The meaning of LOL DRG in case you dont know

[Geebee]

For those that have seen this ingame (who hasent)

LOL DRG started after SE took out the TP gain from Penta thrust weapon skill use on DRG (about 7+ years ago i think), before the removal of this DRG used to gain 60+ TP from penta thrust use which pretty much made them one of the most effective DD's in game.

;)

[Thonuwan]

Is that really all? I always thought it was because Call Wyvern was our 2 hr at first which limited our capabilities if the wyvern died. I wasn't around then so i don't know.

[Geebee]

Is that really all?

like all jobs in FFXI DRG has had its fair share (more then most some would say) of gimps/updates (w/e you wanna call em) sadly penta thrust was the 1st of many, this was way before NIN was released and when we were all running about at the higest level of 70, and when WAR was the ONLY Tank job in the game, the game at lauch was not unlike FFXIII is now,basicly a test platform but with ppl playing their subscrition each month, we had Maintence on a weekly basis for months, and no one had the luxury of FFXIWikki it was a mish-mash of other sites (some were poor beyond poor)


ahh the good ole days :P

[noodles355]

The nerf wasn't aimed at penta thrust FYI. It was aimed at Asuran fists. Monk's would equip base item relic knuckles which have 999 delay. after innitially reaching 100%TP, each weaponskill would return over 100%TP, meaning they could WS indefinitely with no TP phase. Because H2H DMG is calulated on skill and weapon +DMG, not purely weapon DMG, the damage loss wasn't enough to offset the damage increase from WSing repeatedly with no TP phase.

[Mirage]

Well even if it wasn't for that relic knuckles thing, I don't think it would have taken long before drg started getting back 90ish TP either, after they introduced samurai and more store TP gear. They would probably have had to nerf it sooner or later anyway.

Not to mention samurais with penta thrust.

[Ophannus]

Don't forget our premier weapon skill for executing a Light SC was Wheeling Thrust. Before 2005, wheeling thrust had a 1.00 fTP not the decent 1.75 fTP it now has. Because of this, Wheeling Thrust typically dealt ~200-350 damage. Compared to Arching Arrow/Dragon Kick/Mistral Axe/Cross Reaper/Spinning Slash and Shark Bite, Wheeling Thrust was the weakest.

Another reason DRGs were LOL was because we didn't have Spirit Link for 2.5 years after DRG came out. Meaning, if we wanted to heal our pet, we actually had to sit and /heal for about 10 minutes. This was before the Signet buff too, so we lost TP to do this.

To clarify further, not only did the oldschool DRG/SAM get ~65 TP from a 5 hit penta thrust, but back then Meditate was on a 1 minute recast and gave 100 TP even when subbed.

[Andevom]

Is that really all? I always thought it was because Call Wyvern was our 2 hr at first which limited our capabilities if the wyvern died. I wasn't around then so i don't know.

This is the widely accepted reason.

I never heard of this Penta Thrust bug being the reason why LOLDRG was a popular snap. It wouldn't really make much sense considering taking away massive TP gain like that wouldn't make DRG suck, it would just make them more on par with other melees.

Call Wyvern as a Two Hour Ability sucked. When things get rough and you have a moment where you need a trump card, you need an ability that either makes you crazy strong, makes you evade damage, or heals you entirely. Before Spirit Surge, DRG had nothing to offer in that department, which limited solo potential for tough NMs, or use in certain events where THAs are essential for safe runs. For this, they were considered weak, hence LOLDRG.

[Degenxerate]

I don't know why all you guys seem to think its about the 2 hour. He is right about the term coming after that WS nerf. Before that it still had the same 2 hour but people loved the job. 2 Hours really don't make or break a job. Even if the 2 hour could deal 10k damage while filling up the parties HP and MP, giving everyone invincible and giving everyone in a 30 yalm radius 600 million gil it still wouldn't make the drg any better in an xp party which at the time "LOLdrg" came around XPing was easily the thing people did most. Face it, 2 hours aside drg just couldn't keep up with other melee who put the same time/effort in to the job.

[Thonuwan]

I thought it was the 2 hour because I wasn't around during the lolDRG era and all of the explanations I've hard have been that.

[StingRay104]

It was tp nerf

[Ryx]

Allow me to shed some light. While things have been pointing in the right direction, I'd like to give more details on the matter.

Penta-spam was not a bug, it was a design flaw. FFXI's gone through a magnitude of changes over the years, and this was one of the earlier ones. Each hit in a multi-hit weapon skill would give normal TP, so provided all hits landed, 13 TP * 5 hits would yield about 65 TP return from Penta. The same can be used to explain Asuran: 8 hits * 20 TP/hit = 160 TP if all 8 connected. Add to that, you had jumps & meditate, and could get around long delay weapons by disengaging then re-engaging the mob, prompting a hit before it should be ready. There was no re-engage delay back in those days, so all the DDs would be constantly flipping in & out of battle mode to get around their delays.

The call wyvern 2-hour was later deemed a mistake by SE, tho I never considered it to be one, having developed a great respect for my wyvern. Dragoon has never relied on its wyvern for damage output. It's an added bonus, but nothing to rely on. The wyvern's value comes /mage, which wasn't mainstream until later, but that's a story for another time.

