Drk blood price

[ArianeEwah]

In HW Blood Price was actually pretty decent compared to its SB version now.

It had no restrictions regarding stances, and even vs single target it generated a big chunk of mana.
However the amount of mana it generated was a must because Darkside drained mana over time instead.
Now it just doesn't let you regenerate any mana.

At the beginning of SB, SE wanted tanks to be... well, tanks. They introduced stance dance penality (DRK was not affected), accessories without STR, and locked some "beneficial" abilities behind tank stance, such as Blood Price. But in addition to that, they also nerfed the mana gain from Blood Price.

After a huge sh*tstorm SE removed the penality, and later added STR to accessories, so healers wouldn't get stressed out from tanks using STR accessories. Yet Blood Price didn't recieve any additional changes.
Which is conflicting: if SE wants to loosen the stress on healers, I would image something like small pulls, "full time tank stance"-tanks.
Blood Price is the total opposite: to be effective, you NEED to pull big. But even then the mana generation is not high enough to spam DA Abyssal Drain, neither is the duration long enough to do so.

So, DRK end up pulling big, not using DA AD as much as we would like to, and would rather tank without tank stance. A full load of stress on healer. (In addition, you don't want to DA Dark Passenger, 'cause that would blind your enemies. They hit less -> you generate less mana during Blood Price.)
SE achieved the exact opposite of what they originally intended.

The whole design of DRK is contradictory when you pull big. Their abilities are not complementary. They are counterproductive!
(This was also a problem in HW.)

b@topic: I wouldn't add a "thorn" effect, vengeance already has that, it sound too similar.

I would like it to...
a. increase mana generation (to the point we can get along with mob missing hits)
b. change into a mana "regeneration trigger" with increased duration per hit
c. add a life leech (bloodbath) effect (maybe magical damage dealed only?)
d. usable outside of Grit once again or
e. complete rework

[Launched]

It doesn't need changed, it's fine. DRK's Grit resource generation got reworked, not nerfed. In single target Syphon Strike gives double MP so you don't have to rely on getting hit to get enough MP back. In aoe you still get plenty of MP (because you're doing big pulls, right?), but you also get Blood for Quietus which is more damage than AD and also gives a lot of MP back. It's slightly less braindead than HW DRK.

[Tint]

Blood Price is the total opposite: to be effective, you NEED to pull big. But even then the mana generation is not high enough to spam DA Abyssal Drain, neither is the duration long enough to do so.

So, DRK end up pulling big, not using DA AD as much as we would like to, and would rather tank without tank stance. A full load of stress on healer. (In addition, you don't want to DA Dark Passenger, 'cause that would blind your enemies. They hit less -> you generate less mana during Blood Price.)
SE achieved the exact opposite of what they originally intended.

The whole design of DRK is contradictory when you pull big. Their abilities are not complementary. They are counterproductive!
(This was also a problem in HW.)

I disagree. Yes, the AoE blind effect doesn't fit that good into DRKs kit, however...

first you can extend the duration of every second Blood Price with Delirium for an additional 16 seconds, for a total of 31 seconds Blood Price uptime (and the extra mana regeneration of Delerium is nice too for AoE spamming). And since Blood Price cooldown is 40 seconds, you can activate it again after just 9 seconds downtime. So the uptime of Blood Price is actually quite high and should last for the whole big pull.

And the whole Blood Price > Blood, Blood > Quietus, Mana > TBN, TBN > Blood works actually very good together and gives you enough extra mana for DA Abyssal Drain in bigger pulls, plus the shield of TBN of course.

Seriously, I am sitting on capped Blood in some pulls, because I am too busy spamming DA Abyssal Drain to have time to spend the Blood on Quietus >.>

[Bhearil]

Remember that the reason why SE added strenght on tank accesories was to avoid being power creeped by dps, since otherwise tank damage and consequently, aggro would only scale with the left equipment side while dps would scale with both left and right. The obvious solution would have been to make tanks damage scale from their main stat like everyone else but obviously SE doesnt want that

That would make dps damage eventually skyrocket so hard compared to tank's that no ammount of aggro increase skills would compensate for that unless they were up to ridiculous levels and even so it would need to be upped even more again after gear reached certain thresholds. But honestly it feels like a badly done bandaid

[ArianeEwah]

snip

I am gonna try to explain why I think it doesn't work that well.

In theory the ability sounds awesome. Blood overflow, endless mana generation, mana boost with extended duration when Delirium is used. You name it.

But the reality is different. The reason for this is dungeon design and the base (non-Delirium) version of Blood Price.

Most dungeons only allow a big pull of 6 monsters max. Most of them are big, though guys, slowly hitting every 2.5 sec. So, Blood Price generates 1 Blood per hit and 4 every 3 sec for 15 sec. That's 56 Blood without Delirium. Also, your mana generation will only skyrocket once you get multi-hitted or by more than 6 mobs if you get a lucky dungeon pick.
(I could cry every time I get Swallow's Compass and I can pull only 4 mobs at a time.)
BP doesn't increase your damage or life leech, nor decrease damage taken or recast time.

Blood weapon on the other hand generates at the very least 45 Blood, if you get CnS and Plunge in your BW window 51. More once you hit another GCD tier. In addition to that, you deal more damage because your GCD is reduced. (More mana than BP on single target.)

In a scenario where DRK pulls 6 mobs and uses BW instead of BP (no Grit), it generates more mana and blood with Quietus than with BP. BW regeration rate doesn't depend on being hit either, so DA DP will actually be beneficial.

BP only become superior to BW once you use Delirium on it.
While BW gets about 50% duration increase, BP gets more than 100% duration increase.

I agree that BP gets better once you hit 7+ mobs.
BW Quietus would probably overkill in blood and mana generation anyway.
Yet, as I stated in my previous post, that doesn't fit with SE intention and there's definitly a design flaw. It doesn't make tank stance more appealing, and other abilities still don't work well together with BP.