Next visual improvement: Status icons

[Alhanelem]

It actually appears there was a slight change to status icons (they seem like they're antialiased or something) but they are still of low detail. Because of modder's inability to change this, I'm imagining it may be more difficult to implement. But please improve the quality of the status icons- Some of them even look too cloes to eachother, like the HP/MP up/down icons- the H in HP and M in MP look almost exactly the same.

[Vazerus]

I would also like to see an official update to status icons. I would like to be able to glance at my icons and know exactly what buffs/debuffs I have instead of having to scroll through similar looking icons.

[Korpg]

More Aesthetic changes/updates!

Lets make this game look pretty but ignore the actual problems with this game!

[Fearforever]

More Aesthetic changes/updates!

Lets make this game look pretty but ignore the actual problems with this game!

I can't imagine it'd take long to redesign some higher res icons....1 person could probably do it within afew hours.

[Tsukino_Kaji]

I can't imagine it'd take long to redesign some higher res icons....1 person could probably do it within afew hours.If they don't suck at their job, 30min.

[Niklz]

Lets make this game look pretty but ignore the actual problems with this game!

there will always be problems though, atleast make it look pretty.

[Francisco]

More Aesthetic changes/updates!

Lets make this game look pretty but ignore the actual problems with this game!

Yeah, they need to give RDM and SCH Cure VI and T5 nukes, make mages better melee, make every 2H weapon skill in the game crit based, give SMNs a reason to melee, make elemental spirits better than avatars, automatons, wyverns, fellows, BST pets and dual-boxed BLMs.

Then they can focus on making level 75 relics drop 2-4 at a time from Dynamis Lord, level 90 relics drop 5-7 at a time from Arch Dynamis Lord, and mythics randomly drop from Odin, T4 ZNMs and Chariots.

Finally, for the level 99 cap, they can eliminate the job system and replace it with the license board from FF12.

I just hope they make abyssea easier. I sucks I need to use Chakra to solo some NMs and sometimes even need a WHM to kill stuff.

[Alhanelem]

More Aesthetic changes/updates!

Lets make this game look pretty but ignore the actual problems with this game!
Because the people who do art are the same people who write the code.

Everything about the game should be made better. not just what this person or that person wants.

I've never seen you be so negative nancy before.

[Coldbrand]

How about next improvement: 60 FPS and anti-aliasing

[Razushu]

How about next improvement: 60 FPS and anti-aliasing

I read somewhere that the FPS was somehow fundamentally linked to stuff like ability timers and messing with the FPS screws with the game in all kind of ways.

[Alhanelem]

Something like that. They'd have to rework a lot of stuff to be able to change the FPS.

[Korpg]

Because the people who do art are the same people who write the code.

Everything about the game should be made better. not just what this person or that person wants.

I've never seen you be so negative nancy before.

Less artwork, more coding in my opinion.

Spend more resources on actual improvements to jobs, not making the lettering look nicer.

And life sucks at the moment for me, I hate my birthday.

[Atomic_Skull]

One thing they didn't mention in the notes was that FFXI config now has support for exact rendering resolutions. They added 2048x2048 but they also added the same standard desktop resolutions supported by the "Overlay" resolution setting to the "Background" setting as well. This means you can now set Overlay and Background to (for example) 1440x900 / 1440x900 without having to edit the registry.

However, if you want exact double resolution you still need to edit the registry. They should have just changed it so that "Background" is a fraction of the Overlay. e.g. Quarter, Half, Two Thirds, Full, and Double. Or better yet just get rid of the "less than full" resolutions entirely and just replace the "Background" setting with a "Full scene supersampling" checkbox. I don't think anyone needs to use a rendering resolution lower than the screen resolution, or ever did for that matter. Even on a Geforce3 I was running it at 800x600 for both.

Also, in the update notes they call it "Backbuffer" (which is more descriptive) but in the config it's still called "Background". They should just change it to "Resolution" and "Buffer" like FFXIV calls this because it makes it more apparent what the settings actually do.

[Alhanelem]

Less artwork, more coding in my opinion.

Spend more resources on actual improvements to jobs, not making the lettering look nicer.

And life sucks at the moment for me, I hate my birthday.
Improvements are improvements. Changing textures has zero impact on writing code. ZERO. you just swap one file for another. Tweaking a few graphics was hardly the meat and potatoes of this update.

