Masters of the boofs

[Gotterdammerung]

After a long career of activating soul powers and battlestances that draw away power from one area to bring it to another area, i propose dark knight become the master of the JA boof.

This would be a Job trait for drk obtained somewhere between 91 and 99.

The effect:
Duration of JA buffs will only count down while engaged with a weapon drawn.

In other words, if you were swinging on a dhalmel, and used Blood Weapon, and the dhalmel died 15 seconds later, when you put your weapon away the remaining 15 seconds of Blood Weapon would store until you pulled out your weapon again to kill a new target.

Due to the nature of Job traits and transparency, Job ability buffs from other classes should also be affected. But you could choose not to let them be affected. Or you could choose certain ones that aren't affected. Like if the magic buff JA actually gets implemented it shouldn't work with this JT because it can be used without ever engaging and you wouldn't want an infinite buff tweak.

Ultimately, i think this small JT is very powerful because it allows dark to actually efficiently benefit from all their JA buffs. But, as they are meant to be the front runners on reckless brutal damage, and they are currently too far behind on the DD curve, i think that a JT like this, even tho its strong, would be balanced.


P.S. on a side note: I think aftermath from relic/emp/mythic should work this way as well. Nothing is more annoying than hitting a WS and killing something, then running to engage the next thing only to see your aftermath ware after 1 swing on the new monster. Aftermath should either be changed to X number of hits after a WS or have its duration only tic down while engaged with weapon out.

[Urteil]

........?

Are you the one who made the manifesto?

[Gotterdammerung]

........?

Are you the one who made the manifesto?

Hell i wish i was. Those JA's were awesome. I hope they still get implemented. Then smart players can put dark back on the map. And you can hear about it on the forums and copy it and feel good about yourself again.

[Urteil]

Well its a good thing to know that while perusing the map you won't be anywhere on it.

[Gotterdammerung]

I expected as much. When players like me come up with new better ways to do things, players like you rarely like to actually give them credit for it. You just copy it as quick as you can, laugh at anyone who doesn't do it, complain when its eventually ruined and look to the next inventive thing to copy.

[Manicora]

lol Gotter, i'm gona slap you in game now I like you idea and cant steal it damn you Man!!!

[Urteil]

I expected as much. When players like me come up with new better ways to do things, players like you rarely like to actually give them credit for it. You just copy it as quick as you can, laugh at anyone who doesn't do it, complain when its eventually ruined and look to the next inventive thing to copy.

Your'e funny to assume I'd want credit, or copy anything out of anyone's mouth in this entire Job-Specific forum.

Let alone whats above.

[Jar]

What is this i dont even....



















and to the OP No.

[Gotterdammerung]

A new ability that sacrifices TP gain to make attacks more powerful.

This is SE's creative way of giving u a chance to compete.

Drk's complained about how razed ruin made it hard for your WS's to compete with crit WS's. And SE's answer was to give you a way to make WS's obsolete for drk.

With an ability like the manifesto proposed, Drk's would be able to do hellaciously devastating regular swings with weapons like Redemption and magnus scythe. I can make drk crit for over 1k now with proper gear and atma's and thats just using a woeborn with no soul eater. With no store tp needs in your TP set you can lean towards haste, atk, multi hits, crit rate and crit dmg up gear. With atma's you can reach a very high crit rate. With atmas u can reach a very high crit dmg bonus.

I understand the abilities bonus is unknown but SE isn't stupid. They know this ability STOPS the player from Weapon skilling. I highly doubt they would make such a high cost for a 10% dmg boost to melee swings or something ridiculous like that. It should be more like a 50% dmg boost or maybe even as high as double dmg boost to melee swings.

With a bonus around their a dark could easily do as much in 5 hits as another DD with 4 hits + WS

Especially when using magnus scythe and throwing down 3k crits


But enough about this crap, there is alredy a whine topic for manifesto griping. Talk about the OP ability or GTFO.

[Jar]

A new ability that sacrifices TP gain to make attacks more powerful.

This is SE's creative way of giving u a chance to compete.

Drk's complained about how razed ruin made it hard for your WS's to compete with crit WS's. And SE's answer was to give you a way to make WS's obsolete for drk.

With an ability like the manifesto proposed, Drk's would be able to do hellaciously devastating regular swings with weapons like Redemption and magnus scythe. I can make drk crit for over 1k now with proper gear and atma's and thats just using a woeborn with no soul eater. With no store tp needs in your TP set you can lean towards haste, atk, multi hits, crit rate and crit dmg up gear. With atma's you can reach a very high crit rate. With atmas u can reach a very high crit dmg bonus.

I understand the abilities bonus is unknown but SE isn't stupid. They know this ability STOPS the player from Weapon skilling. I highly doubt they would make such a high cost for a 10% dmg boost to melee swings or something ridiculous like that. It should be more like a 50% dmg boost or maybe even as high as double dmg boost to melee swings.

With a bonus around their a dark could easily do as much in 5 hits as another DD with 4 hits + WS

Especially when using magnus scythe and throwing down 3k crits


But enough about this crap, there is alredy a whine topic for manifesto griping. Talk about the OP ability or GTFO.

i dunno if you knew this but most ppl thought of the Physical update note to be meh and didnt care alot the Magical update is what raged ppl.

Also unless the Melee update is +100% damage per hit(because the rumer is that you will gain ZERO Tp a hit)

it will hardly even make up for the loss in WS outside abyssea inside tho it will pull ahead with even a +75% boost.

And i already disagree with the OP but if you would like a reason it would be because id like new things to be added not just ability timers to be nulled.

