PDA

View Full Version : Fix to the Number of Macro Lines.



Tsukino_Kaji
07-08-2011, 05:32 AM
I know I brought this idea up before, but it was in other threads and it was usualy lost admist the mediocrity. We all understand why SE is reluctant to increase the number of lines in a macro, as it would increase the likelyhood of botting and/or RMT activity. This is a very valid concern for them. Oh the other side of the coin, I think they fail to grasp the significance we place on the ability to condence macros that swap gear for such-and-such reason. So my idea, my "fix" that will adress SE's concerns and get us players what we want is as follows;

A Toggle Switch.
How this feature will work is that each macro will have a botton on it that toggles it from the standard macro to a 16 line macro.(Yes a 16 line one, don't be afraid of the size SE.) This now toggled macro will have pre-assigned(And undeletable.) at the start of every line the command text /equip. This will enable your toggle macro to be used for gear and gear only. This will invalidate for the use of other command macros and help players to further streamline their ammount of macro space.

Zagen
07-08-2011, 06:24 AM
You do realize it is 6 lines because of the screen resolution on the PS2 and non HD 360/PS3 right?

Edit: Which the games looks like crap in :D

Zyeriis
07-08-2011, 06:29 AM
You do realize it is 6 lines because of the screen resolution on the PS2 and non HD 360/PS3 right?

Edit: Which the games looks like crap in :D

Read his sig.

Edit: Also, there's something called scrolling.

Second Edit: Alternate idea could be to allow a multiple gear swap with one macro line (text input parameter increase for /equip). Example: /equip "main" "Jupiter's Staff" "sub" "Thunder Strap"

The limitation I see here would be text space but, it would at least be a step in the right direction, as we would be able to change all of our equipment slots in one macro.

Zagen
07-08-2011, 06:33 AM
Read his sig.

Edit: Also, there's something called scrolling.
I know about the Sig doesn't change the reasons given are flawed. If you want to bot use a bot program or write a script to auto loop text inputs takes maybe an hour of learning programming to write a key input bot.

And it still has nothing to do with game functionality due to UI layout restraints

Zyeriis
07-08-2011, 06:36 AM
I know about the Sig doesn't change the reasons given are flawed. If you want to bot use a bot program or write a script to auto loop text inputs takes maybe an hour of learning programming to write a key input bot.

And it still has nothing to do with game functionality due to UI layout restraints
Saying he cares little about the limitations about the ps2 (no one should) and isn't putting that into the idea. He's posting the idea while neglecting/ignoring the ps2, like it should be, so it dies and we can move on.

Zagen
07-08-2011, 06:39 AM
Saying he cares little about the limitations about the ps2 (no one should) and isn't putting that into the idea. He's posting the idea while neglecting/ignoring the ps2, like it should be, so it dies and we can move on.

And the official response will simply be "PS2 Limitations" ignore it all you want SE isn't which should be obvious.

Edit: Don't get me wrong I have a distaste for the limitations of the PS2 that hold this game back but then again I have that same feeling toward the 360/PS3 as they unnecessarily limit the lifespan of the game. Ignoring something so basic as the layout for non HD resolution is the biggest reason macros were designed the way they are gives SE an easy way to say "won't fix" because unless they already have plans for a given suggestion or it is easy to implement they aren't adding/fixing it.

Zumi
07-08-2011, 07:54 AM
They already said they won't add more macro lines simply because the fact is PS2 doesn't have enough RAM to support longer macros. They want gameplay to be equal across all platforms remember.

Seriha
07-08-2011, 09:37 AM
Still fond of the "equip set" idea where the user can create a set that can swap the 16 possible slots with the macro itself being something like '/equipset "rdm_fast_cast"' or '/equipset "thf_evasion"' that you can custom name and modify at will. Far as PS2 RAM or even HD space goes, that can be a non-issue with the equip sets being saved server-side where the proper macro then invokes all the stored gear swaps or querying the set status from whatever management menu sends you the list for equipment not unlike the current equipment screen.