[Atomic_Skull]

Improvements are improvements. Changing textures has zero impact on writing code. ZERO. you just swap one file for another. Tweaking a few graphics was hardly the meat and potatoes of this update.

But what about the PS2 users?

Will somebody please think of the PS2 users?

[Korpg]

Improvements are improvements. Changing textures has zero impact on writing code. ZERO. you just swap one file for another. Tweaking a few graphics was hardly the meat and potatoes of this update.

Still a waste of time to spend "tweaking" visuals when such horrid conditions with pet jobs still exist. Only DRG and PUP can take partial effects from haste, BSTs have the best and only viable "cure" for their pets, and the automation AIs are about as smart as a melee Summoner soloing anything harder than EM. And we have let the company know about the lack of actual improvements to pet jobs, and still, every update, there is little or no improvements for pet jobs at all. More improvements for jobs that are already broken, more improvements that will lead to only one strategy (which most of us already use) and Square's continual path in this matter will lead us to two different types of people: Gimps and Skilled. We already have that system in place, but the differences continue to get farther apart. Skilled players continue to hit 1k-4.5k per hit while the gimp players swing a weapon thinking that they own the world and make "discoveries" that better people have done before them, while contributing nothing to the party except less MP for the healers.

I thought this direction that SE is taking FFXI is towards blurring the line of skilled/gimp players at 75 to when they reach 99, not making it more clear. Where is the fun when you got a newbie telling everyone that they can beat an emp weapon by having a weaker weapon and pet melee at the same time?


But what about the PS2 users?

Will somebody please think of the PS2 users?

PS2 limitations.

You dug your own grave, now lie in it.

[Mordanthos]

I have a better idea. Who cares what our icons look like. How about give us mini icons near our party window so our WHM or RDM, (or whatever the hell can remove that type of status effect), can identify it without screaming in vent for 10 seconds, or typing in party 300 times before someone removes it.

This only applys to status effects, no buffs would appear down here. Only debuffs

[Alhanelem]

But what about the PS2 users?

Will somebody please think of the PS2 users?
No. 12345678


Still a waste of time to spend "tweaking" visuals when such horrid conditions with pet jobs still exist.It's not a "waste of time." And doing this does not prevent them from addressing "horrid conditions with pet jobs and bla bla bla bla."

Please, give me a break. I'm sorry you had a bad day or whatever, but you're really being silly here. It doesnt matter what else they do, you're never going to be satisfied. Many people would like visual upgrades in addition to mechanical tweaks. Should they not get what they want just because you have this list of demands?

[Atomic_Skull]

Improvements are improvements. Changing textures has zero impact on writing code. ZERO. you just swap one file for another. Tweaking a few graphics was hardly the meat and potatoes of this update.

He doesn't understand how a game development studio works. The guys that do textures models etc. have nothing to do with systems and coding and not working on textures and models would just mean they sit around the offices drinking coffee and browsing the internet all day. They are also on salary so you can't save money by not having them work.

[Alhanelem]

he's just in a bad mood and trolling or something. I mean, really. is upgrading the resolution of a few icons that are like 16x16 or something like that to say 32x32 really that much of a challenge? I could do that in MS paint for all the icons in a few hours or less, and I'm no game designer, programmer or artist. And I'm one person.

The amount of time things like this take away from anything else is minimal to none.

[Yugl]

It's more than aesthetics if SE allows you to distinguish between buffs. Did I forget to mention that having barfire is the same as having phalanx?!

[Dallas]

And life sucks at the moment for me, I hate my birthday.

Well you are still obsessing over me, some random forum poster that won't tell you who they are, in EVERY thread. Clearly you have this whole "life" thing figured out. Happy birthday!

[Razushu]

Well you are still obsessing over me, some random forum poster that won't tell you who they are, in EVERY thread. Clearly you have this whole "life" thing figured out. Happy birthday!

He just wants to know what server you're on so he can NEVER group with you ever, like everyone else here

[Korpg]

It's not a "waste of time." And doing this does not prevent them from addressing "horrid conditions with pet jobs and bla bla bla bla."

Please, give me a break. I'm sorry you had a bad day or whatever, but you're really being silly here. It doesnt matter what else they do, you're never going to be satisfied. Many people would like visual upgrades in addition to mechanical tweaks. Should they not get what they want just because you have this list of demands?

Ok, here is a scenario for you.

