A Few (More) Campaign Suggestions!

[Karbuncle]

With the advent of the recent Campaign update, You raised the amount of Exp/Notes per battle significantly, Something I'm (and many others) very grateful for!

With this kind of life put back into the old(ish) content, It would be nice if there could be a few more patches to Campaign? I don't want to ask for too much, Just a small list :X

On Evaluations: Would it be possible to lower the time needed to wait between Evaluations? Maybe to Three days instead of Five? I Quite like the system and getting back into campaign is great! Recovering nearly 10 Lost medals over time... not so much.

On Skill Ups: This is something wanted by quite a few people. Skilling up is by no means difficult, But It would be a nice addition to the number of places we could go to do Skill ups, while enjoying ourselves.

On Reward: This isn't a big deal, But could you add more Campaign Specific Weaponry with the Special Weaponskills? Off the top of my head I can think of a few
*A h2h with Leonine Legflail
*A Bow(?) with the Drain-Arrow WS
*The GS with the AoE Terror WS (Can be nerfed a little?)
*A Gun with that one RNGs WS

Edit:
On Fortifications: Please Un-nerf them. I understand the nerf at 75, But this nerf is unnecessary at level 90+. If we could comprimise, Could Forts give 50% of Normal Cap exp? I.E if you would get 8k Exp from a Battle with mobs, you'd only get 4k from a battle thats Fort bashing?

As is the reason most zones don't get regained in (S) is because Fort bashing is boring and horrifically unrewarding to the point no one does it and its completely avoided. You can bash a fort for 1hour and only get like 600 exp, Its absolutely absurd. Yes people abused it back then but today is a different day and exp is easier to obtain. Please SE, Unnerf this?

Anyway, Thats it, really small list right?

[Dragoy]

I don't quite think they're indeed done with it yet, and will make more changes (hopefully soon).
We can only wait, see, and hope for the best.


I do agree the 5 days wait for an evaluation is too much. Perhaps lower that at the same time when they will lower the time for a new Assault tag (if that's how they still are going to change that).

I really don't know why it should not be possible to train our skills in Campaign. I remember doing so without them tags as a Red Mage, but then they took even that away.
Perhaps it should be only possible when the tags are in effect this time around!

They certainly should add more of those weapons, and other gear too, and I am actually expecting them to. It's just taking some time, as usual. >.>;


To add some thoughts, I would like to see the Campaign Operations be more doable, and add more reason to do so. I think I did each of those, that I could do alone, once at least. Even few of those that required at least 3 characters, but there was little to no reason to ever repeat those. So mostly I would just take Aegis Scream, or more recently, Smokescreen since the Beastman Confederate rule the world (this might change a little at least for a while now that people are doing it again, for the time being at least)...

There's probably no need to even mention the battlefield Operations (Fiat Lux and the older ones).


Another thing is the 'giving your opinion about stuff to them leaders', about how they should go about with their tactics and such. I don't know if this actually has any kind of an effect. I would assume it does, but it probably requires a lot of players to actually do it.
I wonder if the players had more control over where the Allied Forces would be sent... It would definitely be tricky to implement, but surely far from impossible.


Also what could use some attention is the issue whereas you run from battle-to-battle just to have it end as you get there. It's obviously going to happen when running to a battle that has been going for who-knows-how-long, but sometimes it happens with one that has merely begun. I guess it is due to the supplies and/or fortifications, which could probably be easier to re-stock by fewer players (most never bothered at all, I would guess).
More or less related to the things above.


Many NPCs at the areas could use re-positioning too.

For example, when you Retrace to a town, you will be at a certain spot, and if you want to get Sigil or other such stuff, you need to run quite far away (thinking of Bastok as an example here), and then you need to run right back to get to the other NPCs you will likely deal with next.

Some of them were done right, such as the item delivery NPCs, which are positioned right outside the residential areas, instead of in a faraway distant world uhm, place they are in the 'present' time.

On that particular topic, during a Campaign Battle, the Suppliers tend to run right into the middle of the monster hordes, next to the Fortification(s).
Why?
That's just beyond ridiculous. Not that I ever really needed those NPCs as they have little or nothing to offer to me, like ever!
The temporary items altogether could be more useful, like they are at Bastion for example.


Ack! I could go on forever on this topic, really.
I did enjoy doing it a lot, and I have good memories of it even though it was slow to level up that way. Should try out a lower level job there now and see how it fares.

