, the greater the effect becomes, until some cap is reached).

Invigoration - By adding a secret ingredient to their Automaton Oil, a puppetmaster can invigorate their automaton and unlock previously unused potential. Upon use, this job ability consumes an Automaton Oil, and until the duration of the effect expires, each Manuever will be multiplied by the exceptional quality of the oil consumed (+2 Oil will result in each Maneuver counting as two, while +3 oil will make a Maneuver count as three). In addition to this, each weaponskill performed by the automaton will recieve a TP Bonus effect equal to the exceptional quality of the oil times 66 (0/66/132/198).

I make no pretense to the balance of these ideas, I am merely putting them out there because I think they are interesting, and feel in line with some of the changes they have made to Wyverns over time. I have included a complimentary grain of salt with which one can take them.

---Edit for somthing I forgot---
I honestly do not believe, unless SE has said otherwise, somewhere, that meritable 2-hours will allow us to purchase more than one.

I honestly think that it will play out something like (stated from a PUP perspective):

Merit Category 3
Overdrive Recast Timer: 0/5
Second Two-Hour Option 1: 0/5
Second Two-Hour Option 2: 0/5
Second Two-Hour Option 3: 0/5

I just think we are going to be allowed one new two-hour; and by placing a merit into one, we will lock out the other two until the value is lowered back to zero. I also think the recast timers of the old two-hours will be meritable so that we still only have one two-hour ability that represents kicking it into high-gear.

I cannot say that I have anything more than a gut feeling that this will be the case, and I fully admit that I could be wrong, but I honestly believe that this is what is going to happen.

We will be allowed to tailor our character to be a bit closer to our own preferred playstyle, by selecting which path we want our character to take with their new uber-ability - I just hope that they choices are balanced enough that there is a little chance as possible for one to be the hands-down best that you are an idiot for not choosing.

[Wolfandre]

Now, I suppose limited thinking led me to believe most people wanted a second auto to come out, do a combo attack with the master/first automaton, then leave. But that's an interesting twist. 2hr = second automaton, much like Call Wyvern used to be DRG's 2hr. I like it. I could really get behind that, and you're right: the drawback is split attention. Maneuvers apply to both autos.

I love the idea. With the upcoming changes to attachments, puppets could be a viable tank (notice I said could...gtfo plds). 2hr pops out Soulsoother and you have a self-contained party, with the master controlling the enmity flow. If that were the case, I could consider fully meriting Ventriloquy to lower it's recast. Add on the fact that Soulsoother will be able to buff via Prot, Shell, Stoneskin....I'm really excited for this. This could make things really interesting.

Adversely, you could go full DD with Sharpshot and Spritreaver. Granted, the maneuvers would be difficult to match up, but I'm sure there would be a way for us to make it work. Imagine pounding out Armor Shatterers and Thunder Vs, while still meleeing and putting out decent master numbers. It would be really difficult to get the hang of, but that's what makes PUP so fun.


Or...what about a 2hr that let us swap gear attributes? Kinda like 'Turns all magic stats into their melee equivalent and vice versa.' Then we would have a use for all of the laughable pieces we get put on. C'mon. Let me turn all that MATT, MND, and Fast Cast into ATT, STR, and Haste. Or, hell, give it to the auto.

I suppose what I'm really getting to, is PLEASE give me a reason to use Maneuvers. Kthxbai.

[Wolfandre]

---Edit for somthing I forgot---
I honestly do not believe, unless SE has said otherwise, somewhere, that meritable 2-hours will allow us to purchase more than one.

I honestly think that it will play out something like (stated from a PUP perspective):

Merit Category 3
Overdrive Recast Timer: 0/5
Second Two-Hour Option 1: 0/5
Second Two-Hour Option 2: 0/5
Second Two-Hour Option 3: 0/5

I just think we are going to be allowed one new two-hour; and by placing a merit into one, we will lock out the other two until the value is lowered back to zero. I also think the recast timers of the old two-hours will be meritable so that we still only have one two-hour ability that represents kicking it into high-gear.

