Abyssea shouldn't be extended, honestly.

[Juri_Licious]

There's more than enough Abyssea content as is.
I'll quote a post I made.


I am absolutely done with Abyssea. I'm sick of the whole "Trigger Procs, Get Rocks, LOL INVINCIBLE" stuff.

How about some original or hell I don't even care if it's original, we already have a huge Abyssea selection to play from.
We don't need any more.

It'd be nice to focus on areas that actually need attention.

-edit-
I'm not praising the old content, don't misunderstand my post.

[Yugl]

You mean the other content that's been there for 4-8 years?

[Olor]

I know! We need to go back to the days when most jobs couldn't even get an invite for exp! That was fun!

[Karbuncle]

This could have been said in the other thread just as easily without creating a new one mocking the old one. This is the kind of stupid childish thing that is spamming up these forums.

Edit: Old content sucked.

Must be real fun sitting with 17 other people going after the same item as you once every 21-24 hours, hoping today you would beat the bots or today maybe you'll get the HQ to pop if you maybe claim it over the others bots, and maybe get that 1 drop you want to maybe win lot over the other 5 people lotting on it that day.

Or how bout salvage? Maybe the NM you've killed 109 times before will load that 25 body you want?

I don't know the hard-on people have for sadistic drop rates and terrible design that was old content, WOOOO 24-72 Hour NMs! who doesnt love waiting 3 Real life days for a Pixel to pop? There were maybe 1-2 good events back in the old days and even those were flawed due to terrible drop rates.

I'm not asking for more Abyssea-Easy Mode, I'm just saying we need to stop praising old FFXI like it was the best sh*t ever when endgame back then was nothing if not tedious.

There were some redeeming qualities, but again, most of the events that were fun to do were plagued with such terrible drop rates that once the fun wore off, you were still doing the event 2 years longer than you wanted too because you didn't have your drop yet (looking at you DYnamis)

[Juri_Licious]

I know! We need to go back to the days when most jobs couldn't even get an invite for exp! That was fun!

Who says this has to be about EXP?
Also, I know! we need to go back to the days of Abyssea in which most jobs can't even get party invites because procs!


-snip
Once again, they could add something different than Abyssea and it'll still be good.
And who said i'm praising anything? I'm saying some old areas could use some work it's a fact.

You already got this humongous selection of Abyssea areas and things to do, and you're not satisfied?
I feel the type of players you are kinda got what you wanted with FFXI. Let's try adding something new besides Abyssea.

[Greatguardian]

If there's one thing I've noticed reading these forums, it's that the people who tend to praise old FFXI content are generally the same people who were never good enough, or in a good enough group, pre-Abyssea to actually do any of that old content beyond Nyzul, Assaults, Sky, Dynamis, and Limbus at any sort of competent level.

Word to the wise: Karbuncle hit every nail on its respective head.

[Karbuncle]

You already got this humongous selection of Abyssea areas and things to do, and you're not satisfied?
I feel the type of players you are kinda got what you wanted with FFXI. Let's try adding something new besides Abyssea.

If I am not to assume you must not either. I am satisfied with Abyssea, and I'm very satisfied with how Abyssea ended.

Abyssea Is fun, It will remain fun, But outside Content wasn't much better (back at 75, i mean). I simply don't what threads like this to get the reps the idea "We want Old content of 0.5% Drop rates and 24-72 hour NMs back!" We don't.

We want new content, But we don't want it to be tedious again. (Well, We know it'll be tedious to some extent, they have to keep us playing, But please not old-salvage level-tedious again...). I look forward to outside Abyssea content too, However i just do not want to give the Devs the false impression we all loved Old content of 3 day NMs, low drop rates, and tedious events that require 18 people.

People obviously want some 18 man events, its an MMO, we just don't want everything to require 18 people, because then it becomes like i said above, You going to events 2 years after they become boring just becuase you haven't won lot on that 1 item you need still...

[Ravenmore]

We need more procs that all jobs can do. The proc system was a great idea when you look at what old HNM had became. All the old HNMs were killed as fast as possible. If your group wasn't good enough to zerg the only thing they were doing was lolsky taking 45 mins to kill one Kirin running it around and tickleing it to death. Before anyone comes out with not every drk could get a K.club I seen many shells sell drops to buy a couple of k.clubs for zergs. Thats not even counting the rune chopper zergs before SE nerfed them back to were they belonged. How was old content any different then it is now were the few jobs got the most invites and the people that refused to level something other then dime a dozen DD whining about not getting to tag along. Ever wonder why every single new NM takes reduced damage from souleater bloodweapon.

[Sparthos]

Abyssea (post Heroes) is too easy and Salvage/Einherjar is too hard.

XI needs to gravitate back towards middle of the road content like Nyzul, ZNM, Assault and BCNMs, things that rewarded without being heavy-handed about it.

Point systems work wonders towards being fair and also giving individuals the feeling of progress, even amongst failure.

[Greatguardian]

Salvage I can understand, but Einherjar had one of the best rewards systems around imo and was actually fun, while maintaining a 30 minute runtime. My only real issue with it was the RL time between Odins, and the fact that the Ichor system was never expanded upon.

If Einherjar had just used the Ichor system for everything including Abjurations, and the drops from Odin were just a bonus and extra Ichor, I think it would have been darn near perfect.

[Elexia]

This could have been said in the other thread just as easily without creating a new one mocking the old one. This is the kind of stupid childish thing that is spamming up these forums.


Pretty much this.

Also, I've played FFXI since 2002, I lived through "Old, Superior FFXI". I'm sorry but "new" FFXI is what will keep people playing and actually bring in more people. If Abyssea was such a bad system or "ruined XI", why did Dynamis get the Stagger system?

Why did Voidwatch?

Why will Limbus inevitably get it?

Why will Salvage no doubt get it?

It changed the game for the better because it gave the players absolutely 100% more control. Before you went to mock my topic basically, do realize if you actually read, I was referring to extending the story of it because while it is complete, so was Rank 1 - 10 and the Vanilla storyline and they closed some plot holes with the first 3 Add-ons.

Abyssea has a storyline, but it's really disjointed that we get the idea, but it has no "meat" as with these ones, the meat was getting gear.

[Sparthos]

I agree, though Einherjar's totally random Odin pools and non-existent rate on chamber abjurations made the event a crapshoot until recently when the abjurations from chambers was increased dramatically.

Also agree on ichor being abandoned as a silly move. Points are the best way to reward in a game if you're going to encourage 6-12 man play.

[Karbuncle]

I agree with Sparthos on his two posts as well, a nice middle ground that realistically rewards you for your effort would be fantastic.

[Malamasala]

I've been praising points since christ was born. Sadly SE never remembers to add items for all jobs.

Einherjar - I bought mythic item because everything else was crap. And I'm not even making the mythic.
Campaign - I'm using the AN for retrace scrolls.
Conquest - I'm using the CP for warp scrolls.

Is it so hard to add armors for all jobs, and not just focus on PLD, WAR, SAM, BLM? I admit I bought the Yigit set, but only used parts for hmp. That is how pointless the set was for non-BLMs. Imagine a WAR set with only hhp? That would surely go well... not!

I must admit playing Summoner was the dumbest thing I've ever done. Considering their armors consist of AF, JSE, Relic and Empyrean. That's it. You can find scraps and pieces elsewhere, while other jobs keep getting full armor sets at those places.

I wish SE, 2003, had put up a giant Neon sign saying "We won't be adding armors for Summoner. Please pick another job" so I could have avoided waiting 4 years on each new armor set.

