Jeuno Quest Bulliten Board

[Inafking]

I posted an idea like this on the XIV beta board. Players loved it, devs didn't care. I'm expecting a similar respons here except with more trolls.

We all now how difficult it is to get things done in this game. Everything requires a group but getting that group together is often times more challenging than the actual fight. The joke I ususaly tell is "This game is like sex. You spend all your time looking for people to do it with, and it's over in 5 minutes." What I am suguesting is an easier way to get groups together.

It starts out with a bulliten board like FF Tactics or My life as a king. Players can post a quest that they need at the cost of items, gil or board points. Responding players can sign up to help or get a similar reward or quest completion as the posting player. Responding players that sign up to help get board points for their own quests, items or gil. Give everyone a certan amount of board points per day and viola, people are now getting stuff done instead of hanging out in Jeuno.

This fixes Juno zone, shout and yell congestion while also fixing the problem of not being able to get things done.

[Covenant]

I originally supported this idea and SquareEnix did have a post board in the past PlayOnline/newspaper section(I think years 1-3 or so).However, it was underutilized and "outside" the normal game.

I posted a similar idea, but using the Newspaper NPC in Windy(but spread the newspaper to all towns). Heck, a series of "newspaper" quest could have been created. Players could've investigated all types of stories and report to the newspaper.

[Dimitrius]

I really wish there was a way to get english speaking ppl to use the /seacom. Kinda sucks going through that and can't read a thing, but once in a blue moon i see someone wanting something i'm interested in, but not very often. Maybe your idea may catch on more, idk would be nice if there was a way to get ppl to show us what they needed.

[Inafking]

It would be nice if people would pick up on /seacom but I think it's just too passive. Besides, without some kind of reward system, most people can't be motivated to help at all.

[Rosalie]

why not just ask for help in your world forum...

[Garota]

You mean like this? (http://www.ffxiah.com/screenshots/37737)

[Lotmorning]

Honestly I agree with this idea of a board if not the payment portion. I have been playing a long time and I like to try and 100% things while at same time helping others. If there was a way to post a mission that you currently on (my example was WotG 1st Castle Zvahl Baileys fight took me almost 2 months to find people on or past it) I think that would help speed things up. I also see shouts in zones for Nyzul Isle, and feel if there was a way to post what floor you currently on for others to see more people would be able to progress to floor 100's.

[Inafking]

Just saw another ragequit in Jeuno because no one wants to help. You really gotta do something Square.

[Dauntless]

Actually a great idea, but I recommend putting it in General section for more feedback and to increase the chances that a rep will see it.

[Inafking]

I link to it in topics where it applies. I'd like to keep it in this section because this is where I think it belongs / stands out.

[Inafking]

This was posted in another thread, but I'd Like to respond to it here.


You say a player can put put a request for help at a cost (i.e gil? or an item) and hope players chose it?
How would you make a request?
How would rewards be handled?
What types of Rewards are there? Exp?
Could you leave messages on these boards if you're say, in a different time zone but still want to help?
How would it handle Different languages (i.E would it translate it? or would there be JP/EN requests separately/Together?)
What Items do you mean when you say "Sign up using items"? Do the players who help get this item? is it lost?
How long would the request stay on the board? would you get a refund if no one took it? Could you cancel it?

I need to point out that there are numbers and items in here I use for examples. The exact numbers / items used to achieve ballance would require data that only Square has access to.

The easiest way to do this would be to tie it to the auction house. That is where you would make / view / cancel requests. The amount of requests you can make is limited by the points. Here is an example:

TaruX just started the game. He gets 5 points for joining the game. He is now 18+ and needs help getting his support job. So he flags the quest and heads back to Windurst to post his request. He uses 3 points to post his request for help because he needs all 3 items. MithraY needs help with G1, but she does not have any points. So she helps TaruX get his items and is then rewarded with 3 points. That 3 points will only get her 1 of the 3 items she needs. So she needs to work up 6 more points.

The amount of points you use / get are based on the quest difficulty. Due to the number of people who already have so much done, there would need to be some kind of daily point reward to get enough points in to the system to make it work. Asside from point rewards, there would also be gil and item rewards. Mostly for Missions, the gil reward would be based off an amount the poster contributes. Another example:

TaruX needs to fight the Shadow Lord so he can get in to Dynamis (I know this one is a little out of date but please bear with me) he puts up 20k + points for the post. MithraY whops his ass on RDM and is rewarded with 100k + points or perhaps signs up with someone else and they each get 50k and split the points.

