Lack of potion/Ether use

[Deltara]

I want to use them! And I have 99 Ahriman Wings, and other mats for my ALC friends but my question is "where the hell are the Vampire Plants?" I would love to have Elixers on hand.

Many folks are busy trying to do every job/af thing as fast as possible (like they are going away next week) have faith once that settles folks will be exploring all the other cool changes with the new patch.

Keep crafting!

I got vampire plants from the level forty leves out in nine ivies. happy hunting

[TheFatHousecat]

I thought 1.21 would give a huge boost to Alchemists, but it doesn't seem to have turned out that way.

The biggest thing holding me back from using potions and ethers is their effective duration and re-use times compared to food items.

As a mage, I'd love to have Hi- or Mega-Potions of the Mind and Piety, but at just 40 seconds effect duration and a 3 ~ 4 minute re-use it hardly seems worth it.

Elixirs, on the other hand, look very interesting despite their long cooldowns.
But they are scarce in the markets on Saronia and very overpriced when they do appear.

Hopefully SE will keep an eye on the situation and adjust things to make them more appealing and accessible.

I'd also like a longer duration and/or a shorter recast, because that means that you have to understand a fight before going into it. For example, in the Coincounter fight, a lot of BLMs will pop nerve drops because it's a fairly stable fight and you'll get more attacks over time out of a negative enmity potion. But at Chimera I use ethers, because the fight is somewhat of an mp drain (for me, at least), so the little boost helps.

I mean, it's not necessarily a bad thing that you can't stack potions or use them in succession, but it'd be more useful if the recast were shorter, or if perhaps the 4 min. recast only counted for potions of the same category (can't use 2 ethers in a row), but for other types (drops, INT pots, etc) the recast were something like 10-30 seconds. That way you could get the most out of a type of potion, but you couldn't spam that type over and over again.

I don't know if increasing the duration over 1 min. or so would be beneficial overall though, because the longer potions last the smaller the need for food. Stat. pots are intended for your strongest actions to provide an extra burst, if they lasted longer than a minute it would be a little overkill. Or at least if they do decide to add potions that increase stats which last longer, the ingredients need to be very rare in order to keep a bottle neck on their supply, so that the food market doesn't crash.

[Platinumstorm]

I'm not sure what to say about it, yet. Where I am the market isn't really developing, and the materials for the potions can be relatively expensive, therefore the cost of the potion is relatively expensive. There's also the additional problem of inventory slots being taken up by situational items, and many players already have inventory issues.

If people use these items sparingly, it's going to be very easy for the market to get saturated, if any market for these items does appear.

[Mikita]

Or at least if they do decide to add potions that increase stats which last longer, the ingredients need to be very rare in order to keep a bottle neck on their supply, so that the food market doesn't crash.

That's true. They need to make sure the food and medicine markets both remain viable.

Perhaps I'll experiment with medicines for their recovery powers rather than enhancing effects (leaving that to food).

Potions or Ethers for HP and MP recovery could be very useful if a fight starts going badly, or in places like the poison rooms of Aurum Vale.

[TheFatHousecat]

I'm not sure what to say about it, yet. Where I am the market isn't really developing, and the materials for the potions can be relatively expensive, therefore the cost of the potion is relatively expensive. There's also the additional problem of inventory slots being taken up by situational items, and many players already have inventory issues.

If people use these items sparingly, it's going to be very easy for the market to get saturated, if any market for these items does appear.

The mats are all easily gathered (well, if you have friends who have FSH leveled ;D), so I honestly don't have an issue with the supply part, it's probably just really expensive because not a lot of people are selling them and those who are have the option to overprice. Inv. slots I can see there being an issue with, but you should just have 1~3 slots take up depending on the class you use most often/need.

Then again, I'm making pots almost exclusively for my LS and getting a hunk of the amount of mats from gatherers within it, so I can't really say anything about supply/demand in the wards.

[darkstarpoet1]

there's 4 problems i see with the new mega potions and elixers.

1. the duration on them is only good for a very short burst of results. ex: a blm can only get a little over 1 combo off in the time it lasts.

