95 Limit break

[humidfreak]

Am I the only one that wants a Maat style fight for the final Limit break. So many people don't know how to play the jobs they have at 90 it would be an achievement to do it:cool:

[cidbahamut]

People would still manage to do it without knowing how to play their jobs, but I agree that it would be nice to have another limit break that actually presents a challenge rather than more nonsense with moogles.

[Darkwizardzin]

People would still manage to do it without knowing how to play their jobs, but I agree that it would be nice to have another limit break that actually presents a challenge rather than more nonsense with moogles.

meh I disagree I find the moogle stuff funny.

A new maat fight would be interesting... but im pretty sure alot of rdms would be pissed if they had to go through that again.

[SpankWustler]

I managed to beat Maat once without knowing what 90% of the stuff in FFXI did, so I'm sure that plenty of people could beat Maat twice without knowing what 90% of the stuff in FFXI does.

Also, I do find the moogle/Maat/Brown Mage conversations funny even if they're not really content.

[Ravenmore]

Wouldn't do a thing to stop people from speed leveling jobs or stop them d=from hitting 95. Unless they make you do it for every single job you take to 95. Maat was by far the easiest fight in the game for any job outside of rdm. Same thing would happen again. People would just run though on their best geared job and wipe the floor with him. Then they are free to burn up any other job they wanted.

[Zagen]

Am I the only one that wants a Maat style fight for the final Limit break. So many people don't know how to play the jobs they have at 90 it would be an achievement to do it:cool:
What does Curing a few thousand HP teach you about playing WHM?
What does using Astral Flow Pact 2 times teach you about playing SMN?
I could go on, the point is Maat fights in general teach you almost nothing about the job you use for the fight, just like how EXPing on a given job(except maybe WHM) teaches almost nothing about how it will be used in endgame events and vice versa.

Gimp players will be gimp, good players will be good, until getting bored and find humor in being gimp.

While the new limit break cut scene games are annoying they are least provide some humor while still giving the same lack of information

[Saefinn]

I liked my G5 fight, but Maat v1 doesn't teach people to play their jobs and I bet Maat v2 wouldn't either. The fights don't really teach you that much - there's so much a party demands that a solo job specific fight isn't going to teach.

A Maat 2.0 would be kinda fun.

[Twille]

Another Maat style fight would be fun. And no, it wouldn't "teach" you anything about your job, and it wouldn't prevent noobs from reaching 95, but it would provide me additional entertainment, like that one time some nooby LS member died to Maat 17 times. hahahahahahahahahahahaha. good times.

[Korpg]

I thought that 95 cap will consist of 10 merits and 2 unnamed items (doesn't exist yet)

[Juri_Licious]

Maat was by far the easiest fight in the game for any job outside of rdm.
Yeah, say that when you're THF and you cannot steal no matter if you have the highest or near highest stealing skill equipment on. And you have to beat him Melee style.

[Tagrineth]

Wouldn't do a thing to stop people from speed leveling jobs or stop them d=from hitting 95. Unless they make you do it for every single job you take to 95. Maat was by far the easiest fight in the game for any job outside of rdm. Same thing would happen again. People would just run though on their best geared job and wipe the floor with him. Then they are free to burn up any other job they wanted.

Maat... easiest fight in the game?

...wat

[Reiterpallasch]

What does Curing a few thousand HP teach you about playing WHM?
What does using Astral Flow Pact 2 times teach you about playing SMN?
Well maybe those jobs are easier than the rest, but some teach you stuff.

RDM Maat teaches you that swords are bad, and that you can't be gimp as @#$% with BS gear and expect to win. (Hint: RDM Maat wasn't hard either)

MNK Maat teaches you to time your Hundred Fists juuuuuuust right.

[Economizer]

What does Curing a few thousand HP teach you about playing WHM?

The Maat fight for White Mage has three possible ways to win, if it is your first fight, and thus can teach these lessons.

A) White Mage can tank a mob for an extended period of time by curing itself.
B) How to sleep a mob with Repose. See A for details on what happens when you get a resist.
C) Hexa Strike is better then Asuran Fists.

B and C have the added advantages of getting a White Mage to cap Divine Magic or Club skill respectively.

[Zagen]

The Maat fight for White Mage has three possible ways to win, if it is your first fight, and thus can teach these lessons.