In the end, the ideal macro might look something like:
/equipset "war_ws_ragingrush"
/ws "Raging Rush" <t>
/wait 1
/equipset "war_tp"

...instead of hitting like 8 buttons to do one thing normally.

Babygyrl
07-08-2011, 11:07 AM
You do realize it is 6 lines because of the screen resolution on the PS2 and non HD 360/PS3 right?

Edit: Which the games looks like crap in :D


I play on 360 full time and you can easily fit at least 2 more lines per macro.. it sucks that pc peopel can use windower macros and fit al there crap in oner macro when i need three just to put on all my gear ws then put on other gear :(

Babygyrl
07-08-2011, 11:08 AM
Still fond of the "equip set" idea where the user can create a set that can swap the 16 possible slots with the macro itself being something like '/equipset "rdm_fast_cast"' or '/equipset "thf_evasion"' that you can custom name and modify at will. Far as PS2 RAM or even HD space goes, that can be a non-issue with the equip sets being saved server-side where the proper macro then invokes all the stored gear swaps or querying the set status from whatever management menu sends you the list for equipment not unlike the current equipment screen.

In the end, the ideal macro might look something like:
/equipset "war_ws_ragingrush"
/ws "Raging Rush" <t>
/wait 1
/equipset "war_tp"

...instead of hitting like 8 buttons to do one thing normally.

would love this!

Zagen
07-08-2011, 11:33 AM
I play on 360 full time and you can easily fit at least 2 more lines per macro.. it sucks that pc peopel can use windower macros and fit al there crap in oner macro when i need three just to put on all my gear ws then put on other gear :(

Been a few years since I've had the game on 360 but this is what it looks like on PC at a 640x480 Resolution (http://lootnscoot.heckgames.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/ffxi-640x480.jpg), or in other words PS2/nonHD TV resolution. Dunno about you but that looks like you can fit 1 line at best and that's kind of a stretch. Not to mention as it is you can barely see what's going on behind the menus and Macros are a menu I see as being updated on the fly during active gameplay meaning losing 80%~ of visibility is bad UI design already. That said there isn't much SE could have done better with the macro menu for console.

Edit: This is an awesome idea:



Still fond of the "equip set" idea where the user can create a set that can swap the 16 possible slots with the macro itself being something like '/equipset "rdm_fast_cast"' or '/equipset "thf_evasion"' that you can custom name and modify at will. Far as PS2 RAM or even HD space goes, that can be a non-issue with the equip sets being saved server-side where the proper macro then invokes all the stored gear swaps or querying the set status from whatever management menu sends you the list for equipment not unlike the current equipment screen.

In the end, the ideal macro might look something like:
/equipset "war_ws_ragingrush"
/ws "Raging Rush" <t>
/wait 1
/equipset "war_tp"

...instead of hitting like 8 buttons to do one thing normally.

Tagrineth
07-08-2011, 11:40 AM
What I think SE could do to streamline gear swapping would be simply to make "pre-baked" macros that change gear only (or make a new macro palette where you can designate equipment sets like Seriha suggested) - where instead of just getting chatlog lines to put /commands into, you can only type in gear names, with the slots listed to the left of the boxes. So it'd be like


[ALT1] Equipment List
Main [_________________]
Sub [_________________]
Range [_________________]
Ammo [_________________]

etc.

When you complete a gear-list macro and click to save it, have the server parse all gear slots and save the macro using item ID numbers instead of plain text like regular macros.

This would save on memory from the design end, since all it'd have to save is ID#s for the gear. If anything is wrong with the equipment list to where any item ID#s can't be found, just generate an error until the player fixes the mis-typed gear lines.