I cannot say that I have anything more than a gut feeling that this will be the case, and I fully admit that I could be wrong, but I honestly believe that this is what is going to happen.

We will be allowed to tailor our character to be a bit closer to our own preferred playstyle, by selecting which path we want our character to take with their new uber-ability - I just hope that they choices are balanced enough that there is a little chance as possible for one to be the hands-down best that you are an idiot for not choosing.

I honestly don't believe we will get any recast changes. As it currently stands, Evoliths and Synergy are the only means we have at shortening 2hr recasts. SE, or at least the original Dev. Team, was very big on the 2hr being the paragon at what the class did, and that it should only be able to be used at long intervals. 2hrs are sacred. Proof to that is where they have only ever changed or modified two 2hrs in the game's history.

The fact that they are adding new ones does not support my theory, but having one 'true' 2hr (strinctly on a two hour recast) and one modifiable one is viable. Since we can already shorten our current 2hrs, that is the one I see them reducing.

However, I agree. Choices would be amazing, as long as the options offer truely differeing playstyles. Take BLU and it's merit abilities. If a BLU came up to you and told you that he had 5/5 Monster Correlation merits, what would you do? Laugh, most likely. There is one way, and only one way, to squeeze the most of out merits, in most cases, and you are considered 'lol' if you pick any other. Merits are supposed to be 'spec paths.' They aren't. They're just additions to your character that have good choices and awful choices.

[Nezha]

As for additional two hours, I just don't see a second automaton to be a likely outcome.


I wouldn't be so quick to assume what SE might or might not do. They've obviously showed us that they can go any way they want to with Puppetmaster after seperating spell timers and adding enhancing magic which is a totally new and job changing concept from how Puppetmaster has previously worked. Asking for 2 two pets isn't that much; afterall, we're supposed to be puppetmasters. Having two pets would first continue the whole concept with Ovjang/Mnejing (If I spelled that right) from the ToAU storyline, and it would estrapolate on the concept of puppetmasters being one of the better solo jobs because we'll be able to create our own parties with 2 automatons.
The 2 hour would be much like Dragoon's old Call Wyvern 2 hour as Wolfandre said, and they could also create a new set of pet job abilities like Deploy II, Retrieve II, Activate II (The 2 hour), and for manuevers you could either target a pet specifically with manuevers or have the manuevers apply to both pets if you don't target one.
*They could also use the same concept of paradigm shifts from FF13 where you can create different battle stances between the two pets. Using "Tactical Paradigm" might call forth White mage and Paladin pets, using "Magical paradigm" might call forth two black mage pets, and using "Melee Paradigm" might call forth two ranger pets.
- This would involve the concept of saving attachments, though, so you could easily switch between different pets fast.
- Another idea this brings to the plate is the fact that Ob can switch between frames during battle. I think Square Enix should give us something that allows us to switch from something like Ranger frame to White mage frame in a click of a button (Without using deactivate/Activate). This would help with paradigms because we could switch 2 pets all at once by clicking and paradigm during battle.

[Daniel_Hatcher]

This is SE so it'll be.

Merit Category 3:
Selecting one job will block all remaining jobs. Cost 20 Merits.
Puppetmaster 0/1
Red Mage 0/1
Blue Mage 0/1
etc....

[xbobx]

Please, dear God, let this 2 hour summon a second automaton pet... With increased merits it could lower the time it takes to use the Job ability again. You could technically make your own party with your pets: Valor Edge (Tank), Master (DD), and soulsouther (Healing)... The combinations would be endless... Creating controls for two pets at a time might be hard, but you could target a pet specifically when using manuevers, or the manuevers you use could apply to both pets which might be a good consequence for having two pets out.

Please god let it not be two automations, a second automation is a stupid idea.

[Kristal]

Please god let it not be two automatons, a second automaton is a stupid idea.

Not to mention difficult to control. I could imagine some kind of tag team, when you only directly control one maton at a time, but then you still need to manage two kinds of automaton equipments somehow.

