Thread: [4.4 Discussion] "Change the Future"

Originally Posted by ObsidianFire

Going to copy/paste this from my post in the Revelations thread...



I'm honestly more confused then anything else. The entire thing seems very self-contradictory.

Maybe it's talking about what may happen if we continue to walk down that path. Eventually there's going to be a fork in the road if we stick to this plan and one of two things may/could happen: chaos erupts in Garlemald and a Calamity happens before we even get to do anything there. Or we get there, destroy the Ascians (somehow) and that somehow causes a Flood of Light (deleting Elidibus, who I dunno is even still considered an emissary at this point, is probably not a good idea).

For all that we did learn from this patch, it certainly did do a fantastic job of raising even more questions. I suspect heavily that the apparent gradual bleed on the world's is almost certainly linked to the mysterious voice "Calling" people's souls. It was a bit suspect in its own right that the voice first interjected after Thancred's proposed plans were agreed upon, but also it was extremely suspect that the two Scions who are both probably the most versed at understanding aetherology were soul-napped almost immediately after deliberating their respective findings on the aether situation.

And while I certainly expected that there were high odds that Ascians were involved with the Garlean Empire's campaigns since Solus' inception as emperor, I NEVER expected that said emperor would be an Ascian himself. Furthermore, I had initially thought that Varis had only been working with Elidibus since his own inception as the new emperor, and was hoping to use Elidibus to further his own ambitions. This revelation turned that entirely on its head, and now it seems like Varis is only trying to maintain the status quo after having spent probably much of his life knowingly being groomed by the Ascians as a figurehead. Yet he does seem to be growing more unwilling to go along with things if his reaction towards Solus' taunting is any indication. I wonder if he could yet be made an ally after all, especially if the Ascians decide he's more trouble than he's worth and use the fact that Elidibus is piloting the crown heir's body to their advantage.

I assume this is going to become our default MYSTERY VOICE thread for the time being, so...

I've been thinking of this on and off all day after Quintalian hit me with kind of a "Duh." observation.

Ahead looms a Calamity.
Ahead looms Light, expunging all form and life.
Twin dooms only you can forestall. Only you.

I kept thinking, "How can it be both?" whereas more likely the point is prevent both separately; do not let either happen.

Who wants that other than Hydaelyn and mankind? It does sound like Arbert. It does sound like something Arbert would say. But [A] it doesn't sound like Arbert in every language of the game, and [B] the rest doesn't sound like anything Arbert would say.

Those points, of course, are what led me to consider that maybe it could be Zodiark. Nothing but Hydaelyn has ever yanked our soul out of our body to have a quick chat in the aetherial sea, and if I had to imagine what it looks like where He is... <gestures broadly>.

Then, of course there was Nabriales. Pay attention to what he shouts at you throughout the fight. I'm going by all four languages here, so it's not going to quite be what you see in English. (Aside: Only in English he speaks of lower-case darkness and the void; is this a localization error?) First, he summons the powers of Darkness from the Abyss to pervade his being and grant him strength; an all-powerful force whose hunger consumes all. But the most important part is when he commands, "in Zodiark's name" for time to slow. "Let expanse contract, eon become instant..."

But if this is Zodiark, I can see why He would advocate for balance. He's certainly having His emissary do the same. And I can see why He'd advocate against a Flood. Nobody wants a Flood. But why would He advocate for preventing a Calamity...? And why would Zodiark, of all "people", say that "only [the Warrior of Light]" could walk this tightrope? That's literally Elidibus's job.

Is it just deception all the way down? That assumption is no place to begin analysis.

Originally Posted by ObsidianFire

Now what would be a really weird take is if Zodiark (and probably Elidibus) have a different agenda then the other Ascians do

Regardless of whether your expanded context turns out to be true, I assume this is true. I have little doubt that Zodiark assigned his Emissary different missions than his acolytes. It's just ... how different? And is everyone still performing in the same capacity they were whatever thousand years ago when the First Umbral Era hit?

I'm starting to see a good deal of speculation that (for any number of a dozens reasons) His agents are acting against His will. I don't know what to believe, but I already went all in on #TeamHydaelyn so I'm going to ride this train until it crashes if for nothing but PRINCIPLE.

As such, I am honor bound to give Hydaelyn (and by extension Midgardsormr et al.) the benefit of the doubt and assume that the Ascians are bad news, Elidibus is a snake, and if anything doesn't line up, someone is a liar. I will continue to explore all logical avenues and consider all possibilities; like I said, if I was ever tempted to doubt, we're getting there. Something isn't right and I'd prefer to find all the options for exploring why. However, faith in the Mothercrystal is just the road the Spinner has fated me to walk.

What then does that mean if the voice is indeed Zodiark? That he's trying to Anakin Skywalker me, that's what. Palpatine's getting ready to make his big move. The Separatists Ascians are gonna lose the war He had them start, He's gonna (attempt to) throw Count Dooku Elidibus to the wolves, and He's taking everything for Himself as He goes home to the senate Mother Hydaelyn and uses his supremacy to burn Her down. NOT TODAY, SATAN!

Er...

Sorry, what was I saying?

Originally Posted by Anonymoose

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Though there has been one question on my mind for a very long time since the game began, " are the Ascians actually following the will of Zodiark or are they simply assuming that they are following his will by causing Calamities so he can return?"

For this entire storyline, no Ascian has actually heard the voice of Zodiark nor actually spoken to him. They have been acting alone under the belief they are following Zodiark's will but what if this entire time they have been unknowningly going against Zodiark's True Will to preserve Balance because they have been blindly causing events that will create a Calamity born from the complete destruction of the Balance (which I assume already happened in the Future because of what the WoL and Scions did in the original timeline).

The Ascians are basically a cult, a powerful one that has great influence in history, but still a cult that is follow a belief that they are following Zodiark's will. However, their dedication maybe blinding them to the truth and actually been causing events that Zodiark never wanted to happen.

Heck, for all we know Zodiark may have willingly sealed himself away and he may be a Good God this entire time but the Ascian's cult mentality and blind worshipping made them act in these ways while using Zodiark's name to justify their actions.

For Seven Hells, how do we know if there are not TWO Zodiarks, with one being the Real Zodiark (the Voice) and a Primal Fake Zodiark being the one that the Ascians worship born from a event long ago that has been completely erased from history.