Zyeriis
07-08-2011, 12:04 PM
Line 1: /equip "main" "Pluto's Staff" "sub" "Dark Grip"
Line 2: /equip "head" "Duelist's Chapeau" "neck" "Estoqueur's Collar"
Line 3: /equip "body" "Estoqueur's Sayon +2" "hands" "Serpentes Cuffs"
Line 4: /equip "legs" "Nisse Slacks" "feet" "Serpentes Sabots"
Line 5: /equip "back" "Vita Cape" "waist" "Austerity Belt"
Line 6: /equip "l.ring" "Celestial Ring" "r.ring" "Celestial Ring"

^ This is generally my idea on how to at least make things better. I do admit that the idea wouldn't be capable of covering every single slot. 3 slots are missing from my example: ranged weapon, left earring, and right earring. However, most jobs (front line jobs) won't likely be swapping weapons, so that would eliminate that as then you would be able to swap all relevant equipment in one macro (-3 slots from the macro since you won't be swapping main, sub, or ranged because you'd lose your tp).

I'm not saying I wouldn't be for adding an equipment set type of command that you can preset in a different menu or something (saved armor sets of some sort). The solution I am proposing in this post (as i did earlier in a secondary edit) is an attempt at being more realistic about what the current dev team might be capable of/willing to look into. In that, it wouldn't be an entirely new function in the game, it would merely be a slight expansion of what is currently in the game, much like they did with the /wait command (allowed it to be used as <wait #> tacked onto the end of a command in a macro string rather than having to waste a line in the macro for such a simple process).

This idea wouldn't affect RAM or anything any more than it already is, nor would there be any "non-hd resolution" complaints.

Atomic_Skull
07-08-2011, 02:46 PM
I know I brought this idea up before, but it was in other threads and it was usualy lost admist the mediocrity. We all understand why SE is reluctant to increase the number of lines in a macro, as it would increase the likelyhood of botting and/or RMT activity. This is a very valid concern for them. Oh the other side of the coin, I think they fail to grasp the significance we place on the ability to condence macros that swap gear for such-and-such reason. So my idea, my "fix" that will adress SE's concerns and get us players what we want is as follows;

A Toggle Switch.
How this feature will work is that each macro will have a botton on it that toggles it from the standard macro to a 16 line macro.(Yes a 16 line one, don't be afraid of the size SE.) This now toggled macro will have pre-assigned(And undeletable.) at the start of every line the command text /equip. This will enable your toggle macro to be used for gear and gear only. This will invalidate for the use of other command macros and help players to further streamline their ammount of macro space.

Why not just add a command called /next that jumps to the next macro set down and continues running lines. That way you can have as many macro lines as you want and they can't be looped. At the end of the last set of lines you'd use the /set command to jump back to the original macro set. This also has the advantage of being able to work on the PS2 because it's basically just a slight variation on the already existing /set command.

Zyeriis
07-08-2011, 03:01 PM
Why not just add a command called /next that jumps to the next macro set down and continues running lines. That way you can have as many macro lines as you want and they can't be looped. At the end of the last set of lines you'd use the /set command to jump back to the original macro set. This also has the advantage of being able to work on the PS2 because it's basically just a slight variation on the already existing /set command.

Automation.

Alhanelem
07-08-2011, 03:11 PM
Many games allow you, independent of actual command macros, to save "Gear sets." While most of the games where i've seen this don't let you swap gear the way FFXI does, it does help you change all of your gear at the same time without having to change everything one at a time. Saved gear sets and a command to switch between them would do the trick without modifying the current macro system; Gear sets could be accessed from the equipment screen and you just add a button wherever to save your current gear in one of some number of save slots.

This preserves the current macro system (which I actually believe is the way it is not just because of the PS2, but because of other design considerations relating to automation) while also solving a common problem players complain about.