Also in long term engagements as well as battlefields and instanced stuff dyna einherjar ext~ This would add nothing to the Job as you will be attacking 100% of the time already

[Kagato]

..............................Boof?

[Gotterdammerung]

Also unless the Melee update is +100% damage per hit(because the rumer is that you will gain ZERO Tp a hit)

it will hardly even make up for the loss in WS outside abyssea inside tho it will pull ahead with even a +75% boost.

Yeh, i agree. It needs to be an appropriate boost or its worthless. But why not just ask for that. Show support for 75% boost or GTFO. Don't blaze the whole idea.

Also, whereas 50% boost or lower won't catch you up to other DD/sams, i still believe that 50% boost with drk/war with (Relic, Emp, or Magnus Scythe) would beat current Caladbolg drk/sam X hit.



i dunno if you knew this but most ppl thought of the Physical update note to be meh and didnt care alot the Magical update is what raged ppl.

The magic side is equally unknown. But again Se has been giving some seriously big boosts lately.

The results plds are getting from divine emblem right now seem real close to the way the description for the magic boost sounded.

Holy was pretty crap dmg b4 hand and pld had the same casting limitations for divine magic that dark knights have for elemental magic.

Right now divine emblem is glitched and also providing a bonus to specifically aoelian edge causing 9k aoelian edges to normal monsters.

And the screenies have shown holy's for 4-8k dmg. I personally never saw a pld do more than 1k b4 hand with holy. and that was with some serious trying.

This magic buff could of been a great addition to drk's repertoire. And since it said damage to next spell that means it should also work with drain II allowing for some serious dmg boosting to that spell. They also might introduce new dark based dmg spells for dark, since some drks are asking for them.

Either way i think divine emblem shows that 1 JA can instantly replace magic boosting job traits and gear.



And i already disagree with the OP but if you would like a reason it would be because id like new things to be added not just ability timers to be nulled.

Thank you for contributing to the topic. Yes, i did want a reason, so thanks for giving one.

It's a good opinion. Fresh new stuff is more fun than stuff that alters old abilities.

But i still maintain this OP JT would be a very strong addition.

#1 being able to use JA's b4 the fight without worrying about wasting timers will save on JA delay during the fight.

#2 being able to conserve left over time in between pulls and during dead time will help to allow drk to keep their buffs up for more of the actual fighting time.

#3 having a neat useful trick that other jobs don't get is cool way to help define a class and lately the lines between DD's are to muddled. JT like this helps to draw new lines.

#4 getting something like this doesn't mean you can't get something else completely new.



Also in long term engagements as well as battlefields and instanced stuff dyna einherjar ext~ This would add nothing to the Job as you will be attacking 100% of the time already

There is still dead time even in those events. And even if there wasn't, it really doesn't matter. Sometimes stuff just isnt any good in a certain situation. It doesn't make it a bad ability, it just makes it bad for this 1 particular situation. I.E.

souleater vs things immune to souleater
Chi blast with tp inhibition on NMs with special regain
stun on things immune to stun


There is tons of situations in the game where good abilities and traits are made useless by a particular situation. By your logic nearly half the game shouldn't exist because in one particular instance, it is not as good as something else.

[Urteil]

I'm kind of in the magic camp.


But even I'm going to say that "Sacrifice TP" and DRK being in the same sentence is fucking horrifying.

[Jar]

There is still dead time even in those events. And even if there wasn't, it really doesn't matter. Sometimes stuff just isnt any good in a certain situation. It doesn't make it a bad ability, it just makes it bad for this 1 particular situation. I.E.

souleater vs things immune to souleater
Chi blast with tp inhibition on NMs with special regain
stun on things immune to stun


There is tons of situations in the game where good abilities and traits are made useless by a particular situation. By your logic nearly half the game shouldn't exist because in one particular instance, it is not as good as something else.

Well occasions when i pull out DRK now are more or less Soily to do EXP merks with my Linkshell(DRK performs much better riding aftermath on weak mobs than Rubytstic WAR/MNK/NIN) or get the odd Blu/red proc ppl in LS asking for.


And the dead time in events thing is a good point ish i guess i Aim for ZERO dead time when i am doing things tho and the bonus that this would be offering is much less than souleater because i can name on my 2 hands every mob that resists souleater and makes it worthless ~~ but i could also name on my hands the number of times this Job trait would be a great asset. because in no time is buffing off time doing to win in flat parsing situations or DPT situations or zergs or solo or anything from my point of view.

More or less just think of a JT that doesnt focus on off time because aiming for being best when there is alot of idle time is like aiming for being the best when you are missing alot(lol old Zanshin..)

[Gotterdammerung]

Your looking at it wrong. No matter how good you are at killing things there is always gonna be down time. If its one big NM your going to have times when you have to wait for a ??? repop or times when u have to move to a different ???. You might have times where you died and are weakened. And there is other instances, you can think of some surely.

For fighting multiple things in rapid succession like dynamis or nyzul or an exp party, you have down time. No matter how fast you are you are at least gonna waste 1 second changing mobs. And usually its more like 5 seconds but can be as long as 15 seconds if you have to cover any distance to the next mob. Obviously the situations change but even in the best scenario of an auto-switch target to a mob standing right beside the previous target, you will waste at least a second.

There is dead time everywhere. And in terms of duration. lets take last resort fully merited for instance. It is NOT 180 seconds on and 70 seconds off. It IS 180 seconds on minus dead time on and 70 seconds off. Over the course of an entire event i guarantee this ability will largely increase the amount of time that you kept your buffs up. Because it lowers the "minus dead time."

[Jar]

Your looking at it wrong. No matter how good you are at killing things there is always gonna be down time. If its one big NM your going to have times when you have to wait for a ??? repop or times when u have to move to a different ???. You might have times where you died and are weakened. And there is other instances, you can think of some surely.