Company has 500,000 of that country's currency to spend on improving their product. They want to keep their customers, because their product is on the decline in it's product life cycle. They know that there is one complaint that their current customers want changed. They instead spend half the money to make the box look prettier. Is that a waste of resource? Yes.

Now, I'm not saying that the example is Square Enix, but like everyone else, they have a specific budget for this game, and spending money to make the "box look pretty" is a waste when there are technical issues their paying customers have brought to their attention, or at least it would be brought to their attention if they actually read their own "forum" instead of picking one/two things that people have mentioned....

What exactly does the ascetic changes do to this game in terms of customer retention? Absolutely nothing! What would fixing known issues do to this game in terms of customer retention? Increase it by a marginal percentage, but it is still an increase! For any products on the way to an inevitable death, any retention should be the company's top priority!

But that is intermediate business knowledge here, most of you guys wouldn't know stuff like this.

[Korpg]

Well you are still obsessing over me, some random forum poster that won't tell you who they are, in EVERY thread. Clearly you have this whole "life" thing figured out. Happy birthday!

How can I be obsessing over you when you follow me like a lost little puppy. I don't have any food, shoo!

[Sparthos]

Honestly when I saw all these random aesthetic upgrades, I wondered were the practical solutions were.

You know, things like making each roll/song look different (dice + small AF hat icon to denote which job roll is on) along with icons like zerk which look no different than other attack boosting icons. Barspells are impossible to tell apart without toggling through them, status effects are still unable to be seen on players/monsters etc etc.

If some of this is impossible due to console limitations, it'd be great if we knew upfront.

I appreciate all the little graphical upgrades but honestly who cares if the FFXI title screen looks better? Who is on that screen for more than 10 seconds before logging in?

[Korpg]

Honestly when I saw all these random aesthetic upgrades, I wondered were the practical solutions were.

You know, things like making each roll/song look different (dice + small AF hat icon to denote which job roll is on) along with icons like zerk which look no different than other attack boosting icons. Barspells are impossible to tell apart without toggling through them, status effects are still unable to be seen on players/monsters etc etc.

If some of this is impossible due to console limitations, it'd be great if we knew upfront.

I appreciate all the little graphical upgrades but honestly who cares if the FFXI title screen looks better? Who is on that screen for more than 10 seconds before logging in?

Ok, I can see useful ascetic changes like improved status icons that Al has proposed, it at least cuts off 3 seconds of finding out what you have with either Berserk, Blood Rage, Aggressor, Retaliation, Warcry, Restraint or Stalwart's Tonic on. Improving on the lettering on the title screen is a waste of time for one programmer to "fix."

Icons that all look alike should at least be separated by color so we know what the icon is. Give us that option at least so we can choose to enable it or not.

And work on the things that need to be worked on, like Automation AI and Blood Pact timers!

[Eric]

Obviously Korpg is the best person to tell SE what to do. He obviously knows the inner workings of developing an MMO. Also he's so smart that he made up a new way to spell "Aesthetic".

Gimme a break. New status icons wouldn't kill anyone, and as someone said earlier, the people who make the textures are on a salary. They still get paid whether or not they do anything. They're not programmers. They don't do the same job as the people who adjust the game balance.

[Alhanelem]

wall of text
I have a fair understanding of buiness. Please, stop trolling. What you think improves customer retention is entirely your opinion. In reality, any kind of improvement or adjustment. improves customer retention.

Improving the buff icons in particular goes beyond asthetics as many buff icons are ambiguous and some different icons such as HP or MP up/down are actually different but look almost the same to where it's hard to tell.

If the game looked less like it was made 10 years ago, it would gain more new players. People who know nothing about the game systems can't learn them effectively from screenshots and trailers, which are the things that woo people toward a game.

Regardless of all of that, this is a case where you can have your cake and eat it too. We can get our better buff icons and you can still get your fixes. Under your ideas and policies, these sorts of improvements that do get asked for will never happen, because there will always be issues to fix. Go play some MUDs if mechanics are the only thing you care about at all. They have percisely zero graphics, you get to use your imagination even!. Those of us who like video games would likes some better video to go with our game.

We can argue about resources all day, but the fact of the matter is just because you don't want something doesn't mean it shouldn't be implemented.

[Korpg]

Obviously Korpg is the best person to tell SE what to do. He obviously knows the inner workings of developing an MMO. Also he's so smart that he made up a new way to spell "Aesthetic".

