Relic weapons for all jobs.

[Seha]

Same old topic. I'll be concise.
Blue mage, puppetmaster, corsair, dancer and scholar don't have access to a relic. They should.
Sch and Dnc got their mythic added even if they appeared at a later time. So it could very well be the same for relics.
Mythics are next to impossible to do, empyrean are an option, but shouldn't be the only option. They don't have to be necessarily new relics, they could just be added to 'calibur, Spharai, Anni, Mandau, and whatever the staff is(sorry don't remember).

It's just about equanimity. Three options for all.

If this is not even considered by the dev team, I would like at least a clear explanation of the reason, cause it wouldn't break the game, it'd just give these 5 jobs the same options as the other 15.

Hoping to get an answer from the mediators of the forum.

Thanks.

[Coldbrand]

I'm down for this mostly because I want the Ultima Weapons to be forged by combining all three legendary weapon groups. (And to exist for that matter.)

Edit: Would also love to use my Excalibur on BLU once it's done. Or hey, all new weapons is cool too. They'd only have to do a small handful to make this game feel much more complete in that regard.

[Alhanelem]

The new jobs don't need the relic weapons. Equanmity is irrelevant.

The relic sword is not a scimitar and BLUs only use Scimitars.

I'm pretty sure DNC doesn't use the type of dagger the relic dagger is.

The relic HTH are cesti and PUP do not use cesti, with only a couple special exceptions. SCH could really not care less if it has access to the relic weapon or not.

[Cream_Soda]

The relic sword is not a scimitar and BLUs only use Scimitars.
Incorrect


I'm pretty sure DNC doesn't use the type of dagger the relic dagger is.
They also don't use any kind of dagger that the mythic is, either, nor the emp, your point?


The relic HTH are cesti and PUP do not use cesti, with only a couple special exceptions.
and why couldn't there be another exception?


SCH could really not care less if it has access to the relic weapon or not.
You speak for all SCHs now?

[Seha]

The new jobs don't need the relic weapons. Equanmity is irrelevant.They do, it's a tool to improve the jobs on the same level as the others on a matter of options. It's relevant to the game balance they love so much. An "ultimate weapon" less than the others is unbalanced. :>


The relic sword is not a scimitar and BLUs only use Scimitars.Right, the sinuous Almace is such a wonderful scimitar don't you think?

Tiger said it all, come back with an actual argument.

[StingRay104]

PUP's can use cesti, Furor Cesti are my current weapon on PUP.

[Atomic_Skull]

We don't need to give DNC any more of THFs stuff.

[Alhanelem]

They do, it's a tool to improve the jobs on the same level as the others on a matter of options. So you're saying every job added since ToAU must have a relic weapon because it cannot compete without one?

That couldn't be more incorrect.


PUP's can use cesti, Furor Cesti are my current weapon on PUP. It was knuckles, actually. my mistake. Regardless, empyrean HTH > relic HTH. We don't need relic.


You speak for all SCHs now? Not all, but probably nearly all. There's only that thread with thousands of posts talking about how crappy the relic staff is. I think that's enough proof that a SCH wouldn't be interested in that staff. Why are you suddenly arguing for the relic staff when you spent most of a massive thread about them speaking against them?

[Seha]

So you're saying every job added since ToAU must have a relic weapon because it cannot compete without one?

That couldn't be more incorrect.Nope, didn't say that. But every job should have the same amount of options.


empyrean HTH > relic HTHIf that was a good argument then SE could just delete a good portion of the game as well.

[Alhanelem]

Nope, didn't say that. But every job should have the same amount of options.When it wouldn't be much of an option, it doesn't need to be an option.


If that was a good argument then SE could just delete a good portion of the game as well. That's one of the most illogical conclusions I've ever heard.

Pray tell, what makes relic HTH better than empyrean HTH?

The wepaon skill sure doesn't. The relic "aftermath" sure doesn't.

[Cream_Soda]

Oh hey, Emp > this emp > that. We don't need any other weapons! because it's stronger. In some cases, take mythic put it over emp and say the same thing!

[Alhanelem]

Why would you get the relic if the other options are better?

