Any chances of raising the availability of Tier IV and AM1 scrolls?

[Arcari]

Hello,

I'm making this topic to address what I feel is a problem for up-and-coming BLMs (RDMs and SCHs to an extent as well), which is getting your hands on the scrolls for Tier IV spells and AM1 spells. Most of the scrolls before this line of spells are cheap from the AH, can be purchased from NPCs, or might be common drops from enemies/BCNMs, while the spells after these two categories (tier V, -ja etc) can either be purchased from NPCs or are common drops in Abyssea.

However, tier IV and AM1 are a different story altogether. To put it lightly, most of these spells are extremely difficult to obtain compared to most of the other spells in the game. The enemies that are capable of dropping these scrolls will only drop them when the drop rate stars perfectly align, even for THFs and with max TH gear, or you have to beg people to do battlefields, mainly ISNMs, that no one wants to do anymore. Combine that with the fact that tier IV and AM1 are needed for targeting yellow weaknesses in Abyssea, and you have a very bad situation.

Here's an example I'm sure all the servers can relate to: Water IV. (http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Water_IV) Let's see...only drops from the Sapphire Quadav, which are not all that common in their respective zones. Oh, and a 2.2% droprate according to the wiki? The tonberry NMs aren't much better either. And once again, good luck getting people to do those ISNMs on the list these days. The result? 400k Water IV, at least over here on Bismarck.

Here's another example: Quake. (http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Quake) Dear Altana, Quake. Let's see...a pain in the you-know-what to camp Antica NM, 2 timed spawn Orc NMs in the deepest part of that dungeon, and Kirin. From the drop tables, Kirin is your best bet, but he still requires a competent group to defeat. The Antica is next in line, but he's a lottery spawn so he might take forever to spawn, and even then, it's only an estimated 10% droprate. Let's not even get into the Orc NMs on that list. And once again, your other options are BCNMs/ISNMs that no one does anymore. The result? A whopping 700-800k scroll on my server, and most likely the others as well.

I'll offer up a bit of personal testimony. Recently, 2 friends of mine leveled BLM because they wanted to be more useful to parties and the LS (they were SAM mains beforehand). Being the nice guy I am, I helped them burn up their levels and decided to help get spells that they couldn't get on their own. I already knew the tier IV and AM1 scrolls would be trouble, and my friends didn't want me spending so much money on them, so I decided to break out my THF and try farming them. So far, I've only been successful with the Fire line, and the Blizzard line, and that was with hours and hours of farming. I'm currently working on Aero IV, but it's not going well. In a farming session at Castle O, I usually walk away with a few Aero III scrolls, a few Aeroga IIs...MAYBE 1 Tornado if I really lucked out, and no Aero IV. And please don't get me started on Water IV again.

There are a couple of solutions I'd like to propose. The most obvious one is to allow NPCs to sell these scrolls at affordable prices for those levels (perhaps somewhere around 30-50k). Another solution I can think of is to dramatically increase the drop rates on these scrolls and/or make other enemies become capable of dropping them. One more solution I can think of is to make the scrolls drop in Abyssea, which I admit doesn't make a lot of sense, but hey it's an idea.

In conclusion, tier IV and AM1 scrolls (not all, but most of them) are vastly difficult to obtain compared to the tiers below them, and even the tier above them, and I hope that SE will look into easing the acquisition for these important spells. Any thoughts/criticism are welcome.

[SNK]

In conclusion, tier IV and AM1 scrolls (not all, but most of them) are vastly difficult to obtain compared to the tiers below them, and even the tier above them, and I hope that SE will look into easing the acquisition for these important spells. Any thoughts/criticism are welcome.

Sorry but I disagree with this. Teir IV Scrolls and AM scrolls are not that hard to obtain. They're farmed all the time and the only reason I can see anyone complaining is that they can't afford what people are asking for them. It's a good market I do on the side I admit and so I'm more then happy to get paid for the time I spend farming these scrolls.

[Leonlionheart]

Quake is definitely too hard to obtain.

