Abyssea level cap

[FANCY60]

I decided to lvl sch and whm the other day cause my ls members were upset as i had no mage jobs at high levels and all DDs @90. Anyway it was rough the first few levels (1-30)took forever its a ghost town out there for low levels.Your listening to someone who last levelled in the dunes July 2005 so yea it was sad to see fun places like that empty and i was seeking for days before I even got a party @level 10 as I wanted to do it the old fashion way and learn the job as well as have an understanding of it rather than burn it to 90 and have to spend the next 6months skill it up and buying scrolls for it to be any good but i digress. Anyway i believe that abyssea was and still is a great idea but to a point, people abuse it too much and it should stop. Id say a capping its starting point @70 or even 75 would really help the lower level citizens or even people new to the game improve their skills. I'm tired of kids with multiple lvl 90 jobs having no clue how to use them effectively properly cause it was burnt in a FC abyssea party from 35-90 any thoughts

[Leonlionheart]

This again.

[Tamoa]

This again.

What he said.

[FANCY60]

its an ongoing issue though i understand its frustrating but imagine playing this for the 1st time today because even though its a game its also a business for SE, so they do want new players to pay for this. a new player would be completely lost so its an issue that wont go away

[Tagrineth]

Simply put,

it's too late.

[Rearden]

ps2 limitations

[Runespider]

its an ongoing issue though i understand its frustrating but imagine playing this for the 1st time today because even though its a game its also a business for SE so the do what new players to pay for this. a new player would be completely lost so its an issue that wont go away

Grounds of valor fixed the problems, go do that. Biggest problem right now is most peopel still don't know they exist.

[Lynchilles]

So because of the OP's individual experience, SE should change the game for all players on all servers. Got it.

[Aver]

/headdesk

12345

[Kimara]

ps2 limitations
Knew I'd see it XD

[Zagen]

Grounds of valor fixed the problems, go do that. Biggest problem right now is most peopel still don't know they exist.

This. So much this. I took PUP from 22-30 in about 2 hours doing Gusgen GoV Skeletons and people kept showing up some lvl 14 or so, we'd level sync to a lvl 16-18 with a full party the exp was fast.

[Gallus]

I decided to lvl sch the other day cause my ls members were upset as i have no mage jobs at high levels and all DDs @90. Anyway it was rough the first few levels (1-30)took forever its a ghost town out there for low levels.Your listening to someone who last levelled in the dunes July 2005 so yea it was sad to see fun places like that empty and i was seeking for days before I even got a party @level 10 as I wanted to do it the old fashion way and learn the job as well as have an understanding of it rather than burn it to 90 and have to spend the next 6months skill it up and buying scrolls for it to be any good but i digress. Anyway i believe that abyssea was and still is a great idea but to a point, people abuse it too much and it should stop. Id say a capping its starting point @70 or even 75 would really help the lower level citizens or even people new to the game improve their skills. I'm tired of kids with multiple lvl 90 jobs having no clue how to use them effectively properly cause it was burnt in a FC abyssea party from 35-90 any thoughts

boo hoo. cry more. itt: op hasn't tried gusgen gov.

[Rafien]

This. So much this. I took PUP from 22-30 in about 2 hours doing Gusgen GoV Skeletons and people kept showing up some lvl 14 or so, we'd level sync to a lvl 16-18 with a full party the exp was fast.

After the GoV party of amazing exp, shortly after, you spend 10 hours skilling everything up to what it should be.

In the old days, you spend hours grinding away to obtain a level or two, learning your jobs, meeting new people and never having an issue with finding people to help do missions/quests.

In the new era, you spend hours to obtain 10-20 levels, but spend even greater time skilling the things you neglected, never learning your job and will always be bad at it, and complain no one will help you do WoTG, ASA, etc. because you made no friends.

[chubrocka]

I know we have gone rounds and rounds over this, but I agree with OP. Im tired of this game turning into WoW. If you started off playing the game prior lets say 2006 you fell in love with it. Players who started last year or even 2 years ago dont play it for tha same reason we do. I have no clue how to fix it for everyone but level capping abby is a start.

[cidbahamut]

Why won't this thread go away?

[Morier]

First it was if you were power leveled, you were gimp. Then smn burns = gimp then level sync = gimp now abyssea burn = gimp. Get over it, abyssea did not make gimps. Before abyssea even existed at 75 cap there were tons of people that did not know how to play their jobs.

[SpankWustler]

This again.


What he said.


Why won't this thread go away?

Abyssea Level Cap Thread: Collector's Edition

[Zagen]

After the GoV party of amazing exp, shortly after, you spend 10 hours skilling everything up to what it should be.

In the old days, you spend hours grinding away to obtain a level or two, learning your jobs, meeting new people and never having an issue with finding people to help do missions/quests.

In the new era, you spend hours to obtain 10-20 levels, but spend even greater time skilling the things you neglected, never learning your job and will always be bad at it, and complain no one will help you do WoTG, ASA, etc. because you made no friends.

On PUP I'll agree but every other job has taken me much less time to skill up than 10-20 hours. Knowing where to skill up for ranges is key to speeding it up. Also unless you completely refuse to do any research almost every job can be learned by checking wikis/forums for gear ability/spell info. Perfecting the job is the only thing that takes practice.

[Panthera]

Not that this discussion hasn't been done at least three times, but I agree with the OP.

[BorkBorkBork]

Please direct your concerns to the gentleman pictured below.

[Vicious]

Nothing is stopping you from playing the old way. Why don't you guys that agree with the OP all hook up on the same server and go have your SC+MB 3k/hr XP parties in the tree or whatever? You'll all be happy, and we'll be happy because we won't have to listen to your shit.

When you start whining that the devs should change the game to cater to the whims of a very, very slim minority (you), to the detriment of the enjoyment of others (us), yeah, that's when we're going to start disagreeing.

[Zagen]

Nothing is stopping you from playing the old way. Why don't you guys that agree with the OP all hook up on the same server and go have your SC+MB 3k/hr XP parties in the tree or whatever? You'll all be happy, and we'll be happy because we won't have to listen to your shit.

When you start whining that the devs should change the game to cater to the whims of a very, very slim minority (you), to the detriment of the enjoyment of others (us), yeah, that's when we're going to start disagreeing.

Because the reality is they just want to bitch about people getting things done fast while they themselves are partaking in said methods.

[Kensagaku]

After the GoV party of amazing exp, shortly after, you spend 10 hours skilling everything up to what it should be.

In the old days, you spend hours grinding away to obtain a level or two, learning your jobs, meeting new people and never having an issue with finding people to help do missions/quests.

In the new era, you spend hours to obtain 10-20 levels, but spend even greater time skilling the things you neglected, never learning your job and will always be bad at it, and complain no one will help you do WoTG, ASA, etc. because you made no friends.