For fighting multiple things in rapid succession like dynamis or nyzul or an exp party, you have down time. No matter how fast you are you are at least gonna waste 1 second changing mobs. And usually its more like 5 seconds but can be as long as 15 seconds if you have to cover any distance to the next mob. Obviously the situations change but even in the best scenario of an auto-switch target to a mob standing right beside the previous target, you will waste at least a second.

There is dead time everywhere. And in terms of duration. lets take last resort fully merited for instance. It is NOT 180 seconds on and 70 seconds off. It IS 180 seconds on minus dead time on and 70 seconds off. Over the course of an entire event i guarantee this ability will largely increase the amount of time that you kept your buffs up. Because it lowers the "minus dead time."

you do know you can switch target Manually right as the mob dies to keep the weapon always out and overall make you deal alot more damage? this is a big thing with Constant DD/Time limited engagements any wasted time is wasted time and will NEVER be better than just sticking to attacking.

nothing that supports Slow reactions and idle time will ever be supported by me. because it is retarded to support laziness.

Also you shouldn't fight back by slapping your own abilities usefulness in the face. the times you bring up and try and defend are litteraly just removing 10 seconds from the recast on last resort every use that isnt even a 6% boost in last resort time so for Usefulness you've about nulled it in most situations.

[Gotterdammerung]

Yes i know how to switch from target to target.
Im a main bst. Quick reaction time and low down time is essential for the kinds of activities i perform solo.
I don't pull in 180 coins a dyna run solo by being slow and taking my time.



10 more seconds every 4 minutes is an extra 5 minutes of actual active soul eater bonus over a 2 hour event. and thats just 1 JA buff on a player moving at a ridiculously flawless machinelike speed. There is still lots of other buffs in play that are getting the same extra time.

[Jar]

10 more seconds every 4 minutes is an extra 5 minutes of actual active soul eater bonus over a 2 hour event. and thats just 1 JA buff on a player moving at a ridiculously flawless machinelike speed. There is still lots of other buffs in play that are getting the same extra time.

annnnnd an extra 5 min in 2 hours is 4% Nice example.

[StingRay104]

I think the name for the JT you designed is befitting. The name is terrible just like the ability. First off its purpose is to effectively halt the duration timer while our weapons are sheathed, well I can say that SE would say that this couldn't be implicated due to code limitation/ps2 limitations/just too lazy limitations/FF vs 13(aka SE goes to the bahamas) limitations/insert whatever limitation floats your boat. Second this is your big fix to DRK, keeping our buffs up 1-3 seconds longer mass killings, or allow us to buff before the big nm fight and save all that time, the extra few seconds you save us won't have that big of an effect we need a whole lot more than just that. Finally on the discussion of the sacrifices tp for more melee damage ability, it seems that everyone aside from you and leonlionheart hates the new ability, reason being ws's have tremendous power and use, for instance the new ability would have tremendous effect on the aftermath abilities of relic/mythic/empyrean weapons, and the last thing anyone whose gone thro the trouble to obtain these weapons wants is to have the power taken from them. All in all people like ws's and to take away from that aspect of DRK is just wrong, especially since what it seems like SE is doing is just turning us into an even more zergable job. Now its been brought up before and SE has ignored it, but we would much rather we get an ability that eats our mp to deal extra damage, like MP attack on FFIX, and this idea is far more popular than the 2 lame ideas SE gave us, and yes don't kid yourself the magic damage idea is lame because DRK wasn't meant to cast BLM nukes, it doesn't have the mp pool to accomendate this.

[Gotterdammerung]

So... wats your point.

4% of 100 million dollars is 4 million.

% is merely a way of tracking relativity.

5 minutes of extra last resort is useful.

4 million dollars is a lot of money.

And again this is numbers based of 1 out of the many JA's and based on a machine perfect run.

Whereas, its actually playing into all your JA buffs and in reality it actual grows stronger when u apply those mortal times when ... i dunno, you have to pee or the pull is a tiny 3 seconds to slow, or when sumone else has to pee, or poop even!, or when you kill everything in the area and are waiting on respawns, or when competition for a camp causes a slight bit of extra down time, or 100 million different other things.


If you sumhow found some perfect LS filled with amazing people who never make any mistakes and never take bathroom breaks and never stop swinging for even seconds during an event, then congratulations. That is a real accomplishment. More impressive to me than getting all the emp, relic and empyrean weapons on one character.

If thats the case then ya this ability might not improve your performance much. But for the rest of the population, including some really skillful players, this trait would be useful.

[Urteil]

for instance the new ability would have tremendous effect on the aftermath abilities of relic/mythic/empyrean weapons, and the last thing anyone whose gone thro the trouble to obtain these weapons wants is to have the power taken from them.


This is true, not to mention Catastrophe, Scourge, Torcleaver, Quietus are not Elemental WS's.

So unless SE is going to give us A+ sworld skill and Shield Skill and expects us to go around spamming Sanguine blade, LOL @ THEIR SHIT IDEAS.


SE gave us, and yes don't kid yourself the magic damage idea is lame because DRK wasn't meant to cast BLM nukes, it doesn't have the mp pool to accomendate this.

I'm hume and my mp pool can do this just fine.

The problem is we are TWO tiers behind in spells, and don't even have magical attack bonus 1.