I wouldn't mind some kind of arcana fellow though.. perhaps summon a spheroid, pot, doll, ghrah or acrolith (depending on ammo item). Not so much as a new 2hr, but a PUP-only gear enchantment. (Obviously most of the same rules as fellows apply, so only one fellow, doll or magian trial book at a time. But not the party size limit.)

Hmmm.. as a real 2hr, perhaps one of the caturae as an automaton (Void Activate).. depending on the frame in your maton equipment window, you'd get a different one.

[Annahya]

Not to mention difficult to control. I could imagine some kind of tag team, when you only directly control one maton at a time, but then you still need to manage two kinds of automaton equipments somehow.

I wouldn't mind some kind of arcana fellow though.. perhaps summon a spheroid, pot, doll, ghrah or acrolith (depending on ammo item). Not so much as a new 2hr, but a PUP-only gear enchantment. (Obviously most of the same rules as fellows apply, so only one fellow, doll or magian trial book at a time. But not the party size limit.)

Hmmm.. as a real 2hr, perhaps one of the caturae as an automaton (Void Activate).. depending on the frame in your maton equipment window, you'd get a different one.

I've got it! A new frame!

The "Ethertreader Frame" which is a summoner. That way, you could activate the automaton, and depending on what Maneuvers you put up, he could possibly listen to you and maybe summon a corrosponding critter (Caturae, elemental, avatar, whatever). Then the corrosponding critter could maybe listen to your Automaton's commands, or possibly ignore them and blindna the automaton, or silence some crabs.

We would be totally combat ineffective, but we would have two pets, and we could point and laugh at our automaton...
"NOW YOU KNOW WHAT IT FEELS LIKE YOU STUPID GIT! BWAHAHAHAHA..."

In all seriousness though, people mentioning Ob's ability to hotswap frames is interesting. Because of managing attachments, perhaps changing traditional frames in mid fight would be rough - but maybe a new "super frame" could be switched to during a new two-hour?

I hate to compare our pets to many children's cartoons about furry-gladiator-slaves, but many of the iterations of that genre have temporary "crazy battle modes" that their critter changes into for several seconds of intense action. So, maybe soemthing like that, where we two-hour and the Automaton does the spin-dance and blinks out, returning as "Crazy-vampire-tank-dramatically-named-transformer-deathstar-frame MCXLV-4000?"

[xbobx]

Why not just have our two hour call forth the Blue Fairy and turn our puppet into a real boy.

[Annahya]

I wouldn't be so quick to assume what SE might or might not do. They've obviously showed us that they can go any way they want to with Puppetmaster after seperating spell timers and adding enhancing magic which is a totally new and job changing concept from how Puppetmaster has previously worked. Asking for 2 two pets isn't that much; afterall, we're supposed to be puppetmasters. Having two pets would first continue the whole concept with Ovjang/Mnejing (If I spelled that right) from the ToAU storyline, and it would estrapolate on the concept of puppetmasters being one of the better solo jobs because we'll be able to create our own parties with 2 automatons.

I do want to point out that I stressed that everything is pure speculation - and my assertion that I find it unlikely, to the point of dismissive, that we will recieve a second automaton is not "quick" or uninformed.

Primarily, the story about the bond between an Automaton and its master would be a bit thrown to the curb by allowing a second puppet. Yes, there is the sticking point of the Aht Urhgan Mission NPC (I will not go into detail for spoiler-sake), but I feel that this is adequately separated from players as a special case scenario. To give us two puppets would, in spirit, belittle the relationship we are supposed to share with our little, disobedient, razza-fraggin... /trails off

Secondly, I find it highly unlikely that we will be given a second puppet because of the coded command structure. I do not think SE will add /pet2 or the like, just so that our two-hour can give us a second pet, and I do not see them hammering some other way to make it happen. Why do I feel this way? SMN/PUP cannot have two pets out. DRG/PUP cannot have two pets out. PUP/SMN cannot have two pets out. BST/PUP cannot have two pets out. (Continue ad nauseum) Yes, you can have a pet and an NPC, but these are two different concepts. NPCs do not use the /pet command at all. One could argue that you don't use the /pet command for Wyverns, but those are in the pet "slot" as they use the <pet> tag.