Either way, I'll end here, before I go on... and on... and on... and

[Zyeriis]

I can't agree with the lowering of the 5 day period between evaluations. Not because I don't feel the same way that it's too long but because there's already little incentive as it is to finish the WotG storyline as is for some people (though I've long since done so). It needs more incentive, not less.

How is this relevant? Completing WotG nullifies medal loss, making evaluations pointless once you've reach the Altana medal.

[Karbuncle]

I can't agree with the lowering of the 5 day period between evaluations. Not because I don't feel the same way that it's too long but because there's already little incentive as it is to finish the WotG storyline as is for some people (though I've long since done so). It needs more incentive, not less.

How is this relevant? Completing WotG nullifies medal loss, making evaluations pointless once you've reach the Altana medal.

While i agree to some extent, Thats why i suggest a small delay decrease over something drastic. WoTG mission will likely be completed en-mass by SMNs shortly as it will surely be required for Cait Sith.

[Seriha]

At this point, I'd be happy if Offensive battles weren't such a crapshoot thanks to the old Fort nerf. The only other glaring tweak I'd want to see is Gi'ghi Rockchopper's Breakga spell get an increased delay. It's not just once or twice where I've had its petrify effect wear just as he's recasting it again. The complete and utter inability to fight back or at least flee from the NM is maddening. Doubly so since killing his pets just has him resummon more.

[Olor]

I agree with all of Karb's excellent suggestions.

[Octaviane]

I am very happy to see that Campaign has finally gotten a much needed boost. Thanks again SE.

The five day wait to get a lost medal back isn't just five days though. You get it back, then have to wait another five days for an evaluation which allows you to keep your medal, assuming you have earned the right to keep it, then you get 25 days before the next evaluation (followed by a snooty nosed Alfred's (Sandy) reprimand and removal of last medal earned if you failed to Campaign). At least, I think that's how it worked, haven't Campaigned in months. Correct me if I am wrong.

I realize that you don't lose your Medal of Altana if you have progressed beyond a certain WoTG Mission which is awesome. My biggest regret in FFXI was never finishing WoTG. Great storyline and the battles used to be fun. :)

With the increase in XP and such, it shouldn't be too hard to maintain a medal anymore. Perhaps though, the second five day evaluation after losing a medal could be removed entirely.

Nothing like getting to a Battle and there not be one because it just ended. :) I kept enough filters open so I could read all the battle plans being formed and troops dispatched. Not everyone wants to do that or keep looking at the Campaign Map, but it worked for me just fine, and I honestly can't think of anything that would improve that.

The biggest annoyance for me was getting to a Battle a couple of minutes after it started, race to the Tag NPC and see a wall of Beastmen waiting with big smiles on their faces as you get your Tags, then have them event skip you and show you the dirt floor. Quite some time passes before the Beastmen actually arrive true, but generally, most people get to Campaign as it begins, very few are actually in the Zone waiting. This is fine if the area is Beastmen controlled because the Tag NPC is out of the way. So, how about a further "hold" function on the Beastmen that would prevent them from gathering too close to the Tag NPC in nation controlled areas? For example in Jugner Forest (S), stop them from crossing the bridge, or, just keep the Tag NPC's in their Beastman controlled area positions.

These same NPC's could also give and renew Sigil. I believe there is also an option to buy a Sigil Staff or something like that, but as I recall the cost in AN was high and you had to have the Medal of Altana. Again though with increased XP and AN, maybe not so tedious to get either.

Perhaps instead of only having the option to warp back to your Nation of Allegiance, an option could be added to warp to another battle. Even Chocobos at or near Tag NPC's instead of just the cities and Recall spots? I know, more buttons to push and menu's to go through. :)

I enjoyed Campaign and the Missions I was able to complete, glad to see it might become viable again, just like Beseiged. YAY!

[Eri]

I like most of the Ideas in this Thread!

And after the needed update i may Level a Job 75 > 90 in Campaign.... only because i don't enjoy 18 ppl Party with 90 % of the PPL afk -_-; At Least the useless Campaign NPXs dont AFK!

However i dont thik the evalutions should be more frequent .... Not like you spend Days on end doing Campaign waiting for your evaluation anyway!

Regrding Rewards i would love to see more stuff i can use AN on.
But Karb y ain't there any Dagger on you Weaponlist! I feel so Left out!

[Karbuncle]

However i dont thik the evalutions should be more frequent .... Not like you spend Days on end doing Campaign waiting for your evaluation anyway!


I do :( I'm enjoying campaign and want a griffonclaw lol, but im at least 6 medals away from it still >.< I have a good month or longer before i can even consider it ;;

I'm riding those Evaluation days I'm ashamed to say.