I can only imagine the bliss of people who picked SE's favorite jobs and had items dropping everywhere for them. No wonder some people think the game ever was good.

[Dauntless]

I loathe the proc system. Seriously. We could be killing the mob but instead we're sitting here waiting for everyone to run in and do a WS and run out to get more TP. I sincerely hope it's not added into the new content.

[Aliekber]

I loathe the proc system. Seriously. We could be killing the mob but instead we're sitting here waiting for everyone to run in and do a WS and run out to get more TP. I sincerely hope it's not added into the new content.

I know, getting nothing but a crystal off of Kirin was the best!

[Dauntless]

I know, getting nothing but a crystal off of Kirin was the best!

Alternatively, we could just increase the drop rate without having to proc? Nah, that's just stupid!

[Catmato]

I know, getting nothing but a crystal off of Kirin was the best!

Almost as good as proccing blue and yellow on Turul and still just getting a wind ore!

[Karbuncle]

Alternatively, we could just increase the drop rate without having to proc? Nah, that's just stupid!

Can't make everyone happy :\, if you just made a mob with universal "proc" level drop rates the "Easy mode QQ" group would QQ higher, if you made NMs like old days with 4% Drop rates and nothing could help you except Placebo Hunter, it'd become Tedious Fantasy XI again.

The proc system Isn't really awful, it could use some refinements, but i think Voidwatch proc system works really well, You proc almost everything through the course of the natural fight if your group is any good. It doesn't need to be in everything i certainly agree.

I can't really speak neutrally for your side as I personally love the proc system, But i just understand theres two sides to the argument and we can hope the Dev doesn't overkill either one by 99


Almost as good as proccing blue and yellow on Turul and still just getting a wind ore!

mmm, I was under the impression Turul's Cap/Waist were near 100% with Blue... Hell i thought the cape was 100% >____>

I mean, If everyone had cape/waist already thats not really a fair comparison, Because you forced 2 items not to drop by simply having them all.

[Ravenmore]

Alternatively, we could just increase the drop rate without having to proc? Nah, that's just stupid!

Why then we're right back to zerg, kite or basic tank and spank. Just goes to show people don't care about the strat just kill the mob as fast as possible and get loot. With those 3 very basic strat you can kill everything in the game. None of those needs you to pay much attention to the fight if the mob doesn't absorb damage.

[Catmato]

mmm, I was under the impression Turul's Cap/Waist were near 100% with Blue... Hell i thought the cape was 100% >____>
They aren't.


Why then we're right back to zerg, kite or basic tank and spank. Just goes to show people don't care about the strat just kill the mob as fast as possible and get loot. With those 3 very basic strat you can kill everything in the game. None of those needs you to pay much attention to the fight if the mob doesn't absorb damage.

Aside from the few mobs that absorb damage, that's exactly where we are now after proccing.

[Karbuncle]

They aren't.

Ah, So did you guys already have them all?

Or did you not bring TH. If you got Blue/Yellow and got absolutely nothing but a Wind ore, With TH6+, You are probably the single most unlucky person in the world.

[Sparthos]

Something sorely lacking in XI right now are mobs that come with adds that require crowd control.

Stuff like Splitting Heirs and Fiat Lux were examples of battles that were difficult and had an element of strategy.

[Karbuncle]

Don't remind me about Fiat Lux. I loved the fights difficulty but i went 1/fucking18 on any unique Armor (i.e the head, sword or Body), and the one we did get a drop on (Head) went to some guy who showed up to 1 run as a pick up friend.

hrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrng.

But yah, Those types of fights are fun so long as they aren't terribly unrewarding :D

[Sparthos]

Heh, I did Fiat Lux for gil and the cape but yeah... Nocturnus was rare but at the time worth it.

Difficulty seemed to be set at a happy medium. You had his 4hit TP attack capable of oneshotting, moderate adds to sac, absorbing stances and status effects to remove.

The only thing silly was doomspam but in general I feel doom is one of the worst status effects to attach to mobs as it boils down to luck.

Other than that, Fiat Lux was built well.

[Zyeriis]

There's also the MKD final fight, fights like the new kcnm that involves those 2 dragons that rage if their hp %s vary too much. Low manning CoP storyline battlefields before the cap was removed was also a strategic endeavor. Like trying to beat the 3 mammets in 2-5 with 3-4 people (was fun, and no one died).

Fights where you have to string all "3 very basic strats" together in one fight, at different intervals. Some of the Ironclads in abyssea lean toward that type of fight like when it's head pops off and you have to kill/zerg that down quick so it's body doesn't regen a bunch.

Basically, battles that you have to shift focus/tactics mid-battle are what this game needs more of.

[Aliekber]

Exactly, it would be better for the game if the proc system was made more complex--not removed entirely. The whole idea should be to prevent every fight from being the same old CSS Zerg.

[Suirieko]

Alternatively, we could just increase the drop rate without having to proc? Nah, that's just stupid!

Alternatively, we could just work to make increase the drop rate through procs? Nah that's just stupid!

[Dauntless]

Alternatively, we could just work to make increase the drop rate through procs? Nah that's just stupid!

Yes, because it glorifies already overpowered jobs even more.

[Karbuncle]

Yes, because it glorifies already overpowered jobs even more.

I'd argue this is players fault more than anything. When SE added procs (To abyssea) They added procs across multiple jobs, some left out however.

Like say, for red, For Katana, you needed a NIN, for Blueproc you needed a DRK For Scythe, PLD/DRK for GS, WAR for Great Axe, THF(orDNC?) For Dagger, RNG For Archery, COR/RNG for Marks, DRG for Polearm, NIN for Katana, SAM for GK, MNK for h2h, WHM For Club, PLD for sword... For yellow you needed a BLM, a BLU, and a BRD (or /BRD :X), and a WHM.

The ones i named above were only for weapons that require an (EX) WS to be used, and the jobs listed were the only one that could use those EX Weaponskills. THF for DE/SB, PLD/DRK for Spinning slash, etc, PLD for Swift blade.

SE didn't glorify those jobs, we just narrowed it down to easiest time (Blunt) because it could be covered by the least amount of people (A MNk and a WHM).

IN voidwatch they fixed that a bit because they have specific procs like Automaton TP moves, SMN Bloodpacts, etc. in Dynamis they made it to where anyone could proc by not making it specific abilities, but specific actions.

[Dauntless]

If they adjusted procs I wouldn't have a problem with it.

[thenewzero]

IN voidwatch they fixed that a bit because they have specific procs like Automaton TP moves, SMN Bloodpacts, etc. in Dynamis they made it to where anyone could proc by not making it specific abilities, but specific actions.

I think if the Abyssea proc system was shifted more to the Voidwatch style, it would be less frustrating.

I think the best way to do it would be to expand the range of abilities that can proc, say, Yellow (by adding things like SMN Blood Pacts, SCH Helixes, RDM en- IIs or T2 Enfeebles, DRK Absorbs, etc.), and then making it so you don't have to target one *specific* weakness, but that there are maybe 3-4 possible weaknesses. It wouldn't be too hard to set it up so that, as long as you bring enough of the proc-able spellsets, you can guarantee a proc. That way you open up more jobs to proccing.

It should reward us for bringing a variety of classes. It seems like that was what they were *trying* to do, but then they gave BLM two exclusive proc sets (-ga III and AM I), as well as giving them a way to use and land someone else's 'exclusive' proc set (BRD Threnodies). If the proc system was less about covering all spells in a small range of spells, and more about covering, say, half of the spells in a large range of spells, it would end up being more inclusive and less exclusive.

