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  1. #71
    Player
    Maldalewyn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    55
    Character
    Roripu Totapu
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    CONJURER Lv 50
    Quote Originally Posted by Kowru View Post
    Right I get what you're saying. But just because it doesn't mention explicitly you cannot use it in battle does not mean you can just assume it'll be usable in battle. But you're right, I misread that in db. I'm just trying to say, we should wait on jumping the gun on things until the game is fully released and can be fully tested.
    I would agree with you but since Raise explicitly states it can not be used in battle, if Resurrection worked in the same manner, shouldn't it make this statement as well?

    Comparing Stoneskin and Adloquium's Additional Effects would be a bit unfair at this point but just going off what I saw in game, and what I can see on xivdb... I honestly can't see Resurrection working any other way.

    Another point is, Resurrection is restricted to ACN for this very reason, much like Raise should be restricted to CNJ. Because Resurrection does not depend on a trait for more freedom, it's restricted to its main class to prevent other classes from having the ability to raise in battle.


    Anyway, I think it's a fair assessment, and I think it's also very unfair to CNJ and WHM.
    It makes me feel cheated.
    (1)

  2. #72
    Player
    Thunderz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Posts
    430
    Character
    Thunderz Canadia
    World
    Excalibur
    Main Class
    GLADIATOR Lv 50
    Quote Originally Posted by Kowru View Post
    Right I get what you're saying. But just because it doesn't mention explicitly you cannot use it in battle does not mean you can just assume it'll be usable in battle. But you're right, I misread that in db. I'm just trying to say, we should wait on jumping the gun on things until the game is fully released and can be fully tested.

    Edit:

    At 22 ACN, it'll be the first thing I do, literally.
    At least we can still argue that WHM is wasting an trait on that fact....
    (0)

  3. #73
    Player Whippet's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    268
    Character
    Sakura Brandford
    World
    Hyperion
    Main Class
    CONJURER Lv 50
    Lots of misinformation in this thread, Maldalewyn If you need WHM help or just wanna talk whm in game you can /t me i'll help you name is in the avatar
    (0)

  4. #74
    Player
    v_jones's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    63
    Character
    Virus Jones
    World
    Midgardsormr
    Main Class
    CONJURER Lv 50
    Quote Originally Posted by Maldalewyn View Post
    ...Lustrate...
    My point was mainly that Benediction is superior as a fail safe. Really, it was silly to even compare the two, since Lustrate likely is intended for more general use. It could probably be very effective in fights that require a lot of movement, but yes, without knowing the mana cost or whether high ilevel gear would obviate the use of Lustrate for anything other than high hp tanks, it's all speculation (I haven't seen any hard numbers, though I haven't looked very hard).

    Quote Originally Posted by Maldalewyn View Post
    ...Carby...
    ...Freecure/Overcure...
    Whaaaaat? Why don't they get a Carby?

    I can't say whether I like it in practice, because I haven't seen it put into practice in an 8 or 24 man group. However, If it's 15 seconds of free healing, then no, I don't like it. If it works like the spell descriptions seem to indicate, then I do like the idea of it, although Overcure may need tweaking to get it to proc a satisfactory amount. Walking the line between mana efficiency and keeping everyone alive is part of the difficulty of healing, and when done well, can be quite rewarding. Determining which way to lean is dependent upon the fight mechanics, how long the fight is gone on, the health of the tank, the health of other players, your mana, and the mana of other healers who may be present. Letting health drop lower to be more efficient isn't necessarily "negligent" so much as it is a calculated risk. Frankly, I would like to see Cure II gain a boost in potency and mana cost to make Freecure more enticing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Whippet View Post
    Lots of misinformation in this thread, Maldalewyn If you need WHM help or just wanna talk whm in game you can /t me i'll help you name is in the avatar
    Thanks for your contribution...?
    (1)

  5. #75
    Player
    DiceMan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    29
    Character
    Gold Attack
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    CONJURER Lv 50
    Burst heals are only needed if the tank doesn't avoid the red. Yes they will take hits no matter what but just like every mmo that is solely healer/tank based. The tanks in your party will be pros at what they do and avoid 99% or all major hits that they can avoid. In the end healing should be done by both classes and the tanks should do their jobs flawless and you down the hardcore bosses. No matter the healing 90% of the time if the tanks aren't good at what they do all your healing is in vain. Just my opinion on how wow turned out healers would just spam and use their mods to assist while core tanks would be flawless.

    Yes pug tanks and groups aren't the same as your LS group etc. Most hardcore end game is done by guild/LS/friends etc.

    So learn your class what ever it may be. Get with a good group and basically learn your role since there will be plenty of healers and few flawless tanks.
    (1)

  6. #76
    Player
    Maldalewyn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    55
    Character
    Roripu Totapu
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    CONJURER Lv 50
    Quote Originally Posted by Whippet View Post
    Lots of misinformation in this thread, Maldalewyn If you need WHM help or just wanna talk whm in game you can /t me i'll help you name is in the avatar
    You should probably be specific if you want to help anyone...