A) White Mage can tank a mob for an extended period of time by curing itself.
B) How to sleep a mob with Repose. See A for details on what happens when you get a resist.
C) Hexa Strike is better then Asuran Fists.

B and C have the added advantages of getting a White Mage to cap Divine Magic or Club skill respectively.
A) This has what to do with party dynamics or even learning how to play the job "properly"?
B) Odd I slept him with Repose on my WHM mule and didn't win.
C) Aside from being usable for the first Maat fight you're insane unless you're talking about abyssea which has nothing to do with Maat.



Well maybe those jobs are easier than the rest, but some teach you stuff.

RDM Maat teaches you that swords are bad, and that you can't be gimp as @#$% with BS gear and expect to win. (Hint: RDM Maat wasn't hard either)

MNK Maat teaches you to time your Hundred Fists juuuuuuust right.
But then again she swore by RDM/DRK for meleeing not for CS Stun back at 75.

MNK fight taught me Hundred Fists + Counterstance = Win. Ok maybe this fight teaches you how to play MNK >.> LOL j/k

[Gokku]

someones either a bad whm or a bad player... im not sure ill leave it at this
a whm who can do A and B of that list is the difference between a wipe and a last min recovery.

Perfect Example 2 hour'd War NM in dyna condemnation and double attack 1 shots me and the nin. our whm tanked the NM a Bst and its pets while raising us both and curing us as whm/sch. *wipe was due to my lolthf whm off pulling the bst while we tanked the War and Drk Nm's.

TL DR shit happens and a good whm saves everything

[Economizer]

A) This has what to do with party dynamics or even learning how to play the job "properly"?

White Mages can occasionally get hate, especially with all the hate reset moves mobs have these days. Knowing how to keep yourself alive with cure bombs so your party doesn't have a weakened White Mage when they get hate off you is a valuable skill.


B) Odd I slept him with Repose on my WHM mule and didn't win.

Cap your Divine Magic. He can still resist however, but the Maat fight for White Mage is brain dead easy between a Light Staff, Earth Staff and AF1 pants.

I suspect that White Mage just being a mule job to people could influence the lack of a win rate against Maat, the fight is incredibly easy with preparation.


C) Aside from being usable for the first Maat fight you're insane unless you're talking about abyssea which has nothing to do with Maat.

I was being a bit cheeky, considering that the Maat fight is more of a Monk with White Mage sub vs. White Mage fight then a WHM v. WHM fight.

A White Mage with good melee gear can defeat Maat between TP restore items. It isn't common, considering how much easier it is to just Repose him if it is your first fight. If you ever go after Maat for his cap, you'll need to be able to club him to death however.

[Greatguardian]

Maat fight is easy as pie for any player who has half decent gear, buys consumables, and knows what the hell they're doing.

Interesting fact, this is/was probably less than 1% of the playerbase that was hitting level 70 for the first time.

[MDenham]

A White Mage with good melee gear can defeat Maat between TP restore items. It isn't common, considering how much easier it is to just Repose him if it is your first fight. If you ever go after Maat for his cap, you'll need to be able to club him to death however.Protip for these people: Have Black Halo for self-Light, and charge up your Holy lazors.

[Economizer]

Protip for these people: Have Black Halo for self-Light, and charge up your Holy lazors.

I haven't bothered to fight Maat in a long time, but I was under the impression that if you rematched him and used the Black Halo / Hexa Strike skillchain, it generally does enough damage to win. But I guess you could pull off a Holy for magic burst goodness.

[MDenham]

Mostly you just want Holy available in case you forget and do Hexa Strike > Black Halo instead, which is going to net less damage from the SC bonus damage.

[Alhanelem]

Most people don't like having to unlock the higher levels at all, it's just an annoying barrier to progress for a new player, so it makes sense to keep it simple.

[Runespider]

Most people don't like having to unlock the higher levels at all, it's just an annoying barrier to progress for a new player, so it makes sense to keep it simple.

The whole point of adding them at all was to slow people down a little, now that leveling will take a few hours to cap to 95 I would of thought they might of put more effort into the cap quest, or you know...just not fricking bother with it at all. When it's as stupid as they have since 75+ they are just going through the motions for no purpose, no thought or effort went into them at all.