When dealing with these new multimember situations, the people who sign up for help with stuff they need are also charged points, but only a percent of the total. Everyone is required to have full points when they sign up, but the points will be returned apaun completion. I.E. if everyone needs the Shadowllord fight, all points are returned. Or if just TaruX and MithraY needed it, they would each pay full points and have half returned apaun completion.

Item rewards are more for things that drop items everyone is after:

TaruX needs his Brown Belt. So does everyone else on his server who FCed MNK. Everyone who signs up to help him with the Dodo would get Dodo skins of their own.

Allowing people to choose their reward would expand willingness to help. But I would need access to more data to figure out how to balance it. Speaking of balance, the next example is items:

TaruX wants a Genbu Seals for synergy. The amount of points he is charged is based on offseting the drop percentage for his shield. Instead of full points, he offers his pop items to the board. Because the seal is a %100 drop and he has pop items, he is not charged very much for this transaction. MithraY wants the Shield. She is chatged a hefty amount of points to make the shield drop %100. She can offset that by offering her own pop items.

You're already rolling the dice by using pop items on a random PT so don't give me the "it's not far" elitist QQ about making drop rates %100. But ultimatly the exact balance of the item / point / gil offset would be based on numbers that are not known to me. Items could also be used along with gil and points to help conrol the number of posts on the buliten board. For example before you post that you need help with G1 you must trade in 4 zinc cause the AH has been running low. The tier of materials or amount would be based on the difficulty of the mission / quest, but what you trade in would be based on the demands of the market. Those items would then be sold by the board on the AH for the going rate. But these are just some of the many examples of ways you could tweak the system so it balances out the whole game.

Finally we come to the language issue. This would not be a message board, but system using the existing data files to show information in the client's native language. I.E. TaruX is English and MithraY is JP, they would each see the board's data in their own language.

That's as much deatil as I can afford the time to put in for a casual request. If Square is really intrested, they know where to find me.

[Xale]

I really like the idea of having some way of determining who needs/wants to get certain missions and quests done from most major game areas. However, I think the system you are describing, while certainly well thought out, would never be picked up due to it requiring a lot of effort to implement. You say the system is best implemented through the auction houses (presumably because you can access them from all major locations), but this would require changing the way players interact with the auction house, there would have to be some new system for selecting whether you wanted the Board or the AH. You could just add NPCs or objects near the AHs to remedy this but now you're taking up more system resources by adding more models to the area. You're also talking about adding a "Points" system to the Board (I'm assuming this is to both prevent spam and make sure people actually get help), but the issue is how people check this. Is it through a new NPC or is it a menu item? I also don't really see an issue of people not helping, forcing people to group up artificially might have further repercussions (I don't know if this would really be an issue, it's just something to consider, the social consequences of creating this system are not for me to talk about). These points also require storing more information for each player. I also think that the board itself might require the creation of new data (you've stated above that it could just access existing data, maybe you are more well versed in the technical aspects of the game than I am). A Board "Post" must now exist somewhere containing information (or in the least the location of information) such as who is requesting, how many people have already signed up, what each reward would be (points, gil, item), the cost, what the quest or mission is, and probably a text description written by the poster. Finally the whole reward system you describe seems to me like it would throw off the balance of the game (maybe I've misunderstood you). It seems like you're suggesting that if I requested a party for to kill an xNM for x item like minded players could also receive said item, even though only one dropped, as a reward for helping (again maybe I'm misunderstanding). That would then devalue items or require them to be re-balanced perhaps ruining their beneficial nature. It also seems like it might be fairly complicated to figure out for instance if a request of that nature had been completed. To sum all that up for you: I really like the idea, but I think it would be difficult to implement at a technical level and have a lot of unforeseen repercussions.

I'm not just going to nitpick you though, I think this feature could ultimately be implemented in much simpler ways. For instance it seems to me that another search function could be added. The server already knows what quests I have active and what missions I am on. I think it would be a lot easier to add a mission/quest search feature. This would (at least as I imagine it) allow you to search for players in an area (or the whole server or whatever) who have the selected quest/mission active. I think really the biggest issue with this is that the game would have to either present you with a full list of missions and quests (which is clearly unreasonable) or would require the game to keep track of all the quests you have active and present you with that list (which may require creating more data or menus etc). I suppose another option would be requiring the quest name to be input as the search term (like the search name feature). I suppose it could also be pointed out that unlike your suggestion I don't really provide an incentive for people to help, but I've never had an issue with the community's willingness to help out. I think the biggest plus of doing something more of this nature is that it uses existing systems, menus, and commands.

Anyway, if I've misunderstood your post please feel free to correct me. If you have a better understanding of some of the underlying technical elements of the game, feel free to correct me on that too. Like I said at the start this is the kind of feature that I'd like to see exist. :D

[Rosalie]

...really, people. Use search comments. The JP players utilize the mission/quest category for them far more than the NA playerbase does.