    Where is this misinformation exactly? If you have proof, or even if its just different theory than my own, post it and I might add it to the OP.

    Quote Originally Posted by v_jones View Post
    Whaaaaat? Why don't they get a Carby?

    I can't say whether I like it in practice, because I haven't seen it put into practice in an 8 or 24 man group. However, If it's 15 seconds of free healing, then no, I don't like it. If it works like the spell descriptions seem to indicate, then I do like the idea of it, although Overcure may need tweaking to get it to proc a satisfactory amount. Walking the line between mana efficiency and keeping everyone alive is part of the difficulty of healing, and when done well, can be quite rewarding. Determining which way to lean is dependent upon the fight mechanics, how long the fight is gone on, the health of the tank, the health of other players, your mana, and the mana of other healers who may be present. Letting health drop lower to be more efficient isn't necessarily "negligent" so much as it is a calculated risk. Frankly, I would like to see Cure II gain a boost in potency and mana cost to make Freecure more enticing.
    They get the two faeries. One for healing, one for buffing. Carby becomes unavailable.

    And I understand what you mean. Overcure and Freecure can work as they are, but I'm not very satisfied with how they work.

    I just think there are better ways to make CNJ interesting than to have their weird traits that encourage that A > B > C sorta chain. It's obviously never going to create a chain like that but that's kinda my point, it's just so awkward and situational to me.

    Free Cure would be much easier to take advantage of, of course, simply because it's based off your use of Cure, the most commonly used spell you got. Overcure though... it's based off Cure II and you won't be using this too often until higher level content, and even then, when it does proc, what are the chances you're going to want to use it with Cure III? Not very likely.

    It might be better if instead of a 100% crit chance, it just doubled the radius of your Cure III and removed all enmity gained through casting it. I mean really, that's the most limiting part of the spell to begin with, why not lift it?
    (2)
    Last edited by Maldalewyn; 08-24-2013 at 01:35 PM.

  7. #77
    Player
    Maldalewyn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    55
    Character
    Roripu Totapu
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    CONJURER Lv 50
    In trying to keep with how Overcure and Freecure currently function, I rewrote them to match.

    I think if I tried to keep with their current theme, this is how they'd look:

    LEVEL 32
    ENHANCED CURE - TRAIT

    Grants a 15% chance that casting any of your cure spells (Cure, Cure II, Cure III) will allow the next cure spell to be cast for free.

    LEVEL 44
    ENHANCED CURE II - TRAIT

    Grants a 15% chance that casting any of your cure spells (Cure, Cure II, Cure III) will allow the next cure spell to be cast for free and also gain additional properties.

    Ex. Cure I is now granted a 100% chance to critical.
    Cure I will now grant a buff to the target that automatically casts Cure I on them 4 more additional times once every 4 seconds.
    Cure II's cast time is reduced to 0.
    Cure III has its radius double and produces no emnity.

    These additional properties stack with the 0 MP cost.
    (2)
    Last edited by Maldalewyn; 08-24-2013 at 02:08 PM.

  8. #78
    Player
    Thunderz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Posts
    430
    Character
    Thunderz Canadia
    World
    Excalibur
    Main Class
    GLADIATOR Lv 50
    I still don't like the concept behind RNG healing

    i'd prefer combo system or something more reliable then a possible proc from spamming a spell

    how many times will overcure/freecure proc when you actually need it

    Most of the time i'd have it proc is when I'm either full MP and no one is taking dmg (worth the cureII or overcure)
    (0)

  9. #79
    Player
    Tankue's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    6
    Character
    Tankue Vedymuch
    World
    Hyperion
    Main Class
    CONJURER Lv 50
    I don't see anything wrong with proc effects when healing.. How many times proc XXX pops when you need it is attached to how much you are using your cures.

    Combos for healing raises the same question you have for procs.. How often will you be in the right part of your combo to deal with whatever healing is needed?
    A combo set up would leave us sitting on our hands half the time. Healing is just playing whack-a-mole, adding some more reactionary mechanics to it works out just fine.
    (2)

  10. #80
    Player
    Akira-Shiro's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    9
    Character
    Akira Shiro
    World
    Alexander
    Main Class
    CONJURER Lv 28
    So im like new to FF mmo's, and I am very curious as to why the Conjurer is so.... Not good, I mean from what I have seen other classes can take all of our enhancing abilities along with our Cure. So why is it we cannot take any offensive abilities. My biggest gripe with this class isnt its healing or enhancing abilities, it's the Conjurers inability to use AoE and offensive skills from other classes.
    My purpose for posting is that, I would like to know when the next patch is and can I expect the conjurer to be less ass. With the cross class ability in the game, the Conjurer should have access to a better range of skills than it does. Why would a conjurer who is sub classing a Thalmaturge be looking to cross class for its healing ability??? As a Conjurer I have all of the best healing abilities.
    (0)

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