Thirdly, in response to the concept of building our own mini-parties for solo purposes, SE has already established that they agree that a pet job relying on its two-hour to summon one of its basic functions was a bad idea for DRG - as they moved the pet summoning to a non-two-hour and replaced it. If they wanted to move PUP into a mini-party capacity, I doubt it would be done in the form of a two-hour. If they wanted a limited window of power afforded by a two-hour, and were going to use an additional automaton to provide it, perhaps we would get something akin to Odin, where an uber-auto shows up and explodes or something. If we were supposed to manage two puppets and form mini-parties, which I also think is incredibly unlikely based on the above, it would be done in the form of the elimination of Deus Ex Automata (which would no longer be needed and, frankly, overpowering) and the addition of Activate II (and all other derivative /jas).

Two-hours aside, the coding necessary to provide a duplicate set of /jas, or even changing the existing /jas to target <pet1> and <pet2>, makes me think that there is little chance of this happening.

Besides, there is much more precedent in the game for SMNs being able to have an elemental, and an avatar, in play. PUPs have one NPC with two automatons. Random SMN mobs (in content like Limbus) will have an elemental out while idling, and then summon an avatar during the fight without having to give up their elemental. I don't see SE doing this without also giving SMNs, a second pet - especially since SE knows that SMNs already feel ignored. And for that matter, why not give BSTs the ability to Call Beast and still use charm?

All in all, I just think there are way too many concerns for it to be considered an educated guess that we will recieve a second automaton.

Yes, SE can do whatever they want. They could add flying chocobos. They could give every job dual wield as a native trait. They could add five more jobs to the game. They certainly could allow us two have two automatons if they wanted to.

I just don't see any of those things as likely, and I don't think I am "quick to assume" anything by saying such.

But, again, all that said, I opened with the concession that it is all speculation until the rubber hits the road.

[Annahya]

Why not just have our two hour call forth the Blue Fairy and turn our puppet into a real boy.

/em imagines having to do a questline, with lengthy CS farming, where our Automaton runs off with a shady con-man, we are eaten by a whale, and...

/em shudders and walks away without responding.

[Wolfandre]

I do admit, the in-game reason for having the second automaton would be funky. Automatons are expensive. There's a naked Hume in Aht-Urghan somewhere to prove it. We salvaged ours from Lamia infested stinkholes. It was probably one of the ones the Lamia stole, and is likely a murderer. (Wouldn't it be some amazing irony if it was the original Valkeng?)

Anyway, we would need a reason for having the second automaton.

But, now that I'm thinking of it, the current Dev. Teams cares nothing for story, as seen via Abyssea (seriously, how many times do I need to travel ALL THE WAY to Hall of the Gods just to have my ass kissed?), so the opposite it just as likely.

In all honesty, I don't see the second automaton being difficult to code at all. Make it so that, like what was said, maneuvers are shared. Limit it even further by not being able to equip the same attachments on both autos. Sound fair now? The object of the in-game puppetmaster was so that the master and automaton work in tandem, but the master controls the puppet, thus splitting his attention between himself and it. Being a true puppetmaster, one at the top of his prime (lvl 99...), you might think he could control multiple puppets.

Sorry for not using quotes. Have to get this response in fast. In regards to mob SMNs and BSTS: mobs and players have always been different. Mob, as well as auto, ranged attacks are seens as abilities. Mob pets are seen as 'assisting' the mob, not actually under their control. Mob BSTs don't use Sic or Heel or Stay. They are two seperate entities that share hate (in most cases). When monsters use Astral Flow, they are actually calling their avatar to deal some damage, not just being assisted by that avatar.

A good example is Dynamis. Beastmen summoners have Avatars out fulltime. The monster doesn't use Astral Flow: the avatar uses it's Astral Flow ability (Diamond Dust, etc.) at a specified %, much like the primes. NPC Fellows act the same way. Following this rule, having a second pet, no matter what job, is doable. PUP seems like a good choice for that job, in my opinion.