I won't lie, my immediate response to this was "lolwut." I apologize for that and have prepared a more eloquent reply to make up for it. :(

Anyway, look. The thing is that playing through the old grind paths didn't "teach you your job." Bad players will be bad players whether they went 30-90 in Abyssea or outside, that's a fact. A moderate or higher player should be able to pick up the basics of a job with ease, and then you really can't learn most of the advanced stuff until you hit harder things that force you to figure them out and implement them with any sort of skill. The old grindfests were simply throwing DDs at a party while the bard sang and pulled and slept. RDM or WHM would keep up haste, Refresh in RDM's case, and cures. None of that required much juggling, and the DDs were merely swinging their weapons. There was no "learning" there, merely throwing bodies at things.

As for recapping your skills? I agree, they fall behind easily. It's why I make it a point at ~70 to be modestly geared even in an Abyssea group and try to land hits, get skillups where I can. It takes less time outside to reskill, and if you're not doing anything in the group at the time anyway it couldn't hurt. Magic is even easier - Need enfeebling? Toss bio or dia. Elemental? Stone, Aero, stone, aero. Dark? Drain/Aspir/Stun. Healing and Enhancing are really the only ones that hurt, and even with the old method my RDM's Enhancing Skill is only in the 250s. Healing's at 190s.

Meeting new people? I agree that the old parties forced you to meet so many people because it would take hours to get a single level, and thus god knows how many parties to get to 75. I meet a lot of people via Abyssea alliances or PUGs too (the ones that don't make me tear out my hair so I can't focus, anyway), so it's not like you go without meeting people unless you only stick to your group of current friends.

[Dragoy]

Not that this discussion hasn't been done at least three times, but I agree with the OP.
Me too. The level limit is set way too low and it's never too late for change. ^^

I do miss the old-fashion parties, even though I never did party as much as I would rather fool around soloing already early on. Wasn't so much after the levels then.

And no, I am not saying it should be as 'slow and grindy' as it was.


But yeah, that is all.

[cidbahamut]

Magic is even easier - Need enfeebling? Toss bio or dia.
Knitpicking: bio is dark magic skill, not enfeebling.

Ok, carry on.

[Cronort]

I'm just going to say this as someone who played prior to Abbyssea and lost his account because of retarded things they require you remembering and hoping to keep when moving several times (New player thread tells this in more detail).

Partying up was fun, yes. It still will be. But like you said, it took days to get a lvl 10 party :/ Hahaha. And a person sometimes didn't know how to play a job at lvl 50 or whatever even if they did lvl it from 1 - 50 the hard way. I mean, seriously... There will always be a baddie player. Now, it's up the parties and the person to decide if they'll party with someone who just got themselves PLed. The person should go solo something and learn his ordeals, but perhaps they won't and the people he's with won't mind. It's a just deal with it sort of thing.

[FrankReynolds]

I think they should lower the limit to 20, and add some mobs that are lower level, but give less and less xp / cruor to to you as you reach higher levels, so that by 65-70 you are better off in a regular abyssea group. I wanna see 15 level 25 DDs whacking stuff and getting skillups :P or better yet, just make it like that everywhere outside.

[Kensagaku]

Knitpicking: bio is dark magic skill, not enfeebling.

Ok, carry on.

Whoops. Why did I type that? Bio is dark, I need to re-read what I type.

[Salvation]

Yeah I remember the "good old days" back when every person that had a job at 75 knew it inside and out and there was absolutely no bad players whatsoever....

Of course it typically took anywhere from 3 months to a year to get a job to 75 depending on the job's current popularity. I really don't understand this fascination with getting exp the old way. It was inefficient, incredibly boring, and just plain sucked. All these complaints about Abyssea creating bad players is absolutely unfounded as the mechanics of any job always changed at the level cap. Besides, anyone that needs several months of slow exp to learn how to play a job is probably far too stupid to be playing this game in the first place.

The comments about new players being put off the game is a joke at best. The majority of "new players" are people that are returning to this game after finding out that SE has changed a lot of the content that no doubt caused them to quit in the first place.

[Mookies75]

I should be able to play how I want to play, even if it involves paying someone to get me exp while I do something else.

There is a reason why everyone is doing it... it's better.

[Tsuneo]

I find that people who think speed leveling a job results in sucking at a job actually suck at the game themselves. The game is the way it is now because people choose it to be that way. The way people level isn't forced upon them, so for SE to change anything about Abyssea doesn't mean anything. People will just find the next fastest way to level like Astral Flow burns in the past.

[Leonlionheart]

Life lessons, by the laws of physics

Number 1:

The path of least resistance is always the way water will flow, because it's easiest. People are the same way.

[FANCY60]

Awesome ^^ didn't think this would cause so much drama. Guys just from reading a few remarks i can tell that a lot of you are kids,this is not an arguement about who is right who is wrong or which way is better/ worse. it is just my opinion and it's a way to learn more about what the game has to offer. I'll retort on some of the shocking remarks i have read lol. first of all there are always going to be exceptions in every rule but hands down the best mages i have come across in the 8yrs i've played this game are those that took the job from 1-75 first before taking the job to abyssea ( i do not care or am i bothered how they got there). Not to take anything from those who did an abyssea burn as i have also met a few good ones but majority of white and Red mages i've partied with in all factions of the game are those who mastered it.
as for the issue of those pesky new players, please read before you write rubbish, i've introduced 5 of my friends to the game BRAND new players (please check this lol) not returning or pre-mature players have had trouble progressing through the game as is. three of em are now level 90 without and major missions or quest done. levelling is never the issue of course not because people will find a way to burn and yes there are these new valor options to help but getting skills and quest done hmmm. it is ok when you can skill up for 10-20hrs straight when all you have to do is come back from school and play the game what of others that have families and other responsibilities. (children and bills even not just my mobile phone bill) where is the 10-20hrs or free weekends to do it. Oh sorry boss i'm not coming into work i want to skill up my staff in ffxi lmao. people please grow up those who support this thanks, if you don't, thats fine too but i did not write this statement to aggrevate you i mean why would i do that? if you are tired of reading about the same topic ,it ok say you are, only people that can make a difference are happy that there is still a debate about it and throw in great ideas on the metaphoric table so thats all that matters guys chill out, make love and play ffxi lol

[Zagen]

OMG used the fucking enter/return key ~_~

[cidbahamut]

People who don't have time to play MMOs shouldn't play MMOs.