All this thread is really about is people who own these weapons for other jobs wanting a quick path to power on another job.

[Seha]

Why would you get the relic if the other options are better?

All this thread is really about is people who own these weapons for other jobs wanting a quick path to power on another job.
Nope, I don't have any relic at all.
And again, if your argument is H2H relic sucks, then why don't you make a thread asking SE to delete H2H relic since it's not needed anymore? Gimme a break.

[Zyeriis]

Exequy Gun (http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Exequy_Gun)
Considering they made the crap version (the retarded "do 13 weapon skills, use this relic ws once" abyssea weapons) of Annihilator (Relic Gun) usable by COR, I don't see why they couldn't add COR to Annihilator.

@alhanelem, wtf is your problem with this? "Oh no! this would take 3 seconds to add a job to the weapon, we need those 3 seconds for other stuff that I want!" All of your so-called "points" on the matter are completely irrelevant. So what if the emp weapon that the job already has access to is better?

Surely you have better ways/places to spend your time trolling?

[Cream_Soda]

Why would you get the relic if the other options are better?


You could say that about any weapon in the game, no?

[Alhanelem]

Nope, I don't have any relic at all.
And again, if your argument is H2H relic sucks, then why don't you make a thread asking SE to delete H2H relic since it's not needed anymore? Gimme a break.
You give me a break- stop with the ridiculous slippery slope arguments.


You could say that about any weapon in the game, no? Which of the ToAU/wotg jobs is so sorely lacking in other good weapon options that they absolutely need relic weapon access?


Surely you have better ways/places to spend your time trolling? I'm not trolling- I am not posting here to provoke responses. I'm posting here because I have an opinion and I'm giving it.

[Cream_Soda]

Which of the ToAU jobs is so sorely lacking in other good weapon options that they absolutely need relic weapon access?
I didn't say anything of the sort, but by your logic, only the strongest option is needed.

[Alhanelem]

I didn't say anything of the sort, but by your logic, only the strongest option is needed.I'm not saying that. What I'm saying is I don't feel this change is needed, nor does it especially benefit any of the jobs involved.

Why didn't they add the new jobs to the Kclub when it was All Jobs before they came out?

Why didn't they add _____ to _____ when ____ came out?

I could list a ton of items that only certain jobs have access to that I'd like other jobs to have. It doesn't mean they should or they will.

[Cream_Soda]

Why didn't they add the new jobs to the Kclub when it was All Jobs before they came out?

Why didn't they add _____ to _____ when ____ came out?

And there are plenty of items that jobs were added to. What's your point?

[Alhanelem]

And there are plenty of items that jobs were added to. What's your point?
My point? there were plenty of items that jobs were not added to. SE obviously made a concious deciison whether to include or not include a job on an item. It's not like it was random or something.

[Cream_Soda]

There's plenty of things they've done consciously, but I've seen you make threads requesting changes. Are you the only one entitled to the privilege?

Edit: If not made, participated in favor of what the OP was requesting to be changed.

[Alhanelem]

Are you the only one entitled to the privilege?Of course not. But I'm just as entitled to agree or disagree with such requests as you and anyone else are.

[Cream_Soda]

But what if your complaint was about a conscious decision and not something random?!

[Coldbrand]

Incorrect


They also don't use any kind of dagger that the mythic is, either, nor the emp, your point?


and why couldn't there be another exception?


You speak for all SCHs now?

He always thinks he speaks for everyone and that he's a moderator. Just add him to your ignore list.

[Alhanelem]

He always thinks he speaks for everyone and that he's a moderator. Just add him to your ignore list.
I do not think I speak for everyone and I don't think I'm a moderator (here). You can stop slandering me now.

He is not going to add me to his ignore list either, because he finds me entertaining (much to my frustration)

[Bumbeen]

While I find tahn annoying, I find all these request/suggestion threads even more annoying.

[Alhanelem]

While I find tahn annoying, I find all these request/suggestion threads even more annoying.Well, being the official forum, that's what people come here to do. My only issue is with the attention grabbing manner in which such topics are posted. Sometimes it seems like everyone thinks their suggestion deserves SE's attention more than anyone else's.