Gimme a break. New status icons wouldn't kill anyone, and as someone said earlier, the people who make the textures are on a salary. They still get paid whether or not they do anything. They're not programmers. They don't do the same job as the people who adjust the game balance.

We are the best people to tell SE what to do. Not just me, but everyone. Why you ask? Because we are paying customers. Also, spelling is not my strong suit, so sue me.

I'm not saying that they won't kill the game, I'm saying that there are more important things to do than to make this game look pretty. Yeah, they may be on a salary, but could that money used to pay that artist go towards an additional programmer to help fix the coding? I'm not saying that they need to get rid of all artists, but they need to set priorities straight for a dying product. Who cares about how the title page looks? You spend a whole 2 seconds on it.


I have a fair understanding of buiness. Please, stop trolling. What you think improves customer retention is entirely your opinion. In reality, any kind of improvement or adjustment. improves customer retention.

Improving the buff icons in particular goes beyond asthetics as many buff icons are ambiguous and some different icons such as HP or MP up/down are actually different but look almost the same to where it's hard to tell.

If the game looked less like it was made 10 years ago, it would gain more new players. People who know nothing about the game systems can't learn them effectively from screenshots and trailers, which are the things that woo people toward a game.

Regardless of all of that, this is a case where you can have your cake and eat it too. We can get our better buff icons and you can still get your fixes. Under your ideas and policies, these sorts of improvements that do get asked for will never happen, because there will always be issues to fix. Go play some MUDs if mechanics are the only thing you care about at all. They have percisely zero graphics, you get to use your imagination even!. Those of us who like video games would likes some better video to go with our game.

We can argue about resources all day, but the fact of the matter is just because you don't want something doesn't mean it shouldn't be implemented.

I'm trolling because I disagree with you? I'm trolling because I have a different opinion on priorities when it comes to this product? I think you need to understand what an "internet troll" is.

I agree with you about any types of improvements help maintain customer retention, but making the title page nicer is not an improvement, it is a painting. Paintings don't do anything but make the area look better, they don't help write program codes or solve puzzles or do anything besides looking pretty. Like a trophy wife.

These improvements should be looked upon as "pet projects" by developers as something to do on their free time, hence not when they have better and more important things to do. A hobby, as you may call it. Not something to be considered and done before any major improvements, but with major improvements! Title page art improvements should be an addition to other major improvements like level cap increases or fixing jobs that need fixing. Not something that takes priority and has to be done for minor updates like this.

I'm sorry that we disagree, but as to reference you, stop trolling.

[Atomic_Skull]

Ok, here is a scenario for you.

Company has 500,000 of that country's currency to spend on improving their product. They want to keep their customers, because their product is on the decline in it's product life cycle. They know that there is one complaint that their current customers want changed. They instead spend half the money to make the box look prettier. Is that a waste of resource? Yes.

Now, I'm not saying that the example is Square Enix, but like everyone else, they have a specific budget for this game, and spending money to make the "box look pretty" is a waste when there are technical issues their paying customers have brought to their attention, or at least it would be brought to their attention if they actually read their own "forum" instead of picking one/two things that people have mentioned....

What exactly does the ascetic changes do to this game in terms of customer retention? Absolutely nothing! What would fixing known issues do to this game in terms of customer retention? Increase it by a marginal percentage, but it is still an increase! For any products on the way to an inevitable death, any retention should be the company's top priority!

But that is intermediate business knowledge here, most of you guys wouldn't know stuff like this.

Example doesn't fit because that's not how game development works. The artists are on salary and you'll spend as much on paying them no matter what they're doing. And they are artists not programmers so you can't just move the personnel over to coding.

[Korpg]

Example doesn't fit because that's not how game development works. The artists are on salary and you'll spend as much on paying them no matter what they're doing. And they are artists not programmers so you can't just move the personnel over to coding.

But you can fire the artists and hire more programmers.

It is called reorganizing your staff. All companies do it, including Square-Enix.

Why have 3 or more artists when they don't even do anything 90% of the time? One artist is enough for this game.

[Eric]

But you can fire the artists and hire more programmers.

It is called reorganizing your staff. All companies do it, including Square-Enix.

Why have 3 or more artists when they don't even do anything 90% of the time? One artist is enough for this game.

Sure, let's fire someone who could be designing the new material that's coming over the next year, just because you don't want the status icons to be updated.

Do you realize how stupid you sound? You have no idea how the FFXI team is composed. None of us do.