I personally hope we don't get another 'super-awesome-happy-fun-time automaton of death' move. Overdrive II is not the solution to our problem. And you all know what happens with big, one hit moves: need I remind you how really awesome EES and Odin are nowadays?

We need something different. BLUs are gunning for full spell list usage, or at least from what I've seen. What can we come up with that is akin to that in power, but not overly silly?

Sorry for not contributing anything definitive. I'm just offering counterpoints where necessary, and I wanted to know what everyone felt. Keep it going, guys!

[Shotaro1]

2 Automatons, no thanks. Silly idea.

Change Harlequin to a more mnk type job, so we can cover a variety of jobs. Mnk, rdm, blm, whm, rng, pld(war-ish).

Then, as someone mentioned, change Overdrive, to give the respective 2hr to the Auto.

Hundred Fist, Chainspell, Eagle Eye Shot, Invincible (or Might Strikes), Mana Font, Benediction.

Me likey this idea.

[Wolfandre]

Feel like arguing the point of wanting/not wanting a certain 2hr proposed? You know, instead of just saying 'nothxkbai,' and actually contributing to the conversation.

Also...


Ignoring the fact that Overdrive is awful and SE shouldn't even start a sentence pertaining to new 2hrs without considering changing it....

...this isn't an Overdrive thread. There's millions of those elsewhere. I wanna know what the PUP community wants for their SECOND 2hr.

[brayen]

2 Automatons, no thanks. Silly idea.

Change Harlequin to a more mnk type job, so we can cover a variety of jobs. Mnk, rdm, blm, whm, rng, pld(war-ish).

Then, as someone mentioned, change Overdrive, to give the respective 2hr to the Auto.

Hundred Fist, Chainspell, Eagle Eye Shot, Invincible (or Might Strikes), Mana Font, Benediction.

Me likey this idea.

Sorry but mnk would be a horrible idea, it is meant as a beginners pet, it has all 3 skills and is poor at all 3. If anything you would need to entirely rework the frame to make it viable. I am fine for letting it collect dust to be honest unless they have the time to rework the frame entirely on its skill and such.

While the idea of a respective 2hr based on frame it seems a bit pointless, as spells are on a timer and eagle eye shot sucks.

I would like to see something of the likes of boosting all parameters, resetting activate timer, 0 overheating, enhanced attachment effects to a level of a "4th" maneuver when one maneuver is used and making all attachments active at a 3 maneuver static by just having overdrive active. additionally longer duration<this is a must>. basically what overdrive is doing now but to a degree where it will actually be noticeable.

[Shotaro1]

Sorry but mnk would be a horrible idea, it is meant as a beginners pet, it has all 3 skills and is poor at all 3. If anything you would need to entirely rework the frame to make it viable. I am fine for letting it collect dust to be honest unless they have the time to rework the frame entirely on its skill and such.

While the idea of a respective 2hr based on frame it seems a bit pointless, as spells are on a timer and eagle eye shot sucks.

I would like to see something of the likes of boosting all parameters, resetting activate timer, 0 overheating, enhanced attachment effects to a level of a "4th" maneuver when one maneuver is used and making all attachments active at a 3 maneuver static by just having overdrive active. additionally longer duration<this is a must>. basically what overdrive is doing now but to a degree where it will actually be noticeable.

Your right about Harlequin, but I still would like to see the respective 2hrs. Using a new OD will bypass the spell recast timers, for chainspell to work, Mana Font idk, maybe it will force the auto to use only elemental magic spells while active, and reduce the spell cast time to something where we can see it use at least 2-3 spells while under MF. EES is not omgwtf, but its not absolutely terrible. A new mnk style frame would be cool though. Cant have everything, if you dont like EES, dont use the rng frame lol.

Boosting parameters on OD is also a cool idea, not gonna knock it.

But idk, with the versatility, and options pup is supposed to provide, not everyone will be happy with having OD being one way or the other, cause IMO there are many ways it can be changed to.

[Annahya]

Sorry but mnk would be a horrible idea, it is meant as a beginners pet, it has all 3 skills and is poor at all 3. If anything you would need to entirely rework the frame to make it viable. I am fine for letting it collect dust to be honest unless they have the time to rework the frame entirely on its skill and such.