Dragoon was the first Bandwagon DD job, leveled by the masses that go from job to job, based on which has the mechanics advantage. This group has traveled through most jobs over the course of vana'diel's history, instead of devoting itself to specific jobs they enjoy. Dragoon was also the first job to fall from grace when SE decided to change the TP returns.

What brought about the 'loldrg' title is the common view that when we lost the power of penta-spam, it made us inferior to the other jobs. A number of the early dragoons quit at this time, selling their accounts to RMTs, which contributed to why a fair amount of the early gilsellers were dragoons.

Just a few other examples of jobs that've gone through this phase of being popular: Rng, Blm, Nin, Mnk, War, Sam, along with the support jobs like Brd, Rdm, Whm, & Pld.

Now some might say that Dragoon was "gimp" after the TP-nerf, but really, I prefer to think that it made the job mortal. You had to put the work into it for it to be good. I personally leveled Dragoon at this time, and had to grow up with the loldrg mantra everywhere I went. I worked hard at being good though, and did my best to prove that it was still a worthwhile job to have around.

And while I'm on the topic of loldrg history, let's not forget loldrg², lolmelano. Loldrg is a tease, lolmelano is an insult. Melano was an Asuran, incredibly loud and boisterous. He was such a noise-maker, especially on forums (such as KillingIfrit), that every server knew of him, and thus the title was born. Among these posts & 'debates', for an example, was his argument that Orichalcum Lance was better than Mezraq.

Loldrg is typically used to tease someone about playing Drg. Lolmelano is used to say that someone is terrible at the job, typically guilty of subbing nin or dnc, wearing completely inappropriate gear in battle (outside of the newbie levels), or suggesting completely absurd ideas.

/nin & /dnc are worthless in the face of /mage. If the situation is ever so bad that you HAVE to /nin on Drg to survive meleeing, then you should be on another job, or at the very least /sam & standing outside of AoE, running in to WS. Standing back & playing support drg/whm is also a valid option.

This concludes your Dragoon-history lesson, brought to you by Ryx.

[Sotek]

And while I'm on the topic of loldrg history, let's not forget loldrg², lolmelano. Loldrg is a tease, lolmelano is an insult. Melano was an Asuran, incredibly loud and boisterous. He was such a noise-maker, especially on forums (such as KillingIfrit), that every server knew of him, and thus the title was born. Among these posts & 'debates', for an example, was his argument that Orichalcum Lance was better than Mezraq.

Oh God, nostalgia rush lol.
I miss when Jump was affected by Ranged Accuracy, fun times ._.

[Coldbrand]

For those that have seen this ingame (who hasent)

LOL DRG started after SE took out the TP gain from Penta thrust weapon skill use on DRG (about 7+ years ago i think), before the removal of this DRG used to gain 60+ TP from penta thrust use which pretty much made them one of the most effective DD's in game.

;)

Why the Hell are you making a thread about this? No one wants to be reminded of when the community acted like gigantic assholes.

[StingRay104]

Why the Hell are you making a thread about this? No one wants to be reminded of when the community acted like gigantic assholes.

They don't now?

[Coldbrand]

Oh well, penta spam is back in full force and actually worse thanks to all the STP and conserve tp we have now. Except with Drakesbane unless the WS rebalancing shakes things up. So whatever.

[Geebee]

What brought about the 'loldrg' title is the common view that when we lost the power of penta-spam, it made us inferior to the other jobs. A number of the early dragoons quit at this time, selling their accounts to RMTs, which contributed to why a fair amount of the early gilsellers were dragoons.

yeah I remember those days all to well, my friend actually sold his DRG just like you said because of exactly that reason, (such a sad day) I remember him tellling me that he never felt to frustrated after the "nerf" and that he will never play FFXI again and he never did :(

[Valonquar]

My recollection was mostly that people were gaga over the WS damage DRK did in comparison at the time. Never mind that it took them 3 to 4 times longer to build the TP as they missed constantly. I remember PTs where my wyvern alone outdamaged other DDs in XP pts.

I believe the game was out in NA for about 2 to 3 months before the TP nerf hit. I remember it was pretty much RIGHT after I earned the WS.

I do recall it being neigh impossible to get a PT invite on DRG back in the day.

[Gotterdammerung]

lol<insertjob> really is just a term for the elitist bandwagoners Ryx was talking about.

There a group of people with no job loyalty who just play whats strong at the time.

Truthfully its a LARGE GROUP. It represents most of the FF community.

As rules change balance shifts and one job will always be slightly on top.

These fickle bandwagoners instantly switch to wichever job has the most power for the least amount of effort.

Jobs that are deemed not worthy of their attention and jobs that they have moved on from get laughed at and recieve the lolTitle.