[Seha]

My only issue is with the attention grabbing manner in which such topics are posted. Sometimes it seems like everyone thinks their suggestion deserves SE's attention more than anyone else's. Tell me where in my concise post you saw that. And if you're talking about other threads, then go post it there.


While I find tahn annoying, I find all these request/suggestion threads even more annoying. As if it was a hard addition to the game that would cause them to spend months working on it.

[Bumbeen]

As if it was a hard addition to the game that would cause them to spend months working on it.

But what is a reason for them to change it? Clearly SE had a reason to leave it how it is, so your reason for all jobs having relics has to be better than SE's reason for all jobs to not have relics. I find it unlikely that you can come up with a reason that fulfills that requirement.

[Seha]

In fact I asked for a reason. If they don't have one, then my point stands. If they have one, be my guest and tell me.

[Bumbeen]

Couldn't tell ya. I'm not big into FFXI lore etc, it probably has something to do with that though. Sorry I didn't commit the op to memory, if you asked why then carry on.

[Greatguardian]

Mandau is a pretty decent deal better than Twashtar on Dancer, if I'm not mistaken (as it's extremely close on THF, and THF can still SA Rudra's while DNC can't). It's not "pointless". From a lore/work standpoint, it makes about as much sense as the addition of ToAU jobs to Sky gear did. It happened, it just took a long time and a lot of community pressure to do it.

Frankly, the Devs are significantly more concerned with designing and implementing new content than revising a bunch of old stuff, especially things they don't really see as broken. Are they actively preventing ToAU/WotG jobs from being on Relics? Doubtful. It's much more likely they've just never really thought it was an issue.

That said, do all of the relics really make that much sense on new jobs? Many of them were designed around the 1 job that could equip said weapon. Spharai, for example, has Enhances Counter IV on it while Puppetmaster doesn't have any sort of Counter trait at all. While it would probably be simple enough in theory to fix, I wouldn't be surprised if the spaghetti code for Spharai never took non-Mnks into account and temporarily broke Puppetmaster's Counter rate for a time (not that they'd complain).

Does this affect me? Not really. Do I care either way? Nah. Is it a horribly stupid idea with absolutely no basis that needs to be shot down on sight like a lot of others that pop up here? Honestly, I really don't think so. It's a fairly simple change, and question, that isn't really hurting anyone. Go figure.

[Alhanelem]

I'm not a troll, so I love the abuse of the tag feature in this thread. Someone doesn't understand what trolling is.


Couldn't tell ya. I'm not big into FFXI lore etc, it probably has something to do with that though. Sorry I didn't commit the op to memory, if you asked why then carry on. The lore reason not to make this change would be that the new jobs have no role in the Dynamis storyline. But to be fair, this can be countered by the fact they added gear for these jobs to dynamis- but If I'm not mistaken, SE originally planned to add this gear to some ToAU event, but decided to put it in dynamis because they didn't want to make the new event only applicable to the three new jobs.

[Greatguardian]

The only reason Scholar and Dancer are not in the Dynamis storyline is simply the fact that they were not conceived and/or confirmed as part of the game at the time. As they fought in the Crystal War with everyone else, there really is no lore reason that they aren't a part of Dynamis.

Relic armor itself is essentially taking the ancient combat armor off of those corrupted soldiers, so the fact that WotG/ToAU armor drops in Dynamis at all is Ret-Con enough to show that all 20 jobs did participate in the Crystal War and got locked in the Dynamis realms.

[Seha]

What GG said, and also SCH and DNC didn't have anything to do with Balrahn either, yet they were added.

[Darkpearl]

I always wanted say that. Make relic weapon or old equip (like sky equip and so) equip-able by some jobs like BLU, DNC, COR and so on. Would be fun equip Hecatomb set on DNC (I mean... even BRD can equip it...), maybe useless at 90, but lets say you want level DNC and you have Hecatomb pieces, they could help you maybe when you reach 75, until you find better. Same goes for some funny weapons, lets say, Mercurial Kris? I don't think is hard to add COR or SCH in the list of relic and enable them. Probably they just have to add a line string in the code? I don't know. But would be fun see DNC with Mandau XDD

[Yinnyth]

Well, being the official forum, that's what people come here to do. My only issue is with the attention grabbing manner in which such topics are posted. Sometimes it seems like everyone thinks their suggestion deserves SE's attention more than anyone else's.

