RE Bayohne: Square Enix Account Transfer FAQ (Addl. Currency change fees)

[Behemothx]

Can you confirm that we will not have currency change fees with clickandbuy? I live in Canada and so far I have not had to deal with currency conversion fees, I seriously hope there's not. :mad:

[Luso]

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/10386-Square-Enix-Account-Transfer-FAQ?p=156830#post156830

I think this might answer your question.

[Alhanelem]

Can you confirm that we will not have currency change fees with clickandbuy? I live in Canada and so far I have not had to deal with currency conversion fees, I seriously hope there's not. :mad:
If you can actually pay with US dollars, there won't be. I'd assume that C&B will take the USD amount out of your account and it's your bank that does the conversion. But I could be wrong.

[Behemothx]

If you can actually pay with US dollars, there won't be. I'd assume that C&B will take the USD amount out of your account and it's your bank that does the conversion. But I could be wrong.

I'm Canadian, why the hell would my bank let me pay in US Dollars?? AFAIK Canada's currency is CAD$

My statement always showed me the USD value in CAD.

[Behemothx]

Edited: Wrong quote, sorry :confused:

No, it does not. It's so full of interpretation I could write 15 songs about it.

The Q&B ToS says it charges conversion fees and SE guys say they don't without actually pointing to a concrete point on their ToS.

[Alhanelem]

I'm Canadian, why the hell would my bank let me pay in US Dollars??A better quesiton is why wouldn't they? You wouldn't be able to use credit or debit cards outside of your country if you couldn't, and living in a tourist trap town for Canadians from Quebec, I can assure you that people do this all the time.

So check your bank's fee schedule. There should be something in it about that if there is a fee.

[Behemothx]

Whoa there cowboy, not asking about your trips :) I am saying that usually my CREDIT CARD deals with conversions not the persons I actually PAY.

(Edited a bit late, sorry let me clarify)

ToS from C&B Section 17 re: Customers:


Currency Exchange Fee Where We are required to exchange currency in order to process Your transactions, We will apply this fee to the amount of Your monetary value that is converted. 5.9%

So now do you know what I mean? This would mean that a THIRD party would charge me a fee for dealing with outside currencies.

[Behemothx]

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/10386-Square-Enix-Account-Transfer-FAQ?p=156830#post156830

I think this might answer your question.

Nope, this talks about region-specific clients, not currency.

[Bayohne]

Sorry if it wasn't clear because we didn't list every fee that is associated with a separate ClickandBuy E-Money account, but again to clarify, no fees will be charged beyond the subscription cost for customers using ClickandBuy to pay for their subscription.

[Behemothx]

Thanks for your response Matt, much appreciated.

Just to be clear though, since you've not mentioned anything about currencies, saying no other fees also applies to countries other than UK, US and EU right?

I used to pay 12.95, my credit card handled conversion which I prefer.

The terms of service of C&B section 17 says they have a fee of 5.9% ~ "Where We are required to exchange currency in order to process Your transactions" which is not clear to me and a LOT of people outside US, UK or EU.

Can you please clarify?

Thanks, sincerely.

[Raksha]

If I had to guess (based on nothing at all) I would think that your bank/CC company would convert the currency before it ever gets to Click and Buy. I doubt C&B would charge you any conversion fee.

No idea how it's actually gonna shake out for you though.

Good luck.

[Laphine]

Thanks for your response Matt, much appreciated.

Just to be clear though, since you've not mentioned anything about currencies, saying no other fees also applies to countries other than UK, US and EU right?

I used to pay 12.95, my credit card handled conversion which I prefer.

The terms of service of C&B section 17 says they have a fee of 5.9% ~ "Where We are required to exchange currency in order to process Your transactions" which is not clear to me and a LOT of people outside US, UK or EU.

Can you please clarify?

Thanks, sincerely.

That's true. And pay pal has it too. Cheaper, at 3.5%, tho.

Idk if it only applies to me, and the shitty number of taxes we have in Brazil, but i already pay 6.4% fee as impost over exchange operations. So i benefit from click and buy, and benefit even more from pay pal, if they make the exchange in advance.

[Bayohne]

Can you please clarify?

No fees will be charged beyond the subscription cost for customers using ClickandBuy to pay for their subscription. :)

[Ziyyigo-Tipyigo]

I think I like you better as a morbol.

It sounds to me like the currency exchange fee is only charged if you're paying with your ClickandBuy balance rather than "directly" with your credit card. And if you do it the way the FAQ and the reps are saying, you won't be "loading" your account to begin with (your money will only be passing through rather than stopping).

So... the only exchange fee would be whatever your bank charges, I'm guessing.

[RAIST]

Either way, there will likely be a currency conversion fee if your native currency is not accepted somewhere in the transaction. Just depends on whether it is your bank, the Clearing House handling the transaction, or the front end handling the actual purchase.

[Ziyyigo-Tipyigo]

Yeah, but for Canadians, et al, that's nothing new. The question was whether people would have to pay ClickandBuy's steep conversion rate, or if they'd keep paying their bank's as they're accustomed.

