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  1. #11
    Player
    Kuroka's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2016
    Location
    Limsa
    Posts
    912
    Character
    Kuroka Au'noire
    World
    Shiva
    Main Class
    Black Mage Lv 70
    We actually got Tenacy but they kinda dropped the ball on that one.... >_>
    (2)

  2. #12
    Player
    whiskeybravo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Posts
    2,215
    Character
    Whiskey Bravo
    World
    Leviathan
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Raldo View Post
    I don't know why they haven't just gone all-in on the Tanks-are-VIT-only thing and just made VIT the tank damage stat. STR would then be completely useless, and they could set their precious balance to whatever they need to. If they're worried about that approach, they could leave the STR as maxed on all the tank gear, then secretly make that STR do absolutely nothing.
    1) The supposed major reason is due to change in Weakness. It no longer affects vitality/HP but reduces main stats. They could not allow Tanks to suffer "no weakness" after rez.

    2) The reason players keep asking for Vit are because free main stat increase from foods, and because "upgrades" from gear drops actually felt like "upgrades".

    3) SE added Str on SB accessories at patch 4.05 after realizing many tanks were still opting to wear 270 slaying accessories. They added the minimum amount of str necessary for them to be equal to 270 slaying, and that's where we are now.


    There's nothing wrong with STR being the damage stat for tanks. The problem is that raid gear that's supposed to be the best gear for players to strive for is absolutely trashed by crafting accessories. And tanks are the only job that has to deal with this. Adjusting the STR to scale normally like all the other acc is the most sane solution without having to re-write all the damage formulas, weakness effects, food effects, etc etc that would have to be done if changed to Vit.

    It's like literally asking the devs to do 5x more work because of some arbitrary desire for "vitality" to be a main damage stat. Totally unnecessary.
    (1)
    Last edited by whiskeybravo; 07-04-2018 at 03:34 AM.
    Scrubbing it up @ twitch.tv/whiskey1bravo

  3. #13
    Player
    Kabooa's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    1,879
    Character
    Jace Ossura
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    Goldsmith Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by whiskeybravo View Post
    It's like literally asking the devs to do 5x more work because of some arbitrary desire for "vitality" to be a main damage stat. Totally unnecessary.
    Kind of like saying "rework the entire equipment budget if more strength on accessories is too much"
    (0)

  4. #14
    Player
    Voidedge_Ragna's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Posts
    77
    Character
    Edge Void
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 70
    Melding str has nothing to do with using crafted or tome jewels. The first stat is always str on both.

    And if you remove str we can still put 2 lv 6 direct on it. Theres no need to fix this it just creates something to do for crafters
    (1)

  5. #15
    Player
    Megguido's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Posts
    116
    Character
    Minati Illu
    World
    Lich
    Main Class
    Dark Knight Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by whiskeybravo View Post
    1) There's nothing wrong with STR being the damage stat for tanks. The problem is that raid gear that's supposed to be the best gear for players to strive for is absolutely trashed by crafting accessories.

    It's like literally asking the devs to do 5x more work because of some arbitrary desire for "vitality" to be a main damage stat. Totally unnecessary.
    Though pentamelded accessories bring like 50 DPS over ilvl 370 accs. Sure the pentamelded are better and that sucks, but that's not a huge difference that makes the crafted ones 100% mendatory. It's a 50 DPS tradeoff for 1'000 or 2'000 HP (in other words, barely makes a difference in any way). Personnaly, I'd prefer taking raid accs because I know I'll spend as much time collecting enough money and materias to get pentamelded stuff (or like, a mix of both depending on what loots and what's the cheapest on the MB).
    (0)

  6. #16
    Player
    FeliAiko's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Posts
    548
    Character
    Feli Aiko
    World
    Odin
    Main Class
    Dragoon Lv 70
    As long as VIT is deemed the primary main stat for Tanks (while on non-tanks it's the secondary main stat), this issue will still continue. A simple solution could be to swap things around so that STR becomes primary main stat for Tanks (could even make it affect mitigation to a slight degree, like it used to in 2.x). Right side gear is Job locked now so there's no worry about Tanks equipping Slaying pieces either.
    (2)