[Gotterdammerung]

I think the name for the JT you designed is befitting. The name is terrible just like the ability. First off its purpose is to effectively halt the duration timer while our weapons are sheathed, well I can say that SE would say that this couldn't be implicated due to code limitation/ps2 limitations/just too lazy limitations/FF vs 13(aka SE goes to the bahamas) limitations/insert whatever limitation floats your boat. Second this is your big fix to DRK, keeping our buffs up 1-3 seconds longer mass killings, or allow us to buff before the big nm fight and save all that time, the extra few seconds you save us won't have that big of an effect we need a whole lot more than just that. Finally on the discussion of the sacrifices tp for more melee damage ability, it seems that everyone aside from you and leonlionheart hates the new ability, reason being ws's have tremendous power and use, for instance the new ability would have tremendous effect on the aftermath abilities of relic/mythic/empyrean weapons, and the last thing anyone whose gone thro the trouble to obtain these weapons wants is to have the power taken from them. All in all people like ws's and to take away from that aspect of DRK is just wrong, especially since what it seems like SE is doing is just turning us into an even more zergable job. Now its been brought up before and SE has ignored it, but we would much rather we get an ability that eats our mp to deal extra damage, like MP attack on FFIX, and this idea is far more popular than the 2 lame ideas SE gave us, and yes don't kid yourself the magic damage idea is lame because DRK wasn't meant to cast BLM nukes, it doesn't have the mp pool to accomendate this.

#1 i didnt name the ability it doesn't have a name.

#2 I never said anything about this JT being a big fix for DRK. Don't put words into my mouth.

#3a Stop acting like it was really "trouble" to make an emp.
#3b Aftermaths could be incorporated into the ability by using the WS b4 u activate the JA.
#3c If you looove WS's you wouldn't have to use it... So no power is actually being taken away from you. You still have the option of hugging your X-hit build.
#3d Dark is a zerg job so why wouldn't it be moving in that direction? Fast hard wreckless damage = zerg damage= dark.

#4 An ability... that eats mp... to deal damage.... soooo, you mean a spell?

#5 maybe you shouldn't of played a dhalmel or a galka. I play galka. I don't get angry at SE when they give blm new spells with higher mp costs. I don't ask them for abilities that make it easier for me as a galka to cast high cost spells. I understand that its a limit of my race. Its on me to catch up
and work extra hard to be on top of a class with an MP pool. Other races can get plenty of MP on drk for nuking. especially in abyssea.

#6 Why would dark cast blm nukes? Use drk nukes insted.

[StingRay104]

#1 i didnt name the ability it doesn't have a name.

#2 I never said anything about this JT being a big fix for DRK. Don't put words into my mouth.

#3a Stop acting like it was really "trouble" to make an emp.
#3b Aftermaths could be incorporated into the ability by using the WS b4 u activate the JA.
#3c If you looove WS's you wouldn't have to use it... So no power is actually being taken away from you. You still have the option of hugging your X-hit build.
#3d Dark is a zerg job so why wouldn't it be moving in that direction? Fast hard wreckless damage = zerg damage= dark.

#4 An ability... that eats mp... to deal damage.... soooo, you mean a spell?

#5 maybe you shouldn't of played a dhalmel or a galka. I play galka. I don't get angry at SE when they give blm new spells with higher mp costs. I don't ask them for abilities that make it easier for me as a galka to cast high cost spells. I understand that its a limit of my race. Its on me to catch up
and work extra hard to be on top of a class with an MP pool. Other races can get plenty of MP on drk for nuking. especially in abyssea.

#6 Why would dark cast blm nukes? Use drk nukes insted.

#1 After a long career of activating soul powers and battlestances that draw away power from one area to bring it to another area, i propose dark knight become the master of the JA boof. Sorry everytime I read this part of your post I still ask myself wtf is boof, so the only natural conclusion is its the name of the idea your pitching.

#2 The way you are defending this thing so hardcore your making it sound like the ultimate fix to DRK, but thats my opinion and I'm entitled to that.

#3a There are other weapons with aftermath, or did you not know that? Also they may be easier to build than the relics and mythics but they still take more than any other weapons to get.

#3b So in order to use aftermath in any fight that lasts longer than the original aftermath duration I have to drop this ability to build TP and then put it back up when I'm done, or SE can realize that they weren't thinking and not make TP be consumed. BIG SPOILER FOR LATER POINT: Consumes TP for more damage sounds like a WS.

#3c So I should just be happy with getting nothing from SE again, right.........WRONG!!!!! Just because you love zerging so much doesn't mean that everyone else does. As you've seen people both JP and ENG players didn't like the manifesto for DRK, as well as many other jobs.

#3d Remember the souleater nerf? SE doesn't like zerg jobs so ultimately the odds are heavily stacked in favor of this JA being horribly underwhelming, and thus it would just be a big waste of SE's time for something the vast majority of players don't want.

#4 1.21 Jigawatts Marty a message from the future, Consumes TP for more damage sounds like a WS. Great scott, its almost as if its implying that instead of using TP to achieve the necassary voltage to power the flux capacitor we could use MP which it is often neglected due to lack of utilty. Jeez Doc this is heavy why didn't we do that to begin with. In case you missed the Back to the Future reference I'm impying that our MP pool is quite limited and useless at this point so why not consume it like our HP in souleater to increase our damage, an idea that is very popular amoungst the DRK community, which is more than we can say about your idea.

#5 Its amazing how these people can't remember that they have cruor buffs on. Btw DRK doesn't even have half the MP pool of BLM, not even a third on my hume. DRK was never intended to cast t3 spells, and the casting of these spells will lower ones MP very fast and you'd be unable to use your worth while spells. PLD gets to use whm nukes right? Yes but whm nukes are low casting and have less mp cost cept holy, and besides how often do you see PLD casting whm nukes anyways.