[Alhanelem]

Where We are required to exchange currency in order to process Your transactionsThat would only be if your credit card didn't handle it. As far as I know, most if not all do.

And the community team are making it pretty clear that the fees listed on the site only apply to the E-money accounts and do not apply to any money that is not ever held on to by click and buy.

[Behemothx]

Awesome! :)

As long as my CC/Bank handles the conversion I'm cool with that. And thanks again Matt, for responding. :)

[Kristal]

No fees will be charged beyond the subscription cost for customers using ClickandBuy to pay for their subscription. :)

Yet SE definitely is charging ~40% for Euro to Dollar conversion...

[Kraggy]

Yet SE definitely is charging ~40% for Euro to Dollar conversion...
What has that got to do with anything being discussed here, or indeed what has that got to do with anything?

[RAIST]

Think that may be a reference to how some people had their base currency changed up on them and they are now getting hit with the crappy USD/EURO exchange rate.

[Niyariko]

;) aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

[Maacha]

I wonder if this would be the place to ask if there will be some accommodation made for people who are unable to use Click and Buy to pay (they do not support our country) and who cannot buy Crysta (Crysta not available to purchase from their country yet)? Without some change, all those people(including me) will be forced to allow their accounts to lapse...

[RAIST]

And... here is another reason NOT to use C&B. A snag posted on another forum. Catwho, a US player (1 state away from me, and uses the same bank I do) used C&B and got slapped with a fee from his bank because the new payment method is no longer using a US based bank and is being FORCED to go through an international vendor now:

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/forum.html?forum=10&mid=1311755124317849273&h=50&p=5#219


Well, just hit my first snag. My bank charged me an extra 60 cents for buying $20 worth of Crysta via Click and Buy, calling it an international transaction. I had no warning from Click and Buy or from SE that there would be the extra charge.

[Behemothx]

I would change banks asap. :D

[MarkovChain]

And... here is another reason NOT to use C&B. A snag posted on another forum. Catwho, a US player (1 state away from me, and uses the same bank I do) used C&B and got slapped with a fee from his bank because the new payment method is no longer using a US based bank and is being FORCED to go through an international vendor now:

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/forum.html?forum=10&mid=1311755124317849273&h=50&p=5#219

The line from "click and buy" appeared today on my bank account operation listing. I purchased 10000 crysta, got charged 100€, no fee. Way too much umadness™ going on on the internetz. People arguing because they are idiots.

[RAIST]

likely because you are using the Eruo, which is the same currency where C&B is based...Catwho is in the US. If C&B was in the US (like the processer used for POL was), Catwho wo0uld not have been charged an INTERNATIONAL TRANSFER FEE, and you may have been charged one.

[Romanova]

The line from "click and buy" appeared today on my bank account operation listing. I purchased 10000 crysta, got charged 100€, no fee. Way too much umadness™ going on on the internetz. People arguing because they are idiots.

I like this logic. "Because it didn't happen to me, it must not have happen to anyone."

[Ziyyigo-Tipyigo]

Catwho, a US player (1 state away from me, and uses the same bank I do) used C&B and got slapped with a fee from his bank because the new payment method is no longer using a US based bank and is being FORCED to go through an international vendor now:

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/forum.html?forum=10&mid=1311755124317849273&h=50&p=5#219

Sounds like the bank's fault to me.

Such a fee would be buried in the fee schedule in your credit card's terms of service. Neither Square-Enix nor CilckandBuy have any control over that, it's a contract that is between only you and your bank. Blaming one of them for this fee would be like blaming them for your credit card's interest rate.

Not all banks charge the same fees, and not all banks charge fees for everything.

With that being said, at least with my own credit card, I don't believe I'm charged extra for "international transactions" per se, but for currency conversion (e.g. if I'm using a Canadian bank account with Canadian money to pay for this thing in US dollars).

If I were the OP, I'd review the fee schedule on my credit card to make sure it is properly applied.

And if I had a ClickandBuy account, I wouldn't be buying Crysta, I'd just be using the automatic billing instead. Using ClickandBuy to buy Crysta just seems... silly.

[RAIST]

The point is the act of paying for FFXI never incurred any additional costs to this user until SE forced us to change our payment methods--and only because they have chosen to extend the previous sytem to JUST the JP Region.

[Ziyyigo-Tipyigo]

Just went to the OP's bank's website (Wells Fargo), read the credit card terms they have there, and verified that the 3% fee is for foreign currencies, and should not be charged on US accounts that are charged in US dollars, regardless of where the charge came from.

The OP's bank screwed up and charged an illegitimate fee that the OP will have to yell at the bank about. Wells Fargo has been screwing people over since forever.

You can nerd rage all you want, but complaining to Square-Enix won't get Wells Fargo to take off the erroneous charge.

[Pharaun]

The point isn't that they want SE to refund the fee, the point is that the fee was never charged under the old system due to the billing happening from within the US instead of from outside the country.

[RAIST]

The point isn't that they want SE to refund the fee, the point is that the fee was never charged under the old system due to the billing happening from within the US instead of from outside the country.

