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  1. #21
    Player
    Onisake's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
    Posts
    372
    Character
    Naomi Onisake
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Marauder Lv 50
    Quote Originally Posted by Churchill View Post
    You should post the total damage, no one cares what a BRD does solely to Garuda. Your job is to make sure the party is alive when she does Aerial blast.

    e-though considering you're doing the method you're doing, it's probably not as reliable a source of information as most people would base your total output on a more standard party setup.
    Why is this? damage done to plumes really requires one thing: you one shot the plumes with RoD. after that it doesn't matter. you probably don't even have to one-shot them. it just makes it far easier and gives you a lot more room for error.

    because we're only protecting two pillars, the total damage i do varies widely. sometimes i kill 15+ plumes. other times i'll only kill 5 or 6. at around 630-640 per plume, that's a difference of 6k damage rounding down.

    I could kill plumes on the other pillars. but what's the point? you only need 6 stones to survive. i might as well put damage where it matters: on Garuda.

    I think it is a HUGE misconception that BRD should not do a lot of damage to Garuda. If me and the other brd are averaging 20-25k damage on Garuda, that's damage the blms don't have to do. relieving the burden on the BLMs in anyway is overall beneficial.

    My opinion right now is if you're only concerned about killing plumes you can go in with only AF and a Crab bow and do just fine. a ~40DPS bow is ideal, but not required if you're only concerned with killing plumes. and in that case there's not a whole lot of point in talking about gear because just about anything you can gather together will be adequate.
    (1)

  2. #22
    Player
    Churchill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    513
    Character
    Chad Thunderkoch
    World
    Hyperion
    Main Class
    Marauder Lv 70
    Because the BLM burn strategy is a really poor method of killing Garuda and is no where near as 100% as killing a set of sisters and moving on. We can get Garuda to the same HP level as 4xBLM with only 3xBLM and we still kill sisters because it's more consistent and has less of Murphy's Law.

    And, you don't do 20-25k on Garuda. Archer doesn't have the combo's available to push damage like a real DD would - even a DRG who does half plumes/half Garuda would have a hard time breaking 25k without a Gae Bolg. (22k Garuda, 4.5k Superna, 9-15k Plumes is pretty normal)

    Crab Bow and AF doesn't one shot plumes, so you're just throwing what you feel out there and not basing it on reality.
    (0)

  3. #23
    Player
    Darkillumina's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    234
    Character
    Konstantine Porphyrogenitos
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 50
    Quote Originally Posted by Churchill View Post
    Because the BLM burn strategy is a really poor method of killing Garuda and is no where near as 100% as killing a set of sisters and moving on. We can get Garuda to the same HP level as 4xBLM with only 3xBLM and we still kill sisters because it's more consistent and has less of Murphy's Law.

    And, you don't do 20-25k on Garuda. Archer doesn't have the combo's available to push damage like a real DD would - even a DRG who does half plumes/half Garuda would have a hard time breaking 25k without a Gae Bolg. (22k Garuda, 4.5k Superna, 9-15k Plumes is pretty normal)

    Crab Bow and AF doesn't one shot plumes, so you're just throwing what you feel out there and not basing it on reality.
    I don't agree with this. If you got a good group who is well-versed in the burn you can pretty much spam the fight without dying. If you have two bards who are on the same page and communicating you can pretty much deal with any of the plumage quite easily. If you have decent black mages and a tank who can pull the add's and hallowed ground everything on top of this you can pretty much spam the fight non-stop with no deaths.

    At first, I questioned the validity of this method and preferred normal, sister killing methods as well, but after mastering it, I can absolutely say it is much more efficient and easier than a killing the sister's run. All our runs are clean as well. Hell, we're bringing in people who aren't very good players putting them on white mage and getting them their first win. As a bonus we do this so fast that all our food carries over for a full second run.

    So basically for this method I use the Storm Lieutenant's bow with bonus active, double attack iv gauntlets and some other things. After food I'm at about 650 attack. I've done this with garuda's spine but since Garuda dies so fast the higher attack speed on Garuda's doesn't kick in and you actually LOSE damage due to the weak light shots.

    On this method if a bard and his partner are good at taking care of plumes they can add to the DPS on Garuda itself making the fight go even faster. The only issue with this method is you need to have two bards who can listen and communicate well with each other. We're killing Garuda in less than 5:45 seconds like this.
    (0)

  4. #24
    Player
    PSxpert2011's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    1,383
    Character
    Psxpert Sylph
    World
    Excalibur
    Main Class
    Pugilist Lv 50
    Hehe, time to hunt me some b-a-r-ds. :P


    Dance sucka, DANCE! >: D
    (0)
    Last edited by PSxpert2011; 10-01-2012 at 03:44 PM.


    ~'\[[_LEGACY_]]/'~
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  5. #25
    Player
    Onisake's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    372
    Character
    Naomi Onisake
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Marauder Lv 50
    Quote Originally Posted by Churchill View Post
    Because the BLM burn strategy is a really poor method of killing Garuda and is no where near as 100% as killing a set of sisters and moving on. We can get Garuda to the same HP level as 4xBLM with only 3xBLM and we still kill sisters because it's more consistent and has less of Murphy's Law.
    Fair enough. we're doing blm burn. considering we're getting some success; strategy doesn't matter as much as results. we're seeing people use the more accepted strategy and getting about the same success rate. we can argue semantics but i honestly don't think it matters how you kill her as long as it gets done.

    We're not really here to discuss garuda strategies. we're here to discuss gear. the whole point of gear is for DPS.

    How you choose to calculate that is up to you. Because not all fights are like Garuda, and i'm ultimately gearing up for To Kill a Raven (Hard) i'm more concerned with single target, non-trash damage. IE: what i'm doing to Garuda.