If you are offended by this groups behavior, well theres not much for it.
There is a small population of loyalists who believe in fighting to excel at your chosen job. If you are one of these people, the best thing for you to do is keep trying. Much can be accomplished through stubbornness. Playing bst and drg i had many LS leaders try to tell me my jobs were worthless. I made them take me anyway. And i made myself valuable to the runs. By the time those shells had ended they did not regret my job. So u can through dedication prove yourself to these shallow job hoppers. And something to look forward too, eventually the tide will shift and your job will rock again. When this happens, they will flood in like zombies to raise the prices of your gear and try to tell you how to play "YOUR" job, BUT when this happens you will most likely be one of the best players of a popular job, and thats kinda nice.

And if taking the positive approach doesnt work for you, then u can always be a jerk about it.
If the war says "loldrg doesnt even have a good emp ws ahaha"
tell him "well considering u cant take a #$%@ without a white mage to wipe your @#&, i think im ok with being a drg.
because the truth is a war does a lot of dmg but it cant do anything without life support. So you cant even look at war in terms of 1 job dps... because it is war + whm and i know 2 skilled drg/rdm's would outdamage the hell out of war/sam + whm/rdm."


And if that doesnt work you can always just burn them with fire.

[OMEGA_HACK]

lol drg stems from a plethora of things:

1) TP nerf to Multi-hit/high delay weapons (this included penta)
2) horrible accuracy problem with DRG at the later levels when at lower levels it was the DD king
3) quickly dying wyvern and not having a 2hr that could save the party in case of emergency (when Call Wyvern was 2hr)
4) lack of a decent light/dark closing ws due to lolWheeling Thrust
5) uneducated player base once DRG received many buffs to fix the above

[Ophannus]

Don't forget that we couldn't wear sky gear and our endgame armor included crap like Wyvern Helm, Assault Jerkin, Tiger Ledelsens, Taresque Mitts. We also had nothing to put in our ammo slot while other jobs could use xbows for acid bolts or bomb cores.

[Mookie]

It mostly came from losing penta spam. Up until that point drg was still a major dd contender especially when you subbed /sam. Once the tp nerf came out, everyone jumped ship who wasn't a true drg at heart. But then again, I was kinda happy about that. There are a lot of people out there who just level a job cuz they think its uber. They're like your typical fad chasers. They level whatever 'in' job is. True dragoons play the job cuz they love dragons, that's all there is.

[Rochetm]

Drg/sam was a nightmare for tanks. The never ending supply of Penta thrust was out of control. They took that away and left Drgs being pretty sad.

Honestly though 2 handers kind of stunk in general though.

[Ophannus]

MNK/SAM was more of a nightmare since they got back more than 100% TP with Asuran Fists and relic knuckles, they could spam indefinitely and were probably the cause for the TP nerf. DRG/SAM was decent but to be honest, since this was back when people EXP'd off Incredible Tough- High Def/High evasion, before the age of sushi, without berserk, Penta did around 250-500 damage each. It was more viable for solo/low man stuff really than exp grinding or endgame at that.

Would be fun if our new merit 2hr ability was Save TP+60 so we could relive Multihit WS spam for 1 minute every 2 hours.

[Zerich]

Why the Hell are you making a thread about this? No one wants to be reminded of when the community acted like gigantic assholes.

too soon 1234

[Aana]

It was just a casualty of the 1st major nerf so everyone jumped off the bandwagon and drg didnt really have any eye popping way to stay in the spotlight. Back when war was just a sub job. Mnk sucked because it couldnt do distortion. Drg stunk because we faught IT+++++ mobs and had trouble 'turning' the mob opening light with lolWheeling thrust and the fact that we had less enmity via high jump for the thf or drk/thf to close SATAWS light.

Back then it was all about the SC. The mobs were so high level in parties that melee DoT didnt mean crap so it was all about SC+MB (usually involving lots of thf or /thf to plant hate on the Estaff Pld).

Then tou came and burn parties on squishy piercing pink exp bags and the 2hander super buff and drg jumped back in. Then we finally got onto 'heavy' armor in TAU (aurum/Ares/Askar), 20 min wyvern and drakesbane. We have basically been sitting pretty ever since with ever improving armor and buffs (more acc/atk traits, spirit/soul, reduced JA timers, stardiver, 6/5hit builds etc).

Drg has come up a lot in the world, but like most things on the interwebz, stigmas dont die very easily and are perpetuated by people that have no idea why it was there in the 1st place (and in this case have been entirely removed by now).

[Ophannus]

MNK/SAM was more of a nightmare since they got back more than 100% TP with Asuran Fists and relic knuckles, they could spam indefinitely and were probably the cause for the TP nerf. DRG/SAM was decent but to be honest, since this was back when people EXP'd off Incredible Tough- High Def/High evasion, before the age of sushi, without berserk, Penta did around 250-500 damage each. It was more viable for solo/low man stuff really than exp grinding or endgame at that.

Would be fun if our new merit 2hr ability was Save TP+60 so we could relive Multihit WS spam for 1 minute every 2 hours.

[Aramaic]

Oh the days of looking for party on drg which was just as horrible as lfp on drk. Went 2 full weeks with flag up near crawler's nest without invite, wanting to bash head into wall the whole time.

[Transmit]

DRG's these days will never know the greatness of an Assault Jerkin.

[Ophannus]

That thing is pretty awesome right up until they released Perle. 18 attack and 3 acc is pretty fine for a melee body.