  7. #17
    Player
    whiskeybravo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Posts
    2,215
    Character
    Whiskey Bravo
    World
    Leviathan
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by FeliAiko View Post
    As long as VIT is deemed the primary main stat for Tanks (while on non-tanks it's the secondary main stat), this issue will still continue. A simple solution could be to swap things around so that STR becomes primary main stat for Tanks (could even make it affect mitigation to a slight degree, like it used to in 2.x). Right side gear is Job locked now so there's no worry about Tanks equipping Slaying pieces either.
    I think Vit as the main tanking stat is debatable. Back in early HW before they changed the damage formula, when damage was still based off Str, tanks only tried to reach a certain HP threshold and put the rest towards Str. Vit was not the "main" stat then and it's not now since it's simply a given on tank accessories. No one is trying to maximize (or minimize) their Vit anymore, it's just there, and the extra Vit from 370 accessories is not necessary in current content. How can something be a main stat when it's not even required to upgrade it? The only time Vit was desirable as a main stat was when the damage formula included it. Outside of that Tanks have done damn near everything they can to put their stats in anything other than Vit. That's a quality main stat right there.

    I'm not trying to discount the argument that Vit might make more sense as a damage stat in general, since it's traditionally the only "main" stat we got on accessories. But I think SE realized that's a difficult way to work around in their system and it makes more sense for AP to be based of Str anyways, so they changed it. None of that is really the issue to begin with. The issues are crafted being BiS for the entire raid tier - only for tanks - and raid drops basically hitting the floor because no tank main wants them especially after spending millions on the crafted. Sure some people will still wear them, and non-tank mains will be able to get upgrades, and maybe it's not even that big of a difference one way or the other, but none of those secondary benefits excuse the situation.

    Even if they wanted to keep it like it is, at least make the upgrades meaningful. I would've bet money prior to 4.2 that they would address the scaling issue on new gear, but they actually managed to make it worse. If they really are just trying to keep tank DPS in check by throttling Str on accessories, so be it, at least make the str gains from the next set of crafted > raid gear more than +1. Otherwise it's basically just a slap in the face for tank mains.
    (1)
    Last edited by whiskeybravo; 07-04-2018 at 03:41 AM.
    Scrubbing it up @ twitch.tv/whiskey1bravo

  8. #18
    Player
    Deceptus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Ul'Dah
    Posts
    829
    Character
    Deceptus Keelon
    World
    Behemoth
    Main Class
    Scholar Lv 70
    What's worse is Accessory Materia syncing affects tanks more than any other class by removing STR when synced down.
    (0)
    WoW expects basic competence. FFXIV is pleasantly surprised by it.


  9. #19
    Player
    Duskane's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2018
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    664
    Character
    Dusk Himmel
    World
    Moogle
    Main Class
    Dragoon Lv 70
    really they could remove tenacity and work it into Determination
    and just bring DH for tanks
    (1)

    if i ever sound aggressive or rude in my comment that is never my intention

  10. #20
    Player
    Kabooa's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    1,879
    Character
    Jace Ossura
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    Goldsmith Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by whiskeybravo View Post
    But then what? Leave str as it is? Cap it same as DPS? I don't get the impression SE is just willing to give us a free DPS upgrades for the hell of it. A plan that is DPS neutral would probably have a better chance at getting adopted. (IMO, but it's often wrong so.. Lol)

    (if they did cap the str and adjust WD at least it would solve the melding of str problem)
    You take the current formula, and add 25 to it, then remove primary melding. This allows the one materia slot you get to be a materia of your choice, rather than strength.

    It almost completely nullifies the substat advantage crafted accessories get.

    No other adjustments. Period. End of story.
    (0)

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