[Inafking]

I have no idea what JP players use in thei /seacom because they refuse to auto trans. Even if it were true that they use /seacom more than us, it does not help us if no one else uses it. But I wouldn't mind if Squarre would save our /seacoms when we log and let us file one under each category. I don't think the board would be as hard to implement as Xale says, but I'll take what we can get.

[RAIST]

I've actually gotten to get quite a few things done simply because I put it up in /seacom and bazaar. I got my DRG feet simply because I had it in /seacom--was farming chests off pucks and I got a tell out of nowhere from a THF farming funguar. Partied up and I got my feet and I stuck around for him/her (was a stranger) to finish seals off the NM.

I've also tracked down people that posted in server pages at other sites...even the job pages too. Others have looked me up because I posted for guidance on something and we linked up and got her done.

There are already several tools available for helping you out with teaming up, people just don't use them. Surprises me too after Magian's has been out so long--this is one of the most obvious reasons to use the comments. Who knows why they aren't using the tools. Maybe they didn't RTFM....maybe they haven't done any research and don't know about all the sites out there. Maybe they're just blindly following what others are doing and would rather sit on their fanny and shout for 8 hours for a party instead of...idk, get off their butt and grab a couple friends to low-man some pages or <gasp> go solo with your flag up.

You'd be surprised how many people I see come into the game and don't even know about ffxiclopedia, much less the dozen or so other places I have gotten info from over the years. One of my old LS's had a blog where we listed links to about 8 sites for tools, guides, and general info on this stuff. We also had our own request board to post things we wanted to do where others could sign on for, but only a handful of people actually used it.

The point is... just because you build it....doesn't necessarily mean they will come. Might be better served to educate the masses first.

[Inafking]

I've tried /seacom, no one uses it. The only way you're going to get people to use somehing is if they have incentive to do so.

[RAIST]

my incentive to use it is simply.... it works for me.

[Inafking]

So you're the only one who uses it because you're the only one it works for. Good for you. Now we gotta fix it for the rest of us.

[RAIST]

funny... if it worked for me, then it worked for all the other people who I partnered with because of it, including a handful of people I've added to friendlist over the years--some who were indeed JP and read my auto-trans. /seacom.

Take a look at some of the extra features, some not originally in the game that SE has added over the years (Brenner, Ballista, Garrison, Expedition Forces, Pankration, Choco Racing, Besieged, Campaign, the list goes on). Some work for some, doesn't for others. As long as people like you are not willing to use it and preach it doesn't work, then it may just continue to work for fewer and fewer--the same thing could happen to a bulletin board. People could post there and not get a response after a short time and just say f*k it. I've done Garrison and didn't like it... doesn't mean I think others shouldn't do it. Doesn't mean that it works or doesn't...just that one person had an issue with it and has elected not to use it. That one person's experience is not necessarily indicative of everyone's...otherwise people wouldn't have manequin's in their mog house. So long as it is proven that it works for at least one person, it IS fullfilling it's role, and serves a purpose. So you technically can't say it doesn't work as it has been proven to work by definition.

That's not to say a bulletin board wouldn't be useful either. I'm just saying there are methods already available that can be used to reach the same end result. People should try them out if they haven't already, which by the state of the forums here, they are not (at least on this site).

Have a feeling this could go round and round to infinity....so please, just stop.

Reminds me of Gin Rummy from the Boondocks:


Gin Rummy: I always say the absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence.
Riley: What?
Gin Rummy: Simply because you don't have evidence that something does exist does not mean you have evidence of something that doesn't exist.
Riley: What?
Gin Rummy: What country are you from?
Riley: What?
Gin Rummy: 'What' ain't no country I ever heard of! They speak English in 'What'?
Riley: What?
Gin Rummy: English, motherfucker! Do you speak it?
Riley: Yeah.
Gin Rummy: So you understand the words I'm saying to you!
Riley: Yeah.
Gin Rummy: Well, what I'm saying is that there are known knowns and that there are known unknowns. But there are also unknown unknowns; things we don't know that we don't know.
Riley: What?
Gin Rummy: Say what again! Say what again! I dare you! I double dare you, motherfucker! Say what one more time!



/facepalm

[Inafking]

I'm trying to relate actual experience in the game, not just some stuff you do for Lulz that happens to work every now and then on your server. It does not work for the rest of us, now please stop distracting from the real problems at hand.

[RAIST]

not stuff I do for "lulz". I don't list that, I list important more important stuff.