[Francisco]

No need for this. The option to farm them yourself is there... and if you don't want to do that, you gotta pay someone to do it for you.

It's a source of profit for a lot of players.

[Raxiaz]

I don't care if it's a source of profit for a lot of players... SE has killed the sources of profit for players before, so why not do it now for magic scrolls? I don't see how I can buy a higher version of a spell for hundreds of thousands of gil cheaper than the lower tier spell. Doesn't make sense from a logical standpoint. Economically I understand why, but the progression of spells (and the consistency with which they were made available) ought to dictate that Water V be more expensive than Water IV.

And if farming these scrolls is the only source of profit any player has, I feel sorry for them. There are much better ways to make money in this game now than to spend hours farming those.

[Cream_Soda]

And if buying scrolls are your only means of obtaining them, I feel sorry for you.

See how that works both ways?

Go farm them.

[Sparthos]

Nuke one of the few avenues to make profit outside Abyssea? Yes!

Crater O.Ingots while we're at it pls.

Oh wai-

[Tagrineth]

If anything, R3 should become more available. They did it before.

[Malamasala]

I think they should sell all spirits at NPC. That way everyone who wants AM and IV spells can play SMN instead! I promise the spirits will cast them... eventually.

[Korpg]

Why stop at spells, lets make everything that has ever dropped from a mob/NM NPC purchasable.

Wild Onions are selling for 25k a stack here, lets get a NPC that would sell them for, I don't know, 25 gil each (since they drop from way too weak gobbies, lets keep the price to the level of mob here). You know how many angry farmers and growers you will have?

Also, lets make the cockatrice meat sell for, I don't know, 100 gil each (since the level of cockatrices aren't that much higher). You still will create a lot of angry farmers out there.

Then, you will have a lot of people flooding the markets with kabobs, all of which are selling at just above 1% profit....which will create a lot of angry cookers out there who spent years making/selling kabobs and other stuff to get an actual profit for the time it was used to craft to 100 or so.

Lets not forget sushi, make Black Sole what, 200 gil each? Make every fisher out there angry too.

Point being, if you make farmable scrolls into NPC purchasable scrolls, you will cut the source of income for a lot of farmers out there, and that will make them very angry and have to spam/farm something else, which will increase supply on the next big thing and affect the market that way.

[Tsuneo]

I don't necessarily think they should be easier to get , but I sympathize with people who lack the spells. I've been spell farming recently, and I'd hate to have compete with people who are there for gil. The best option probably is to make some gil and buy the scrolls rather than spend an eternity having claim wars with random thieves.

[Covenant]

I do agree that drop rates need to be adjusted for a more favorable return. However, most of the mobs that drop the rare scroll drop not so rare scrolls that sell for 30-90k. Sothe time to farm one IV or AM can almost equal 3-8 of those types. Not to mention the gold coins if players go /THF.

By the way I'm all for a NPC cap spell cost. 100k seems more than reasonable for a lvl 50 spell.

[Francisco]

Aside from it being a profit source for other players, also keep in mind thousand of other players obtained these spells with LESS sources than there currently are.

I don't care if people abyssea burn their jobs to 90, but knock off the whole "wah, wah... scrolls/gear is hard to get" crap... do some quests and BCNMs for a change.

[Darkwizardzin]

I don't care if it's a source of profit for a lot of players... SE has killed the sources of profit for players before, so why not do it now for magic scrolls? I don't see how I can buy a higher version of a spell for hundreds of thousands of gil cheaper than the lower tier spell. Doesn't make sense from a logical standpoint. Economically I understand why, but the progression of spells (and the consistency with which they were made available) ought to dictate that Water V be more expensive than Water IV.

And if farming these scrolls is the only source of profit any player has, I feel sorry for them. There are much better ways to make money in this game now than to spend hours farming those.


It's that kind of thinking (the statement in bold) that hurts the game.... you have to think of it on a larger scale then just yourself. The reason why SE has in the past... as you put it: "killed the sources of profit for players" is more often then not because they had to in order to update the game. Doing what your saying will force people to stop farming these spells thus they will farm other things... flooding those markets. Then values of items would drop across the board... no one wants that.