On the topic of Daggers... I don't think theres any NPCs that use Daggers in Campaign that aren't RNGs (and thus, use ranged WS) :( Sorry.

Only one i thought of was another GS one called "Spinechiller" that Leon guy uses.

[Eri]

Ye Rangers.... Its the Past... so pre Rng Nerf! That y the Npc's come up with a hord of Rangers anyway, probably....

[Dragoy]

I can't agree with the lowering of the 5 day period between evaluations. Not because I don't feel the same way that it's too long but because there's already little incentive as it is to finish the WotG storyline as is for some people (though I've long since done so). It needs more incentive, not less.

How is this relevant? Completing WotG nullifies medal loss, making evaluations pointless once you've reach the Altana medal.

I agree with your point but I don't see the Evaluation to really have an effect on this, since one still must earn each Medal to first get them either way, and you only lose the most recent Medal, no matter how long you wait to get to it again and then, if you are doing Campaign like that, getting 1 of them back probably wouldn't be that big of an issue, especially if you're already at the highest one.
On the other hand, when you got the highest one, and you are not doing Campaign, it can be quite annoying since you would likely lose the medal, and then have to wait for days to be able to get it back.

I'm sure there are others who do not feel like this, but it's how I see it and I know others who agree, and most certainly would rather have new medals faster, and did not do the nation quests for this reason (though it's a nice bonus).
I was indeed quite annoyed about it back when I had that highest medal, but the ability to keep them was not yet implemented and I wasn't there to fight in Campaign.

So my opinion may or may not be a tad coloured by that.

The reason I completed the missions (and quests) was to help a friend at first, who was stuck around after the point where you get the Jeunoan flag. And it didn't even help me keep my medals since I am with Bastok and she is with San d'Oria and I didn't want to change over. ^^;
I have since helped another friend to finish the missions, though, and ran thru the quests for Bastok and Windurst as well, which do not take long at all with only 2-3 characters even.

It's the missions themselves that take most of the time, and I'm sure many are just 'bleh' with how long the cutscenes are at time.
I, for one, enjoyed each of the stories and the battles even with their faults and whatnot. They were fun, even if not too surprising and that there are a lot of 'yeah I sooo did not see that coming' moments.
Most of all I enjoyed the time I was spending with my close friends, which was definitely my main incentive.

But I digress.

The end-rewards certainly could, and should be better.
There is no doubt about it, and I think Campaign itself has a lot of potential to expand into with the new levels and abilities to come.


I am very happy to see that Campaign has finally gotten a much needed boost. Thanks again SE.

I would like to say thanks for this again as well, and challenge them to not stop here!


The five day wait to get a lost medal back isn't just five days though. You get it back, then have to wait another five days for an evaluation which allows you to keep your medal, assuming you have earned the right to keep it, then you get 25 days before the next evaluation (followed by a snooty nosed Alfred's (Sandy) reprimand and removal of last medal earned if you failed to Campaign). At least, I think that's how it worked, haven't Campaigned in months. Correct me if I am wrong.

If you have not performed to a satisfying degree, they will take away the highest rank Medal you have at the time, and give the new seal lasting for 30 days, with 5 days to next Evaluation which would reward you with the next Medal (which would be the one you lost).


I realize that you don't lose your Medal of Altana if you have progressed beyond a certain WoTG Mission which is awesome. My biggest regret in FFXI was never finishing WoTG. Great storyline and the battles used to be fun. :)

It's actually the Quests of the nations that have that effect, not the actual Missions. ^^
Moreover, one needs to complete the quests for the nation they are fighting with for the 'added effect'.

The Wings of the Goddess Missions category page of the FFXI wiki at Gamer Escape and the wikia wiki FFXIclopedia has the missions and quests sorted out quite nicely now.

Just mentioning that if you haven't checked it after it was sorted better.

You really should complete the missions, and all of the quests if you enjoy the story and battles. You would probably like them all, a lot!


With the increase in XP and such, it shouldn't be too hard to maintain a medal anymore. Perhaps though, the second five day evaluation after losing a medal could be removed entirely.

While it did feel to me a bit that they had increased the points needed for the Evaluation, they did state that: "Actions that are subject to evaluation will now grant more points towards the final assessment. The maximum number of points that can be earned for performing these actions has also been increased."

Perhaps it was just a weird feeling I got for some reason...


These same NPC's could also give and renew Sigil. I believe there is also an option to buy a Sigil Staff or something like that, but as I recall the cost in AN was high and you had to have the Medal of Altana.