That's why they hired community reps to read the forums for them. SE wants ideas from the players, community reps sift through the crap to find reasonable suggestions and/or popular ideas which they then take back to the devs and see how feasible it is to implement. If your argument against this post is that it's trying too hard to get noticed, that would be as stupid as saying "I don't want to vote for ____ and you shouldn't vote for them either because he/she is trying too hard to get everyone's attention." That's what politicians do, they try to get noticed. Hate them for something else.

So why would giving relics to all jobs be a bad idea aside from the fact that the OP is obviously trying to garner illegal amounts of attention? I don't think it would upset the balance of the game, and apparantly neither do you. I don't think it would cost the dev team very much time at all to edit each of those jobs onto one weapon each. Relic weapons used to be THE ENDGAME. The last thing you would get to beat FFXI. I think it's unfair that those jobs are excluded from these once-prestigious items.

[Moink]

I am pretty sure mythics were not introduced until after WotG came out. If I remember correctly, it was one of the near last installments to ToAU content.

I could care less of whether or not the five more recent jobs get added onto relic, but it does make me wonder why add them to the joke weapons with the relic WSs...

As far as story goes... DNC and SCH were apart of the crystal war... Dynamis is suppose to represent the "What if that war never ended and the beastmen did have control over the cities?" So in theory it would still make sense to add them to weapons more than it would PUP, BLU or COR considering theyre jobs from a continent that took no part in that war.

If SE decides to do it great, if not... oh well.

[Minsc]

Well, being the official forum, that's what people come here to do. My only issue is with the attention grabbing manner in which such topics are posted. Sometimes it seems like everyone thinks their suggestion deserves SE's attention more than anyone else's.

I don't agree with you, so you must be attention grabbing!

This kind of thought process has always amused me.

[Suirieko]

Personally, I'm in huge favour of this. I Really don't see a reason why DNC can't be using Mandau.


It was knuckles, actually. my mistake. Regardless, empyrean HTH > relic HTH. We don't need relic.

It shouldn't really matter. IF anything, Relics should've been stronger than Empyrean in the first place. SE said somewhere that they are going to balance it. Also, it should be all about choice.


That's one of the most illogical conclusions I've ever heard.

Pray tell, what makes relic HTH better than empyrean HTH?

The wepaon skill sure doesn't. The relic "aftermath" sure doesn't.

The counter. The Relic H2H have insane amount of counter, especially in it's current final form. I've watched a MNK with spharai countering almost nonstop with that on. It was a pretty amazing sight, especially against 20 mobs.


Which of the ToAU/wotg jobs is so sorely lacking in other good weapon options that they absolutely need relic weapon access?

At the time, and for the longest time, the mythic is so difficult to get that it's almost not even worth getting, unless you're working on Yagrush, Nirvana, Burtgang, and Ryunohige, which I believe are the more popular mythic weapons in the game. The mage mythic weapons do hold advantage over Relics (And even Empyreans!) because they are actually USEFUL for the mages.


My point? there were plenty of items that jobs were not added to. SE obviously made a concious deciison whether to include or not include a job on an item. It's not like it was random or something.

And the point is? This is what the forums are for. To voice our request to change that, or at least request an explanation of why they changed it. For the longest time, until the relics AF came out, DNC barely had any useful gears to begin with, which was pretty silly to begin with. DNC couldn't requip homam, they couldn't requip hecatomb, they couldn't equip salvage gears. They had only very few choices to equip, Same with SCH. I understand right now it's a pretty moot argument, but back then, it was one of the issues that DNC had to deal with, other than the fact that most people thought DNC was a useless job.