Specifically remember getting my cards for Sleepga2 quest because of it (mentioned earlier)
Got my DRG AF3 feet and made them +1 because of it (mentioned earlier)
Got assistance on upgrading over 30 weapons and 50 pieces of armor so far (mentioned earlier)
Got a blind invite to the first Diabolos fight because of it.
Got invited to Fenrir Prime fight because of it.

Those are just a few specific details that come to mind. I've gotten invited to all kinds of things because I had it in my /seacom and or bazaar.

Oh yeah..forgot about getting from rank 9 to rank 10 because of it.

There have been lots of things like that that happened because I have stuff in either my /seacom or bazaar. People routinely check me and I don't have anything in my bazaar... so people are looking for something. Certainly isn't my gear because it's all mostly common gear that anyone can eventually obtain simply by playing the game even solo.

You are the one that keeps challenging the validity of FACTS that show the exisitng resources can and do work for some, basically saying no one uses it because it doesn't work. So, if anyone needs to drop it, it is YOU.

[Karbuncle]

I'd like to first point out, this idea has some merits, but it needs to be a bit more fleshed out. The way i think about it, the more work we do with the basics, the more chance SE has to implement it (Less work on their part). My Ideas.

The Bulletin Board:
The Bulletin Board would be placed next to Auction Houses, Clicking The Bulliten board will bring up a menu where you can select one of three options

*View Quests
*Place Request
*Claim Reward

View requests:
Viewing Quests is pretty basic, It will bring up a List of available Quests. There Could be a Sort Feature to sort them by category. I.E BCNM/KSNM, Mission, Level-Cap, Support Job.

When Selecting a Quest, It will bring up a small description and ask you If you'd like to confirm helping. Once You click Confirm, a Message is sent to the player with something like "XXX has Taken your request! Please Contact him". This will be a Playonline message (like a Friend message).

Once you have Completed the Task, Return to the bulliten board, When the Quest is Marked as "Completed" By the original Owner, You receive your reward of 5 "bulletin Points" (name in progress), which are used to Claim rewards later.

***Problem here. Someone can complete a request and Poster does not mark as completed = no reward. It could mark as "Auto-Complete" After a few days, but then people might take requests and ignore the Requester simply to claim the "Auto-Complete" reward. Needs some Solutions here. Obviously it can't be System automated as The Quests Board will have no way to confirm rather or not you completed said quest.
***Possible Solution. Categories can be placed. I.E if you chose BCNM, and someone accepts it. It will be similar to magian trials. your goal is to do the BCNM with said player, Once you actually Win the BCNM, A message appears in log saying "Quest Completed, Report to Bulletin board to claim Reward". At this point, Either the poster or Helper can mark it as Completed so the Helper can claim their reward.

Place Request
When Placing a Request, The information is filled in by you. The game first asks you the nature of the quest (i.E General, Level Cap, BCNM). Which will help Sort it later. Once Selected, Player places a General Description. Maximum 100 characters. Something like

"Need help with BCNM40, Under Observation. Have BLM, BST, NIN, Would like a YoYD System, Just need Utsusemi: Ni"

Once entered, It will show you your information again, and ask you to confirm, as well as tell you how many "points" you spend placing a Request. I think Requests should be static 2 point per Request, keep it low so the System isn't too much of a hassle.

If you are logged out when someone takes your Quest, you will still receive a message. The Request Will stay on the board until you mark it as "Completed" or until 7 Days have passed. Once 7 Days have Passed if someone has taken your Request and you have not marked it completed, It will be marked "Completed".

You can re-request it any time.

Claim Reward:
The Reward for helping other players should be good. Most players will want good rewards, Some don't need one. But to really fix the problem we need to appeal to the crowd who are not easily swayed to help others. Here is an Example of a Reward System:

[Inafking]

IDC how they do it as long as it allows me to get stuff done.

[Upokupo]

Glad I decided to check out the forums today. Learned about and how to use /seacom and that some people actually do use it. I'm gonna get mine all set up and see how it goes :p Thanks for the advice/tip.

Seems to me that this is already a Bulletin Board type system 'on the go' style. Don't need to be huddled in a specific zone to check. I think that it would be better served if SE did something to make this feature stand out a bit more. Having a physical Bulletin Board somewhere in towns could help with that by tying it in with the /seacom command. Or like someone else suggested the newspapers. Have a Help Wanted section or something. Lots of ways to tackle this without actually implementing something totally new.

As for a rewards based approach, seems a bit convoluted and yet another point system to keep track of.

A bulletin board would be great because it would be a more visceral approach to using /seacom. Commands like that are great for the power user but a more casual person could go for a long time without knowing/utilizing that feature.