In closing, what the OP is asking for is unneeded and overall hurtful to the game (even if it's only slightly) thus should not be implmented. If people want those spells they can just gather the gil to buy them just like everyone else from the ah..that's why it's there.

[Tagrineth]

Why stop at spells, lets make everything that has ever dropped from a mob/NM NPC purchasable.

Wild Onions are selling for 25k a stack here, lets get a NPC that would sell them for, I don't know, 25 gil each (since they drop from way too weak gobbies, lets keep the price to the level of mob here). You know how many angry farmers and growers you will have?

Also, lets make the cockatrice meat sell for, I don't know, 100 gil each (since the level of cockatrices aren't that much higher). You still will create a lot of angry farmers out there.

Then, you will have a lot of people flooding the markets with kabobs, all of which are selling at just above 1% profit....which will create a lot of angry cookers out there who spent years making/selling kabobs and other stuff to get an actual profit for the time it was used to craft to 100 or so.

Lets not forget sushi, make Black Sole what, 200 gil each? Make every fisher out there angry too.

Point being, if you make farmable scrolls into NPC purchasable scrolls, you will cut the source of income for a lot of farmers out there, and that will make them very angry and have to spam/farm something else, which will increase supply on the next big thing and affect the market that way.

I specifically mentioned R3 because they've made R3 more available for this exact reason once before.

[Korpg]

I specifically mentioned R3 because they've made R3 more available for this exact reason once before.

It is not hard to find a SMN to solo E-vase-ive Action KSNM30.

I went 1/4 on the scroll, ended up getting 1mil gil while "farming" that scroll.

[Horadrim]

No need for this. The option to farm them yourself is there... and if you don't want to do that, you gotta pay someone to do it for you.

It's a source of profit for a lot of players.

Eh, I'm split on this.

If this were 2009 or earlier I'd say it was stupid -- but you can express to 90 so quickly that not having ancient magic or (certain) Tier IV spells isn't a real issue. I went from 31 BLM to 90 in two days, and since I had SCH75 a few months after the job was released I had all of my spells already.

I will say that I'd like Quake to drop from more than just NMs, but they aren't anything crazy and can be solo'd easily at 90 so I can't complain too much. A slight increase in drop rate wouldn't hurt the profit too much considering most people are too lazy to head out there -- Dropping the prices down to 100-300k because it drops more often wouldn't hurt people's income much. It would actually probably increase it.

In this day and age, soloing spells isn't too hard, you just can't be lazy.

[Raxiaz]

Spending more time getting a few spells than it did leveling the job is ridiculous if you're not BLU.

[Panthera]

I don't see how rarity of spells enhances gameplay and enjoyment of FFXI. Corsair gets it pretty simple; go to npc, buy dice, end of story. Dancer gets it's abilities, well...

Scrolls should be readily available and affordable, particularly older ones. The rareness of certain WHM spells in days passed made for worse gameplay, not better. Give the blms a break!--and while you're at it, pup attachements could come from profoundly less obscure sources as well, but of course, all this entails SE listening to it's player base; talk about a rare drop indeed.

[Covenant]

@KORPG, I like how you compare wild onions a more than common drop item, with ultra(whether NM and BCNM) rare spell like Quake or AeroIV. If a NPC were to sell a scroll for 100k players could still farm the rare scroll or sell enough regular scrolls to buy one. There also nothing stopping players from making 99,999 Gil off these scroll.
Playrs point to how easy it is to make Gil...but one of the easy ways of making Gil is charging a ridculous price for them in AH. Even when players try to drop the AH price forcing prices to go down Gil farmers just buy the "cheap" scroll and sell both at the exhorbinant price of 800k. Its called "Market Manipulation" or insider trading. Especially if this same groups are the only ones capitalizing camps and BCNM's.
If anything, this is the problem with Captialism in real life as well. Why simply get rich, when I can get richer? Where and when is enough, enough? I used this example under the "utsmemi NI" discussion...if a merchant was the only one selling milk and he was charging $1,000 dollars a gallon how long before people tore him apart? 100k is more than reasonable for any spells and most items also.