[Andrien]

Continents of Vana'Diel
http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/The_Distant_Continents_of_Vana%27diel

I'd like to move on to different continents. Far East. Northern lands Rhazowa. Southern islands Olzhirya. Finally the West, Ulbuka.

As to when this might happen? Maybe never, but I hope we do get these content when job adjustments is complete down the future etc. Might take a year till we see another full expansion pack. Got to admit though, there is room for plenty content to be had.

[StingRay104]

Ok for all you abyssea haters out there just answer one question, whats so bad about procs? Sure it sucks that PU groups or some LS's only accept jobs that have the most procs, but the whole proc system takes the super ridiculous random luck factor out of it. Sure nothing is 100% but its a hell of a lot better than that old stuff we've had to deal with. I used to outclaim bots on things like Leaping Lizzie, Mee Deggi, and Valkurm Emperor for years, and after all the numerous claims goin into the high 40's each I've only got 1 drop, and that was shortly after they switched to the r/ex version. Lets not forget argus either, or HNM kings. People your just ridiculous with your anti abyssea logic. So what if some noob takes all his jobs from 30-90 just cuz he can, he's still a noob and will suck at them. Who cares if abyssea buffs turn you into a god, hell lots of the nms are still a very rough fight and lots of fun to do. Who cares if you can get brews for 200k apop, if it helps reduce the time spent spamming the same mob over and over again so you can actually go out and enjoy the game thats much better. All you seem to want is the top end gear and weapons but no one else can have them so you can sit there and feel awesome about yourself while everyone encies you. Well fine lets have the Dev team make a special Epeen game just for you guys were everything is impossible to get, as for the rest of us we prefer to get what we work our asses off for.

[Suirieko]

I'd argue this is players fault more than anything. When SE added procs (To abyssea) They added procs across multiple jobs, some left out however.

Like say, for red, For Katana, you needed a NIN, for Blueproc you needed a DRK For Scythe, PLD/DRK for GS, WAR for Great Axe, THF(orDNC?) For Dagger, RNG For Archery, COR/RNG for Marks, DRG for Polearm, NIN for Katana, SAM for GK, MNK for h2h, WHM For Club, PLD for sword... For yellow you needed a BLM, a BLU, and a BRD (or /BRD :X), and a WHM.

The ones i named above were only for weapons that require an (EX) WS to be used, and the jobs listed were the only one that could use those EX Weaponskills. THF for DE/SB, PLD/DRK for Spinning slash, etc, PLD for Swift blade.

SE didn't glorify those jobs, we just narrowed it down to easiest time (Blunt) because it could be covered by the least amount of people (A MNk and a WHM).

IN voidwatch they fixed that a bit because they have specific procs like Automaton TP moves, SMN Bloodpacts, etc. in Dynamis they made it to where anyone could proc by not making it specific abilities, but specific actions.

Personally, I'm a fan of the way they had the procs setup in Dynamis. However, I was going to say it doesn't 'glorify' any jobs, then I realized how strongly useful DNC/NIn is for this. They have a lot of job abilities that effect the mobs, can WS multiple times, and ninjutsu does the job to stagger the mobs.

[Octaviane]

If there's one thing I've noticed reading these forums, it's that the people who tend to praise old FFXI content are generally the same people who were never good enough, or in a good enough group, pre-Abyssea to actually do any of that old content beyond Nyzul, Assaults, Sky, Dynamis, and Limbus at any sort of competent level.

Word to the wise: Karbuncle hit every nail on its respective head.

A typical elitist, "I'm better than you just because I say I am, just ask me I'll tell you" response. Maybe you are, frankly I really don't give a hoot, but please remember, this is a game, stop putting people down in almost every long-winded post you make because YOU think people aren't good enough. You can't possibly say that since you don't know 90% of the people who play and you never will. Let people enjoy the game and do as they please. If they suck, they suck, my bet is they will still get all that great gear and weapons regardless of skill or ability. You don't have to associate with them. You don't have to help them, so do and say nothing. We all pay to play, just as you do for better or worse.

[Octaviane]

No-one is ever satified with anything in this game (or any other come to that), it's been that way from the very beginning. "We want more, we want more, gimme, gimme" is the daily cry. Nothing wrong with that either, everyone is entitled to their opinion, but really, every five minutes someone is complaining about something. Please note the word COMPLAINING. Where are the thank you's?

Oh wait, I know, $12.95 every 30 days is thanks enough.

You all have received what you asked for and a lot more thus far, you keep on getting what you ask for, you will continue to get what you ask for yet you still and still will complain and cry "MORE". Be satisfied and patient for a longer than five minutes and let SE work on and present its road map as and when they are ready. They are not perfect to be sure, there are many issues that have gone unresolved/ignored/ridiculed and there will undoubtably be more. You still come back for more though like lemmings drawn to the sea. You all must have a "gimme more reasons to complain" complex.

The people who are "childish" are the ones who think they are better than everyone else and who take every opportunity to say so in no uncertain terms. Like I said, maybe you are, the rest of us poor, less than perfect beings don't give a hangnail.

You are no different, and in many cases, a lot worse than the elitist's from 2 or 3 years ago who would ridicule those players considered less stellar than themselves.

Oh, back on topic, there is enough Abyssea style content, let's hope SE has something else up their sleeves to satisfy the masses. :)

[MarkovChain]

Abyssea should not be extended for several reasons.

1. Job imbalance. The proc system sucks too much to get anything on any job at any time.
2. Since exp is too easy and jobs are so unbalanced, everyone levels a few of each job leading to more imbalance
3. Abyssea is nothing but a giant grind. Look at empy weapons magian trials. Look at AF3. As such it is not better than older content.
4. There is absolutely no challenge or no reward for killing faster or better.

Most of the complains I ve seen in the thread are towards the old hnms. Seriously if you think the old system=hnms you probably didnt do endgame at 75. Secondly every nm in abyssea that drops popular af3 mats is camped, botted, and getting af3 is a matter of outclaiming others. Inbe4 someone mentions a trade macro thinking he is the only one that knows the trade macro.

Abyssea popularized the no friends system with mnk+whm dual box system. It introduced the ability to do an event at anytime without requiring others. The result is here. Way too many people play it outside their normal prime time cockblocking others from other time zones. Not different than the hnm system is it? Didnt have that problem with salvage. Of course SE is going back to this type of content ! No way the game can survive if you dont build anything serious.

[StingRay104]

Abyssea should not be extended for several reasons.

1. Job imbalance. The proc system sucks too much to get anything on any job at any time.
2. Since exp is too easy and jobs are so unbalanced, everyone levels a few of each job leading to more imbalance
3. Abyssea is nothing but a giant grind. Look at empy weapons magian trials. Look at AF3. As such it is not better than older content.
4. There is absolutely no challenge or no reward for killing faster or better.

Most of the complains I ve seen in the thread are towards the old hnms. Seriously if you think the old system=hnms you probably didnt do endgame at 75. Secondly every nm in abyssea that drops popular af3 mats is camped, botted, and getting af3 is a matter of outclaiming others. Inbe4 someone mentions a trade macro thinking he is the only one that knows the trade macro.

Abyssea popularized the no friends system with mnk+whm dual box system. It introduced the ability to do an event at anytime without requiring others. The result is here. Way too many people play it outside their normal prime time cockblocking others from other time zones. Not different than the hnm system is it? Didnt have that problem with salvage. Of course SE is going back to this type of content ! No way the game can survive if you dont build anything serious.

