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  1. #11
    Player
    Craiger's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    747
    Character
    Atiqa Craiger
    World
    Phoenix
    Main Class
    Pugilist Lv 80
    You can have even higher SS than that, because getting BiS will take some time (depending on who we are talking about)

    You can easily get 800+ until you get certain pieces

    Even if Purification can be used to save you, which I don't think it can on some fights, it still means you're losing out on DPS because of that.

    I can't get even close to the DPS on the SSS dummies right now, cause I have 800+ SS, and have to use purification.

    I don't understand why they can't just remove most of the SS until they fix it... We should have scaling TP regeneration (in one way or the other) with the SS.
    (0)

  2. #12
    Player
    Jekyll's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    203
    Character
    Henry Jekyll
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Gunbreaker Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Craiger View Post

    I don't understand why they can't just remove most of the SS until they fix it...
    I would disagree that SS needs to be fixed. There was some extensive math done on rotation changes to accommodate for high SS on this reddit post which was pretty interesting.

    The summarized version of it was that with 600+ SS, you only have to apply DK every 3rd rotation (it falls off but only for the DK re-application, which ends up being a dps gain); around 850+ SS, you only have to apply DK AND TS every 3rd rotation (they don't fall off at all).

    I did some parsing on these and they do increase damage output. With that said, it is a change most monks are probably not used to since it would no longer be flank > flank > flank > rear > rear > rear/flank and instead would require you to alternate between flank and rear more frequently.

    I'd recommend to read it over and give it a shot before attempting the SSS dummy again (not sure which one you're referring to nor what your ilvl is).
    (1)

  3. #13
    Player
    Aomine1992's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Posts
    829
    Character
    Daiki Sejuro
    World
    Behemoth
    Main Class
    Summoner Lv 80
    Lol this reminds me of healers running out of MP cause they pop their regen skills at zero mp....50-65% is your magical number my friend trust me DRG TP is dropping like crazy to but I never really have a TP issue
    (0)

  4. #14
    Player
    Velox's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Sharlayan
    Posts
    2,205
    Character
    Velo'a Nharoz
    World
    Mateus
    Main Class
    Scholar Lv 90
    The DPS loss from using a Purification in place of Forbidden Chakra is minimal. You're forgetting that you can still weave in Chakras more often between cooldowns of purification due to being able to execute more skills. Then you have the sum of the DPS gained from the extra attacks for each rotation used with Purification.
    (0)

  5. #15
    Player
    Krindor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Posts
    435
    Character
    U'tyada Tia
    World
    Odin
    Main Class
    Marauder Lv 67
    Quote Originally Posted by Aomine1992 View Post
    Lol this reminds me of healers running out of MP cause they pop their regen skills at zero mp....50-65% is your magical number my friend trust me DRG TP is dropping like crazy to but I never really have a TP issue
    DRG TP isn't comparable with MNK since 3.0 with the addition of another skill at the end of the combo and the dot time of phlebotomize the biggest TP draining skill being increased the TP that DRG uses is a lot less total. A MNK goes through a bit more than 500TP/min including the tp regen. Invig being 400 TP/120 sec we are missing 600 TP regen to keep up and will run dry about 48 sec after the invig. The total amount of time it takes for a MNK to be completely out of TP when using invig at the perfect moment is: 120+100(invig at 600 and at 0)=220 seconds which is 3:40 minutes at a reasonable amount of SkS, with the current SkS bloat we will not make it to the 2nd invig and will be completely dry after about 160 seconds with 8 seconds where you can not do anything. This is pure theory with a set amount of tp per second, in reality the time is going to be shorter and time spent dry longer.

    EDIT: Using my spreadsheet I use to compare rotations and adding TP calculations to it, @765 SkS the total amount of time until we run dry is 212 seconds with purification and invig but also using fracture, without fracture I would add another 10-20 seconds but the next invig isn't coming up until 280 seconds.
    (0)
    Last edited by Krindor; 03-22-2016 at 02:59 AM.