When I look at all the cap quests to 75 and how much effort went into them it's really sad to see how little effort they put in now, if they think the players are so impatient and want to get 95 so quick just leave out the cap quest.

[Inafking]

No more maat fights. We've had enough already.

[Alhanelem]

Maat fight is easy as pie for any player who has half decent gear, buys consumables, and knows what the hell they're doing.

Interesting fact, this is/was probably less than 1% of the playerbase that was hitting level 70 for the first time.
Which is roughly 100% of the elitists in the game. Interesting fact.

[Aver]

I managed to beat Maat once without knowing what 90% of the stuff in FFXI did, so I'm sure that plenty of people could beat Maat twice without knowing what 90% of the stuff in FFXI does.

Also, I do find the moogle/Maat/Brown Mage conversations funny even if they're not really content.

Exactly, a little levity in a game where the world is constantly ending is a nice thing.


Which is roughly 100% of the elitists in the game. Interesting fact.

lololololol

You have to be an elitist to know how to play your job/buy a vile elixir/vile elixir+1?

Congratulations, you just caused a fit of laughter so great my coworkers are looking at me funny.

[Zagen]

White Mages can occasionally get hate, especially with all the hate reset moves mobs have these days. Knowing how to keep yourself alive with cure bombs so your party doesn't have a weakened White Mage when they get hate off you is a valuable skill.
Abyssea taught me that a WHM with good gear/atma can hold an NM until it gets to rage timer. Later on I learned how WHM is a better tank than PLD inside abyssea. Neither of these 2 things apply to "standard" WHM play style


Cap your Divine Magic. He can still resist however, but the Maat fight for White Mage is brain dead easy between a Light Staff, Earth Staff and AF1 pants.

I suspect that White Mage just being a mule job to people could influence the lack of a win rate against Maat, the fight is incredibly easy with preparation.
Repose landed and it was the first Maat fight, I didn't auto win so I don't see the point other than being able to Repose > Debuff or some breathing room(is that needed on whm fight?), what's the point in mentioning it? I won 1/1 btw with cure method after Repose > Debuffs.


I was being a bit cheeky, considering that the Maat fight is more of a Monk with White Mage sub vs. White Mage fight then a WHM v. WHM fight.

A White Mage with good melee gear can defeat Maat between TP restore items. It isn't common, considering how much easier it is to just Repose him if it is your first fight. If you ever go after Maat for his cap, you'll need to be able to club him to death however.
Ah I see, oddly enough cure method on my taru mule took less time than meleeing it down as an 80 WHM for Maat's Cap. Though didn't have Black Halo at the time so no Hexa > Halo WS option.


Which is roughly 100% of the elitists in the game. Interesting fact.

LOL man my whole LS is filled with elitists then and here I thought I was in a casual LS learned something new.

ITT: Decent gear + Correct Item/Food usage = Elitist.

[Economizer]

Repose landed and it was the first Maat fight, I didn't auto win so I don't see the point

Repose lasts 90 seconds unresisted, and you have to survive for five minutes after your first hostile action on Maat. Basically, you have to Repose him 2-3 times unresisted, you can avoid having to do it a third time with enough distance and time between casts.

It is just an easier way of doing the cure method I suppose, but it definitely makes the fight much easier and cheaper if you don't have to cure spam yourself for five minutes.

[Zagen]

Repose lasts 90 seconds unresisted, and you have to survive for five minutes after your first hostile action on Maat. Basically, you have to Repose him 2-3 times unresisted, you can avoid having to do it a third time with enough distance and time between casts.

It is just an easier way of doing the cure method I suppose, but it definitely makes the fight much easier and cheaper if you don't have to cure spam yourself for five minutes.

Ah, interesting... swore I did it in less than 5 going the cure route but this was a several months ago and I don't think i took a screenshot.

[Cybernetic_Empire]

I agree that the final limit break needs to be a Maat style fight but not against the old man. He's had his time in the spotlight for almost every job. What needs to be done is to have a BC fight against a legendary NPC of the job type you're trying to limit break. As a matter of fact, if you can't find one for every job then introduce new ones via new storylines for each job's limit break. Furthermore, make the quest storyline meaningful to the job. Craft a great story around it and put effort into the cutscenes so that when players finish their jaws are on the floor and their hearts are racing. Lastly, make the fights HARD AS HELL! Players should get a reward for sticking with their jobs to the very end and they should earn the right to unlock their greatest potential. Merits and KS/KC/HKC reek of laziness and have created poor players all around.