[Vicious]

Why have 3 or more artists when they don't even do anything 90% of the time? One artist is enough for this game.

Yeah, y'know, you're right; FFXI would be way better without new gear/weapon/furniture/item/spell/icon/npc/weaponskill/etc. designs for the rest of the game's life. With such brilliant ideas, why haven't they made you a dev yet?

[Ravenmore]

The graphics reboot seemed to do help WoW, or people really like cartoons.

[Sargent]

New icons is way overdue, it's like SE added 20 status icons to the game.

[Panthera]

I agree with the OP.

Many Icons do look similar, if not identical.

The Utsusemi Icons changes were a good thing, as was Third Eye. The Icons should get an overhaul such that no two icons look identical. A little similarity isn't too bad, but icons that look that same that mean different things is just confusing.

Biggest, most important change FFXI needs? No, but far from trivial, and thanks for bringing it up; it's worth discussion, and what's more, attention from devs.

[Sesh]

Here's the thing though if you have ever re-skinned .dats or HQ'd them you know that even with unofficial software it would take maybe 7 minutes to HQ a status icon. So you're looking at less than a half a day easily to HQ all of the status icons, recolor, create new ones, and still take a nice long break for lunch. Acting like a few hours work would be taking away from the games "Big Needs" is just silly.

I would love to see them commission out .dat re-skinning work (I know they never would) however if they commissioned someone like Mooshywooshy from (dead) ffxidats we could probably have icons, AF1/2/3 all HQ'd in a week.

[Korpg]

So you guys are saying that it takes more than one "artist" to design and create such awesome gearsets like Teal, Aurore, and Peale armors? Or the emp armors? It takes more than one "artist" 6 months plus to create all these designs and stuff?

It takes more than one "artist" to spend 3 months redesigning a title page?

Or that the artwork done for this recent update was worth the entire art staff of Square Enix's time? We really got our money for the work put into...well...nothing?

I'm not saying that they need to get rid of their art department, I'm saying that they aren't being effective for doing nothing but reskins of old gear. Might as well fire half the art staff and hire more programmers to fix problems they are obviously having trouble fixing.

[Alhanelem]

But you can fire the artists and hire more programmers.Yeah, those damn artists. Always using up our money for no good reason. Fire the lot of em!

Give me a godforsaken break. If you were running this game, it wouldn't have graphics at all. it would just be a text based game.

After I made the suggestion, it probably took them 5 minutes to fetch the orgiinal master logo and use it to replace the low-res copy in the dats. I'm so sorry I delayed your patch by 5 minutes. I know graphics aren't everything (personally I think good music is one of the most valuable and underappriciated things in any video game), but it's something that's worth improving.

If the game is so riddled with problems to you, maybe you'd be better off playing a game that's more polished. It's not like SE hasn't had 8 years to get it right.

Many other older MMOs have recieved graphical overhauls over the years, and these did not interfere with their ability to release new content or balance changes. D&D online came out not that long after FFXI, and it's recieved MULTIPLE graphical overhauls, including adding directX 9 and 10 support. If SE REALLY wanted to, they could do stuff like this. The real problem here is SE not wanting to commit too much in resources to this game even though it's making money for them, and that even if they wanted to devote more resources, they feel like they can't do a whole lot because of the PS2 which they feel they need to maintain support for for some reason.

[Sesh]

Hiring and Firing isn't the issue though SE is the 9th largest game company in the world. I think that if they needed to hire more programmers it wouldn't bother them, certainly not to the extent of having to fire ppl to pay the salary. I think it's more about a disconnect or a stubborn mentality on SE's part. They are not really concerned about FFXI anymore, yes it makes them money but they have tons n tons of other sources for money. If they wanted to I would wager they could put a team the same size as 14s or bigger without a sweat but they won't because the coding is old, they're too involved in other projects, and XI is riddled with so many problems that they are content to do mini version updates all the way until the game dies. So in the meantime at least they can give us a better looking game since it's obvious 80% of the changes the player base asks for aren't gonna get done.

[Rafien]

But what about the PS2 users?

Will somebody please think of the PS2 users?


We're thinking about the ps2 users.. Get a new system and stop holding FFXI back!

[Korpg]

Yeah, those damn artists. Always using up our money for good reason. Fire the lot of em!

Give me a godforsaken break. If you were running this game, it wouldn't have graphics at all. it would just be a text based game.

Nice assumption.