[Tagrineth]

It is not hard to find a SMN to solo E-vase-ive Action KSNM30.

I went 1/4 on the scroll, ended up getting 1mil gil while "farming" that scroll.

I have 90 SMN myself. I have no doubt I could solo Evasive Action. The problem is, even if I get the drop... I dunno if I'd even want to use it. 1mil for a "trophy spell"? I'd rather put that toward a Grim Cuirass or something to that effect. :\

[Korpg]

@KORPG, I like how you compare wild onions a more than common drop item, with ultra(whether NM and BCNM) rare spell like Quake or AeroIV. If a NPC were to sell a scroll for 100k players could still farm the rare scroll or sell enough regular scrolls to buy one. There also nothing stopping players from making 99,999 Gil off these scroll.

You are correct, but knowing SE, they will set the price to about 20k or so, since spells at that level usually go for that much anyway. I used Wild Onions as an example because it is an item that is not purchasable from any NPC, and you either have to grow them, or farm them from gobbies, to sell them. I made it a point in showing that if you put all scrolls into NPC, that is going to make a lot of scroll farmers angry because they are now limited on how much to sell stuff, and some stuff might not be worth the effort it takes to farm the spells.


Playrs point to how easy it is to make Gil...but one of the easy ways of making Gil is charging a ridculous price for them in AH. Even when players try to drop the AH price forcing prices to go down Gil farmers just buy the "cheap" scroll and sell both at the exhorbinant price of 800k. Its called "Market Manipulation" or insider trading. Especially if this same groups are the only ones capitalizing camps and BCNM's.

Wait, I don't understand, if people buy the scrolls at a low price, and try to sell them at a higher price, what will keep others from buying the spells at the lower price? Unless somebody actually went and bought all scrolls of stone 1 for 10k, and charge you 100k for the scroll, what is keeping you from buying the scroll at 10k the next time somebody sells a scroll of stone 1? RMT isn't active now, so you can't blame this method as actual practice now.

Ever hear of supply and demand?


If anything, this is the problem with Captialism in real life as well. Why simply get rich, when I can get richer? Where and when is enough, enough? I used this example under the "utsmemi NI" discussion...if a merchant was the only one selling milk and he was charging $1,000 dollars a gallon how long before people tore him apart? 100k is more than reasonable for any spells and most items also.

...guess not. You are blinded by your own prejudices of a known method of life that you automatically blame everything on that one thing without understanding the nature of the system. People wouldn't sell milk for $1,000 a gallon before somebody sells a gallon of milk at $999 a gallon. Then the price will continue to go down as the supply of milk increases, until you hit (in perfect capitalism, which will never happen because of prejudices) a point where the cost of making the milk (raising the cows, labor, equipment, packaging, storage, etc) is equal to the price of milk.

You honestly think that everyone is making billions of dollars off of everyone else? Do you think that the price of gas is so high because of the gas stations are out to "milk" you for all you are worth, and then some? Or that the gas producing companies (you know, the ones that turn the crude oil into gasoline) are charging extraordinary prices because they are out to squeeze every dollar of cash out of you? I'm afraid it goes further than that. If you really want to blame anyone, blame OPEC. But that is besides the point.

The point being, stop being so narrow-minded that you can't look beyond the haze in front of you in life. People sell scrolls that high because of the time investment and demand of the scrolls, nothing more.

[Korpg]

I have 90 SMN myself. I have no doubt I could solo Evasive Action. The problem is, even if I get the drop... I dunno if I'd even want to use it. 1mil for a "trophy spell"? I'd rather put that toward a Grim Cuirass or something to that effect. :\

1 million gil on junk (and other sellables) + that spell. So basically, you can get about 2 million gil on 4 runs solo. Not bad, if you ask me. And minimal time investment too.