Nope, there is no such item, unfortunately.
Only the present day has those staves and the Conquest Points price on them is 5000.
Perhaps you're thinking of the Aketons?
Those cost a whopping 56000 Conquest Points... the Livery versions in the past are only 10000 Allied Notes though.

That said, they should lower the cost of them Aketons but that's a bit off-topic!


However i dont thik the evalutions should be more frequent .... Not like you spend Days on end doing Campaign waiting for your evaluation anyway!

When I did it as much as I did about a year or more ago, I certainly did. >.>;
And so did my friend... meh, I miss those times...


Now, what did I forget to say... oh well.
Meh!
Sorry if it's a confusing post, I'mabitsleepystillgargl.

[Ryce]

I've been ranting about Campaign improvements for years now, so this thread is a sight to sore eyes. I miss Campaign being relevant. The exp update was AWESOME (THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU DEV TEAM!), but it still doesn't effect the problems with offensive battles (forts). If forts provided reasonable exp or skill ups, I think that would fix the problem.

IDEA: Destroying a fortification (reducing it's HP to 50%) triggers a group of beastmen to spawn at the fort. Players would then stick around to attack forts, spawning more mobs (for exp/notes) while moving the war effort in the right direction.

Pretty please :)

[Zyeriis]

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/5597-Campaign-Improvements-What-it-could-and-should-be.

[Karbuncle]

Yes. I'm aware of the existence of that thread. But could not find it (couldn't even remember what section it was in).

[Olor]

I think that given that so many players are in such desperate need of skill ups, and that campaign still doesn't have a full niche of its own (although the exp improvements were great, THANK YOU again) - I would LOVE to see campaign become skill up heaven for skills between level 50 and level 75.

What I am saying is, don't just allow us to get skill ups in campaign, make it the single best way to skill up for that level range.

If you did so it would not only make skilling up less terrible, it would bring a lot of life back to the past.

[Dragoy]

The following issues have been addressed:

- An issue wherein experience points and Allied Notes are doubled for campaign battles under certain circumstances.

I wonder if I witnessed this myself at all, I didn't do it much in-between...
Anyone noticed any noticeable drop yet?

I don't know when I can try myself at this time.


Edit:

As I guessed, I probably did not see it happen, and thus would not notice any change.

[Morgantisthedon]

I vaguely rember one the dev team respond to skilling in campaign battles. i know we used to be able to hit forts with out tags to get to 150ish skill and the normal mobs with out tags to cap us @75 (but if we died we where SOL ) They mention something about the code and being hard to change probably due to the past change they made to this.....

I would like to be able to get skill while doing this like Beseiged is with tags on and some the other ideas where amazaing. That being said I hope you (the devoplement team) if you chose to do it could rework some your old code once you got time on your hands to implement this. :) Or something similar again with the new cap for skills. Gives people a bigger variety of place to skill up. i have like the addition of union getting gil or small chance if I lot high that has came since it first came out also.

My only other suggestion is can we have like a 30 second delay after signing up b4 we get slammed with npc spells or by mobs so we can actually sign up for a union. Sometimes that is so frustrating.

[Seriha]

I'd like the tagging process to just jump to asking about joining a union, that way both happen at once and you can technically avoid the basest form of NPC interruption. However, some kind of grace period until you make any kind of action could be nice, too.

[Olor]

So, just did some campaign this morning, and I have to say ... offensive battles are broken!

I'm sorry but it is bogus to get 70 exp and 35 notes for whacking at a fort (including several self skill chains) - over a time greater than the time spent getting 6000 exp and 3000 notes hitting mobs. Sure, they don't hit back, but there is absolutely no incentive for me as a player to bore myself to death doing that.

I would be better off killing things that drop 8 exp each! Give me a break.

Anyway, I was thinking on this, and I wanted to reiterate - we need skill ups in campaign. Cause while it is more fun than doing GoV the exp is considerably less - and it is way more uneven. GoV doesn't just give you skill ups but it gives you a skill up prowess that you can use solo in the zone afterwards to skill up.

The problem is I often see 6 or more people waiting to get into a GoV alliance because there are not a lot of good pages to do. So if campaign changes continue to make this event better - it will help take some pressure off the single alliance most people are using to level from 55-75... having it so only 18 people at a time can level effectively in that range without leeching is pretty sad.

[Karbuncle]

For what its worth, I'd still like Evaluations to be Lessened from 5 days to ~3. Nothing to drastic, But a small change would be nice.

[Souljacker]

I'd agree we need skill ups in Campaign, and it's the single biggest reason that the place is empty. There is no longer any real reason to keep skill ups out - as Abyssea broke all the old rules.