YES!! SOMEONE ELSE GETS IT!!!!

[Fusionx]

No other fees? When i go to sign up for click and buy its telling me its trying to charge $2.40 when i get to the verified by visa screen. What is this?

[RAIST]

They're "pinging" your account, and then you are supposed to confirm the amount sent. It's a round-a-bout way for them to do the same thing that MC SecureCode, Visa Verified by Visa, JCB Jsecure, and AMEX SafeKey do. Only with them you supply a password at the point of sale to streamline it (in some cases, a digicert on your PC may be used to stop the popup verifications).

[Kit_Katz]

Sorry if it wasn't clear because we didn't list every fee that is associated with a separate ClickandBuy E-Money account, but again to clarify, no fees will be charged beyond the subscription cost for customers using ClickandBuy to pay for their subscription.

It is nice and reassuring and all that we don't have to pay Click&Buy, but you claim "no additional fees" yet there most certainly are additional fees for residents of Oceania (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oceania). Most notably of which is Australia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australasia) a continent that is in fact not part of Europe (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europe), but instead share a time zone with Square Enix's own base of operations Japan (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan), which it seems is a point Square Enix needs clarified for them explicitly. Residents of Australia are indeed forced to pay additional fees over what they did in the old payment system, but it is not originating from Click&Buy but instead from Square Enix itself.

They are being forced to pay in Euro (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Member_states_of_the_European_Union) the currency of the member states of the European Union, of which Australia is not a part. This translates in layman's terms to an increased service charge, so much so in fact that more than one of my close friends will be forced to quit playing Final Fantasy Online because they likely can not afford this increase.

So after a little refresher on geography, I was wondering if Square Enix had any plans to make the system equitable to all of its customers rather than alienating some? Is it really to difficult to ask them for say 11.95 AUD or whatever equivalent rather than the Euro cost?

[Kit_Katz]

To elaborate on my previous statement for those unfamiliar with currency conversion.

Australia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australia) formerly was forced to pay in USD for their monthly fees. So from the beginning they were just tossed the game as an afterthought it seems and given a shoddy work around. Fortunately the USD and AUD convert relatively well and the base $11.95 USD comes to around $11.50 AUD. But they like we are now in the US, were forced to pay overseas exchange fees from the start meaning they had always paid a bit more than us but not enough to cause alarm.

Under the new system Australians are lumped in with Europe, and are forced a Euro charge. The Euro however does not convert to AUD well at all. Their normal service fee suddenly becomes 11.95 Euro + 4 mules. Not bad on the surface? Except that 11.95 Euro is $16.30 AUD.

So instead of paying what they should be paying with a base $11.95 AUD service fee, they have $4AUD added on to their bill. Compounding the problem is Square charges an additional Euro per character further skewing the conversion against them and in Square Enix's favor (which conveniently enough translates into more Yen than if they charged AU players their region's fair amount). All mules in total their once roughly $15 AUD monthly fee turns into just shy of $22 AUD per month per account, a significant $7 AUD price hike. This means the more mules you have, the more you are overcharged.

To shortchange a market like Oceania (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oceania) even if it is somewhat smaller than other regions is really beyond me. Is there some hidden law that disallows Square Enix from dealing with Countries of the region or handling Australian currency? I admit Australia is notorious for banning things frivolously, and has a field day attacking games in their media so much that many residents are forced to buy overseas products but I don't think this would factor in here. Regardless of the region's geographic size I have met many players from Australia and many are good friends. Friends who it seems I may no longer be able to play with.

So what's up Square, how does giving the Americas and Oceania the short end of the stick (Oceania's much shorter) solve the problems that were inherent in the original billing method?
It seems more and more prevalent for Square Enix to take a wait and see approach on everything they do after tossing out a hastily conceived plan full of holes till they see how many of us fall through in the beta stage. Contrary to what the higher ups may have hoped we are in fact not Guinea Pigs but paying customers, I was under the impression that means something. But maybe I was wrong?

Maybe any silver lining to be found would be that our bills over here in the Americas just got higher too thanks to overseas processing fees, though unlike the issue faced by AU players who pay more straight into Square Enix's pockets, our brand new fees just go to our bank. So maybe I'll be joining my friends elsewhere and leaving this game behind for something better if these problems can't be fixed.

[RAIST]

Yeah...Australia mistakingly gets lumped in with EU for some stupid reason...maybe their post WW2 history is a bit screwy and they don't realize Austraila is it's own entity now. Unfortunately, until SE realize this, it means you get hit by the new policy as stated in the NA KB/FAQ:

http://support.na.square-enix.com/faqarticle.php?kid=59527&id=20&la=1

- The currency of fees (i.e. monthly subscription fee, World Transfer Service fee,fee for purchasing registration codes, etc.) will be based on the region for the Square Enix account
(it's all the way at the bottom, easy to miss)

IDK just what their deal is with Australia...they just seem to be the red-headed step-child for SE. Not only are they not approving Crysta, they won't even put up a portal for them on their own merchandise site--they send you to AU based iKON, a third party, to order things:

http://www.square-enix-shop.com/au/fake-au.html