Zemzerrett
07-08-2011, 03:58 PM
Line 1: /equip "main" "Pluto's Staff" "sub" "Dark Grip"
Line 2: /equip "head" "Duelist's Chapeau" "neck" "Estoqueur's Collar"
Line 3: /equip "body" "Estoqueur's Sayon +2" "hands" "Serpentes Cuffs"
Line 4: /equip "legs" "Nisse Slacks" "feet" "Serpentes Sabots"
Line 5: /equip "back" "Vita Cape" "waist" "Austerity Belt"
Line 6: /equip "l.ring" "Celestial Ring" "r.ring" "Celestial Ring"

^ This is generally my idea on how to at least make things better. I do admit that the idea wouldn't be capable of covering every single slot. 3 slots are missing from my example: ranged weapon, left earring, and right earring. However, most jobs (front line jobs) won't likely be swapping weapons, so that would eliminate that as then you would be able to swap all relevant equipment in one macro (-3 slots from the macro since you won't be swapping main, sub, or ranged because you'd lose your tp).

I had an idea similar to this, which I posted way back when, on Twitter, when the /wait # command was modified to also be used as <wait #>... would it be possible to the same with /equip? i.e.:

/equip main "Yama's staff +2" <equip sub "Wise Strap"> <equip ammo "Witchstone">

Even dropping the equip so it would be like <sub "Wise Strap"> would be good too.

Doombringer
07-08-2011, 04:36 PM
i don't even care how they do it... i just wanna be able to swap more gear in less macros.... so badly. so very......very badly..

Laraul
07-08-2011, 04:52 PM
The game saves the gear you had equipped when changing your main job. Also, I do not understand why you can't just use /macro set 2 and then trigger the second macro, and then end it with /macro set 0 or whatever your default set is. And the problem with "gear sets" is that the gear has to be in your main inventory. And if you are asking for more macro lines, it means you don't want just to swap gear... you want to multiple swaps before and after you use an ability.

Altogether, there are 24,000 macro lines. The only possible way you can't make 24,000 lines work is if cuz you aren't trying. Get creative. I managed to turn a single macro into a way of both summoning an avatar and allowing me to determine which of three actions for it to perform as the result of my actions during the execution of those "six" lines. It worked both on the 360 and PS2, and even the PC version. And I couldn't swap sets from a macro back then. So stop complaining and start experimenting!

Zyeriis
07-08-2011, 05:21 PM
I had an idea similar to this, which I posted way back when, on Twitter, when the /wait # command was modified to also be used as <wait #>... would it be possible to the same with /equip? i.e.:

/equip main "Yama's staff +2" <equip sub "Wise Strap"> <equip ammo "Witchstone">

Even dropping the equip so it would be like <sub "Wise Strap"> would be good too.

I went and tested the text space before writing that, the most I could fit was 2 pieces of equipment so I went with that in my example. I doubt we'd be able to cram a third piece into one line. That being said, after I wrote the part about <wait #> I came up with the same alternate idea to make it like:
/equip "main" "Jupiter's Staff" <sub "Thunder Strap">

As an addition to this idea, we might be able to fit more it the remove the /equip and replace it with /main "Jupiter's Staff". I see little reason why we need to say "equip" and the slot it goes in, aside from some type of command list amount limitation in RAM like there is with auto translate. Perhaps I'm missing something like some other command that would conflict with this but, I can't think of one.

Atomic_Skull
07-08-2011, 05:24 PM
Automation.

/next would only work in one direction (1 -> 2 -> 3 -> 4 etc.) so automation would not be possible. At the end of your macro set you would use the /set commant to return to the original macro set.

So:

set1 line1 (whatever)
set1 line2 (whatever)
set1 line3 (whatever)
set1 line4 (whatever)
set1 line5 (whatever)
set1 line 6 /next

set2 line 1 (whatever)
set2 line 2 (whatever)
set2 line 3 (whatever)
set2 line 4 (whatever)
set2 line 5 (whatever)
set2 line 6 /set 1


In this example you would have a 10 line macro. /next could also be implemented using the same syntax as the recently added <wait> and a <set> command could be added as well so that you wouldn't have to waste lines on them.

Zyeriis
07-08-2011, 06:05 PM
/next would only work in one direction (1 -> 2 -> 3 -> 4 etc.) so automation would not be possible. At the end of your macro set you would use the /set commant to return to the original macro set.