1. The imbalance in jobs existed before abyssea, war king of damage before abyssea and now its even more king of damage. Only difference is some of the not so high end dd's with a randomly good crit ws and RR all of a sudden are doing great damage like PUP and stringing pummel.

2. EXP isn't endgame, its not even content really, its sort of an unlock to the jobs potential. If someone takes the time to learn a job then they can be equally as effective as someone who slaved thru the xp, the only difference is it takes them longer to skill up a job and the person who took the long route bitches more because they did it the "right" way while everyone else isn't.

3. Hate to break it to you but magian trials came out before abyssea, granted abyssea gave it the best trials. Also back in the old days guess what was a grind? Thats right xp was a grind just with slower wheels, not to mention certain jobs like drg pup and bst would wait hours to get pt invites. Hell lets look at sky, you have to GRIND!!!!! thru all these mobs just to get the pi's like in abyssea and people would camp the nms or the ??? spots and try to out do each other all the time. Sea once again we have to grind thru all sorts of mobs and nms but the drop rates were even lower and thus less comp for popping kings.

4. If your not having fun with the game you don't have to play. I enjoy the faster pace that the game is taking, besides there are still plenty of good fights in abyssea.

The reason the complaints are directed to the old HNMS is because they were the cream of the crop when it comes to crap content. 21-24 hr pops with a 3 day + cahnce to see HQ king? So if you have no life, no job, nothing constructive at all to do you can get a chance at these guys to get some really great gear, and that is complete and total bullshit. Make it challenging is one thing but make it ridiculous like this is too much.

Ok Imma talk serious to you about this so please pay close attention. All your negative points about bots, large camps, trade macros, and all these other tactics that these jerks use, guess what? No matter what content SE makes these jerks will still be here and continue to use their jerkish techniques to get things they want faster. In other words your complaint isn't against the content of the game its against the jerks who play the game. The bonus with having faster content like abyssea is you ultimately have to deal with these people for lesser periods of time IE: HNM camps lasting months of seeing the same jerks get the claim on the King despite how good of a shell you put together and how dedicated and awesome your friends are.

[Ryce]

I understand the general feeling that Abyssea has made FFXI really easy at "endgame", and that annoys the Old Guard, but actually compare the old way of getting things done to some of the new ones:

1. Drops: I'm sorry, but the stagger system is awesome. I'm sure it causes some people frustration and could probably use some adjusting, but never before could you purposely effect your chances of getting your desired drop. Yes, there was TH (the update to that is awesome too), but that catered to exactly one job.

2. Time: Goodbye 24/7 bots. Goodbye killing placeholders every 15 minutes for 3 hours to get a ToD, then waiting another 90 minutes and starting over again. If you want an NM in Abyssea, you gotta farm your pops and get your business done before Visitant Status wears off. Yes, you can farm massive amounts of time with relative ease on many jobs, but it's by-and-large an ACTIVE process. Respawn windows? <No thanks.> Let me play the game.

3. Character Growth: Atmas are overpowered, I'll give you that, but the concept is great. "Here's a significant upgrade to your character based on an achievement". Rather than the old, "Hack away at Colibri for 5 days and you can increase a stat point by 2 (for a maximum of 5)". Perhaps atma can exist in the real world (non-aby) at a more reasonable strength and be our 99 merit equivalent.

4. Travel: Aby warps are nice. If nothing else, they accommodate the lack of outpost warp NPCs in Jeuno. VCs are great too.

5. Progress: As more of a casual player, I love the fact that I can collect items (seals, stones, etc) from reasonably accessible fights and make quantifiable progress toward the gear I want. Campaign and Assault did this too with notes/points, to an extent, but I feel like they hit a nice balance between grind and luck-of-the-draw with the current system.

I think the current dev team is doing an awesome job of bringing this amazing game into the modern world. I'm very much looking forward to their post-aby content, not because it's post-aby, but because of what they accomplished in aby.

[StingRay104]

Also if you anti abyssea people want harder content, well wouldn't making really harder content in abyssea satisfy you? Almost as if expanding abyssea to include extremely challenging fights with great rewards would answer all your prayers. Nah that would potentially make you happy, can't have that now can we.

P.S. I bet the first counter point to this mentions brews.

[Panthera]

I think after 3 mini-expansions of the same thing, we're over due for something new.

What was great about pre-abyssea / level cap increases FFXI is that there were so many different things to do. Even if you weren't in love with every event, there had to be at least a few things one could do and enjoy. Getting to 75 and End Game was worth the effort. As things stand, if you aren't completely enraptaured with Abyssea, you're out of luck. The point of getting to 90 is so that you can do... what? A single alternative, i.e. Voidwatch, is far from the great variety we once had.

What I'd like to see is a balance between story and characters vs gameplay. A Crystaline Prophecy et all. had too much story, too little to do, where Abyssea is a void of any narrative rationale to go into these strange lands. Honestly, Abyssea makes me appreciate "old content" even more now then I did then.

As for the matter of redudancy of this thread, the original was framed in such a way so as to favor more abyssea, or additions to current abyssea. A more generalized, neutral question such as "What should the next expansion be?" followed by the OP's replying in a separate post, would make things more balanced. A thread title gets a bigger "oomph," so the opposition feels it has the right--as it does-- to make it's own thread, so that it's own voice can be heard with equal volume.

[Raxiaz]

Getting to 75 and experiencing end-game was totally not worth it. I didn't start to like end-game until abyssea hit. And I've been playing since before ToAU. Dynamis was the bane of my existence until they recently revamped it. Now I wouldn't mind revisiting some of the city zones, if just to collect pieces of gear I'll never wear.

One can still do all the former end-game events, too. A major thing about them that I absolutely despised was the need for an 18-man alliance or at the very least 6-man. Nowadays one can go in with 3-4 people and get things done, almost faster than a full 18 man did.

What SE needs to do is make the former end-game events relevant again. Provide trials to upgrade the pieces of equipment gained from these events. I'm desperately awaiting SE to do this, because as it stands getting a group together for Nyzul is nigh impossible.

[MarkovChain]

If you want an NM in Abyssea, you gotta farm your pops and get your business done before Visitant Status wears off. Yes, you can farm massive amounts of time with relative ease on many jobs, but it's by-and-large an ACTIVE process. Respawn windows? <No thanks.> Let me play the game.

1/ If it's easier to get drops how come you don't have stones stored at the npc ? I got 200 stones stored, full empy wpn and gear, and only started in february.

2/ Why are you all mentionning 24h windows ? You guys are out of the loop. Hnm gear was crap for the most part. 95% of the endgame could be organized at a given time. But from the look at your post as well as other whiners, you clearly did not do endgame.


bringing this amazing game into the modern world. I'm very much looking forward to their post-aby content, not because it's post-aby, but because of what they accomplished in aby.

The only way to make the game survive is to introduce variety and challenge in endgame. Abyssea is the opposite of that. The only way to bring challenge in the game is to put a time limit to reach a boss. The only way to bring variety is to introduce challenge so that people care enough to farm situationnal gear.

[Ryce]

1/ If it's easier to get drops how come you don't have stones stored at the npc ? I got 200 stones stored, full empy wpn and gear, and only started in february.

I've got plenty of stones saved myself. The point is that a bot/devoted camper cannot simply sit in the zone and wait for a pop all day every day. For the most part, you have to do something to pop the NM (not a new concept, just a good one).


2/ Why are you all mentionning 24h windows ? You guys are out of the loop. Hnm gear was crap for the most part. 95% of the endgame could be organized at a given time. But from the look at your post as well as other whiners, you clearly did not do endgame.