As for the "It doesn't fit the lore" I call bollocks. While I understand the argument with BLU, PUP, and COR taking no part in the Crystal war, since those jobs originated in the Aht Urghan empire. DNC and SCH were heavily involved in the crystal war, and therefore, makes sense to be in Dynamis. In fact, one of the famous well known NPC, Schultz, whom is a Scholar, was heavily involved in Crystal War, which further proves the reason why these jobs should be able to use the relic weapons.

Also, for the argument regarding "They have the Mythic and the Empyrean". My response? So What?

As I said earlier, the Mythic weapons are extremely difficult and time consuming to get. Look at the vana'diel census, notice that only 5 people actually completed Terpsichore, the DNC mythic? Maybe the next update might actually change that, but as it stands, and have stood ever since the beginning, it was not even worth the trouble of doing. If you ask me, many of the mythic weapons need a huge overhaul to actually justify the incredible effort to get them in the first place, but that's another thread for this.

As for the empyrean? Great. Nearly everyone has them. It's basically the 'salvage gear' of 2011. It is a fairly strong piece of gear, and shows that you are the best, and yet thousands have them. It's a minor achievement compared to completing a relic. If you ask me, completing an empyrean relic is as much of an achievement as completing a salvage set (Ares, Skadi, etc), only that it is actually easier to get than finishing salvage set at the time (and by time, I mean two or more years ago, compared to today)

Even though most empyrean weapons beat relic weapons, Obtaining Relic weapons (let alone Mythic) shows a huge achievement. Maybe not as big as it used to be (given the new Dynamis), but still, it is a pretty significant achievement. So the question is: Why shouldn't BLU, COR, PUP, DNC, SCH be allowed to use the relic weapons, if all 20 jobs have access to empyreans? Mythic is a different issue because there is one for each job, and are designed to enhance that specific job. Relics, on the other hand is not.

People say that BLU only uses Scimitar weapon? So? BLU Can use Almace, and it's most certainly not a scimitar weapon type.

People say that DNC don't even use the dagger type as Mandau? In fact, they do. Heart Snatcher says hi, very similar design, and yet DNC can use it.

People say PUP shouldn't be able to use Spharai because of the counter? Well why the hell not? I'm sure it'd be a nice benefit to them.

And why shouldn't COR be able to use Annihilator, when they have Armageddon that's similar in design (only more cooler looking)

SCH though, well, I don't think any SCH would really care about the staff >.>, so I'm not gonna say anything there.

Again, I strongly support this idea, and if SE would do this. Fantastic! Another reason to continue working on Mandau (I love my DNC as much as I love my THF). If ,for some reason SE chose not to do this, I'd like to hear an explanation why. I could understand this would create some issue (Especially for Spharai on Pup since pup don't have any counter trait far as I know), but I really would like to see this happen!

[Nala]

giving all jobs access to a relic weapon would not make things equal, jobs such as sam which gets access to two relics or ranger with two relics and empyrean, paladin with two empyrean ect ect.

[Suirieko]

giving all jobs access to a relic weapon would not make things equal, jobs such as sam which gets access to two relics or ranger with two relics and empyrean, paladin with two empyrean ect ect.

SAM with Empyrean Bow or Paladin with Great sword and so on is pretty moot since it's by standards that players don't really do it, so really. It's a moot topic. Paladins and SAM still have their relic, empyrean, and mythics. COR, BLU, PUP, DNC, SCH, however, cannot use any of the relics. This is the idea of the thread.

Obviously as follows:

Dancer -> Mandau
Corsair -> Annihilator
Scholar -> Claustrum (Though no one in the right mind would do this unless for the sake of achievement)
Blue Mage -> Excalibur
Puppetmaster -> Spharai (Again, I can see some issues with this due to Counter on Spharai, but frankly, it's a nice bonus for pup)

[Zyeriis]

giving all jobs access to a relic weapon would not make things equal, jobs such as sam which gets access to two relics or ranger with two relics and empyrean, paladin with two empyrean ect ect.
So, if they can't even things out completely, they shouldn't even out things where they can?

[Yinnyth]

I would argue blu should actually get mjollnir. Not that they shouldn't be allowed to use excalibur too, but I like the idea of adding jobs to some of the relics that are more job exclusive.