So:

set1 line1 (whatever)
set1 line2 (whatever)
set1 line3 (whatever)
set1 line4 (whatever)
set1 line5 (whatever)
set1 line 6 /next

set2 line 1 (whatever)
set2 line 2 (whatever)
set2 line 3 (whatever)
set2 line 4 (whatever)
set2 line 5 (whatever)
set2 line 6 /set 1


In this example you would have a 10 line macro. /next could also be implemented using the same syntax as the recently added <wait> and a <set> command could be added as well so that you wouldn't have to waste lines on them.

I'm not sure I follow what you're saying. /next (<next>) would enable 120 line macros. While not exactly automation, it's still borderline. This is, of course, unless you're saying it would only work once and not be able to continue past more than 1 extra macro. If that's the case, I'm not really sure how they could do that when macros are nothing more than lines of text commands unless they put a time/usage limit on how quickly it would become usuable again. However, in that scenario, that might screw us up more than help us when we click a macro thinking it will activate both macros but doesn't because of the restrictive use on /next.

Note: This entire post is based on assumptions and speculation on the quoted information/post. I may be completely off or have not consider a specific angle/context/intent. If that is the case, please disregard everything I just said (after letting me know).

Alhanelem
07-08-2011, 11:43 PM
See my post. Then you could condense all gear swaps into a single line.

Defiledsickness
07-08-2011, 11:56 PM
i support more macro lines!

and even if people do skill up cheats or w/e else you can do by looping macro's endlessly, you still can't solo a chimera or something without being there so idc. i just want to swap all my gear with 1 macro so i can gravity/bind then immediately nuke :) or be able to change gear for every single blu spell using all their slight modifiers. i mean i bought gear for every situation, it shouldn't be a chore just to wear it.

Atomic_Skull
07-09-2011, 08:15 AM
I'm not sure I follow what you're saying. /next (<next>) would enable 120 line macros. While not exactly automation, it's still borderline. This is, of course, unless you're saying it would only work once and not be able to continue past more than 1 extra macro. If that's the case, I'm not really sure how they could do that when macros are nothing more than lines of text commands unless they put a time/usage limit on how quickly it would become usuable again. However, in that scenario, that might screw us up more than help us when we click a macro thinking it will activate both macros but doesn't because of the restrictive use on /next.

Note: This entire post is based on assumptions and speculation on the quoted information/post. I may be completely off or have not consider a specific angle/context/intent. If that is the case, please disregard everything I just said (after letting me know).

You could automate things like switching gear using a WS or a spell and switching back I suppose. I don't really see the harm in something like that though.

Nala
07-09-2011, 08:19 AM
/next would only work in one direction (1 -> 2 -> 3 -> 4 etc.) so automation would not be possible. At the end of your macro set you would use the /set commant to return to the original macro set.

So:

set1 line1 (whatever)
set1 line2 (whatever)
set1 line3 (whatever)
set1 line4 (whatever)
set1 line5 (whatever)
set1 line 6 /next

set2 line 1 (whatever)
set2 line 2 (whatever)
set2 line 3 (whatever)
set2 line 4 (whatever)
set2 line 5 (whatever)
set2 line 6 /set 1


In this example you would have a 10 line macro. /next could also be implemented using the same syntax as the recently added <wait> and a <set> command could be added as well so that you wouldn't have to waste lines on them.

Minus the automation there is already a method to pull this off of sorts.

its the /macro set x command they added a few years back, in order to utilize it hower requires multi input from the user still though you can set it up where its easy enough when used proper you can swap all 16 pieces without massive effort.

Example:

macro set 1 control 0:
/macro set 2
/equip "whatever"
/equip "whatever"
/equip "whatever"
/equip "whatever"
/equip "whatever"

macro set 2 control 0
/macro set 1
/equip "whatever"
/equip "whatever"
/equip "whatever"
/equip "whatever"
/equip "whatever"

now by setting up your macros as such all you have to do is quickly double tap control 0 and it will swap up to 10 gear pieces and return you to your home macro row, you can extend this out to swaping all 15/16 pieces of gear, its what i have been using since they introduced them, this particular command has other interesting uses with some imagination.

not to say i myself wouldn't like to see better in game macros, however they have provided us alternatives which it seems not many saw the use for when they added.

p.s. if your interested in using this method i recommend using the /macro set command in the first line as it allows you to execute the next part of the macro faster.