2. the materials for the items are quite expensive to buy to make the items. on my server if you bought the mats to make the potions you would be spending over 6k a piece for them. i have mine up for 5k each because i farmed my own mats, but since people aren't willing to buy the finished products for that i just sell the individual mats at market value. i'm selling 10x as many of the materials as i am the finished products.

3. you add the duration of the item with the cost to make the item and they are just not enough value for the gil right now. hopefully they will look at these again and make adjustments to make them a viable item to make, sell, buy, and use.

4. the long cool down between uses. if you use one you get 30-40 seconds of results and anywhere from 3-5 minutes between uses. it's also not helping that you use an elixer and get silenced you cannot use the drop to cure that so it doesn't benefit you to keep both types on you.

[Skies]

darkstar, you cannot really complain about the market state if you aren't helping it, which is a big gripe of mine and perhaps a bit offtopic.
You say that the materials cost more than the finished product, great, mine your own materials, sell them cheaper at what you consider reasonable prices, create your own finished product and sell at a reasonable price. Then proceed to attempt to convince others to do so.
Start the goddamn change in the market! That is the one portion of the game that is completely player-driver and if a player doesn't takes up to himself to change it, it'll remain as-is forever.

[Mikita]

there's 4 problems i see with the new mega potions and elixers.

1. the duration on them is only good for a very short burst of results. ex: a blm can only get a little over 1 combo off in the time it lasts.

2. the materials for the items are quite expensive to buy to make the items. on my server if you bought the mats to make the potions you would be spending over 6k a piece for them. i have mine up for 5k each because i farmed my own mats, but since people aren't willing to buy the finished products for that i just sell the individual mats at market value. i'm selling 10x as many of the materials as i am the finished products.

3. you add the duration of the item with the cost to make the item and they are just not enough value for the gil right now. hopefully they will look at these again and make adjustments to make them a viable item to make, sell, buy, and use.

4. the long cool down between uses. if you use one you get 30-40 seconds of results and anywhere from 3-5 minutes between uses. it's also not helping that you use an elixer and get silenced you cannot use the drop to cure that so it doesn't benefit you to keep both types on you.

I definitely agree with points 1 and 3... not as someone who makes and sells them (because I can't) but from a buyer's point of view.

You say that the materials cost more than the finished product, great, mine your own materials, sell them cheaper at what you consider reasonable prices, create your own finished product and sell at a reasonable price. Then proceed to attempt to convince others to do so.

It's not just gil... it's about time, which to me is FAR more valuable.

Farming materials takes time. Getting your craft up to the level where you can make these items takes a huge amount of time.


Ultimately a balance needs to be struck between time cost, gil cost, and effect/duration.
Right now we are not at that balance point and so these items are selling or being used much.

SE can help to nudge things in the right direction, and hopefully they will do so in upcoming patches.

[Estellios]

If you are able to sell the materials for the potions/ethers, you are still contributing to the economy since that means someone somewhere is making and using them. I've been leveling up off of mega-potions and now mega-ethers, farmed/gathered all the mats and splitting them among my LS, selling the excess on the wards. Obviously if you are already capped Alchemist then you really aren't getting anything for your time if it earns you more money for selling materials instead and that's your call.

It really does depend on your server, though. On Istory you can buy all the materials for Mega-Potions from the wards/NPCs and still turn at the very least a small profit, and really the most "difficult" item to get is the Sagolii Sage. Mega-ethers are similar in that the only relatively uncommon item is the Black Truffle, with the rest of the materials being dirt-cheap or otherwise easy to get on your own. I haven't checked the price on Black Truffles since I gather them myself but they would be the deciding factor between selling them or the finished Ether. If it makes more money selling the Truffles eventually more people will start selling them and drive the price down, resulting in more people selling the finished ethers for a profit.

[Vassteel1]

yeah. its the re-use duration penality that is making all the potions completely worthless

it means you get to use 1 potion of a fight. and the remove stats effect potions are uttergarbage when fighting multipule mos that are spamming poison blind or what ever

only certian pots should have a reuse timer like elixers and ungents but not 10 min therrible