[Gallus]

Awesome ^^ didn't think this would cause so much drama. Guys just from reading a few remarks i can tell that a lot of you are kids,this is not an arguement about who is right who is wrong or which way is better/ worse. it is just my opinion and it's a way to learn more about what the game has to offer. I'll retort on some of the shocking remarks i have read lol. first of all there are always going to be exceptions in every rule but hands down the best mages i have come across in the 8yrs i've played this game are those that took the job from 1-75 first before taking the job to abyssea ( i do not care or am i bothered how they got there). Not to take anything from those who did an abyssea burn as i have also met a few good ones but majority of white and Red mages i've partied with in all factions of the game are those who mastered it.
as for the issue of those pesky new players, please read before you write rubbish, i've introduced 5 of my friends to the game BRAND new players (please check this lol) not returning or pre-mature players have had trouble progressing through the game as is. three of em are now level 90 without and major missions or quest done. levelling is never the issue of course not because people will find a way to burn and yes there are these new valor options to help but getting skills and quest done hmmm. it is ok when you can skill up for 10-20hrs straight when all you have to do is come back from school and play the game what of others that have families and other responsibilities. (children and bills even not just my mobile phone bill) where is the 10-20hrs or free weekends to do it. Oh sorry boss i'm not coming into work i want to skill up my staff in ffxi lmao. people please grow up those who support this thanks, if you don't, thats fine too but i did not write this statement to aggrevate you i mean why would i do that? if you are tired of reading about the same topic ,it ok say you are, only people that can make a difference are happy that there is still a debate about it and throw in great ideas on the metaphoric table so thats all that matters guys chill out, make love and play ffxi lol

hey it's a giant wall of text. with the advent of GoV, the experience outside abyssea is very similar to dominion ops. you can do a standard party and make really good exp/hr doing so, or you can team up with an alliance and get exp rolling really fast. rather than baw about nerfing abyssea, you should try building a GoV party sometime and spread the word about it.

[AldielQuetz]

The problem is, in a party-based game, you go where the party is, amirite? And when beginning a new game, that's intended to be multiplayer, don't you want to play with other people instead of soloing? I think that if we were to put a level cap on abyssea that the number of new players would pretty much bottom out as well. In short, what we are dealing with are PS2 limitations, plain and simple.

Thank you.

[FrankReynolds]

I don'y have an enter key. (Edited because nobody should be forced to look at this post twice.)

I just ate a huge burrito, and I wanted to punish myself for it, so I actually read that eyeball wrecking post of yours. I have some questions.

1. I have leveled BLM on 3 characters. How would raising the level cap have made me a better player on my 2nd and 3rd time? This just seems like it would have been annoying.

2. If a person gets to 90 in 2 days, and then plays the job at 90 in events etc. for 6 months... and another guy takes 6 months getting the job to 90 the old way. At the end of 6 months.... who do you think will be better at the job at that point...really?

3. If you have all the time to spend leveling jobs the old fashioned way, why don't you have time to skill up? Seems like a wash to me.

[cidbahamut]

3. If you have all the time to spend leveling jobs the old fashioned way, why don't you have time to skill up? Seems like a wash to me.
Because real life card bro.

[Zagen]

Because real life card bro.

That applies to all that time needed to exp the old way >.> which was his point.

[cidbahamut]

Yes, I know.

[Babekeke]

I decided to lvl sch the other day cause my ls members were upset as i have no mage jobs at high levels and all DDs @90. Anyway it was rough the first few levels (1-30)took forever its a ghost town out there for low levels.Your listening to someone who last levelled in the dunes July 2005 so yea it was sad to see fun places like that empty and i was seeking for days before I even got a party @level 10 as I wanted to do it the old fashion way and learn the job as well as have an understanding of it rather than burn it to 90 and have to spend the next 6months skill it up and buying scrolls for it to be any good but i digress. Anyway i believe that abyssea was and still is a great idea but to a point, people abuse it too much and it should stop. Id say a capping its starting point @70 or even 75 would really help the lower level citizens or even people new to the game improve their skills. I'm tired of kids with multiple lvl 90 jobs having no clue how to use them effectively properly cause it was burnt in a FC abyssea party from 35-90 any thoughts

This makes me laugh just because he used SCH as his example... the 1 job in the whole game that really DOESN'T MATTER even half as much as any other job in the game whether your skill is capped, or if it's 0.

When SMN burn was all the rage, and all the salvage cheats got hit by the banhammer, this is the job they all levelled to get back into end-game. The melee equivalent is WAR, due to being able to skill a weapon from 0-cap in less than a day.

[Ravenmore]

Whats funny is the OP has no idea how Sch works any way and knows nothing about how the job works. FYI sch has it made you can be use full with it with 0 skill. The get wonderful little JA that bumps your magic skill up to B skill level for that level no matter you currant skill level is. That makes skilling up so much faster its not even funny. I don't know if you said anything about it in that eye bleed wall of text but really 5 mins on wiki you would know that.

[Eric]

Not only that, but since's SCH's native magic skills without Light Arts or Dark Arts are all D level, which means that you have considerably less skill ups to get on top of the fact that you start at B skills.

[Babygyrl]

I decided to lvl sch the other day cause my ls members were upset as i have no mage jobs at high levels and all DDs @90. Anyway it was rough the first few levels (1-30)took forever its a ghost town out there for low levels.Your listening to someone who last levelled in the dunes July 2005 so yea it was sad to see fun places like that empty and i was seeking for days before I even got a party @level 10 as I wanted to do it the old fashion way and learn the job as well as have an understanding of it rather than burn it to 90 and have to spend the next 6months skill it up and buying scrolls for it to be any good but i digress. Anyway i believe that abyssea was and still is a great idea but to a point, people abuse it too much and it should stop. Id say a capping its starting point @70 or even 75 would really help the lower level citizens or even people new to the game improve their skills. I'm tired of kids with multiple lvl 90 jobs having no clue how to use them effectively properly cause it was burnt in a FC abyssea party from 35-90 any thoughts

I know some people feel this topic is like beating a dead horse but i completely 100% agree with you. I would really love to hear why exactly SE thought it was a good idea to let level 30 jobs into abyssea when they are completely useless at that level to begin with. Abysea has made everyone LAZY because of this.. grand it i love abyessa exp for 75 + it really is great.. but they should have never let anyone below 75 in to "leech".. it has essentially broken the game.. everyone has a matts cap now, and i am sure hardly anyone who has one even remotely knows how to play 90% of those jobs. But whats done is done and i doubt SE can go back and change it without half the people rage quitting over it... I miss the old party exps for the level 50-60s especially..

But seriously, to the moderator staff, What was The logic behind letting 30+ jobs in to Abyssea? Is there a specific reason we haven't discovered other then leeching exp yet? Just curious.

[Merton9999]

Man I really wish we didn't have cars. It was sooo much more rewarding to travel when you had to feed your horses and smell their butts on the long and fruitful journey to your destination. Progress sucks.