[Covenant]

On One hand you say the scroll is expensive because it's so hard to get, while on the other hand you say it's as easy as 3-4 BCNM's. Not taking into account whether or not your group goes with the "your orb your drop" or the "let's spilt everything 3 ways" even though it's a fair chance these are pickedup players that you may never have seen before and you expect them or yourself to be trust to sell everything and give each other fair shares.
I, of course knew I was giving an extreme example with the milk thing. I was just saying these scrolls prices have such a huge range 100k~800k that something is fishy. Normal economics aren't at play, if it were players would have seen a slow and steady climb in price not 100k or more price jumps.
I have also done these BCNM runs and spell farming runs and haven't come across a single scroll sometimes days at a time. Or in the case of BCNM, the drop went to someone else.

I tend to look at the market values in a general way. Namely, level to spell or a progression where higher spells become harder to "get" and cost more if available in NPC shops. Most of these "rare" scroll are around the 37-40 mark and if anything drain Gil from other items like ninjistu items and or other choices.

[Eeek]

Arcari, I do understand your frustration, but to an extent, it's always been this way for BLM. It's never been an inexpensive job to gear up, and part of gearing up BLM is dealing with the sticker shock on some spells. Every BLM, including myself, has likely spent millions on their BLM spells over the course of their BLM careers.

Hell, I spent something like 750k buying the level 86-90 nukes from an NPC right after I dinged BLM90. I wanted them right away for a LS event or something of that nature (I forgot exactly why).

[Solonuke]

I'm all in for making these easier to obtain or make them purchasable from NPC for more than tier 3 spells but lower than tier 5 spells. I really didn't enjoy farming tier 4 spells as Blizzard IV drops from ISNMs which I don't have any IS to do and it seems overall very low drop rate from normal mobs as me and a friend of mine spent 3-4 hours farming them with no drop with capped TH. I just don't think that those spells should be a road block for a starting BLM and you could probably end up spending at least 3 million gil at the current prices on only spells. For 3 million gil I could get pretty awesome gear on any job that don't have to use that money on spells. Raise III is like 1 million gil on my server and it doesn't do anything but giving a tad more hp and less exp loss than Raise II, yet it's incredibly easy to get if you have an evasion job. What if you had to do a KSNM that had NMs that resisted physical damage to learn "Blood Rage" on Warrior? Or a level 30 BCNM for "Flee" for your thief? Or a level 20 BCNM for "Dual Wield" on Dancer? Ninja is pretty useless without Utsusemi, so let's demand 1 million gil for each Utsusemi scroll and the Ni version of it is incredibly tedious to get and it just never seems to drop when I do it.

But then again BLM is probably the most valuable job on seal based NMs.

[Korpg]

On One hand you say the scroll is expensive because it's so hard to get, while on the other hand you say it's as easy as 3-4 BCNM's. Not taking into account whether or not your group goes with the "your orb your drop" or the "let's spilt everything 3 ways" even though it's a fair chance these are pickedup players that you may never have seen before and you expect them or yourself to be trust to sell everything and give each other fair shares.

I'm correct in both counts. The scrolls are expensive because they are rare drops (and not from the little "rare" symbol on the scroll. The scrolls are easy to get because all it requires from you is to either kill a weak mob, or fight a battlefield of monsters for a chance for it to drop. Who's really hurting on BSs now anyway?



I, of course knew I was giving an extreme example with the milk thing. I was just saying these scrolls prices have such a huge range 100k~800k that something is fishy. Normal economics aren't at play, if it were players would have seen a slow and steady climb in price not 100k or more price jumps.

Normal economics are in play, you just don't know normal economics at all. Demand for these scrolls are high, but the number of scrolls are low, so of course the price is high. When nobody wants those scrolls (see: Blizzard V) the price of those scrolls will plummet down to what you can get from selling the scroll to a NPC. You just think that economics are not in play because of your bias against Capitalism.


I have also done these BCNM runs and spell farming runs and haven't come across a single scroll sometimes days at a time. Or in the case of BCNM, the drop went to someone else.