MarkovChain
07-09-2011, 10:57 PM
The OP's idea is interesting but I would do something a bit different. This would allow the use of the current macro system . Allow the use of a "/gearset" command in the current macro. "/gearset x y" would execute the gear change macros found on the macro#y of set#x.

For instance if my set#9 macro looks like
palette9-ctrl 1:
/equip head A
/equip body B
/equip legs C
palette9-ctrl 2 :
/equip head A'
/equip body B'
/equip legs C'


I could use the following macro in my ctrl1 WS macro from set#1 :
ctrl 1
/gearset 9 1 <wait 1>
/ja combo <t>
/gearset 9 2

hitting ctrl 1 would equip {A,B,C} for ws= and reequip {A',B',C'} for melee. /gearset would only read "/equip" lines to avoid botting.

geekgirl101
07-10-2011, 06:46 PM
I have a couple of suggestions for this... one would be a mode switch from console to PC, with more options for PC users such as extra macro lines, permanent display of action buttons without having to hold down CTRL or ALT to bring them up and flip between them, maybe even a minimap instead of having to bring up the large map all the time and tab through the buttons to find out where you're positioned.

Another suggestion would be for SE to allow a certain amount of moderated plugins for PC users, as long as the plugins are not displaying things that the game wouldn't normally allow. SE is very taboo on the subject of addon useage as they can rapidly evolve into botting applications or display information that shouldn't be there which is why they are banned from being used, but I think that if SE allowed for moderated addons and that they used a format which would encrypt them from being edited once compiled so that other players don't try to modify them, then that would help improve the game a little more for PC users.

Nala
07-10-2011, 11:16 PM
problem with that is the whole trip SE is on is equality in game play, and at least if your following the ToS a pc user has all the same capabilities of a console player...

theory vs reality however we know there are plenty of people who use the non sanctioned windower, which even its benign features give PC players an advantage. /sigh

Also as ive stated before they have added a method to extend macros, untill they respond to one of the many threads on this matter i'm under the impression that /macro set is all were getting =/

Annahya
07-11-2011, 12:01 AM
Because of gearswapping, I do agree that we should have more macro lines - at least enough to change the 12 non-weapon slots. To this end, I think the most elegant solution that has been posed, save the simple addition of more lines that SE has shot down, is the gear-set suggestion. If, when we selected equipment, we were offered something like we are on PUP (Master/Automaton) but they were namable selections like Macro books, it would be amazing.

For instance:
Set 01 (Renamable)
Set 02 (Renamable)
Set 03 (Renamable)
Set 04 (Renamable)
Set 05 (Renamable)
Automaton (if PUP)

And the addition of the command /equipset "Set 01 (Renamable)"

I know I am restating what others have, and I want to take no credit for the idea, but I do think this is a very elegant solution as far as user-interface is concerned. I have no idea how it would work on the programming side, and if memory were a concern, I would gladly give up the normal /equip command for this option.

All that said, if SE were to give me one wish, I would actually wish for the removal or limitation of the ability to use gearswaps in the first place. I know this is an incredibly unpopular idea, but I honestly do not like the concept. From an immersion standpoint, it is ridiculous - the idea that a person would stumble up to a monster, changing their pants, jewelery and hat, is just dumb.

/soapbox on
I know the "silly roleplayer" comments are about to come out, but before you waste your breath, let me make a distinction:
Checkers, hopscotch and Super Mario Bros. are games. FFXI is a Massively Multiplayer Online Roleplaying Game, which is a specific subgenre of game that is intended to include immersive roleplaying aspects. If you choose to play your MMO purely as a numbers game, that is your choice, and I have no issues with that. Just know that the assertion that roleplaying concerns are somehow unecessary, unimportant, etc., is inaccurate by nature - and that by choosing to ignore these portions of the game, one is not using the product as intended.