#6 What DRK nukes? Drain is not a nuke, its an absorb. Now if they made DRK specific nukes then you'd have a point but at this time your point remains invalid.

Oh and to answer your question Urteil casting multiple t3 nukes would empty your MP pool rather quickly, after all at my max (no mp atmas just cruor and twilight cloak) I can get just under 700 mp, which means after 7 t3's my mp is gone, and after all we are leaving abyssea right, so good bye cruor buffs now you can only get 3-4 t3's and then you got nothing. Might be useful on those occasions were physical damage is ultra resistant or absorbed, but then again we also got twilight scythe for that so now what?

[Jar]

So... wats your point.

4% of 100 million dollars is 4 million.

% is merely a way of tracking relativity.

5 minutes of extra last resort is useful.

4 million dollars is a lot of money.

And again this is numbers based of 1 out of the many JA's and based on a machine perfect run.

Whereas, its actually playing into all your JA buffs and in reality it actual grows stronger when u apply those mortal times when ... i dunno, you have to pee or the pull is a tiny 3 seconds to slow, or when sumone else has to pee, or poop even!, or when you kill everything in the area and are waiting on respawns, or when competition for a camp causes a slight bit of extra down time, or 100 million different other things.


If you sumhow found some perfect LS filled with amazing people who never make any mistakes and never take bathroom breaks and never stop swinging for even seconds during an event, then congratulations. That is a real accomplishment. More impressive to me than getting all the emp, relic and empyrean weapons on one character.

If thats the case then ya this ability might not improve your performance much. But for the rest of the population, including some really skillful players, this trait would be useful.

i toss out numbers that have nothing to do with the argument when i Realize Im retarded too.

[Gotterdammerung]

#1 After a long career of activating soul powers and battlestances that draw away power from one area to bring it to another area, i propose dark knight become the master of the JA boof. Sorry everytime I read this part of your post I still ask myself wtf is boof, so the only natural conclusion is its the name of the idea your pitching.

#2 The way you are defending this thing so hardcore your making it sound like the ultimate fix to DRK, but thats my opinion and I'm entitled to that.

#3a There are other weapons with aftermath, or did you not know that? Also they may be easier to build than the relics and mythics but they still take more than any other weapons to get.

#3b So in order to use aftermath in any fight that lasts longer than the original aftermath duration I have to drop this ability to build TP and then put it back up when I'm done, or SE can realize that they weren't thinking and not make TP be consumed. BIG SPOILER FOR LATER POINT: Consumes TP for more damage sounds like a WS.

#3c So I should just be happy with getting nothing from SE again, right.........WRONG!!!!! Just because you love zerging so much doesn't mean that everyone else does. As you've seen people both JP and ENG players didn't like the manifesto for DRK, as well as many other jobs.

#3d Remember the souleater nerf? SE doesn't like zerg jobs so ultimately the odds are heavily stacked in favor of this JA being horribly underwhelming, and thus it would just be a big waste of SE's time for something the vast majority of players don't want.

#4 1.21 Jigawatts Marty a message from the future, Consumes TP for more damage sounds like a WS. Great scott, its almost as if its implying that instead of using TP to achieve the necassary voltage to power the flux capacitor we could use MP which it is often neglected due to lack of utilty. Jeez Doc this is heavy why didn't we do that to begin with. In case you missed the Back to the Future reference I'm impying that our MP pool is quite limited and useless at this point so why not consume it like our HP in souleater to increase our damage, an idea that is very popular amoungst the DRK community, which is more than we can say about your idea.

#5 Its amazing how these people can't remember that they have cruor buffs on. Btw DRK doesn't even have half the MP pool of BLM, not even a third on my hume. DRK was never intended to cast t3 spells, and the casting of these spells will lower ones MP very fast and you'd be unable to use your worth while spells. PLD gets to use whm nukes right? Yes but whm nukes are low casting and have less mp cost cept holy, and besides how often do you see PLD casting whm nukes anyways.

#6 What DRK nukes? Drain is not a nuke, its an absorb. Now if they made DRK specific nukes then you'd have a point but at this time your point remains invalid.

Oh and to answer your question Urteil casting multiple t3 nukes would empty your MP pool rather quickly, after all at my max (no mp atmas just cruor and twilight cloak) I can get just under 700 mp, which means after 7 t3's my mp is gone, and after all we are leaving abyssea right, so good bye cruor buffs now you can only get 3-4 t3's and then you got nothing. Might be useful on those occasions were physical damage is ultra resistant or absorbed, but then again we also got twilight scythe for that so now what?


#1 JA boof is just a fun way of saying JA buff. Its neat that you made a conclusion. Its more neat that you think its a "natural conclusion." But ultimately, your conclusion is flat out wrong. The Job trait has no name.

#2 Defending it hardcore? hahaha.
Also, you can have opinions all day. But it doesn't stop them from being completely wrong. You stated that i proposed this was a end all be all fix for dark. FACT: I proposed no such thing. Ergo you are wrong.

#3a Yes, i know there are relics and mythics... i wasn't talking about them. In your statement, you complained about all the hard work of emp, mythic, and relic owners going to waste because of the loss of aftermath. I was merely stating that emps do not belong in that set because they take less than a week to make.

#3b I didn't say it was perfect. I just said you COULD incorporate aftermath into the new ability. Also, pointless to even talk about things like this until the exact parameters of the ability are available. It could take your tp to 0 then have a duration based on TP absorbed in wich case you couldnt use aftermath b4 it. (but in this case if the bonus dmg from x-hit+1 swings is more than your old WS dmg + aftermath extra dmg , then the ability is worth using.) The point is we don't know how the ability works or the duration or recast so we don't even know how compatible it is with aftermath.