Personally, I didn't say anything about 24hr windows (but I realize other have). My beef is with common NMs (such as the NMs in the first stages of many weapon trials) with the 60-90 minute respawn timers. After you find, claim, and kill the NM, you are forced to stop pursuing your goal (if you didn't get the drop, etc) for 60-90 minutes. Either stop playing or go do something else (adding more wasted time traveling back and forth). Most people can be seen AFK for an hour after an NM kill. I don't like that. I'd much rather have to go farm another pop set in the area, then come back and try the NM again. At least then I feel like I've been working at it the whole time, not playing the game for 10 minutes between hour breaks.

And no, I didn't do much endgame for many of these reasons. I've been playing FFXI since it came out (in NA) and generally don't have the schedule to accommodate the long endgame runs of old. In fact, I was turned off from even trying a lot of stuff because of the abysmal drop rates and time required to get involved. I'd LOVE some really challenging fights, but that's COMPLETELY different than moderately difficult events which try your patience and free time, not your ability to play the game.


The only way to make the game survive is to introduce variety and challenge in endgame. Abyssea is the opposite of that. The only way to bring challenge in the game is to put a time limit to reach a boss. The only way to bring variety is to introduce challenge so that people care enough to farm situationnal gear.

I agree with you on time limits to reach bosses. It could also just be tougher battles, or battles which change dramatically with each attempt.

[Malamasala]

What SE needs to do is make the former end-game events relevant again.

That is the one thing they don't have to do. It is the dumbest idea I've ever read, and it makes me sad people keep repeating it.

[Ravenmore]

The people wanting a challenge in the game can make one for them selfs. No one force's you to use brews, atmas cruor buffs so find people that think the same way. I agree with GG those that whine now never did anything outside of lolsky. Good HNM fights were there for everyone T4 ZNM fights were a good challenge, KS99s were more of a challenge then ground, low manning sky, limbus, grinding your way up to JoL. All those had one thing in common they were pretty easy if you took 18 people to them, or like sky, znm, sea 18+.

[Sparthos]

The people wanting a challenge in the game can make one for them selfs. No one force's you to use brews, atmas cruor buffs so find people that think the same way. I agree with GG those that whine now never did anything outside of lolsky. Good HNM fights were there for everyone T4 ZNM fights were a good challenge, KS99s were more of a challenge then ground, low manning sky, limbus, grinding your way up to JoL. All those had one thing in common they were pretty easy if you took 18 people to them, or like sky, znm, sea 18+.

"Make your own challenge" is a terrible argument in an online game. Offline? Sure. Plenty of console games are designed to be simplistic and the only way to squeeze out a challenge involves tying one hand behind your back for the sake of amusement.

This isn't an offline game however.

The very fact that such things like brews, atmas and cruor buffs are on the table defeats any point of going without them. What are you going to get without em? The same drops as everyone else.

Perhaps if SE had rewards tied to doing something in "hardmode", you'd see more people doing such things. As it stands right now, you get nothing from fighting Rani from 100% -> 0% w/o a brew other than some personal satisfaction.

Abyssea served its purpose as being a place where people could enjoy being godlike via insane levels of buffs. It also happened to kill off half the jobs in the game and annihilate years worth of old content.

No one is asking that XI goes back to levels of tedium that such events like VNM, Salvage and Fay Augments encouraged but there is a happy medium and it isn't a place where you can 2shot everything under an invincibility drink that isnt even hard to acquire.

[StingRay104]

Actually the level cap raise killed off the old content, don't believe me, first cap to 80 before people really knew what abyssea did, Hagun dropped from its 3m price tag to 300k, now look at it, its nothing. This is what happens all that old gear that was built into the old content was centered around a lvl 75 max lvl. So now that everything is changing all that old gear is of course gonna be replaced with new and better gear, so therefore since the old content was set at lvl 75 cap who wants to do the old stuff. I'm glad they are at least making the cop reward ring scale up to lvl 99, they really need to rethink the Toau one, but ultimately this is what happens with change, believe it or not things change. It seems to me all you people are complaining about abyssea because it was the first real thing to happen with the level cap, get over it. Abyssea was a huge success and SE sees that so you can bet that things from abyssea are gonna stick. As much as I would like to see old gear get buffed up to compete with the new stuff, SE has continue to fall short in this dept, plus most of it was not even worth trying to scale up. Things are gonna change new armor and challenges await.

[thenewzero]

I understand the general feeling that Abyssea has made FFXI really easy at "endgame", and that annoys the Old Guard, but actually compare the old way of getting things done to some of the new ones:

1. Drops: I'm sorry, but the stagger system is awesome. I'm sure it causes some people frustration and could probably use some adjusting, but never before could you purposely effect your chances of getting your desired drop. Yes, there was TH (the update to that is awesome too), but that catered to exactly one job.

2. Time: Goodbye 24/7 bots. Goodbye killing placeholders every 15 minutes for 3 hours to get a ToD, then waiting another 90 minutes and starting over again. If you want an NM in Abyssea, you gotta farm your pops and get your business done before Visitant Status wears off. Yes, you can farm massive amounts of time with relative ease on many jobs, but it's by-and-large an ACTIVE process. Respawn windows? <No thanks.> Let me play the game.

3. Character Growth: Atmas are overpowered, I'll give you that, but the concept is great. "Here's a significant upgrade to your character based on an achievement". Rather than the old, "Hack away at Colibri for 5 days and you can increase a stat point by 2 (for a maximum of 5)". Perhaps atma can exist in the real world (non-aby) at a more reasonable strength and be our 99 merit equivalent.

4. Travel: Aby warps are nice. If nothing else, they accommodate the lack of outpost warp NPCs in Jeuno. VCs are great too.

5. Progress: As more of a casual player, I love the fact that I can collect items (seals, stones, etc) from reasonably accessible fights and make quantifiable progress toward the gear I want. Campaign and Assault did this too with notes/points, to an extent, but I feel like they hit a nice balance between grind and luck-of-the-draw with the current system.

I think the current dev team is doing an awesome job of bringing this amazing game into the modern world. I'm very much looking forward to their post-aby content, not because it's post-aby, but because of what they accomplished in aby.

Very much agree with Ryce on this. Aby isn't perfect, but it has brought a tangible and accessible feeling of advancement to the game, and taken the game from a passive time sink of a waiting game into a system of investing your time *actively* into whatever progression you choose.

The only areas that I feel are lacking are the exclusivity of the proc system in Aby (which is much less exclusive in Dynamis and Voidwatch), and the awkward things some of the more extreme Atma have done to game balance. If they refined the proc system to include more Jobs and reward diversity in group comps, the proc system would be great. Once we're outside of Abyssea, the issues caused by uber-Atma will largely resolve themselves.

I think a lot of people forgot that the level cap isn't done being raised yet, and that this isn't the last content we will ever see. Abyssea is not *the* endgame. It's just a stepping stone into whatever they have planned for the 99 level cap. As a stepping stone, it's worked wonderfully, allowing many players to 'catch up', and older players to hit the ground running with Jobs they may have never even considered leveling before.

[Ravenmore]

"Make your own challenge" is a terrible argument in an online game. Offline? Sure. Plenty of console games are designed to be simplistic and the only way to squeeze out a challenge involves tying one hand behind your back for the sake of amusement.

This isn't an offline game however.

The very fact that such things like brews, atmas and cruor buffs are on the table defeats any point of going without them. What are you going to get without em? The same drops as everyone else.

Perhaps if SE had rewards tied to doing something in "hardmode", you'd see more people doing such things. As it stands right now, you get nothing from fighting Rani from 100% -> 0% w/o a brew other than some personal satisfaction.