Campaign was one of their best ideas and I'm sad to see that it's turned into a ghost town.

[Modoru]

I would like a revision over Union Spoils and lotting merits. I got out-lotted 4 times by a 60BLM who did next to nothing, while I tanked 4 mobs at a time, capping my damage exp easily, and healing myself, as well as others as /DNC.

Seriously, it's bull. How is it I get a lot of 43 after doing all that? It's a huge-ass middle finger to the face.

[Yugl]

How about not randomly blocking people from doing the "Unlocked once every millennium BCs" (Splitting Heirs and such)?

[Modoru]

That's not really hard to get though, my server's unlocked the Cuch's windy BC easily whenever they really wanted to.

[Karbuncle]

Problem is finding people who "want too" -.-;

1 group of friends couldn't possible take all 5 zones, then keep them claimed/claim Oztroja. It requires a good amount of effort.

You basically have to open your campaign map and hope one of the nations control all 5 of their zones so you can start working down on the Stronghold.

But once you get battles in the strongholds, it is quite easy, all you have to do is kill Campaign mobs until their morale is super low, and the retreat very easily in combat, which means you gain heavy influence.

[Modoru]

Well, as far as the non-stronghold areas, people in the server do that generally. Most windy/Sandy nations are usually taken, and two of my friends went into stronghold alone just to lower morale on their own [granted, these two have very good gear, and are generally amazing players.]

[Karbuncle]

Yes, And i've solo'd a zone to lower morale.

I'm not saying thats the problem the problem is getting all other zones in order to actually get into storngholds to lower morale.. Its harder to claim ~5 zones than it is to claim 1. Once you have all the zones claimed to windy, Getting the stronghold is very simple, it can be solo'd with effort.

In the end we're really agreeing here...

[Modoru]

Pretty much, but yes, as far as regular zones go, at least for my server, they're always being dealt with, maybe a few odd weeks where we don't have all the zones for a certain nation.

[Olor]

Pretty much, but yes, as far as regular zones go, at least for my server, they're always being dealt with, maybe a few odd weeks where we don't have all the zones for a certain nation.

yeah... Beastmen pretty much always rule on Asura... I guess that is the difference... although, combined the three nations hold 12 zones this week - most I have ever seen since returning. Still, a lot more needs to be done to make doing campaign viable for most people again.

Also Karb, you should totally fire off a tell to me when you're doing campaign sometime. I promise I am only sort of kind of mostly gimp still.

;)

PS- (THANKS FOR THE ATMA, BRO)

[Serei]

so pretty much all we really want is them to do.
#1 Update the xp you get from bashing on the walls a little more.. (25%-50% increase would be nice and would stand a chance of getting more people back into do campaign.)
#2 Let us get skill ups again, with or with out tags (which ever would be easier to code. But for the love of the goddess, let us skill up again.
#3 Decrease the number of days in between assestments.
#4 update some of the rewards you can get from either union's or from the sigil npc's (there are a number of weapons that i would love to see unlocked that campaign npc's use. ((personally myself i would love to have spine chiller)

So Dev team, if your reading this.. lets get with the program already and bring some of the older content up to date a little bit hmmm?

[Raxiaz]

How bout trading exp for the ability to skiill up? Lol.

[Urthdigger]

I'd like to see campaign operations be more useful. It was a nice concept, do small quests to affect the battlefields, but it was crippled by a number of things: First, the rewards are rather poor. Secondly, the affect they have on the battlefield is not well stated. A lot of the information out there is just what I pulled out of Maruna-Kurina when he was added to the game, and still it's a lot of guesswork in some cases. Third, for those few people who ARE interested in altering the state of the battlefield, the limit of one campaign op per real life day is just too small. One person cannot conceivably make a difference with that small number of operations.

I'd love to see a few things: First, remove the limit on how many campaign operations we can do, and maybe even let us accept multiple operations at a time. Second, allow us to do a variable amount of completions for non-battlefield operations. What I mean by that is let us accept an operation, say, Bailey Borer, and in that example go into Castle Zvahl and destroy any and all fortilaces we see. Later, we can go back to the NPC, turn it in, and affect the battlefield for X number of fortilaces destroyed. Basically, it removes the need to run back to the NPC, turn in the op, and accept a new one.

And lastly, can "Cut and Cauterize" be made more exciting? Not only does it only involve talking to NPCs, but the number of NPCs is only half the number of people who entered. Half the party gets to sit around doing nothing! At the very least give everyone an NPC to guide, or let the other people do something like cast refresh on them.