#3c I just think its funny that your a dark who doesn't want to deal massive damage yet you don't want spell tricks. I think you play drk just because you like to complain. I don't envy SE employee's in charge of drk. They have to be careful what they give you because they respect the class and understand that just a little bit of a bump can turn you into broke killing machines yet at the same time they can't give you little things that add up because you all turn into sandy vag's. Ultimately, you guys won't be happy until you get something strong that is easy to use, has no drawbacks, and instantly puts you at the indisputable #1 DD spot, But that will probably take a while because your so fearful that every new JA might be worthless, that you shoot down everything. So even if SE did try to give you an ability to take u to #1, you would probably boo it into the ground before it even started.

#3d SE is under new management... didn't u get the memo? Times are different and SE is different. If the old SE was here today 80% of the game would get a nerf. Today's SE aint sceert. (since u get hung up on weirdly spelled slang words, sceert means scared)



#4 Ah... I see. Fictional characters in your head agree with you, so i should too. Got it. Nice one.

#5 MP is one of the easiest aspects of the game to manage. Figure it out.

#6 A nuke is a dmg spell. Drain II is an absorb spell sure, but it does REAL damage to the monster. Ive seen it do 1-2k often on a serious drk with a true drain casting set. Therefore it is a nuke. So my point is valid. And when they release more drk specific nukes it will become even more useful. In the mean time you don't even know what kind of strength this JA could give your T3's. Its not smart to say something is worthless when you don't even know its parameters.

I find it funny that you use the "some players dont want to play that way" argument in your #3c point, yet you ignore this same argument when it comes from darks who want more casting options.

@urteil DRK alredy has access several elemental WS's.

@Jar The fact that you think those numbers have nothing to do with the argument, definitely helps me gauge your cognitive capacity.

[StingRay104]

#1 JA boof is just a fun way of saying JA buff. Its neat that you made a conclusion. Its more neat that you think its a "natural conclusion." But ultimately, your conclusion is flat out wrong. The Job trait has no name.

#2 Defending it hardcore? hahaha.
Also, you can have opinions all day. But it doesn't stop them from being completely wrong. You stated that i proposed this was a end all be all fix for dark. FACT: I proposed no such thing. Ergo you are wrong.

#3a Yes, i know there are relics and mythics... i wasn't talking about them. In your statement, you complained about all the hard work of emp, mythic, and relic owners going to waste because of the loss of aftermath. I was merely stating that emps do not belong in that set because they take less than a week to make.

#3b I didn't say it was perfect. I just said you COULD incorporate aftermath into the new ability. Also, pointless to even talk about things like this until the exact parameters of the ability are available. It could take your tp to 0 then have a duration based on TP absorbed in wich case you couldnt use aftermath b4 it. (but in this case if the bonus dmg from x-hit+1 swings is more than your old WS dmg + aftermath extra dmg , then the ability is worth using.) The point is we don't know how the ability works or the duration or recast so we don't even know how compatible it is with aftermath.

#3c I just think its funny that your a dark who doesn't want to deal massive damage yet you don't want spell tricks. I think you play drk just because you like to complain. I don't envy SE employee's in charge of drk. They have to be careful what they give you because they respect the class and understand that just a little bit of a bump can turn you into broke killing machines yet at the same time they can't give you little things that add up because you all turn into sandy vag's. Ultimately, you guys won't be happy until you get something strong that is easy to use, has no drawbacks, and instantly puts you at the indisputable #1 DD spot, But that will probably take a while because your so fearful that every new JA might be worthless, that you shoot down everything. So even if SE did try to give you an ability to take u to #1, you would probably boo it into the ground before it even started.

#3d SE is under new management... didn't u get the memo? Times are different and SE is different. If the old SE was here today 80% of the game would get a nerf. Today's SE aint sceert. (since u get hung up on weirdly spelled slang words, sceert means scared)



#4 Ah... I see. Fictional characters in your head agree with you, so i should too. Got it. Nice one.

#5 MP is one of the easiest aspects of the game to manage. Figure it out.

#6 A nuke is a dmg spell. Drain II is an absorb spell sure, but it does REAL damage to the monster. Ive seen it do 1-2k often on a serious drk with a true drain casting set. Therefore it is a nuke. So my point is valid. And when they release more drk specific nukes it will become even more useful. In the mean time you don't even know what kind of strength this JA could give your T3's. Its not smart to say something is worthless when you don't even know its parameters.

I find it funny that you use the "some players dont want to play that way" argument in your #3c point, yet you ignore this same argument when it comes from darks who want more casting options.

@urteil DRK alredy has access several elemental WS's.

@Jar The fact that you think those numbers have nothing to do with the argument, definitely helps me gauge your cognitive capacity.

Lol this is so funny, you attempted to counter all of my points with name calling and absolutely nothing to back up your original points. I would hav enever thought of using that tactic, granted I tried to lighten the mood a bit by implementing the whole B2TF reference but I guess that was lost on you.

As for the empy thing its all a matter of resources. It takes a large amount of resources IE: Time, People, Money, to complete any relic/mythic/empyrean weapon. If someone bought 200M from rmt then they could just flat out buy a relic, or they could get a LS full of people to farm for his weapon, or small group of people to take longer farming, or farm gil and buy currency, or all the above to get a relic. Either way it takes these resources to build. Empy's take 50X, 50Y, and 75Z to get to level 90 and to get X, Y, Z you need to farm. If you had a LS full of dedicated people you could in fact get a weapon done in a week, but if you go with less its gonna take longer. Now if you want to sit there and say empy are easiest and mythic are hardest to get, no one is gonna argue with you, but your trying to say that everyone has empy's because they are super easy to get yet A.) I only have the 1, not one for all my 90+ jobs which I would if they were as easy as you claim, B.) Everyone in the game would have at least one which also isn't the case. These weapons take quite a bit of resources to make, yes they are easy compared to relics but they are the same tier, and I was talking about all 3 of them so stop selectively choosing my words and fixing them to your liking.