Abyssea served its purpose as being a place where people could enjoy being godlike via insane levels of buffs. It also happened to kill off half the jobs in the game and annihilate years worth of old content.

No one is asking that XI goes back to levels of tedium that such events like VNM, Salvage and Fay Augments encouraged but there is a happy medium and it isn't a place where you can 2shot everything under an invincibility drink that isnt even hard to acquire.

Still no different then at 75. People low man sky sea limbus to make their own chellange back then. Nothing in sky needed 18 people to kill but the gimp LSes still refused to do them with out 18+. Saying someone shouldn't have gear because thier not as skilled as you is more elitest then anything else. That never stop them before.

Those years worth of content was already dead. People stop doing sky long before abyssea, limbus was dieing a slow death, salvage never took off to be that big of a deal since only a couple of jobs got anything of value list goes on the game was dieing. If you weren't on floor 100 in nysul no bother to go back and help after a few months after the WSs were released. People were getting bored killing kirin for the 100th time or going back to save the mage that forgot the weapons agro magic on the way to kitty for the 1000th time.

[Korpg]

Personally, I don't think there is anything wrong with Abyssea as is.

I think it should be extended storywise, but with challenging level 99 content.

[Manicora]

This may not even be worth reading, However: Make a New tier for ZNM Sky Sea if you want to modify old content.
Make New Zones: Those that challenge solo and Team/party adventured. Seemingly @ lvl 90 Almost any job save for 2-3 can solo in all old zones with almot no problems. ZNM farming for gear can be done solo or Duo even t4. Ive seen Dark Ixion be Solod, Ive seen Tiamat 4boxed. Ive done Bahamut 2 within 10 min with 11 people. Make the game Harder for us. Quit giving in to all the cry babys who cant get it done @90 where others got it done @75. Give Us rewards for Old content being done outside of Abyssea. Allow us to enjoy the game again for what is was known for: Difficulty
If somehow the game got harder @91-99 I would love it more.

[Zyeriis]

The only thing I can see them doing with the abyssea storyline is merging it with the apocalypse nigh questline (that merges RotZ and CoP). That's it.

[Ravenmore]

Thats the thing old content should be left were it is and new content made. No one enjoyed the game for difficulty since nothing was really hard it was all time sinks. What was the first thing people tried after they nerfed AV? If people really wanted hard fights then they would have been lineing up to fight AV. The hardest thing in the game has always been get 5 to 17 other people that were not brain dead and could follow simple directions.

[Michae]

Abyssea has a lackluster storyline with a unimpressive ending. Old content at least gave us that. And aby isnt any better about drop rates. But now instead of low drop rates and 3-5 pts camping, we have great drop rates with 3-5 alliances camping 1 popable/timed nm that all the members of that alliance need. The only why to make it in Aby is to have no real life going on so u can join one of the ls that run 5-7 hrs a day 5-7 days a week so u can fight the same nm 50+ times for an upgrade that will be out of date with the upcoming lvl increases. Say what you will about the old content but at least it had a good story with a challange and you could play with ppl who were 75 and skilled at thier jobs instead of ppl who are lvl 90 with decent gear and lvl 30 skills and no idea how to use them. I have found my hrs playng the game dwindle down so low I dont even log in everyday anymore. Between aby, ffx-2, ffxiii, ffxiv and the new content upcoming I am loosing ALOT of faith in the SE dev team. I am sure I will be switching to other games soon enough and leaving SE titles behind me.

[Alukat]

i liked the self-regulating time investment at the old content (dynamis / einherjar / limbus, didn't bothered myself so much with HNMs,Sea,Salvage and sky was meh too).so with dynamis 4hours / einherjar 1 hour / limbus ~2 hours and one of them per day the time invested per rl was pretty much regulated.but now with all the pop items farmable via procs / gold chests it is possible to complete the things very quickly by spending 24/7 in abyssea.
we can't be more addicted as the game allows us to be, and abyssea raises the addiction pretty much and becomes boring pretty quickly.

so i would too see that SE finds a good middle between the old EG content and the new Abyssea content.

[Raxiaz]

No, old content storylines gave us the three story add-ons... they gave us the three-year-long wait for WotG's ending... they gave us WoTG in the first place, the worst story line progression in the game (in my opinion). I can't stand the thought of having two mission lines intertwined with each other. How would you feel if you couldn't have progressed through Chains of Promathia if you hadn't yet beaten Rise of the Zilart? Or ToAU before beating the others? That's how I felt with WoTG, all the way, from the moment I couldn't progress through the main story because I had to beat a nation mission. One that wasted much of my time shouting for.

I do not want another story like the three add-ons. I want something that is equivalent to the length of CoP or ToAU. If they can't give me that, and things like Abyssea are all they can come up with, then that's fine with me. Because the story add-ons were horrible. They were not what I would call "ideal content" and no, putting all three of them together they come nowhere near as close to the content as provided by former expansions. They don't even come close to ONE abyssea add-on, IMO.

/rant

[Ravenmore]

Abyssea has a lackluster storyline with a unimpressive ending. Old content at least gave us that. And aby isnt any better about drop rates. But now instead of low drop rates and 3-5 pts camping, we have great drop rates with 3-5 alliances camping 1 popable/timed nm that all the members of that alliance need. The only why to make it in Aby is to have no real life going on so u can join one of the ls that run 5-7 hrs a day 5-7 days a week so u can fight the same nm 50+ times for an upgrade that will be out of date with the upcoming lvl increases. Say what you will about the old content but at least it had a good story with a challange and you could play with ppl who were 75 and skilled at thier jobs instead of ppl who are lvl 90 with decent gear and lvl 30 skills and no idea how to use them. I have found my hrs playng the game dwindle down so low I dont even log in everyday anymore. Between aby, ffx-2, ffxiii, ffxiv and the new content upcoming I am loosing ALOT of faith in the SE dev team. I am sure I will be switching to other games soon enough and leaving SE titles behind me.

Nothing your saying here is any different then when the old content was at its peak. Stop doing anything with PUGs, thats the same as it ever was. Having cap skill didn't mean they had any freaking idea how to play thier jobs outside of lolexp. The missions gave us the story line that most players spammed though to get to the shinnys. Really ZM could be finished in a day and you were in sky. At least you know it won't take more then 50 times to finish a weapon how many time did you have to into dynas to finish a relic for the sponsor or how many time would you have to kill kirin to get everyone w.legs. Not to mention seemed like everyone was after kitty pants.

There is just as many gimps now as there was at 75. You just come into more contact with them since pugs are now at the same levels they been in other MMOs. Now instead of just pugging exp and missions poeple are puging the currant endgame. Really how is any gimp different then 4/5 af wearing gimps that you pasted in WG or jeuno at 75.


i liked the self-regulating time investment at the old content (dynamis / einherjar / limbus, didn't bothered myself so much with HNMs,Sea,Salvage and sky was meh too).so with dynamis 4hours / einherjar 1 hour / limbus ~2 hours and one of them per day the time invested per rl was

Nothing has changed since all you did was the entry level anyone could do endgame. There was no limits on how much time you could farm sky, sea, ZNM pics/NMs and salvage could be done every day. People would camp ground on every single day of the week. So nothing has change since the bulk of the endgame content. Lets see why FF14 is still failing hmmm the game forces you not to be hardcore.

[Sparthos]

Still no different then at 75. People low man sky sea limbus to make their own chellange back then. Nothing in sky needed 18 people to kill but the gimp LSes still refused to do them with out 18+. Saying someone shouldn't have gear because thier not as skilled as you is more elitest then anything else. That never stop them before.