[Suirieko]

I would argue blu should actually get mjollnir. Not that they shouldn't be allowed to use excalibur too, but I like the idea of adding jobs to some of the relics that are more job exclusive.

Why would a BLU use that?

[Ironside]

I would argue blu should actually get mjollnir. Not that they shouldn't be allowed to use excalibur too, but I like the idea of adding jobs to some of the relics that are more job exclusive.

Mjollnir's a hammer, which are almost all WHM-exclusive; it's not just the relic on that one. In addition, BLU doesn't really have anything to do with clubs aside from a mediocre native skill with the weapon; they don't even get many normal clubs, much less the higher-end ones. No thanks.

Ironically though, while SCH isn't on most hammers either, it -is- on the fake relic club, but not the staff. I can't say I understand that one; usually relics/empyreans are -more- selective on usable jobs than the normal weapons of the same type.

[Suirieko]

Mjollnir's a hammer, which are almost all WHM-exclusive; it's not just the relic on that one. In addition, BLU doesn't really have anything to do with clubs aside from a mediocre native skill with the weapon; they don't even get many normal clubs, much less the higher-end ones. No thanks.

Ironically though, while SCH isn't on most hammers either, it -is- on the fake relic club, but not the staff. I can't say I understand that one; usually relics/empyreans are -more- selective on usable jobs than the normal weapons of the same type.

That is interesting. I thought SCH are more associated with Staffs, and not clubs. SCHs can't even use the empyrean club, but can use the staff. Lastly, their mythic is a staff as well. Oh well, it's kind of moot anyway, since I really don't see how SCH would benefit club, but more so staff if ANYTHING. (Which generally, they...don't.)

[Ralos]

Do want. Once they added them there would be a nice little upsurge of people going for relics, at least for a short while

[Ironside]

Do want. Once they added them there would be a nice little upsurge of people going for relics, at least for a short while

I dunno, I think the only relic that would gain any real demand would be Mandau, since that's useful for DNC. The others mostly have other weapons they'd prefer to use, if I'm not mistaken. BLU and COR will want their Empyreans due to how game-changing they are for those jobs, PUP will probably want Mythic (if possible) or Empyrean (I'm not too familiar with PUP though), and SCH is basically the worst melee in the game, so either relic they could get (probably club, but I wouldn't rule out staff entirely) would be wasted on them.

[Finuve]

I dunno, I think the only relic that would gain any real demand would be Mandau, since that's useful for DNC. The others mostly have other weapons they'd prefer to use, if I'm not mistaken. BLU and COR will want their Empyreans due to how game-changing they are for those jobs, PUP will probably want Mythic (if possible) or Empyrean (I'm not too familiar with PUP though), and SCH is basically the worst melee in the game, so either relic they could get (probably club, but I wouldn't rule out staff entirely) would be wasted on them.I doubt even Mandau would go up, since the climactic flourish update Rudra's/Twashtar would be much better than mandau/mercy

[Sparthos]

COR could easily make use of Annihilator and ditto to PUP on Spahrai.

[Ironside]

COR could easily make use of Annihilator and ditto to PUP on Spahrai.

Maybe because I don't see Coronach much, but wouldn't Wildfire still be kinda heavily superior?

PUP on Spharai's the main one I wasn't sure about; they could use it, but I think -for now- Verethragna is better. Then again, most empyreans are better than most relics right now; the rebalance might make Spharai better for PUP, but I can't really see it making Excalibur beat Almace for BLU, or Annihilator beat Armageddon for COR.

[Sparthos]

Outside Abyssea, Wildfire isn't going to beat Coronach. Inside w/Fire atmas? No contest.

Armageddon (and Gandiva) are neat weapons for epeen swinging but the relic bow/gun still have their pulls that make them in ways better than their Empyrean counterparts. Enmity is a big a deal and being able to deal damage while delaying dying is crucial on a ranged class.

Annihilator plays right into the hands of a ranged COR. You have access to a huge amount of racc/ratt that the Emp lacks, a reliable WS in Coronach (FU Slug) and it doubles as the best QD gun in terms of base damage.