I swear I think all the people who want to go back to the old level grind would have us buying arrows and ninja tools the same we we bought potions in the original NES FF1 - one at a time. Now that was some challenge!

Seriously, there is a lot to enjoy in this game now. SE finally fixed the old and boring system that prevented us from enjoying it on any job we want.

The Abyssea burn = bad player nonsense is a mistake of correlation vs. causation. Yeah you can burn a job in a day or two and yeah there are bad players. Did the burn cause the bad playing? Maybe for some, but for most they would have been bad anyway.

[Nefertiri]

The minimum level of 30 for abyssea was indeed a terrible idea, this isn't how I wanted to level...but whatever, there's no going back now. Suddenly raising it to 75 out of the blue, after well over a year, would do nothing to reverse the process and only alienate those who didn't access the content in time. Please let it go.

That said, what I would like to see is a little bit of consistency. Might as well remove the minimum level requirement as it makes no sense in an entirely different context as mentioned above. What's a level 30 player going to be able to bring to Abyssea that a level 1 player can't? All they're going to do is leech all the same, so just remove that silly level requirement.

Getting to 30 can be a bit of a chore nowadays for that very reason. Yes, we have Gates of Valor, but people still prefer Abyssea so GoV is not quite as common in most cases. I miss MMM...even if a PL was needed half the time (everybody dualboxes these days anyhow).

[Luvbunny]

Abysea level cap is 30 because you can do some quests at lvl 30 since it only required that you have sneak and invisible. Also by lowering level cap you can sell the expansion to more people from newbie to veteran players. It is all business decision, get the content available to the majority of your consumers.

As for people who bitched and moaned about how fast we level to 90, please get over it. The game has changed. Now you no longer grind for xp to lvl your jobs. The new grind is on magian weapon trials and gears. To get that moving along you need to be at least level 75 and up. Making people have to grind to lvl their jobs for a year, then do another grinds for weapon and gears are just dumb, not to mention counter intuitive when it comes to marketing.

Your actual training of the jobs now begin at lvl 90, when you start grinding for the seals or atma, or those +2 items and those empyrian weapon. Even with elemental magian weapon, where you can solo kill those 200-300 mobs, giving you time to test different job abilities and reach your comfort levels. The downside of this, you have plenty of people who are new at their jobs trying to join you and farm seals and events - which often results in wiped or disasters because they have no idea how to make macro and what their jobs can do. Since xp loss is no longer and issue, this should matter less other than the inconvenience of having to get new pop items. Perhaps it is time you get to know other people more and start doing things together more as a small group. Isn't that why you play this game?

[Modoru]

I argued this when abyssea came out. You people are still complaining >:l

[Alhanelem]

I'm tired of kids with multiple lvl 90 jobs having no clue how to use them effectively properly cause it was burnt in a FC abyssea party from 35-90 any thoughts

Abyssea didn't create people who don't know how to play their jobs. Those people already existed before abyssea and just stood out more afterward. I'm just sick of people saying "we need a minimum level for abyssea because I met some noob." We don't need a level cap. You have the power to control who you play with. If someone sucks, kick them out, blacklist them, and/or never play with them again.

[Modoru]

Abyssea didn't create people who don't know how to play their jobs. Those people already existed before abyssea and just stood out more afterward. I'm just sick of people saying "we need a minimum level for abyssea because I met some noob." We don't need a level cap. You have the power to control who you play with. If someone sucks, kick them out, blacklist them, and/or never play with them again.
You know [and this is slightly off-topic, but], I've never kicked out anyone from a party for being bad. Sure, I'm never okay with them, but I just try to make up for it as best as I can with everyone else's performance or jobs. What I have done, however, is gotten someone kicked out for acting like they were the sole reason the party was going, even though they were one person, and everyone else was just "sitting there", even when that person literally left to walk around and not contribute at all for ~30 minutes of the party. [Abyssea - Altepa, btw]

But, we all meet a couple of those kind of people.

[Alhanelem]

Well if you don't want to kick them, that's fine, but don't complain about this problem when you're willing to tolerate it. I'm merely saying people have the power to control their own gameplay experience. if you don't like something, there's usually something you can do about it. We don't need a level limit. If people don't like a certain kind of player, then they shouldn't allow them into the party, and/or a person shouldn't join a party knowing it it will be one they won't like.

If people want to level fast and suck at their job, I say that's their right to do so. I also have the right not to party with them if they don't at least learn afterwards.

[Babekeke]

There are just 3 jobs that really should be levelled normally:
PUP (though you can burn this to 49 and cap it's skill as /PUP - the only job this can be done on)
BLU (you'll probably hit 90 just collecting the spells with all the exp buffs/rings around now)
NIN (can't skill katana or ninjutsu on any other job, and you will really struggle to tank without these capped)

Of course, you CAN run around with these 3 level 90 and gimped too, but it's way more obvious if you're spamming head butt and pollen on blu, or you can't even cast utsu Ni without being interrupted on NIN, then can't hit hard enough to hold hate. Or you pull out your automaton on PUP and it only uses tier 2 magic because skill is gimped.

[FANCY60]

I argued this when abyssea came out. You people are still complaining >:l
no one forced your hand if you dont want to talk about it dont. as for abyssea cap its an opinion people deal with it but in hind sight im loving the views on this really exciting so much rage in discussions though like people are taking it personally its even on hot topics thanks for the replies really have learnt a lot from people that actually made sense and not just posting for the sake thanks wow.

[Neisan_Quetz]

Interruptions on Ni usually (I say this tentatively) aren't due to ninjutsu skill but bad timing. Getting offensive spells to land, you have a case there.

[Richie]

I'm for the minimum level increase being bumped up to 60. If you were crazy it didn't take a week to get 60 even without fields/grounds of valor. Recently, my friends brother joined the game for the first time and was level 33 the next day lol. My other friend got both RNG and SAM to 60 with essentially capped skills outside of abyssea recently and that only took at maximum 3 or 4 days (including both of them.)

I think it would be wroth doing.

[Tamoa]

I'm for the minimum level increase being bumped up to 60. If you were crazy it didn't take a week to get 60 even without fields/grounds of valor. Recently, my friends brother joined the game for the first time and was level 33 the next day lol. My other friend got both RNG and SAM to 60 with essentially capped skills outside of abyssea recently and that only took at maximum 3 or 4 days (including both of them.)

I think it would be wroth doing.

When I first played, in 2004, it took me 5 months to get drk to lvl 52 - that was being a brand new player with everything that entails.

I can assure you, before level sync, FoV and now GoV, leveling those unpopular jobs to 60 took a lot longer than 1 week.