I love how you mention nothing about my point of "Consumes TP for more damage sounds like a WS." It just validates that you got nothing. Before you bring up your mp/magic comment, MP attack was originally an ability in FFIX, when in doubt look for ideas in the other games because after all, SE gets most of their ideas from the past FF games.

So you brought up the change in management, I got news for you. The guy who took over from Sir nerfs-a-lot is now in charge of FFXIV and the guy who came up with abyssea is in charge of FFXI. Did you know that? Yes I too keep up with things that SE does, and one thing I've noticed is that even tho war is incredibly overpowered, instead of bringing the DD's left behind up and leaving war where it is for now, they keep giving it more power. That tells me that they have a serious issue when it comes to balance, and remember what event brought out most of this imbalance, Abyssea, which I do like but hey its very unbalanced and the guy that created it is making the rest of our content. Ya you can have faith all you want but the rest of us are gonna speak our minds about what he thinks we want, and if you wanna see how good he is at guessing right check the thf forum out.

Drain is not a nuke it and aspir are the original absorb spells. Thats what they do, they are designed to absorb hp or mp from the target and give it to you, side effect includes hp/mp damage. To claim they are nukes is ignorant on magic in general. Can you do decent damage, sure if the moon aligns right and you have all the right gear, but how does it compare to actually nukes.........doesn't even come close. I love how once again you ignore what I said to try and discredit me, check #6 again I said "Now if they made DRK specific nukes then you'd have a point but at this time your point remains invalid." Also Mab doesn't effect drain so why should this new ability, after all they were looking at specifically elemental nukes, so your comment about super drains is just your assumption. Btw if drain actually did do real damage it would say Drain does x damage and you gain x hit points, kinda like when you have blood weapon on and the side effect is absorbs hp.

If you want to go on praising the new abilities then go for it, just remember your pretty much all alone. I do find it funny that the only comment with any context came at the end here, yes we do have our own ele ws's, and right now they suck, but they might be getting a boost come next update IE: SE is doing several modifications to ws's, not the DRK update.


P.S. just because you hang out with people who use that slang doesn't mean that I do, and likewise others. It takes alot for something to became a universally accepted slang like owned/pwned or woot/w00t, and lets face it, boof or screet ain't gonna make it.

[Jar]

@Jar The fact that you think those numbers have nothing to do with the argument, definitely helps me gauge your cognitive capacity.

Yeah We where totally arguing about money bro..



Also Re-rationalizing my statement With that stupid Rescaled logic isnt Arguing its just being stupid Akining 4mil Cash moneys is nothing close to the shit you want implemented. wow we get 4% more last resort thats not even 1% damage boost over all Totally stupidity aside Please come back with another REASON why your JA is so much better than my math says it is.















And stop BSing about empyreans like you have a good one lol axe..

[Gotterdammerung]

Lol this is so funny, you attempted to counter all of my points with name calling and absolutely nothing to back up your original points. I would hav enever thought of using that tactic, granted I tried to lighten the mood a bit by implementing the whole B2TF reference but I guess that was lost on you.

As for the empy thing its all a matter of resources. It takes a large amount of resources IE: Time, People, Money, to complete any relic/mythic/empyrean weapon. If someone bought 200M from rmt then they could just flat out buy a relic, or they could get a LS full of people to farm for his weapon, or small group of people to take longer farming, or farm gil and buy currency, or all the above to get a relic. Either way it takes these resources to build. Empy's take 50X, 50Y, and 75Z to get to level 90 and to get X, Y, Z you need to farm. If you had a LS full of dedicated people you could in fact get a weapon done in a week, but if you go with less its gonna take longer. Now if you want to sit there and say empy are easiest and mythic are hardest to get, no one is gonna argue with you, but your trying to say that everyone has empy's because they are super easy to get yet A.) I only have the 1, not one for all my 90+ jobs which I would if they were as easy as you claim, B.) Everyone in the game would have at least one which also isn't the case. These weapons take quite a bit of resources to make, yes they are easy compared to relics but they are the same tier, and I was talking about all 3 of them so stop selectively choosing my words and fixing them to your liking.

I love how you mention nothing about my point of "Consumes TP for more damage sounds like a WS." It just validates that you got nothing. Before you bring up your mp/magic comment, MP attack was originally an ability in FFIX, when in doubt look for ideas in the other games because after all, SE gets most of their ideas from the past FF games.

So you brought up the change in management, I got news for you. The guy who took over from Sir nerfs-a-lot is now in charge of FFXIV and the guy who came up with abyssea is in charge of FFXI. Did you know that? Yes I too keep up with things that SE does, and one thing I've noticed is that even tho war is incredibly overpowered, instead of bringing the DD's left behind up and leaving war where it is for now, they keep giving it more power. That tells me that they have a serious issue when it comes to balance, and remember what event brought out most of this imbalance, Abyssea, which I do like but hey its very unbalanced and the guy that created it is making the rest of our content. Ya you can have faith all you want but the rest of us are gonna speak our minds about what he thinks we want, and if you wanna see how good he is at guessing right check the thf forum out.

