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  1. #81
    Player
    Ryannex's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    94
    Character
    Lolorei Lalarei
    World
    Omega
    Main Class
    Arcanist Lv 70
    Wasn't it Lore already that we don't actually die, per say? The echo grants us visions of the future, basically, so everytime we 'die' in a fight, it is actually a vision of the future showing us what NOT to do. Basically, we have NEVER lost a fight. All the times you wipe in a raid or fight or whatever are due to the echo showing you what could go wrong.
    (1)

  2. #82
    Player
    Cilia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    2,043
    Character
    Temujin Haragin
    World
    Famfrit
    Main Class
    Dark Knight Lv 70
    When Midgardsormr said that the Warrior of Light was "the strongest of [their] kind," I'm pretty sure he was talking about strength of character and not force of arms.
    (0)
    Temujin Haragin's Way Status (4.1 - End)
    [ ]LOST [X]NOT LOST
    "Diese Welt ist grausam, es ist traurig aber wahr"

  3. #83
    Player
    Dualgunner's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    1,592
    Character
    Sora Maxwell
    World
    Coeurl
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Ryannex View Post
    Basically, we have NEVER lost a fight.
    No fight has ever killed us is the more accurate statement.
    We've been defeated by Zenos twice, as two immediate examples of our defeat.
    (1)
    Quote Originally Posted by Defias View Post
    "I don't want to have others in my party who don't play the game exactly how I want to play it; as I don't want to teach/explain/carry them. But I also don't want them to be able to avoid ruining my experience, let alone have an option to do the content without communicating with me, so I can belittle/berate them and make them feel bad & explain why my way is the only way."
    #Dualgunner7456
    Add me on Discord if ya like

  4. #84
    Player
    Grayve's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    577
    Character
    Moengohta Sylgraebwyn
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Dark Knight Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Ryannex View Post
    Wasn't it Lore already that we don't actually die, per say? The echo grants us visions of the future, basically, so everytime we 'die' in a fight, it is actually a vision of the future showing us what NOT to do. Basically, we have NEVER lost a fight. All the times you wipe in a raid or fight or whatever are due to the echo showing you what could go wrong.
    I believe that is just a fan theory, much like the echo letting us see AoE markers (if that were true, then it means NPCs in new fights have the echo, since they have finally learned to dodge AoE's since the end of HW).
    (1)

  5. #85
    Player
    Keever's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    86
    Character
    Lyon Polnareff
    World
    Ultros
    Main Class
    Paladin Lv 70
    Yeah, it's sort of a real-world "design flavour" thing that kind of fits with the whole theme of the Echo, but that doesn't make it canon lore. Sometimes a gameplay mechanic is just a gameplay mechanic, even if the buff we get for old fights is named "the Echo".
    (1)

  6. #86
    Player
    LetsGoKaito's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2017
    Posts
    1
    Character
    Yuyunasu Ririnasu
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Astrologian Lv 70
    Tataru, that lala secretary has been through everything of the Scions on top of politics and day to day management of the most renowned organisation of heroes on the planet. She may not have been great at being an arcanist, but her mastery of mining in such a short time makes it pretty obvious she's destined to be the best marauder in Hydaelyn if she wanted to.
    (0)

  7. #87
    Player
    Enkidoh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    5,054
    Character
    Enkidoh Roux
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Paladin Lv 69
    Quote Originally Posted by Ryannex View Post
    Wasn't it Lore already that we don't actually die, per say? The echo grants us visions of the future, basically, so everytime we 'die' in a fight, it is actually a vision of the future showing us what NOT to do. Basically, we have NEVER lost a fight. All the times you wipe in a raid or fight or whatever are due to the echo showing you what could go wrong.
    We don't actually 'die' in the game though because if we did, there would be no plot, so we're given narrative and gameplay immunity (this is hardly limited to FFXIV either, all games with storylines have this as a fundamental aspect of it.). Gameplay wise when you lose all HP and fail a battle or whatever, you're not actually dying but simply being knocked unconscious (it's literally called 'KO'), thus making spells like Raise not actually raising the dead but instead simply resuscitation and it's kind of handwaved away how 'lucky' you are to survive it with just a loss of consciousness.

    Also the Echo cannot view the future, it only allows you to 'transcend the boundaries of the soul', specifically, other people's souls, in the form you access their memories and view them of events that person experienced. As the future has not happened yet, no memory yet exists of it and thus, no future vision through the Echo. You need a little suspension of disbelief when in battle as narrative wise, it is already assumed for story purposes that you win, the game's story does not take into account how many times you won, lost or attempted that battle: you fought it once and once only.

    This is why 'hard' mode and 'savage' mode versions of dungeons take different routes or feature different enemies - they're not the same battle or dungeon only with ramped up difficulty, you're travelling into that place again after some time has passed since your earlier venture there, so things will inevitably affect that.
    (1)

  8. #88
    Player
    Remedi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Posts
    964
    Character
    Remedi Maxwell
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    Goldsmith Lv 70
    Tbh savage modes have always been considered as the recalling of our dear friend the wandering ministrel
    (0)

  9. #89
    Player
    Belhi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Posts
    2,888
    Character
    J'talhdi Belhi
    World
    Tonberry
    Main Class
    Conjurer Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Remedi View Post
    Tbh savage modes have always been considered as the recalling of our dear friend the wandering ministrel
    Well, savage mode raids are. The most of the Expert and Hard mode dungeons and trials however are revisits of the same locations and/or enemies.
    (0)

  10. #90
    Player
    Remedi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Posts
    964
    Character
    Remedi Maxwell
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    Goldsmith Lv 70
    Yes, was just correcting the savage raids part
    (0)

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