[Ironside]

Fair enough. I should probably not talk about specific weapons for jobs I don't play or really know much about, haha.

[Suirieko]

I doubt even Mandau would go up, since the climactic flourish update Rudra's/Twashtar would be much better than mandau/mercy

It's gonna depend on how the updated Mandau will be like. I will imagine that it would make a significant different there. Plus, the hidden triple damage effect would make it even nicer, melee wise for DNC.

[Suirieko]

Shameless bumping because I feel the need to raise the awareness of this issue >.>;.

[Coldbrand]

Outside Abyssea, Wildfire isn't going to beat Coronach. Inside w/Fire atmas? No contest.

Armageddon (and Gandiva) are neat weapons for epeen swinging but the relic bow/gun still have their pulls that make them in ways better than their Empyrean counterparts. Enmity is a big a deal and being able to deal damage while delaying dying is crucial on a ranged class.

Annihilator plays right into the hands of a ranged COR. You have access to a huge amount of racc/ratt that the Emp lacks, a reliable WS in Coronach (FU Slug) and it doubles as the best QD gun in terms of base damage.
You do know that while it doesn't have an enmity reduction aftermath Armageddon does have significantly reduced enmity on WS?

[Nidhogg]

There was no BLU PUP COR DNC or SCH Hydra Corp so there wont be any relic weapons for them, get over it.

[Seha]

There's the armour.
Balrahn wasn't a dancer.
Etc...

[Kimble]

While we are on the topic... while it prob isn't relevant at the moment, I always wondered why they didn't add SCH to the Morrigans robe set and Dancer to the Skadi set.

Hopefully they will add them before we get to augmenting the gear.

[Suirieko]

While we are on the topic... while it prob isn't relevant at the moment, I always wondered why they didn't add SCH to the Morrigans robe set and Dancer to the Skadi set.

Hopefully they will add them before we get to augmenting the gear.

Sadly to say though, I really don't think there's any point in that anymore, unless the augments are totally decent.


There was no BLU PUP COR DNC or SCH Hydra Corp so there wont be any relic weapons for them, get over it.

Moot point. This was discussed earlier. While it makes sense that there wouldn't be any BLU, PUP, COR in theory since they are generally based in the near eastern empire, which had no involvement, not to mention there are really no NPCs in WoTG that are any of the said 3 jobs. However, Scholars and Dancers have heavy involvement with the Crystal War. There was a troop of Dancer soldiers, and several NPCs that are scholars. Therefore, it makes no sense that there wouldn't be any Dancers or scholars in the Hydra Corps.

Finally. At the inception of Dynamis. The said five jobs didn't even exist, so it's really a moot point.

[Suirieko]

Yes. I'm bumping this in hopes that SE would address this situation. :|

[Xellith]

The new jobs don't need the relic weapons. Equanmity is irrelevant.

1. The relic sword is not a scimitar and BLUs only use Scimitars.

2. I'm pretty sure DNC doesn't use the type of dagger the relic dagger is.

3. The relic HTH are cesti and PUP do not use cesti, with only a couple special exceptions.

4. SCH could really not care less if it has access to the relic weapon or not.

1. Um... you are wrong. (http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Corbenic_Sword)

2. Errr... wrong again. (http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Clement_Skean)

3. http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Heofon_KnucklesYea only a few exceptions like this.

4. I agree with this statement 100%

[Suirieko]

1. Um... you are wrong. (http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Corbenic_Sword)

2. Errr... wrong again. (http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Clement_Skean)

3. http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Heofon_KnucklesYea only a few exceptions like this.

4. I agree with this statement 100%

1. Not to mention that BLU has access to Almace, which isn't even a scimitar either, so that is moot.

2. Also, it should be pointed out that Mandau is very similar design to another dagger that dancer can use. That is Heart Snatcher, which again throws this point out of the window.