Again, I am not saying folk are wrong to choose to play the game this way - I merely ask that we call a spade a spade, so to speak.
/soapbox off

I personally wish there was a way to limit in-combat gearswapping, or eliminate it completely. I have thought about having every slot reset TP like weapons, or having the /equip command stop working when a weapon is drawn (much like how /ws does not function unless a weapon is drawn). However, I recognize that this would hamper melees more than mages, and that would be unfair. I have yet to think of a way, futile as it would be anyway, to suggest a fair way of handling it without the outright elimination of the /equip command.

I also wonder if eliminating gearswapping might actually foster a bit more variation in playstyles. Yes, just like now, there would be an "elite setup" that equipment-nazis would assert is the end-all-be-all, but because of the removal of the ability to golf-bag every needed specialty, I wonder if some players might rejoice in their new inventory space and just choose a handful of specialties, that they enjoy, over others. No solution is perfect, and I know this paradigm would have its flaws as well. I am merely stating my personal opinion, like everyone else here.

~Anna

{Edit: Cleaned some lines up.}

Alhanelem
07-11-2011, 12:23 AM
We don't need more macro lines- stuff like swapping gear shouldn't need a bunch of macro lines. That is why I proposed saved gear sets. Then you can switch all your gear with a single command.

Annahya
07-11-2011, 12:27 AM
We don't need more macro lines- stuff like swapping gear shouldn't need a bunch of macro lines. That is why I proposed saved gear sets. Then you can switch all your gear with a single command.

Which is why I agreed with you...

...aside from my anti-gearswapping rant, that is.

MarkovChain
07-11-2011, 03:56 AM
Don't pay attention to him ...

On the gear-swapping subject I think It doesn't make sense in today's game anyway. Ever since I got my Verethragna (aka the new destroyer according to the census :D) I don't swap anymore beside earth staff "until it procs" lolz. Either the stuff dies before you even get tp or it is one shotted regardless of the gear if you have, not to mention full monk AF3+2 is a pretty solid WS-setup... The gear-swapping nazi that you are referring to are noobs thinking they are elites for using the best WS set to one-shot bubble berny, and are probably found on some site where they post how awesome they are for unlocking a level 85 (only) weapon (aka the new destroyers) - Elitism 101 . Some people don't realize that the game changed.

Tsukino_Kaji
07-11-2011, 04:06 AM
On the gear-swapping subject I think It doesn't make sense in today's game anyway. Ever since I got my Verethragna (aka the new destroyer according to the census :D) I don't swap anymore beside earth staff "until it procs" lolz.Gear swapring is for outside of abyssea only realy, since a few more points of str over your already 200+ or what ever isnt' realy going to make a differece. Outside though, that +20-90 or what ever you have makes a huge difference. This seems to be the source of a bit of the confusion over the "neccessity" if gear swaps.

MarkovChain
07-11-2011, 04:18 AM
Are you kidding ? Outside of abyssea the mobs you fight are level 80 at best... Right now the only interesting thing to do is dynamis coin farming (level 75 mobs) on which you spam provoke until they proc, so damage doesn't matter at all. Voidwatch seem fail looking at the rewards so I won't mention it (best thing I saw is a helmet that makes a mix&match set 0.5% worse than full AF3 ..w).

Seriha
07-11-2011, 07:12 AM
Seeing how most aren't even capping ATK in Abyssea since they don't think food is needed, swapping to STR stuff alone helps in remedying that to a degree even the STR itself isn't directly needed. In or out, though, you should be swapping to get the most out of every ability. It's just a pain for console users thanks to the antiquity of the macro system.

Atomic_Skull
07-11-2011, 11:51 AM
.

I also wonder if eliminating gearswapping might actually foster a bit more variation in playstyles.

No because 25% haste would still > everything. You'd just have people selling or dropping their WS gear WSing in their TP sets.