I didn't say fire all artists, I even said that they should fire some to free up the money for more developers and programmers to help make this a better game. You are assuming that I said fire all artists. You need to read the whole post before jumping the gun.

I know the benefits of having an art department for a game, but considering that their latest "great contribution" is a nicer title page, I don't see the point in having as many artists there now. One artist could do that work in the month between updates. Can you honestly say that the art department has earned their keep with this last update?

[Alhanelem]

It's already a fine game. They don't need to revamp their staff to keep it that way.


One artist could do that work in the month between updates.You're absolutely right, and it likely didn't interfere with any of the other changes in any way whatsoever.

Really- You probably have no idea how small the art team most likely is- just a few people probably. Working with older technology, even when creating new items, it doesn't take 1/5th as long to create even a new model and textures compared to a more modern game like FFXIV (Where Yoshida menitioned a single full armor set can take up to 6 months to create)

You also need to remember that these guys make the new items and gear that are the meat and potatoes of any major update.

quoting myself because I doubt you saw it.

Many other older MMOs have recieved graphical overhauls over the years, and these did not interfere with their ability to release new content or balance changes. D&D online came out not that long after FFXI, and it's recieved MULTIPLE graphical overhauls, including adding directX 9 and 10 support. If SE REALLY wanted to, they could do stuff like this. The real problem here is SE not wanting to commit too much in resources to this game even though it's making money for them, and that even if they wanted to devote more resources, they feel like they can't do a whole lot because of the PS2 which they feel they need to maintain support for for some reason.

Instead of reorganizing, they should simply devote more resources to the game that's making them money. I won't knock FFXIV and I know they really want to turn it around and they think they can do it, but it shouldn't come at the expense of damaging what's actually bringing in the bacon.

[Korpg]

Hiring and Firing isn't the issue though SE is the 9th largest game company in the world. I think that if they needed to hire more programmers it wouldn't bother them, certainly not to the extent of having to fire ppl to pay the salary. I think it's more about a disconnect or a stubborn mentality on SE's part. They are not really concerned about FFXI anymore, yes it makes them money but they have tons n tons of other sources for money. If they wanted to I would wager they could put a team the same size as 14s or bigger without a sweat but they won't because the coding is old, they're too involved in other projects, and XI is riddled with so many problems that they are content to do mini version updates all the way until the game dies. So in the meantime at least they can give us a better looking game since it's obvious 80% of the changes the player base asks for aren't gonna get done.

I know its not about the money, it is about the budget put into this game.

For this game to be successful in the future, Square has to plan ahead. One of Square's tools to plan ahead is a budget, and having a set amount for development costs. I'm suggesting that they take some of the funding from the art department and put it into development costs for future updates. The art department has been very lackluster lately on updates, and unless they are developing a whole new set of zones for gameplay, they are not earning their keep as far as I'm concerned.

[Alhanelem]

Again, you don't seem to realize that its going to take more than fixing bugs to keep people interested. They want new content, new features, new pretty looking gear. You need programmers, project managers, and also the artists to make that happen. All of it is important as a whole, even if only one piece of it is important to you.

[Korpg]

You're absolutely right, and it likely didn't interfere with any of the other changes in any way whatsoever.

Opportunity costs. Example: You have 10 bucks, do you go see the movie or go get something to eat. What you are giving up is the opportunity cost, if you go watch the movie, you miss getting something to eat (cost). They have limited resources for this game, remember that.


Really- You probably have no idea how small the art team most likely is- just a few people probably. Working with older technology, even when creating new items, it doesn't take 1/5th as long to create even a new model and textures compared to a more modern game like FFXIV (Where Yoshida menitioned a single full armor set can take up to 6 months to create) Even if they have 2 people, one of them is still being a waste of space. You admitted that also.


You also need to remember that these guys make the new items and gear that are the meat and potatoes of any major update. They make the skins for the new gear, which 90% of the time are just reskins of older gear. 1 person, seriously, one person could make those 3 new sets of Aztec armor in less than a week.

Instead of reorganizing, they should simply devote more resources to the game that's making them money. I won't knock FFXIV and I know they really want to turn it around and they think they can do it, but it shouldn't come at the expense of damaging what's actually bringing in the bacon.

That is what I'm saying! Instead of paying 2+ "artists" a salary each month, fire half and spend the money on other things, like fixing programming bugs and developing newer content (heck, you can transfer the "artists" to the development stage, and then they would be useful again).