Sorry about your bad luck. If you really want the scrolls for yourself (and not to sell) then I would suggest you farming the gil. I hear that cruor is a great way of getting gil.


I tend to look at the market values in a general way. Namely, level to spell or a progression where higher spells become harder to "get" and cost more if available in NPC shops. Most of these "rare" scroll are around the 37-40 mark and if anything drain Gil from other items like ninjistu items and or other choices.

Again, proof positive that you don't know how economics work. Just because something is of a higher level doesn't mean that they should be "rare" in that aspect. Level 37-60 scrolls are hard to get because you have to farm/buy from AH on almost all of them (Sleepga II, you got to quest it).

Also, lumping consumable items with your scrolls....yeah, you still don't know economics. You are comparing apples to kumquats.

[Korpg]

I'm all in for making these easier to obtain or make them purchasable from NPC for more than tier 3 spells but lower than tier 5 spells. I really didn't enjoy farming tier 4 spells as Blizzard IV drops from ISNMs which I don't have any IS to do and it seems overall very low drop rate from normal mobs as me and a friend of mine spent 3-4 hours farming them with no drop with capped TH.

You think it was easier for people who leveled BLM much earlier than you? I spent at least 10 million gil on scrolls for my BLM, and I leveled it after ToAU was released, so not only was it harder for me to farm, but harder for me to level too.


I just don't think that those spells should be a road block for a starting BLM and you could probably end up spending at least 3 million gil at the current prices on only spells. For 3 million gil I could get pretty awesome gear on any job that don't have to use that money on spells.

3 million? You got it easy. If you don't want to farm the scrolls, farm the gil.


Raise III is like 1 million gil on my server and it doesn't do anything but giving a tad more hp and less exp loss than Raise II, yet it's incredibly easy to get if you have an evasion job.

E-vase-ive Action KSNM. Find a SMN friend, one who can solo stuff, and sic them at it. By the time you get your scroll (on average) you will have 1 million of sellable stuff each. Think of all the BLM scrolls you can buy. And it only costs you 120 KS (on average).


What if you had to do a KSNM that had NMs that resisted physical damage to learn "Blood Rage" on Warrior? Or a level 30 BCNM for "Flee" for your thief? Or a level 20 BCNM for "Dual Wield" on Dancer?

2 of them are job abilities. Not spells. On both of those, they are for jobs that enhance the job without using anything. Well, you stop swinging for .5 seconds, I guess you can consider that as a cost. The last one is a job trait. I think you are confusing the three with BLU spells. Now there is a job you will like! No gil spent on getting the spells!


Ninja is pretty useless without Utsusemi, so let's demand 1 million gil for each Utsusemi scroll and the Ni version of it is incredibly tedious to get and it just never seems to drop when I do it.

Utsusemi: Ichi is a quested scroll. Very easy quest, you just have to put in a little effort to get it (fame 6 or so). But that last part, kindof makes me /facepalm. You know why? Because it almost sounds like you are demanding that stuff drops for you all the time.


But then again BLM is probably the most valuable job on seal based NMs.

Hence the prices for scrolls. More people leveling BLM, less scrolls on AH, higher the price. Simple economics people!

[Malamasala]

You are comparing apples to kumquats.

You can compare pretty much whatever you want though. It is only silly people who set up rules on what you can compare. "Rule 1: Can't compare chocolate to white chocolate.", "Rule 2: Can't compare women and men", "Rule 3: Can't compare brown and white eggs".

[Korpg]

Now you are just nitpicing my argument.

[Tagrineth]

E-vase-ive Action KSNM. Find a SMN friend, one who can solo stuff, and sic them at it. By the time you get your scroll (on average) you will have 1 million of sellable stuff each. Think of all the BLM scrolls you can buy. And it only costs you 120 KS (on average).

How are you getting 1million worth of sellable junk from Evasive Action? very very few of the drops even break 10k in value, unless I'm missing something majour.

[Korpg]

Oh wow, I thought Pole Strap would still be 500k like it was about a couple of months ago.