[Mirage]

Regardless of if you agree with the current level requirement of 30 in abyssea or not, I hope you understand that it is now too late to change it. Suddenly requiring people to be level 70+ would put all new players at an unfair disadvantage compared to old players, most of those who are interested in leeching/keying their jobs to 75+ have already done it, so new or returning players would be affected the most. If SE had wanted to change it, it would have happened within a few months of the first abyssea expansion.

Personally I think it's a bit retarded that low levels can reach exp rates higher than that of a post-exp update normal party just by popping chests, but get over it, it's too fucking late now.

Furthermore, I would like to know how healers below level 70 are actually leeching. Considering only whm gets cure 5 and up, it's almost only cure potency gear that makes a rdm90 a better healer than a whm50 in something like a worms party (assuming a couple of refresh atmas). If you're contributing to the fight, it's not really called leeching.

[Rearden]

ITT: People who aren't good at their jobs complain about Abyssea making other people not good at their jobs

[FrankReynolds]

Abysea level cap is 30 because you can do some quests at lvl 30 since it only required that you have sneak and invisible. Also by lowering level cap you can sell the expansion to more people from newbie to veteran players. It is all business decision, get the content available to the majority of your consumers.

As for people who bitched and moaned about how fast we level to 90, please get over it. The game has changed. Now you no longer grind for xp to lvl your jobs. The new grind is on magian weapon trials and gears. To get that moving along you need to be at least level 75 and up. Making people have to grind to lvl their jobs for a year, then do another grinds for weapon and gears are just dumb, not to mention counter intuitive when it comes to marketing.

Your actual training of the jobs now begin at lvl 90, when you start grinding for the seals or atma, or those +2 items and those empyrian weapon. Even with elemental magian weapon, where you can solo kill those 200-300 mobs, giving you time to test different job abilities and reach your comfort levels. The downside of this, you have plenty of people who are new at their jobs trying to join you and farm seals and events - which often results in wiped or disasters because they have no idea how to make macro and what their jobs can do. Since xp loss is no longer and issue, this should matter less other than the inconvenience of having to get new pop items. Perhaps it is time you get to know other people more and start doing things together more as a small group. Isn't that why you play this game?

Its actually to stem off the RMT from leveling mad characters as fast (Although who has seen one lately).

[FrankReynolds]

ITT: People who aren't good at their jobs complain about Abyssea making other people not good at their jobs

Agreed. and let me reiterate. Six months later, the guy who burned it will be better than the guy who leveled old school. He has more experience playing at level cap. Your just mad because your playing with people at 90 who haven't capped skill yet as if it was way more fun when they sucked at lower levels. Its far less detrimental to the group at 90 than it was in a 6 man PUG.

[FrankReynolds]

I'm for the minimum level increase being bumped up to 60. If you were crazy it didn't take a week to get 60 even without fields/grounds of valor. Recently, my friends brother joined the game for the first time and was level 33 the next day lol. My other friend got both RNG and SAM to 60 with essentially capped skills outside of abyssea recently and that only took at maximum 3 or 4 days (including both of them.)

I think it would be wroth doing.

I'm going to move that it be lowered to 1. I get more exp solo doing EP mobs than I would in your Dunes party, and I'm sick of people inviting me to that crap 1000 times when I don't have my flag up.

[Mirage]

I'm going to move that it be lowered to 1. I get more exp solo doing EP mobs than I would in your Dunes party, and I'm sick of people inviting me to that crap 1000 times when I don't have my flag up.

maybe you should use /anon

[Kari]

Bads will be bad.
Giving Abyssea a requirement will not make people better at the game.
I'd love for someone to explain how killing Colibri for hours on end, day after day, makes anyone better at ANYTHING you do at 90.
If you want to level outside of Abyssea, good for you! Ground of Valor is an EXCELLENT resource for you! Even more-so after this coming update!

All in all -- it is far too late to make a requirement for Abyssea.
SE sold us this product ensuring us that we'd be able to access the content at level 30.
Just as well, anyone who has burned all their jobs to 90 would have a severe advantage over anyone who has yet to do so.

Oh and one last thing.
A level 60 "cap" as some have been calling it in this thread...
You realize that would mean you couldn't be ABOVE level 60?
I don't think people know what the word means.

[Mirage]

Some people like to think cap means both at least and at most. I hope they don't have drivers licenses.

[Reaux]

I agree with OP! Should be capped at 75 minimum

[Moink]

Its actually to stem off the RMT from leveling mad characters as fast (Although who has seen one lately).

Quetz still has RMT... They Shout Abyssea Parties for leechers to come out between 50-100k an hour... They then turn around and sell that money.

Its been getting worse slowly day by day.

[cidbahamut]

Quetz still has RMT... They Shout Abyssea Parties for leechers to come out between 50-100k an hour... They then turn around and sell that money.

Its been getting worse slowly day by day.
I think you have confused "RMT" with "players willing to offer leech spots to make a quick buck". I could be wrong though, since I haven't been on Quetz for a few months now, but when I was still there I'm fairly certain it was players doing it and not RMT.

[Merton9999]

I think you have confused "RMT" with "players willing to offer leech spots to make a quick buck". I could be wrong though, since I haven't been on Quetz for a few months now, but when I was still there I'm fairly certain it was players doing it and not RMT.

It was players for a while and to some extent still is. But RMT groups also do it. The nice thing is they're easy to identify - very little English understanding, terrible gear, and much less efficient than the player ones.

I always assumed the 30 cap was to minimize RMT too. How do these groups fair in GoV burns now though? I wonder if that's why we're now seeing them show up in Abyssea on Quetz.

[cidbahamut]

Cool beans. Good to know it's not just someone being all "grrr, selling leech spots is RMT" because they're jealous that they can't leech or whatever.

[Moink]

Cool beans. Good to know it's not just someone being all "grrr, selling leech spots is RMT" because they're jealous that they can't leech or whatever.

Been on Quetz and this game long enough to determine who is an actual player and who is a RMT. If you have a problem with what is actually is being said... I'm sure I could provide SS of RMT shouting for leech spots after I am done with work. I don't complain about leeching or leechers, I was simply answering the question whether or not RMT still exist in XI.

[Moink]

It was players for a while and to some extent still is. But RMT groups also do it. The nice thing is they're easy to identify - very little English understanding, terrible gear, and much less efficient than the player ones.

I always assumed the 30 cap was to minimize RMT too. How do these groups fair in GoV burns now though? I wonder if that's why we're now seeing them show up in Abyssea on Quetz.

I have seen a bunch of anons in Gusgen Mines that tend to follow the RMT pattern. I would only imagine we're observing a flux of RMT is for the upcoming "Holiday Special" but who knows... they'll prob be banned eventually anyways

[cidbahamut]

Nah it's cool man. I just know there's a fair number of folks out there who are dumb and can't tell the difference between a player selling a leech spot and an RMT, so I wasn't sure.