3. It makes sense, in a way, but there's no reason why they can't make a special exception with puppetmaster, and giving them access to Spharai. If they have special exceptions to other kind of cestis. (IE, HEafon Knuckles, and Furor Cesti's, then why not Spharai, especially since it is an incredibly difficult weapon to obtain.) Other than the potential issue that could come up with Counter and Puppetmaster, why shouldn't puppetmaster have access to Spharai.

4. Frankly, all things considered any of the mage weapons (Claustrums and Mjollnir) is considered as epic waste of money/currency. Only reason to go after these is for the sake of achievement. That said, I would argue that Scholars should be allowed to equip Claustrum in this sense, even though it's almost entirely meh.

[Suirieko]

Yes I'm going to keep bumping this in hopes for answers from SE. Deelgeed with it. >.>

[Suirieko]

I'm going to bump this thread because I feel SE still needs to address this issue and it shouldn't be ignored. At least hearing the explanation on why they shouldn't is good enough for me.

Again, I'm aware that we have the mythic and the of course the empyrean, but as said before, it shouldn't be the reason to prevent the five newer jobs from being able to wield these weapons. I can't really think of an excuse why they shouldn't be able to wield these weapons at all.

"It would piss all the THF that have Mandau off."

Maybe so, maybe not. THF is the first job I took to level 75 (and 90), and will always be my main job. THF performs so well with Twashtar as opposed to Dancer. (Hi Sneak Attack and Trick Attack), and of course, the same can be said for Mandau and Mercy Stroke. I believe that allowing DNC to wield Mandau won't necessarily 'steal' the show from THF. Even with the upcoming changes that THF will get (The upcoming changes to Bully).

With all many of the other questions, some that are even trivial being answered, it bugs me that I feel that this subject is being ignored, since there has not been a response to this at all.

[Kimble]

I'm going to bump this thread because I feel SE still needs to address this issue and it shouldn't be ignored. At least hearing the explanation on why they shouldn't is good enough for me.

Again, I'm aware that we have the mythic and the of course the empyrean, but as said before, it shouldn't be the reason to prevent the five newer jobs from being able to wield these weapons. I can't really think of an excuse why they shouldn't be able to wield these weapons at all.

"It would piss all the THF that have Mandau off."

Maybe so, maybe not. THF is the first job I took to level 75 (and 90), and will always be my main job. THF performs so well with Twashtar as opposed to Dancer. (Hi Sneak Attack and Trick Attack), and of course, the same can be said for Mandau and Mercy Stroke. I believe that allowing DNC to wield Mandau won't necessarily 'steal' the show from THF. Even with the upcoming changes that THF will get (The upcoming changes to Bully).

With all many of the other questions, some that are even trivial being answered, it bugs me that I feel that this subject is being ignored, since there has not been a response to this at all.

Climactic Flourish says no.

[Suirieko]

Climactic Flourish says no.

I suppose all things considered, it puts them on even footing, but given the way Bully looks, I think Bully will outshine with climatic flourish, given how strong SATA already is with THF.

[Kimble]

Would most likely be about the same, doubt it would be higher as DNC also gets a 20% damage boost with Climactic Flourish.

[Juri_Licious]

Reverse Flourish dagger!

[Rearden]

We don't need to give DNC any more of THFs stuff.

^this


Also not quite sure why anyone wants to use excal/would do excal

[Urteil]

I want to use Aegis. (*'-')|"'

[Sparthos]

I dont see why THF is all like "nuh uh" on Mandau as if that'd somehow change the situation. There is no reason the newer jobs shouldn't be on relic. The notion of being overpowered has been a laughing joke since before Empyeans were released.

If you had a Mandau, the odds are you'd be a THF main anyway.

[Rearden]

I just hate dancer

[Sparthos]

Dont see why.

The job has extremely limited application and only truly shines in lowman play. As much hate as TH/THF gets, people still crawl back to the class when the time comes. Mandau would do nothing to change the status of both.

[Deadvinta]

@ the Coronach vs Wildfire argument.

Outside abyssea, with MAB and AGI gear, Wildfire will still dominate Coronach.

[Rearden]

Unless the mob takes no fire damage or reduced magic damage (more than 1/2) WF wrecks shop in VW. Unresisted should net ~22-2600