While the idea of a respective 2hr based on frame it seems a bit pointless, as spells are on a timer and eagle eye shot sucks.

Also, keep in mind that in my "respective two-hour" suggestion, it was based upon the head not the frame. This was specifically because of the concern you raised. It offers the Harlequin head as a viable tactical option for the other frames by making Hundred Fists available for fights where you know you will want to two-hour; Seal/Crest NMs, force pop NMs, WoE, what-have-you.

Just pointing that out, incase it was missed.

But, as others have mentioned, this is supposed to be a thread about the new two-hours. My OD suggestion was originally in response to others discussing it, not an attempt to derail this topic.

[Shotaro1]

Oh no I didnt mean to derail the topic, my bad.

As for a new 2hr for pups, I've always liked the idea of gaining the abilities the auto has from the attachments for like ~5 min or so. Like a sub menu would be available with the list of abilities available through the equipped choices of attachments, and you can use them if you have the required manuevers and what not. Though I think the RNG ones, and Nuking ones would be useless. The DD based ones, and Curing/Refresh (if you sub a mage job to cure) would be cool. Like Flame holder, if you have Fire manuevers up, you can use that ability, it erases the fire manuevers, and when you WS, you will gain added ws atk. Some would be just job traits added to your list of traits of course (Tension Spring, Vivi-Valve, Accelorator), and some would be a flat out JA you can use.

Idk, crap idea maybe. Or maybe that should be like some 20 min recast JA we get, that would be cool to.

[Wolfandre]

No worries, guys. In retrospect, I took on the role of 'HOW DARE YOU DISCUSS SOMETHING ELSE ON MY THREAD?!?' My apologies, and thanks for the input.

I like the idea of gaining attachment stats via maneuvers and whatnot. With the upcoming overhaul to attachments, I could see that being a huge boon. x3 Earth Maneuver would get us a hefty -PDT that we can't get via gear. x3 Fire Maneuver could get us some major ATT from Tension Springs and Attuner, as well as some Store TP? Hell, Haste from Turbo Charger if you were really hurting for it. Ohhh, what about Optic Fiber? Lot's of things to discuss there. I like it.

However, like you mentioned, it would only be useful on Valoredge and possibly Sharpshot. Unless using it also gave us magic skills (and a chance to use all that mage gear!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! >.> ), mage frame usage is out. SE has a bad habit of not giving us something if it only benefits part of the job, too, so I don't know if they'd do this or not.

[Theytak]

To be honest, I think they should just admit they love us, and change the effect of Overdrive to this:

Overdrive:
Duration: Instant Recast: 2:00:00
Deactivates the automaton if active, and then activates an Automaton from another dimension to perform a powerful attack. The Automaton activated varies with the player's level, and amount of raw fighting spirit.

Level 1~15: Activates Gurren Lagann, who proceeds to throw its sunglasses at the target, and then punch them with a drill.

Level 16~30: Activates Gurren Lagann, who will then execute GIGA DRILL BREAKER

Level 31~45: Activates Dai-Gurren, who will then summon Team Dai-Gurren and swarm the target

Level 46~60: Activates Dai-Gurren, who will then Launch Gurren Lagann, pierce the heavans, fuse with the moon to become Arc Gurren, and launch righteous drills of manly justice at the target, completely destroying them, as well as all other hostile targets in the zone.

Level 61~75: Activates Super Galaxy Dai-Gurren, who will launch the RAGE MODE BADASSERY versions of Team Dai-Gurren, and proceed to destroy any and all monsters within the same region as the player

Level 76~90: Activates Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann, who will hurl several galaxy-shuriken at the target, and then proceed to instantly kill every monster within the region the player is in, and all connecting regions.