[Juri_Licious]

This again.

Maybe because it's actually a problem?

[Greatguardian]

Maybe because it's actually a problem?

I think you mad jelly, bro. You salty?

I don't care how anyone else plays their game on their own time, it's their $12.95 bro

Someone shows up to Absolute Virtue with level 0 skills? I boot their ass.

Someone shows up to Absolute Virtue with a level 90 job and doesn't suck at it? I don't give half a shit how they got there or how long they've been playing.

Likewise, I don't give half a shit how long you've been playing or how long you took to level if you're terrible at your job. Playing since release and being XXX/YYY Main Career All-I-Care-About-Is-This Job doesn't mean you're half bloody good at it or worth keeping around in a party.

People want to be "Redeemed" because they're shitty at their jobs but they leveled it "the right way", so at least they're "better than" those other guys who leveled "the wrong way".

It's the same reason all good players must be lying, scheming cheaters with no friends and no life. When people want to feel better about themselves, their first response is to claim the moral high ground.

So quit being so mad, bro. If you want to be better at the game, get better at the game. Making excuses and lauding around about how "morally superior" one is is not getting anyone anywhere.

[Tohihroyu]

It would be nice if it was capped at even 65, but clearly SE dose not give a damn, they didn't during smn burns & they don't now (I once GM'd a smn burn & nothing happened, unless a GM can post here saying its against ToS)

[Bagel]

I still do not understand the rage over PL/AstralBurn/FC leech/Abyssea leech. BTW, tags are hilarious.

[FrankReynolds]

It would be nice if it was capped at even 65, but clearly SE dose not give a damn, they didn't during smn burns & they don't now (I once GM'd a smn burn & nothing happened, unless a GM can post here saying its against ToS)

lol you GM'd people for getting xp faster than you. you fail.

[Luvbunny]

This is the new way to get xp now, no more level grind. You can easily get from 10-35 via gusgen GoV, move to Crawler Nest or Garlaige for 32-56s (can synch all the way till you hit 60s) then go to Bost Ob till you hit 65s. After that it's a matter of leeching as puller if you can sub ninja or just help heal if you come as rdm, whm, smn, and sch - and go do abysea dominion. You end up getting faster xp per lvl if you only play 1-2 hours via GoV - aby leech at 30s you have to stay over 2-3 hours to reap the benefits, and up to 6-7 hours to get to 80s-90s.

[Tohihroyu]

lol you GM'd people for getting xp faster than you. you fail.

QQ moar plz, I GM'd because of the mass lag you lout.

Also I really don't care if you got faster exp at least I wont have to spend hours skilling up- oh wait you have bots for that, too bad I don't use bots or windower like you & everyone else dose Q_Q

[Neisan_Quetz]

iMad

fixed that for you

[Zagen]

QQ moar plz, I GM'd because of the mass lag you lout.

Also I really don't care if you got faster exp at least I wont have to spend hours skilling up- oh wait you have bots for that, too bad I don't use bots or windower like you & everyone else dose Q_Q
Here's your skill up bot and its PS2 Compatible! (http://ffxi.gamerescape.com/wiki/Zvahl_Fortalice)

[Bagel]

QQ moar plz, I GM'd because of the mass lag you lout.

Also I really don't care if you got faster exp at least I wont have to spend hours skilling up- oh wait you have bots for that, too bad I don't use bots or windower like you & everyone else dose Q_Q

Because someone has to be using a bot and cheating if they're doing something better than you.

[FrankReynolds]

QQ moar plz, I GM'd because of the mass lag you lout.

Also I really don't care if you got faster exp at least I wont have to spend hours skilling up- oh wait you have bots for that, too bad I don't use bots or windower like you & everyone else dose Q_Q

LOL So you spend hours standing around looking for a group instead?

Here's a pro tip since your not good. It doesn't take very long to skill up. If you start hitting stuff instead of key whoring at say 65ish, you will be almost at cap by 90.

Also, it's fairly obvious that YOU are the one that bots as you keep bringing it up in regards to abyssea leveling where botting doesn't help at all. If you want to keep SE from finding out that you bot, stop putting it in your signature and talking about it every chance you get.

[Dragoy]

It would be nice if it was capped at even 65, but clearly SE dose not give a damn, they didn't during smn burns & they don't now (I once GM'd a smn burn & nothing happened, unless a GM can post here saying its against ToS)
I once had a rather thorough chat with a Gamemaster about this, and it would seem it is considered the same as 'PLing'.

To me, it seemed (and still does) like a game-weakness abuse, and should not be possible at all. It's far from a proper way of leveling up and easily creates grudges amongst players but well, it's not for me to decide what's OK and what's not OK here.

Hardly meaningful anymore, though, with Abyssea being open to level 30 characters and so on, but I just thought I'd mention that it is not against the ToS (as far as I know).

[Fyreus]

So because of the OP's individual experience, SE should change the game for all players on all servers. Got it.

That's also how returning and new players feel. Know what happens when they leave and older players continue to leave? I hope this isn't a common mentality.

[FANCY60]

wow a player who reads and understands a point made. see how nice and precise the answer is, instead of coming out like no one should have an opinion, you replay like this people and go about you business


This is the new way to get xp now, no more level grind. You can easily get from 10-35 via gusgen GoV, move to Crawler Nest or Garlaige for 32-56s (can synch all the way till you hit 60s) then go to Bost Ob till you hit 65s. After that it's a matter of leeching as puller if you can sub ninja or just help heal if you come as rdm, whm, smn, and sch - and go do abysea dominion. You end up getting faster xp per lvl if you only play 1-2 hours via GoV - aby leech at 30s you have to stay over 2-3 hours to reap the benefits, and up to 6-7 hours to get to 80s-90s.

[Leonlionheart]

I think you mad jelly, bro. You salty?

I don't care how anyone else plays their game on their own time, it's their $12.95 bro

Someone shows up to Absolute Virtue with level 0 skills? I boot their ass.

Someone shows up to Absolute Virtue with a level 90 job and doesn't suck at it? I don't give half a shit how they got there or how long they've been playing.

Likewise, I don't give half a shit how long you've been playing or how long you took to level if you're terrible at your job. Playing since release and being XXX/YYY Main Career All-I-Care-About-Is-This Job doesn't mean you're half bloody good at it or worth keeping around in a party.

People want to be "Redeemed" because they're shitty at their jobs but they leveled it "the right way", so at least they're "better than" those other guys who leveled "the wrong way".

It's the same reason all good players must be lying, scheming cheaters with no friends and no life. When people want to feel better about themselves, their first response is to claim the moral high ground.