Oh well, you can still get 300k by the time the RIII scroll drops.

[Tagrineth]

Oh wow, I thought Pole Strap would still be 500k like it was about a couple of months ago.

Oh well, you can still get 300k by the time the RIII scroll drops.

Wait what? O_o; When was Pole Grip ever that valuable... jeez. That's insane lol. Even now, it's funny because I remember getting mine when they were introduced for like 5k.

[Korpg]

I was surprised too, it was back when stacking DA was popular.

[Orson]

Teleport scrolls really need to be added in some shape or form other than quests. At least make the quests repeatable. The prices on them are highway robbery.

[Seriha]

Maybe I'm weird, but I feel like all spells should be dropped by some open world mob somewhere, and not at a depressingly heart aching rate where you could go a 5+ hour farming session and not see it. Seems like most everyone here against the notion of increased availability are older players who've more than likely long since had their spells prior to the Abyssea rush, and while perhaps citing high gil vales on some scrolls, neglect the mention of timing in which "8 million gil" then could be like 16 million now when compared to old profit angles crashing, markets drying up, and so on.

Off the top of my head, aside from AMs, you also have things like Raise III, Army's Paeon V, some spirits, arguably COR rolls if the NPC goes incognito, select PUP attachments, and then some. Maybe I just grew up on a vastly different server than some, but gearing BLM and such could, at times, be just as expensive as a melee, if not more, and you don't see WARs needing to chase down a scroll of Retaliation just to learn that JA. In essence, depriving jobs of core features strikes me as a bit of a no-no. Let how "good" one is be defined through their play, not so much how long they sat in a dungeon plinking a wimpy mob over and over and over dancing with the random number generator.

[Eeek]

I didn't start playing until after the ToAU release. I started BLM well after the post-STF deflation and when BLMs were not welcome in parties. I farmed and spammed BCNMs/KSNMs with friend to buy my HQ staves (600k - 800k each at the time). I farmed or bought all of my spells and even paid well over 200k for spells I've cast a handful of times. I, along with many, many other BLMs, have invested millions upon millions of gil into the job over the years. Nothing about BLM was ever inexpensive.

People who jumped on the BLM bandwagon for Abyssea need to face the reality that the rest of us have known and dealt with for years: BLM is not cheap when done right. Gil is available to those willing to make it. The scrolls are available to those willing to leave Port Jeuno and get them.

The only problem is the laziness of those unwilling to put forth any actual effort.

[Solonuke]

I put in 1.5 million gil into haubergeon, spending over a month for one piece of armor, then spent another 2 months to buy balmung for 2.6 million gil and another million gil for sniper rings. Now all of that is obselete at level 90 and you could buy everything for less than 100k. In this regard it should only make sense that mage spells would also become cheaper, but instead are still expensive to this day. It's not difficult to farm any of these spells either if it's for gil or the spell itself, it's however a lot of work, work I want to spend on something else. I already spent 4 hours farming a single tier 4 scroll with a friend of mine with capped TH and the mob would only drop tier 3 and Freeze during the entire period, is this low drop rate really necessary? Will I become better at the game if I repeat the same mob over and over again for one spell? I know the yagudos are very tight on the Aero IV spell. At this stage of the game, farming scrolls for hours do feel like doing those fetch quests from those add ons before Abyssea.

[Eeek]

The scrolls are expensive because they're still useful and there's demand for them.

And if spending a few hours farming a scroll is what it takes to get the scroll, then yes, it's worth it. Especially for Blizzard IV as it's still a commonly used nuke. If farming Blizzard IV is whine-worthy, try making magian staves. I only have three of them (Surya's +2, Varuna's +2, Indra's +2), but each one was its own special brand of annoying grind. They were well worth the effort, though.

And 'annoying grind' isn't just limited to FFXI - it's a fact of life, to one degree or another, in every MMO (not to mention some offline RPGs). MMOs would die off way too quickly without grinds here and there to keep the playerbase occupied and spending money on the game.