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View Full Version : Alchemy in need of new consumables.



Reiterpallasch
10-13-2011, 08:15 PM
Alchemy is (IMO) in some pretty desperate need of new high tier consumable items, namely potions and the like. Aside from a select few recipes (extra emphasis on the few), the craft is damn near useless.

The mass quantity of temp items gained through abyssea, VW, and WoE leaves much to be desired for a craft whose main purpose is to pump out potions. Worse yet, our most powerful crafted potions drop out of FoV and GoV chests like candy from a freshly beaten piñata.

Our most powerful items we can make pale in comparison to some of the temps we can get. For instance:


Max-Potion, lvl 95 synth, restores 500 HP, and gives a medicated effect for 15 minutes.



Lucid Potion I, gained simply by entering abyssea or purchased with a measly 50 cruor, also restores 500 HP and does not have a medicated effect.



Lucid Potion II blows that out of the water with 1000 HP restored, and with VW KI you can actually hold more than 1 at a time.



Lucid Potion III is 1500 HP, several times stronger than our most powerful elixirs (unless your HP is 6000+ anyways)


Some things I believe would help Alchemy once again become a much more useful craft:


Make new craftable items, equal to or greater than temp items in strenght, either through higher skill (if they ever raise it), or via synergy (much easier approach).
Stop making them drop so damn often in chests. Yes, getting healing items in boxes is always a nice bonus to keep you moving along smoothly. But leave it at temps. When every other box is yet another elixir, that's just way too much. I can't recall ever getting an ammo pouch from a box, or armor that didn't suck from any boxes.
Make them stackable. Dear god make potions stackable. No, I'm not asking for some almighty stackable brew you can use anywhere. But SE sort of did this at one point with the "drops" version of potions, which A: left you medicated, and B: went no higher than the hi-potion variety. Sweet! 110 HP once every 5 minutes!

And that's just the beginning of it. Yes I know almost every craft needs something new to breath life into it (except you goldsmithing, @#$% you for being the main craft in 90% of all the good synergy recipes) but we gotta start somewhere.

Thoughts, opinions, anything to add? Hopefully if people have some good ideas, a dev at SE will read it, Tanaka won't read it, and we'll get something good out of the deal.

Zarchery
10-13-2011, 11:21 PM
Well I'm a diehard alchemist. Have the skill at 100, plus the Smock, Caduceus, Mitts, Ring, and Belt, as well as all the furnishings (Alchemist's Stall and Alchemist Signboard look really cool together) and all the key items. I fondly remember madly synthing silent oils for weeks to save up 5 million gil for some Cross-Counters back in 2005. I also remember I made a killing on those same silent oils when the price went up to 50k per stack right after TOAU came out.

I still make some pretty sweet profits off the craft though. I don't know exactly how much good it would do us if we could synth things like Lucid Potions and Lucid Ethers and various potions. I never really use them. Ethers and elixirs restore too little HP and MP for their usage time. Actual healers, or DNC sub, does a better job than potions, and in Abyssea (even without martellos and temp items) MP is never an issue.

Maybe a better solution would be meds that cure status ailments, or meds that give stat boosts. I don't have any ideas off the top of my head, except that greatly reducing the absurdly long medicated status you get from Icarus Wings.

Shadotter
10-14-2011, 01:26 PM
I really think they need to buff the standard potions and ethers we have at the moment, the reason nobody uses them is because you could get a +3 Hi Ether and still only get 90 mp. Maybe if they were based on your maximum hp/mp instead?

Kristal
10-18-2011, 09:47 PM
Get rid of medicated status on instant-effect medicines such as potions. (With some exception, such as TP wings, where medicated status should be shortened.)
Reduce medicated status to the duration of the status effect granted by the medicine. (Ie, Charisma Potion lasts 3 minutes, but medicated status lasts 15 min... make that 3 minutes.)


Yes I know almost every craft needs something new to breath life into it (except you goldsmithing, @#$% you for being the main craft in 90% of all the good synergy recipes) but we gotta start somewhere.


The whole crafting system needs to be overhauled, so it would be better to do it all at once.