Drain is not a nuke it and aspir are the original absorb spells. Thats what they do, they are designed to absorb hp or mp from the target and give it to you, side effect includes hp/mp damage. To claim they are nukes is ignorant on magic in general. Can you do decent damage, sure if the moon aligns right and you have all the right gear, but how does it compare to actually nukes.........doesn't even come close. I love how once again you ignore what I said to try and discredit me, check #6 again I said "Now if they made DRK specific nukes then you'd have a point but at this time your point remains invalid." Also Mab doesn't effect drain so why should this new ability, after all they were looking at specifically elemental nukes, so your comment about super drains is just your assumption. Btw if drain actually did do real damage it would say Drain does x damage and you gain x hit points, kinda like when you have blood weapon on and the side effect is absorbs hp.

If you want to go on praising the new abilities then go for it, just remember your pretty much all alone. I do find it funny that the only comment with any context came at the end here, yes we do have our own ele ws's, and right now they suck, but they might be getting a boost come next update IE: SE is doing several modifications to ws's, not the DRK update.


P.S. just because you hang out with people who use that slang doesn't mean that I do, and likewise others. It takes alot for something to became a universally accepted slang like owned/pwned or woot/w00t, and lets face it, boof or screet ain't gonna make it.

I'm done with you. You have the reading comprehension of a gnat. I'm not going to dance circles with you trying to explain the things you misunderstood, didnt understand at all, or completely missed.


Yeah We where totally arguing about money bro..



Also Re-rationalizing my statement With that stupid Rescaled logic isnt Arguing its just being stupid Akining 4mil Cash moneys is nothing close to the shit you want implemented. wow we get 4% more last resort thats not even 1% damage boost over all Totally stupidity aside Please come back with another REASON why your JA is so much better than my math says it is.

Are you that easily side-tracked?

You tried to imply that 4% increase was small. And just showed you that you can't use percentages to show actual value, only relative value. I did this with a money example. The topic isn't about money and i never implied it was.

And i still maintain that your not being honest about the true amount of lost buff time that you experience in play. But thats beside the point, because i conceded my numbers based on this unrealistic idea that u only have tiny amounts of seconds wasted per buff. I gave you that one. And still when u take those seconds and compound them over several uses of several different buffs, even in this unrealistic situation, the math shows a nice increase in buff life.

I mean meriting 50 seconds off of last resorts timer is a good call for merits. But knocking 10 seconds of the recast timer of every ja buff in your arsenal is worthless? Because that would produce the same result as conserving 10 seconds of buff time for every JA.

And again thats assuming that you are always moving at breakneck speeds without any mistakes from now until the end of the game. A highly unlikely scenario.

[StingRay104]

I'm done with you. You have the reading comprehension of a gnat. I'm not going to dance circles with you trying to explain the things you misunderstood, didnt understand at all, or completely missed.



Are you that easily side-tracked?

You tried to imply that 4% increase was small. And just showed you that you can't use percentages to show actual value, only relative value. I did this with a money example. The topic isn't about money and i never implied it was.

And i still maintain that your not being honest about the true amount of lost buff time that you experience in play. But thats beside the point, because i conceded my numbers based on this unrealistic idea that u only have tiny amounts of seconds wasted per buff. I gave you that one. And still when u take those seconds and compound them over several uses of several different buffs, even in this unrealistic situation, the math shows a nice increase in buff life.

I mean meriting 50 seconds off of last resorts timer is a good call for merits. But knocking 10 seconds of the recast timer of every ja buff in your arsenal is worthless? Because that would produce the same result as conserving 10 seconds of buff time for every JA.

And again thats assuming that you are always moving at breakneck speeds without any mistakes from now until the end of the game. A highly unlikely scenario.

I really explained it so that, strangely enough, a gnat could understand it. Sorry it was above you but its not my problem. Go get him Jar he's sadly misinformed and has no clue what he's talkin about, plus he seems to be ignoring me.

[Jar]

Are you that easily side-tracked?

You tried to imply that 4% increase was small. And just showed you that you can't use percentages to show actual value, only relative value. I did this with a money example. The topic isn't about money and i never implied it was.

And i still maintain that your not being honest about the true amount of lost buff time that you experience in play. But thats beside the point, because i conceded my numbers based on this unrealistic idea that u only have tiny amounts of seconds wasted per buff. I gave you that one. And still when u take those seconds and compound them over several uses of several different buffs, even in this unrealistic situation, the math shows a nice increase in buff life.

I mean meriting 50 seconds off of last resorts timer is a good call for merits. But knocking 10 seconds of the recast timer of every ja buff in your arsenal is worthless? Because that would produce the same result as conserving 10 seconds of buff time for every JA.

And again thats assuming that you are always moving at breakneck speeds without any mistakes from now until the end of the game. A highly unlikely scenario.

because i dont suck at this game i become highly unlikly. nice logic




overall this is moot end of point NOTHING youve said has even argued other wise you just BS the same shit in a circle.

[Gotterdammerung]

overall this is moot end of point NOTHING youve said has even argued other wise you just BS the same shit in a circle.

ditto

[StingRay104]

overall this is moot end of point NOTHING youve said has even argued other wise you just BS the same shit in a circle.

ditto

Ditto your ditto, I can be lazy and not contribute also.

[Kagato]

This topic is bad and you should all feel bad.

[Urteil]

I feel bad.

: (

[Rezeak]

Wow this topic is fail in 2 ways

1st. the idea adds little to DRK and we'd rather SE put there time into useful stuff for DRK
There really isn't much else to say about it.

2nd too much arguing.most stuff was said in everyones first/second post really no need to go further with it lol.

[Dart]

i'm hungry, anybody want some of my pringles?

they're sour cream and onion. but lite.

[Rezeak]

I never trust a hungry man giving away food :P
i mean if ur hungry and have food why are you hungry, it must be a trap.