[Ravenmore]

I agree that the final limit break needs to be a Maat style fight but not against the old man. He's had his time in the spotlight for almost every job. What needs to be done is to have a BC fight against a legendary NPC of the job type you're trying to limit break. As a matter of fact, if you can't find one for every job then introduce new ones via new storylines for each job's limit break. Furthermore, make the quest storyline meaningful to the job. Craft a great story around it and put effort into the cutscenes so that when players finish their jaws are on the floor and their hearts are racing. Lastly, make the fights HARD AS HELL! Players should get a reward for sticking with their jobs to the very end and they should earn the right to unlock their greatest potential. Merits and KS/KC/HKC reek of laziness and have created poor players all around.

Wouldn't do crap again you simply fail to see how many people don't really care for jobs they are forced to level to do endgame content. I seen so many great players on jobs in the past that were always stuck on some job they hated and did the least they could get away with. Its not even something new it was every where long before abyssea. Brds, rdms meriting that were just there as merit whore jobs cause they used the instant invite these job brought to get merit for their fav jobs. Leveling whm, brd, rdm, blm to get into a good endgame shell to get gear for the jobs they really enjoyed.

If you were willing to play a job no one else wanted to or were tired of coming only as whm to every single event you would gladly take some moron that filled a role that a bot could with out the risk of using a cure bot(while it been next to 0 point remains). If you were honest and look back at the good old days of 75 cap I willing to put good money on that 90% of the gimp of old are the same type you see now, only level a job to use at endgame for the goal of gearing another job. If that your goal then investing as little as you can in the "whore" job for you main is simple logic.

Few players suck at every single job that they don't have one job they know like the back of their hand and could trash any solo BCNM. In fact I lump any one that complains about pugs into the same group as the gimps. You can fix it your self by avoiding pugs and only doing things with people you trust and know personally from past interactions and know they are not brain dead.

[Zagen]

Thinking about it I would love to see new Maat fights for a lvl 99 version of maat's cap. Setup could be as simple as trading him the cap on a given job to begin the fight. Forget running to BCNMs just fight him in Ru'Lude instance :D Make the fight start right away so no time for buffs or anything that would be fun/annoying all in one.

[Saefinn]

Wouldn't do crap again you simply fail to see how many people don't really care for jobs they are forced to level to do endgame content. I seen so many great players on jobs in the past that were always stuck on some job they hated and did the least they could get away with.

This is good point actually. I wonder how many people who don't play their jobs 'properly' are only doing it because they have to? I know people blame it on laziness and being keywhores or leechers, without perhaps thinking why they might have keywhored or leeched that job.

I think I mentioned in the previous "Maat 2.0" thread, where the OP was calling for an ultra difficult Maat fight that 'teach people to play their jobs properly'...people are only gonna focus on their preferred jobs, the ones they spent a lot of time into - the poster also suggested that people do it for every job, so that's your bandwagon WHM out of the window. Without it being for each job, you're still faced with the same problem.

[Soranika]

would it matter. Do fight with the job that's "easiest" as player testimonies and guides for job specific battles will flood out. Then beat, go back to leveling whatever job of choice without actually being made aware of the limitations and where the job shines.

However as it stands, it won't teach nothing. As it stands now, choice of subjob MATTERS and how you use your subjob matters. I did the original maat fight for limit break on SMN. I've only applied the very same strategy I used there ones and that was on the ENM to get an astral pop, which made you level 60 but didn't really take in the fact that merits and experience made it a piece of cake.

[Kraggy]

The Maat fight for White Mage has three possible ways to win, if it is your first fight, and thus can teach these lessons.

A) White Mage can tank a mob for an extended period of time by curing itself.
B) How to sleep a mob with Repose. See A for details on what happens when you get a resist.
C) Hexa Strike is better then Asuran Fists.

B and C have the added advantages of getting a White Mage to cap Divine Magic or Club skill respectively.
(B) wasn't available when the first WHMs were trying this fight, Respose makes the fight pretty easy now, 'back in the day' it was far from trivial.