[Korpg]

Again, you don't seem to realize that its going to take more than fixing bugs to keep people interested. They want new content, new features, new pretty looking gear. You need programmers, project managers, and also the artists to make that happen. All of it is important as a whole, even if only one piece of it is important to you.

Why do you assume that I'm saying to get rid of the entire department? I'm saying spend the money that is being wasted on something more productive.

[Alhanelem]

It's entirely your opinion what's "more productive."

To me, a total overhaul of the visual experience would be extremely productive. But since the people who work on stuff other than the visuals would still be there, it doesn't have to come totally at the expense of technical immprovements.

They can have their cake and eat it too, they just need to be willing to invest a little more in their baby.

[Korpg]

That's fine by me. Gives those "artists" something to do with their time.

Think they are going to do it?

[Eric]

I don't know why people haven't pointed out how arrogant it makes you look to assume that you know the inner workings of the FFXI staff.

You make it seem like they would need one artist specifically just to update the status icons. Your signature obviously points out that you have no taste. Aesthetics are important for some people, stop trying to ruin it for the rest of us.

[Unleashhell]

Ok, here is a scenario for you.

Company has 500,000 of that country's currency to spend on improving their product. They want to keep their customers, because their product is on the decline in it's product life cycle. They know that there is one complaint that their current customers want changed. They instead spend half the money to make the box look prettier. Is that a waste of resource? Yes.

Actually no it isn't. You go shopping for food, and companies will put on the packaging "New and Improved" and they not only change the product but change the packaging. Does it work? you bet it does otherwise companies wouldn't have been doing it for a century. Its all marketing to attract customers or keep current customers buying their product.

Doing subtle changes to the game such as icons, fonts etc helps step up the game visually. I know I like all the graphical improvements to the game and I am hoping to see a lot more. I do not understand how people can say the artists are doing nothing. Do you realize when you make new armor for instance, its not just ok this is what it looks like and bam its done. You have to create that armor on each race type, and then do the full motions of that armor such as running, casting magic, swinging a weapon. All of that takes time, they aren't just sitting around doing nothing. Ask anyone who does graphic artwork that has to wrap textures around a wire frame and they will tell you how long it takes.

Keep up the nice visuals SE!!

[Korpg]

I don't know why people haven't pointed out how arrogant it makes you look to assume that you know the inner workings of the FFXI staff.

You make it seem like they would need one artist specifically just to update the status icons. Your signature obviously points out that you have no taste. Aesthetics are important for some people, stop trying to ruin it for the rest of us.

How many people do you think it takes to group of icons in a month? Seriously, how many?

How many people would it take to draw a few pictures of 100 icons in a month?

Seriously, I show an opinion and you guys think its gospel. That you think that it will become what I say because I'm showing everyone my opinion with basis behind it.

Few of you guys actually convinced me that people really want the makeup and junk, but I still don't think that the amount of money Square Enix puts for art per month is worth what they are getting back. Nobody here has proven that the artwork made in the last 3 months is worth the money invested.

That is my point. You can have all the pretty flowers in the world, but if they don't work for what is intended, what is the point in having them and spending the money for them?

[Eric]

[Removed by Moderator according to the FINAL FANTASY XI FORUM Guidelines (http://support.na.square-enix.com/rule.php?id=20&la=1).] You're implying that SE hires one artist specifically to work on the status icons, or that they will have to hire one just to update them. Why can't SE use one of the artists that already does work for the game and ask him to make icons?

I'm pretty sure that they're keeping at least one artist around. It's pretty common sense that a game for which new content is being developed would need artists. Asking one of them to update the icons wouldn't cost any money. At most it would cost a few hours of their time. If the artists for FFXI aren't doing anything impressive, as you say, then why not make them do some work to justify hiring them? New job abilities are coming with the cap increase, so are new weapon skills(I would presume). [Removed by Moderator according to the FINAL FANTASY XI FORUM Guidelines (http://support.na.square-enix.com/rule.php?id=20&la=1).]

[Removed by Moderator according to the FINAL FANTASY XI FORUM Guidelines (http://support.na.square-enix.com/rule.php?id=20&la=1).] They're smarter than that.