Those years worth of content was already dead. People stop doing sky long before abyssea, limbus was dieing a slow death, salvage never took off to be that big of a deal since only a couple of jobs got anything of value list goes on the game was dieing. If you weren't on floor 100 in nysul no bother to go back and help after a few months after the WSs were released. People were getting bored killing kirin for the 100th time or going back to save the mage that forgot the weapons agro magic on the way to kitty for the 1000th time.

Wait, so it's elitist for SE to create challenges that only the skilled few obtain through overcoming difficulties? Nonsense.

You aren't going to get me to say that I liked 75 cap XI because I didn't but this extreme ease is just as poisonous as what we left behind at 75. Ah yes, lets be able to throw brews at everything that beats you on the first try because doing it legitimately is no different.

Some of us enjoy challenges, not playing a game of Supermarket Sweep.

I simply seek a happy medium and Abyssea is far from it. Don't get me wrong, I love the concept but more? Pass. Half of my classes are rotting from disuse due to Easy Mode 3.0.

[Ravenmore]

Nothing is stoping you from doing the challenge. Your being elitest by saying only the skilled should control the drops since thats all it would come down to. Any half away decent group can kill every single NM in abyssea with out brews. Wouldn't do anything about the unclean still getting the same gear your so proud of. You are measuring your own worth the same way the botters did at old ground. No one beside you care how you got your gear.

With old endgame you didn't know for sure if that sam in you exp party bought his kitty pants or did sky to get them, or if that mnk just sat at a ground camp and bought the BB items, or the war got e.body that same way.

Nothing can take away the way you got the item, and no one really gives a crap either but the elitest that use gear to mesure them self agienst other people. You know you didn't kill rani with a brew or can kill him with out a brew. Anymore if they can follow directions I don't care what they have since thats what endgame has always been about.

[Sparthos]

Nothing is stoping you from doing the challenge. Your being elitest by saying only the skilled should control the drops since thats all it would come down to. Any half away decent group can kill every single NM in abyssea with out brews. Wouldn't do anything about the unclean still getting the same gear your so proud of. You are measuring your own worth the same way the botters did at old ground. No one beside you care how you got your gear.

With old endgame you didn't know for sure if that sam in you exp party bought his kitty pants or did sky to get them, or if that mnk just sat at a ground camp and bought the BB items, or the war got e.body that same way.

Nothing can take away the way you got the item, and no one really gives a crap either but the elitest that use gear to mesure them self agienst other people. You know you didn't kill rani with a brew or can kill him with out a brew. Anymore if they can follow directions I don't care what they have since thats what endgame has always been about.

Here we go with the self-righteous nonsense.

I don't see what problem there is with putting certain pieces of gear on the rare tier so long as patches provide enough normal gear able to be obtained by the masses.

I have no problem with +2s being obtainable by anyone but certain pieces should be rare because they provide something to work towards in the long term.

This could be an item acquired by doing obscene levels of questing, something through TOTM or simply a rare drop from an event that spits out alot of good gear but has some rare drops that spice up the pool. There are many creative ways to go about rewarding a player for playing XI.

Instead of going straight for the lazy response that im an elitist that wants to control drops understand that I feel that when everyone is the same, things get boring. Everyones in Port Jeuno rocking their 2nd, 3rd and 5th Emps with +2s bleeding out the ears right now because getting gear is more like a checklist now.

Good for them.

I dont care for world spawns or any of the old silliness moreso than something you get for going above and beyond the baseline. If you beat all BC40s? You get a reward. Beat all BCNMs? Uber Reward. All KS99s? Reward.

That's more of a challenge. Something you can't avoid with an easy button and gives everyone and equal shot at completing.

[hiko]

Also if you anti abyssea people want harder content, nobody force you to equip atma in abyssea.
fixed that for you ;)

[Ravenmore]

Still using gear for a measure your self and other. Why do you care if someone got something you have. Gear has always been a check list.

[Zyeriis]

Still using gear for a measure your self and other. Why do you care if someone got something you have. Gear has always been a check list.
Why do you care that some one has something that you don't have?

[MarkovChain]

Still using gear for a measure your self and other. Why do you care if someone got something you have. Gear has always been a check list.

Nonsense.
1/ Why do you care if someone has gear that you don't have ? Looking at you pro abyssean.
2/ this game is entirely based on gear. Proof is that the reasons most of you like abyssea is that you can get the gear this time.

[Karbuncle]

Nonsense.
1/ Why do you care if someone has gear that you don't have ? Looking at you pro abyssean.
2/ this game is entirely based on gear. Proof is that the reasons most of you like abyssea is that you can get the gear this time.

I happen to like abyssea because its easier for me and my friends to get together and do something, It was an enjoyable event we could do at the spur of the moment and accomplish things. We did this before Abyssea, But abyssea really made it more accessible to us.

It made the game a bit more fun to play in my eyes. It took the grind out of it. I could care less if someone has armor i don't. If i want an armor bad enough I'll get it, no matter what that means, with determination and Effort, Rather its effort in farming the gil to buy it, or effort in going to the event/camping it.

Some people like Abyssea for the wrong reasons, It doesn't make Abyssea a bad event, or a bad zone collaboration. It was absolutely awesome to me, and many like me.

I unlike some of those pro-abyssea people, Would not mind if Content became more difficult, Only that they at least keep an aspect, a small portion of events, Low-man Friendly, Like Salvage was, or Nyzul, those events required less than 7 people.

The more i think about it the more i find myself looking away from alliance wide Content, Because the fun in that is usually hindered by the fact unless you were in a large LS, you were stuck shouting for people, and 99% of people found through Shoutting were garbage-tear turds who couldn't find their job ability menu without you holding their hand through the process. So what should be a rewarding, challenging, alliance fight becomes a tedious wading through hell with 17 people who couldn't co-operate their way out of a swimming pool, let alone do an event reasonably.

But i'm getting ahead of myself. I as much as most people look forward to out-of-Abyssea content, I loved abyssea to death, But I'm not sad its over, I was happy to be along for the ride.

This is all of course my point of view, and might not mirror opinions of other "Pro-abyssea" People.

[RabidSquirrel]

To be honest, I (a thief) have had a lot fun randomly duoing NMs with my black mage buddy. We just look up who can drop what, be it seals, +2 items, or equipment, and go try it out. And if he's not online, I'd go and try soloing whatever I felt like. Just to do it. Even if it's probably not going to end well (like soloing Warbler in aurore gear). And you know what? I can't really remember having as much fun with anything else in the game.

[Juri_Licious]

I'm honestly just tired of the whole buff up on steroids system part of Abyssea.
If you say "You don't have to use Atma", the area was designed for you to use Atma so you really expect someone to play this area with out Atma? Horrible point.

I just want a new area where it's based off your actual stats/skills other than Super Saiyan 3.
Also, no more Procs. As I stated before there is already a huge Abyssea selection so people don't need to get all pissed off if the next area they add isn't Abyssea.

[Raxiaz]

No more procs? Are you ****ing daft? The proc system is probably the second best thing SE has added to the game alongside abyssea. If anything, keep the proc system around, but in future events don't make it similar to Abyssea nor Dynamis. Change it up for every event.

[Olor]

To be honest, I (a thief) have had a lot fun randomly duoing NMs with my black mage buddy. We just look up who can drop what, be it seals, +2 items, or equipment, and go try it out. And if he's not online, I'd go and try soloing whatever I felt like. Just to do it. Even if it's probably not going to end well (like soloing Warbler in aurore gear). And you know what? I can't really remember having as much fun with anything else in the game.

yeah, this. It is fun to be able to just try stuff, and if you fail, no biggie. Learn for next time, try a different atma configuration, ask a friend to help.