So quit being so mad, bro. If you want to be better at the game, get better at the game. Making excuses and lauding around about how "morally superior" one is is not getting anyone anywhere.

This times infinity. If anyone brings up the argument that Abyssea should be level capped, please refer to this post. I might even link it to the second post in a spoiler box!

[Anathiel]

When you see a person that doesn't know how to do their job at 90, point them to the nearest wiki. And btw, back when the cap was at 75 you still had a ton of people that sucked at their jobs. (Thfs that couldn't SATA, rdms that sucked at refresh, whms that couldn't keep party alive, ninjas that were horrible at utsusemi casting, sam's that didn't know SC charts, drks that would use all their JA at once and promptly die, brds that couldn't seperate between giving melee, melee songs and mages, mage songs, drgs that had no timing on jumps to get rid of hate and couldn't keep wyvern alive to save their life, blm's that couldn't time a MB at all, I really hope you're getting the point.)

[Juri_Licious]

With book burn parties, why do people still need to leech?

[scaevola]

gimme dat croor

[FrankReynolds]

wow a player who reads and understands a point made. see how nice and precise the answer is, instead of coming out like no one should have an opinion, you replay like this people and go about you business

So...... you don't have a problem with people getting EXP fast, your just mad because abyssea parties last too long?

FYI:

1. If you level warrior (supposedly your main job?), you need to skill up several weapons which you will not be using in any experience points parties.

2. Level synching in GOV parties means that you will be unskilled in your main weapon just like those nasty abyssea people. Not to mention, you still don't get to skill up on every weapon that warrior can use.

3. As previously stated: Every job has 1 weapon that they "do the best at". You will still have to skill up on all the other weapons that your job can wield on your own time.

4. Since nobody has mentioned the elephant in the room... Somebody has to be on chest duty in abyssea. its a full time job. That person would be stupid if they did it on a job that was already merited / skill capped.

5. keys cost 500 Cruor each (the "leech" is paying for this).

6. Cruor can be exchanged for items that can in turn be sold for Gil.

7. If you open chests for a EXP party in abyssea, you make roughly enough Cruor per hour to pay for the keys that you are using.

8. everyone else in the party makes the same amount of Cruor, but doesn't have to buy keys (who is really leeching?).

9. If you pay to get in an abyssea party, you still make a bunch of Cruor. Thus negating the loss of Gil that you paid to get in.

10. A-fukking-gain: A guy who plays any job at level 90 for 6 months is almost always going to be better than a guy who takes 6 months getting from 1-90 (Not to mention, he is obviously smarter to begin with).

11. If you haven't realized all of this yet...... You are doomed to fail.

[FANCY60]

jack of all trade master or non. read the post you are replying too before you pick and dissect something else this is a broken record, you are just repeating what others have said just to post stop crying and talking bout issues you clearly have no idea of

So...... you don't have a problem with people getting EXP fast, your just mad because abyssea parties last too long?

FYI:

1. If you level warrior (supposedly your main job?), you need to skill up several weapons which you will not be using in any experience points parties.

2. Level synching in GOV parties means that you will be unskilled in your main weapon just like those nasty abyssea people. Not to mention, you still don't get to skill up on every weapon that warrior can use.

3. As previously stated: Every job has 1 weapon that they "do the best at". You will still have to skill up on all the other weapons that your job can wield on your own time.

4. Since nobody has mentioned the elephant in the room... Somebody has to be on chest duty in abyssea. its a full time job. That person would be stupid if they did it on a job that was already merited / skill capped.

5. keys cost 500 Cruor each (the "leech" is paying for this).

6. Cruor can be exchanged for items that can in turn be sold for Gil.

7. If you open chests for a EXP party in abyssea, you make roughly enough Cruor per hour to pay for the keys that you are using.

8. everyone else in the party makes the same amount of Cruor, but doesn't have to buy keys (who is really leeching?).

9. If you pay to get in an abyssea party, you still make a bunch of Cruor. Thus negating the loss of Gil that you paid to get in.

10. A-fukking-gain: A guy who plays any job at level 90 for 6 months is almost always going to be better than a guy who takes 6 months getting from 1-90 (Not to mention, he is obviously smarter to begin with).

11. If you haven't realized all of this yet...... You are doomed to fail.

[Mirage]

Why are you so upset?

[Tsuneo]

With book burn parties, why do people still need to leech?
GoV burning is still slow compared to Abyssea, but it provides an option for those who aren't leeching in Abyssea.

[Mirage]

It's about 25% as fast as a good worms party (good meaning 200k/h and up). The exp does however build up to the max much faster.

[Kuishen]

I'll tell you why people are quitting the game, it's because of twats like the OP trying to ruin it for everybody else, not abyssea leeching.

Good *** lord how do some of you remember how to breathe when you can't seem to form a logical thought.

[Fawkes]

I'd rather they add options as opposed to take them away. Make FoV as good as GoV with the bonuses and whatnot. Add more pages to all zones that are just one mob type that's reasonable to fight. If you still lose some exp with your adventuring fellow out, maybe get rid of that like they did for BST pets, to make soloing a little nicer. People returning to the game and just starting seem pretty unhappy with the way exp is pre-75, but the answer is not to make the game more like it used to be. The only thing that was remotely better about exp in the old days was that there were more people your level trying to exp so the odds of finding anyone seeking to exp in Qufim with you were higher. The game needs to continue to adapt to it's smaller/top-heavy playerbase.

[Kuishen]

People returning to the game and just starting seem pretty unhappy with the way exp is pre-75.

No. They. ***. Aren't.

A small, SMALL minority of people are. Most of them old players, because I'll tell you what, most of the returning players came BACK because of abyssea exp so stop making retarded generalizations based on what maybe 100-300 people out of the 500,000 (or however many, basing that number off last year's census or w/e) that play the game say.

[Anathiel]

This kuishen guy...I like this guy.

[Fawkes]

stop making retarded generalizations based on what maybe 100-300 people out of the 500,000

So generalizations are bad, and pulling numbers out of nowhere is good. Gotcha.

Also, I don't get why you're mad. I'm agreeing that the OP is wrong and they shouldn't change the entry level for abyssea.

[SpankWustler]

I'd rather they add options as opposed to take them away. Make FoV as good as GoV with the bonuses and whatnot. Add more pages to all zones that are just one mob type that's reasonable to fight. If you still lose some exp with your adventuring fellow out, maybe get rid of that like they did for BST pets, to make soloing a little nicer. People returning to the game and just starting seem pretty unhappy with the way exp is pre-75, but the answer is not to make the game more like it used to be. The only thing that was remotely better about exp in the old days was that there were more people your level trying to exp so the odds of finding anyone seeking to exp in Qufim with you were higher. The game needs to continue to adapt to it's smaller/top-heavy playerbase.