    Quote Originally Posted by Churchill View Post
    And, you don't do 20-25k on Garuda. Archer doesn't have the combo's available to push damage like a real DD would - even a DRG who does half plumes/half Garuda would have a hard time breaking 25k without a Gae Bolg. (22k Garuda, 4.5k Superna, 9-15k Plumes is pretty normal)
    i said me AND the other bard. that's combined damage.

    If you read my other post i said i'm averaging around 17k damage on Garuda. If you add in ~15 plumes at ~640 damage each that's another ~9k damage. so total damage is in the 25k neighborhood.

    breaking 20k on BRD should not be hard. I'm not dumping TP as efficiently as i could be for fear of missing an RoD. but honestly worst case scenario if i dumped 1k TP with a heavy shot as plumes spawned i could build it up fast enough to RoD before they do enough damage to the pillar to matter. I could probably push out another 3k damage if i dumped TP in a more risky fashion.

    We're getting to the final phase consistently. so w/e we're doing while plumes are spawning is working. no need to change any of that. I could artificially bump my numbers higher by killing plumes i don't need to. but what's the point? i don't need to stroke my e-peen that much. I'd rather put DPS where it matters.

    Quote Originally Posted by Churchill View Post
    Crab Bow and AF doesn't one shot plumes, so you're just throwing what you feel out there and not basing it on reality.
    i also said you probably don't need to one shot plumes. >.>;;

    if brd is only killing plumes gear does not matter. period. end of story. killing the plumes is not hard. if you can build 3ktp in 30 seconds and then pick off a number of plumes with either light shot or wide volley you'll be fine.

    I've had some other bards come in with AF only and NQ accessories and SGT bows. they do roughly half my DPS. they are killing plumes fine. Most of the time they are killing more plumes than I am. but i'm also not killing plumes that aren't on my pillar, unless the other brd is in dire need of backup.

    but we still lose these more than we win with the sub-par bards. So i'm gonna stand by that the damage brd outputs on Garuda does in fact matter. even more so when she has ~1% HP when we wipe and the other BRD is doing 7k damage to Garuda compared to my 15k
    (0)

  6. #26
    Player
    Onisake's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    372
    Character
    Naomi Onisake
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Marauder Lv 50
    For those interested:

    Got a couple of trials against Raven (hard)

    my group is still streamlining it's strategy, and it looks like i'll be switching to whm in the interim while we work our some of our difficulties with the fight itself. the hard part of brd for this fight is positioning. and that can be learned on whm. skill rotation is very easy, as you're always ~13 yalms away you can pretty much combo freely with TP being your limiting factor.

    However I've been ranging between 12k-22k damage in about 14 minutes. focusing purely on Nael and occasionally helping with meteors. (have not made it to 10meteor phase). this is roughly 70% of the damage our DRG. roughly 75-80% of the mnk. As a side note, I feel our MNK is not hitting his proper rotation so that may not be a good approximation of where BRDs damage should be on this fight.
    (0)

  7. #27
    Player
    Churchill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    513
    Character
    Chad Thunderkoch
    World
    Hyperion
    Main Class
    Marauder Lv 70
    He doesn't seem to have inherently higher defense or stats than the regular version, only higher HP/Regen and has Absorb Defense move.
    (0)

  8. #28
    Player

    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    51
    I'm just gearing up my bard and can't seem to find the stat cap based on the Flame bow.

    Please correct me if I'm wrong, but from what I gathered, stat caps are based on a weapon's dps.

    So if the stat cap for Garuda's Spine (22.90 DPS) is around 350/310 piety/dex, would it be safe to say that the cap on the Flame bow (26.59 DPS) should be somewhere north of 350/310?
    (0)

  9. #29
    Player
    Onisake's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    372
    Character
    Naomi Onisake
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Marauder Lv 50
    Quote Originally Posted by Churchill View Post
    He doesn't seem to have inherently higher defense or stats than the regular version, only higher HP/Regen and has Absorb Defense move.
    positioning affects damage more than anything. because you have to stop shooting to move into position.

    also accuracy plays a bigger role. but yes. he seems to take the same amount of damage

    Quote Originally Posted by BiggLethal View Post
    I'm just gearing up my bard and can't seem to find the stat cap based on the Flame bow.

    Please correct me if I'm wrong, but from what I gathered, stat caps are based on a weapon's dps.

    So if the stat cap for Garuda's Spine (22.90 DPS) is around 350/310 piety/dex, would it be safe to say that the cap on the Flame bow (26.59 DPS) should be somewhere north of 350/310?
    Spine has a DPS of 40.97 and caps around 350

    Flame LT bow is 40.24

    Ifrit bow is 36.74 and caps around 310

    so for every full point of DPS you need roughly 10 more of your main stat.



    Flame bow probably caps around 345. There's a formula floating around somewhere. but that's your ballpark. might as well shoot for the 350 for when you get your spine.
    (1)

  10. #30
    Player

    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    51
    Quote Originally Posted by Onisake View Post
    positioning affects damage more than anything. because you have to stop shooting to move into position.

    also accuracy plays a bigger role. but yes. he seems to take the same amount of damage



    Spine has a DPS of 40.97 and caps around 350

    Flame LT bow is 40.24

    Ifrit bow is 36.74 and caps around 310

    so for every full point of DPS you need roughly 10 more of your main stat.



    Flame bow probably caps around 345. There's a formula floating around somewhere. but that's your ballpark. might as well shoot for the 350 for when you get your spine.

    Wow I was waay off with the DPS numbers haha. Thanks you for clarifying
    (0)

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