[Juri_Licious]

No more procs? Are you ****ing daft? The proc system is probably the second best thing SE has added to the game alongside abyssea. If anything, keep the proc system around, but in future events don't make it similar to Abyssea nor Dynamis. Change it up for every event.

Name calling and cursing, are you capable of posting with out it?
And that's just your opinion, I personally dislike it because it's heavily limited to a certain number of classes.

[Korpg]

Name calling and cursing, are you capable of posting with out it?
And that's just your opinion, I personally dislike it because it's heavily limited to a certain number of classes.

So is everything else.

Want to do WoE? Better have a SMN for most of it.

Want to do Einherjar? Certain jobs are more perfered than others.

Nyzul? Same thing. Salvage? Same thing. Assault? Heck, all jobs are great for different ones.

This game is where no one job can rule them all, except maybe WHM. Only cause a healer is needed for most everything.

[Juri_Licious]

So is everything else.

Want to do WoE? Better have a SMN for most of it.

Want to do Einherjar? Certain jobs are more perfered than others.

Nyzul? Same thing. Salvage? Same thing. Assault? Heck, all jobs are great for different ones.

This game is where no one job can rule them all, except maybe WHM. Only cause a healer is needed for most everything.

I guess my problem is with FFXI itself than. I'm not a fan of leveling up or playing a ton of different classes.
I kinda like to stick to the one I like the most.

[Raxiaz]

Then don't play? Favor a job that's liked among the entire community for all of FFXI's events?

And whoever said that future proc systems would be the same? I vouched for quite the opposite. I'm sure SE is well aware that the current two systems favor some jobs more than others. In the future, they ought to design a system where procs can be done by a multitude of jobs.

And just FYI, there is no name calling in this post. But that's because you didn't post something stupid.

[Malamasala]

So is everything else.

Want to do WoE? Better have a SMN for most of it.

Want to do Einherjar? Certain jobs are more perfered than others.

Nyzul? Same thing. Salvage? Same thing. Assault? Heck, all jobs are great for different ones.

This game is where no one job can rule them all, except maybe WHM. Only cause a healer is needed for most everything.

All you listed are stuff I've been told "Change job" for. Because they did not want a SMN for any of that. Heck, even today they only want me SMN for like Voidwatch "because it is good" and for Abyssea "Because it is so easy it doesn't matter".

Personally I'd like a quick update that makes SMN overpowered so people can stop saying the job is worst, along with PUP and BST.

[Bumbeen]

I dunno, I had a lot of fun doing salvage... I think toau content was very well done.

[Solonuke]

I want to do storyline missions, but the thought of shouting for them sends a chill down my spine. I've wasted enough hours to shout for CoP 8-2 for example. I can't do the assault missions solo because of the minimum entry is 3 people. I've yet to start on any of the TOAU and WOTG missions as there has been zero interest in all the linkshells I've been in, even though it only takes a few days to complete each of them from start to finish. Doing CoP 2005 was probably something of the most epic thing I've experienced in the game, but if one out of 6 people spread around the globe couldn't make it, we had to wait another week before attempting Snoll for the 5th time while holding on medicines for millions of gil. I watched all the cut scenes for that Shantotto add on because of I didn't feel like doing all these incredibly tedious fetch quests. Chances are that I'll do the same thing for TOAU and WOTG because I don't need a party to watch the cut scenes on Youtube.

I thought they designed the quest chain for Abyssea from start to finish really well as you fight a lot of NMs that drops relevant gear, atma and abyssites providing a lot of interest doing these NMs so most of them aren't roadblocks no one wants to help you with. But I do think that once the focus changes to different content that Abyssea will be just as difficult to do as the earlier storylines.

[Korpg]

All you listed are stuff I've been told "Change job" for. Because they did not want a SMN for any of that. Heck, even today they only want me SMN for like Voidwatch "because it is good" and for Abyssea "Because it is so easy it doesn't matter".

Personally I'd like a quick update that makes SMN overpowered so people can stop saying the job is worst, along with PUP and BST.

You have been told to change your job from SMN in WoE? Does your SMN really suck that much? Einherjar (Odin Chamber only) too?

Are you meleeing with your SMN? That might be why you are told to change jobs.

[Zaknafein]

The reason why abyssea should not be extended at this time is simply put... there is enough abyssea at this time. Abyssea has been great for the casual, and not so ls friendly players who prefer to do things in small groups. Anyone who falls into those two categories should still have plenty to do inside abyssea for the foreseeable future. The same goes for newer players.

Abyssea was a welcome change of pace for everyone. Personally I am a huge fan of the proc system. It was well thought out, and broadened the amount of jobs that were acceptable in events. It might not have included every job, but it was a step in the right direction. At the very least the proc system challenged players to at least use their heads a bit, and not just mindlessly zerg. Hopefully what ever is in store for 99 end game will encompass a requirement from all 20jobs, and retain those proc elements. Even expand them with Nyzul WS's, and merited spells/Bloodpacts. Personally I'd rather see it stay the way it is for abyssea vs the dynamis procs if the system is added to w/e new content comes out.

Going forward 99 content should be set up to have access for casuals, and small groups types along one path. Then another path requiring larger groups that test the players limits skill wise. If this balance is struck along with a revamp to PvP so people can get that out of their system it will be a sweet deal. There would be a variety of options to choose from, and with SE's revamp of older content (which I am a big fan of) players should have plenty to keep them busy. Which is all you can ask from a MMO.

Plz plz plz however take the training wheels off. Little to no atmas or any crutch at all please. Abyssea has been a great way for players to beef up their strength both job, and gearwise. It's time they stood on their own, and got back to relying on strategy, and skill. Versus atma's, abyssites, and brewskies.

[Orson]

Abyssea was a blast and is great casual content. I'm fine with adding new harder content but that doesn't mean they can't add more casual stuff that gives better rewards than pankration, ballista, chocobo racing, etc.

[StingRay104]

Abyssea was a blast and is great casual content. I'm fine with adding new harder content but that doesn't mean they can't add more casual stuff that gives better rewards than pankration, ballista, chocobo racing, etc.

Lol just wondering did anyone expect pankration to be an event people actually did?

[Orson]

Lol just wondering did anyone expect pankration to be an event people actually did?

It was extremely popular for a brief time but like everything with no rewards people got bored fast.

[Malamasala]

It was extremely popular for a brief time but like everything with no rewards people got bored fast.

It was rather that people figured out that there were like 2-3 builds that owned everything else, so people lost interest when they couldn't win without making a cookie cutter build.

I think it was either a Wivre or a Chigoe you were meant to train in a special way. Might have been something like an elemental also for a magic caster choice.

[Orson]

Ya it turned into a rock, paper, scissors concept but even then no one will keep doing an event for no tangible reward. After people got their beastmen hats they stopped caring. Apart from ZNM I guess.

edit: This is getting way off the heart of the issue though. My point is casual content that can be done solo and in small groups is awesome but it needs decent rewards just like hardcore content. Casual content caters to everyone whereas hardcore content is only available to the people with the proper jobs, number of friends, gear, etc. Completely ignoring either type of content is detrimental to the game but having both hurts no one. That's why adding more Abyssea wouldn't be necessarily a bad thing but overall everyone wants other things to be worked on mainly truly new areas to explore (Tavnazia!!!!!!! PLEASE!!!!!!!.)