Is anyone else dying to get to Garlemald?

[Kyran-Varlsen]

I'm not too sure about this. We already did something quite similar with Thordan, although Thordan was planning to betray the Ascians almost from the start.

And Thordan did succeed in betraying the Ascians. He destroyed Lahabrea, who certainly did not expect it. That we end up stomping Thordan and his knights anyway is another matter entirely, which does not negate his success.

Thordan got the upper hand. In my scenario, it is the other way around - the man who conjectured the alliance needs our help to stop the Ascians and Elidibus (who may or may not be an Ascian in the normal sense). Loyalty is not the issue so much as knowledge and experience. Thordan was able to wipe Lahabrae from existence with a massive amount of energy. But only the Scions devised a method by which a mortal might destroy an Ascian. The Empire, despite it's vaunted strength, may be unable to bring such power to bear fast enough.

Basically Varis may be able to handle the problem but it would require throwing so much manpower and energy into it that it would be less trouble to bring in the "experts." We already have experience making a truce with bastards in this story, in the form of Lord Lolorito. This would be on a larger scale.

Also, sorry for throwing my threads around like that. I just figured here was better.

[Enkidoh]

Thordan was able to wipe Lahabrae from existence with a massive amount of energy. But only the Scions devised a method by which a mortal might destroy an Ascian.

This isn't actually correct -

Thordan destroyed Lahabrea not by a massive amount of energy, but by using Ascalon to reduce Lahabrea to his aetherial form which he then simply consumed him, turning him into a tasty aetheric snack. Thordan and the Heavensward had become the Primal Knights of the Round by that stage, and Primals require a source of aether to keep themselves anchored in the corporeal realm, consuming any aether they can find. Thordan himself even says this outright immediately after consuming Lahabrea.

This was hinted way back in 2.2's storyline where the same fate befell the Sahagin Elder whom Elidibus had supposedly granted 'mastery of the Echo' to - the Elder had become a being of pure aether, and Leviathan consumed him as aether accordingly, destroying him.

As Knights of the Round Thordan and his knights planned to consume the rest of the Ascians, the Dravanian Horde and other Primals alike as 'God-King', except his plan however had one fatal weakness - he was up against that meddling adventurer who had made a career for themself taking down Primals like he had become (namely, the player ). Needless to say, he folded so easily.

As for how Varis and Garlemald will use their newfound synthetic-Echo power... it's hard to say. But one thing is clear is that it will not lead us into an alliance with them - Garlemald is still our enemy, they are still allied with the Ascians, and in true FF style, it's likely once we get to Garlemald's capital itself, finally taking out the Empire's ruling regime will then reveal the real string pullers all along, the real big bad, which is almost guaranteed to be the Ascians and their evil moon deity Zodiark.

But we'll find out either way.

[Kallera]

I am, but not as some conqueror looking to raze/balkanize the place. I feel like doing that, no matter if it is at the head of some coalition, would leave me feeling fairly empty about it and the Scions.

And if Cid seems ok with it, I'm just going to write him off as inhuman trash.

[Khalithar]

I certainly am, mostly because I've wanted heavy garlean style plate armor (zenos, regula, etc.) for ages.

[Klonoa7]

I mean the Garlean empire is one of the main antagonistic threat organizations in the world and we know they home base is Garlemald which is in the northern part of Ilsabard. I really would like to see know more and see more of there how their society works. I wish I know we were going there in the 4.x series but surely by 5.0 we'll infiltrate it no?

I'm dying to nuke Garlemald. Kill every last Garlean man woman and child except for Cid. They're gonna consider us savages no matter what we do (And it's painfully obvious at this point Garland is FF14's take on Nazi Germany) so might as well show them what real savagery is and end them all except for Cid who's the only one among them who's not a malicious tyrant.

[Klonoa7]

More reasons to end the Garlean Empire

Another reason to want to finish off the Garlean Empire once and for all? Black Rose, a bio weapon of mass destruction they originally planned to use against the rest of the world.

Want another? Some dialog from Namai hints at Garleans threatening to rape a little girl after beating her brother half to death and forced them to denounce their parents

Yet another reason? They murdered their Kojin mercenaries simply because they abandoned their posts to defend their homelands.
Honestly, theres an infinite number of reasons the Empire needs to be destroyed once and for all

[VargasVermillion]

I'm dying to nuke Garlemald. Kill every last Garlean man woman and child except for Cid. They're gonna consider us savages no matter what we do (And it's painfully obvious at this point Garland is FF14's take on Nazi Germany) so might as well show them what real savagery is and end them all except for Cid who's the only one among them who's not a malicious tyrant.

Calm that edge down. we don't know what the bulk of garlemald is like yet so there probably are redeemable people, Nero remarked that cid defecting made him more popular than he was before so that's something to consider.

[KageTokage]

Stormblood really didn't make the empire seem redeemable, since all their supposed goodness has still been almost strictly through word of mouth, while we now know they're willing to stoop to using their prisoners as lab rats for their inhumane research into the Echo and even chemical warfare. I think Eorzea and Othard's view of them is only going to get worse before it gets better, because it's a given they're going to do something to push us into invading their territory by the end of the 4.x cycle.

Nero remarked that cid defecting made him more popular than he was before so that's something to consider.

That could simply be interpreted as him saying there's more people who like Cid outside of the empire then in it, though.

[Alleo]

I can somehow understand that people want the empire to be more grey but I do believe that SE does not really want to make Garlemald look good. They have some soldiers that seems to have some good in them but even in real life you will find good people even in the worst dictatorship. I also believe that a lot of the population itself is not evil so I am fine if Garlemald later becomes a better state by changing the way they rule or something like that. But a good state under the current rule? I dont believe so.

SE really goes out of their way to make them look bad (and throws in some grey or good Garleans to make up for it a bit, yet the only real good Garleans are traitors to their own kind..). Even Gaius was a very dark grey character that only chose to not let the experiments on poison going on because it would leave no people to rule over. One might see this as good but to me it looked more like a decision that was made because its better for the empire to have people that work in the conquered land than to kill them all and not because it was morally wrong to do so. Also he still saw us as lower beings (savages) and he was the one that ordered the raid on the base of the scions, an organization that was neutral and was only trying to stop the summoning of primals. Yet many were slaughtered by people under his command. (Which then forced our hands in attacking them) Also he was more than ready to use Ultima against the city states if they do not surrender. Later on SE even said that they made Zenos in an enemy that nobody will like (oh the irony) because people liked Gaius even though SE itself never wanted him to be seen that way.

Also none of the important Garlean characters are shown in any good light in SB. Also their reason for conquering is really funny..as if they started to conquer the world because they wanted to protect it. Wasnt it stated that they first met the primals when they went to Eorzea? Also if they never tried to conquer then Middy and his lake would still be alright. And some of the primals are summoned because the people and beastman are afraid of Garlemald.

They might have said that some conquered lands are better of with Garlemald but its show dont tell and the only thing that we are shown in SB is the bad side of the empire. And seeing how people that are born under their rule still dont get the same rights as Garlean themselves..At the end after SB I just see them as something like the Third Reich in real life, thus I know that there are good people living there but that the government itself should be gone. If you only have a good life under Garlemald if you do whatever the government says and give up your culture and everything (and be killed of in wars around the world..) then I would never want to live under them. And I do kinda wonder what threat we all would face to work together with them.

[Klonoa7]

Exactly, Garleans are irredeemably evil with Cid being the only exception. Some may claim to have noble causes, but, in the end it always comes down to conquest and genocide.

(Also how did you type all that? The limit is 1000 letters.)