[AyinDygra]

Just thought I'd throw this in here...
A 3 part interview with the effects team, Translated over at JPbutton.
(the effects team handles the icons too, as stated in part one of the interview)

The most interesting quotes, related to this discussion:

Hatae: For anything that is displayed in the game in Japanese, we also have to make it in the 3 other languages. Requests for new status icons are also often made to the Effects Team for some reason. (laughs) Things relating to the User Interface and menus are handled by Producer Tanaka though. The status icons made by the Effects Team are the ones you see at the top of your screen.

–How many people are on the Effects Team?

Hatae: Right now it’s the 3 of us.

–Can you tell us in detail what the 3 of you are each in charge of?

Hatae: The battle effects aren’t really handled by any one person. For backgrounds, we decide who will be in charge of each area and that person is responsible for all the effects needed there. We only use one effect designer per area so that the scenery has a uniform look to it.

Tsutsui: Lately, the three of us have been diving the work between us.

–For a game of this scale, I was expecting there would be more people.

Hatae: It’s been the three of us since around the latter part of production for WotG.

–Was the team larger before?

Hatae: No…. It’s always been around 3 to 4 members with people changing positions.

–You mentioned before that you make the status icons. Now there are a lot of different ones but in the past there weren’t very many. For example, the icon for Utsusemi was just the regular enhancing magic icon. Why did it change?

Tashiro: That was a request from one of the planners.

Tsutsui: We don’t really put forth the idea to change things. It’s mostly us meeting the requests of the planners when they have them.

Hatae: They get changed if there is an opportunity for it.


Part 1 (http://www.jpbutton.com/?p=1954)
Part 2 (http://www.jpbutton.com/?p=2324)
Part 3 (http://jpbutton.bluegartr.com/?p=2535)

[Korpg]

[Removed by Moderator according to the FINAL FANTASY XI FORUM Guidelines (http://support.na.square-enix.com/rule.php?id=20&la=1).] You're implying that SE hires one artist specifically to work on the status icons, or that they will have to hire one just to update them. Why can't SE use one of the artists that already does work for the game and ask him to make icons?

I'm pretty sure that they're keeping at least one artist around. It's pretty common sense that a game for which new content is being developed would need artists. Asking one of them to update the icons wouldn't cost any money. At most it would cost a few hours of their time. If the artists for FFXI aren't doing anything impressive, as you say, then why not make them do some work to justify hiring them? New job abilities are coming with the cap increase, so are new weapon skills(I would presume).

[Removed by Moderator according to the FINAL FANTASY XI FORUM Guidelines (http://support.na.square-enix.com/rule.php?id=20&la=1).]

They're smarter than that.

[Removed by Moderator according to the FINAL FANTASY XI FORUM Guidelines (http://support.na.square-enix.com/rule.php?id=20&la=1).]

I did not imply that SE should hire artists, I'm saying that the artists they currently have have not done much for this game in recent months, and I was questioning Square Enix's decision in keeping such artists on the payroll instead of spending the money on something else that needs to be done.

We all know that there is at least one "artist" on board. Have they contributed much in the past year? Yes, they gave us nice looking weaponskills up until December, but it is now July and we don't have anything new to see except shiny weapons, Aztec armor, and better lettering (which they probably did not do anything). Is that really 6 and a half months worth of work there? 5 and a half if you want to take away the month lost during the earthquake in Japan.

[Removed by Moderator according to the FINAL FANTASY XI FORUM Guidelines (http://support.na.square-enix.com/rule.php?id=20&la=1).]

[Midorikaze]

Probably a little off-topic but still in the visuals department. It would be great if the character selection screen was actually widescreen-friendly. It's weird seeing everything stretched horizontally so my characters all gain about 50lbs each. I know it's just the character select area but it's been a gripe of mine for quite some time - maybe animate them a little, I don't know...They look a little stiff. Just sayin'... :o

I am liking the new look of the status icons, a bit smoother. Making them easier to distinguish different effects (for those different status effects represented by the same icon) would be a big plus. Not to mention the higher-rez names are most welcome. :)

[Alhanelem]

It's an aspect ratio issue @ above. For some reason the aspect ratio setting (and a lot of other settings) are character specific and don't get used until you log in.

[Midorikaze]

I can see how that would mess things up...lol

[OMEGA_HACK]

/shameless bump

Also, would like to agree, that with updates the status icons we get a plethora of updated (new looking) status icons. I was actually doing the Early Bird Catches the Worm KSNM99 just now and I saw I had 6 of those weird gray shield with a red line through it buff icons...A little more variety doesn't hurt.