  6. #16
    Player
    ZerofraZ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Posts
    17
    Character
    Vovan Zerofraz
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    Bard Lv 70
    Very nice, that will be possible to use DK less often and it will rise DPS, but the fact is- this will not help to save TP, and when TP will dry out, DPS will drop and all this efficiency becomes useless.Dragoons have much slower GCD and their Invigorate restores 600 TP, so please, dont tell me, that dragoons can be dried out on TP
    (0)

  7. #17
    Player
    Transfinite's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Posts
    47
    Character
    Kaden Sun
    World
    Behemoth
    Main Class
    Paladin Lv 60
    I know you're more likely to end up with a 240 Lore weapon over the 245 Midan weapon thanks to the Gobdip in A7S, but is it really worth it just to sacrifice 1 Point of Damage and 7 Strength in exchange for losing up to 96 Critical Hit, gaining 39 Skill Speed and 59 Determination?
    (0)

  8. #18
    Player
    Craiger's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    747
    Character
    Atiqa Craiger
    World
    Phoenix
    Main Class
    Pugilist Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Transfinite View Post
    I know you're more likely to end up with a 240 Lore weapon over the 245 Midan weapon thanks to the Gobdip in A7S, but is it really worth it just to sacrifice 1 Point of Damage and 7 Strength in exchange for losing up to 96 Critical Hit, gaining 39 Skill Speed and 59 Determination?
    Secondary Stats doesn't do as much as a lot of players think, and weapons have Weapon Damage too, which is super strong.

    The 245 Midas wep gives around 12.3 more Weighted Strength over the 240 Lore wep.

    So in other words, even a 5 ilvl increase can give pretty much
    (0)

  9. #19
    Player
    Critical-Limit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Location
    Ul'dah
    Posts
    570
    Character
    Xizzy Azenith
    World
    Zalera
    Main Class
    Monk Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by JackFross View Post
    Extra Skill Speed isn't going to save you from 10-20s downtime for Boost.
    Extra Skill Speed isn't going to save you from dashing around the field to hit orbs during Brawler.
    Extra Skill Speed isn't going to save you from quarantines in A7S
    Extra Skill Speed isn't going to save you from the spreading mechanics in the final phases of A8S when the boss isn't targetable.

    Every other point in each of those fights is essentially a striking dummy. Skill Speed doesn't help you maintain GL3 while standing still punching a wall.
    Even in moments you can save GL3 during some sort of down time. It isn't done by skill speed. It's done by timing your snap punch just before down time then, then form shifting back to demolish and hope a target comes back. You can't punch the air so skill speed doesn't save you.

    I'm agreeing with you, just adding how much skill speed doesn't save your GL 3
    (0)

  10. #20
    Player
    Ricdeau's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    484
    Character
    Ricdeau Cyton
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    Monk Lv 60
    Quote Originally Posted by Jekyll View Post
    I would disagree that SS needs to be fixed. There was some extensive math done on rotation changes to accommodate for high SS on this reddit post which was pretty interesting.

    The summarized version of it was that with 600+ SS, you only have to apply DK every 3rd rotation (it falls off but only for the DK re-application, which ends up being a dps gain); around 850+ SS, you only have to apply DK AND TS every 3rd rotation (they don't fall off at all).

    I did some parsing on these and they do increase damage output. With that said, it is a change most monks are probably not used to since it would no longer be flank > flank > flank > rear > rear > rear/flank and instead would require you to alternate between flank and rear more frequently.

    I'd recommend to read it over and give it a shot before attempting the SSS dummy again (not sure which one you're referring to nor what your ilvl is).
    An interesting read from what I saw. I didn't have time to read through the whole thing, but I will read through the whole thing later. I did talk about this same thing back in 2.x, and said then that it would require well over 800 SS to do two BS/TS rotations between DK/TwS refreshes. Back then you just couldn't feasibly get enough SS to even break even so any of us toying around with it just shelved it indefinitely. I had completely forgot about my testing back then though, and have been trying to focus on keeping my SS in check. I'll have to try it out and see how it goes. I'm all for some experimenting especially if it can have some interesting positive results.

    I've always been more of a fan of more midrange amount of SS over really high or really low as a personal preference though.
    (0)
    Last edited by Ricdeau; 03-25-2016 at 01:41 AM.

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