MDenham
10-18-2011, 10:11 PM
Reduce medicated status to the duration of the status effect granted by the medicine. (Ie, Charisma Potion lasts 3 minutes, but medicated status lasts 15 min... make that 3 minutes.)Hell, if the reason for the medicated status is to make it balanced with a JA doing the same thing, even five minutes for a 3-minute medicine would be fine. (Actually, 5 minutes on a 3-minute medicine seems about right from a balance standpoint.)

The adjustments to it I'd suggest:

* Colored drops: No medicated status. They're candy, and they're rare, so they can't reliably be spammed. (Their only advantage over the equivalent stat potion is 3x duration; they give a weaker effect. Black Drops basically only allow you to have two scrolls of Instant Warp on you.)
* Other medicine drops: No medicated status, to bring them in line with Ether Drops. (Alternatively, if Ether Drops are supposed to give a medicated status and don't currently, 5 seconds.)
* Hyper Ether/Hyper Potion: 15 seconds' medicated status.
* Pro-Ether: 30 seconds.
* Stat potions: 5 minutes. (Most 3-minute duration effects that aren't food are JAs on a 5-minute timer, so this matches up with them.)
* Icarus Wing/Hermes Quencher: 7 minutes 30 seconds. (Could also be 5 minutes - they're effectively Meditate and Flee in item form - but this seems like a still-balanced starting point to work from.)

Tsukino_Kaji
10-27-2011, 08:13 PM
If they gave you any new potations, they would inevitably have the medicated effect and no one would ever use them. Just be thankful that wings are 20k each.

saevel
10-28-2011, 08:02 PM
Well for starters, make medicines stack-able to 12. Also make Potions / Hi-Potions / Max-Potions restore a set percentage of HP rather then a static number, or create new potions that do this. Remove medicated effects period, their a relic of pre-zilart era FFXI.

In every Final Fantasy that ever existed you could stack medicines and use them as emergency healing / status restoral, why not FFXI?

Tsukino_Kaji
10-28-2011, 08:09 PM
Also make Potions / Hi-Potions / Max-Potions restore a set percentage of HP rather then a static number, or create new potions that do this.They're called elixers. lol
Remove medicated effects period, their a relic of pre-zilart era FFXI.Yes.

saevel
10-28-2011, 08:14 PM
Ok here's something, have alchemy recipes for all those effects that "temp" items produce? Stuff like stalwarts tonic and what have you. Well all except fanatics / fools for obvious reasons. Make em stackable. Also create recipes that reproduce magic spells effects, things like Stoneskin / Blink / Protect / Shell / Phalanx / Spikes. Again stackable.

saevel
10-28-2011, 08:16 PM
They're called elixers. lolYes.

Well I was looking for a way to have potions be useful. Elixirs restore both HP / MP, these would be similar but only restore HP. Or SE could create a new set of items that do 25/50/75 percent restored.

I know they were afraid of people spamming temps instead of using white magic for healing, but they failed to realize the monetary costs of using items for healing, MP is free items aren't. They'd be emergency use only.

Tsukino_Kaji
10-29-2011, 12:16 PM
I would relay like to see elixers stack.

Yandaime
11-04-2011, 11:08 PM
Surprised no one thought of this one yet...

PHOENIX DOWN!! <Yes, Please>

Its not really that necessary with RR Items and Mages and such but it has always been a part of Final Fantasy and would be nice if I could have a few in my pocket cuz I go soloing on a DD job and find a dead guy somewhere more often than not even at 95 and I'm sure I'm not the only one lol.

Oh, and all I ask is that SE please removes that G** Damn spell lock from using Meds such as Potion/Ether/Elixer... I never use the damn things because I cant cast for 10 seconds after using the Item <.<; the Medicated effect is one thing but that spell lock crap has got to go xD

Covenant
11-07-2011, 01:22 AM
I'm in favor of new alchemy items..however, I'm more of the "new effect" family. I'd like more "pet" buff items, job ability adjustment items(imagine a lower recast timers effect), enimity items(both lower and raise), etc.