Level 91~99: Activates Super Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann, who upon being activated, will cause all monsters in the game of Final Fantasy XI to instantly die, including Pandemonium Warden and Absolute Virtue, and also any unintelligent player, and any player who is not able to handle the sheer manliness exuded. After using this technique, the puppetmaster will erupt into an explosion made of pure awesome, fighting spirit, manliness, and GAR. The player will then find their real life body compelled to leap into the air and scream with all their might, after which the credits will roll, and all players will be informed that the puppetmaster has just completely won FFXI forever. Then their computer will explode just like their character, Sage Sundi will appear and hand them a set of full scale, fully functioning automatons, and the puppetmaster will be asked to spread the good word of he who gave his life for us. Kamina.

I think that sounds like a pretty reasonable 2hour for pup.

[tendo64]

I always thought it would make for a cool idea to have the 2hr assimilate the Automaton into the Puppetmaster (or I guess vice versa could work), adding its stats (or at least boosting) to yours and giving you access to all of the abilities and attachments it would have in its current state. Meaning you could cast all the spells of the Spiritreaver on command, boosting your MAB like crazy with Ice Maneuvers as normal with Loudspeakers. You could use Barrage when you wanted, and use the Flame Holder and be able to choose your weaponskill--Arcuballista {{No thanks}}. Oh, and Shield Bash on time for once. It would have to be pretty uber to have a short duration as usual. Having an effect of constant 3 Maneuvers of all types would help for sure.

[cmontee]

I think a good pup 2hr would be to keep what it is now and add that you can choose what it does for the duration. like spells cast and weapon skils used. and maybe a special ability :)

[Kristal]

What if we took a page out of SMN's book, and have the ability to summon special pets during our 2nd Two-Hour? You would have a choice of a Chariot, Iron Giant, Catura or Acrolith, and each would have massive HP, MP, TP and enmity gain during the PUP's Two-Hour. After the Two-Hour ends, they lose their Regen, Refresh and Regain, but still remain in the field until deactivated, destroyed or zoned. Repair can be used to recover HP, but they have no self-healing.

But it'll probably be a more mundane Two-Hour, where all attachments function as if 3 maneuvers were present, for a whopping 60 seconds. Perhaps with a 80% reduction in maneuver recast, so you can spam them back to back.

[Dfoley]

I want alexander as a pup 2hr, not SMN.... After all it is the be all end all automaton, we might just need a bigger animator though.

If you dont know what i am talking about, stop noobing it up and go play through toau it takes all of 5 days to go start to finish with any 3 man group.

[Kristal]

I want alexander as a pup 2hr, not SMN.... After all it is the be all end all automaton, we might just need a bigger animator though.

If you dont know what i am talking about, stop noobing it up and go play through toau it takes all of 5 days to go start to finish with any 3 man group.

I think you mean the Iron Colossus(Aht Urhgan version.. Olduum one is the size of a city). Alexander is not an automaton, but an astral entity possessing the Iron Colossus.

[Theytak]

I think a good pup 2hr would be to keep what it is now and add that you can choose what it does for the duration. like spells cast and weapon skils used. and maybe a special ability :)

A proper pup 2hour would be a 2 hour that actually had a noticeable effect on every puppet's strengths. The biggest problem with overdrive, in my eyes, is that it doesn't give any casting buffs to harlequin/stormwaker, at all. Nope, if I 2hour with soulreaver out, I get an awesome melee buff!!!.... oh boy...


I want alexander as a pup 2hr, not SMN.... After all it is the be all end all automaton, we might just need a bigger animator though.

If you dont know what i am talking about, stop noobing it up and go play through toau it takes all of 5 days to go start to finish with any 3 man group.

you're confusing the Iron Colossus with the Celestial Avatar that possessed it, like Kristal said ^. That said, the animator that controlled it was the freaking podium Ghatsaad was standing at. Maybe make it so we can't move while the colossus is out, but giving it awesome ranged attacks like missile launchers and lasers. or something.

[Zemarin]

Overdrive: Make it last 30mins... not 30s plz.

2nd 2 hour ability: Automaton blows up doubling everyone stats, hp and mp for 5mins, and doing 5x its hp in fire dmg.

the end

[Kaisha]

I just want Overdrive to make the pet explode. A much more powerful Mijin. I can't say no to a 2hr that gives off some spike damage since anything else you could try to do with your automaton would take too long to put in effect in emergency situations.