I wish everyone who wanted more active ways to level to 90 had such a positive attitude and a desire to see FFXI adapt to it's player-base.

This post is way more constructive than the usual "THE GAME SHOULD NOT EVOLVE EVER BECAUSE THE T-REX DID NOT EVOLVE INTO ANYTHING AND THE T-REX IS MY FAVORITE DINOSAUR! BRING BACK 6-MAN PARTIES AND KILLING 985374 CRABS AND BIRDS!"

It would be great if Fields of Valor were made more like Grounds of Valor. I still have a level 10-ish job or two that I should level to 49, and that would make the process a lot less monotonous for me.

[Kuishen]

So generalizations are bad, and pulling numbers out of nowhere is good. Gotcha.

Also, I don't get why you're mad. I'm agreeing that the OP is wrong and they shouldn't change the entry level for abyssea.

I'm mad that this topic exists, not at you. Also I may have misread your post, and I apologize for that. I should have made it clear that that number was an example of a very very small minority that I mentioned in the beginning of my post. It's really not hard to see that these idiots that baw and pitchfork for getting rid of abyssea/raising abyssea level cap/whatever are very few in number and are a minority. So when somebody says something like all the returning or new players hate it, I like to point out that there is absolutely no proof for such a statement.

[FrankReynolds]

stuff..

I think you guys were both saying the same thing. I agree with both of you.

[FrankReynolds]

I wish everyone who wanted more active ways to level to 90 had such a positive attitude and a desire to see FFXI adapt to it's player-base.

This post is way more constructive than the usual "THE GAME SHOULD NOT EVOLVE EVER BECAUSE THE T-REX DID NOT EVOLVE INTO ANYTHING AND THE T-REX IS MY FAVORITE DINOSAUR! BRING BACK 6-MAN PARTIES AND KILLING 985374 CRABS AND BIRDS!"

It would be great if Fields of Valor were made more like Grounds of Valor. I still have a level 10-ish job or two that I should level to 49, and that would make the process a lot less monotonous for me.

Same here. I am leveling a new character at the moment, and I would love if it wasn't just a giant frigging grind. Why are all those books telling me to kill 2 different mobs that don't spawn anywhere near each other, or the books?

I think they need to make EXP outside of abyssea match the EXP inside. That way both pro evolutionists and dinosaurs get their way.

[Alhanelem]

why are we even bothering with one of these threads? The community is never going to come to any kind of consensus...

[Leonlionheart]

why are we even bothering with one of these threads? The community is never going to come to any kind of consensus...

The smart 3/4s of the community has come to the consensus that the stupid 1/4 of the community is stupid.

Leeching =/= sucky player.

I've played with a WHM who's done nothing but play WHM for years, and he/she is ****ing horrible at it.

[Meyi]

No.

Should have gone to Gusgen Mines.

[FrankReynolds]

The smart 3/4s of the community has come to the consensus that the stupid 1/4 of the community is stupid.

Leeching =/= sucky player.

I've played with a WHM who's done nothing but play WHM for years, and he/she is ****ing horrible at it.

Same here. I did dynamis for a year with this chick who played whm only and sucked ass. We used to constantly joke that raise was more mp efficient than cure.

[Zagen]

Its funny I never thought of it like this but removing the ability to leech would actually hurt those who are low level.

Everyone that has wanted to level a job with a decent playtime has already gotten that/those job(s) to 75+ meaning anyone that is low level that doesn't have friends willing to gimp themselves by level syncing would get screwed and end up quitting.

In other words the OP and those few agreeing with it actually want to force lower level players to quit.

[Godofgods]

Abyssea should have been capped at 70 or 75! However... its so late for that now.

[Rearden]

Abyssea leeching makes players bad! What, chain 200 at 75 cap? Musta been bots cause most I saw was #5.

[Zagen]

Abyssea leeching makes players bad! What, chain 200 at 75 cap? Musta been bots cause most I saw was #5.

Only 200 your bots musta been gimps! XD

[FANCY60]

I have come to find out that the community in-game is not helpful or friendly one bit. They seem to be very clique oriented and will IGNORE you because you do not have 7 jobs to 90 or have not been playing for 8 years like them. Not to mention the language barrier cuts the already dwindling population of people online even further (The other half are gil farmers.)

IF YOU ARE THINKING OF STARTING BACK I RECOMMEND YOU CONSIDER THIS:

You will need to solo the majority of a game NOT MEANT for soloing. You will not be able to do missions, get a subjob before level 30+ (normally lvl18), level at any respectable rate, and forget about unlocking jobs because it more than likely will not happen without paying people in-game HUGE amounts of gil (YOU WILL BE DIRT POOR) or unless you have been lucky enough to get into a linkshell but even then that promises nothing.

Its funny how a dying games community can be so shallow and cold towards new players. You would think that they would appreciate new players more since it keeps all their level 90 jobs somewhat relevant and keeps THEIR game populated. Instead its just the opposite its about who you know rather than what you know or do that makes or breaks you in this game currently and it will only get worse by the day.

If soloing a un-soloable game is your thing, play this game. If being ignored by other players because they do not know you is your thing, play this game. If playing a game where you can not unlock anything solo but a chocobo at the appropriate level is your thing, play this game. If not, I suggest you play WoW (a game you can solo if needed and can actually find a party) or even... FFXIV, which I have not played yet and with this SE game experience will more than likely not.

issue is everyone has different experiences as i keep saying. for those who can read, its my opinion your might have a valid point/(S) yes, but there is no need to be calling ppl names cause someone says something you dont agree with please guys keep it clean i only care now for this thread cause its getting a lot of views .i am happy with that lol

[Alhanelem]

The smart 3/4s of the community has come to the consensus that the stupid 1/4 of the community is stupid.

Leeching =/= sucky player.

I've played with a WHM who's done nothing but play WHM for years, and he/she is ****ing horrible at it.
Well I completely agree, but there will always be people resenting the fact that someone else leveled up faster than them.

I find the quoted stuff in the post above completely untrue, I've always been helping people ingame and see lots of people doing it. It's not hard to level, even solo since the EXP for normal monsters was increased and things like grounds of valor came out. Even if you don't leech in abyssea, it's not THAT bad.

It almost makes more sense just soloing the missions now, since the missions don't acknowledge the help or presence of anyone other than yourself anyway it doesn't affect the flavor of the missions.

[FrankReynolds]

On my new character, the biggest pain in the ass for me has been running all over hell and creation trying to get all the tele points, outpost, maws, boat passes, talking to 10,000 quest NPCs that don't really have much to say, and trading a million of X item to X person to get fame in X region.